home

NC Exits, Thread 2

By Big Tent Democrat, Section Elections 2008
Posted on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:32:16 PM EST
Tags: (all tags)
Share This: Digg! StumbleUpon del.icio.us reddit reddit

(BTD) The NC exits. Obama wins. Whites (63%) go Clinton by 59-36 (5% missing?). African Americans (33%) go Obama by 93-7.

4% of the vote is missing from this exit poll. Right now it shows 55-39.

Comments now closed.

< Indiana Results: Thread Two | New Elections Thread, CBS Calls Indiana for Hillary >

  • The Online Magazine with Liberal coverage of crime-related political and injustice news

  • Contribute To TalkLeft


    • Display: Sort:
    NC Exits, Thread 2 | 199 comments (199 topical)
    BTD apologize to Zogby! (5.00 / 1) (#1)
    by GOPmurderedconscience on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:34:20 PM EST
    He seems to have come pretty close in NC.

    He said Obama would win Indiana (5.00 / 2) (#5)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:35:46 PM EST


    Parent
    0_o (none / 0) (#2)
    by Faust on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:35:25 PM EST


    Parent
    I don't understand why NC was called this early... (none / 0) (#152)
    by Exeter on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:11:51 PM EST
    ...as compared to saying "too early to call" as they traditionally do until they get some bellweather areas in.

    Parent
    Wait...only 36% white for Obama? (5.00 / 1) (#3)
    by Stellaaa on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:35:37 PM EST


    Am I wrong (5.00 / 1) (#10)
    by Iphie on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:39:55 PM EST
    in thinking that that figure does not bode well for Obama? I mean, beyond today?

    Parent
    No you are not (5.00 / 1) (#17)
    by angie on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:40:55 PM EST
    he can't win the GE with that kind of number for white votes.

    Parent
    His white numbers are dropping (5.00 / 1) (#31)
    by nycstray on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:44:23 PM EST
    and he already didn't have Hispanic . . .

    now how's he gonna win the GE?

    Parent

    That's the usual white vote for Obama (none / 0) (#102)
    by Cream City on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:00:02 PM EST
    across all the states so far.  That's why he can't take the GE.  Bill Clinton needed 45% of it to give us our only Dem prez in decades.  Gore and Kerry got a bit over 40% -- and it wasn't enough.

    Parent
    Obama if he's lucky (none / 0) (#109)
    by Salo on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:01:23 PM EST
    gets 39%

    Parent
    Be interesting to see (none / 0) (#117)
    by riddlerandy on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:03:32 PM EST
    Hillary win it with seven percent of the AA vote, too

    Parent
    The difference, though, (none / 0) (#142)
    by Exeter on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:09:42 PM EST
    is that black voters will stay home or vote for Hillary. White voters are much more likely to vote McCain, which is twice as worse than simply staying at home.

    Parent
    I am sure you believe that (none / 0) (#160)
    by riddlerandy on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:13:10 PM EST
    but that doesnt make it so,

    Parent
    Have you taken into account the percentage (none / 0) (#187)
    by Florida Resident on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:17:09 PM EST
    of voters in the GE that AA voters compromise as opposed to white voters?

    Parent
    On the flip side (none / 0) (#147)
    by sarissa on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:11:20 PM EST
    9% AA for Hilary is abysmal :(  What happened?  Shouldn't she be peeling off more AA females?

    Parent
    There's no reqason to suppose (none / 0) (#157)
    by Salo on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:12:51 PM EST
    that Obama would get anything less than the Stalinist 90%

    Parent
    On TV, CNN say he got 41% of whites. (5.00 / 1) (#4)
    by Teresa on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:35:45 PM EST


    Well (none / 0) (#38)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:47:16 PM EST
    The web site does not.

    Parent
    I saw that. They must be meaning (none / 0) (#61)
    by Teresa on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:52:30 PM EST
    non-AA rather than just white, I guess. Or they are just wrong one place.

    Parent
    SUSA was right about AAs (5.00 / 1) (#6)
    by andgarden on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:36:51 PM EST
    I think this might be a case where Obama looks better in the exits than he actually does. Think Georgia.

    The AA vote is huge for Obama (5.00 / 2) (#14)
    by oldnorthstate on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:40:32 PM EST
    Enormous.  Beyond enormous.  It is unreal.

    Parent
    Wright didn't hurt him at all w. the black voters (5.00 / 1) (#34)
    by bridget on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:45:49 PM EST
    that's for sure

    Parent
    case closed. (none / 0) (#64)
    by Salo on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:52:45 PM EST
    indeed.

    They can't hold him to anything can they?

    Parent

    Take a look at how Michelle campaigned (none / 0) (#183)
    by Shainzona on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:16:06 PM EST
    in NC.  It was a revival meeting!

    http://article.nationalreview.com/?q=OGQ1MzFkMWU4MmYxMjhkZmNiZGE5YWY3NWUzNGMyMmY=

    Parent

    What would you expect? (5.00 / 1) (#39)
    by Mrwirez on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:47:20 PM EST
    I still won't vote for him

    Parent
    Thanks Ralph (none / 0) (#80)
    by Molly Bloom on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:56:14 PM EST


    Parent
    It's almost as if (5.00 / 1) (#41)
    by Edgar08 on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:48:12 PM EST
    They've only considered one thing when voting for him.


    Parent
    Almost??? (5.00 / 1) (#60)
    by sickofhypocrisy on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:52:15 PM EST


    Parent
    Well I do wonder (5.00 / 1) (#73)
    by Edgar08 on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:54:45 PM EST
    If MLK's dream included 95% of the black population voting for a black candidate?


    Parent
    The first serious one? (5.00 / 4) (#100)
    by gyrfalcon on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:59:34 PM EST
    You bet it would have.  Listen, it's one thing to be a little disappointed more AAs don't see Hillary as vastly better, but nobody, none of us, should be criticizing those voters for voting for the first guy ever who looks like them, has a reasonable approximation of their overall political values, and has a very real chance to be POTUS.

    Many of us who are, ahem, not white males understandably have a hard time really understanding  the power of that possibility because it's simply never been on the radar screen in all of human history.

    Parent

    Wow (none / 0) (#129)
    by Edgar08 on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:06:45 PM EST
    "Looks like them".

    Parent
    Let me make one thing clear to everyone (none / 0) (#168)
    by Edgar08 on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:13:53 PM EST
    Cause there are clearly things you can and can't say about all this crap.   Even on this blog.

    But I will make one thing perfectly clear.

    If women were voting for Clinton to the tune of 93/6, I'd be saying the exactly same thing about them.


    Parent

    Kind of like, say, (none / 0) (#170)
    by sickofhypocrisy on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:14:22 PM EST
    a female president?  Yet white and hispanic women are not voting on genitalia.  

    Parent
    dunno.. (none / 0) (#97)
    by p lukasiak on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:59:24 PM EST
    but I doubt that he would want 92% of them who said that race wasn't important voting for a Black candidate.

    That's the number that always kills me in these exit polls.   The only explanation for it (other than lying, or some really severe lack of self-awareness) that I can come up with is that Wright was correct about the whole right brain-left brain thing.

    And I'd rather think that AA are just lying.

    Parent

    But BO's white numbers are horrible. (5.00 / 1) (#51)
    by Shainzona on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:50:48 PM EST
    I read someplace that if he doesn't break 40% with white voters he has big problems.

    Parent
    OK.........well, (5.00 / 1) (#7)
    by AnninCA on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:37:00 PM EST
    I think I agree with the CNN pundit.  This is not close enough.

    They called NC already? (5.00 / 2) (#8)
    by joanneleon on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:37:41 PM EST
    I saw that CNN and MSNBC called NC as soon as the polls closed.  I have to admit, that's kind of weird, given that Indiana results are still pouring in and the state hasn't been called even though the spread is not tight.

    Strange.  Are the exit polls that reliable?

    He got 91% of the AA vote (5.00 / 1) (#12)
    by angie on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:40:14 PM EST
    which made up 1/3 of the votes -- no way can Hillary win it, but we still have to wait for the margin -- if she keeps it close it is good for her no matter what the pundits say -- remember Obama was always expected to win NC because of demographics -- IN was to be the "tie-breaker." Plus, Hillary is winning more white votes.

    Parent
    Only when they favor Obama (none / 0) (#15)
    by stillife on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:40:37 PM EST


    Parent
    CNN actually had a countdown so they... (none / 0) (#56)
    by Shainzona on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:51:27 PM EST
    could all shout Obama wins NC!!!  He's so awesome.

    Parent
    Nice "post-racial" coalition there. (5.00 / 2) (#11)
    by MarkL on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:40:01 PM EST


    It's post Stalin. (5.00 / 1) (#20)
    by Salo on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:42:08 PM EST


    Parent
    No, we are having a dialogue about race (5.00 / 2) (#22)
    by Stellaaa on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:42:15 PM EST


    Parent
    Where; when? (none / 0) (#37)
    by oculus on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:47:03 PM EST


    Parent
    No wait...monologues (5.00 / 2) (#46)
    by Stellaaa on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:48:39 PM EST


    Parent
    The Speech II (5.00 / 1) (#67)
    by oculus on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:53:33 PM EST


    Parent
    True. but who is at fault? (none / 0) (#62)
    by sarissa on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:52:31 PM EST
    Why does Obama get all the "blame" about this? Clinton should be getting more of the black vote than she is and has been.  9% is shameful - thanks Bill :(

    Parent
    Don't blame Bill (5.00 / 2) (#76)
    by ineedalife on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:56:04 PM EST
    If it wasn't one thing it would have been another. Obama's strategy was to mine every interview done by the Clinton camp to find something they could distort to betray them and their supporters as racists.

    You could say it was inevitable and smart politics but I will never vote for Obama now.

    Parent

    Not Bill's fault (5.00 / 1) (#114)
    by ruffian on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:03:01 PM EST
    Obama camp played the race card masterfully, at least for a Dem primary.  He could have won the nom without it, and not alienated whites (like me) in the process.  It will sink him in the GE.

    Parent
    Because it was Obama who started (5.00 / 4) (#81)
    by angie on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:56:22 PM EST
    calling the Clinton's racist on such bs pretexts as Hillary's "tears" in NH, Bill's use of the word "fairy tale," etc., etc. -- remember the "How to play the race card" memo the Obama camp produced that pumpkinhead held up at the NV debate? This was not the fault of anything said by Hillary or Bill.

    Parent
    this is about Wright... (5.00 / 2) (#115)
    by p lukasiak on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:03:12 PM EST
    not Clinton.

    Its a purely "defensive" vote -- AA feel they can't abandon Obama when he is being "attacked because of his race."  

    But the exact same dynamic is killing Obama with with voters, whose objections to Wright aren't really about "race" qua "race", but about Wright's perspective on racial issues.  

    Parent

    But in the General Election (none / 0) (#150)
    by stefystef on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:11:37 PM EST
    race will be an issue.  Many white who voted for Obama said they would vote for McCain in the General Election.

    Obama won't hold onto a significant white electorate when up against McCain.

    If Obama is the nominee, McCain is the President of the United States.

    Parent

    that's exactly right (none / 0) (#162)
    by Dr Molly on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:13:29 PM EST
    So, where does that leave us?

    The racial divide is really depressing here.

    Oh, and one thing that hasn't been much discussed, but which I'm sure will be forthcoming - the new pastor of Trinity makes Rev. Wright look mainstream.

    So the racial polarization may yet deteriorate.

    Parent

    100% in agreement with that!! It was a defensive (none / 0) (#194)
    by DeborahNC on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:18:51 PM EST
    vote, IMO. No doubt! I think when she began closing the gap, it was motivation to really get out there for Obama for some folks!

    Parent
    to who? (none / 0) (#75)
    by Salo on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:55:18 PM EST
    I'd personally be more comfortable with the Democratic Party if more white people voted Dem and less black.

    There's no way that 90% of the black population actually is socially liberal and fiscally liberal.

    Parent

    Ugh! (1.00 / 0) (#191)
    by sarissa on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:18:50 PM EST
    So 1 white voter is worth more than 1 black voter in your calculus then?  In what percentage - 3/5 maybe?  Crawl back under your rock please.

    Parent
    Ugh! (1.00 / 0) (#192)
    by sarissa on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:18:50 PM EST
    So 1 white voter is worth more than 1 black voter in your calculus then?  In what percentage - 3/5 maybe?  Crawl back under your rock please.

    Parent
    As Bill would say (none / 0) (#137)
    by riddlerandy on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:07:56 PM EST
    Jesse Jackson did well there too

    Parent
    NC Live Results (5.00 / 1) (#16)
    by ChuckieTomato on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:40:37 PM EST
    Here

    According to this chart (none / 0) (#24)
    by stefystef on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:42:28 PM EST
    Obama is behind Hillary.  Can someone explain this?

    Parent
    It's very early (none / 0) (#27)
    by ChuckieTomato on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:43:19 PM EST
    Metros haven't reported yet

    Parent
    Yes, I understand (none / 0) (#169)
    by stefystef on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:14:00 PM EST
    I see the changing in the votes.
    When does the early vote ballots get counted?

    Parent
    The Election Is Now Completely Racialized (5.00 / 2) (#21)
    by dugan49 on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:42:14 PM EST
    93% black vote for Obama guarantees racial polarization in this country. Blacks and leftists do not realize or understand this.

    Obama's racist pastor meant nothing to blacks in N.C.

    I agree... (5.00 / 2) (#25)
    by stefystef on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:43:01 PM EST
    and this kind of emphasis on the AA votes will not play well in WV and KY.

    Parent
    Leftists no (5.00 / 1) (#32)
    by catfish on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:45:26 PM EST
    but blacks might. Completely understand voting identity-wise for a viable candidate. But a lot of blacks are women.

    Parent
    I dunno.... (none / 0) (#126)
    by p lukasiak on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:05:36 PM EST
    when 92% of African Americans who say that race was not a factor in their decision wind up voting for Obama, you gotta wonder to what extent they are aware of the actual dynamic in this campaign.

    Parent
    Leftists actually do understand that. (5.00 / 3) (#43)
    by Salo on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:48:29 PM EST
    I consider myself a European Style Social Democrat who would be on the left side of a Labour UK, argument. Because that's literally what I am.

    What you have is some social democratic leftists who realize that this sort of polarization is destructive, and some revolutionary leftists who actually see it as a good.

    Obama is really showing his Alinski bathos right now.  Clinton is showing her Attlee-like seriousness.

    She's got the more useful coalition to enact reform.  His looks like a polite version of the SDS Socialist Workers Party Platform.

    ordinary voters will begin to realize this and whig out without really understanding why.

    Parent

    Bingo! (5.00 / 2) (#57)
    by AnninCA on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:51:38 PM EST
    That's the American non-academic version of saying.......

    I so agree.

    Parent

    BINGO! twice over (5.00 / 2) (#119)
    by RalphB on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:03:55 PM EST
    Democrats are going to nominate someone who will make Dukakis look like a winner.

    Parent
    heh.. (none / 0) (#132)
    by p lukasiak on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:07:02 PM EST
    ordinary voters will begin to realize this and whig out without really understanding why.

    great pun!

    Parent

    How does Obama's base grow for the GE? (5.00 / 1) (#66)
    by OxyCon on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:53:18 PM EST
    Obama has monopolized the AA vote in the Democratic party, and even though he owns this demographic, he's still only beating Hillary by a very slim margin.
    My question is, how does Obama grow his base for the general election? We all know there aren't many AA Republican votes out there for him. I think his voter appeal is maximized and there is no where for him to grow. I do not see conservatives voting for him, be they Dem or Repub.

    Parent
    Personally, I think he doesn't (5.00 / 7) (#72)
    by andgarden on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:54:31 PM EST
    we're screwed.

    Parent
    And at 4 times what it will cost McCain? (5.00 / 1) (#121)
    by Cream City on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:03:58 PM EST
    I know Obama has tapped a lot of donors, a lot of bucks -- but really, if it costs him this much to win primaries, imagine the cost of the GE.

    Parent
    Weeks in PA, 3:1 spent, didn't even budge Nos. (5.00 / 1) (#206)
    by Ellie on Tue May 06, 2008 at 08:01:40 PM EST
    And that's up against a fellow DEM.

    He's alienated other minority voters, repelled seriously loyal Dems -- including the kind of Dems who get out the vote -- and hasn't made "back" the equivalent with new registrants / donors.

    If the Dems go all in based on this, they might as well hang millstones downticket IMO. When the sh!t really starts flying out of the Repug catapults, those are the ones who'll bear the brunt of it.

    Incidentally, Donna Brazille is being especially nauseating: beaming and saying she'll cook stuff for Bill Bennet and Lou Dobbs, and getting tetchy about GE concerns, saying she wants to discuss ISSUES not superficialities. (Oh bake it, Donna.)

    I'm going to tune in later to see how it looked when the dice stopped. The Obama spokesbot is still flogging the "eleven contests in a row" faux accomplishment which doesn't portend well.

    Parent

    Maybe true, but his supporters (none / 0) (#139)
    by independent voter on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:09:03 PM EST
    are willing to fund it.

    Parent
    I could swear I just heard... (5.00 / 1) (#144)
    by OxyCon on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:09:56 PM EST
    ...Donna Brazille basically saying something about a "new" democratic party that doesn't need to rely on white, working class voters.
    WTF?
    Am I being tossed out of my political party?
    Because, I'll be glad to tell you, I really do not need any more motivation for leaving the party.

    Parent
    I have (5.00 / 2) (#155)
    by dissenter on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:12:38 PM EST
    two college degrees. Apparently I will be right behind you.

    Parent
    The whole CNN team (5.00 / 2) (#199)
    by lilburro on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:47:57 PM EST
    is quite happy to dismiss the white working class/rural vote tonight.  Obnoxiously so.  Because apparently, in the Democratic Party, they are second only to aliens in terms of the smallness of their representation.

    The new Dem message:

    We don't need you, but you should know, it's in your economic interest to vote for us.

    WTF?  Does this pan out in the long run?  No.  Not at all.  

    Parent

    Voting patterns guarantee racial polarization? (none / 0) (#108)
    by Molly Bloom on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:01:20 PM EST
     At best it might be evidence of racial polarization, but it does not guarantee racial polarization. Oy Vey!

    Parent
    Oh brother! (5.00 / 1) (#28)
    by ChiTownDenny on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:43:39 PM EST
    What would be her strategy now, 2209?  NC just broke my heart.

    On CNN (none / 0) (#138)
    by ChiTownDenny on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:08:40 PM EST
    Donna Brazile just said the Dem party is expanding/changing.  Barack doesn't need "blue collar" votes to win the GE!

    Parent
    she also said, don't need Hispanics (5.00 / 1) (#151)
    by Stellaaa on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:11:39 PM EST
    either....

    Parent
    Axelrod just said (none / 0) (#181)
    by ChiTownDenny on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:15:46 PM EST
    he thinks the party will come together.  Will someone give him this site's web address.  I don't think so.

    Parent
    Brazille actually said those things? (none / 0) (#202)
    by jawbone on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:53:20 PM EST
    The 10% party? With some higher socio-economic whties? And young people?

    Parent
    Well that's a Mccain commercial right there. (5.00 / 1) (#174)
    by Maria Garcia on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:14:49 PM EST
     

    Parent
    Maybe it's time for a 3rd party because (5.00 / 1) (#200)
    by ChiTownDenny on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:50:26 PM EST
    I see THIS Dem party polarized/split.  I don't see us coming together in Nov.  And a DNC bigshot just said she doesn't care about core Dem demographics.

    Parent
    What more could she have done? (5.00 / 2) (#33)
    by OrangeFur on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:45:36 PM EST
    She won whites by 23 points. The AA vote is simply lost for her.

    If the reality is that she has to win whites by much more than that, then it's simply impossible. You can't demand someone win the white vote by 40 points.

    I'm not sure you'd want it to happen (5.00 / 2) (#49)
    by Salo on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:50:23 PM EST
    period.

    that sort of a majority denotes a chilly political reality.

    The Dems themselves don't even get that sort of a performance out of the GOP.

    Parent

    Where did you get that number? (n/t) (none / 0) (#48)
    by cmugirl on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:49:46 PM EST


    Parent
    The 23 points... (none / 0) (#87)
    by OrangeFur on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:58:12 PM EST
    ... is from BTD's calculation. A 40-point margin among whites is about what she needed to overcome Obama's 80-point margin among blacks, who make up 1/3 of NC's voters.

    The demographics are basically insurmountable. Even nationally, if the AA vote is about 20 points (just a guess), she'd have to win the remaining voters by 20 points to overcome a 90-10 split among blacks.

    That's an almost impossible demand, it seems.

    Parent

    Huh? Nationally, she wouldn't be up against (none / 0) (#125)
    by Cream City on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:05:30 PM EST
    an AA.  She still has the better stats to beat McCain.

    Parent
    And Obama (none / 0) (#135)
    by americanincanada on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:07:30 PM EST
    will bleed hispanic support to McCain. God...it will be a McCain landslide of epic proportions.

    Parent
    I meant nationally... (none / 0) (#154)
    by OrangeFur on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:12:07 PM EST
    ... in the sense of the Democratic primary.

    Parent
    Indianapolis and Gary (5.00 / 1) (#52)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:51:03 PM EST
    But frankly, their regional exits do not support their assumptions.

    I am getting the feeling the exits are significantly off tonight.

    I agree (none / 0) (#68)
    by andgarden on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:53:42 PM EST
    but which way do you think they're off? Like PA in IN?

    Parent
    Look at Marion county (none / 0) (#113)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:02:57 PM EST
    The exits said Obama 71-29. It is running 60-40.

    Parent
    AAs over-represented (none / 0) (#118)
    by andgarden on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:03:52 PM EST
    SUSA smarter than the exits?

    Parent
    isn't marion (none / 0) (#141)
    by p lukasiak on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:09:24 PM EST
    isn't marion the GOP county where there were lots of voters earlier today?

    Parent
    No (none / 0) (#146)
    by andgarden on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:11:14 PM EST
    Marion is home of Indianapolis.

    Parent
    The NC exits... (none / 0) (#71)
    by Dawn Davenport on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:54:18 PM EST
    ...have Obama winning women, which I find hard to believe even with the overwhelming AA vote for him.

    Parent
    That's why he's winning women (none / 0) (#74)
    by andgarden on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:55:06 PM EST
    it's very believable.

    Parent
    I do not (none / 0) (#85)
    by americanincanada on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:57:35 PM EST
    believe for one second that Obama won women in NC.

    Parent
    Then you can't do math (5.00 / 1) (#89)
    by andgarden on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:58:30 PM EST


    Parent
    If black women... (5.00 / 1) (#99)
    by OrangeFur on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:59:30 PM EST
    ... were a third of all the women, then yes, he probably won among women.

    Parent
    yeah, you're right... (none / 0) (#94)
    by Dawn Davenport on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:58:50 PM EST
    I realized that after looking at the percentages again.

    Parent
    Obama "loses" momentum (5.00 / 2) (#55)
    by stefystef on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:51:22 PM EST
    because he was suppose to win NC by about 20% because many thought he had the white voters.

    Hillary really strengthened her coalition.  What unity can Obama offer?  None.  He can't win Red States in November, but Hillary can.

    If Obama is the nominee, McCain is the President.

    sorry he's done (5.00 / 2) (#58)
    by kmblue on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:52:00 PM EST


    Wright actually good for BO in the AA community (5.00 / 3) (#59)
    by GOPmurderedconscience on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:52:08 PM EST
    When the press and everyone else took the issue, we felt besieged, even I as a Hillary supporter.

    I think we always regroup as soon as we feel one of ours is attacked.

    Makes sense (5.00 / 1) (#95)
    by Steve M on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:59:12 PM EST
    If I were black I'd find it awfully hard not to be upset by the obvious double standard.

    Parent
    That's OK (none / 0) (#82)
    by AnninCA on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:56:42 PM EST
    If he won, he won.  

    And if he's the Dem candidate in spite of it, so be it.

    and if we lose the Fall because of it, so be it.

    I still feel very good that Hillary really fought it well in NC, was on target, and if she can't hit 60% of the "white" vote, so be it.

    She probably should get out.

    Overall?  I'll still always think it was "stolen."  But that's a bigger issue.

    Finally, we hit these two primaries on equal footing.

    If she lost this badly, then she lost.

    If she wins slim in Indiana and loses this big in NC?

    Won't work.

    She needs to end it.

    Parent

    I thought this might happen - Support higher in AA (none / 0) (#101)
    by jawbone on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:59:42 PM EST
    community as Obama seen to be under attack about Wright.

    Now, does this follow through to IN?

    Since she gets only singled digit votes from blacks in both states, mayhap.

    Parent

    I predict (5.00 / 1) (#83)
    by ajain on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:56:49 PM EST
    She will drop out by the end of the week, if the exit polls bear out.

    I Predict You Are Wrong. (5.00 / 2) (#90)
    by PssttCmere08 on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:58:37 PM EST


    Parent
    Lets hope (none / 0) (#116)
    by ajain on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:03:14 PM EST


    Parent
    Not a chance. She was never (5.00 / 1) (#122)
    by vicsan on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:04:50 PM EST
    expected to win NC (except by me). However, Obama WAS suppose to win his neighboring state of Indiana. I think he should drop out. He can't win in November. Democrats will not win NC in November either. AA will support him no matter what, obviously, but he cannot win with that group alone. He needs to drop out by the end of the week.

    Parent
    HA! (none / 0) (#148)
    by sickofhypocrisy on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:11:27 PM EST
    Maybe in a perfect world.

    Let's face it, he's going to get it.  The media has already decided it.  They could find him in the back seat of his limo mutilating puppies and they'd forgive him for it.  In fact, they'd find a way to blame Hillary for it.  

    This just sucks.

    Parent

    I like your style. 8^) n/t (none / 0) (#149)
    by misspeach2008 on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:11:32 PM EST


    Parent
    Not a chance. She was never (none / 0) (#182)
    by vicsan on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:15:55 PM EST
    expected to win NC (except by me). However, Obama WAS suppose to win his neighboring state of Indiana. I think he should drop out. He can't win in November. Democrats will not win NC in November either. AA will support him no matter what, obviously, but he cannot win with that group alone. He needs to drop out by the end of the week.

    Parent
    CNN - Brazille throws half the party under the bus (5.00 / 3) (#143)
    by joanneleon on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:09:46 PM EST
    while discussing the results, Donna Brazille just said that the party has changed, is younger and more urban, and she basically said that the white working class voter is not that important anymore.

    Brilliant.  Just brilliant.

    That sure does make me hopeful about jobs in this country, outsourcing, etc.

    My god.. (5.00 / 2) (#158)
    by gmo on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:13:04 PM EST
    ...she is an exceptionally stupid woman.  

    Parent
    You have to re-evaluate Gore. (none / 0) (#177)
    by Salo on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:15:14 PM EST
    Brazille, Lieberman...a pox.

    Parent
    Well well well. (none / 0) (#165)
    by Salo on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:13:39 PM EST
    tipping her cards I see.

    Parent
    I think (none / 0) (#184)
    by TeresaInSnow2 on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:16:09 PM EST
    she should run on that.  Spread that news far and wide, Donna.

    Parent
    OMG what a fool. (none / 0) (#186)
    by RalphB on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:16:49 PM EST


    Parent
    Brazille is a disgrace (none / 0) (#189)
    by stefystef on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:17:50 PM EST
    Please, Hillary, keep going to KY and WV and let's see what Donna's attitude will be about voters in those states.

    The Dems are good at shooting themselves in their foot.  I feel that time is coming if Obama is the nominee.

    Parent

    Heh (5.00 / 1) (#163)
    by Steve M on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:13:32 PM EST
    Here's an interesting one.  In NC, 6% of the voters said, depressingly, that race was "the most important" factor in their vote.  Those voters went 64-34 for Obama.

    Likewise, 6% of the voters said gender was "the most important" factor in their vote.  Those voters went for Obama by an overwhelming 67-28 margin.

    In other words, the number of people who voted for Clinton solely because she's a woman is vastly outweighed by the number of people who voted for Obama solely because he's a man.

    Bagalia...Yeah (5.00 / 0) (#197)
    by Stellaaa on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:41:55 PM EST
    "we cannot win with eggheads and AAs"

    CNN calling out Brazille (5.00 / 0) (#198)
    by catfish on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:46:27 PM EST
    Campbell Brown saying "you've been on our panels for months as an undecided voter. But it sounds very much like you are decided." Brazille: I'm undeclared, not undecided.

    The irony is that Obama (5.00 / 0) (#205)
    by Danbury on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:59:52 PM EST
     never wanted to be the "black candidate" and his campaign used that bogus charge of race baiting against the Clintons in order to inject race into the campaign, yet here we are: without the black vote, Obama wouldn't be in the contest.

    But supposedly to say that is race baiting!

    What an ironic twist to this whole sorry saga.

    Popular vote metric (none / 0) (#9)
    by sarissa on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:38:37 PM EST
    is getting shaky for Clinton if that holds up.  Damn, 55-39.

    I agree...... (none / 0) (#13)
    by AnninCA on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:40:22 PM EST
    I called it below 10%.  That would have been "changing."

    But if he pulled out NC in double digits after the horrible Wright stuff, et al, then that' that.

    But you know what.....at least she finally got a fair shot!

    Parent

    No (5.00 / 4) (#19)
    by americanincanada on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:42:07 PM EST
    If he won on the backs of only the AA voters and got less than 40% of whites he is in trouble for the GE.

    Parent
    this is true... (none / 0) (#173)
    by p lukasiak on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:14:41 PM EST
    especially since these were white DEMOCRATS and independents.

    Kerry got 85% of the black vote in NC in 2004, and still lost by 12 points.

    Parent

    I read on riverdaughter (5.00 / 1) (#23)
    by angie on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:42:25 PM EST
    that the Clinton camp expects her to lose NC by 5 -- not more then that. BUT, they  might not have been expecting 91% AA for Obama.

    Parent
    I think they very much (5.00 / 3) (#29)
    by americanincanada on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:44:12 PM EST
    expected the black vote to go to Obama in those numbers. How could it not? It has in every race.

    But he is losing whites by an alarming margin and the supers must look at that no matter what the pundits say.

    If she can keep it under 10% her campaign can spin that easily.

    Parent

    LOL (none / 0) (#26)
    by Edgar08 on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:43:11 PM EST
    Right.


    Parent
    The rural votes? (none / 0) (#18)
    by stefystef on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:41:29 PM EST
    Anyone count the rural votes yet?

    Just winning the AA vote in the primaries will not get to win the General Elections.

    In Obama's world and the DNC (5.00 / 2) (#69)
    by vicsan on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:53:45 PM EST
    world AA and college educated vote can win the November election. He doesn't need the white working class, seniors or women.

    Parent
    On Fox, on of the pundits called (5.00 / 1) (#133)
    by angie on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:07:04 PM EST
    the "working class" voters "low class" -- yep, I got my comeuppance for watching Fox.

    Parent
    Apparently Obama won't (none / 0) (#84)
    by waldenpond on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:57:00 PM EST
    need the rural vote. (remember Axelrod said the working class doesn't vote Dem)... the plan is for Obama to take places like Ohio by .......

    [If they ultimately back McCain (again, a big "if" in a year like this!), and Obama wins the state anyway, he will have won with a voting coalition we haven't seen before. Perhaps he will have pulled in upscale, suburban Republican-leaners around Columbus, Cleveland, and Cincinnati.]

    I keep seeing more of these articles on how Obama would be able to do this.... Jay Cost at RCP.

    Parent

    Exactly (5.00 / 1) (#104)
    by AnninCA on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:00:42 PM EST
    This is a sad day for working class Americans.

    They really aren't relevant.

    Not only has their livelihoods gone away, but now their voting power.

    God bless.

    Parent

    So They Called NC Based on Exit Polls Only? (none / 0) (#30)
    by PssttCmere08 on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:44:12 PM EST


    yeah (5.00 / 1) (#35)
    by AnninCA on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:46:12 PM EST
    they do that when it's overwhelming

    Parent
    I have been trying to regain sanity and thus (none / 0) (#136)
    by BarnBabe on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:07:50 PM EST
    Was there a Dem for a Day in NC? In Ind? Please advise.

    Parent
    It's impossible to respond to any of this (none / 0) (#36)
    by Edgar08 on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:46:52 PM EST
    Without baiting the race issue.

    I know (none / 0) (#42)
    by americanincanada on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:48:23 PM EST
    This has become entirely about race and it hs become that because of the Obama campaign.

    Parent
    Hardly a one sided affair. (5.00 / 1) (#140)
    by Molly Bloom on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:09:07 PM EST
    There has been divisive behavior by partisans of both sides. Their chosen candidates behalf relatively well, but the partisans are awful.

    Parent
    It Is Time For The DNC To Grow A Pair And (3.00 / 2) (#70)
    by PssttCmere08 on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:53:58 PM EST
    step in to tell obama NOW that he is not a viable candidate for the general election.

    Parent
    If I were a gamer... (5.00 / 2) (#92)
    by Salo on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:58:38 PM EST
    ...I'd call Obama the ultimate BETA tester of the McGovernite Delegate Design Architecture.

    Yep, he cracked the system alright.

    Charming Antiwar Harvard educated black man, he's able to get 50% of the delegates.

    Parent

    Russert Was Just On Saying Super D's (none / 0) (#145)
    by PssttCmere08 on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:11:07 PM EST
    should just wait and see how this plays out as it appears Hillary is not going anywhere anytime soon.

    Parent
    Don't you mean 6% missing? (none / 0) (#44)
    by goldberry on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:48:31 PM EST
    55 + 39 only adds up to 94.  

    And now some IN (none / 0) (#47)
    by americanincanada on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:49:44 PM EST
    polling places staying open late.

    John King (none / 0) (#50)
    by kmblue on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:50:35 PM EST
    is carefully explaining that right now

    I want nothing more than for her to win, but (none / 0) (#53)
    by sickofhypocrisy on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:51:05 PM EST
    I hope she drops out.  

    Even if she won every primary from here on out and the supers could realistically throw it to her, how do you think that would be received by the already ridiculously pro-Obama media?  It wouldn't fare well for Hillary.  She will be accused of having stolen it.  

    I don't want her to win under those circumstances.  It will be Clinton 1992-2000 all over again except the attack dogs will be in our own party.

    I would rather see her bow out gracefully, watch him lose the GE (he will NOT have my vote), become Senate Majority Leader and run again in 2012.  

    No Thanks....Too Much At Stake re: SCOTUS (none / 0) (#79)
    by PssttCmere08 on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:56:13 PM EST
    and bringing our troops home, which would all end disastrously if McCain wins.

    Parent
    If she's majority leader (5.00 / 1) (#93)
    by TeresaInSnow2 on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:58:43 PM EST
    Let's see McCain nominate Scalito-ian judges.

    Parent
    There's pretty much absolutley no way (none / 0) (#110)
    by tigercourse on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:02:40 PM EST
    she could become Minority leader.

    Parent
    So tired of SCOTUS being the reason (1.00 / 1) (#130)
    by sickofhypocrisy on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:06:59 PM EST
    to support a weak candidate.  Roe v Wade was decided 7-2.  Only 2 of the 7 in the majority were appointed by dems.  Only 1 of the dissenters was appointed by a republican.  It will be fine.  

    I want someone with some serious foreign policy experience in the WH.  Obama's not that someone.  I will vote McCain in November.

    PS - I think McCain wants to wind down the war just as much as the rest of us.

    Parent

    Whether you are sick of the Scotus (5.00 / 1) (#164)
    by Molly Bloom on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:13:36 PM EST
    being the reason, you should examine carefully the make up of the court and the justices likely to be appointed by McCain.

    This

    Roe v Wade was decided 7-2.  Only 2 of the 7 in the majority were appointed by dems.

    is irrelevant today.

    McCain  was out promising to put more Scalias and Alitos on the bench today (or yesterday).  

    Parent

    I know exactly what you mean (none / 0) (#91)
    by Dr Molly on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:58:38 PM EST
    And I've been thinking that for a while now. What's the point of her trying to win at this point? If she wins, the entire media has already set it up that she will have stolen the nomination from Obama. There just really is no point to this anymore.

    Sorry to be depressing.

    Parent

    Well I was hoping (5.00 / 1) (#107)
    by TeresaInSnow2 on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:01:15 PM EST
    she'd get the nom because even if she doesn't?  She'll be the one they'll blame if the Dems lose.  They won't blame his divisive campaign (over 90% AA's?).  They won't blame the fact that he's an empty suit and will be lame in debates even with McCain.

    They'll blame Hillary.

    Parent

    I know Teresa (5.00 / 1) (#131)
    by Dr Molly on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:07:00 PM EST
    They will definitely blame her somehow. But if she did somehow get the nomination and then lost to McCain somehow, she'd also be blamed for ruining everything - in that case, they would say Obama would have won if she'd dropped out. I think they've made it so that she can't win in any possible way.

    Parent
    I feel the same way... (5.00 / 1) (#112)
    by Dawn Davenport on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:02:52 PM EST
    ...because of the Obama campaign's successfully driving the narrative at every step, and the media following its suit.

    I've watched in disbelief how they've painted the Clintons as racist, made it perfectly acceptable to disenfranchise what amounts to 10 percent of the electoral votes needed in the fall, and threatened race riots if the supers vote their conscience, rather than by the slim and concocted pledged-delegate lead.

    I haven't felt this stunned by created realities since the FL vote in the 2000 general election. :(

    Parent

    You and me both (none / 0) (#127)
    by otherlisa on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:05:42 PM EST
    "President McCain."

    Sigh...

    Parent

    She won't give up. (5.00 / 1) (#124)
    by OrangeFur on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:05:23 PM EST
    She still has a good chance in the popular vote, especially with WV and KY coming up.

    If the supers take it away, well, they take it away. But she won't give it to them.

    As for the media, they can go [something].

    Parent

    i tend to agree with you (none / 0) (#96)
    by oldnorthstate on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:59:21 PM EST
    she should probably give it up but also for reasons of bring the country, the people, the races, and genders together.  in fact, she could drop out in such a way where and play a role in the future of being seen as a great uniter where is could play well to her political future.

    if obama gets the nomination and loses to mccain as some think he might, somebody has to run again in four years.  there might be a lot of people that will have decided she really is the best candidate because of the way she handled the situation and how she saved the party.

    Parent

    Nope, no one can bring a lot of us back (none / 0) (#172)
    by Cream City on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:14:33 PM EST
    into the party that has encouraged calling us and those whom we admire racists.

    As for bringing the country together, the Axelrovian campaign has shut down discourse on race, setting it back years.  It has to include schools, educators, etc.  And as a teacher, I'm not alone in this; ask others.  It's too difficult to do now, with the wholesale flinging far and wide of charges of racism.

    Some of us know how McCarthyism happened -- and who was targeted first.  Teachers.

    Parent

    I Am Just Going To Kickback And Wait For (none / 0) (#54)
    by PssttCmere08 on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:51:05 PM EST
    the final (or close to it) numbers.  I remember when they said that exit polls weren't going to be so relied upon after the 2000 or 2004 exit poll debacle...sorry can't remember which year.

    They also said that after NH (5.00 / 1) (#98)
    by vicsan on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:59:29 PM EST
    when they all had egg on their faces. They were all drooling over Obama's NH win, according to the exit polls, and Hillary ended up winning. After that they decided Exit polls were unreliable.

    Parent
    Both. Networks in 2000, Wonkette (none / 0) (#77)
    by oculus on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:56:08 PM EST
    in 2004.  

    Parent
    Thanks...As You See The Networks Have (none / 0) (#86)
    by PssttCmere08 on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:58:00 PM EST
    short memories and polls being so far off this season, yet they still don't learn their lessons.
    Nothing would make me happier for them to have to admit tonight that they made a big fat mistake!

    Parent
    I agree (none / 0) (#63)
    by Mrwirez on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:52:43 PM EST
    Its Bu!!$hit.

    Because the major areas.... (none / 0) (#65)
    by AnninCA on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:52:53 PM EST
    Indianapolis and Gary.....aren't in yet.

    i am missing something, why did they call (none / 0) (#88)
    by thereyougo on Tue May 06, 2008 at 06:58:24 PM EST
    it so soon in NC for Obama?  don't we deserve the courtesy to at least have 10% of the votes counted?

    the disrespect these people have for HIllary its depressing!

    Jamal is a dork... (none / 0) (#103)
    by Stellaaa on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:00:06 PM EST
    Does not recognize that Obama not getting white vote.  

    Stellaaa...he is too busy spinning (none / 0) (#179)
    by PssttCmere08 on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:15:25 PM EST


    Parent
    CNN discussing historic (none / 0) (#105)
    by kmblue on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:01:04 PM EST
    nature of Obama's candidacy.
    Historic nature of Clinton's candidacy?
    Not so much.

    Well, life is a trade-off (none / 0) (#161)
    by AnninCA on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:13:23 PM EST
    The first viable female candidate, who is admired for her depth....is Hillary, but she IS the wife of a president.  Big X against her from day 1.

    And it's also, if I may be bold enough to suggest, a matter of "beyond our control."

    First viable AA man meets first viable Woman.

    She has name/position against her.  He has his stepping stone Marxist roots against him.

    They X each other out in which is worse, category.

    Which is why this race has been so tight.

    So.......he has edged her out.

    Good for him.

    Let's truly hope women don't take this as a smack-down.  I think this close of race indicates it was anything BUT a smackdown.

    And I wish Obama well.  

    I personally state, for the record, my vote is up for grabs.

    I proclaimed myself Independent a few weeks ago.

    I wait to see who convinces me.

    But I'm definitely not an automatic Democrat.

    Never again.

    I'll never forgive the Democratic party bosses for what they pulled this season.

    Never.  

    And there's not enough time left in my voting life for them to overcome it.  LOL*

    BUT........hats off to Obama for surviving Wright.

    Parent

    Oh, it's a smackdown. A very week man beat (none / 0) (#193)
    by tigercourse on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:18:51 PM EST
    the strongest woman in the party. I don't see how that isn't a smackdown.

    Parent
    We are "post-counting-votes" nowadays (none / 0) (#106)
    by joanneleon on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:01:06 PM EST
    Insignificant things, those actual votes.

    We're going to resume that wonderful practice of the American media reporting voting results, (before they come in, that is)

    Hey, good luck in the GE! (none / 0) (#111)
    by gmo on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:02:46 PM EST
    Obama's an absolute BRICK. Who the hell actually thinks he can win the GE with JUST the black vote?  Are you effing kidding me?

    It'll be Clinton's fault... (none / 0) (#128)
    by Dawn Davenport on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:06:12 PM EST
    ...at least, that's the current meme from the obama campaign, dutifully reported by the media.

    Funny, I don't remember anyone blaming Bradley for Gore's "loss," or Dean for Kerry's loss.

    Parent

    Religion (none / 0) (#120)
    by Steve M on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:03:56 PM EST
    The exit polls show catholics, protestants, and "other," which is like 52% of the vote.  What is an "other" in North Carolina?  Are Baptists not Protestant?  I'm confused.

    Jews, Muslims, Hindus, and Buddhists? (none / 0) (#153)
    by cmugirl on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:11:57 PM EST
    Because I imagine there is a whole lot of them in NC.....</snark>

    Parent
    Wiccans? (none / 0) (#175)
    by misspeach2008 on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:15:09 PM EST


    Parent
    Baptists and Methodists (none / 0) (#185)
    by tnjen on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:16:22 PM EST
    NC has a lot of methodists and baptists and no, some of them don't consider themselves "Protestants." Technically, they are correct since Protestants were formed in protest of the Catholic church *but* it has more to do with just the way they think of themselves as Baptist or Methodist than any academic argument. A lot of forms in the south, will have Protestant, Catholic, and Baptist. It's a quirk of identification, IMO.

    Parent
    Baptists and Methodists (none / 0) (#188)
    by tnjen on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:17:43 PM EST
    NC has a lot of methodists and baptists and no, some of them don't consider themselves "Protestants." Technically, they are correct since Protestants were formed in protest of the Catholic church *but* it has more to do with just the way they think of themselves as Baptist or Methodist than any academic argument. A lot of forms in the south, will have Protestant, Catholic, and Baptist. It's a quirk of identification, IMO.

    Parent
    CNN (s)election center (none / 0) (#123)
    by TeresaInSnow2 on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:05:04 PM EST
    has Montgomery County in "Obama Blue" even though Hillary is winning it by 14%.

    They apparently don't want things in Indianna to look as crappy as they are for him.

    Link

    What is the exit poll data on IN? (none / 0) (#134)
    by FoxholeAtheist on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:07:20 PM EST
    I mean if CNN called NC on exit poll data, why not IN? have they given any explanation for treating the results in these two states so differently? We know the reason, but what are they saying? I can't bear to watch it live.

    IN polls (none / 0) (#159)
    by cmugirl on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:13:06 PM EST
    stayed open until 8 EDT in some western counties.

    Parent
    CBS...... (none / 0) (#166)
    by michitucky on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:13:39 PM EST
    Just called Indiana for Clinton......Jeff Greenfield said nothing has changed and we go forward to June.

    Parent
    Axelrod is such a creep (none / 0) (#171)
    by Stellaaa on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:14:26 PM EST


    McCaskill on MSNBC repeating Obama poor kid... (none / 0) (#176)
    by Exeter on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:15:12 PM EST
    ...myth. Obama was the one that was raised by a single mother on food stamps, blah, blah, blah.

    McCaskill on MSNBC repeating Obama poor kid... (none / 0) (#178)
    by Exeter on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:15:20 PM EST
    ...myth. Obama was the one that was raised by a single mother on food stamps, blah, blah, blah.

    Both Obama's parents had Phds (5.00 / 0) (#201)
    by catfish on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:50:51 PM EST
    Yes for a while she may have used foodstamps but there's a difference between being in ghetto and seeing no other way of life, and being temporarily poor but with access to education and expectations.

    Why they call it the "wealthy AND the WELL CONNECTED."

    Parent

    It has come to Race (none / 0) (#195)
    by mmc9431 on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:25:11 PM EST
    If 90% or more of the white population voted for Hilary, there would be screams from the rafters that Obama was being discriminated against. Why since it's reverse is it OK. In order to win in Nov Obama is going to have to do a lot better than he is with the white community. The Republican will shamelessly play the race card at every junction. They have no fears of losing their base over it.

    If Obama gets almost 100 percent of the AA vote (none / 0) (#196)
    by Prabhata on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:30:21 PM EST
    There is nothing that HRC could do to win any of those votes.  Those percentages are beyond reason.  Simply put this race is about race. The Republican Party was taken over by the right wing of the party.  Now we see the Democratic Party being taken over by the AA vote.  Not cool.

    'Missing' votes (none / 0) (#204)
    by RonK Seattle on Tue May 06, 2008 at 07:58:04 PM EST
    NC allows "No Preference" votes.
    Also, late pre-election poles show sustained low single-digit support for other candidates (John Edwards?).

    It is beginning to look like (none / 0) (#207)
    by Militarytracy on Tue May 06, 2008 at 08:15:53 PM EST
    I may need to put some of my N.C. momentum back in my posterior.

    NC Exits, Thread 2 | 199 comments (199 topical)