Today on MSNBC, Kevin Spacey, a star of HBO's film depiction of the 2000 Florida Presidential vote travesty, Recount, said about the current Florida Democratic delegate fiasco:

I do not see how you can pretend two million people did not vote.

Indeed. The Huffington Post has a headline that reads HBO's Recount Opens 2000 Wounds. I think it does more than that. It rubs salt in the current wound in the Democratic Party on the seating of the Florida and Michigan delegations.

On May 31, the DNC better do the right thing. The DNC better do the smart thing. Seat the Florida and Michigan delegations.

By Big Tent Democrat

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Buried in the DOJ's Inspector General Report yesterday: The Pentagon allowed Chinese officials to visit and interrogate Gitmo prisoners. It even softened them up for the interrogation.

Buried in a Department of Justice report released Tuesday are new allegations about a 2002 arrangement between the United States and China, which allowed Chinese intelligence to visit Guantanamo and interrogate Chinese Uighurs held there.

According to the report by Justice Department Inspector General Glenn Fine, an FBI agent reported a detainee belonging to China's ethnic Uighur minority and a Uighur translator told him Uighur detainees were kept awake for long periods, deprived of food and forced to endure cold for hours on end, just prior to questioning by Chinese interrogators.

Susan Manning, a lawyer who represents several Uighurs still held at Guantanamo, said Tuesday the allegations are all too familiar. U.S. personnel "are engaging in abusive tactics on behalf of the Chinese," she said Tuesday. When Uighur detainees refused to talk to Chinese interrogators in 2002, U.S. military personnel put them in solitary confinement as punishment, she said.

Attaturk at Firedoglake has more.

Here is a lesson in reading an exit poll. Even in Oregon, Barack Obama lost working class voters to Hillary Clinton. You will read otherwise at Obama sites (Greg Sargent is a terrific and fair journalist, I was wrong to refer to him in that manner), but they will be disingenuous when they do so.

There are two basic characteristics that are used to define working class voters - income and education. In Oregon, a state as favorable as you can find for Obama on this score, Clinton won voters with a HS degree and no college 53-46. In Oregon, Clinton won voters earning less than $30,000 a year by 54-45.

If your intent is to bury your head in the sand, you will include the "some college" group (read COLLEGE STUDENTS) into the working class. Some Obama supporting observers will play that game. But that will not make the problem go away.

By Big Tent Democrat, speaking for me only

Comments closed.

As I have stated repeatedly for a month now, it is my view that Barack Obama will almost certainly be the Democratic nominee. And it is time Barack Obama starts acting like he believes that. That means doing things that will help him win in November. I have talked about his need to unify the Democratic Party, address his problems with working class voters of all stripes (except African Americans of course) and, the issue of the upcoming week - show respect to the voters of Florida and Michigan. Today, John Dickerson writes:

The math is relentless, yet Obama hasn't won yet, and Hillary Clinton shows no sign of stopping. She will travel to Florida on Wednesday to argue that he wants to win the nomination by disenfranchising the state's Democratic primary voters, a visit that can only damage him in a swing state crucial to Obama's chances in November.

(Emphasis supplied.) [More . . .]

The LA Times sent out a "breaking news" e-mail saying "Clinton money shocker! Posts at 6 A.M. Eastern 3 AM Pacific."

It published its scoop here. Then it sent out another e-mail saying:

Due to a mathematical error, Hillary Clinton's loans to herself were counted twice in this morning's item on her campaign debt, which is $20 million not $31 million. We will be publishing a corrected item asap, but wanted to alert you as quickly as possible.

Never mind....

Here's the final thread tonight, and remember, TalkLeft may be down tomorrow from 9am ET for several hours -- there's a chance a backup will be in place which would mean only 10 minute outages per hour through the morning, but I'm not counting on it. This is a network wide issue, not a TL server issue.

Thanks to all for the congratulations on earlier threads to Nic, the TL kid who was sworn in today as a Colorado lawyer. The ceremony was led by all of the Justices of the Colorado Supreme Court, with a federal judge and others presenting remarks.

When it came time for the oath, they asked all the existing lawyers in the audience who were there with their kids being sworn in to stand with their kids and retake the oath. So the TL kid and I got to take the oath together.

Here's a photo of us right afterwards. [More...]

Who won bigger in today's primaries? 100% of the vote is in from Kentucky, 66% is in from Oregon:

• Hillary won 51 delegates so far, Obama 35.
• Hillary earned 650,000 votes, Obama has gotten 475,000.

Hillary won a lot more votes and more delegates tonight.

She's tonight's winner.

Kentucky: 100% of vote:

• Hillary: 459,145 votes * 65% * 37 delegates
• Obama: 209,771 votes * 30% * 14 delegates
• Counties: Hillary wins all but 2

Oregon: 66% of votes in

• Obama: 272,000 votes * 58% * 21 delegates
• Hillary: 196,000 votes * 42% * 14 delegates
• Counties: Obama wins 16; Hillary wins 13 (1 tied, 4 still out)

More....

Via John Cole, who loved it, Ron Reagan said:

If Appalachia was a country, Hillary Clinton could be President.”

It is funny how Appalachia keeps growing for some Obama supporters. It now encompasses not only West Virginia, Kentucky, Tennessee, Arkansas, and parts of Pennsylvania and Ohio, but also California, Arizona, New Mexico, New Hampshire, Nevada, New Jersey, Massachusetts, Texas, Oklahoma, New York, Rhode Island and Florida.

By Big Tent Democrat, speaking for me only

Just in from our network provider...Some kind of critical issue requires maintenance that will have TalkLeft (and not just us) down Wednesday morning starting around 9am ET and continuing for several hours.

Just got an e-mail from Mochila, where we get our news headlines. They are in New York and write:

Please be advised that our hosting provider will be performing critical maintenance on a power cable tomorrow morning EDT. In anticipation of that, we are required to temporarily shut down real-time content feeds into our marketplace as of 5AM EDT tomorrow, May 21st.

Undoubtedly, there will be a lot of sites down tomorrow.

So, get your comments in tonight. I'll keep the threads going for a while tonight.

This is an open thread. Updates below:

******

(Big Tent Demorat): My understanding is that the telephone polling in Oregon shows a double digit (56-43) Obama win. I personally am not going to stay up following it too closely.

For some reason I feel it is going to be closer than expected, say 9? But I have no basis for that.

In any event, CNN results board for your perusal. Here are the CNN Oregon Exit Polls. BTW, Obama STILL has a working class voter problem in Oregon, despite the claims of the Obama News Network (NBC), Clinton win voters earning 30k or less by 54-43. Clinton wins non-college voters by 54-44.

Again, talk about Oregon or anything you like. J. is out celebrating a real life triumph, the TL Kid became a full fledged lawyer today, taking to oath.

Night all. My usual post mortems in the morning.

By Big Tent Democrat

Update (TL): I'm back. A big thanks to BTD for keeping the threads going tonight. I'll be here for the duration.

Comments now closed.

I am really interested in how Obama deals with this expectation that he will sort of declare victory but not declare it. ESPECIALLY if he will mention Florida and Michigan.

I also love watching the Obama News Network (NBC) acting as if this is the biggest bestest night ever for the Obama campaign. They are so funny because now they are being so defensive that everyone knows they are the Obama News Network.

Talk about what you like. I am not live blogging any speeches. Never have and never will.

Ok, one thought, it is just weird that he is in Iowa, not Oregon. I do not get it. He could have done the speech right at 11 pm EST and been on all the local news shows. It is sort of a dis of Oregon isn't it?

By Big Tent Democrat

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CNN, along with NBC, at the behest of the Barack Obama campaign, will pretend Florida and Michigan do not exist. They will declare that Barack Obama has won a majority of the pledged delegates in the Dem race. They will declare that 2.3 million voters in Florida and Michigan do not exist. This is not only outrageous of these news organizations, it is monumentally stupid of the Obama campaign.

I have stated repeatedly that I believe that Barack Obama will almost certainly be the nominee. That he will capture a majority of the pledged delegates. But he is pissing away Florida and making trouble for himself in Michigan he simply does not need. All to avoid one bad night of news coverage?

He has handed Hillary Clinton the most appealing battle cry a politician could possibly have - count the votes. Donna Brazile and Keith Olbermann and the other Obama surrogates can scream about the RULZ. Hillary Clinton can fight for the votes!

Just a supremely stupid move by the Barack Obama campaign.

By Big Tent Democrat

Comments now closed.