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Biden on Palin

By TChris, Section Elections 2008
Posted on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 09:09:39 AM EST
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Joe Biden on Sarah Palin's media coverage:

Asked if some of the criticism aimed at Palin has been sexist, Biden said: "Yes, by you guys in the media. ... When I heard that media response, you know, this coming from some of the right-wing guys, saying that, 'Well, how can you be a mother and a vice president at the same time?' ... I mean, millions of women in America are going through exactly what she (is going) through. And guess what? They can handle it."

Amen.

Biden on Palin's speech: [more ...]

"I didn't hear a word mentioned about the middle class or healthcare or about how people are going to fill up their gas tanks. ... She never once mentioned the word Afghanistan, never once mentioned the word Pakistan," he said. "The phrase 'middle class' was not mentioned once." ...

The Democratic vice presidential nominee noted that the speech reeked of the influence of Karl Rove.

"That's sort of the Rovian way of doing things," he said. "You know, I think it's a political skill set that Republicans have used with some effectiveness over the years and so it's not surprising to me." ...

"So much of what was said was just simply not true." The senator cited taxes as one example, noting the case of Palin's sister who owns a gas station. "I should let her sister know she'd be better off under a Democratic plan."

Crafty Biden did his best to raise expectations for Palin's debate performance, characterizing her as a formidable adversary, knowing full well that he has a huge advantage in his knowledge of national and international issues.

"I think she's gonna be a pretty skillful debater. I think it'll be a tough debate for me."

Right. Biden could phone it in and still win easily. But the more people expect of the GOP's newest star, the worse she looks when she falls flat.

< Late Night: The Road to Nowhere | Not Taking A Page From Hillary: Why Palin's Speech Erred >

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    Biden on Palin | 76 comments (76 topical)

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    Joe Biden (5.00 / 3) (#1)
    by Pegasus on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 09:13:11 AM EST
    is a pretty sharp guy.

    he only has to be as sharp (none / 0) (#69)
    by Salo on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 11:47:15 AM EST
    as Kinnock against Thatcher and the entire election is going to be lost. One false move and Biden is going to get smoked.

    [ Parent ]
    Kudos to Biden (5.00 / 9) (#6)
    by Coral on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 09:18:16 AM EST
    Attacking Palin on kitchen-table issues: health care, middle class wages, rising gas prices, etc.- is the way to go.

    Attacking her on issues of home & family does nothing but play into the culture wars, where the GOP is most at home.

    exactly (none / 0) (#56)
    by wystler on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 11:04:52 AM EST
    leave the sexist stuff to Dr. Laura

    Palin's getting abuse, but it's people on the right who've broken out the sexist rants.

    [ Parent ]

    Rush Limbaugh says the "drive-bys" (none / 0) (#74)
    by oculus on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 12:55:21 PM EST
    [by which I assume he means the female talking heads on cable news coverage] have kids and work but are saying Gov. Palin shouldn't be VP because she has kids.  He is firmly in Palin's camp.

    [ Parent ]
    Thank you, Joe Biden (none / 0) (#77)
    by AccidentalTourist on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 01:51:12 PM EST
    for focusing on policy and ideas.

    This is a smarter strategy and hopefully will move people away from tasteless rumormongering and sexist remarks.

    [ Parent ]

    Sexism (5.00 / 3) (#14)
    by bocajeff on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 09:41:52 AM EST
    I listened to Randi Rhodes on Friday (the day of the VP announcement) and she referred to Gov. Palin as a "chick" and "girl" more than 2 dozen times in the first 1/2 hour (we counted) as a way to diminish her. Alex Bennet said on Sirius Radio Left yesterday that any women who has children past the age of 40 was "highly irresponsible" (the vast majority of births to women past this age are totally fine).

    You think the sexism aimed at Sen. Clinton was bad? Wait til they get through with Gov. Palin.

    were you trapped? (5.00 / 3) (#33)
    by dws3665 on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 10:17:43 AM EST
    Could you not get away from the radio? I think they should make this into some kind of horror movie: "Trapped with Randi!" Ugh. She is puerile.

    As others have said, the "Left media" including blogs and talk radio are doing Obama no favors. But this has little to do with the Obama campaign's treatment of this issue. I thought Biden's earlier comment about how "pretty" Palin is was cringeworthy and inappropriate, but this statement is spot on.

    I hope Harry Reid's office is paying shrill, er, strict attention to it.

    [ Parent ]

    I hope you're wrong. (none / 0) (#17)
    by ccpup on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 09:51:22 AM EST
    I suspect the Republicans are almost banking on that being the response from the Dems in order to distract the voters from the failure of the Bush Years, anger women and others who are disgusted by sexism and either add votes to the McCain column because of it or make people disheartened enough to not vote at all.

    Besides, one day talking about the sexism leveled against Palin is a day when the Media isn't singing -- and the voters aren't hearing -- the praises of Obama.

    And it would be a nightmare to find Obama constantly on defense having to answer to the Media's constant use of sexism against Palin.  Even if he's innocent of it, eventually, with his constantly being on defense, he begins to look guilty.

    [ Parent ]

    In fairness to Randi... (none / 0) (#57)
    by kdog on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 11:05:56 AM EST
    I can't judge the context like you can because I wasn't listening, but "chick" and "girl" are not necessarily demeaning.  

    Randi's abrasive no holds barred style turns alotta people off...but I kinda like it.  

    [ Parent ]

    and yet (none / 0) (#62)
    by Redshoes on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 11:22:34 AM EST
    why do I think they were intended to insult and demean?

    Randi became the Left's answer to Rush.  As that old pol Stevenson noted "He who slings mud loses ground."  

    [ Parent ]

    This is completely OT, but (5.00 / 1) (#16)
    by JAB on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 09:48:14 AM EST
    as a crime law blog, there may want to be a post about this

    Kwame Kilpatrick (mayor of Detroit) has resigned and pled guilty to obstruction of justice by perjury.

    Woo Hoo!  The people of Detroit and southeastern Michigan can start the healing from the cesspool that was his administration.

    LINK

    Joe Biden on Palin (5.00 / 2) (#20)
    by BDB on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 09:59:40 AM EST
    "There's a gigantic difference between John McCain and Barack Obama and between me and I suspect my vice presidential opponent," Biden said.

    "She's good-looking," he quipped

    Yeah, those right-wing guys sure are sexist pigs.

    Lighten up. (4.25 / 4) (#23)
    by JoeA on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 10:00:58 AM EST
    That's sexist?  To me it's an self deprecating and objective statement of fact.

    [ Parent ]
    do you know any women? (5.00 / 1) (#30)
    by Capt Howdy on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 10:11:26 AM EST
    try asking one what they think about it

    [ Parent ]
    I know plenty of women (5.00 / 1) (#48)
    by Dadler on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 10:44:42 AM EST
    They don't get offended a tenth as often as people on this blog seem to.  Every reference to physical features, for example.  You don't think women make comments about other women?  Please.

    [ Parent ]
    Not to mention (none / 0) (#58)
    by TChris on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 11:14:32 AM EST
    the readers of this blog who were commenting last night on how hot Palin's husband is.

    [ Parent ]
    The obvious solution.... (none / 0) (#68)
    by kdog on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 11:46:25 AM EST
    is unisex burkas for everybody...that way the good-looking people won't be faced with the horror of others acknowledging their good looks.

    [ Parent ]
    Woman, Here (none / 0) (#49)
    by daring grace on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 10:45:15 AM EST
    What do I think of Biden's comment?

    Silly
    Other generational (Old guy, tin ear)
    Ultimately unimportant

    I'd say this if it was something a Republican said about a Democrat woman too.

    Maybe if Biden continues to make these kinds of comments I would upgrade my reaction to annoyed, offended. But he has a long way to go to get to outrage and I don't see him heading that way.

    [ Parent ]

    All my life.... (none / 0) (#60)
    by kdog on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 11:16:20 AM EST
    I've been telling women they are better looking than I am, even in the rare cases when it ain't true:)

    I've yet to meet one who got offended by it.

    But like Dadler said, the comments at talkleft ain't exactly the norm.  People seem to hold extreme views on sexism and racism around here...merely trying to have an honest debate about these topics will get ya in hot water.

    [ Parent ]

    A lot of people hold (none / 0) (#83)
    by Bluesage on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 05:29:54 PM EST
    Strong views, not necessarily extreme views, on sexism and racism after witnessing what was done to both Hillary and Bill Clinton in the primary race.  That was extreme and is when many lost all respect for the so-called "progressive" blogs, the ridiculous media and the obviously possessed wing of the Obama supporters which seemed to be most of them.  The leaders of the Democratic Party lost all perspective and encouraged this behavior and manipulated the outcome and lost many life-long members. So there are strong views and long memories to contend with.  

    [ Parent ]
    focusing on her looks (5.00 / 2) (#36)
    by dws3665 on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 10:20:24 AM EST
    is sexist. Did you hear anyone besides Chris Matthews talk about male candidate's handsomeness? This kind of statement reinforces the notion that women's worth and importance can and should be judged on their appearance. That is sexist.

    Making a self-deprecating joke about it doesn't make it less sexist. The message is still "ain't she pretty! (pat on head)."

    [ Parent ]

    Yeah (5.00 / 2) (#42)
    by flyerhawk on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 10:33:46 AM EST
    it's not like the media would focus on a picture of a male candidate with his shirt off.  

    Nah that would never happen.

    They would never refer to Obama as dreamy

    It amazes me that some of you are so determined to find sexism at every turn that you seem to think that politics has never been puerile before women became prominent politicians.

    [ Parent ]

    JOHN EDWARDS HAIR!!!! (5.00 / 4) (#47)
    by Dadler on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 10:40:42 AM EST
    We are getting ridiculous.  Sexism in the United States exists, it is not on par with anything approaching the evil it is beginning to be treated as.  It is what it is.  It is NOT something we should be so afraid of that we fail to speak truth to power, simply because the power is wearing a pants suit.  We've now given Republicans a new reverse talking point.  Congratulations all sexists and hysterics.  You think Palin doesn't use the language of sexism?  You don't think hockey-mom is sexist, since it implies a more important function than hockey-dad?  Stop giving Republicans a strategy.  Ignore her or do something worthwhile, all this equivocating in between nonsense is pointless.

    [ Parent ]
    They talk about how handsome the (5.00 / 1) (#64)
    by Grace on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 11:37:08 AM EST
    men are when they are handsome.

    Unfortunately, most of our male politicians look like lumpy mashed potatoes.  

    Commenting on breasts and rear ends is sexist and offensive.  There is a huge difference between "You look nice in that dress" and "Your butt looks fine in that dress."  One is acceptable and one is not.      

    [ Parent ]

    I saw the tape of him saying that (none / 0) (#61)
    by Grace on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 11:21:04 AM EST
    on TV and I also believe it was meant to be self deprecating humor.  It wasn't a sexist comment.

    Don't forget:  She's only been announced as VP a day before so he probably didn't really know that much about her to say what differences existed aside from the obvious ones.  

    [ Parent ]

    Biden is right (5.00 / 1) (#70)
    by Grace on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 11:49:23 AM EST
    On the issue of the media, the worst questions I heard last night came from Larry King.  He asked something similar to:  "Does she had a "right to parade her disabled child and pregnant daughter on the stage?"  I was appalled at that question.  Did Larry King ask if Dick Cheney had a right to parade his lesbian daughter on stage?  The question was just offensive.  Her pregnant daughter and disabled child are part of her family!    

    It isn't (4.00 / 3) (#2)
    by Emma on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 09:13:38 AM EST
    coming from the right wing guys.  It's coming from the left wing guys.  As it has been for months.

    The right wing only says it... (5.00 / 1) (#5)
    by wasabi on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 09:17:36 AM EST
    The right wing only says it when they think their mikes are turned off.

    Dr. "I'm MY Kid's Mom" Laura thinks she is a bad parent for not putting her youngens first FWIW.

    [ Parent ]

    True, but I think Biden.... (5.00 / 2) (#8)
    by alexei on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 09:21:34 AM EST
    Hit this right.  He certainly acknowledged the sexism, he affirmed women's motherhood and working, and he pointed out, what I thought was missing, the issues important to voters.  This is the best response yet from the Dems.

    I also agree with his keeping the expectations up, the Dems sure blew it when they dampened those before her speech.

    [ Parent ]

    Which shows they could have noted the sexism (5.00 / 1) (#46)
    by jawbone on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 10:40:31 AM EST
    hitting Hillary--but then it was to their advantage to ignore it.

    Feh.

    Actually, several people had predicted that Repubs would be stronger against MCM sexism than the Dems were--and they were right. There wasn't a Repub woman (did any men mention this?) that didn't say they they weren't insulted by an MCMer's question about whether Palin could be a mother and a VP. They all said you would never ask this of a man.

    Now, about the more subtle sexist comments, not so much said--bcz subtle IS harder to deal with. And the MCM will drop the mommy approach and find something else. Still to be seen how that will be taken on.

    [ Parent ]

    Yes, (none / 0) (#29)
    by Emma on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 10:10:36 AM EST
    He did hit it right.

    [ Parent ]
    There's not a single "left wing guy" (none / 0) (#4)
    by Pegasus on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 09:16:08 AM EST
    at any of the major media outlets.  There's a left-wing woman, I guess, but as a general rule the far left is excluded from the corporate media.

    [ Parent ]
    Ah, well (4.00 / 4) (#28)
    by Emma on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 10:10:13 AM EST
    I guess I should have said:  "It's not coming from the right-wing guys.  It's coming from Obama supporters as it has been for months."

    Better so?

    [ Parent ]

    Sure. (none / 0) (#31)
    by Pegasus on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 10:14:02 AM EST
    I just think it's kinda funny when people fall into the trap of thinking the left side of the media spectrum is actually the left side of the national spectrum.  I do it too sometimes.

    [ Parent ]
    Point taken. :) (none / 0) (#75)
    by Emma on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 01:44:54 PM EST


    [ Parent ]
    Actually no (none / 0) (#44)
    by flyerhawk on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 10:38:15 AM EST
    Broadsides accusations of sexism against Obama supporters is not better.

    [ Parent ]
    Obviously (none / 0) (#82)
    by Emma on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 02:59:49 PM EST
    I can't please everybody all the time. If you are offended, please refer to my original comment.

    [ Parent ]
    I did see it. (none / 0) (#76)
    by Emma on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 01:46:48 PM EST
    I expected no better and it was not pretty.  But outright public sexism against Palin isn't coming exclusively, or even primarily, from the right-wing guys.  (Hey, Dobson loves her.)  It's coming from the left-wing guys like those on Kos etc.

    [ Parent ]
    Because they love her (none / 0) (#78)
    by nalo on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 01:51:23 PM EST
    their reactions are not sexist? Even when they claim her primary qualification is that she's "smoking hot" and a "VPILF"?

    [ Parent ]
    The public part. (none / 0) (#81)
    by Emma on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 02:58:18 PM EST
    Their comments were sexist.  They weren't made for public consumption, as those on the left were/have been.

    [ Parent ]
    Biden could phone it (4.00 / 5) (#3)
    by Capt Howdy on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 09:15:50 AM EST
    you know, this sounds a lot like the dismissive attitude being taken toward her speech yesterday.
    you might want to, um, rethink the hubris.

    Please (5.00 / 4) (#7)
    by bluegal on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 09:20:47 AM EST
    Her speech should be dismissed. It was hateful and I didn't learn anything about her.

    She is new to the stage and needs to introduce herself just like Obama had to.

    Where you defending Obama when people "dismissed" his speeches?

    This woman is ridiculous and I think that the glow will wear off of her in two weeks once people start to fully learn of all her scandals.

    What a fraud.

    [ Parent ]

    It doesn't matter what you think (5.00 / 3) (#11)
    by Roz on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 09:33:38 AM EST
    It doesn't matter that you think her speech should be dismissed. You weren't going to vote for McCain anyway. What does middle American think? What do swing voters in the battle ground states think?

    She wasn't talking to you. She was talking over you.

    Did she succeed in making a good (2nd) first impression with her target audiences? Republicans, definitely. We'll know soon enough about swing voters.

    [ Parent ]

    She Won Republicans (5.00 / 1) (#52)
    by daring grace on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 10:53:10 AM EST
    That's for sure.

    I listened to her speech last night knowing I'm not her constituency--and never will be--but wondering just how other independents will react.

    I had the feeling there wasn't yet enough meat on the bone to her presentation. That can come in time and presumably tomight McCain may offer some tangible reasons why voters anxious about jobs, prices, health care etc. would want to vote for them instead of Obama/Biden. Some affirmative reasons.

    But all she did last night was roll out her intro bio and attack Dems. Which was all she was probably supposed to do. But I think the jury is still out on who, outside of Republicans, will support this ticket.

    [ Parent ]

    I watched it with my room mate (none / 0) (#72)
    by prose on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 12:12:34 PM EST
    who leans right and he said he wasn't impressed.  He thought it was a good speech but it didn't inform him on anything or change his mind in anyway.  For the first time he is leaning toward voting for a Democrat.

    [ Parent ]
    thats funny (4.33 / 3) (#10)
    by Capt Howdy on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 09:31:57 AM EST
    really.  this is going to be a fun day.

    [ Parent ]
    "Winning" debates is in any case (5.00 / 1) (#9)
    by frankly0 on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 09:25:18 AM EST
    only in part -- indeed only in small part -- about actual knowledge of the issues.

    Notoriously, George W Bush was declared the "winner" of his debates against Gore by many people and by most pundits. I don't think anyone would argue -- not even George Bush himself -- that he knew more about the issues than Gore.

    I personally can't really guess in advance who's going to "win". I can see Palin projecting real confidence and a sense that she will be a very quick learner and very competent on the job, and I can see her committing major gaffes that will really hurt her.

    Basically, it's going to depend a lot more on how she can manage than on anything Biden does positive or negative, it seems to me.

    [ Parent ]

    in Alaska (5.00 / 1) (#15)
    by ccpup on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 09:44:56 AM EST
    she's widely regarded as being very strong in debates, intelligent and an impressively quick learner and fantastic on-the-stump speaking with voters and answering questions.

    Combine all that with her famous (or infamous, depending on where you stand) competitiveness, and it's safe to say Joe Biden better double up whatever debate prep he's doing.

    The absolute worst thing that can happen is if THEIR VP nominee makes OUR VP nominee look like a bumbling fool in the debate.  Probably won't happen, but Biden and Team Obama better not underestimate her.

    [ Parent ]

    She didn't (5.00 / 2) (#12)
    by TChris on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 09:36:55 AM EST
    write the speech.  And as much as she will be prepped for the debate, she's on her own once the questions start flying.

    [ Parent ]
    I dont remember any of t his concern (5.00 / 3) (#13)
    by Capt Howdy on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 09:40:43 AM EST
    about who wrote the speech at the convention last week.
    why is that?

    [ Parent ]
    exactly (5.00 / 4) (#18)
    by ccpup on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 09:55:40 AM EST
    I did find it funny that Palin and the Republicans were being slammed last night for having their speeches "pre-scripted"!

    I mean, the NERVE of those people.  To prepare and write out beforehand what they were going to say?!  Ugh.  The levels to which they'll stoop in their conquest to be organized and prepared.

    Thank God Obama and Biden's speeches are all off-the-cuff and from the heart.  No preparation there, no siree, bob.

    {snark}

    [ Parent ]

    Palins speech was written weeks ago (5.00 / 3) (#21)
    by JoeA on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 09:59:50 AM EST
    and adjusted at the last minute to change it from masculine to feminine.

    Obama's speech was written by Obama.

    [ Parent ]

    what about Bidens? (none / 0) (#27)
    by Capt Howdy on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 10:10:11 AM EST


    [ Parent ]
    Biden (5.00 / 2) (#32)
    by CST on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 10:17:09 AM EST
    did write his own speech.  I do think this is a silly attack since politicians do it all the time.  But in fairness to Biden he did write his speech.

    [ Parent ]
    it's an unbelievably (5.00 / 2) (#37)
    by ccpup on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 10:24:28 AM EST
    stupid and silly line of attack, yes.  

    And it shows how truly deep in the doo-doo we are if we're (and I use "we're" to indicate us generally, not us specifically) resorting to attacking whether or not she wrote her speech or the timbre of her voice or her family sharing her moment on-stage afterward.

    It makes us look petty and makes our insistence that we stick to the issues and not engage in the Politics of Personal Destruction seem craven and opportunistic eg. "How dare they say that about Obama!  Those Republicans, ugh ... oh, but did you hear she didn't write her speech and isn't her voice a little whiny?  And wasn't she a bit too ... forceful, too strident for a woman?" etc and so on

    [ Parent ]

    as evidence of how deep the doo doo (none / 0) (#39)
    by Capt Howdy on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 10:26:44 AM EST
    go back and read the glee that supposed libruls were exhibiting yesterday over the open mike comments of three clueless right wing hacks.
    it was really quite hilarious.

    [ Parent ]
    Republican Washington Professionals (none / 0) (#55)
    by daring grace on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 11:00:27 AM EST
    were caught expressing realistic views about the state of the race:

    Is McCain fatally going all personality/bio lite in a substantive issues driven year?

    Added in was a slice of life from inside the beltway which we've been hearing a lot of since the Palin pick: "Nobody but governors have ever spoken to her." "Who IS she?" etc. Obviously some career Washington pols and operatives have some ruffled feathers and feel left out.

    You're right. It IS kind of hilarious to watch when viewed from that angle.

    [ Parent ]

    personally (none / 0) (#38)
    by Capt Howdy on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 10:25:15 AM EST
    I know some speech writers.  I know for a fact and lot of times when they say they wrote it, they had help.
    sometimes lots of help.

    [ Parent ]
    good point (5.00 / 1) (#24)
    by Jlvngstn on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 10:02:20 AM EST
    because Obama has been debating and campaigning for 18 months and she is an unknown quantity.  The jury is still out as to her knowledge and command of the issues, his is not.  Like him or not, agree or not, he is on record with the issues.  I still think O lost most debates and performed adequately at best.  I think 4 weeks is an incredibly short time to prepare for the debates and the media onlslaught and that is the overriding question.  Was it just a great speech (since it was not written by her it is not indicative of her knowledge) or is she the real deal?  I think not but I was highly impressed with her delivery.

    [ Parent ]
    Which speech last week? (none / 0) (#19)
    by JoeA on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 09:58:01 AM EST
    The issue is that Palins speech was written weeks ago for a male VP by a Bush speechwriter.  

    [ Parent ]
    Who cares? (none / 0) (#43)
    by flyerhawk on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 10:35:52 AM EST
    I would hope that the candidates at least have input on their speeches.  

    [ Parent ]
    You don't care? (none / 0) (#79)
    by nalo on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 01:57:01 PM EST
    That McCain and Palin are puppets to the same advisors who led us to George Bush?  McCain has literally hired the same team that smeared him in 2000 and Tucker Eskew is just one example of the type of intensive prep that Palin got for her speech.

    [ Parent ]
    Because Obama wrote his? (none / 0) (#73)
    by prose on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 12:15:16 PM EST
    And Palin's very speech contained crack after crack diminishing and dismissing Obama.  In the midst of what was just a speech she attacked Obama for having "just a speech."  

    Everything about last night was laden with hypocricy.

    [ Parent ]

    according to all I've heard (none / 0) (#40)
    by ccpup on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 10:26:47 AM EST
    about her political history in Alaska, she's very, VERY strong in debates.

    As I said up-thread, Joe better hunker down and do his homework because, if he underestimates her, it's quite possible Sarah will wipe the floor with him.

    [ Parent ]

    okay (none / 0) (#54)
    by ccpup on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 10:56:55 AM EST
    be skeptical.  You wouldn't be the first.  

    In fact, I strongly suspect the Incumbent Gov Frank Murkowski, himself a politician with 30+ years of experience, ALSO believed he'd be the sure-fire winner in his debates with Sarah.

    Too bad he lost to her in the Primary by 30 points.

    First rule in politics:  never underestimate your opponent.  

    [ Parent ]

    get off it (1.00 / 1) (#59)
    by wystler on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 11:14:58 AM EST
    bitterness isn't becoming on anybody

    Murkowski was knee-deep (head first) in scandal.

    First rule in internet politicking: don't think that we're all stupid.

    [ Parent ]

    get off it? (5.00 / 1) (#63)
    by ccpup on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 11:30:49 AM EST
    I wasn't aware I was on it!  I'm certainly not bitter ... nor do I knit.  

    And I don't believe I even questioned or made mention of your intelligence.  That's best left to those who know and work with you and, perhaps, to those who judge those kinds of things based on the level of discourse you offer on sites like this.

    Perhaps you might want to consider finding another way of replying to posts which refrains from attacking or attempting to belittle the Poster you're speaking to?  

    Just a thought.

    [ Parent ]

    your thumbnail ... (none / 0) (#67)
    by wystler on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 11:44:31 AM EST
    ... of the Murkowski/Palin primary was fairly inaccurrate, if not entirely disingenuous. The debate had little, if anything, to do with his embarrassing defeat.

    Perhaps I assume too much, believing that most community members knew Murkowski was in deep trouble long before any debate.

    [ Parent ]

    it's quite probable (none / 0) (#80)
    by ccpup on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 01:57:31 PM EST
    you are assuming too much.  

    I, perhaps like most, am not intimately familiar with Alaskan politics and the stench surrounding the 2006 race for Governor.  All I know is that people underestimated her, she impressed (both on the stump and in debates) and beat Gov Murkowski in the Primary before winning in the General.  The info which preceded her win or the mood in Alaska at the time is not something I'm aware of.

    Although, the possibility I may NOT be as aware of the history as you are certainly didn't prevent you from accusing me of being disingenuous or of pushing something inaccurate.  

    Perhaps it might have been better to ask if I knew the history and, upon learning I didn't, seek to "thumnail" it for me?

    [ Parent ]

    Wrong! (none / 0) (#35)
    by allpeopleunite on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 10:18:28 AM EST
    He's right that she didn't mention healthcare, but she talked a lot about the working class people and about energy *including consumers gas woes) so he is incorrect, possibly misinformed.

    You left out part of what Biden said (none / 0) (#41)
    by lambert on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 10:28:23 AM EST
    Which is that the Palin family is "off limits." Why?

    http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080904/ap_on_el_pr/cvn_convention_rdp

    Of course... (none / 0) (#65)
    by kdog on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 11:37:47 AM EST
    women can handle it, most every single mom has no choice but to handle it. My moms raised 4 kids working full time most of the time...and did a heckuva job if I do say so myself.  Grandma, my older siblings, and the neighbors helped out a whole lot...which makes it easier.

    That being said, I don't think it is wrong to ask whether it is in the best interest of young children to have both parents working when it is not necessary for survival.  It is a personal choice of course, but something worth discussing.

    McCain better hire (none / 0) (#66)
    by NE Dem on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 11:38:36 AM EST
    a food taster fast!  The Repug base likes her better than him and Queen Sarah is looking out for #1.  Be careful what you wish for John...

    Working mom (none / 0) (#71)
    by BaseballMom on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 11:59:41 AM EST
    I don't think it is fair to compare performing the job of Vice President of the Free World to any other job that a working mother may have.  If Palin gets this job, or please help us, the job of President, then she must put country first, not her family.  I think that's the source of the comments about her parenting.  I would risk saying that there are not very many jobs out there that require this kind of commitment, but the job that Sarah Palin is applying for is indeed one of them.  Why be pro-life if you aren't going to be around very much to support the lives you bring into the world?  Her family needs her way more than this country does.

    I wasn't aware (none / 0) (#84)
    by Bluesage on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 05:47:53 PM EST
    That her husband was so incapable of being there to put the family first and be a real partner and parent while she was doing her job.  I'm a Democrat and would not vote for this ticket but your post was a bit sexist in that you gave her husband no credit.  They seem to have it pretty much worked out.

    [ Parent ]
    Biden on Palin | 76 comments (76 topical)

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