Making History and Denying History

This is an Open Thread. But it is also an explanation for why I feel Barack Obama should give Hillary Clinton some space tonight.

Barack Obama will be the Democratic nominee for President. Yes, this is historic - an African American will be our nominee. It is something for our Party to be proud of. But a different dream will die tonight, and I would hope Obama and his supporters will be sensitive to it. The chance of a woman being our Presidential nominee in this election will die tonight. For many women, this is a hard night because of it.

The night of the first debate when only Obama and Clinton were left standing was one of our proudest. And it was not just because of Barack Obama. It was also because of Hillary Clinton. Remember women and fathers of daughters (like me) who still must dream of the day when a woman will be our Presidential nominee. That dream must NEVER die. I would hope Obama and his supporters will have a thought about that tonight. Not just the history made. But the history NOT made.

Speaking for me only

Comments closed.

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    Still never going vote for the empty suit. (5.00 / 20) (#1)
    by Shainzona on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:04:32 PM EST
    Historic?  Well, an historically big mistake to have Barck Obama as the Dem nominee.

    I am so out of the Democratic Party and nothing, nothing will bring me back.

    Same here. (5.00 / 14) (#38)
    by vicsan on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:16:19 PM EST
    I'll soon be leaving Talk Left because there's not one single nice thing I can say about BO and I know Jeralyn is supporting the Dem ticket.

    I am finished with the Democratic Party unless Hillary takes this to the convention.


    Sorry, BTD, the "dream" of a woman (5.00 / 14) (#85)
    by angie on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:25:11 PM EST
    president is dead as a doornail if Obama gets the nomination after the unrelenting sexism spewed at Hillary by him and the msm while the Dem. Part stood silently by. Meanwhile, if Hillary says a historically accurate fact that LBJ signed the Civil Rights Act into law, then the entire Party gangs up on her as a racist. I actually think BTD is sincere, but let me put it as plainly as I can: As a woman, if Obama (who, other then having this alleged charisma, is so obviously not qualified for President) gets the nomination after all that has happened, it proves that this country -- especially the Dem. party "elders" are just not ready for a woman president. I take no pride in that, and the Party should not either. Pretty words now does not excuse the conduct I witnessed from the Dem. Party this primary.

    Don't blame the country! (5.00 / 4) (#121)
    by hlr on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:30:30 PM EST
    Blame the party elders and the media.

    I specifically blame BO for not 100% repudiating Pfleger's remarks about Hillary -- those remarks were a proxy for all white women. It's absurd to say that he could not address this specifically while the primary was still in process b/c that's equivalent to saying that he'd benefit as long as he kept his mouth shut. Too late now.

    The country still has promise.


    Don't Blame the Country! (1.00 / 3) (#217)
    by Spike on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 05:16:44 PM EST
    When all is said and done, Hillary Clinton will ultimately blame herself. She has run a valiant -- but flawed -- campaign. The inevitability theme was all wrong for the times. She never should have had so much confidence in Mark Penn. She never should have been so confident that she was going to run the table on Super Tuesday. When Obama battled her to a draw on Super Tuesday -- and then ran off a long string of unanswered victories -- the campaign was lost. In reality, this was over in Wisconsin. The fact that she has battled back from that low point to make it close is a miracle. Don't denigrate her achievement by making her a victim. She didn't win, but she fought like a champ.

    If Hill were VP (none / 0) (#123)
    by cawaltz on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:31:26 PM EST
    she'd be set up to run in 2016 providing Obama proved capable. I'm still not entirely convincedwith his philosophy or positions but I do TRUST Hillary's political instincts and would take it as a sign if she were to join the ticket. I don't buy that she'd bean obscure figure. Hillary Clinton is not the obscure type. She's smart, opinionated, strong and capable. She'll fight for her positions. There is no way she'd be obscure and I think the Obama camp is well aware of thatand THAT is why they are hedging on hving her on the ticket).  

    She'll Be 68 (5.00 / 2) (#133)
    by BDB on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:33:01 PM EST
    But then one of the good things about being a woman is that we tend to live longer. :-)

    Younger than McCain (5.00 / 1) (#141)
    by cawaltz on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:34:29 PM EST
    and as far as I know SHE hasn't had a bout with cancer.

    Flip the ticket (5.00 / 7) (#156)
    by Democratic Cat on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:38:19 PM EST
    and we have 16 years of Dems in the White House. Eight with Hillary to make the da** government work again and right the ship of state, and then eight with Obama. Too bad he couldn't take the long view of things.

    Just got a call (5.00 / 4) (#178)
    by Eleanor A on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:50:16 PM EST
    from a friend in Kentucky, who received a call from an Obama supporter trying to get her to change her vote at the KY state convention.  Apparently she was told that "Hillary had told her staff to stop campaigning and had called everyone to NYC for a meeting."

    I'd be amazed were this not happening all over the nation.

    Here's the thing, folks:  Jeralyn has told people she'll support the eventual nominee, but she's also repeatedly said she thinks this will go to the Convention.

    I find her to be eminently reasonable about most things, so I can't say for sure what I'll do (other than respect her wishes to the best of my ability...)


    It's about sexism, stupid. (5.00 / 6) (#184)
    by fkperiera on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:54:19 PM EST
    I probably won't vote for Obama in the fall; I'd rather write in Clinton's name.  

    I think it's sad that, at every point in American history when the choice comes down to an African-American man or a woman, women have to take a back seat.  Women got the right to vote over 80 years after black men did.  Will it be another 80 years before a woman has another shot at the top spot?

    BTD-- what is particularly sad is that while Obama will likely be the nominee no one who supports him seems to recognize that if he lost this primary season the opportunity for him or someone like him-- a black man-- to run would still be there.  Colin Powell, though a Republican, was once touted as a possible first African-American president-- one who, like Obama, may have had a real shot.  (I say 'may have' because his standing in the GOP probably means that won't happen.)  

    With Clinton, that's probably not the case.  Women who are 'impervious' to the sexism of American society, women strong enough and smart enough don't get that far that often.  The NY Times ran an article to this effect only a few weeks ago.  There really is no one to step up into Clinton's place as a viable female candidate in four, eight or 20 years.

    So you see, it's much bigger than just Clinton losing. It is, in some sense, giving up on a woman having a legitimate shot at being the Commander in Chief for, probably, a generation or more.  Will Clinton live to see the day that a woman is president?  I doubt it.

    At base, Obama is a man and men have always been at the top.  Even in Congress, the precentage of women is unrepresentative of the proportion of women in the US.  Even though more women graduate from college than men, there are fewer women as CEOs and executives than men.  This is not just a matter of women making different choices, this is a matter of women facing barriers that their male colleagues-- black, Asian, whatever-- do not have.  There is sexism at work here, just as there was in the primary campaign, allowed by the media and stoked by Obama's campaign and surrogates.

    And the rank sexism that produced Obama's victory ensures that feminist men, like myself, won't be voting for him.


    Their sexism is clear (5.00 / 2) (#206)
    by Nike on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 05:11:00 PM EST
    I agree. Their sexism comes out strongly in the new "appeal" that they are making to women voters: the Roe v. Wade hostage charge. If you (women) don't vote for our guy, then you will be responsible for the overturning of reproductive rights for you (women). Of course, that argument assumes 1. that women are the only ones with any responsibility for reproductive acts (at a personal and a political level); 2. that you trust Obama to spend one dime supporting women or women's rights. I, for one, don't.

    Same here (5.00 / 2) (#220)
    by kenoshaMarge on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 05:19:45 PM EST
    I know now that I will never live long enough to see a woman in the White House. Guess it doesn't matter. Woman's place, as always, is second place.

    I concur (5.00 / 7) (#2)
    by andgarden on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:04:56 PM EST
    and hope that the Americablog narrative about tonight does NOT carry.

    I dont even know (5.00 / 4) (#29)
    by Capt Howdy on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:13:51 PM EST
    what the "americablog narrative" is but I join you in hoping it does not.

    Someone better muzzle that guy. (5.00 / 1) (#32)
    by pie on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:14:38 PM EST
    He's lost it.

    muzzle (5.00 / 1) (#42)
    by Capt Howdy on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:17:08 PM EST
    leash, straitjacket.
    whatever it takes.

    oh man (5.00 / 3) (#186)
    by Capt Howdy on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:54:52 PM EST
    just dropped by and found this nugget:

    Hillary always claims she's fully vetted, but that's not true. And, the vetting process includes the spouse.

    you really cant make this stuff up.


    I don't know what it is either (5.00 / 2) (#64)
    by ruffian on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:21:11 PM EST
    but I'm pretty sure I won't like it.

    To all of you who can't take anymore beyond tonight, happy trails. It's been fun and not so fun agonizing with you the last few months.

    Hope we meet again down the line.


    It was fun. (5.00 / 6) (#138)
    by Fabian on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:34:07 PM EST
    Not always pleasant, but always informative - which is the main reason I come here.  Echo chambers are a dime a dozen, but reality based blogs have become a vanishing breed.

    I can't really support Obama.  I keep hoping there's a chance he'll wise up, but I doubt.  He can win or lose without me.


    Do you realize (5.00 / 2) (#3)
    by Steve M on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:05:45 PM EST
    how tough Edwards dropping out was for me as a white male?

    heh (5.00 / 3) (#7)
    by andgarden on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:06:50 PM EST
    Truth told, I thought he handled that in a dignified way, but minimized his influence. I hope Hillary does not make the same mistake.

    Made worse because (5.00 / 2) (#12)
    by pie on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:08:15 PM EST
    I knew what was coming because of who was left standing.

    Ditto Shainzona!!! (5.00 / 4) (#4)
    by athyrio on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:05:52 PM EST

    How many of those one on one debates... (5.00 / 9) (#5)
    by citizen53 on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:06:32 PM EST
    were there?

    Were we, as Americans, really allowed to get into the campaign?

    Or was it just a media circus?

    What a great example we set for other democracies.

    As usual, quite incisive. (5.00 / 2) (#28)
    by TomP on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:12:50 PM EST
    Issues became less important after Edwards dropped out. He brought a progressive voice.

    Issues never were important, Tom... (5.00 / 9) (#74)
    by citizen53 on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:23:44 PM EST
    as this country is too wrapped up in itself to care about issues.

    More reality TV!  More 24 hour news cycle!  Soon, the ability of Americans to think for themselves on a critical level will be gone, yet we will keep shouting that we are #1.

    I admire that you have been able to make peace with some of the Obama supporters, but I'm afraid that their comments over the months have shown more of their true selves.  That is why I have always believed that this type of hope is an illusion.  

    Watch out.  They will turn on you in a flash.


    The problem with the MSM is (none / 0) (#183)
    by WelshWoman on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:54:06 PM EST
    it's too busy trying to be the news instead of reporting it.

    Sorry but our BBC and ITV coverage is alot better and its issues based.

    Our tabloid press leaves a lot to be desired though, that's all about who they can build up so they can rip them down later.


    not really (5.00 / 1) (#224)
    by Edgar08 on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 05:22:13 PM EST
    If your issue was smearing Clinton well ok then.

    Thank you (5.00 / 2) (#8)
    by Grey on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:06:51 PM EST
    I just appreciate the consideration, and wanted to tell you that.

    It's a very, very tough day.

    I Wouldn't Be Surprised the First Woman President (5.00 / 3) (#9)
    by Dan the Man on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:06:56 PM EST
    turns out to be a Republican.

    I could easily imagine Kay Bailey Hutchison (5.00 / 1) (#11)
    by andgarden on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:08:12 PM EST
    But no, I will never vote for her.

    I expect Hutchison to be McCain's VP pick (5.00 / 1) (#45)
    by Dan the Man on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:17:26 PM EST
    I thought she might be a Presidential possibility in 2012, but then she would be 70 years old in 2012 so I don't think that's likely.

    If he's smart (5.00 / 1) (#58)
    by cawaltz on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:20:09 PM EST
    He'd consider Snowe. She is a moderate in a blue state and female.

    Sarah Palin... (5.00 / 0) (#77)
    by OrangeFur on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:23:51 PM EST
    would be a terrific choice for McCain, from what I know of her.

    A Woman (5.00 / 0) (#103)
    by BDB on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:28:18 PM EST
    Would be very smart.  They clearly see an opportunity to pick up women voters (so nice for the GOP that so many democrats and fauxgressives rushed to embrace misogyny - see we have unity already).  And who can blame them, they won in 2004 largely because white women went for Kerry, whereas Gore basically split them with Bush.  So they don't even have to win over women they haven't won before.  They just have to find a way to keep the 2004 coalition together.  

    I agree with this... (5.00 / 0) (#201)
    by Dawn Davenport on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 05:04:46 PM EST
    ...it would be very smart indeed for the McCain to pick a woman for v.p.

    I went as far as to look up Sarah Palin's Wikipedia page the other day to check out her positions (I still haven't decided how I'm voting in November).

    Aside from belonging to Feminists for Life (same org for which Justice Roberts' wife was once v.p.), her background looks pretty good, especially on environmental matters.

    If it shakes out to be McCain-Palin vs. Obama-anydem (particularly if anydem is an anti-choicer like Casey), my decision will be made all the more difficult.


    Oops (none / 0) (#111)
    by BDB on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:29:12 PM EST
    Should read that white women went for Bush over Kerry...

    personally (none / 0) (#71)
    by Capt Howdy on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:22:56 PM EST
    I think if he picks any woman besides Hillary (or at least without OFFERING it to HIllary) all hell will break loose.
    as well it should.

    I think they meant McCain (5.00 / 0) (#80)
    by CST on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:24:27 PM EST
    But you are right about Obama.

    sorry (5.00 / 1) (#99)
    by Capt Howdy on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:27:52 PM EST
    need to pay attention.
    McCain would be very smart to pick a woman.

    Reagan (none / 0) (#90)
    by BDB on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:25:58 PM EST
    Certainly tempered his image in 1980 by picking George H.W. Bush, who was considered moderate.  

    Well They Definitely Wouldn't Remain Silent (5.00 / 17) (#21)
    by MO Blue on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:11:15 PM EST
    while the media talked trash about their candidate.  That was one of the most shameful aspects of this entire campaign.

    No kidding. (5.00 / 8) (#130)
    by vicsan on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:32:44 PM EST
    Not one party leader came out to defend her against the onslaught of all the sexist/racist crap thrown her way. Not one. I will never forgive them.

    Me Neither (5.00 / 8) (#161)
    by BDB on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:38:58 PM EST
    And I intend to tell them every opportunity I get.  I've decided to take this photo, courtesy of Iphie at Corrente, and I'm going to attach it to the response card of every solicitation I get from the DSCC, the DCCC, and the DNC.  

    Then, I'm going to re-register as an unaffiliated voter, cut my Dem voter registration into bits, and send it to Howard Dean (cc'ing Nancy Pelosi, Harry Reid, Dianne Feinsten, Barbara Boxer, my congressional rep., whose an Obama SD, and Art Torres, head of the Democratic Party).  I'm going to express my extreme disappointment in the silence of the party and explain that I don't trust any party that condones misogyny to have my best interests at heart.  Then I'm going to tell them that I've decided it's in my best interest to be an unaffiliated voter because 1) I will feel no need to vote for any Democrat simply out of loyalty, but instead will vote only for candidates who earn my vote, and 2) the Democratic Party clearly values independent voters more than me, even letting them choose its nominee, and so now I'm an independent voter, they can woo me, too.


    Link (none / 0) (#171)
    by BDB on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:41:20 PM EST
    Forgot the link to the photo.

    REMAINED SILENT?!?! (5.00 / 4) (#174)
    by sickofhypocrisy on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:41:37 PM EST
    I would have given anything for them to remain silent - THEY JOINED IN!

    I wouldnt be surprised if (5.00 / 7) (#50)
    by Capt Howdy on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:18:10 PM EST
    the first AA president is a republican

    Yep (5.00 / 1) (#194)
    by Eleanor A on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 05:00:35 PM EST
    I live in TN, which has never had a woman governor or Senator.  Only five women have ever been elected to Congress from here, and the only current one we have is the odious Marsha Blackburn.

    (And!  My state party just had as the speaker at the state's yearly fundraiser one Claire McCaskill, shill for Obama - and nobody to represent Hillary, despite her 14-point win here in the primary.

    It's sickening.  I'm pretty thoroughly disheartened at this point.)


    Numbers in US (none / 0) (#239)
    by MichaelGale on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 05:45:09 PM EST
    are dismal.  74 female members of Congress out of 435.

    There are 12 Female presidents who lead foreign countries. We have a woman run and she is called a b***h and displayed in our airport shops as a nutcracker with her legs open.

    What more is there to say?


    If Hillary doesn't take this all the way, (5.00 / 1) (#231)
    by samanthasmom on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 05:26:24 PM EST
    I am positive that the first woman President will be a Republican.

    I used to say that (none / 0) (#13)
    by Grey on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:08:23 PM EST
    about the first African American nominee (or President).

    Me too (5.00 / 1) (#22)
    by CST on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:11:16 PM EST
    Could still be right about the president. Although, ironically they would probably have to win it without the black vote.

    not based on this election (5.00 / 1) (#55)
    by Capt Howdy on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:18:50 PM EST
    Trust me (none / 0) (#66)
    by CST on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:21:44 PM EST
    I have a lot of black friends, all of whom voted for Obama, many of whom admitted that a major reason they support him over Hillary was race, who would never vote for a black republican.  It would be like selling out.  Race is important to them but it's not the only thing.

    if you say so (5.00 / 1) (#76)
    by Capt Howdy on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:23:45 PM EST
    I would not be at all surprised (none / 0) (#129)
    by ruffian on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:32:19 PM EST
    Too bad I may have to vote against the first woman candidate. After not enthusiastically supporting the first A-A.  Not at all how I had thought it would turn out.

    Maybe I'll get to like Obama more as time goes on.  Where's that Kool-aid?  Ah, sweet, sweet Kool-aid!


    Why tonight? (5.00 / 6) (#15)
    by indiependy on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:09:03 PM EST
    Jeralyn just reported that Terry McCauliffe said Hillary absolutely will not drop out tonight. They're still making superdelegate calls and fighting this thing until the end, presumably Denver. So why would there have to be any "space" given tonight? Her camp has made it clear nothing is over.

    This is called (5.00 / 14) (#75)
    by vicsan on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:23:45 PM EST
    "uniting the party" because after all the nasty, racist, hateful, disgusting things the Obama campaign and his supporters have done to Hillary and her supporters...we're now going to be patronized, schmoozed, stroked and coddled to come together and sing Kumbaya. That's how it works. I'm in no mood for it and never will be.

    I will never vote for anyone who paints Bill and Hillary Clinton as racists. I'm done.


    Sad, but true... (5.00 / 4) (#140)
    by citizen53 on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:34:12 PM EST
    to see so many proponents of the politics of hope and unity act with such cynicism and divisiveness.

    It's like MLK preaching nonviolence while his surrogrates are tossing bricks behind his back.

    If you call for a new way, then should not you act that way, notwithstanding what others do?


    I agree, BTD. (5.00 / 3) (#17)
    by TomP on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:10:30 PM EST
    There were two dreams based on identity (race and gender) in the primary.  

    Identity is a zero sum game.  One will win and another will lose.  

    I prefer class warefare, but that's just me. :-)

    I believe that it will all work out and that Obama and Clinton will unify the party, one way or another.

    Dang, you made me cry. What a nice post. (5.00 / 2) (#18)
    by Teresa on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:10:41 PM EST
    I always figured if you ever made me cry it would be because you scared me to death.

    Give your little girl a hug BTD. And one day, you have to tell us all what happened that day in NY when you took her shopping. I'll never forget that diary and I've always wondered what it was that she or you did that you wouldn't tell us.

    I have a 9 year old daughter (4.80 / 5) (#61)
    by Dave B on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:20:48 PM EST
    who has watched this campaign like a hawk because she wants to be president someday.  Personally, I'd rather see her be a doctor or something...

    Many women and African Americans and others (5.00 / 2) (#24)
    by TomP on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:11:49 PM EST
    could be described as "affirmative action" candidates.

    Both Hillary Clinton and Barack Obama were "qualified."

    It's funny to me (5.00 / 8) (#25)
    by Stellaaa on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:11:58 PM EST
    That he who never wanted to be identified as the "black candidate" now gets to carry the flag in the stadium of being the first black candidate.  It just does not make sense.  And frankly, the media was more enamored with the "first black" vs. the first woman.  So, that goes to show you how transcended and transformed we are.  

    As my momma thought me... (5.00 / 7) (#30)
    by Marvin42 on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:14:03 PM EST
    if you have nothing good to say, say nothing. Hint hint.

    He Said "Good" Riddance (1.00 / 2) (#150)
    by flashman on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:36:42 PM EST
    what more do you want?

    who are you directing your comment to (1.00 / 2) (#195)
    by manish on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 05:01:34 PM EST
    I hope you are directing your comment to Shainzona who also had nothing good to say.

    How is the dream lost (5.00 / 4) (#33)
    by cawaltz on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:14:38 PM EST
    if there is unity ticket? If there isn't a unity ticket btw feel free to have the party without me.

    I didn't find the moment that they were debating as overwhelmingly transformative either though. Then again, race and gender have taken a back seat to issues for me. Supporting Hillary, as a woman, has been secondary to, supporting Hillary because she is better qualified.

    Fair points (5.00 / 2) (#57)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:19:33 PM EST
    I clarified my post.

    Thanks but the big lesson is the hatred for women (5.00 / 18) (#35)
    by Nike on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:15:38 PM EST
    Thanks for these thoughts, which are gracious and speak to the kinds of principles we all ought to have. It is clear, though, that neither the Obama campaign and certainly his key supporters and surrogates and the media itself, in even more profound ways, perpetuated and extended hatred or at least profound contempt for women. It is clear that I will not have the chance to vote for a woman as president in my lifetime. My sense--the viciousness out there was remarkable and pervasive--is that sexism is so fundamental to our culture that the risk of having a woman come this close is not a step towards that future but an assurance against it.

    A profound loss (5.00 / 4) (#122)
    by marisol on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:30:41 PM EST
    and I agree with your analysis about sexism.  I'm far from naive, but I've been shocked at what this campaign has revealed.
    I feel somewhat like I did about 25 years ago when the ERA for women failed.  We're still working for equality.  And it's not going to be in my lifetime, either.

    Perhaps the Clintonites... (none / 0) (#152)
    by citizen53 on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:36:53 PM EST
    should push Obama to call for a new ERA.

    The ego won't let him (5.00 / 3) (#36)
    by TeresaInSnow2 on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:15:53 PM EST
    He wants to squash that little beotch once and for all.  And he'll get caught up in the Americablog/Olbermann hatefest and won't be able to help himself.

    In the end, he's a very small man.

    But, he'll try to get as much out of her (5.00 / 6) (#67)
    by JavaCityPal on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:21:48 PM EST
    as he can before he throws her off the bus with the others.

    He has no moral compass. If he ends up successful in August, and again in November, they won't need any transition time in the WH, it's just a continuation of the same.


    If Hillary doesn't take this (5.00 / 3) (#166)
    by vicsan on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:40:13 PM EST
    to the convention, she and Bill should take Chelsea and go on a trip around the world and let BO fend for himself. She owes him NOTHING.

    I am more addened tonight (5.00 / 14) (#39)
    by americanincanada on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:16:44 PM EST
    because we are about to nominate an underqualified candidate for president over a much better, more electable, qualified candidate.

    Let's also remember the mothers and (5.00 / 8) (#40)
    by Teresa on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:16:50 PM EST
    grandmothers who really will never see that dream. I hurt for my mother with all my heart. I doubt I will see it, but I know she won't.

    Jumping the gun, again (5.00 / 8) (#41)
    by JavaCityPal on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:17:03 PM EST
    This is all just media hype.

    I will be very disappointed in Hillary if she gives up after all this.

    My decision to find something outside of supporting or voting for Obama rests largely in the laps of the media, the DNC, Axelrod & pals, and Obama, himself.

    He is flawed beyond anything that was wrong with GWB, and the DNC has broken all their own rules to force him on us in concert with the media lies and distortions about the Clintons. It is not possible for me to just brush it off at though it hasn't been enormously offensive and in complete contrast to my beliefs.

    Thanks (5.00 / 11) (#43)
    by TeresaInSnow2 on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:17:10 PM EST
    We'll enjoy your loss in November

    This is too early a post mortem (5.00 / 4) (#44)
    by nulee on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:17:10 PM EST
    -- I thought TL was the only place not following the MSM.

    Thank you, BTD. (5.00 / 3) (#46)
    by suki on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:17:33 PM EST
    Your girls are very blessed to have a father who wrote that.

    BTD... (5.00 / 17) (#48)
    by madamab on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:17:37 PM EST
    Good luck trying to change peoples' minds.

    As for me, I'm not throwing in the towel unless HRC does. At that point, Obama can do whatever he pleases. I won't be interested.

    Why? Not because I'm a hysterical female-type person, or because my feelings have been hurt by Obama. It's simply that I don't believe in Obama's version of the Democratic Party. Moreover, I don't believe his nomination, should it happen, is going to be legitimate considering Saturday's dog-and-pony show regarding FL and MI.

    We now have only a razor-thin chance of re-infusing our party with its former FDR values. We can only do that if Hillary is the nominee, for Obama has proclaimed in every way possible that he doesn't care for those values at all.

    I don't see anything whatsoever to celebrate if Obama should become the nominee. In fact, I believe it will be a tragic and Party-destroying nomination.

    Historic, indeed, but not in the sense I suspect you mean.

    I second every line of your post (5.00 / 7) (#70)
    by bridget on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:22:55 PM EST
    Thank you. :-) (5.00 / 3) (#82)
    by madamab on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:24:41 PM EST
    Peace out, everyone.

    Can I third? (5.00 / 4) (#95)
    by otherlisa on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:27:21 PM EST
    fourth (5.00 / 5) (#110)
    by Capt Howdy on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:29:07 PM EST
    And I 3rd it. (5.00 / 4) (#136)
    by JDEUNO on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:33:56 PM EST
    The Dems are toast in November, thanks to Obama and the DNC.

    So, so true. (5.00 / 3) (#113)
    by vicsan on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:29:26 PM EST
    The Democratic Party will be dead. Millions are leaving it.

    Historically Sad. (5.00 / 3) (#118)
    by nycstray on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:30:01 PM EST

    Can I fifth? (5.00 / 2) (#181)
    by Andy08 on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:53:13 PM EST
    I couldn't agree more with you madamab. Thank you for expressing it so well.

    Unfortunately, Saturday's proceedings (5.00 / 13) (#52)
    by pie on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:18:23 PM EST
    have caused a deep and painful rift.  We used to say Bush and his gang were not your father's republican party.

    Well, I'm no longer sure these dems represent my democratic one.

    Growing pains. (none / 0) (#109)
    by pie on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:28:52 PM EST
    We are a young country, after all.

    But the dems better get this fixed.


    The Party Will Survive (none / 0) (#167)
    by flashman on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:40:17 PM EST
    If we lose, we'll be forced into introspection.

    If we win, we can heal the wounds.

    Either way, I'll be a Hillary fan for life!  She has more class than any candidate I've seen for a long time.

    And I'll be proud of the party again... at least I hope for it.


    Thanks BTD. You are a real gentleman (5.00 / 1) (#56)
    by bjorn on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:19:19 PM EST
    and it gives me hope.  

    Help Me Out Here (5.00 / 12) (#60)
    by flashman on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:20:44 PM EST
    I really, really, really want to be proud tonight.  However, this selection process has been tainted.  Not only was the process tilted in favor of the African American male, but the mood of the voters was dishonestly swayed by numerous instances of race-baiting.  We are no further in race relations as before, evidenced by the awful spectacle at Trinity Church.  

    I wish I felt as proud as you.  Something about this whole circus is making me kinda ill.

    An historic mistake if Obama is the nominee. (5.00 / 11) (#65)
    by alexei on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:21:29 PM EST
    Obama will not win in the GE.  I will not vote for him even if Clinton is on the ticket as VP. Forget about it. And it isn't over until either she concedes (which I hope she doesn't) or the votes are tallied at the Convention and a nominee is then made.  SDs can change their vote anytime until then and so can pledged delegates (unless state law doesn't allow).  Two months is a lifetime in politics and the the rumors about the Republicans coming out full bore on the Obamas should make every SD stop before being a lemming.

    But, I have no faith in the Democratic Party after the fiasco about MI and FL.

    Personally (5.00 / 4) (#73)
    by nellre on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:23:38 PM EST
    I think Hillary won. It's only because of a dysfunctional system that Obama is the "presumptive nominee".
    Secondly I think Hillary would beat McCain easily... but I don't think Obama will. So that's a huge disappointment to me.
    We'll just have to wait and see how this all pans out.

    I'm not so proud (5.00 / 8) (#81)
    by suisser on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:24:31 PM EST
    I respect all of you who can approach this evening with pride.  I wish I felt that. What I feel is grubby. And as a democrat I feel a sense of sorrow that my party has selected this candidate.  I feel a profound sense of wasted opportunity and abandoned possibility.  The dems have chosen the wrong candidate, for all the wrong reasons and I can't feel proud about that.

    amen (5.00 / 1) (#86)
    by Capt Howdy on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:25:21 PM EST
    what?! you don't like puppets? (5.00 / 4) (#137)
    by Josey on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:34:00 PM EST
    Obama has so many characteristics similar to Bush that it's difficult for me to get excited about him. So much immaturity, arrogance, hubris...
    And his ability to ruin the reputations of good people who disagree with him, by simply smearing them as "racists" is downright scary.

    Which is why you need to be given space (5.00 / 1) (#151)
    by coigue on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:36:47 PM EST
    and respected for awhile.

    awhile? (5.00 / 2) (#187)
    by sickofhypocrisy on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:57:14 PM EST
    don't kid yourself.  no amount of space is going to make me come any closer to voting for obama.  

    Stay out of my space requirements (5.00 / 0) (#228)
    by suisser on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 05:24:35 PM EST
    If the shoe (none / 0) (#158)
    by 1jane on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:38:39 PM EST
    were on the other foot the same words would apply suisser.

    You're right (5.00 / 1) (#211)
    by blogtopus on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 05:14:41 PM EST
    but it would be felt by a lot fewer people.

    Well said. n/t (5.00 / 0) (#91)
    by LarryInNYC on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:26:08 PM EST

    I sincerely doubt it (5.00 / 11) (#92)
    by ccpup on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:26:22 PM EST
    Obama hasn't shown himself to be either sensitive or gracious in this campaign.  From covertly encouraging the crowd's booing Hillary to brushing her off his shoulder or wiping her off his shoe, he's shown himself to be just another arrogant bully who's charmed his way to the precipice of great accomplishment.

    Problem is, as with all precipices, it's a very long, brutal fall to the bottom if one isn't careful.  And, based on what I've seen so far, the excitement of "his" moment has overtaken the need for him to be more careful.

    I predict a fall.  And I don't see Hillary conceding or dropping out or whatever you want to call it.  I see her taking MI to the Credentials Committee and taking this to the Convention.

    If he is the Nominee, it'll be the first time since 1992 that I won't be voting or donating money.  Simple as that.

    Not in my lifetime (5.00 / 12) (#94)
    by trillian on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:26:54 PM EST
    The dream will die for me for good.

    Do you really see any other woman willing to run the gauntlet of misogyny in the near future?

    This will kill that idea for at least a generation.

    Hillary had it all....but still loses to the unqualified man.


    I hope so (4.00 / 1) (#112)
    by coigue on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:29:18 PM EST
    Do you really see any other woman willing to run the gauntlet of misogyny in the near future?

    It's the only way progress will be mde


    Thanks for your sensitivity all along BTD (5.00 / 3) (#96)
    by karen for Clinton on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:27:24 PM EST
    Obama has given no consideration of kindness, I expect him to keep right on being himself.

    I'll watch her win or wins or split tonight and cheer for her and listen to what she has to say about the future as well as her summation of the race we've all been through together.

    I'll support her all the way to Denver if that is what she wants to do.

    Nobody threw in the towel yet, as far as I know.

    The wheel's still in spin.

    historically divisive (5.00 / 2) (#98)
    by Edgar08 on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:27:48 PM EST
    I don't what else obama qualifies as at this point.

    If/when he becomes the nominee (5.00 / 1) (#100)
    by Chimster on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:27:57 PM EST
    It'll be up to Obama to unite the party, not Hillary. He needs us more than we need him. But I doubt he'll reach his arm across the aisle of his own party even at his own political peril.

    Hopefully some Obama supporter will explain to me why I should  support Obama in the primaries after clinching the necessary delegates. I already know we can't afford to let the Republicans win.  

    I want to hear why Obama supporters REALLY want him in the White House. Is it his policies? His message of hope? The first African American president? I've got an open mind to hear logic and reason. But so far, I ain't buying what he's selling.

    As Bob Herbert stated in today's (5.00 / 0) (#170)
    by oculus on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:40:56 PM EST
    NYT, Obama needs to put together an economic plan fast and figure out how to communicate it to voters.  

    It's Amazing (5.00 / 8) (#214)
    by BDB on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 05:16:06 PM EST
    that Bob Herbert doesn't wonder why Obama doesn't have an economic plan that he talks about already.  That right there should be a signal that something is wrong.  An Obama media supporter saying Obama should now develop an economic plan and start talking about it when the "economy" has been the number one issue for at least two months.

    It's Amazing (5.00 / 0) (#216)
    by BDB on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 05:16:24 PM EST
    that Bob Herbert doesn't wonder why Obama doesn't have an economic plan that he talks about already.  That right there should be a signal that something is wrong.  An Obama media supporter saying Obama should now develop an economic plan and start talking about it when the "economy" has been the number one issue for at least two months.

    It's Amazing (5.00 / 0) (#218)
    by BDB on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 05:18:27 PM EST
    that Bob Herbert doesn't wonder why Obama doesn't have an economic plan that he talks about already.  That right there should be a signal that something is wrong.  An Obama media supporter saying Obama should now develop an economic plan and start talking about it when the "economy" has been the number one issue for at least two months.

    I'll give it a shot (1.00 / 1) (#173)
    by CST on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:41:32 PM EST
    For me it's mostly about foreign policy.  I really think we need a drastic change as far as how we deal with foreign heads of state we disagree with.  I know this backfired on Carter, but I think that the times have changed and we need to change with them.  I think Bush has damaged our international reputation so badly, that we need to show the world concrete drastic shifts in tactics to salvage our role as an international leader.  I think Obama will bring this.

    My next reason kind of goes along with the first which is that he has been very vocal about supporting habeus corpus and closing Guantanamo bay for a long time.  His experience teaching constitutional law makes me think he would be much more inclined to strictly uphold our rights under the law.

    Finally, I think one of the biggest challenges facing the world in the future is what to do about the environment and climate change.  And to get anything done in this arena I really feel like we need to reach across the isle and pass whatever bills we can pass, as soon as possible.  That means compromising (aka Cheney energy bill - a huge misnomer in my mind).  And not giving a "gas tax holiday".


    Not bad, thanks. (5.00 / 1) (#197)
    by Chimster on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 05:03:03 PM EST
    Though I don't really want my Democratic president to reach across the political aisle for at least two years. I want him/her to reach across their own party first. The Repubs can wait. I want many things returned to the way they were before W mucked it up. I "hope" he can do it.

    Chris matthews is (5.00 / 2) (#101)
    by LoisInCo on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:27:59 PM EST
    getting the "giggles" waiting for tonight.

    IGNORE MSNBC (5.00 / 5) (#107)
    by andgarden on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:28:46 PM EST
    Especially tonight.

    good lord yes (5.00 / 0) (#160)
    by ruffian on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:38:44 PM EST
    I plan on keeping whatever station I watch mute until I see Hillary start talking.

    No, Don't Ignore MSNBC (5.00 / 2) (#203)
    by BDB on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 05:07:09 PM EST
    It is a reminder of what Obama and the DNC sat silent in the face of.  When Hillary complained about the Shuster comment about Chelsea, the DNC and Obama could have shown Unity and joined in. If pressure had been put on these guys by more than just Clinton, it wouldn't be this bad now. But they wouldn't even speak up against the misogyny when the victim was Chelsea.

    So I don't feel at all guilty when I hear these guys spew - and they are going to be awful tonight - that I hold it against Obama, Dean, Pelosi, Reid and the rest of our so-called "leaders" who are now calling for Unity. If they wanted Unity, there were plenty of things they could've done to get it. Instead, they sat silent through this vile crap and now are going to want me to forget any of it happened and that they did nothing as Obama and others praise Hillary to high heaven in the coming days.

    I can tell you one thing, Republicans may pursue loathsome misogynistic policies, but they would never sit in silence while Keith Olbermann, Tweety, Russert, et al, treated a woman Republican Senator this way. No frakking way.  

    And I am not going to forget that with few exceptions the Democrats, including our new Leader who is going to bring us all together.

    * I'm not going to watch MSNBC because I don't reward misogyny and because cable news is universally awful, but I won't ignore them either or pretend they aren't doing exactly what they are going to do.


    turn him off, he is a fool (5.00 / 2) (#120)
    by bjorn on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:30:23 PM EST
    well said Armando (5.00 / 2) (#102)
    by coigue on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:28:12 PM EST
    well said

    Once Obama is the nominee, McCains' (5.00 / 1) (#105)
    by MarkL on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:28:38 PM EST
    donations will see a sharp spike, I'm sure.

    They already have from what I hear (5.00 / 0) (#236)
    by americanincanada on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 05:30:54 PM EST
    as has his website membership.

    I disagree, BTD (5.00 / 4) (#106)
    by sickofhypocrisy on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:28:44 PM EST
    I can't get over all of the self-congratulating Dems are doing about nominating a black or female candidate.  This is not something Dems should be proud of.  It's 2008.  We should all be ashamed it's taken this long.  

    That is hard to argue with (5.00 / 1) (#117)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:30:01 PM EST
    This is not over yet (5.00 / 3) (#116)
    by barryluda on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:29:49 PM EST
    That is to say, even though Obama will shortly become the democratic nominee, Clinton isn't going anywhere.  She's shown herself to be the best of the best.

    Clinton clearly has a lot of talent, poise, grace and love for both our country and the Democratic party (even though, lately, perhaps it hasn't deserved such affection).

    Who knows what happens next?  But I'll be watching Clinton, following her, listening to her words.  This is not over and won't be even in November. Clinton has made history.

    Yes, as BTD says, Barack Obama should give Hillary Clinton some space tonight.  But it's more than that.  For many days, months, and years into the future, I know that I will give Hillary Rodham Clinton my support.  She's a true leader and I'm proud that she's a Democrat.

    Shoutout: Real Men don't fear Strong Women! (5.00 / 1) (#125)
    by Ellie on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:31:49 PM EST
    If they don't know that they don't know Diddley.

    Real men just bring it.

    They don't have to keep re-announcing the non-news that it's here if you squint and keep re-doing math.

    How can I put this couthly: if you have to squint, it's not likely to get anyone anywhere and it. Wasn't. Brung.

    All you want is my vote...not me. (5.00 / 2) (#142)
    by Shainzona on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:34:42 PM EST
    And my vote is worth a whole lot more than Barack Obama can ever throw my way.

    No. Going. To. Happen.

    Maybe... (5.00 / 4) (#143)
    by OrangeFur on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:34:49 PM EST
    ... you forgot that this is only the primary? You'll need the people who voted for Clinton in November. There are more of them than there are who voted for Obama.

    Really? In primaries? (5.00 / 2) (#144)
    by coigue on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:35:03 PM EST
    I think you are comparing general elections with primaries.

    Temporary boost. (5.00 / 1) (#145)
    by Fabian on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:35:15 PM EST
    And then...heh.

    Frankly (5.00 / 2) (#154)
    by DaveOinSF on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:37:55 PM EST
    I'm just speaking for myself, but frankly the fact that Hillary Clinton is a woman has had little to do with why I support her.  The dream is not to have a woman or a minority in the White House, but rather to have the best person take this country forward.

    If and when Hillary Clinton fails to become the Democratic nominee, there will be two options for me - John McCain or Barack Obama, and I welcome each of them to make their case.

    The moment of pride... (5.00 / 2) (#168)
    by OrangeFur on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:40:45 PM EST
    ... came after Obama and Clinton were the only two left. We already knew then that we were going to have an historic candidate.

    Since then, it's been a lot of moments of shame.

    Pfleger removed from St. Sabina (5.00 / 0) (#177)
    by Andy08 on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:49:43 PM EST
    by Cardinal effective today.  

    (source Chicago Sun Times; Lou Dobbs)

    I hope it is true (5.00 / 0) (#189)
    by bjorn on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:57:39 PM EST
    He should be banned from any church for the things he said.  I grew up Catholic, was active until about age 20...That was 30 yrs ago, But I am proud of Catholics for kicking him out today.

    Nahhh... (none / 0) (#226)
    by oldpro on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 05:22:41 PM EST
    just a 2-week sabatical/vacation/retreat...and he's refusing to go!



    Hillary will be the nominee (5.00 / 1) (#193)
    by diplomatic on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 05:00:12 PM EST
    Through the smoke and mirrors lies the truth.

    I can't get excited (5.00 / 1) (#209)
    by JustJennifer on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 05:14:18 PM EST
    about tonight.. I am far too disappointed in how this all came about.  I have never voted Republican, and frankly I am used to being on the losing end of elections.  This almost hurts more than 2000.  And while I will never vote for a Republican a tiny part of me has started to think I would be happy to see Obama get his ass handed to him as payback, which is very bad indeed.  I hope I get over that feeling soon.

    Did Chuck Todd just call South Dakota (5.00 / 3) (#210)
    by bjorn on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 05:14:23 PM EST
    for Clinton?  I came in late and he was talking about how it is a nice thing for her tonight and Tom Daschle's hopes for VP might have been dashed since he could not deliver SD....

    Are you serious? (none / 0) (#229)
    by masslib on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 05:24:50 PM EST
    Phenominal.  Wow, if she won SD, that's huge.  Means she would have won 9 of the final 15.  That's 60%.  Obama, 5.  I consider Guam a draw.

    So, let's see...
    Hill won:



    is it me (5.00 / 1) (#212)
    by Capt Howdy on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 05:15:29 PM EST
    or is the site going up and down?
    must be a primary tonight!

    Hey Sparky... (5.00 / 1) (#213)
    by oldpro on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 05:16:04 PM EST
    nice sentiments and all but I think we would all do well to remember that nothing is final until the votes are called in August...and it's a loooong way to August.

    Looks like a hot summer ahead.

    Don't be counting any chickens before they're hatched.

    We may see the Gore/Clinton ticket yet...

    Works for me and of course, saves the party along with the country.

    What a concept.

    If Hillary decides not to continue.... (5.00 / 3) (#219)
    by kdog on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 05:19:32 PM EST
    there are still women to vote for if you so choose.

    Cynthia McKinney, Kat Swift, Gloria La Riva, Ruth Bryant White.

    Nothing meaningful will change until we scare the pants off the Democrat and Republican parties.

    Hey Sparky... (5.00 / 2) (#221)
    by oldpro on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 05:19:45 PM EST
    nice sentiments and all but I think we would all do well to remember that nothing is final until the votes are called in August...and it's a loooong way to August.

    Looks like a hot summer ahead.

    Don't be counting any chickens before they're hatched.

    We may see the Gore/Clinton ticket yet...

    Works for me and of course, saves the party along with the country.

    What a concept.

    Mr. Sensitive? Since when? (5.00 / 3) (#225)
    by Caro on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 05:22:22 PM EST
    When has Obama been sensitive about anything, except when something arises that is a danger to his campaign?

    He doesn't have the required number of delegates.

    He is not the nominee.

    Hillary is not quitting, and I don't want her to.

    My support for Hillary has nothing at all to do with her gender or the historic nature of being the first female nominee or first female president.  It has to do with the fact that she can beat John McCain and Obama can not.

    If the party poohbahs do manage to carry Obama over the finish line to the nomination, they are guaranteeing a Republican president for another four years.

    Carolyn Kay

    Not Just Hard For Women (5.00 / 1) (#227)
    by squeaky on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 05:24:11 PM EST
    The chance of a woman being our Presidential nominee in this election will die tonight. For many women, this is a hard night because of it.

    It is hard for all who relished the idea of a woman leading America and reversing the damage done by a rootin tootin [fake] cowboy.

    After Saturday (5.00 / 2) (#230)
    by LibOne on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 05:25:01 PM EST
    I can't possibly be proud of the Democratic Party.  I'm quite ashamed.

    I haven't given up yet (5.00 / 0) (#234)
    by blogtopus on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 05:28:45 PM EST
    because I know that Hillary hasn't either.

    That said, I have a backup plan, and that is to wait out the storm of a McCain presidency until 2012.

    I'm not even going to pretend that the Obama fans will take responsibility for their selection in November; they won't, and fingers will be wagging and pointing for 2 years until the books come out about what really transpired this primary season. Maybe the makers of Recount will do another one called Railroad.

    I'm SO glad my wife and I decided not to have children. I'd hate to have to explain this to a daughter just starting middle school.

    I know the unity (5.00 / 2) (#238)
    by Grandmother on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 05:44:12 PM EST
    crowd is out there; but I'm not joining.  My primary reason for not voting for Obama:  lack of experience, no accomplishments, dirty tricks in Chicago, failure to take a stand on hard issues, ducking hard issues - the list goes on and on.  He has not paid his dues, he has not done anything that shows that he is a uniter.

    I've enjoyed coming to this site for the past six plus months but I'll be bowing out because there is no unity train for me.  I'm moving over to John McCain's column.  At least I know who he is and what he stands for.  I've voted for every Dem since 1972.  A lot of good it has gotten me.  This time I'm not going to be the good soldier that Howard, Donna and Nancy tell me to be.  If Hillary Clinton wants to be a good Democrat after they have trashed and deserted her and her husband, after all the race baiting and lies that have come from the Obama campaign about them, so be it but I don't have to join in.  I'm disgusted with the Democratic Party.  And as previous posters have noted, the Democratic Party sat back and allowed Hillary to be trashed and all the while cheering behind closed doors so they could get Obama the nomination.  Congratulations and Goodbye

    You know, I actually respect you Dalton (4.80 / 5) (#119)
    by angie on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:30:19 PM EST
    because you have always been very polite and well-reasoned, but I cannot buy that you believe it is "amazing and tragic" that the first viable AA & woman ran this year -- call me crazy all you want, but the Dem. elites knew this was the ONLY way to derail Hillary, and that is exactly why Teddy & Kerry took Obama under their wing in 2004. And yes, I believe this to the core of my being.

    You know, I've been a little suspicious (5.00 / 5) (#200)
    by Eleanor A on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 05:04:07 PM EST
    That the date the nominee will give his or her acceptance speech is the 40th anniversary of MLK's "I Have a Dream" speech.  

    Looks like the fix may have been in, for a while now.  

    What a sad, sorry tale this episode will be for the Dems when viewed through the prism of history.


    I absolutely believe that too (4.66 / 3) (#146)
    by ruffian on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:35:24 PM EST
    Obama would not have run if anyone but Hillary was the frontrunner in the field.   Would he have run against Gore or Kerry?  No way.

    Well said (3.66 / 3) (#6)
    by SpinDoctor on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:06:48 PM EST
    Though honoring the accomplishments of both tonight are not mutually exclusive.  In an ideal world, I would love to have both together tonight.  Since that will not occur, there is nothing wrong with Obama celebrating his milestone as long as he does so with equanimity and gives Senator Clinton the substantial credit she is due for also running such a historic candidate.

    I fully expect Obama to be gracious and to use tonight to take the first steps towards bridging the divide that this campaign season has caused.

    candidate=campaign (5.00 / 0) (#14)
    by SpinDoctor on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:09:00 PM EST
    No edit feature  :(

    Don't hold your breath (5.00 / 7) (#26)
    by Prabhata on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:11:58 PM EST
    Obama has no class.  If he did, he would have responded the way McCain responded to Phleger's comments about Hillary. If Obama had class, he would have done a lot of things differently.  Obama and his wife do not belong in the WH.

    You're not being helpful (3.40 / 5) (#49)
    by Democratic Cat on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:17:41 PM EST
    This has nothing to do with Obama's wife. And class has nothing to do with deserving to be in the White House. Come on, stop with the insults.

    Class does have to something (5.00 / 2) (#153)
    by waldenpond on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:37:43 PM EST
    to do with being in the WH in that it goes to character.  Obama has made sexist remarks and benefitted from the sexism that was so over the top in this country.  It will be a challenge to say the least for him to overcome provided his is made the nominee at the convention.

    I don't disagree entirely (1.00 / 1) (#191)
    by Democratic Cat on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:59:06 PM EST
    But I dislike too much focus on character, because it is too subjective. I think there were people in 1992 who thought that Pres. Bush was a classy guy, and Clinton was a bubba. So I'm wary of those kinds of arguments.

    But I was probably reacting more to the reference to Sen. Obama's wife.  After watching people trash Hillary in 1992, I don't want to see that again, even if I have no intention of voting for her husband.


    We disagre then (2.00 / 4) (#51)
    by SpinDoctor on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:18:17 PM EST
    We obviously have different perspectives on what transpired.  For me, what took place in the past needs to stay there if we are going to be successful in November.  For each Obama incident that offended you, please know that Obama supporters can come up with a similar Clinton incident.  Engaging in a tit-for-tat debate for the next 5 months will do nothing but ensure a Republican enters the White House in January.

    He has a whole convention week in August (5.00 / 8) (#78)
    by ruffian on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:23:58 PM EST
    to do nothing but celebrate his milestone. And it will actually be appropriate then.   As Dean put it Saturday, the convention is to "showcase" the candidate.

    It is ungracious to showboat tonight.


    Every single time he says something (5.00 / 3) (#88)
    by sickofhypocrisy on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:25:51 PM EST
    positive about Hillary, I want to throw something at the TV.  Empty words - like every other one that comes out of his mouth.  I would rather he didn't mention her at all than talk about how much he respects her.  Gag.  Effing gag.  If he had an iota of respect for her, he would have put a stop to all of the visciousness perpetrated by his army of children.  

    Please excuse my tone.  I'm about to swallow a very bitter pill and I'm not happy.  


    Be gracious??? (5.00 / 5) (#104)
    by DarielK on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:28:28 PM EST
    He could have waited one more day for his victory speech and let the primary's play out - a slap in the face to Hillary and her supporters.  

    He could have planned the event at somewhere else besides Minnesota - a slap in the face to all Republicans.

    As I have said from the very beginning of Obama's campaign, he is nothing more than an arrogant opportunist - sadly, he just keeps proving me right.


    He couldn't wait one more day (5.00 / 2) (#128)
    by nycstray on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:32:11 PM EST
    he has a freakin' fund raiser here tomorrow night.

    Slap in the face to Republicans? (none / 0) (#180)
    by SpinDoctor on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:52:08 PM EST
    First of all, there has been no "victory speech".  To the extent that Obama claims "victory" tonight, it will occur after ALL the primaries concluded so I have no idea how that could be construed as an insult to anyone.  Secondly, how is holding a rally in Minnesota a slap in the face to Republicans and, frankly, why do you care even if it was?  Minnesota is a swing state that went Democratic in 2004 and one that would be visited frequently by whomever is the nominee.  I just do not understand your complaint.

    The idea is (none / 0) (#223)
    by DFLer on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 05:21:38 PM EST
    it's a slap in the face to the GOP because Obama has booked the Xcel Center in St. Paul, the site of the 2008 GOP convention....whether that's a slap or just chutzpah, I dunno....but that's the context of the previous post. Okay?

    (having trouble posting re server etc., hope this doesn't end up here 3 times. if so, sorry))


    Hey, there's a first time for everything... (5.00 / 0) (#114)
    by MarkL on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:29:42 PM EST
    But don't hold your breath.

    To Not Be a Republican (2.33 / 3) (#185)
    by kaleidescope on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:54:39 PM EST
    I can't remember who, but a few years back someone said about Republicans that they can't even be gracious winners.  I don't expect that Barack Obama or his campaign will be like that, though if you look at some of the diaries at dKos, there will certainly be plenty of Obama supporters who will be.

    There was a time in my life when politics as a fashion statement was more important than politics.  At some point I realized that there was real flesh and blood at stake and, like Billmon, my days of voting for Barry Commoner were over.

    There's at least something romantic about being a fervent never give up jerk in supporting the losing, but better candidate.  I have little patience, but some sympathy (and certainly not disdain) for Dennis Kucinich's and Ron Paul's supporters. May they grow up some day.

    It's quite another thing when you take that self-indulgent narcissistic attitude about a candidate who has won.  What's the point?  As a former Green Bay Packers fan, I understand how nice it is to rub the noses of people from Dallas in the Cowboys' loss.  But football is a game; politics isn't.

    Barack Obama hasn't run a perfect campaign, but he has run a damn good one.  Better than Carter, Mondale, Dukakis, Bill Clinton, Gore or Kerry.  He did, after all, come from behind to beat someone as established, funded, organized and gifted as Hillary Clinton.  Say what you want, but Barack Obama and his campaign are adults for whom politics isn't a fashion statement.

    So, yes, I expect that the Obamas and their campaign will give Senator Clinton as much space as she needs -- at least to the extent that doesn't conflict with organizing and running a strong and ruthless general election campaign against John McCain.

    And I expect that Senator Clinton will also be an adult for whom politics isn't a fashion statement.  She understands that all the things she cares about -- all those things she teared up about in New Hampshire -- will be easier for her to work on and to enact if Barack Obama is in the White House rather than John McCain.  

    Who can doubt Hillary Clinton's commitment to universal health care?  How different would the prospects be depending on who gets elected president in November?  Personally, I would like to see her appointed to replace John Paul Stevens on the Supreme Court (though she's a little old).

    In any event, I expect both Obama and Clinton will deal with each other as adults.  I also expect that to be the case with most of their supporters, though there will always be a few who are, like I once was, more interested in politics as a fashion statement than a serious life and death game.

    May they grow up some day.

    Heh (5.00 / 3) (#205)
    by Steve M on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 05:10:43 PM EST
    You make more childish, mocking posts than just about anyone at this site.  Take a look in the mirror before you deliver that self-righteous advice.

    Tonite (1.00 / 2) (#23)
    by eagleye on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:11:38 PM EST
    I expect that Obama will bend over backward to acknowledge Senator Clinton's campaign and her supporters.  He is probably under a lot of pressure from the Party to do the right thing and be as inlcusive as possible.  He has already acknowledged that Hillary is on the short list for VP.

    I don't buy into all this talk of leaving the Democratic Party and/or voting for McCain if Hillary is not the nominee.  The next President will have at least 3 Supreme Court appointments, and we're crazy to let the Republicans have the opportunity to cement their hold on the SCOTUS for the next 25 years. That's just plain stupid.

    I Believe He Will (5.00 / 5) (#54)
    by BDB on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:18:41 PM EST
    But I don't believe he's under any pressure from the party.  The party is going to put this all on Clinton. That was clear on Saturday.

    If Obama feels any pressure, it's to try to show he can unify the party without Clinton on the ticket.  Because I don't think he wants her there, but he's limping across the finish line and, if he can't show he's a stronger candidate than he currently is, he may have no choice.


    If What You're Telling Me (5.00 / 10) (#69)
    by BDB on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:22:42 PM EST
    that the Democratic-controlled Senate will not ensure that only qualified, moderate judges get on the Supreme Court, then my response is why should I ever vote for any Democrat for any office?  Because that's kind of a lousy argument:  we're weak and pathetic, so elect more of us!

    Obama has several months to try to win my vote.  So far, every opportunity he's had, he's kicked me in the teeth. Odd, for a guy promising me unity.

    As for the Democratic Party, maybe they can win back my time, money and registration by 2010, if they actually start acting in ways that reflect my values.  


    Look at ant state govt (none / 0) (#79)
    by andgarden on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:24:21 PM EST
    in the country. The Governor may compromise some, but at the end of the day he gets most of what he wanted.

    You've got to control the executive branch.


    Not Massachusetts. (none / 0) (#87)
    by masslib on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:25:26 PM EST
    Massachusetts is an anomaly (none / 0) (#93)
    by andgarden on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:26:41 PM EST
    Look at swing states like Pennsylvania or Virginia.

    Heck, look at the US now (none / 0) (#97)
    by andgarden on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:27:37 PM EST
    Bush is still nominating and having confirmed RW judges, and his war funding is still coming through.

    Yes, because (5.00 / 3) (#126)
    by Democratic Cat on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:32:05 PM EST
    The Senate is full of lily-livered Dems who won't stand up to him, and the people do not hold them accountable. If there were protests on the Mall every week to end the war, it would be ended. Voters say they want government to do certain things and then they don't fight for those things and hold them to account. We're all home watching American Idol. We get the government we deserve.

    I know you aren't saying this, but electing a particular person to the Presidency and then thinking it will all be ok is a big mistake.


    Well, then, I'm just plain stupid. (none / 0) (#127)
    by Shainzona on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:32:09 PM EST
    Shainzona -- me too! (none / 0) (#202)
    by Valhalla on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 05:04:50 PM EST
    I can't agree (1.00 / 1) (#115)
    by Steve in CNJ on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:29:47 PM EST
    that Obama should give Clinton the stage on the night of his primary victory.  Her best opportunity to be a gracious and heroic runner-up was after the Indiana primary when Obama spoke eloquently about her as a role model for his own daughter.  Expect him to reiterate his admiration at some point during this week, but Hillary's moment has passed.

    He can have his moment tonight (5.00 / 4) (#132)
    by bjorn on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:32:56 PM EST
    but even MSNBC is reporting that the Obama camp was responsible for the false AP reports this morning.  He could at least have tried not to do voter suppression today.  So just don't stomp on Clinton today, is all I am saying.

    She should have conceded... (5.00 / 1) (#135)
    by OrangeFur on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:33:42 PM EST
    ... right before she was going to win three primaries by 35+ points?

    You joined to say that? (5.00 / 4) (#176)
    by waldenpond on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:48:57 PM EST
    First comment and that is the best you can come up with.  Oh the unity.  

    Dear Chimster.... (1.00 / 1) (#139)
    by eagleye on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:34:09 PM EST

    The choice is clear--  Either we get McCain, which will be a continutation of Bush policies or worse.  Or we take a chance on Obama.  For me, the war in Iraq and the looming Supreme Court appointments make this an easy decision.  In fact, Hillary would make an terrific Justic appointment if she is interested.

    And there is another factor which isn't getting any media attention-- if we can drive huge voter turnout among Democrats in November, we can win a lot of the down-ticket races for House and Senate, Governorships, state and local races, etc.
    This year has the potential to be a real game changer that could marginalize the Republicans for decades, and I'm not going to sit on the sidelines.  I've voting a straight Democratic ticket.

    Maybe. (5.00 / 5) (#155)
    by OrangeFur on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:38:09 PM EST
    Not that I don't think those things are important, but also important is sending a message to the Democratic Party that their treatment of Hillary Clinton this cycle was abhorrent.

    I won't let them take me for granted. Their actions throughout this campaign, and especially on Saturday when they simply gave Obama some free delegates, has been disgraceful.


    I appreciate the info (5.00 / 1) (#175)
    by Chimster on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:42:39 PM EST
    and agree with what you say, but the question remains "Why Barack?" besides the obvious Republican presidency issues if a Dem doesn't win.

    If Supreme Court and Iraq were the top issues of importance to you, then  Hillary should be in the White House, not him.


    Please tell me (none / 0) (#172)
    by cawaltz on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:41:29 PM EST
    that you aren't going for Anybody but.....version 2.0. Please tell me you have a BETTER argument because that one didn't work real well in 2004.

    The divergent roads must re-join (1.00 / 2) (#188)
    by tlhwraith on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:57:29 PM EST
    Traditionally the winner of any contest is magnanimous, but at the same time the expectation is that the non-winner doesn't steal the winners spotlight.  I understand the notion of giving Clinton and her supporters some space to work through this, and I hear ya, but what about the other side that says that Obama and his supporters should be given the opportunity to celebrate the fruits of their history making campaign?

    Also, I understand this is a pro Clinton blog and all, but Barack Obama isn't the devil.  There is just as logical and reasonable case to be made that any bad blood that exists is either a result of the Clintons or a hybrid Clinton/Obama mistake.  I learned a long time ago that the first sign of seeing you are in the wrong is when your ideology becomes so polarized you can't at least see the "other side" of an arguement.  The fact that both candidates have almost 50% of the party behind them should be a strong indication that any ill-feelings are not the exclusive right of one side to claim.  Remember, on the issues themselves, Obama and Clinton are darn near the same.

    And now, the real war begins. Obama faces a party divided by sex and race, a country yearning for a new direction but petrified of change, and a world holding its breath to see what the future of the country will be, either a mere regurgitation of the current mess or the possibility of a new and better tomorrow.

    But, those fights are for tomorrow, tonight some of us get to watch history in the making while others sulk and fester in the past and in delusions of a tomorrow that was never guaranteed. Hopefully, all of us as a party can pull back from the precibus of snatching defeat from the hands of victory and realize that although our favorite Democrat may not be our nominee, on a bad day Obama is still better than McCain.

    So tonight, either lick the wounds of your shattered ego or revel in the history making end to an epic conflict of two stellar candidates, for tomorrow, tomorrow we all march headlong into the abyss of an entirely new paradigm of POTUS campaigns. An abyss marked with the perils of a very unconventional nominee, baptized by the fires of a long and protracted nomination process, lifting the hopes of many, carrying the fear and doubt of many others.

    Congratulations Senator Obama for winning and hats off to Senator Clinton for putting up an epic challenge.

    First female candidate should be post-60's era (1.00 / 2) (#196)
    by jor on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 05:01:49 PM EST
    ... but its amazing someone doesn't make the obvious parallel between Obama and Clinton. The first woman president, like the first black president, will be post-civil rights / post-feminism. This is a good thing for everyone. A post-feminist president will be much better female presidential candidate and much free-er.

    One decade ago, rappers were singing that we would never see a black president in our life time. I think women might feel the same way right now -- but obviously times have changed. There are plenty of amazing women out there. Just like Obama came almost out of nowhere, don't be surprised, if an amazing female candidate comes out of nowhere, in the next decade.

    Agreed (1.00 / 1) (#204)
    by s5 on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 05:07:28 PM EST
    Though Hillary's great success, even in her loss, is to prove that a woman can run for president and be taken seriously as a formidable candidate, rather than a novelty or an "identity" candidate. If anything, maybe this primary has shown that America is finally growing up a little, and that your skin color or gender matters far less than your platform and your ability to execute a campaign.

    Cheers to the Democratic party for this primary. For all its flaws and mistakes, we can finally feel comfortable considering candidates who aren't white men.

    good point (none / 0) (#20)
    by manish on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:10:57 PM EST
    Hey BTD,

    Point well said and well taken.  Having said that, its time for unity and its time to move forward.

    Clinton has the right to stay in the race as long as she wants to.  On the other hand, Obama and his supporters also have the right to call on her to suspend (or whatever you want to call it) her campaign and endorse Obama and start working towards winning in November.

    disagree, manish (5.00 / 8) (#62)
    by suki on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:20:53 PM EST
    No one has the 'right' to suspend Senator Clinton's campaign, other than Senator Clinton.

    to be clear.. (none / 0) (#192)
    by manish on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:59:26 PM EST
    ..I wrote:

    Obama and his supporters also have the right to call on her to suspend...


    Pardon me for oversight (5.00 / 2) (#208)
    by suki on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 05:13:40 PM EST
    I still disagree. They have no right to 'call on her' to suspend.

    What right would that be? (5.00 / 0) (#235)
    by americanincanada on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 05:29:48 PM EST
    At that point it would be within her rights to say that the superdelegates votes are nothing more than promises until November and since he doesn't have enough pledged delegates to secure the nomination, it's impossible, then she could continue.

    How Obama conducts himself now, tonight, means everything going forward.


    ahhh...there's that "unity" word again (5.00 / 8) (#72)
    by Josey on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:23:05 PM EST
    If only it had meant more than just a word to Obama...
    His reactionary rhetoric and consistent vitriol and animosity toward Hillary and the Clinton administration appears to confirm his Establishment backers wanted to kill the Clinton legacy!
    And they certainly didn't envision Hillary as his running mate, since she was supposed to be gone months ago.

    I think this is a historic night for both, and (none / 0) (#37)
    by demps on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:16:04 PM EST
    what would be truly fitting would be if they honored each other. And I am holding out hope that Senator Clinton may be extended an invitation for the vice presidency, Obama can only benefit by her addition.

    I go back and forth on this. (5.00 / 2) (#108)
    by OrangeFur on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:28:49 PM EST
    That ticket would be so clearly upside-down it would almost be farcical.

    At the moment my reaction to every piece of Democratic solicitation is a pretty short "Screw this."

    To make me feel more enthusiastic, unity will have to mean more than "let's do it my way."

    If only the Democratic establishment could put as much effort into health care as they put into stopping Hillary Clinton...


    Obama has every right (none / 0) (#47)
    by mattt on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:17:34 PM EST
    to celebrate a historic event tonight, if he crosses the finish line in terms of pledged delegates after waging a great campaign.

    Hillary has every right to celebrate a historic campaign that paved the way for future female candidates.

    BTD's post sounds like it's a night for mourning.  Both campaigns should celebrate, their own achievments, each others', and those of the party and the nation.

    mattt (5.00 / 4) (#63)
    by bjorn on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:21:09 PM EST
    I know you mean well, and I want Obama and his folks to have their moment but for some of us it is like mourning, so just let us have that tonight.  Don't ask us to get excited about anything tonight.

    OK, (none / 0) (#163)
    by mattt on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:39:24 PM EST
    thanks for recognizing good intentions.

    Reading BTD's post again  I see he wasn't calling for mourning, but for sensitivity by BO.  I agree with that sentiment completely, and hope and expect that he'll show just that.


    for some reason (5.00 / 2) (#83)
    by Capt Howdy on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:24:55 PM EST
    I think your celebratory mood is relative to who is "winning".

    If he were defeating Repubs (5.00 / 5) (#134)
    by Chimster on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:33:04 PM EST
    then great! Let's celebrate!

    But he's defeating his own party, and a majority of the party at that!


    I for one will be shocked if he gets (none / 0) (#148)
    by bjorn on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:35:37 PM EST
    any boost, at least not until he puts Clinton on the ticket

    there will likely be some boost (5.00 / 1) (#169)
    by Capt Howdy on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:40:52 PM EST
    at least in the short term.
    but the fact is in this climate the dem should be 15 or 20 points ahead.
    anyone touting a two point lead at this point is clueless.

    VISIBLE Show of Support for Hillary!! (none / 0) (#179)
    by sos2008election on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:51:20 PM EST
    Dear ALL,

    Please let the media and the world know how much we care and respect Hillary Clinton by sending any tribute (flowers, packages, signs, ribbons, etc) feasible for people who are able to reach the Clinton house in NY.

    It's NOT to be funereal, but an honoring and tribute and show of support to a true American Hero!  Anything that the media or camera could angle as if a 'r.i.p.' or 'goodbye' should, of course, be avoided--ie, clear unequivocal messages of support and respect (sign messages, ribbon creations, floral arrangements, etc etc)

    A plus is that it is a story/photo that the media canNOT ignore, no how much they may parse their words.  It is also a strong message to the DNC and SD and other supporters of HRC to not give up the good fight...:)

    Please send out the call of visible support to any and all possible who can act on this today (ideally a strong message/photo op BEFORE the speeches tonight)


    MT looks strong for Obama (none / 0) (#182)
    by waldenpond on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 04:54:04 PM EST
    $$$ going for Obama 61/35
    College Obama 64/32
    Srs for Clinton but I missed the number
    Under 30 Obama 74/24
    61 men for O no surprise
    50 % women for Obama

    Obama should win by at least 10 looks like. sigh.

    Maxine Waters (none / 0) (#199)
    by SarahinCA on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 05:03:45 PM EST
    changed her endorsement today.

    I don't get it.  I can understand changing if something horrible happened, but what kind of reasoning is this?

    (CNN) -- California Rep. Maxine Waters, a longtime supporter of Hillary Clinton, said Tuesday she is switching her support to Barack Obama.

    "Senator Hillary Clinton has run a superb campaign and has proven to be a hard worker while gaining the support of many key constituencies that will be essential for Democratic success in November," she said in a statement. "Despite that, Senator Obama's delegate numbers more than describe the enthusiasm for his candidacy and I believe that by the end of the day, he will have the necessary numbers to become the Democratic Party nominee for President."

    "It is now time to close ranks and time for all remaining delegates to put their support behind the presumptive nominee, Senator Obama. Senator Obama has run an effective campaign and has overcome many obstacles to create an energy that has brought many new Democrats into the party," Waters also said. "Together, both of these candidates have generated an unprecedented involvement in Democratic Party politics. This is something that all Democrats can be proud of."

    Speaking to CNN in early February, Waters said she endorsed Clinton over Obama because "It's clear there are two different campaigns, one is about hope and inspiration and the other is a campaign about concrete proposals and solving problems -- and I think Senator Clinton's experience emerged very clearly."

    Thanks for making me cry, BTD (none / 0) (#232)
    by Lil on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 05:28:33 PM EST

    Supreme Court and Abortion Rights (none / 0) (#240)
    by whecht on Tue Jun 03, 2008 at 08:54:45 PM EST
    I hope that all the Democrats can come together and defeat McCain.

    Imagine what would happen if you replaced Stevens, Ginsburg and Souter with clones of Roberts, Alito, and Scalia?????