home

Saturday Open Thread

By Big Tent Democrat, Section Blog Related
Posted on Sat Jan 31, 2015 at 02:44:56 PM EST
Tags: (all tags)
Share This: Digg! StumbleUpon del.icio.us reddit reddit

Tomorrow is the Super Bowl. I'll have my pick for you then, but you may remember I love the Super Bowl prop bets so I'll give you a sneak peek:

SPECIAL (NE @ SEA) - What will Katy Perry be wearing when she begins the Halftime show?

(6016) Pants (below knees) +250

We'll also have the traditional props like coin clip, length of national anthem, etc. Oh, and the game of course. I think I'm going with the East Coast Cheaters.

Open Thread.

< The argument for a populist Democratic Party: Not the Obama Coalition | ISIS Executes Kenji Goto >

  • The Online Magazine with Liberal coverage of crime-related political and injustice news

  • Contribute To TalkLeft


    • Display: Sort:
    Saturday Open Thread | 72 comments (72 topical)

    Readers Must Login or Create an Account to Comment

    Pull the chute - Plane Crash - Pilot OK (5.00 / 1) (#23)
    by Slado on Sun Feb 01, 2015 at 05:14:22 AM EST
    FYI I have my pilots license and was working on my instrument befor I lost my medical.   Wasn't sure who else at TL was into aviation.

    Here is great footage of a Cirus single engine pilot deploying his parachute and surviving a crash into the ocean off the coast of Maui.  Know this guy Donald?

    Cirus parachute deployment

    He had a malfunction with his long distance or reserve fuel tanks so he knew for a while he wasn't going to make it.   That would suck.  First rule of aviation is ace enough fuel to get to your destination.  You'd be surprised how many crashes are the result of pilots running out of fuel.

    Since he was suffering a malfunction instead of just running out of fuel he was able to alert his controller and that's why you see the cruise ship being nearby and the Coast Guard shooting footage as he runs out.   Over land he would have just landed at the closest airport but over the Pacific once you go a certain distance there is no turning back.

    What's interesting about this type of airplane is the system was developed because during a stall ( plane loses power and starts to fall nose down)  it cannot recover from a spin (one wing dips lower during the stall and plane starts to spin nose down.).  

    There is debate as to if this matters - Cirus post on subject and the FAA does not requires spin recovery as part of training.

    I learned in a Cessna172 (which can recover from a spin) and was taught to execute a spin and then how to get out of it by my instructors.   It was actually quite fun but nothing I'd ever done on my own without an instructor.   The main goal is obviously to avoid spins.  

    For "old school" pilots this need for a chute was reason for many of them to dislike the Cirus because in their minds you never should need a Chute.

    This video shows at least one scenario where a very experienced pilot was glad to have it.   Drifting down into the ocean is much easier then trying to land at 60 knots on it.  Made a believer out of me.

    Pretty sure the guy is from the Bay Area (none / 0) (#26)
    by nycstray on Sun Feb 01, 2015 at 02:22:23 PM EST
    and was flying to Hawaii. He filmed his descent with a GoPro camera . . .

    Parent
    Had a brief love affair with (none / 0) (#34)
    by CaptHowdy on Mon Feb 02, 2015 at 09:06:26 AM EST
    gliding.  Amazing experience.  Took a couple of lessons and got distracted.

    Parent
    I love this (5.00 / 2) (#29)
    by CaptHowdy on Sun Feb 01, 2015 at 04:59:33 PM EST
    Huckabee Compares Accepting Gay Marriage To Asking A Jew To Eat Bacon

    The funny thing is I know Jews who love bacon.

    On a semi related question (5.00 / 1) (#30)
    by CaptHowdy on Sun Feb 01, 2015 at 05:05:56 PM EST
    i was just rewatching Noah and I'm wondering how his son ended up named Ham?

    Parent
    I haven't seen Noah yet (none / 0) (#72)
    by Militarytracy on Fri Feb 27, 2015 at 10:34:05 PM EST
    It's on the to do list.  Boy that movie caused religious outrage here. Some folks had their Bibles out and were livid.  The theater owner here will not show certain films here for different political and religious reasons.  He did show Noah though, and there was outrage.

    There are three small movie theaters here that he owns.  Two can show two different performances, the third can show three.  He dedicated one two movie building to each Twilight release after the first one.  For someone so politically and religiously convicted, I was puzzled.  But to each his own, I'm not going to lose sleep.  He dedicated a whole building to 50 Shades of Grey though.  I am confused.  And where's the outrage?

    Parent

    That is very funny (5.00 / 1) (#71)
    by Militarytracy on Thu Feb 26, 2015 at 11:31:36 PM EST
    Comparing gay marriage to a food so delicious it makes vegetarians cry in their sleep

    Parent
    Me too. These wingers are so (none / 0) (#35)
    by Mr Natural on Mon Feb 02, 2015 at 10:17:53 AM EST
    living in the past (or the Book, as they say).  

    That dietary law evolved to prevent trichinosis.  Maybe some of the Huckster's troglodyte base gnaw raw pork but nobody else does.

    Parent

    Baa waa waa (none / 0) (#37)
    by Ga6thDem on Mon Feb 02, 2015 at 02:56:48 PM EST
    He must not know any Jewish people because my friend who is Jewish eats bacon and the then while she has a piece in her mouth she says I'm really not supposed to be eating this.

    The only time she ever follows those dietary laws are during the holidays.

    Huckabee apparently must only know Hasidic Jews.

    Parent

    Well, stereotyping is what they do. (5.00 / 2) (#38)
    by NYShooter on Mon Feb 02, 2015 at 03:52:03 PM EST
    Life's a lot simpler that way.

    Parent
    If he'd said "A Muslim..." (none / 0) (#40)
    by unitron on Mon Feb 02, 2015 at 03:55:31 PM EST
    ...he'd have been just as correct if not more so, but he'd probably have rather endorsed gay marriage.

    Parent
    He did not leave out Muslims (none / 0) (#50)
    by MO Blue on Tue Feb 03, 2015 at 07:55:16 AM EST
    His entire quote:

    "It's like asking someone who's Jewish to start serving bacon-wrapped shrimp in their deli," he said. "We don't want to do that -- I mean, we're not going to do that. Or like asking a Muslim to serve up something that is offensive to him, or to have dogs in his backyard."


    Parent
    Herd immunity (5.00 / 1) (#39)
    by CaptHowdy on Mon Feb 02, 2015 at 03:52:53 PM EST
    I F'ing Love Science

    Herd Immunity And Measles: Why We Should Aim For 100% Vaccination Coverage

    What Exactly Is Herd Immunity?

    Let's look at the concept of herd immunity first. The basic idea is that a group (the "herd") can avoid exposure to a disease by ensuring that enough people are immune so that no sustained chains of transmission can be established. This protects an entire population, especially those who are too young or too sick to be vaccinated. But how many people need to be immune to achieve this?
    To calculate the fraction (none / 0) (#41)
    by KeysDan on Mon Feb 02, 2015 at 04:50:04 PM EST
    of a population needed to be immune to reach herd immunity, an estimate can be made through the "R" or reproduction number.  That is, how many new cases a single case of an infection will cause.  For example, if the R = 5, one individual passes the infection to 5 others, 4 out of 5  (80 percent) of the population need to be immune to prevent an outbreak of the disease. Or, 20 percent may remain individually susceptible, but the population would remain protected. These estimates are subject to biological and other variables.

    For Ebola and influenza, R=2, polio/smallpox R=5 to 8, measles (wildly infectious/airborne), R= 10 to 20, therefore need 90 to 95 percent.  The goal should be 100 percent vaccination coverage--everyone who can should to protect themselves and to protect those who cannot, through herd immunity.  If only an extremely small proportion of the population is vulnerable, herd immunity protects those unvaccinated or those once vaccinated but whose effects have waned over time. Measles vaccine is one of the most effective vaccines (two doses, initial and booster, provides about 97 percent immunity and is safe).

    It will be a sad state of affairs if, once again, as with Ebola, the issue of vaccination is captured by political demagoguery.  Herd immunity exemplifies the importance of public health.  And, the    balancing of private health decisions with the greater good.  It is not unlikely that Republican primary candidates will need to demonstrate their libertarian/ conservative bona fides by showing up to debates with red dots covering their faces.

     

    Parent

    Too late (5.00 / 1) (#42)
    by CaptHowdy on Mon Feb 02, 2015 at 05:37:28 PM EST
    N.J. Gov. Chris Christie Jumps Into Vaccine Debate

    You might remember his actions during the Ebola thing.  Basically putting that woman under house arrest.

    Parent

    House arrest? (5.00 / 3) (#43)
    by Zorba on Mon Feb 02, 2015 at 06:51:10 PM EST
    It was way worse than house arrest.  He had her quarantined in a tent, with no running water, reliable heat, or other amenities.
    Link.
    He has shown extreme inconsistency regarding public health.

    Parent
    Yes and Nurse Kaci Hickox (5.00 / 3) (#44)
    by KeysDan on Mon Feb 02, 2015 at 06:56:16 PM EST
    sprung herself--out- bullying the bully.   Hope the American electorate will learn from Nurse Hickox and boot that bully and send him back to moving traffic cones around bridges.

    Parent
    Oregon is having problems with this (none / 0) (#45)
    by ZtoA on Mon Feb 02, 2015 at 07:46:53 PM EST
    Several years ago Ashland OR was in the news because there was an epidemic of not vaccinating the children. Evidently that has spread.

    Federal figures show about 91 percent of Oregon children between 19 months and 35 months have been vaccinated against measles.

    Cieslak says that's below the target of 94 percent, the point when herd immunity stops measles from spreading.

    Link

    Parent

    In MD, you cannot enroll your child in (none / 0) (#46)
    by Anne on Mon Feb 02, 2015 at 09:24:32 PM EST
    a licensed day care home/child-care center, pre-school or kindergarten through high school without proof of being current on age-appropriate immunizations.  There is a medical contraindication exemption, and also a religious belief exemption, but the religious exemption  does not apply during times of epidemic of disease or emergency.

    Are these exemptions hard to get?  I don't know.  I have a feeling there may be more inquiry by parents as to what percentage of children in licensed day care homes/centers and schools are unvaccinated.  As others have wisely asked, "if I can't bring peanuts or peanut products into my child's school because of the danger to those with peanut allergies, why is it okay for unvaccinated children to attend?"

    Also, it occurs to me that a lot of people who don't vaccinate do so under a theoretical assumption that their children are protected because the vast majority of people are vaccinated.  When this theory meets reality - when they either know someone who gets the measles, or realize their unvaccinated child has been exposed to measles (or pertussis or any of the illnesses for which there are vaccinations) - I suspect a lot of these religious and non-medical objections are going to disappear.

    Parent

    I hope more people start to get their (none / 0) (#48)
    by ZtoA on Tue Feb 03, 2015 at 01:05:13 AM EST
    children vaccinated! All a parent needs to do is say they have a 'religious' or 'philosophical' objection and check that box on the form and return it. So the schools do have a record of who is vaccinated and who is not. But the other parents of kids in that school don't know. I'm wondering if some infected kid gives in infectious disease to a neighbor's newborn, or immune compromised family member, if they might be legally liable for some damages.

    The woman highlighted on the Jon Stewart segment is Sarah Pope. link to her blog post about vaccines. The comment section is telling.  

    Parent

    What I find kind of interesting is that (none / 0) (#49)
    by Anne on Tue Feb 03, 2015 at 06:56:20 AM EST
    these people really are counting on their children being protected because other people's children have been immunized; they don't seem to realize that "herd immunity" becomes less and less effective if the herd keeps shrinking.

    I especially liked the comment from the mom who was mad because the school makes her keep her kids home every time there's an occurrence of one of the illnesses for which her children have not been vaccinated.  Others chimed in to report that this is just the school's way of trying to scare people into getting the shots.  

    Here's the thing: we're all fine until we aren't.  It's great to be convinced that your child will never get the measles or whooping cough, but I have to wonder how many of these anti-vaxxers are having doubts and worries now that their children have a very real chance of getting measles.

    Parent

    Having my morning coffee and cable (5.00 / 1) (#59)
    by CaptHowdy on Tue Feb 03, 2015 at 10:15:04 AM EST
    and I see this woman on MSNBC being asked to defend not vaccinating her kids.  She gets all weepy and warbly and says this is "hate speech".  "I can't believe I'm living in America".

    You can't make this stuff up.

    Parent

    Perfect example of trying to PC to dismiss (5.00 / 1) (#64)
    by ZtoA on Tue Feb 03, 2015 at 12:15:58 PM EST
    any reasonable information and to deflect from someone's actions. Does not matter how she tends to vote politically, she is trying to control other's free speech.

    Parent
    I thought this article was interesting (none / 0) (#66)
    by ZtoA on Tue Feb 03, 2015 at 12:30:40 PM EST
    link

    I was interested to see that Nevada County in CA which has under 75% vaccination rate. I used to live in Nevada City-Grass Valley area and still have many friends there. I visit when I can. It is a wonderful place with lots of 'hippies' old and new. It also has a very active medical marijuana economy. People are very independently minded. It is a micro-community where many distrust 'the government' or any corporation (except the ones that have their R&D located there). They say they are very progressive. I hope they get a clue that they are not the only people on the planet.

    Parent

    Hippies, meet Darwin (none / 0) (#67)
    by CaptHowdy on Tue Feb 03, 2015 at 12:36:26 PM EST
    Darwin, hippies........

    Parent
    I remember one conversation (none / 0) (#56)
    by CaptHowdy on Tue Feb 03, 2015 at 10:01:16 AM EST
    with a game producer who said she would rather her children had the diseases than the vaccines.


    Parent
    This is not a partisan issue (none / 0) (#57)
    by Slado on Tue Feb 03, 2015 at 10:10:57 AM EST
    This is not a conservative issue.

    This is a stupid and selfish parent issue.

    Liberals more likely to be anti vaccine.

    This data makes it' clear that both sides have their kooks on this issue.   Arguing that one side has a specific hold on this is just snarky partisanship.

    Parent

    It really is (none / 0) (#60)
    by CaptHowdy on Tue Feb 03, 2015 at 10:19:23 AM EST
    learning more about this as it goes along.  Seems it all goes back to an article published in Lancet which has not only been officially retracted by the publication but the person who wrote it has had their license to practice medicine revoked.

    But the BS lives on..  Reminds me of that thing about "a lie going around the world before the truth gets its shoes on"

    Parent

    The story (none / 0) (#61)
    by CaptHowdy on Tue Feb 03, 2015 at 10:34:39 AM EST
    Retracted autism study an 'elaborate fraud,' British journal finds

    An investigation published by the British medical journal BMJ concludes the study's author, Dr. Andrew Wakefield, misrepresented or altered the medical histories of all 12 of the patients whose cases formed the basis of the 1998 study -- and that there was "no doubt" Wakefield was responsible.
    ---
    Britain stripped Wakefield of his medical license in May. "Meanwhile, the damage to public health continues, fueled by unbalanced media reporting and an ineffective response from government, researchers, journals and the medical profession," BMJ states in an editorial accompanying the work.



    Parent
    Those same liberals are prob also (none / 0) (#70)
    by nycstray on Wed Feb 04, 2015 at 04:40:30 PM EST
    very high on a poll about feeding kids pure/organic food vs manufactured crap :) At least in my neck of the woods . . .

    Parent
    Its 73 and sunny . . . (none / 0) (#1)
    by nycstray on Sat Jan 31, 2015 at 03:49:24 PM EST
    I just don't know what to do with myself. Wander the marina with the dog? Light yard work /start veggie garden while said dog hunts for bees and butterflies? Sit on the porch and read while dog watches world?

    I did do the farmers market and open the windows . . . cleaning can wait until rain  :D

    It's been nice here too (none / 0) (#2)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Jan 31, 2015 at 06:37:13 PM EST
    all the bad weather has been going by to the north.  If the terrible winter everyone was fretting about is coming it better arrive pretty soon.   So far it's been a very mild winter.  Only one tiny snow for about 24 hours then back to the 50s.

    I probably just jinxed that.

    Parent

    Mild here too. (none / 0) (#5)
    by Ga6thDem on Sat Jan 31, 2015 at 07:22:57 PM EST
    Though some areas of the country have had some hard hits like Buffalo NY getting a record snow fall.

    Parent
    Tusk (none / 0) (#3)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Jan 31, 2015 at 07:09:13 PM EST
    I just saw this
    Wow.  Just wow.

    I love Kevin Smith.  I thought Red State was a minor masterpiece.  I think this is too.  But man is it odd.  It's interesting to see, sometimes, what a brilliant guy like Smith will do when there is no supervision.   IMO it's worth seeing just for Michael Parks, in his best role since Red State, and Johnny Depp.

    Favorite review quote (none / 0) (#4)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Jan 31, 2015 at 07:13:40 PM EST
    Tusk is a movie I like and would never recommend


    Parent
    I will be rooting for the (none / 0) (#6)
    by ZtoA on Sat Jan 31, 2015 at 08:06:38 PM EST
    "Skittles Guys". But I like the idea of a matchup between the East Coast Cheaters and the West Coast Skittle Guys. I bought a big cheese ball to bring to my sister's tomorrow. Lots of family and friends will be there. One 19 year old who played HS football and who is such a great guy (friend of my nephew). As many female football fans as male too. Nice way to celebrate my birthday too.

    Actually today is my actual birthday and I'm having my idea of a perfect day. Went to the grocery store and got my favorite deli food, and some bird seed. Fed the birds on my back deck and watched them. I've worked very hard not to let anyone know (or to let them forget) my BD, and my close friends have been having some serious medical problems so they are not in a party mood. I talked to my daughter for a long time today. I won a first place prize in a west coast biennial which has a nice cash prize attached to it. Did not have to go to the opening in California. Been working for around 6 hours and will work for several more, then some Grimm and a glass of wine. My recovery from that bad drug/medication reaction continues to improve so I am in no pain whatsoever.

    Happy actual birthday! (5.00 / 1) (#7)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Jan 31, 2015 at 08:29:51 PM EST


    Parent
    thanks! (none / 0) (#8)
    by ZtoA on Sat Jan 31, 2015 at 08:37:47 PM EST
    Oh, and I'm sure the males watching the superbowl will be way more interested in Katy Perry (or whatever her name is). At least they are very interested in her 'outfits'. :)

    Parent
    I used to record it for the commercials (none / 0) (#9)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Jan 31, 2015 at 08:49:48 PM EST
    no need these days.  They are already online.

    Parent
    Have a fun birthday... (5.00 / 1) (#11)
    by desertswine on Sat Jan 31, 2015 at 09:12:05 PM EST
    If it ain't fun, it ain't nothing'.

    Parent
    Today is my birthday, too! (5.00 / 2) (#12)
    by caseyOR on Sat Jan 31, 2015 at 09:22:09 PM EST
    Happy birthday, ZtoA.

    Parent
    Happy Birthday to you! (none / 0) (#14)
    by ZtoA on Sat Jan 31, 2015 at 09:50:41 PM EST


    Parent
    Happy Birthday (none / 0) (#24)
    by fishcamp on Sun Feb 01, 2015 at 07:21:38 AM EST
    to my favorite Northwest ladies.  

    Parent
    A belated Hippo Birdy to both of you! (none / 0) (#22)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Sun Feb 01, 2015 at 05:12:26 AM EST
    Go Seahawks!

    Parent
    Happy long-weekend B'Day, casey! (none / 0) (#31)
    by christinep on Sun Feb 01, 2015 at 05:49:53 PM EST


    Parent
    Weekend Birthdays are fun, ZtoA (5.00 / 1) (#25)
    by christinep on Sun Feb 01, 2015 at 12:42:33 PM EST
    They have that special quality ... as in a reason to celebrate for 2 days.
    Happy 2-Day Birthday, ZtoA!

    Parent
    Ha! 2 days of birthday celebrations are (5.00 / 1) (#32)
    by ZtoA on Sun Feb 01, 2015 at 10:32:02 PM EST
    about 1 1/2 days too long for me. But my mother recently turned 90 and I keep telling her that merits a 10 year celebration. She used to be such a severe person, only being restricted and only wearing tan clothes and never cooking any good tasting food, staying in a marriage that was awful for her, etc. Just her upbringing - she is actually very sensitive and dam smart. She now actually says "love you too" when signing off a phone call with me! But she did accept a 2 week celebration of her 90th. I think I would have to be 110 to accept anything like that, and maybe then I won't even realize it. (hope my joking around here is not offensive, but :)  ).

    On second thought, I might declare every day a BD celebration and fill those days with at least 10 hours of work, some nice food, some great friends and family, tooling around on the internet pursuing some interest of mine, reading some great book about some interest of mine, a bit of some show watched online, talking to my daughter, and everything else I love. I could 'do' that!

    Parent

    Pete Carroll's no stranger to cheating, (none / 0) (#10)
    by Anne on Sat Jan 31, 2015 at 09:05:46 PM EST
    so I think it's just a matter of which cheater you find easier to tolerate.

    Parent
    Well, I was just riffing off of BTD's line (none / 0) (#13)
    by ZtoA on Sat Jan 31, 2015 at 09:50:17 PM EST
    I prefer the "Skittles Guy", but others may prefer the cheaters who have just been outed as cheaters (maybe). I also think that possibly, maybe, some other players like Skittles. Did you see the Marshawn Lynch interview by Skittles? The '12's love him - and all of them. Maybe cheating and Skittles both make the game more awesomer.

    Parent
    That was in college at USC. (none / 0) (#17)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Sat Jan 31, 2015 at 11:57:45 PM EST
    As a head coach in college, you can't just be all about the X's and O's and concerned with player personnel. You have to actually administer a program, and that includes monitoring things like a student-athlete's class attendance, etc. Pete Carroll was so myopic and tunnel-visioned in his focus at USC that his neglect of other important matters allowed the Trojan football program to drift into the realm of the rogue. He's now back in the pros where he belongs.

    Parent
    The USC recruting violations (none / 0) (#20)
    by MKS on Sun Feb 01, 2015 at 01:38:45 AM EST
    were not all that earth shattering.  A alumnus provided a car to Reggie Bush's dad was the one that got perhaps the most attention.

    No one has suggested that Pete Carroll has cheated during the games.

    Parent

    Where is the biennial? (none / 0) (#21)
    by oculus on Sun Feb 01, 2015 at 02:23:03 AM EST


    Parent
    I really don't care to link to... (none / 0) (#15)
    by desertswine on Sat Jan 31, 2015 at 10:38:28 PM EST
    The Today Show, but this is a really nice story about ex-football player George Taliaferro re-uniting with an old friend 60yrs down the road.  Taliaferro, it is little known, was the first African-American to be drafted by the NFL in 1949.

    Interesting, I was just reading about Taliaferro (none / 0) (#16)
    by ZtoA on Sat Jan 31, 2015 at 11:17:45 PM EST
    today. Also this nice history of black quarterbacks in the NFL.

    I was talking to a friend of mine and we were wondering why is it that so much of the sports media seem to be angry at the Seahawks. She said "well they don't look like players in the earlier decades". I wondered look like? . I bounced around online and I have no idea if I am reading the cultural sports 'discourse' right or not, but I did find this interesting piece.

    Parent

    That was an interesting article... (none / 0) (#18)
    by desertswine on Sun Feb 01, 2015 at 12:42:55 AM EST
    I didn't know about Fritz Pollard.  That was a nice picture of him too.

    Parent
    I liked the pictures too (none / 0) (#19)
    by ZtoA on Sun Feb 01, 2015 at 01:04:26 AM EST
    (but we are both artists so that explains some of that). I figured if I was going to be a sports fan I had better start learning about the politics, players, and history of the sport. I can see why so many people are fans. It is a very deep field of art (athletic and strategic) and all that an art entails (money, insider politics, gossip/communication, and love from fans. I love it that all the Seahawks contribute their wins to the '12's. The fans.

    Parent
    Answered (none / 0) (#27)
    by CaptHowdy on Sun Feb 01, 2015 at 04:05:52 PM EST
    why are there no unicorns?

    You have ended an argument (5.00 / 2) (#33)
    by Slado on Mon Feb 02, 2015 at 02:36:12 AM EST
    Actually happened this afternoon...

    Five year old Avery: Daddy isn't it sad there aren't unicorns anymore?

    8 year old know it all older brother Christian: Avery unicorns aren't real.  They are make believe like fairies or dragons.

    Avery: they where real but they became extinct.

    Christian: No they didn't they are make believe becsuse no one has found any bones to prove it;

    Yes, no, yes, no you get the picture.  

    I step in and say we can never be 100% sure but that it's ok if Avery believes in them.  Christian takes the hint and we move on.

    Now I can show them that Avery was correct.

    Parent

    The Unicorn Song (5.00 / 1) (#36)
    by Mr Natural on Mon Feb 02, 2015 at 10:21:30 AM EST
    sung by The Irish Rovers

    Parent
    LOL! (none / 0) (#28)
    by Zorba on Sun Feb 01, 2015 at 04:45:36 PM EST
    Thanks for the laugh, Howdy!

    Parent
    And the crazy derby has begun (none / 0) (#47)
    by Politalkix on Mon Feb 02, 2015 at 09:32:53 PM EST
    link

    Crazy is right (none / 0) (#51)
    by MO Blue on Tue Feb 03, 2015 at 08:03:39 AM EST
    As for Paul, he told talk show host Laura Ingraham that he had chosen to hold off on vaccinating his children for some diseases.


    Parent
    Howard Dean regarding Paul's remarks (5.00 / 4) (#52)
    by MO Blue on Tue Feb 03, 2015 at 08:11:16 AM EST
    DEAN: I actually believe this disqualifies Rand Paul from becoming President of the United States. If you're a physician and you say what he just said, then you are clearly willing to override any set of facts that you ought to know.

    It's one thing for Christie to blunder his way through this and try to pander. For Rand Paul to deny his entire education as a physician, I assume he went to a good medical school and knows something about medicine, that is truly appalling and he, a guy like that should never be let near the White House.



    Parent
    Howard (5.00 / 1) (#53)
    by Ga6thDem on Tue Feb 03, 2015 at 09:11:43 AM EST
    is 100 percent right on that. A medical doctor who doesn't vaccinate apparently does not under science is also the last person I would consider for any medical treatment.

    My neighbor who does not vaccinate is a chiropractor. All she does is reinforce the belief that chiropractors are quacks.

    Parent

    If you look a the anti-vaxx sites, you will (5.00 / 1) (#55)
    by Anne on Tue Feb 03, 2015 at 09:45:16 AM EST
    see that there are plenty of medical doctors, researchers and scientists who went to excellent schools, and who support parents' decisions not to vaccinate.

    I don't know whether this means these doctors do not have good clinical and diagnostic skills, but there would be a level of distrust for me that would not work.  

    I haven't done any significant research on the subject, but I can tell you that when I see chiropractors involved, my level of skepticism goes way up.  

    You know who's big in this movement?  Robert F. Kennedy, Jr.  He's actually written a book about it.  

    Parent

    Thanks (none / 0) (#58)
    by Slado on Tue Feb 03, 2015 at 10:13:57 AM EST
    I posted another link that showed that neither party or political group has a hold on being anti-vaccine.

    They are just ignoring science for different reasons.

    For me it is a selfish parent issue. They want to have it both ways. They want to avoid the risk of a possible side effect and then have the rest of us hide their child within the herd because they have been vaccinated.

    Parent

    Actually some children cannot be vaccinated (none / 0) (#63)
    by ZtoA on Tue Feb 03, 2015 at 12:11:31 PM EST
    A very rare few actually have allergic reactions - in extremely rare cases those reactions are severe. Some are immune compromised, like children are being treated for cancer.

    Percentages vary (from what I've read) but at least 94% need to be immunized in a population. Strong anti-vaxxers simply discount herd immunity, for whatever stupid reasons.

    These kids absolutely have to not be exposed to infected people. It is the responsible thing to do to get your kids vaccinated for the enitre community. I think that should over-ride any fear of Merck.

    Parent

    And the worst part is that with a lot of (none / 0) (#68)
    by Anne on Tue Feb 03, 2015 at 12:40:24 PM EST
    these illnesses, you are contagious for some period of time before you ever have symptoms, which means babies too young to be vaccinated, and people of all ages whose medical/health situation prevents them from being immunized, are exposed are at much greater risk of contracting the illness, with all the associated risks.

    I think people who don't vaccinate because they are convinced it's all part of some big conspiracy to hide the truth from the American people are wrong.  And I will politely, but clearly, tell them so.  I don't think I am obligated to subject myself to having to listen to what amounts to paranoid ravings - if
    I want to learn more, there are plenty of places to find information.  And should it pique my interest enough to want to discuss it, there are people and places where I can find those discussions.

    Parent

    Dr. Rand Paul (none / 0) (#54)
    by KeysDan on Tue Feb 03, 2015 at 09:23:18 AM EST
    did go to a good medical school (Duke, medicine; Baylor, pre-med), and was certified by the American Board of Opthalmology. However, he seemed make a curious turn professionally.  He disagreed with the ABO decision to grandfather in older opthalmologists and waive the new 10-year recertification requirements.

    Paul started his own alternative to the ABO certification program, the National Board of Opthalmology in 1999, but he let it dissolve a year later after failing to filing the necessary papers with the KY Sec of State.  Paul re-created NBO in 2005, three months before his original ABO certificate expired, and was re-certified by his NBO--"his" since he was president, and his wife and father-in-law were on the Board.  NBO was dissolved in 2011.

    Parent

    Why didn't I think of that? (5.00 / 1) (#69)
    by sj on Tue Feb 03, 2015 at 02:28:19 PM EST
    I'll just certify myself...

    Parent
    Burned alive (none / 0) (#62)
    by CaptHowdy on Tue Feb 03, 2015 at 11:51:15 AM EST
    in a cage while Jordan tries to deal.

    Unbelievable.

    Now saying (none / 0) (#65)
    by CaptHowdy on Tue Feb 03, 2015 at 12:25:11 PM EST
    this actually happened in early January.  I guess it took this long to put together the long elaborate video with multiple language subtitles together.

    Amazing that he was dead for this whole time of fake bargaining.

    Parent

    Saturday Open Thread | 72 comments (72 topical)

    Readers Must Login or Create an Account to Comment