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ISIS Releases Glossy New Recruitment Magazine

The Islamic State formerly known as ISIS has released a new issue of its glossy photo-magazine, titled "The Return of the Khilafah." You can download the English version here.

It leaves no doubt as to IS's view of non-Muslims. It says the world is divided into two camps:

Amirul-Mu’minin said: “O Ummah of Islam, indeed the world today has been divided into two camps and two trenches, with no third camp present:

The camp of Islam and faith, and the camp of kufr (disbelief) and hypocrisy – the camp of the Muslims and the mujahidin everywhere, and the camp of the jews, the crusaders, their allies, and with them the rest of the nations and religions of kufr, all being led by America and Russia, and being mobilized by the jews.”

It also repeats its plea for professional recruits: [More...]

A call to all Muslim doctors, engineers, scholars, and specialists

Amirul-Mu’minin said: “We make a special call to the scholars, fuqaha’ (experts in Islamic jurisprudence), and callers, especially the judges, as well as people with military, administrative, and service expertise, and medical doctors and engineers of all different specializations and fields.

We call them and remind them to fear Allah, for their emigration is wajib ‘ayni (an individual obligation), so that they can answer the dire need of the Muslims for them. People are ignorant of their religion and they thirst for those who can teach them and help them understand it. So fear Allah, O slaves of Allah.”

IS also provides a roadmap (more like a method to its madness). The foundation seems to be the creation of chaos:

In short, these phases consist of immigrating to a land with a weak central authority to use as a base where a jama’ah can form, recruit members, and train them. (If such a land does not exist or hijrah is not possible, the place can be formed through long campaigns of nikayah attacks carried out by underground mujahid cells. These attacks will compel apostate forces to partially withdraw from rural territory and regroup in major urban regions.)

The jama’ah would then take advantage of the situation by increasing the chaos to a point leading to the complete collapse of the taghut regime in entire areas, a situation some refer to as “tawahhush” (“mayhem”). The next step would be to fill the vacuum by managing the state of affairs to the point of developing into a full-fledged state, and continuing expansion into territory still under control of the taghut.

This has always been the roadmap towards Khilafah for the mujahidin.

Why does ISIS behead people? I have no idea, but perhaps it's related to this quote from the report, about a gathering at which those present received a message from the Messenger of Allah (sallallahu ‘alayhi wa sallam).

‘Abdur-Rahman Ibn ‘Abd Rabbil-Ka’bah narrated, saying, “I entered the masjid and there was ‘Abdullah Ibn ‘Amr Ibn Al-’As sitting in the shade of the Ka’bah with people gathered around him, so I came to them and sat before him.... Then he said, ‘We were on a journey with the Messenger of Allah (sallallahu ‘alayhi wa sallam), and we stopped at a place....We gathered around the Messenger of Allah (sallallahu ‘alayhi wa sallam) and he said...

....Whoever wishes to be saved from the fire and enter paradise should die believing in Allah and the Last Day, and should treat people the way he wishes to be treated. Whoever pledges allegiance to an imam, giving him his hand in sincerity, should obey him as much as he is able to. And if another man comes forward disputing his legitimacy, then strike that other man’s neck.’” [Recorded by Muslim] (my emphasis.)

This was confusing and upsetting to some of those present.

The reporter of the hadith says, “So I came close to him and said, ‘I beseech you in the name of Allah, did you hear this from the Messenger of Allah (sallallahu ‘alayhi wa sallam)?’ So he extended his hand to his ears and his heart, and said, ‘My ears heard it and my heart fully grasped it.’

This doesn't quite square with what Allah said, and the reporter of the hadith questioned him about this.

Allah says, {Oh you who have believed, do not consume one another’s wealth unjustly but only [in lawful] business by mutual consent. And do not kill yourselves [or one another]. Indeed, Allah is to you ever Merciful.}

The response:

So he was quiet for some time. Then he said, ‘Obey him concerning what is obedience to Allah, and disobey him in matters involving disobedience to Allah.’” [Recorded by Muslim]

What does that mean? According to ISIS:

Therefore, we will continue to obey the imam as long as he orders us to obey Ar-Rahman (the Most Merciful). But if he orders us to disobey Allah, then we won’t obey those orders.

Likewise, we will strike the neck of anyone – whoever he may be – that attempts to usurp his leadership, and we will remain patient in the face of such tribulation with the help of Allah Al-Hakim (the Most Wise) and Al-Mannan (the Most Gracious). (my emphasis.)

One last thing: I was wondering the other day about which border crossing with Syria was featured in the End of Sykes Picot video where they blew up the police station and held the prisoners captive in a locked room. Was it al Walid or Qaim? (They are about 120 miles apart.) We now have the answer: It was the border of Qaim and Albu Kamil, and it happened on June 22.

BORDER POLICE STATIONS BLOWN UP
Wilayat Al-Anbar - Sha’ban 22
Six police stations belonging to the Safawi forces in Iraq were blown up on the border near Albu Kamil.

Once again, there is no reference in this report to plans by ISIS or the Caliphate to strike at the West. They may hate the West and Israel, but they have their own fish to fry and that's clearly going to be their focus for quite some time. What they want is "the complete unification of all Muslim peoples and lands under the single authority of the Khilafah." I wish the media would stop writing its Henny Penny scenarios. This isn't about the United States, unless, of course, we go over there and butt in.

Here's an interesting comparison in the Washington Post by Peter Arnett: "In Baghdad, we could see the fall of Saigon all over again".

Where is Country Joe when we need him?

< Reports That ISIS Caliph Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi Severely Injured | Israel to Treat Alleged Killers of Palestinian Child as Terrorists >
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  • Display: Sort:
    The downfall (5.00 / 1) (#22)
    by Politalkix on Sun Jul 06, 2014 at 02:49:39 PM EST
    The downfall of the ISIS will be its overreach. A good article on "The Caliphate Fantasy" was published in the New York Rimes.

    Baghdad won't fall (5.00 / 1) (#26)
    by Jack203 on Sun Jul 06, 2014 at 03:43:45 PM EST
    It won't be Saigon 2.0.

    South/North Vietnam did not have the Sunni/Shiite religious split   The majority of Baghdad is Shiite.  It will hold.

    I just don't see the Shiites retaking ground with majority Sunni population without major political compromise that the Shiites are not willing to make, and ISIS are not willing to take.

    I often give our government the benefit of the doubt that they are making the right decision on extremely  important matters, just taking into account all the advisors and strategists we must have.  But those that sold us into the Iraqi war (with false information) without a doubt are the most inept fools of all time.

    The less our footprint in the Middle East the better,  We've already done enough damage.

    My concerns are that IS and its actions (2.00 / 1) (#57)
    by Green26 on Mon Jul 07, 2014 at 03:25:42 PM EST
    1. May lead to destabilization of various countries in the region, important allies in the region, and/or eventually much of the Middle East.

    2. May result in IS and its "allies" holding territory and creating sanctuaries for training of militants, including ones who will eventually try to carry out actions in the West (including the US). Like the Taliban did in Afghanistan for years, leading to 9/11.

    3. Could eventually disrupt oil in the MIddle East, leading to higher fuel prices and impacting the US and World Economy.

    IS is organized, has a trained military (now being described as more like a conventional army than a terrorist group), now has considerable money, and now has considerable weapons and ammunition.

    IS is not some new little terrorist group. In my view, it would be a huge mistake for the US to ignore it. The Wall St Journal has a good article today on the weapons and munitions that IS recently seized in Iraq. I read it in hard copy today (so no link, even if I knew how to do it). Back page first section. Humvees (apparently hundreds), antiaircraft canons and mortars, tanks (may not be able with sustain with parts and repair), helicopters (probably don't have the technical ability to use them), small arms, a huge amount of munitions, trucks.

    Try this (none / 0) (#58)
    by Zorba on Mon Jul 07, 2014 at 03:58:57 PM EST
    Link to the article you referenced in the WSJ.
    You can link to an article by highlighting and copying the URL.  Then you can choose a word in your comment.  Click on that word and then hit "select."  Go to the top of the comment box and click on the "link" graphic.  It looks like a very small chain.  Paste your URL into the box, after you backspace and get rid of the http:// that is already there.
    Try that, and good luck.  It's not immediately intuitive.

    Parent
    Thanks, but I don't have a subscription (none / 0) (#62)
    by Green26 on Mon Jul 07, 2014 at 10:27:15 PM EST
    to the online Journal, and generally most Journal articles can't be accessed online right away, if at all. Plus, I'm old school.

    Parent
    If you have a subscription (none / 0) (#64)
    by Zorba on Tue Jul 08, 2014 at 05:34:37 AM EST
    to the paper version, you can now get the online WSJ added on at no extra charge.  Call them and ask about it.
    Of course, if you're buying it at the store, then that does not apply.     ;-)

    Parent
    May, May, and Could. Pathetic (none / 0) (#72)
    by Jack203 on Tue Jul 08, 2014 at 09:42:57 PM EST
    Ok so let's act on your solution and bomb a few dozen of their humvees they stole.  Now what genius?

    You don't have a plan.  All you have are complaints and whining.  

    Do you President Green authorize 150k American troops to serve and die to police and suppress the Iraq Sunni lands for the next 20 years?   Where do we get the extra 2-3 trillion dollars for this?  The biggest benefactors of our blood and treasure will be Iran and Syria who will be laughing at us all the way to the bank.

    But OH NO...if we don't DO SOMETHING it MAY lead to DESTABILIZATION.  It was neocon fools that exasperated this destabilization to begin with.  Sunni-Shiite rivalry were always simmering under the surface, but it took truly stupid Westerners with their various agendas and hubris to unravel the tenuous peace.

    We have done enough damage.  Nobody thinks the situation in the Middle East is good.  But Western  arrogance is not going to solve their problems.  We will only make them worse for them and us.

    Parent

    Not only "Western arrogance," but, (5.00 / 1) (#73)
    by NYShooter on Tue Jul 08, 2014 at 11:03:11 PM EST
    Western ignorance.... of the history of the Middle East.

    The idiot Man/Child that our Supreme Court handed The Presidency to, apparently listened to Glenn Beck too much. He believed in the delusion that the Iraqis were secretly praying at night for the Americans to come and hand them "Democracy," and/or bomb the hell out of them if they didn't show enough appreciation.

    Sound stupid? Absolutely!

    Did GWB believe it totally? Absolutely!

    Parent

    Not Glen Beck, but (5.00 / 1) (#76)
    by RickyJim on Wed Jul 09, 2014 at 08:45:33 AM EST
    people he trusted in his own administration.  The story of how some insiders (Wolfowitz, Perle, Feith et al) was able to do it is told in a book by a Newsweek editor Richard Bonin:
    Arrows of the Night: Ahmad Chalabi and the Selling of the Iraq War


    Parent
    Looks good. Very tempted to buy the audio CD. (none / 0) (#80)
    by Jack203 on Wed Jul 09, 2014 at 07:41:54 PM EST
    It looks like it will just reinforce my understanding of how we got in the Iraq war mess though.

    Parent
    And I was exasperated... (none / 0) (#81)
    by unitron on Thu Jul 10, 2014 at 01:44:00 AM EST
    ...when they exacerbated the destabilization.

    : - )

    Parent

    Chilling (none / 0) (#1)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Jul 05, 2014 at 04:02:01 PM EST
    Good word

    I remain a little deflated :) (5.00 / 1) (#2)
    by Militarytracy on Sat Jul 05, 2014 at 04:23:01 PM EST
    This isn't my first Kafir rodeo :)

    and Peter Arnett comparing Baghdad to the fall of Saigon...come on man!

    If there is one place on the whole map IS isn't taking, it is Baghdad.  Not these days.

    If they took Haditha dam they could destroy Baghdad in a flood.  That would be an impossible fight.  It was almost impossible for our forces to take Haditha dam during our invasion of Iraq.  If anyone thinks President Obama with is 600 "military advisors" there is going to let IS take Haditha dam, they have been visiting Colorado for too long :)

    Parent

    I think they are a more serious threat (none / 0) (#5)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Jul 05, 2014 at 05:59:21 PM EST
    Than some.  That said I also think the threat is being overstated.
    My comment was more about the tone.  It has the feel of mainstreaming.   Whatever they may or may not be able to do they are effectively helping to mainstream the ideas.

    Parent
    Al Qaeda had a glossy mag (none / 0) (#6)
    by Militarytracy on Sat Jul 05, 2014 at 06:02:30 PM EST
    And was mainstreaming too. I suppose that is why I don't see much here that wasn't already here.

    Parent
    Well (none / 0) (#7)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Jul 05, 2014 at 06:05:21 PM EST
    They didn't declare a workd wide Muslim state open for business.

    Parent
    Yeah they did (none / 0) (#8)
    by Militarytracy on Sat Jul 05, 2014 at 06:05:58 PM EST
    Their whole attitude (none / 0) (#9)
    by Militarytracy on Sat Jul 05, 2014 at 06:07:34 PM EST
    and the goals changed once we got the bin Laden

    Parent
    I am not suggesting any action (none / 0) (#10)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Jul 05, 2014 at 06:09:18 PM EST
    Just making an observation

    Parent
    I'm not suggesting an action either (5.00 / 1) (#11)
    by Militarytracy on Sat Jul 05, 2014 at 06:12:55 PM EST
    But they recruited globally via their magazine, they asked for the educated to join their ranks as well, and they published articles about how to kill the kafir in foreign lands and they encouraged those that had become radicalized but couldn't join them on the front lines to attack others in the nations where they were.

    Parent
    Wow, you are getting even more (none / 0) (#13)
    by Green26 on Sun Jul 06, 2014 at 01:30:30 AM EST
    out of touch with reality, than you were.

    Parent
    OMG...you and Jim (5.00 / 5) (#14)
    by Militarytracy on Sun Jul 06, 2014 at 04:32:11 AM EST
    The verklempt drama divas.  How do you think IS leadership was just so successfully targeted for air strike?  Obama has now sent in 600 special forces " military advisors". You and Jim claim to know and understand " military situations" but I'm calling bull$hit on both of you right now.  Neither one of you seems to really understand what has gone down and will continue to go down until who knows when.

    Parent
    Tracy, please don't make things up (none / 0) (#23)
    by jimakaPPJ on Sun Jul 06, 2014 at 03:07:59 PM EST
    I have not made a single comment about the military advisers.

    In fact, I hope you are correct.

    Only time will tell.

    Parent

    You know what Jim? (5.00 / 4) (#27)
    by Militarytracy on Sun Jul 06, 2014 at 04:27:53 PM EST
    The Pentagon already spilled certain beans on what they set up.  You just have to know what you're reading when you read it.  Since you know about air support and all that, I just figured you knew how to read certain statements that were released by the Pentagon.

    Parent
    I don't read Pentagon statements. (none / 0) (#44)
    by jimakaPPJ on Sun Jul 06, 2014 at 11:42:50 PM EST
    That's your job.

    Got a link??

    Parent

    Why should I link you? (none / 0) (#46)
    by Militarytracy on Mon Jul 07, 2014 at 03:45:10 AM EST
    The most important thing to you is to show up here shooting your mouth off followed by shooting off one of your own body parts.  Google Dana Pittard, then maybe google what a joint special operations center is because for all of your gas bagging navel buzzing, I'm certain you have not one clue what one is or does.

    Parent
    You should link me to prove (none / 0) (#50)
    by jimakaPPJ on Mon Jul 07, 2014 at 10:14:14 AM EST
    your point and that you aren't lying.

    Otherwise I rest my case.

    You make stuff up.

    Parent

    You are so knowledgeable about the (none / 0) (#51)
    by Militarytracy on Mon Jul 07, 2014 at 10:23:24 AM EST
    Use of military though Jim, how can you show here making claims involving use of military force about our President that are untrue without even checking sources?

    Makes you look not very knowledgeable, about anything.

    Parent

    MT, all I know is what I read in the papers (none / 0) (#55)
    by jimakaPPJ on Mon Jul 07, 2014 at 12:18:06 PM EST
    and what your President tells me.

    And thanks for proving that you have no credible source....

    Reading too much ThinkProgress and Kos again??

    ;-)

    Parent

    "what your president ..." (5.00 / 1) (#59)
    by Mr Natural on Mon Jul 07, 2014 at 05:59:01 PM EST
    Hey MT, now we know why Jim's so unhappy.  

    He's lost "his" president!

    Parent

    And Jim is too dumb to google? (none / 0) (#60)
    by Militarytracy on Mon Jul 07, 2014 at 08:33:59 PM EST
    Compounded problems.

    Reality, he googled Dana Pittard and was hoisted by his own petard :). And now it's my fault :). AGAIN

    Parent

    THAT'S what he means ... (5.00 / 1) (#61)
    by Yman on Mon Jul 07, 2014 at 08:44:45 PM EST
    and was hoisted by his own petard :). And now it's my fault :). AGAIN

    ... by his constantly repeated "10 years in naval aviation".

    Parent

    Yes indeed Yman (none / 0) (#67)
    by jimakaPPJ on Tue Jul 08, 2014 at 10:14:22 AM EST
    I served and you let someone else carry your part of the load.

    Aren't you ashamed?

    Parent

    Was it hard, Jim? (5.00 / 1) (#70)
    by Yman on Tue Jul 08, 2014 at 06:25:39 PM EST
    Carrying that heavy "load" up your petard?

    :)

    Parent

    Not too hard for me, Yman (none / 0) (#75)
    by jimakaPPJ on Wed Jul 09, 2014 at 08:32:55 AM EST
    I walked away without a scratch.

    But for Dick, whose body they never found, it was.

    And for Knudson, who drowned tangled in wreckage, it was.

    And for Paul, who was crushed/cut in half, it was.

    And for all the others who died during the undeclared but very real Cold War it was a very heavy burden.

    Thanks for asking.

    Parent

    Lots of people die everyday (none / 0) (#78)
    by Yman on Wed Jul 09, 2014 at 07:30:55 PM EST
    ... doing their jobs.

    Even cooks in a mess hall during peacetime ...

    Now back to you hoisting yourself ...

    Parent

    Ah yes, Yman (none / 0) (#82)
    by jimakaPPJ on Thu Jul 10, 2014 at 08:16:59 AM EST
    You prove again how much you despise the military.

    I bet you wish you could have been in San Fran so you could have spit on them.

    Parent

    I have a lot of respect ... (5.00 / 1) (#87)
    by Yman on Thu Jul 10, 2014 at 07:44:52 PM EST
    ... for the military and guys like my uncles who served in combat - without talking about it.

    Guys who try to brag about their peacetime service around as though it's the equivalent, or who aren't open/honest about when or how they served, or who pretend it makes them special?

    Not so much.

    Parent

    Spat on (none / 0) (#85)
    by jondee on Thu Jul 10, 2014 at 11:13:09 AM EST
    like you were.

    Oh wait, that's right: you didn't go. You read about all that spitting in Bernie Goldberg's harrowing autobiography.

    Parent

    You're in love with that "served" word (none / 0) (#69)
    by jondee on Tue Jul 08, 2014 at 02:33:31 PM EST
    I'm guessing what you did involved big, steamy dollops in the mess hall.

    lol

    Parent

    Ah, MT, frustrated again, eh? (none / 0) (#68)
    by jimakaPPJ on Tue Jul 08, 2014 at 10:29:51 AM EST
    You have no proof so you resort to your typical response, personal insults.

    lol.

    Thanks for proving you don't have any proof.

    What I find amusing is that I hope that you are right. I hope that Obama made at least that weak response.

    But based on his actions I doubt it.

    Parent

    Oh the hypocrisy ... (none / 0) (#71)
    by Yman on Tue Jul 08, 2014 at 06:28:01 PM EST
    This:

    I served and you let someone else carry your part of the load.

    Followed by this:

    You have no proof so you resort to your typical response, personal insults.

    Heh, heh, heh ...

    Parent

    Thanks for being a straight man (none / 0) (#74)
    by jimakaPPJ on Wed Jul 09, 2014 at 08:21:32 AM EST
    You see Yman, the difference is that I have been saying the same thing for years and I provide many links to prove my point....

    MT doesn't.

    Of course if you had served something besides the mashed potatoes you wouldn't be so jealous.

    lol

    Parent

    Because you can't google? (none / 0) (#77)
    by Militarytracy on Wed Jul 09, 2014 at 01:50:34 PM EST
    What are you trying to force me to be?  Some sort of enabler?

    Parent
    No force involved MT (none / 0) (#83)
    by jimakaPPJ on Thu Jul 10, 2014 at 08:20:33 AM EST
    I'm just pointing out that you rarely link to anything but are always quoting something/someone.

    You don't have to do anything that would give your claim some substance and, perhaps, additional information to the reader.

    BTW - If you ever get arrested you will be screaming, correctly, that the prosecution must prove its charges.

    Parent

    I gave you Dana Pittard to google (none / 0) (#86)
    by Militarytracy on Thu Jul 10, 2014 at 07:43:35 PM EST
    Pages and pages and pages of links follow that google that describe to YOU that Dana Pittard is a General.  Dana Pittard is a United States Army General in charge of current US operations in Iraq that include a Joint Operations Unit...which is special forces....like all of them, Seals, Rangers, Delta, the 160th....everyone.  There are thousands of links there, thousands

    Parent
    Your "links", like your claims (none / 0) (#79)
    by Yman on Wed Jul 09, 2014 at 07:32:33 PM EST
    ... are a joke.

    Come to think of it, that explains all the "LOLs" in your posts.

    Parent

    You're making things up again (none / 0) (#84)
    by jondee on Thu Jul 10, 2014 at 11:00:18 AM EST
    he doesn't use LOL. Prove it.

    Parent
    Hey Natural, I think the (none / 0) (#66)
    by jimakaPPJ on Tue Jul 08, 2014 at 10:13:23 AM EST
     "our President" silly.  He is "the President."

    Of course if you are for slavery and have no trouble with "our" then be my guest.

    Parent

    Hmmm Let me see (none / 0) (#3)
    by jimakaPPJ on Sat Jul 05, 2014 at 05:44:56 PM EST
    What they want is "the complete unification of all Muslim peoples and lands under the single authority of the Khilafah."

    Reminds me of the Peter Arnett interview of 3/97:

    REPORTER: Mr. Bin Ladin, will the end of the United States' presence in Saudi Arabia, their withdrawal, will that end your call for jihad against the United States and against the US ?

    BIN LADIN:... So, the driving-away jihad against the US does not stop with its withdrawal from the Arabian peninsula, but rather it must desist from aggressive intervention against Muslims in the whole world.

    Link

    I would say that the war is "on" but in fact in their eyes it was always been "on."

    And whether we like it or not we must choose to fight or be a subject.

    There isn't a second choice.

    No we don't have to choose (5.00 / 5) (#4)
    by Militarytracy on Sat Jul 05, 2014 at 05:55:44 PM EST
    And if our President did choose anything at all, it won't be made public for years.  Because he's not a dumba$$ up there blathering "Bring It On!".  Oh yeah, and the forever famous and always popular, "If you aren't with us, you're aGuinness!

    Parent
    Uh Tracy, you're wrong. (1.00 / 1) (#24)
    by jimakaPPJ on Sun Jul 06, 2014 at 03:11:00 PM EST
    Obama has announced when we will Afghanistan and made public that he would cut and run from Iraq.

    Parent
    Cut and run....soooo funny (5.00 / 1) (#30)
    by Militarytracy on Sun Jul 06, 2014 at 04:38:18 PM EST
    The one in the corner cutting themselves and developing the runs is you :)

    Parent
    Excellant... (5.00 / 1) (#32)
    by fishcamp on Sun Jul 06, 2014 at 05:05:36 PM EST
    ent... (5.00 / 1) (#33)
    by fishcamp on Sun Jul 06, 2014 at 05:06:35 PM EST
    Jim sometimes makes it impossible (5.00 / 2) (#34)
    by Militarytracy on Sun Jul 06, 2014 at 05:28:54 PM EST
    For me to silence my sophomoric voices :)

    Parent
    Actually I was thinking (1.00 / 1) (#45)
    by jimakaPPJ on Sun Jul 06, 2014 at 11:44:46 PM EST
    junior high.

    And my description was dead solid perfect.

    Even a fisherman should be able to figure it out.

    Parent

    Not quite (5.00 / 1) (#48)
    by Yman on Mon Jul 07, 2014 at 06:25:50 AM EST
    Obama has announced when we will Afghanistan and made public that he would cut and run from Iraq.

    Even your own buddies at red states know that it was your boy GW's with drawal schedule.  

    Iraq War ends on Bush's schedule, not Obama's.

    All U.S. troops, except for 159 uniformed troops and officers as well as a marine guard in the US embassy in Baghdad, will be out of Iraq before December 31, 2011, as required by the Status of Forces Agreement President Bush made with Iraq.

    The Democrats can trumpet the Obama Iraq withdrawal all they want, but it was accomplished right on schedule -- a schedule established by President Bush, not Obama.

    Parent

    Yman, quit making things up. (none / 0) (#49)
    by jimakaPPJ on Mon Jul 07, 2014 at 10:12:40 AM EST
    "Making things up" - heh (none / 0) (#56)
    by Yman on Mon Jul 07, 2014 at 12:31:44 PM EST
    I guys facts and reality can be a little disorienting when you live in a right-wing bubble, huh Jim?

    Parent
    it was more about MT's (5.00 / 2) (#53)
    by fishcamp on Mon Jul 07, 2014 at 11:28:26 AM EST
    cut and run joke jim but I am mad at you for another reason.  Your Naval air buddies from the Boca Chica Naval Air Station continually shred the air very loudly at about 500' in their F5 Tiger jet fighters and scare the fish.  Can you fix that?

    Parent
    How about (5.00 / 1) (#54)
    by jimakaPPJ on Mon Jul 07, 2014 at 12:13:17 PM EST
    a really low pass... say about 20 feet.

    That should kick up a rooster tail of water so you can just reach out and pick the fish off.

    Wait for number 10

    There ain't nothing too good for my friends.

    ;-)

    Parent

    Call fishcamp (none / 0) (#63)
    by Militarytracy on Mon Jul 07, 2014 at 11:13:27 PM EST
    Complain

    That's the only way they stop doing stupid stuff, and all noise complaints have to be logged.  I know some people don't like to be complainers, but alpha personality pilots take until someone says no.  Don't ever put up with military flight training noise that disrupts your life or livelihood.

    Parent

    They don't use F-5s anymore (none / 0) (#65)
    by Wile ECoyote on Tue Jul 08, 2014 at 06:21:26 AM EST
    Been at least 10 years.  

    Parent
    Unimpressed (none / 0) (#12)
    by RickyJim on Sat Jul 05, 2014 at 07:25:36 PM EST
    I didn't read the magazine that carefully.  Do they want to block oil shipments to the west?  Have there been any surveys of Muslims world wide to see how many share their views?  I would like to see proof that if we don't militarily engage these guys they would come over here and get us Kufrs. The only thing I worry about is that Israel will panic and use atomic weapons on its enemies, which at the moment includes ISIS.

    They (none / 0) (#15)
    by Ga6thDem on Sun Jul 06, 2014 at 06:09:20 AM EST
    sound just like George W. Bush. Maybe they got his speechwriter for their magazine.

    I keep (none / 0) (#16)
    by lentinel on Sun Jul 06, 2014 at 07:27:11 AM EST
    thinking that all this turmoil goes back to the usurping of land from the Palestinians by the big powers.

    This is going to get nastier and nastier until a political settlement can be arrived at.

    Religion is the fire-starter, but the substance underneath is political injustice and the suffering of people.

    Not Sure About That (none / 0) (#17)
    by squeaky on Sun Jul 06, 2014 at 08:41:56 AM EST
    But the western land grab sure was/is incendiary. Oil and other strategic issues may have caused the same problems in the region without Israel ever being part of the picture. And it is possible things could be worse there without Israel. Hard to know.

    Gideon Levy at Haaretz does not think a political settlement is going to happen. Interesting read, IMO..


    Parent

    Yes, the land grab was incendiary (5.00 / 1) (#19)
    by Zorba on Sun Jul 06, 2014 at 01:28:36 PM EST
    But I think that it goes way beyond just Palestine.
    It seems to me that when the big powers divided the Middle East into different countries, after World War I and the collapse of the Ottoman Empire, they threw different tribes, ethnic groups, religions, and opposing sects of Islam together without much regard to ancient animosities, which the Ottomans were able to (more or less) keep under control due to their military might.
    And Levy's article is certainly depressing, but he very well may be right.    :-(


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    Numbers Game (5.00 / 1) (#21)
    by squeaky on Sun Jul 06, 2014 at 02:19:28 PM EST
    The Palistinian Arab population reproduces at a higher rate than the Jewish population (non ultra orthodox). The math dictates that in order to have a Jewish state there have to be a majority of Jews...  

    It really boils down   to demographics.

    And there are some who say demographics are not a problem.

    In any case, many are worried about demographics...

    I guess we have something in common, although on a much less intense scale and effect.

    Parent

    Demographics are definitely a concern (none / 0) (#25)
    by Zorba on Sun Jul 06, 2014 at 03:35:51 PM EST
    But it also all goes back to throwing groups together in "countries" that are not, and at least in the foreseeable future, will never be cohesive countries.
    The European powers did pretty much the same thing with their former colonies in Africa.  And in many cases, that certainly didn't turn out well.  Again, different tribes, different religions, different ethnic groups.

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    Mahmoud Ahmadinejad (none / 0) (#28)
    by lentinel on Sun Jul 06, 2014 at 04:33:25 PM EST
    asked an interesting question, I thought.

    Why was the State of Israel created in a manner in which the Palestinians were displaced?

    Why wasn't it carved out of a piece of Germany?
    They were the villains after all.

    And now Germany is rebuilt and powerful.

    There is probably a simple answer to this... based on history... but I don't know what it is.

    Parent

    The answer is (5.00 / 2) (#39)
    by Zorba on Sun Jul 06, 2014 at 07:49:36 PM EST
    History and religion, both.  Did you ever watch the film "Exodus"?  Simplified in many ways, but it gives a lot of the reasons why the Jewish people felt strongly about going back to their ancestral homeland.  Can't say as I blame them, given the enormous problems and persecution they faced in the countries they settled in after the Diaspora.  
    Do I think that this gave them the right to displace the Palestinians, who, after all, had been there for many centuries?  No, but I sure as he!! don't have the answer to all of it.
    Listen to the song from the movie.  It may give you and idea of how the returning Jews and soon-to-be Israelis felt.
    And a somewhat different perspective of the same song can be found here.
    It's a sad and complicated history.

    Parent
    Well, heck (none / 0) (#40)
    by Zorba on Sun Jul 06, 2014 at 07:55:28 PM EST
    The video links don't seem to work.
    Google "The Exodus Song (This Land is Mine) by Pat Boone on YouTube for the first, and "This Land is Mine on Vimeo" for the second.


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    History and religion is only part of it (none / 0) (#41)
    by Politalkix on Sun Jul 06, 2014 at 08:20:23 PM EST
    Please read link

    From the article
    "But as Amr al-Zant, an Egyptian scientist and columnist, has noted, it takes openness for societies to progress. Closed politics may be tempered by an openness to ideas and an open economy, as in China. Open politics can make up for poverty and a paucity of human resources, too. But to have closed politics and closed minds together is a recipe for disaster; for proof, consider the current fate of the Arab states."

    And what looks like factors arising from religion may not be entirely factors arising from religion.
    Please read link

    Parent

    I pretty much agree (none / 0) (#42)
    by Zorba on Sun Jul 06, 2014 at 08:31:42 PM EST
    with the two articles regarding Islam.
    But they both fail to explain anything about Israel and the Jewish people and their history regarding the land.

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    Israel and Jewish history 1880-1948 (none / 0) (#43)
    by Politalkix on Sun Jul 06, 2014 at 09:05:48 PM EST
    regarding the land. link

    "Yet in the end, the dispute over occupying Palestine pitted two cultural groups against one another. With the Zionists succeeding in their quest for a Jewish homeland, the failure of the Palestinian Arabs to achieve their own separate state has continued to be the cause of much conflict and upheaval in the Middle East over the last 60 years.

    But overall, deficiencies in nationalism, political organization and leadership, economic growth, external support and military power jeopardized the creation of a Palestinian state during the first half of the 20th century.

    The absence of a Palestinian nationalist movement was in sharp contrast with the cohesive Zionist movement desperate to find a Jewish homeland. Unlike the Jews of Eastern Europe, the Palestinian Arabs did not hold the same sense of nationalism and community that Eastern European Jews produced under the Zionist movement."


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    What was (none / 0) (#47)
    by lentinel on Mon Jul 07, 2014 at 05:42:02 AM EST
    circling around in my head is the reality of Israel being surrounded by people who are, to say the least, antagonistic to its existence. I knew a man whose family lives there and when 9/11 struck here, he told me that he said that, or the fear of that, was part of their daily life.

    And on the other side, there is what I have to feel is the injustice of sweeping people off their lands, the Palestinians, in the creation of the State.

    Well, no matter what the history was - at present we have an unending war between peoples who do not seem to me to be so dissimilar in a deep sense. They want to worship how they please and raise their children in peace.

    And it seems that every administration has its turn at brokering something or other to have a peaceful settlement between the parties, but it never takes hold.

    A two-State solution seems the only viable one, but for some reason or other, this never has reached fruition.

    I have no solution.
    I did, however, feel like posing the question about the site chosen for the State of Israel because it seems to have placed the Israelis in a constant state of apprehension, and the Palestinians in a constant state of poverty and suppression - paving the way for the likes of Bin Laden and Amirul-Mu'minin.

    And, as I said, the Germans are doing just fine.
    And so are the Italians.
    And so are the Japanese.

    Parent

    Wow (none / 0) (#31)
    by squeaky on Sun Jul 06, 2014 at 05:01:32 PM EST
    Why wasn't it [Israel] carved out of a piece of Germany?

    They were the villains after all.

    I guess you are pretty short on empathy lentinel.

    So I will try to help you put your feet in the shoes of the Holocaust survivors.

    Imagine you and your entire extended family were rounded up, plus all your friends, by a neo nazi cult who gained power over state of Alabama. Everyone in Alabama was 100% behind the neo-nazi's so they did not have much trouble.

    You and your family was tortured, many were killed, soap was made from your fat which was cut off your body and rendered..

    Well the cult got broken up and they lost power in Alabama. You and your family no longer had anywhere to go so the authorities decided that the best place to resettle you, your friends and entire family was in the homes of the cult members of Alabama.

    Would you feel cozy?

    Or would you want to get the f' out of there in no time flat?

    Parent

    Jerusalem (none / 0) (#35)
    by CaptHowdy on Sun Jul 06, 2014 at 05:29:30 PM EST
    Is not on Germany

    Parent
    Yes. (none / 0) (#37)
    by lentinel on Sun Jul 06, 2014 at 05:46:34 PM EST
    I know.

    Parent
    It Could Have Been Done Differently (5.00 / 1) (#52)
    by RickyJim on Mon Jul 07, 2014 at 10:30:26 AM EST
    The most sobering thing I have read about how events might have unfolded differently in the past 100 years is this from a Jew who migrated to Palestine from Russia in the 1880s (During what is called the "First Aliyah")

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    Abolition of the Caliphate (none / 0) (#20)
    by Politalkix on Sun Jul 06, 2014 at 02:09:57 PM EST
    "It seems to me that when the big powers divided the Middle East into different countries, after World War I and the collapse of the Ottoman Empire, they threw different tribes, ethnic groups, religions, and opposing sects of Islam together without much regard to ancient animosities"

    By that measure, even Kemal Ataturk should be held guilty.
    Irrespective of the motivations of the big powers, the divisions were progressive in nature.

    Parent

    They were "progressive" in nature? (none / 0) (#29)
    by Zorba on Sun Jul 06, 2014 at 04:35:05 PM EST
    Really?  
    I know more than a few Arab Christians from the Middle East who escaped from there because they were among the lowest on the totem pole.  Sunnis and Shiites were opposed to each other, but both were opposed to the Christians.  The Christians do not seem to think that the divisions were in any way progressive.   That's why they got the he!! out of there as soon as they were able.
    And the Jews in those artificial countries fared even worse.

    Parent
    Making people of different religions (none / 0) (#36)
    by Politalkix on Sun Jul 06, 2014 at 05:34:58 PM EST
    and sects live together in the same country even if the boundaries are artificial is more progressive than creating separate homelands for people of each and every sect and religion. Yes, Ataturk's Turkey was more progressive than the Ottoman Caliphate that got dissolved in 1924 and Shia and Sunni enclaves into which Iraq is disintegrating at this time.

    Your statement "And the Jews in those artificial countries fared even worse." should be judged in context. The mistreatment of Jewish people in Europe (not just in Nazi Germany but over centuries in many countries in Europe) created the yearning for a separate homeland and the state of Israel. I know many people of Jewish faith who immigrated from the Soviet Union/Russia to the United States and Israel. They have all said that they were discriminated against and persecuted in Russia. The way that Bosnians were treated by the Serbs and Croats led us to intervene in Kosovo.

    The more reasonable question to ask may be as follows. Did Christians in Iraq face more discrimination (from WW1 to 2003) compared to Jewish people in Soviet Union/Russia or non-Muslims in Saudi Arabia or Muslims in Serbia, Croatia, Greece, or North Africans in present day France or Spain or Turks in present day Germany, etc. In my opinion, the answer in "No".

    How many little countries can you create?

    Parent

    The Christians that I know (5.00 / 1) (#38)
    by Zorba on Sun Jul 06, 2014 at 05:55:57 PM EST
    who lived in Iraq would say (and have said) that they and their relatives were better off under Saddam Hussein (repressive as he was) than after he was gone.  Hussein, being a dictator, pretty much stomped on everyone but tried to make sure that they didn't kill each other.  
    When the Muslims gained ascendency, they treated the Christians much worse, and many of them left.
    It's true that ISIS (now IS, or whatever they are calling themselves) will most likely be even worse towards the Christians, and the few remaining Jews, as well.
    A multi-ethnic and multi-religion society works much better under a true democracy that represents everyone, and that is willing to safe-guard the rights of all.  They are nowhere near there, yet.

    Parent
    What I was wondering... (none / 0) (#18)
    by Mr Natural on Sun Jul 06, 2014 at 09:53:58 AM EST
    Did they release those prisoners from the locked room before blowing up the police station?

    Seriously, they had already completely depersonalized them, calling them worshippers of Satan.  Standard operating procedure.