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Oregon Results Thread: Obama Wins

By Big Tent Democrat, Section Elections 2008
Posted on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:00:33 PM EST
Tags: Oregon '08 (all tags)
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Update (TL) 9:12 pm MT: 17% in, CNN joins NBC in projecting Obama the winner.

******

(Big Tent Demorat): My understanding is that the telephone polling in Oregon shows a double digit (56-43) Obama win. I personally am not going to stay up following it too closely.

For some reason I feel it is going to be closer than expected, say 9? But I have no basis for that.

In any event, CNN results board for your perusal. Here are the CNN Oregon Exit Polls. BTW, Obama STILL has a working class voter problem in Oregon, despite the claims of the Obama News Network (NBC), Clinton win voters earning 30k or less by 54-43. Clinton wins non-college voters by 54-44.

Again, talk about Oregon or anything you like. J. is out celebrating a real life triumph, the TL Kid became a full fledged lawyer today, taking to oath.

Night all. My usual post mortems in the morning.

By Big Tent Democrat

Update (TL): I'm back. A big thanks to BTD for keeping the threads going tonight. I'll be here for the duration.

Comments now closed.

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    Oregon Results Thread: Obama Wins | 221 comments (221 topical)
    I'll say what the "phone poll" (5.00 / 1) (#1)
    by andgarden on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:01:22 PM EST
    said when CNN puts it up shortly.

    Here's where we are: (5.00 / 1) (#2)
    by andgarden on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:04:02 PM EST
    Obama 55.85%, Clinton 42.25%, according to the phone poll.

    [ Parent ]
    Test on exit polling. (none / 0) (#5)
    by Stellaaa on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:05:23 PM EST
    For this kind of election.  

    [ Parent ]
    Well, it's not an exit poll (none / 0) (#9)
    by andgarden on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:06:39 PM EST
    it's just a well-run (we hope) phone poll. Just like what any pollster would do.

    [ Parent ]
    "exit poll" (5.00 / 1) (#11)
    by Stellaaa on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:07:49 PM EST
    I bet the exit poll outfits are lobbying against mail in votes.

    [ Parent ]
    Edison/Mitofsky does both (none / 0) (#12)
    by andgarden on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:08:58 PM EST
    and a phone poll is frankly easier to organize. I'll bet they woudln't complain too much.

    [ Parent ]
    With the DNC (Do Not Call) (none / 0) (#90)
    by JavaCityPal on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:33:58 PM EST
    list, Caller ID, and cell phones replacing land lines, phone polling is going to get more and more challenging.

    Other states are moving toward all mail-in, too.

    [ Parent ]

    DNC doesn't apply to polling (none / 0) (#96)
    by andgarden on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:38:25 PM EST
    Your other concerns are valid, but so far there's never been a race where they've explained polling errors.

    Generally speaking, phone polls are pretty good. That's why campaigns spend a small fortune one them. (I know BTD sez that they all su*k, but whatev.)

    [ Parent ]

    Voting by mail is great! (none / 0) (#216)
    by Newt on Wed May 21, 2008 at 12:18:36 AM EST
    I hope other states take it up as well.  As an Oregonian, I can tell you that progressive candidates have historically taken a beating when it rains on voting day.  Not anymore.  Nowadays we throw parties and you have to come with your ballot in hand (no expectation of sharing how you voted, secrecy is still respected).  

    The parties/BBQs tend to get people talking about issues before actually voting, or people talk about the issues at the party.  Either way, we end up with a much higher percentage of voting Democrats than before mail-in and it seems like the average voter is more informed.  

    [ Parent ]

    It won't be 9 (5.00 / 1) (#4)
    by blogtopus on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:05:17 PM EST
    even if it is 9.0001%.

    They'll claim it as 10 and bray about a 'double-digit' win. /s

    Yes, but. (none / 0) (#16)
    by kpatton1 on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:10:51 PM EST
    Both sides do this, you know.

    I'm not sure how you could criticize anybody for this.  It is politics, after all.

    [ Parent ]

    Actually, no it's the hypocrisy. (5.00 / 1) (#35)
    by Maria Garcia on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:20:01 PM EST


    [ Parent ]
    You mean... (none / 0) (#33)
    by mindfulmission on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:19:31 PM EST
    ... how everyone said Hillary won Indiana by 2%, even though it was really 1.1%?

    [ Parent ]
    A win is a win (none / 0) (#36)
    by txpolitico67 on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:20:18 PM EST
    period. end of story.

    [ Parent ]
    umm... (none / 0) (#53)
    by mindfulmission on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:24:24 PM EST
    ... that wasn't my point.  blogtopus was complaining about how a 9.1% win would be spun as a 10% win for Obama, and I pointed out that the same thing happened in Indiana, but benefiting Clinton.

    But sure... go ahead and spin it around to mean something that I wasn't even talking about.

    [ Parent ]

    sorry... (none / 0) (#57)
    by mindfulmission on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:25:38 PM EST
    ... that should be 9.00001 or something like that.  :)

    [ Parent ]
    how in the heck (none / 0) (#124)
    by txpolitico67 on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:59:19 PM EST
    is that spinning?

    damn you people are SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO hyper-critical.

    [ Parent ]

    Someone already explained this (none / 0) (#219)
    by tree on Wed May 21, 2008 at 12:31:08 AM EST
    but here goes attempt number two. Traditionally, when the media report election returns they round each candidates percentages to whole numbers. They then take the difference between these two whole numbers and that is listed as the percentage lead of one candidate over another.

    Thus, when Clinton won 50.56% of the vote in the Indiana primary, the number was rounded up to 51%, since 50.56 is greater than half way between 50 and 51. And when Obama got 49.44% of the vote, the number was rounded down to 49% because 49.44 is less than half way between 49 and 50. So then, 51% minus 49% leaves a difference of 2%. This is standard, nothing out of the ordinary.

    The media has always done the conputations this way. But some well known Obama bloggers decided that the convention needed to be overturned when Obama lost Pennsylvania because it made them feel better to say that Obama lost 54.6 to 45.3, or by 9.3 percent, so that they could claim it wasn't a double digit loss.  Before that I am aware of no one who was petty enough to care about stating election percentages to the tenth, in order to assuage their own feelings.

    [ Parent ]

    A "Blow Out" by Hillary Clinton (5.00 / 4) (#7)
    by nycstray on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:06:09 PM EST
    is the lead in to the local news. They are now on Teddy as the main story but I'm looking forward to hearing more about the "Blow Out"  ;)

    Oh, and DWTS was a fun show tonight. I'm guessing by the comments in the other thread it beat the heck outta watchin' Obama, lol!~

    NYC local ABC news had Obama winning majority (5.00 / 1) (#22)
    by jawbone on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:14:52 PM EST
    of pledged delegates tonight, but said Clinton contested this take on things.

    Map, not math for me.

    [ Parent ]

    Same station :) (5.00 / 1) (#68)
    by nycstray on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:28:56 PM EST
    They led in before the news with that followed by the shirtless Jason Taylor. I'll take the shirtless Jason Taylor TYVM!  :D

    [ Parent ]
    Fine, more Christiąn for me :-) (none / 0) (#105)
    by Ellie on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:42:58 PM EST
    Actually, I don't follow the show but I've absorbed the Jason / Christiàn wars from random sibs and co-workers.

    In closing, WOW.

    [ Parent ]

    John King is amazed (5.00 / 2) (#10)
    by ruffian on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:07:11 PM EST
    that votes mailed in weeks ago can already be counted.  God.

    NBC as you would expect (5.00 / 2) (#14)
    by TalkRight on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:09:55 PM EST
    calls it for Obama.. the only network to do so. Candies for their staff..

    ok candies for Wolf too. (none / 0) (#17)
    by TalkRight on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:11:53 PM EST


    [ Parent ]
    Hee hee hee (5.00 / 3) (#18)
    by txpolitico67 on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:12:04 PM EST
    I love open threads.  Allows for a little mischief (not much).

    I think that MT may go more for Hill than BHO.  SD, Daschle will try to deliver that for BHO.  It would be fabulous if it fell flat on his face that it didn't come to pass.

    A losing Democratic senator trying to shore up a solidly red state.  We can all look forward for SD to be put in the win column in Nov for BHO.

    Well (5.00 / 1) (#26)
    by DaveOinSF on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:16:46 PM EST
    Well Montana in recent years has seen an influx of a lot of the wine track liberals fleeing the urban centers.  A western version of Vermont in the making.

    [ Parent ]
    I would think (5.00 / 1) (#49)
    by txpolitico67 on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:23:06 PM EST
    Bozeman may be pretty good territory for Obama.  Didn't know about the changing demographics and the influx of the creative class/wine-sipping types.

    However, there are surely more natives there than this group.  Wishful thinking but I hope that they equate Hillary's strength with an Emersonian style of just doing it for yourself way, much like those in the West are perceived to be.

    [ Parent ]

    so many wine-sippers who want ranches (5.00 / 1) (#72)
    by Kathy on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:29:45 PM EST
    that the locals cannot afford housing.  Ted Turner and some pals set up a fund to help subsidize middle class, working MT's who want to buy homes because they can't afford them on their own.

    [ Parent ]
    He's ahead in MT right now, (5.00 / 2) (#67)
    by eleanora on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:28:41 PM EST
    by @eight points last poll I saw, and has been blanketing our state with ads. We don't watch much tv at our house, but I've already gotten completely sick of them. Haven't seen one ad for Hillary yet, hope she gets enough $ tonight to do a few. Too many ads actually tends to backfire here, even candidates with lots of cash learn to go easy.

    I so wish Gov Schweitzer and Senator Baucus would go ahead and declare for Hillary. Scuttlebutt says they're in her corner, but it would really help to have that boost so they could campaign for her. Haven't heard one way or another about Tester.

    [ Parent ]

    300 plus million dollars and it's still a tie (5.00 / 1) (#164)
    by ChuckieTomato on Tue May 20, 2008 at 11:27:31 PM EST


    [ Parent ]
    Oregon (5.00 / 1) (#19)
    by Stellaaa on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:12:14 PM EST
    No surprise.

    A surprise would have been nice (5.00 / 2) (#23)
    by ruffian on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:14:56 PM EST
    On to Puerto Rico!

    Let's blow Chris Matthews' mind!!!

    [ Parent ]

    Oregon (5.00 / 2) (#20)
    by DaveOinSF on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:13:52 PM EST
    Obama cleaning up in Multnomah (Portland) and Lane (Eugene) Counties.  Hillary competitive in Marion (Salem) and tied in Wasco.

    Congratulations to TL-Kid, Jeralyn. (5.00 / 8) (#21)
    by MarkL on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:13:58 PM EST


    Ditto. You must be so proud and happy, Jeralyn. (5.00 / 4) (#25)
    by jawbone on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:16:28 PM EST


    [ Parent ]
    Ditto. Congratulations! (5.00 / 2) (#38)
    by BostonIndependent on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:20:27 PM EST


    [ Parent ]
    So far, they've counted (5.00 / 1) (#24)
    by TeresaInSnow2 on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:16:02 PM EST
    Portland and the college counties (marked with Eugene/Salem (Corvalis)).

    That's where (none / 0) (#32)
    by flyerhawk on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:19:30 PM EST
    everyone lives.  

    [ Parent ]
    Wow lots of empty land in Oregon (5.00 / 1) (#43)
    by Marvin42 on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:21:46 PM EST
    I mean no one lives out there.

    Oh wait, or is this the new "map" where any area no overwhelmingly not supporting Sen Obama gets erased from the map (a-la KY, WVA, FL, MI)?

    [ Parent ]

    Maybe someone can guess on OR (none / 0) (#63)
    by Kathy on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:26:52 PM EST
    but I know that in MT, the population is so low and the state so big that every person could stand alone with one square mile of empty space around them.

    OR has 3.7 million people.  KY has 4.2mm.  

    [ Parent ]

    In Montana, we have less than a million (none / 0) (#82)
    by athyrio on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:32:52 PM EST
    folks in the entire state which is the 4th largest state in the union land wise....the latte set live in the west mostly....My hubby and I already voted absentee and for Hillary....:-)

    [ Parent ]
    Hence the horse reference in your name! (none / 0) (#91)
    by Kathy on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:34:01 PM EST


    [ Parent ]
    Exactly Kathy!! We raise horses as a hobby (none / 0) (#103)
    by athyrio on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:42:07 PM EST
    as well on our section....Love it here....

    [ Parent ]
    Okay, it's time to hear from MUSA (none / 0) (#185)
    by Cream City on Tue May 20, 2008 at 11:46:40 PM EST
    'cause you have lots of moose there, too, right?

    Let's see if they can call the primaries as well as Kathy's cats.  No actually polling required; just see if the mooses can call this horse race for us!

    [ Parent ]

    Nope lots of empty land (none / 0) (#64)
    by flyerhawk on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:27:24 PM EST
    Eastern Oregon is mostly mountains and desert.  A couple of pockets of towns but not a whole heck of a lot.

    [ Parent ]
    A good majority (none / 0) (#39)
    by TeresaInSnow2 on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:20:34 PM EST
    of folks live there, but since they haven't counted rural areas yet, it's going to get much closer.

    [ Parent ]
    I'll stick (none / 0) (#42)
    by flyerhawk on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:21:44 PM EST
    with my 15 point win.  

    [ Parent ]
    Everyone who "counts" (none / 0) (#41)
    by angie on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:21:31 PM EST
    to Obama, you mean -- cause it is only 30% of the vote per Fox & CNN.

    [ Parent ]
    What? (none / 0) (#47)
    by flyerhawk on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:22:58 PM EST
    Where did I say that certain votes count?

    20% of the population of Oregon is in the Portland area.  

    [ Parent ]

    You don't know the meaning of (none / 0) (#55)
    by angie on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:25:06 PM EST
    "everyone" either?

    [ Parent ]
    Wasco 50 50 71percent reporting (5.00 / 2) (#27)
    by Prabhata on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:16:56 PM EST
    Maybe the rural vote will be closer and make BO's win less than 10.  I hope so.

    Congrats (5.00 / 1) (#28)
    by Jgarza on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:17:03 PM EST
    Criminal defense I hope?

    yes, criminal defense (5.00 / 7) (#65)
    by Jeralyn on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:27:33 PM EST
    with a great Denver firm specializing in it. He's been clerking there for 6 months and they offered him an associate's position last month. He's thrilled. He's been doing federal crack cocaine sentence reduction motions all month so it gives us a lot to chat about.

    Can't wait to watch him in court.

    [ Parent ]

    Thats amazing (5.00 / 1) (#84)
    by Jgarza on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:33:07 PM EST
    My mother, single mother, got her PhD while When i was in my teens.  I know it really helped me when I was in college.  I also know it helped my brother when he went to law school(also criminal defense).  I'm sure the example of your achievement meant a lot to talkleft kid.

    [ Parent ]
    how wonderful to see (none / 0) (#79)
    by Kathy on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:32:11 PM EST
    all your hard work and love and sacrifice embodied by such a wonderful young man.

    [ Parent ]
    May I share? (5.00 / 3) (#30)
    by suisser on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:18:56 PM EST
    Emailed popular WNYC radio host to point out numerous errors he made today regarding HRC, ie "she campaigned in FL" , " Broke rules" "Is 20 Mil in debt to herself" and on and on

    I get this back

    "It's a talk show and I misspoke. Listeners called in and corrected me.
    That sort of thing happens when a guest doesn't show up and you're
    forced to ad lib with no preparation. It wasn't part of a misinformation
    campaign and it wasn't like I was claiming I had ducked bullets on the
    airport tarmac in Bosnia."

    2 cheers for the media say I

    Sheesh (5.00 / 3) (#40)
    by cawaltz on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:20:50 PM EST
    Aren't you picky expecting folks to hae their fact straight before they speak? ;)

    Jeralyn, congrats to you and your son.

    [ Parent ]

    whoa... (5.00 / 6) (#54)
    by Tess on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:24:30 PM EST
    What a knucklehead!  And this is what they call journalism?  

    There was a time in a galaxy far far away when you'd get fired for a comment like that!

    Sad.

    [ Parent ]

    The "Big Rally" in Oregon (5.00 / 4) (#34)
    by Leisa on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:19:32 PM EST
    Here is the a very probable reason for the turnout for Obama on Sunday...

    This makes me feel more hopeful that this will be a tight race.

    Propaganda at it's finest (5.00 / 4) (#45)
    by TeresaInSnow2 on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:22:12 PM EST
    and what we can expect from an Obama campaign and administration.

    [ Parent ]
    I read this somewhere else (5.00 / 3) (#51)
    by bjorn on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:23:50 PM EST
    but did not hear one news person mention it.

    [ Parent ]
    Wow, just like Bush's Potemkin rallies (none / 0) (#136)
    by Ellie on Tue May 20, 2008 at 11:06:54 PM EST
    Ideally some semi-awake journalist will see if the free (unmentioned) concert had free beer too. Any coverage I saw made it seem like all those people were drawn to Obama's magical Hope You Got Change platform.

    John King just said "Sen Clinton can't win by any traditional math!"

    What the frackety farkin FRACK???

    The Dems need to explain this or step in and issue a correction.

    [ Parent ]

    I saw a lot of photos that made it look (none / 0) (#187)
    by Cream City on Tue May 20, 2008 at 11:48:48 PM EST
    like a cross between Woodstock and a frat party.  Lots of boyz without shirts on but lots of paint on their hairless chests.  Ugh.

    That's a major difference from Clinton rallies.  We don't go topless. :-)

    [ Parent ]

    You're now... (none / 0) (#203)
    by Alec82 on Wed May 21, 2008 at 12:04:01 AM EST
    ...linking to stories promoted by Robert Knight???

     I mean....that...is...something.  Not sure what to call it, but something.  

     Celebrate Senator Clinton's win in KY, but don't promote Knight, of all people.  

    [ Parent ]

    When did right winger (5.00 / 2) (#44)
    by Stellaaa on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:22:07 PM EST
    Gergen become the big Civil Rights fighter, telling Hillary what to do.  

    But isn't it just great for them? (5.00 / 4) (#60)
    by Maria Garcia on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:26:21 PM EST
    ...they can wipe away years of bigotryand intolerance on their parts by this one vote for Obama. It's like being born again.

    [ Parent ]
    That conversation offended me. She should (5.00 / 3) (#71)
    by Teresa on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:29:38 PM EST
    tell any racists out there that she doesn't want their vote? Will Obama tell the anti-woman vote the same? I voted for HC and I volunteered a lot of my time for Harold Ford here in TN. It's not his race, it's what he speaks for. I say speaks because I'm still not sure what he stands for.

    If they had asked me, I would have said race is important to me...it's a huge leap forward for our country. But I would still have voted for Hillary.

    [ Parent ]

    I was offended as well (5.00 / 2) (#106)
    by americanincanada on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:43:12 PM EST
    It made me change the chanell and run from the room. Gergen asserting that the race issue and the Wright issue is something Hillary has to fix.

    And then Toobin saying Hillay needs to look at the larger picture.

    [ Parent ]

    Why the F*** does she have to (5.00 / 1) (#129)
    by nycstray on Tue May 20, 2008 at 11:03:18 PM EST
    fix everything? Let Mr. Unity do it. It's his schtick.

    [ Parent ]
    I'm e-mailing them.. (5.00 / 1) (#148)
    by kc on Tue May 20, 2008 at 11:14:09 PM EST
    even though I didn't see it. I've been boycotting CNN and MSNBC for a while now.

    Not that my e-mails achieve anything, but it makes me feel that I am doing something. What a double standard.

    [ Parent ]

    No one should tell racists not to vote for Hillary (none / 0) (#221)
    by Newt on Wed May 21, 2008 at 12:44:20 AM EST
    but Hillary should not encourage racism either.

    "...hard-working Americans, white Americans..."

    I'm sure you've covered this on another thread.  

    [ Parent ]

    I have the tv on mute (5.00 / 3) (#74)
    by angie on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:29:53 PM EST
    I can see the #s on the bottom of the screen just fine without the comments from the peanut gallery.

    [ Parent ]
    Stella, (none / 0) (#75)
    by Lil on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:30:28 PM EST
    that segment just made me sick. Racism: IACF and they are to a person talking about her being out. I'm just sick. expletive again deleted. They all make me sick, especially Gergen. And the condescending attitude about Clinton having a long career ahead of her...

    [ Parent ]
    Welllll..... (none / 0) (#77)
    by Spike on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:30:58 PM EST
    Remember that right winger Gergen worked in the Clinton White House.

    [ Parent ]
    So, you are saying he's an Obama supporter? (5.00 / 1) (#83)
    by Kathy on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:33:03 PM EST


    [ Parent ]
    An Obamacan....only after the NC poll with (none / 0) (#95)
    by bjorn on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:38:16 PM EST
    Hillary winning with the help of Republican women we need to come up with a name for Clinton repubs.

    [ Parent ]
    republican women for Clinton? (5.00 / 1) (#101)
    by Kathy on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:41:12 PM EST
    Let's call them what they are:  winners.

    "I'm going to keep making our case until we have a nominee, whoever she may be."



    [ Parent ]
    No Idea (none / 0) (#104)
    by Spike on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:42:32 PM EST
    I have no idea who Gergen is supporting. Someone asked why Gergen was trying to advise Clinton. I was only pointing out that Gergen was an advisor to Bill Clinton. I assume that he and Hillary Clinton are friends.

    [ Parent ]
    With friends like that..... (none / 0) (#202)
    by miriam on Wed May 21, 2008 at 12:04:00 AM EST
    Gergin has made several sexist remarks about Clinton.  But tonight was just plain disgusting.  Hillary is supposed to march around telling people not to vote for her if they are racists????  (My previously low blood pressure is really hurting from this campaign.)  Has anyone like Gergin suggested that Barack Obama should tell voters he doesn't want their votes if they are sexist?

    THE MEDIA IS COMPRISED OF IDIOTS.  

    [ Parent ]

    He's a Republican. (none / 0) (#81)
    by MarkL on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:32:41 PM EST


    [ Parent ]
    Gee, Gergen isn't a right-winger (none / 0) (#167)
    by gyrfalcon on Tue May 20, 2008 at 11:29:33 PM EST
    He's a middle-of-the-road straddler.  He was in Bill Clinton's White House for a while, remember?


    [ Parent ]
    Kudos To Jeralyn's Kid (5.00 / 3) (#48)
    by creeper on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:23:03 PM EST
    What a joy it is when you know they're going to be okay.

    All ways the high road for Hillary (5.00 / 4) (#52)
    by TalkRight on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:23:51 PM EST
    CNN panel saying she should tell her supporters IF you are voting for me because Obama is Black.. then I don't want your vote..

    Again they are calling Hillary supporters racist.. I just don't get these pundits..

    Gergen particularly (5.00 / 4) (#56)
    by Stellaaa on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:25:38 PM EST
    the old geezer Republican telling anyone to "take the high road"

    [ Parent ]
    He used to be (5.00 / 1) (#144)
    by MonaL on Tue May 20, 2008 at 11:08:56 PM EST
    pretty centrist until he fell into the kool-aid tank for Obama.  I don't think he realizes how really obvious his love for BO is. Not much credibility anymore.  Toobin on the other hand, seems to be playing devils' advocate often.  He's a nice contrast to the rest of them.

    [ Parent ]
    IMHO, Toobin is nuts (5.00 / 1) (#179)
    by gyrfalcon on Tue May 20, 2008 at 11:39:24 PM EST
    He's trying, but he said earlier tonight that his prediction was that Obama would get Chelsea (not a typo) to play a huge role in his GE campaign and thus heal the wounds.

    I have no idea why he's allowed to pontificate on politics.  He's a decent legal analyst, but simply isn't competent on political stuff, I think.

    [ Parent ]

    Obama's supposed to "pimp" (5.00 / 2) (#204)
    by Cream City on Wed May 21, 2008 at 12:06:47 AM EST
    the Clintons' daughter now?  What will David Shuster have to say about that?

    I wish the Gergens and other guys having their male midlife crisis meltdowns all over the toob would just retract their claws, put down their teacups, and periodically make some sense.

    [ Parent ]

    The educated dummies---people (5.00 / 4) (#58)
    by MarkL on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:26:00 PM EST
    who think they are better than the "rifraf" because of a degree.

    [ Parent ]
    So should Obama tell his AA supporters the same (5.00 / 7) (#59)
    by bjorn on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:26:11 PM EST
    thing....why is it always Hillary has to come to the rescue.  Never once has anyone called on him to make things right. Furious.

    [ Parent ]
    oh because she is the big MOM of the party (none / 0) (#115)
    by TalkRight on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:53:32 PM EST


    [ Parent ]
    can they NOT discuss the sexist issue with same (5.00 / 3) (#76)
    by TalkRight on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:30:53 PM EST
    seriousness...

    [ Parent ]
    I hope they also said Obama should tell his (5.00 / 3) (#108)
    by bridget on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:45:57 PM EST
    supporters IF you are voting for me because Hillary is a woman and not black ... then I don't want your vote.

    Which one of those highminded pundits said that?

    I guessed it. Zero.

    [ Parent ]

    Wow, CNN (5.00 / 5) (#62)
    by Lil on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:26:39 PM EST
    I wish I had a number to call CNN right now. Just wow. Yeah we are all racist because we vote for Clinton. And Donna Brazille gets to sit there being all quiet...wow, just wow. I'm sick and really doubt the party is gonna get unified anytime soon.

    yes the core democrat (5.00 / 1) (#85)
    by TalkRight on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:33:24 PM EST
    constituents especially we the working class white voters are racist.. get over with it.. and one more thing.. the leaders of this party are sexist.. I know I have to live with that.

    [ Parent ]
    Speak for yourself (none / 0) (#151)
    by cawaltz on Tue May 20, 2008 at 11:17:13 PM EST
    I'm not now, nor have I ever been racist.

    [ Parent ]
    Boycott them people... (none / 0) (#161)
    by kc on Tue May 20, 2008 at 11:26:29 PM EST
    Hit them where it counts----ratings/money.

    [ Parent ]
    Nope. I've decided that as the Dems (5.00 / 1) (#209)
    by Cream City on Wed May 21, 2008 at 12:10:38 AM EST
    have decided that I'm racist, I'm going to stop donating and working for my African American member of Congress, my African American local officials and judges, and I'm just going to save my money and time.  Maybe I'll spend it on Jeff Foxworthy CD's.

    Then, when white males win all those seats I worked for here, maybe the white males on tv will stop intoning at me that I'm a racist.  Because when they return the white males to their rightful place in the world, and we only have white males again in office, there will be no racism again.  That's how it works in their miniscule minds.

    [ Parent ]

    Donna may be hearing us (none / 0) (#135)
    by MonaL on Tue May 20, 2008 at 11:06:06 PM EST
    She did concede that HRC supporters were passionate and they'd be very important in the GE (or words to that effect).  She, or maybe all of the DNC are getting it, don't dismiss Hillary, don't take us for granted or we walk. It's finally sinking in.

    [ Parent ]
    Congratulations to Jeralyn and her son (5.00 / 1) (#66)
    by athyrio on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:28:23 PM EST
    on such a wonderful achievement!!! So happy for you both!!!

    Ditto, good news for you. congrats (none / 0) (#88)
    by Lil on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:33:54 PM EST


    [ Parent ]
    Oar-uh-gone (5.00 / 1) (#70)
    by txpolitico67 on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:29:22 PM EST
    I hope that the actions of the NARAL chapter in OR would have been an vote changer.

    Since NARAL is a liberal organization, and OR is a pretty liberal state, it would give those there pause...like, "I wonder why they aren't jumping on the Obama bandwagon?"  "Maybe they know something I don't?" "Why are they rejecting the national endorsement?"

    It would certainly make me pick up the phone and call NARAL and ask them why.  It would have been a fair question.

    BTD was close (5.00 / 1) (#87)
    by Melchizedek on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:33:51 PM EST
    9 points was just about it. Well, we can at least pretend.

    Crazy. Gergen says Hill should tell her voters (5.00 / 3) (#93)
    by masslib on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:36:50 PM EST
    don't vote for me because I am white.  No word on BO telling white liberal men don't vote for me because I'm a man.

    That was funny (5.00 / 1) (#127)
    by MonaL on Tue May 20, 2008 at 11:02:23 PM EST
    Did you see how really quiet and serious he was when he said it.  In a later segment, Begala said, "uh, I don't think a white woman who's running behind should say that."  Jamal even agreed with Paul.  Great moments in pundit-head TV.

    Earlier than that Toobin thought it'd be great if Chelsea started campaigning for BO, the rest of the panel looked at him like, "are you crazy?"  another great moment.

    [ Parent ]

    lots of late votes (5.00 / 1) (#99)
    by Robert Oak on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:39:11 PM EST
    so while I expected Portland to be the stronghold and it still might be it looks like stoner Eugene are the ones who really voted for Obama heavily.  ...once again yet another college town sort of area and unfortunately DeFazio (who I love, fantastic rep) endorsed Obama.

    60,000 (5.00 / 2) (#102)
    by DaveOinSF on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:41:33 PM EST
    Obama's lead with about 50% in is 60,000 votes.  If he doubles that to 120,000, Hillary still will have netted 130,000 votes on the day.

    Nada.. (5.00 / 2) (#113)
    by BostonIndependent on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:49:27 PM EST
    50% of the precincts already reported seem to be all in the pop. heavy western corridor. Methinks he won't gain much more.. Here's hoping :-)

    [ Parent ]
    Spoke too soon.. (5.00 / 1) (#116)
    by BostonIndependent on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:55:11 PM EST
    Eugene and Portland still seem to be coming in heavily for Obama.. so he could still rack up big numbers there. Sigh. The 'entitled generation' is firmly in his corner -- LOL!

    [ Parent ]
    MSNBC Follies (5.00 / 6) (#107)
    by Decal on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:43:36 PM EST
    Chris Matthews interviewing alleged independent commentator Michelle Bernard (a Hillary hating Republican).  Matthews asks about Hilary's complaints about sexism (he never uses the word media of course).  Bernard says the constant complaints about it from the Clinton camp aren't helping.  She then contrasts that with how the Obama campaign has completely refrained from talking about racism!  Matthews seemingly assents to all this.  What color is the sky in MSNBC world?  

    there is no sky in MSNBC world (5.00 / 2) (#109)
    by bjorn on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:46:37 PM EST
    only big dart boards with Clintons face on them.  They have lost all credibility, the only reason to watch occassionally is for the comedy value.  But I have boycotted Keith's show completely.

    [ Parent ]
    Ministry of Truth n/t (5.00 / 2) (#112)
    by angie on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:48:45 PM EST


    [ Parent ]
    This is excellent (5.00 / 2) (#117)
    by MonaL on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:55:39 PM EST
    Hillary's camp thought they'd lose OR by high double-digits.  I was expecting 19-20 points.  If it ends up at 13-15 points, I'm thrilled.

    And she still wins the less-educated, blue-collar vote not matter how the Obama News Channel tries to spin it.  I'm really glad I don't have to spend 2 hours of my day watching KO and Tweety anymore.

    Clinton/Obama 08!

    I was just thinking that! (5.00 / 1) (#128)
    by eleanora on Tue May 20, 2008 at 11:02:56 PM EST
    I thought she was expected to lose OR by at least 20 points, maybe more. So anything in the teens is pretty sweet o/

    [ Parent ]
    Donna says they might reduce the penalty for MI/FL (5.00 / 1) (#118)
    by TalkRight on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:55:46 PM EST


    Isn't that sweet. I say count no (5.00 / 2) (#120)
    by MarkL on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:57:22 PM EST
    votes from FL for Obama, since he advertised heavily there.

    [ Parent ]
    The rulez (5.00 / 2) (#126)
    by cawaltz on Tue May 20, 2008 at 11:02:04 PM EST
    only apply when they benefit the Annoited One, you silly.

    If Donna doesn't look happy lately it must be because she's taken a look at the electoral maps. It appears there are an awful lot of "racist" states that won't vote for Obama in an Obama McCain head to head.

    [ Parent ]

    when 8 in 10 Clinton voters... (5.00 / 4) (#138)
    by TalkRight on Tue May 20, 2008 at 11:07:18 PM EST
    say they'd be DISsatisfied if Obama were the nominee; about 60% of Clinton voters in Oregon said the same... you know why Donna is so gloomy.. the SD's would also be looking for some answers WHY?

    [ Parent ]
    I've been saying this all along (5.00 / 2) (#132)
    by s5 on Tue May 20, 2008 at 11:04:47 PM EST
    The penalty for Florida is going to be 50%, just like it should have been from the beginning, just like the Republicans did for their primary. All of this uncertainty could have been avoided if they just set the penalty up front.

    [ Parent ]
    But If It Had Been that from the Beginning (5.00 / 3) (#158)
    by BDB on Tue May 20, 2008 at 11:22:04 PM EST
    Then Clinton might have gotten a bump from the Florida result like McCain did.  No, better to keep your thumb on the scale until four days before the primaries end.

    [ Parent ]
    I remember MSNBC... (5.00 / 2) (#177)
    by Dawn Davenport on Tue May 20, 2008 at 11:38:39 PM EST
    ...totally ignoring the FL results that night.

    I couldn't believe they weren't even running the vote totals on the crawl.

    [ Parent ]

    Yeah, like that was an accident (5.00 / 1) (#201)
    by lambertstrether on Wed May 21, 2008 at 12:03:36 AM EST
    Puh-leeze.

    [ Parent ]
    LOL: CNN reverse spin on Obama's 'victory' speech (5.00 / 4) (#121)
    by Ellie on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:57:59 PM EST
    Tonight's planned IOWA victory speech -- :: snivel :: Where it all began!! -- wasn't to declare victory in a Mission Accomplished self-oronatation, but to celebrate that he can "see the finish line!"

    WOO HOO. I used to run track and I gotta tell you, pausing 6/8 of the way to flex and prance around like a feckin eedjit always worked for me.

    oh wait ...

    The tortoise and the hare! (5.00 / 1) (#210)
    by Cream City on Wed May 21, 2008 at 12:14:43 AM EST
    Your track metaphor cracked me up -- and reminded me of the story of the tortoise and the hare.  Remember, the hare is so over-confident that he stops along the way to preen . . . while the tortoise just keep steadily moving along.  And wins.

    I think I just must celebrate the start of summer with a turtle sundae tomorrow -- but I'm going to think of it as a Hillary Clinton sundae. :-)

    [ Parent ]

    Fox heavy on the sexism (5.00 / 2) (#123)
    by waldenpond on Tue May 20, 2008 at 10:58:58 PM EST
    discussion tonight.  Earlier joint ticket.  Now sexism in the campaign and how Clinton has been treated.  How she had to prove she was tough, then prove she was sensitive. Edwards guy called out, NH when E and O jumped on Clinton.... you're likeable enough (everyone sighed, someone went sspppphst, that one was bad)

    I like watching Fox.  I see exactly where they are going in how they are praising Clinton.  They will be able to go after Obama for denying the choice of the (working class) people for VP, go after him for his personal sexism (women), being elitist (men), how tough she is (Obama not?), he's now the machine candidate with the backing of the party elite (not change at all) interesting themes all in one night.

    I STILL don't like or trust FOX (5.00 / 1) (#133)
    by cawaltz on Tue May 20, 2008 at 11:05:50 PM EST
    Anyone who argues in court they don't HAVE an obligation to report the truth loses the right to call themselves a news network IMO. TV is strictly entertainment in this house.

    [ Parent ]
    I don't trust Fox either (5.00 / 2) (#166)
    by Valhalla on Tue May 20, 2008 at 11:28:59 PM EST
    they're no friends to Democrats, they're jumping on the sexism theme because they want to promote division in the Party.  You can often take their spin as the harbinger of Repub campaign themes.  So, even though I don't know how any single one of them will be able to say it with a straight face, I expect Republicans to play up the Obama is misogynist angle as much as possible.

    [ Parent ]
    This Is Part of How They Will Run Against Him (5.00 / 3) (#159)
    by BDB on Tue May 20, 2008 at 11:23:49 PM EST
    and it will be somewhat successful if only because it's true.  They will then combine it with their untrue slurs to give them credibility,

    I'll say this for them, the GOP know how to win - or at least be competitive - in presidential elections even in bad years for them.  The Dems often seem to prefer the noble loss.

    [ Parent ]

    nothing noble i can see (5.00 / 1) (#169)
    by sancho on Tue May 20, 2008 at 11:31:05 PM EST
    about losing with obama, the noble vote-suppressor of michigan and florida. i know he's had help but he's the "leader" of the stomp-the-voters campaign team.

    [ Parent ]
    McCaskill falsely Targets Ferraro (5.00 / 2) (#130)
    by TalkRight on Tue May 20, 2008 at 11:03:19 PM EST
    it is bitterly disappointing to me that a woman like Geraldine Ferraro would actually publicly say she is thinking about supporting John McCain,

    Ferraro said she won't vote for Obama.. she did not say she will vote for McCain..

    When a person falsely implicates you as a racist.. while himself acting in the most sexist behavior.. I don't see how she could reward that person.. perhaps McCaskill should take the high road and acknowledge Ferraro's contributions to the greater cause than go for the mudsling that she is adept at.

    McCaskill makes me embarrassed (5.00 / 1) (