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Time For A Blogger Ethics Panel

In a much cited WSJ Op Ed piece, former Carter Administration Attorney General Benjamin Civilleti writes with Republican Dick Thornburgh and former FBI Director William Webster that:

Public disclosure of the NSA program also brought a flood of class-action lawsuits seeking to impose massive liability on phone companies for allegedly answering the government's call for help. The Intelligence Committee has reviewed the program and has concluded that the companies deserve targeted protection from these suits. . . . We agree with the committee. Dragging phone companies through protracted litigation would not only be unfair, but it would deter other companies and private citizens from responding in terrorist emergencies whenever there may be uncertainty or legal risk.

Unless they reviewed the material, it is hard to see how they could have agreed. But leave that aside. The authors of the piece may have reached this conclusion in good faith, but their conflicts of interest need to be disclosed. Civiletti is a Senior Partner in the Washington law firm Venable, which represents telcos. Similarly, Thornburgh is affiliated with Kirkpatrick and Lockhart, also a telco law firm. And Webster is with Milbank Tweed, also a telco law firm. It may have had no effect on their views, but its disclosure is necessary to maintain journalistic ethics. Not surprisingly, the Wall Street Journal choose not to disclose these facts.

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  • Display: Sort:
    more like... it's time for... (5.00 / 1) (#1)
    by Michael Gass on Wed Oct 31, 2007 at 10:56:24 AM EST
    a law requiring a "conflict of interest disclosure"

    An "Anti-Bullsh*t Act?" (1.00 / 0) (#2)
    by Edger on Wed Oct 31, 2007 at 11:00:16 AM EST
    LMAO (5.00 / 1) (#4)
    by Michael Gass on Wed Oct 31, 2007 at 11:21:07 AM EST
    exactly!!!!

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    Heads Up (5.00 / 1) (#3)
    by Jeralyn on Wed Oct 31, 2007 at 11:17:55 AM EST
    While I disagree with the op-ed and believe that immunity should not be granted to the telcos, and agree that the authors' firms' interest in representing telcos should have been disclosed, I would repeat Big Tent's words,  "The authors of the piece may have reached this conclusion in good faith" and "It may have had no effect on their views."

    I consider Ben Civiletti a friend. We both serve on the Lexis Nexis-Martindale legal advisory board and I have spent four days a year with him and his wife and the other board members for the past ten years -- most recently last month in Madrid.

    His ethics are the highest and I have tremendous respect for him.  In fact, I often seek out his opinions on a variety of political and legal topics because he's very smart and I know he has put careful thought into them.

    So disagree with and criticize his op-ed and discuss why his firm's representation of tel-cos should have been disclosed, but I won't host personal attacks on him or his character.

    I don't think we have to attack his character (5.00 / 1) (#5)
    by Michael Gass on Wed Oct 31, 2007 at 11:26:44 AM EST
    to understand the basic concepts at work here;

    • the government had no warrants issued and telecom's voluntarily turned over private information
    • the governments program, to which the telecom's were responding, has had dubious legality
    • the telecom's, in not pushing for the warrants, became complicit in the illegality
    • now, the immunity for their illegal actions is trying to be pushed through, just as it was pushed through in the MCA


    Parent
    What has that to do with (none / 0) (#9)
    by jimakaPPJ on Wed Oct 31, 2007 at 12:51:38 PM EST
    whether or not the WSJ should have disclosed the background of the authors?

    And the answer is, nothing.

    What you are doing is a restatement of the charges as if they were 100% accurate and therefore impeach the authors of the article.

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    I am adamant about the need for disclosure (5.00 / 2) (#6)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Wed Oct 31, 2007 at 11:31:54 AM EST
    To be quite frank, I would like to know how these 3 men came together to write this piece.

    As I said, their views are certainly possibly held in good faith, but the coming together of this piece strikes me as surprising UNLESS organized, ad there are many such organizers, by parties with a vested interest.

    Why was the piece written by these 3 men? Their stature is certainly part of it, especially Civilleti's.

    The conflict the 3 have is obvious.

    It should have been disclosed.

    Indeed, if they held different views, I believe they would not have written it precisely because it would conflict with the interest of their clients.

    Parent

    Exactly (5.00 / 1) (#7)
    by squeaky on Wed Oct 31, 2007 at 11:48:28 AM EST
    Indeed, if they held different views, I believe they would not have written it precisely because it would conflict with the interest of their clients.

    Well put BTD.  

    How can these guys have reached this conclusion in good faith?  As you suggest, their opinion was known and they were sought out because of it. Is no coincidence that these three were hired to write the piece for the WSJ who also shares their opinion.

    It sure would be interesting to know the mechanics of how this piece came into being.

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    uh.... It is an editorial.... (1.00 / 1) (#10)
    by jimakaPPJ on Wed Oct 31, 2007 at 12:56:31 PM EST
    If it had been presented as hard news you would have a point. As it is, you don't.

    Parent
    Uh (5.00 / 1) (#11)
    by jondee on Wed Oct 31, 2007 at 01:08:52 PM EST
    are you suggesting that because it's "an editorial" that it dosnt significantly influence opinion -- or isnt designed to influence opinion?

    It's an editorial in a largely "hard news" context, just as Coulter and Hanjobbity are "just entertainers" in an (alleged) "hard news" context.

    Is it just me, or does this follow a pattern?

    Parent

    Jondee (1.00 / 0) (#22)
    by jimakaPPJ on Thu Nov 01, 2007 at 09:35:00 AM EST
    So what? It was labeled an opinion piece.

    Did it influence anyone? Of course. That's what editorials do. See any newspaper on any day at any time.

    That's not illegal, immoral or fattening.

    And I haven't the vaguest what you mean by "hard news context." I suspect that you don't either.

    And yes, Coulter, Hannity, King, Moore, etc and et al are "entertainers." People do not listen to, pay money to, etc., unless they are entertained at some level. Political comment is the product.

    A pattern? Product? Try this.

    Parent

    You dont have the vaguest idea (5.00 / 1) (#25)
    by jondee on Thu Nov 01, 2007 at 12:19:31 PM EST
    Well, if you're really that dense, you probobly shouldnt bother posting here and wasting everyone's time.

    No one's ever explained to you how the framing of information and the contextual frame work it's presented in, influences how it is percieved?

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    Gee........ (1.00 / 0) (#28)
    by jimakaPPJ on Fri Nov 02, 2007 at 05:31:22 PM EST
    Having made my very excellent living in big ticket complex sales for many years....no. Never heard of it. (sarcasm alert.)

    So what does that have to do with the basic fact.

    These people provide entertainment to the masses. Someone just told me that Limbaugh has 60,000,000 million people who give him $10 a year for his special "something." (Whatever that is.)

    Do you really think they like pain, and want to be insulted?????

    BTW - I be here for you.

    Parent

    Entertained (5.00 / 1) (#26)
    by jondee on Thu Nov 01, 2007 at 12:41:20 PM EST
    "at some level"; what about the other levels?

    You're doing the framing I was just talking about.

    Calling them "just" entertainers is a transparent manuvre to enable them to spew with no accountability for content.

    Funny how the right meme is that Rush, Coulter, et al are "just entertainers", while so few on the Left side ever say that about Franken or Moore.

    Parent

    You're just jealous. (1.00 / 0) (#29)
    by jimakaPPJ on Fri Nov 02, 2007 at 05:37:58 PM EST
    Calling them "just" entertainers is a transparent manuvre to enable them to spew with no accountability for content.

    Uh, they are not "just" entertainers. They are at the top of the heap. The best of the best....

    And no one said they can't be held accountable. It happens every time some one turns them off/on or challenges their message.

    What you can't understand... perhaps you do and won't admit.... is that they are bigger, better, faster, smarter, richer than you are. (Me too.)

    I'm just not jealous.

    Parent

    You're just incredibly stupid (5.00 / 1) (#31)
    by jondee on Sat Nov 03, 2007 at 08:36:11 AM EST
    Sorry, but there's just no other way to put it.

    Coulter is "the best of best"? lol

    Parent

    Actually,you're right (5.00 / 0) (#32)
    by jondee on Sat Nov 03, 2007 at 08:54:35 AM EST
    Jim.

    If I could just be a commentator on Fox News and only say things that would bring a smile to Rupert and Roger's face and bask in the sunshine of their beneficance, I could die a happy, deeply fulfilled man.

    That's all anyone could want whether they admit it or not.

    Parent

    Voguing (5.00 / 0) (#33)
    by squeaky on Sat Nov 03, 2007 at 10:54:25 AM EST
    Wow, now we know who his role model is. Not that I am surprised. No wonder he is so enthralled with Giuliani.

    Parent
    Oh, you're just jealous (5.00 / 1) (#34)
    by jondee on Sat Nov 03, 2007 at 01:03:31 PM EST
    and you have cooties,too.

    Parent
    Sorry (5.00 / 1) (#12)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Wed Oct 31, 2007 at 01:10:08 PM EST
    That is simply wrong in terms of journalistic ethics.

    You know not of what you speak.

    Parent

    The problem is. (5.00 / 0) (#13)
    by jondee on Wed Oct 31, 2007 at 01:13:09 PM EST
    he does know. He's just a believer in the Noble Lie.

    Parent
    How do you feel about corruption (1.00 / 0) (#24)
    by jimakaPPJ on Thu Nov 01, 2007 at 09:58:34 AM EST
    articles...hard news articles...not giving the party affiliation of the politician being charged? Think maybe the reporter is biased?

    Link

    How about anonymous sources?? Think maybe an agenda is in play?

    Parent

    Yeah that's real comparable (5.00 / 1) (#27)
    by jondee on Thu Nov 01, 2007 at 01:07:12 PM EST
    To this case.

    Look over there: people who cant be bothered to take 3 minutes to find out a politician's party affiliation.

    You can do better than that, Jim.

    How about something from the Clinton files; or another posting of Squeaky's out-smearing Rove statement?

    Parent

    Question?? (1.00 / 0) (#30)
    by jimakaPPJ on Fri Nov 02, 2007 at 05:40:59 PM EST
    Why should party affiliation require a trip of Google???

    Do you really want me to embarrasses Squeaky??

    The answer to the former is NO.

    The answer to the latter is NO.

    And what about anonymous sources?? Think maybe an agenda is in play?

    Parent

    Huh? (5.00 / 0) (#14)
    by squeaky on Wed Oct 31, 2007 at 01:14:40 PM EST
    Because it is an op-ed it would not be interesting to know how it came about that these three men came to write it?

    Why is that? Does your curiosity stop when something is on the opinion pages as opposed to the news?

    Strange.

    Parent

    This a pattern (5.00 / 1) (#15)
    by jondee on Wed Oct 31, 2007 at 01:18:11 PM EST
    Of course, when Obama says something we have to probe into where he went to grade school and who with.

    It is to laugh.

    Parent

    That's incorrect. (1.00 / 0) (#23)
    by jimakaPPJ on Thu Nov 01, 2007 at 09:47:18 AM EST
    No one has said you shouldn't probe into the backgrounds of the three authors.

    Probe away.

    You must be remembering the hissy fits thrown on this blog over the probe into H. B. Obama's background.

    Parent

    Got It (5.00 / 0) (#16)
    by squeaky on Wed Oct 31, 2007 at 01:20:30 PM EST
    IOKIAR, IOW you are a GOP shill covering for your masters.  

    Parent
    ethical problem (5.00 / 0) (#20)
    by a gilas girl on Thu Nov 01, 2007 at 08:17:58 AM EST
    The ethical problem that you point out lies, not so much with the authors of the op-ed as it does with the WSJ, it strikes me.  As the publisher of said opinion piece it is incumbant upon the Journal to make known the affiliations of those opining. They are not necessarily responsible for letting the readers know, from whence this op-ed arose, those as a recommendation for the future that's not a bad one for media outlets to take up: was this op-ed commissioned?  If so, by whom?  Did it arise from a conference, a gathering?  Was it a free submission? (Yeah, right, like those actually get published).  Is/Are the authors part of a stable of op-ed writers that the outlet regularly turns to on various issues? (i.e. is the author one of our resident "experts" on topic A?)

       

    I agree (none / 0) (#21)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Thu Nov 01, 2007 at 08:21:09 AM EST
    Nice to see you virtually again.

    Parent
    Surprised? Not! (none / 0) (#8)
    by TexDem on Wed Oct 31, 2007 at 12:16:38 PM EST
    Why should we be surprised at their non-disclosure of their conflicts of interest. Recently Thornburgh spoke out about the politicizing of the DOJ, maybe he thought he should get a pass on this one. OTOH, they could have put their info forward and WSJ editorial board edited. If the later is the case they should demand publicly for a public apology. I'm inclined to go with the former though.

    What a disingenuous load of cr*p (none / 0) (#17)
    by Alien Abductee on Wed Oct 31, 2007 at 02:01:29 PM EST
    At best Civiletti, Thornburgh and Webster are operating under the delusion that all is normal with this adminstration and that whatever they're done was purely for the good of the country. A dubious proposition considering everything that's come out about their lies and malfeasance in their drive for expanded executive power.

    Mr. Bush concluded that this was essential for protecting the country, that using the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act would not permit the necessary speed and agility, and that he had the constitutional power to authorize such surveillance without court orders to defend the country.

    Bush may have concluded that. Did the telcos really conclude that too? Or did they calculate that if they went along with what the administration wanted, even if it was clearly against the law, they'd be protected and rewarded for it? If it's really so clear that it was legal, the lawsuits will fail. Let them go to court like "citizens" without lobbyists and insider friends have to do when lawsuits are filed against them. No political protection for them. Let them face the fallout of their actions - let the chips fall where they may. Even if they acted from the best of intentions, others in future will be more persuaded to follow the actual law and presidents will be persuaded to get laws changed instead of simply ignoring the inconvenient ones.

    From its earliest days, the common law recognized that when a public official calls on a citizen to help protect the community in an emergency, the person has a duty to help and should be immune from being hauled into court unless it was clear beyond doubt that the public official was acting illegally.

    For one thing, emergencies that might excuse skirting the law don't last for years. And secondly, the telcos aren't "citizens" - they're corporate entities, and ones deeply entwined in the politicized corruption of this administration, which holds out to them on the one hand the promise of support for their push for a tiered Internet and the vast lucre that would ensue, and on the other prosecution for those who don't comply.

    As the Intelligence Committee found, the companies clearly acted in "good faith."

    Um, the intelligence committee members are interested actors here - any malfeasance that Bush and the telcos engaged in tars them too if they went along with it and didn't do everything in their power to bring it to the light of day.

    That the three editorial writers don't disclose their conflicts of interest here is shocking, or at least it would be if we hadn't been seeing similar and worse lately from the complicit media. It's starting to feel like reading Pravda. Thank g*d for the <s>samizdat</s> blogs.

    Insisting on disclosing conflicts of interest (none / 0) (#18)
    by Compound F on Wed Oct 31, 2007 at 10:13:36 PM EST
    has nothing to do with "personal attacks," as Jeralyn seems to suggest.  On the contrary, it is routine and obvious why they must be revealed.  It is an act of public faith, disclosing, "here's how reliable we may or may not be."  I never went to Madrid with these guys, and I don't know these guys, so how would I know whether they were beyond reproach?  Disclosure gives full warning fairly, and casts no ill light on the disclosers.  In fact, it protects them against undue suspicion.  The failure to disclose these conflicts, on the other hand, is quite objectionable, and casts that ill light.

    I didn't say it did (5.00 / 0) (#19)
    by Jeralyn on Wed Oct 31, 2007 at 10:24:23 PM EST
    Re-read my comment. I didn't equate disagreement with what was written or the lack of disclosure with a personal attack. I said I disagreed with the position taken by the authors of the op-ed and agreed their connections should have been disclosed.

    What I asked was that people not personally attack the character of one of the authors.   I said,

    So disagree with and criticize his op-ed and discuss why his firm's representation of tel-cos should have been disclosed, but I won't host personal attacks on him or his character.  


    Parent