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Sunday Night Open Thread

By Jeralyn, Section Blog Related
Posted on Sun Apr 21, 2013 at 09:01:03 PM EST
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I don't think I've read any news this week that's not related to the Boston bombings.

I'm turning my attention now to Nurse Jackie, the Good Wife and Celebrity Apprentice.

Here's an open thread, all topics welcome.

< Legal Analogies to Boston Bombing Suspect Dzhokhar Tsarnaev | By the Numbers: Homegrown Muslim-American Attacks Decline >

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    Sunday Night Open Thread | 89 comments (89 topical)

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    I'd like to see a little more attention ... (5.00 / 1) (#4)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Sun Apr 21, 2013 at 11:25:30 PM EST
    ... paid to that fertilizer plant explosion in West, Texas. Last I heard, 14 are dead and 60 are missing.

    Speaking for myself only as someone who works in the public decision making process, I'd love to learn how Texas officials and the operators of that plant came to determine that storing countless tons of volatile ammonium nitrate next to both a school and a nursing home was somehow a good idea.

    All 60 missing have been accounted for (none / 0) (#14)
    by jbindc on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 07:47:50 AM EST


    Parent
    That's the first good news ... (none / 0) (#24)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 10:36:28 AM EST
    ... in this story. I'd still like to know how 270 tons of ammonium nitrate came to be stored in a small Texas town, who concluded that it was okay to do so and signed off on the decision.

    I think it's pretty apparent that the laws governing the storage and transport of hazardous materials were being ignored and even flouted by management in this case, and that the state and federal authorities nominally charged with oversight over plant operations were either looking the other way, or in some manner had been hamstrung in their abilities to perform their prescribed duties to a requisite and optimal capacity.

    Therefore, I'd offer that this particular incident is actually of far greater overall consequence to most Americans than the tragedy which happened in Boston. Unbeknownst to most residents of West, their lives had been recklessly placed at profound risk by corporate management, which valued profit before public safety.

    Given the extent of the subsequent destruction of property and the accompanying loss of life, the town of West should be treated as a crime scene, and the operators of that plant should be the subject of a criminal investigation.

    Aloha.

    Parent

    270 tons (none / 0) (#17)
    by MO Blue on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 08:07:13 AM EST
    ❖ Fertilizer plants and depots are required to report amounts of ammonium nitrate they have in excess of 400 pounds.  That West, TX fertilizer plant had 270 tons of the stuff, unreported.  Moreover, "DHS did not even know the plant existed until it blew up."  Update:  "Texas Explosion Seen as Sign of Weak U.S. Oversight".  Ya think?  Update: 14 bodies found, 200 injured. The dead include 5 volunteer firefighters and 4 emergency medical techs. link

    Parent
    I read that the plant had not been inspected since (none / 0) (#22)
    by Angel on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 10:32:45 AM EST
    1985.  Epic failure.

    Parent
    My first thought as well (none / 0) (#23)
    by Slado on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 10:34:03 AM EST
    I mean it's not like there wasn't plenty of room.

    Shouldn't this thing have been in an industrial park 5 or more miles out of town?

    All that said accidents will happen and people will screw up.   The idea that gov't can protect us from everything is fools gold.

    Parent

    Jeez Slado, (5.00 / 2) (#26)
    by NYShooter on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 10:38:53 AM EST
    and you were doing so good....

    Parent
    Texas (5.00 / 1) (#33)
    by Ga6thDem on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 10:54:51 AM EST
    is known to have very lax zoning laws. So apparently if you don't have zoning laws people don't have the sense to not put a plant in the middle of a town.

    I don't think the government can protect us from everything but don't you think they can do better than this?

    Parent

    I am not sure what the plant was storing when it (none / 0) (#46)
    by Angel on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 11:51:56 AM EST
    was built, or when the homes and school and other places were built around it.  But you'd think that once all those people were there they would at least have had the common sense to inspect it and try to manage the quantities of chemicals stored and try to mitigate the risks of harm to those nearby should there be any explosion, etc.  But this is Texas (my home and birth state) we're talking about...what more can I say?

    I lay some blame on the owner and managers who allowed the quantities of chemicals to be stored there knowing full well they were way over the legal limits. I'm wondering how those townspeople feel about them now.  Before, they all felt like one big happy family, it's a company town after all.  Now they are learning that the company didn't take care of them.  

    I will tell you that our esteemed governor, Rick "Good Hair" Perry will somehow find a way to try to blame this on Obama, he'll ask for federal funding for clean-up and compensation to the victims, and he will refuse to take any responsibility for Texas' failure with regards to inspection and oversight.  He'll say Texas did what Texas was supposed to do blah blah blah knowing that Texas didn't protect these people, and they aren't protecting the thousands of other people just like those in West, Texas, who live near fertilizer and other chemical facilities.  

    Parent

    It's amazing how quickly your attitude ... (none / 0) (#52)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 12:08:27 PM EST
    ... can change and harden toward others whom you once thought respected you and cared about you, after you've learned that you and your family and friends were really little more than disposable commodities to them.

    Parent
    Slado, please read this ... (5.00 / 1) (#39)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 11:10:31 AM EST
    ... article about the 1947 disaster in the port of Texas City, before you embarrass yourself further with such silly blather about government not necessarily being obligated to provide for the public's safety.

    What happened in West was an eminently avoidable tragedy, and was not simply the unfortunate result of somebody's "screw up."

    Rather, the disaster became inevitable, thanks to a willful and longstanding decision on the part of corporate management to neglect and / or circumvent duly prescribed protocols -- both regulatory and common sense -- regarding the transport and storage of extremely volatile materials such as ammonium nitrate.

    Parent

    West Fertilizer (none / 0) (#34)
    by DebFrmHell on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 10:57:10 AM EST
    was established in 1962.  As the town grew they built closer to that factory.  In '62 is was probably "boonies" and surrounded by primarily farms.

    As for the inspections, the EPA had fined them  10k last summer.  Curious about the State inspections though.  All of the ones I have checked into (mildly) are at a Federal level.

    Parent

    Sad to say, $10,000 is of little ... (5.00 / 1) (#41)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 11:21:52 AM EST
    ... or no consequence to a company like that. Quite obviously, that pittance of a fine had no significant impact or deterrent effect on its behavior. The institutional groupthink of corporate management tends to write off such paltry panalties as simply part of the cost of doing business.

    Parent
    Dunno, Donald. (none / 0) (#50)
    by Towanda on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 12:03:56 PM EST
    Apparently that $10,000 fine was going to shut down the company <snark>.  

    I read that it got the feds to reduce that fine by half.


    Parent

    Yeah, it ended up being reduced to (none / 0) (#53)
    by Angel on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 12:12:30 PM EST
    ...drum roll, please...a whopping $5,250.

    Parent
    Simply put, I'm stunned. (none / 0) (#77)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 04:08:40 PM EST
    A problem in West, TX was clearly identified, and yet nothing concrete was ever done to resolve it. Instead, the paltry fine was deemed too burdensome upon the plant's operator, and reduced by 47%.

    That's why I said, this should be a criminal investigation of this tragedy, and not merely one conducted in the course of a regulatory review. 14 people are now dead, and they didn't have to die.

    Parent

    Obama's budget proposal does not cause (5.00 / 5) (#12)
    by MO Blue on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 07:22:03 AM EST
    enough pain for the poor, the sick, the military and the elderly so Simpson/Bowles has come out with yet another deficit reduction-plan calling for $2.5 trillion in reductions.

    Not surprisingly their plan includes cutting Medicaid, raising the Medicare retirement age, adopting the Chained-CPI for Social Security, and cutting military pensions.

    This is effectively Simpson and Bowles's response to President Obama's pre-compromise budget and it proves why the strategy was misguided. The supposed justification for the Obama budget was to win over the "Serious People" by showing he was willing to to make the tough choices while the GOP isn't.

    Instead of fully embracing Obama's budget and attacking the Republicans for not getting onboard, the professional deficit hysteria industry chose to declare it insufficient. It is not serious enough because it doesn't contain enough terribly designed policies that hurt regular people, like raising the Medicare age. link

    Also included in the plan is one of the main reasons the poor, the sick, the military and the elderly must lose much of what they need to survive. Simpson/Bowles wants to "reform" the tax system whereby eliminating all tax expenditures will not be used to reduce the deficit but be used to lower the top individual and corporate rate to 25% and the "biggie" to please our corporate master implement a territorial tax system.

    Beware the New Corporate Tax-Cut Scam: LIFT Is A Big LIE

    During the 2012 presidential campaign President Obama attacked Romney for backing the territorial tax system but now that the election is over:

    The president of a group of more than 200 CEOs has said that US President Barack Obama had told the business community last month he might back a territorial tax system, which would exempt offshore profits from taxation. link


    Charlatan (5.00 / 4) (#20)
    by Dadler on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 09:05:13 AM EST
    Pure and simple. I am whatever people see me to be, I am anything, I am everything, I am nothing.

    Such a wasted eight years. Literally wasted when put into context.

    Parent

    More than wasted (none / 0) (#58)
    by smott on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 12:45:34 PM EST
    Enormously, tragically destructive...

    Parent
    NBC reporting (5.00 / 1) (#51)
    by CoralGables on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 12:07:07 PM EST
    Boston bombing suspect Dzhokhar Tsarnaev will not be treated as an enemy combatant...per WH Press Secretary Jay Carney

    In my opinion (if true) this would be an excellent decision.

    But "weapon of mass destruction" (none / 0) (#62)
    by shoephone on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 01:05:19 PM EST
    is such a crock! When has anyone setting off a bomb in the U.S. been charged with using a "weapon of mass destruction"? Not until 9/11 and the Patriot Act rendered this country's legislatures and justice systems insane. The charge is purely political, and should be denounced as such.

    Parent
    Are you sure? (5.00 / 1) (#68)
    by MO Blue on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 01:53:22 PM EST
    On August 10, 1995, McVeigh was indicted on 11 federal counts, including conspiracy to use a weapon of mass destruction, use of a weapon of mass destruction, destruction by explosives and eight counts of first-degree murder.  wikpedia


    Parent
    I stand corrected (none / 0) (#80)
    by shoephone on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 06:30:52 PM EST
    I had never heard that terminology charged to another defendant before 9/11.

    Parent
    I was surprised also (none / 0) (#89)
    by MO Blue on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 09:53:39 PM EST
    I googled McVeigh to see what the charges were expecting to find something else and was surprised when WMD charges were included.

    Parent
    5 people dead - not by bombs in Washington (5.00 / 1) (#71)
    by MO Blue on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 02:38:41 PM EST
    FEDERAL WAY, Wash. (AP) -- Gunfire erupted at an apartment complex in a city south of Seattle and five people were shot to death, including a suspect who was shot by arriving officers, police said early Monday. link
    Well, it does show improvement (none / 0) (#74)
    by NYShooter on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 02:58:48 PM EST
    Amidst all that carnage it appears they might also have a suspect


    Parent
    MOBlue, how are you doing back there with (none / 0) (#84)
    by caseyOR on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 07:04:21 PM EST
    the flooding? My hometown of Peoria and its environs are flooding. The Illinois River is already at record high levels, and more rain is expected tomorrow.

    Parent
    Thanks for asking. (none / 0) (#88)
    by MO Blue on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 09:47:30 PM EST
    Many in my immediate area are experiencing wet basements including me. Not particularly fun, but definitely much better than some of the areas here in MO where roads are flooding etc. More rain scheduled for the next couple of days so I anticipate more areas will be affected.

    Sorry to hear about Peoria. One of my friends has family in rural Illinois and the roads are flooded there too.

    I hope the weather calms down soon. People need a break - too much hardship from too many sources.

    Parent

    Well, enjoy it while you can, because (none / 0) (#1)
    by Anne on Sun Apr 21, 2013 at 09:05:10 PM EST
    tomorrow is the one-week anniversary, so be prepared for a complete re-hash of the last week's non-stop coverage.

    This time, with added speculation!

    Yeesh.

    For reasons that are unimportant, (5.00 / 2) (#3)
    by NYShooter on Sun Apr 21, 2013 at 11:14:53 PM EST
    I was at a place where a TV was "on" most of the time this event, and its aftermath, took place. And, I don't want to pile onto the criticism expressed so energetically by many here regarding the reporting. Some was quite good, most was a primer on how far down  the cognitive scale we've plunged in so few decades.

    Having said these things, I'm left with only one point I'd like to express, and maybe see if others agree. And, that point is the sheer volume, and redundancy of the reporting. A reporter of average intelligence relaying this event to a person, or audience, also of average intelligence could, I would estimate, deliver every salient point worthy of observation in, oh, around ten minutes. And, I'm being generous here.

    As a mentally visual reference, just imagine Jethro Gibbs slapping Dinozzo in the back of the head, and demanding the patented "Gibbs update." Can you imagine Tony taking more than 10 minutes to give "the Boss" a complete, thorough, encyclopedic  rerun of the event?

    How do those "anchors" do it?  I mean, given less than 10 minutes of real news, and ordered to fill 24 hours of "air-time?" (pun intended.)

    What I endured, and, please people, by no stretch of the imagination am I making even a hint of an analogy to what those poor, tragic, unfortunate victims suffered; but, strictly framed on/in the stage as a news consumer, it was as close to civil torture as ever recall.

    Parent

    How do they do it? Fill hours of air time (5.00 / 1) (#10)
    by Anne on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 06:53:25 AM EST
    when there's not a lot new happening?

    Ever watch a baseball game?  Better yet, a baseball game that's a pitching duel?  No one's hitting, no one's running, but does that stop the announcers from yammering on and on and on for the duration?  You'd think it was Useless Stat Day at the ballpark, for heaven's sake.

    Parent

    You're obviously not (none / 0) (#11)
    by CoralGables on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 07:07:59 AM EST
    a Vin Scully fan.

    Parent
    Some are clearly better at it than others, (5.00 / 1) (#16)
    by Anne on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 08:03:32 AM EST
    but too many of them just make you want to hit the "mute" button.  The good ones know when to stop talking and just let people watch the game.

    I shouldn't single out baseball, though; it's not the only sport where announcers act as if the microphone is rigged to explode if there is more than 2 seconds of dead air.

    I've pretty much avoided, as much as I can, the coverage of the Boston bombings; not only am I sick of hearing the same information over and over again, but I'm tired of the media's effort to wring every last tear of grief out of anyone in proximity to a microphone.  They always want to wallow in it, and then segue to how heroic the people are for actually getting on with their lives.  

    Don't get me wrong - it's not that I don't care about the events, or mourn the loss of life, or feel bad for the injured, or that I don't understand and sympathize with the uneasiness that lingers, it's that the media don't know where the saturation point is, so anxious are they to have every last eyeball glued to their reporting and not the competition's.  And it's not like the reporting has been stellar, which makes it even worse.

    Parent

    TV is NOT mandatory! (5.00 / 2) (#45)
    by the capstan on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 11:46:28 AM EST
    I live where my only choice is satellite  TV.  I pay a fairly hefty (but cheaper than cable) price for something I hardly ever turn on.

    I happened to be watching back when Jack Ruby fired that gun in Texas.  I watched MLK, the moon walk, most presidential debates--and the old, old favorites: Lucy, Wagon Train, Bewitched, etc. along with most folks back in the 3 channel days.

    When I read the email from my son about the Marathon bombing, I did turn on the TV.  (My son lives across the Charles River from that finish line.)  I am glad I have that option, but 95% of my news comes from the internet.

    But the programs Jeralynn and you all mention are not on my horizon.  I choose the net, where I can pick my own poison, thank you!

    Parent

    Except for Nurse Jackie... (none / 0) (#82)
    by unitron on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 06:47:41 PM EST
    ...or whatever it was (which I think is on one of the "pay" channels), everything mentioned was either on one of the broadcast networks or CNN,MSNBC,FOX News, etc., all of which should be part of a basic satellite package.

    If you don't choose to watch them, fine (nothing sends me diving for the remote faster than the need to remove Donald Trump from the screen), but if you've got a satellite subscription they aren't exactly exotic and obscure.

    Parent

    I swear, it had to have been an SNL skit (none / 0) (#25)
    by NYShooter on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 10:37:05 AM EST
    It couldn't have been more than an hour and a half after the bombs went off, and the camera was aimed at an, obviously, new, young female "reporter."  Wolfe had just finished telling us the same exact fact six different ways in his migraine producing nasal drone, and even he couldn't squeeze it out for a seventh. So, he spots this pretty new news reader, and he hands her the mic. She looks around frantically for the script, but, alas, it was a missing. She was going to have to actually speak, talk, converse, and/or interview some FBI guy all on her lonesome. Now, please don't call me a misogynist, and I really did sympathize with her, and here she was in the spotlight for what was probably her very first solo...........with no script. God bless her, she cleared her throat, put on her real stern face, and looked straight at Mr. FBI: " Agent Smith, it's been over an hour since the bombs went off; just when can we tell the loved ones, and the people watching at home, that you've made an arrest? People are getting anxious."

    I just wanted to squeeze her into unconsciousness right there and then.

    Talk about having something to tell the grandkids someday.  


    Parent

    The best worst example... (none / 0) (#28)
    by unitron on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 10:42:05 AM EST
    ...the '84 LA Olympics opening ceremony.

    84 grand pianos playing Gershwin and Jim McKay would not shut his mouth, despite all of Peter Jennings hints.

    Parent

    Given that I had attended that ... (none / 0) (#78)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 04:36:37 PM EST
    ... particular opening ceremony in person, I'm rather glad that I missed that.

    The best reporters in the broadcast medium are those who know when to keep their traps shut and NOT say anything at all, but rather let the scene itself simply unfold for the viewer.

    Parent

    TV is NOT mandatory! (none / 0) (#49)
    by the capstan on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 11:57:59 AM EST
    I live where my only choice is satellite  TV.  I pay a fairly hefty (but cheaper than cable) price for something I hardly ever turn on.

    I happened to be watching back when Jack Ruby fired that gun in Texas.  I watched MLK, the moon walk, most presidential debates--and the old, old favorites: Lucy, Wagon Train, Bewitched, etc. along with most folks back in the 3 channel days.

    When I read the email from my son about the Marathon bombing, I did turn on the TV.  (My son lives across the Charles River from that finish line.)  I am glad I have that option, but 95% of my news comes from the internet.

    But the programs Jeralynn and you all mention are not on my horizon.  I choose the net, where I can pick my own poison, thank you!

    Parent

    Well, I think it's high time Americans learned ... (5.00 / 1) (#6)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Sun Apr 21, 2013 at 11:36:25 PM EST
    ... about this, because it's really all about diverting the media with shiny new objects.

    Parent
    Once again, (5.00 / 4) (#8)
    by NYShooter on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 12:55:01 AM EST
     not intended to compare Texas to the Boston event, I agree with you, Donald, that the fertilizer/citizen disaster had much more relevance to every day Americans then did "The World Wide war on Terror."

    I also, have a fairly intense history with construction, building, zoning, and politics. Coming from the Northeast...... New York & Connecticut primarily, but having had projects going in all 13 NE States at one time or another. And, I'm not stating this in an attempt to do a Sunday Night version of "The Donald," humbly, painfully humble, telling us how much he hates, despises even, "tooting his own horn," but, on this issue I stand shoulder to shoulder with my humility drenched Hawaiian public servant....lol.

    I couldn't help myself, Don, and, as always, I only joke about The Strong, so, if I didn't know you could "take" a joke, as well as deliver one, I would've kept my trap shut.

    But, now, in all seriousness, when I read/saw the Texas tragedy, it was so distressing to me that, while I didn't actually cry, I sure as h*ll felt like I wanted to. The reason it was so moving for me was/is because it brought out for me a reminder of the old adage, "there's no thing as a free lunch."

    What I mean here is, and I`m sure Donald, that you`re well aware of it too, is that the so-called "Texas Miracle" is no such thing. It's equivalent of your losing weight.....by cutting off your legs. The Texas explosion is simply an over dramatic lesson of how charlatans like Gov. Perry flash their "economic miracles," but hide the price most average citizens are condemned to pay for it.

    Why wouldn't "businesses" flock to Texas? Guaranteeing his fat cat Corporate Masters an absolutely orgasmic potpourri of human sacrifice to stoke their never ending lust for "More and More wealth and power," they couldn't fire up their Bentley's fast enough to "come on down," and feast on the riches that the destroyed middle class standards of living would provide them.

    Regulations, schmegulations, why provide ordinary people with clean air and water when they know ordinary citizens are fungible. That is, why spend money for regular people's ability to breath clean air, when you've driven down their standard of living so far that they would shove spoon fulls of fertilizer up their own noses just to be able to put a few scraps of food on the table for their families? Certainly, those TrillionAires don't breath the same air as the "regular folks" do, having built their mansions high atop their mountains of corrupt money, and reelecting Perry-like sub humans whose empathy for the broken families they engineered is limited to tsk, tsking at the TV, and muttering, "what a shame."

    Not that I've even scratched the surface of life under Plutocratic domination, you do have to give those sociopaths some credit, they made sure their victims could restore some semblance of their lost dignity by fondling their guns publicly, from morning to night, while making it socially acceptable to laugh and sneer at those "queers kissing each other," over at those hotbeds of perversion, the Universities, staffed by (as O'Reilly mocks) "pinhead professors."  

    These "miracles" that human excrements like Perry, Walker, and Scott deliver will be studied by anthropologists for years to come. How did they take a country designed by the likes of Jefferson, Franklin, Madison, Adams, et al, and turn it over to the dregs of the perrys, walkers, and Scotts?

    Yup, the Texas Miracle.....Yeee-Ha!

    Parent

    You could take you typical right winger (5.00 / 1) (#19)
    by TeresaInPa on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 08:17:25 AM EST
    and try to explain this to them..... and they would see no problem with sacrificing people for business profit.  They really do believe that if we do not give business everything it demands the USA will fold and no one will have jobs.  Sacrificing individuals for the greater good is nothing to them. Socialism for corporations, tough shit for the rest of us.

    Parent
    Exactly. Well said. (none / 0) (#9)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 02:46:02 AM EST
    And what you just articulated may very well be why it's presently all Boston, all the time. The all-too-cozy relationship between Big Money and Texas state government has long been unseemly, and this is the type of thing that shines a bright light on that relationship.

    Further, it's not like Texas has no prior experience with the hazard posed by the reckless handling of ammonium nitrate -- 66 years ago to the day, as it so happened. One can only be grateful that last week's explosion didn't occur in the middle of the day, when school was still in session.

    Speaking again as someone who works in a state legislature, the tragedy at West, TX screams of probable criminal negligence, if anyone in authority wants to take the time to investigate. Its victims cry out for justice, and people need to be held to account for the wickedly wretched decision making that enabled this horrific event to occur.

    Aloha.

    Parent

    Our media is scheduled to get even worse (5.00 / 1) (#18)
    by MO Blue on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 08:16:35 AM EST
    Koch Brothers Plan To Buy Up Eight Major Newspapers

    At a recent seminar in Aspen, one attendee reported that the brothers -- infamous for bankrolling conservative candidates and causes -- put forth the question of, "How do we make sure our voice is being heard?" Their answer, it seems, will be to purchase the entire Tribune company, which constitutes a huge swath of American print media:

    The papers, valued at roughly $623 million, would be a financially diminutive deal for Koch Industries, the energy and manufacturing conglomerate based in Wichita, Kan., with annual revenue of about $115 billion.

    Politically, however, the papers could serve as a broader platform for the Kochs' laissez-faire ideas. The Los Angeles Times is the fourth-largest paper in the country, and The Tribune is No. 9, and others are in several battleground states, including two of the largest newspapers in Florida, The Orlando Sentinel and The Sun Sentinel in Fort Lauderdale. A deal could include Hoy, the second-largest Spanish-language daily newspaper, which speaks to the pivotal Hispanic demographic.



    Parent
    some good comments this morning (none / 0) (#27)
    by P3P3P3P3 on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 10:39:20 AM EST
    MO Blue

    the Tribune Co is a mainline conservative media outlet, its been in bankruptcy for a while, looking to sell off pieces, Cubs sold most recently to Conservative Tom Ricketts, some of the actual buildings they own are some prime property, a friend is now retired from there

    so it may be of interest to the Koch's, but their far right views, if put into the papers, wouldn't  sell well

    Parent

    Newspapers are already... (none / 0) (#83)
    by unitron on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 06:50:19 PM EST
    ...not selling well.

    Which would make it that much more difficult for opposing views to compete with Koch Bros. owned (and subsidized)papers.

    Parent

    Ok Anne (none / 0) (#7)
    by Slayersrezo on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 12:11:56 AM EST
    That's true, sad, and funny all at the same time.

    Parent
    You pegged it: Moment of Silence at 2:50 pm! (none / 0) (#29)
    by shoephone on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 10:49:00 AM EST
    Stop whatever you're doing and pray for America! And then stay tuned to see how they can top that for next week, the two-week anniversary...

    Parent
    OMG! (none / 0) (#2)
    by Politalkix on Sun Apr 21, 2013 at 10:22:35 PM EST
    link

    Just for that, the Czechs should be ... (none / 0) (#5)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Sun Apr 21, 2013 at 11:30:15 PM EST
    ... compelled to give up the Sudetenland to Germany, as a gesture of good faith to secure peace in our time.

    Parent
    Czech Republic or Chechnya (none / 0) (#13)
    by MO Blue on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 07:31:49 AM EST
    will be deemed irrelevant. The key equation is "Muslim = Terrorist" as already demonstrated by at least two of the people commenting on TL.

    Expect many more verses of bomb, bomb, bomb Iran.  

    Parent

    Check out the terminology in (none / 0) (#55)
    by oculus on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 12:16:59 PM EST
    Jeralyn's new post. "Muslim-American."

    Parent
    I am somewhat confused by your comment (none / 0) (#57)
    by MO Blue on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 12:40:00 PM EST
    I was not referring to Jeralyn in my comment. Examples of "Muslin = terrorist" can easily be found in the thread below.

    Obama Press Conference on Boston Bombing Suspect

    Parent

    I know. Just wondering if we will be (none / 0) (#60)
    by oculus on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 12:48:02 PM EST
    seeing articles aboutbUnitarian-Americans, agnostic-Americans, etc.  

    Parent
    Got it now (none / 0) (#63)
    by MO Blue on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 01:15:44 PM EST
    I think we should do away with all the other labels and just go with NWNC-Americans. That way we could cover all the evil doers with just one label.

    Parent
    U.S. Sending 200 Troops To Jordan (none / 0) (#15)
    by MO Blue on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 07:57:24 AM EST
    WASHINGTON -- Defense Secretary Chuck Hagel told Congress on Wednesday that the Pentagon is sending about 200 soldiers from an Army headquarters unit to Jordan to assist efforts to contain violence along the Syrian border and plan for any operations needed to ensure the safety of chemical weapons in Syria.

    The 1st Armored Division troops are largely planners and will replace a similar number of U.S. forces that have been in Jordan for some months. They will include specialists in intelligence, logistics and operations.

    Sending a cohesive headquarters unit will enhance the troops' ability to respond to any security needs, and will provide leadership personnel that could command additional forces if it's determined they are needed in the future. link
    Some Apple info (none / 0) (#21)
    by jimakaPPJ on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 09:36:45 AM EST
    My daughter's car was broken into Saturday while parked at baseball practice and Grandson's back pack with books and IPad stolen.

    Not to fear, said I. We have the the Find It ap!
    The thief will be discovered and truth, justice and me saving money will prevail.

    Wrong.

    If the IPad has a 3G wireless connection when it is turned on it will be "found."

    If the IPad does not, but is WiFi only, when it connects to a WiFi network it will be "found."

    Here's the catch. If the IPad is off, when it is turned on and if you have established a Passcode, you must enter the Passcode to connect. Since the thief doesn't have the Passcode he can't connect to a WiFi. So the IPad can't be found.

    Such is the case with Grandson's.

    I ASSUME the thief will take the IPad to someone who can disable the passcode, wipe out the ID and will be in business.

    Solution?? Sign up with your fav wireless carrier and further enrich them. Or...

    Don't use a Passcode. The thief can turn it on and connect to WiFi and you can find it.

    Probable result for me?? I'm out about $500 bucks.

    Perhaps you can vicariously enjoy... (none / 0) (#31)
    by unitron on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 10:50:20 AM EST
    ...this fellow's revenge.

    Parent
    I love it (none / 0) (#38)
    by jimakaPPJ on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 11:07:00 AM EST


    Parent
    Still developing (none / 0) (#30)
    by jbindc on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 10:49:37 AM EST
    It is possible the Boston suspects were planning more attacks:

    More details of what the authorities said was the original plot were becoming clearer. The Boston police commissioner, Edward Davis, said the authorities believed that Mr. Tsarnaev and his older brother, Tamerlan, 26, had planned more attacks beyond the bombings at the finish line of the Boston Marathon, which killed three people and wounded more than 170. When the suspects seized a Mercedes-Benz sport utility vehicle and held the driver hostage, they told him that they planned to head to New York, the senior United States official said Sunday.

    It was not clear whether the suspects had told the driver what they planned to do there.

    Mr. Davis told CBS News's "Face the Nation" on Sunday: "We have reason to believe, based upon the evidence that was found at that scene -- the explosions, the explosive ordnance that was unexploded and the firepower that they had -- that they were going to attack other individuals."

    And, more details emerge in the alleged carjacking.

    that's pure speculation (none / 0) (#32)
    by Jeralyn on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 10:54:15 AM EST
    stop feeding the fear, at least please don't do it here. If they found documents showing future plans, text messages, photos etc. that's one thing. Some cop's assessment based only on the number of explosive devices is not proof of anything. And what a carjacking victim claims after the act when provided his 15 minutes of fame is also not fact. It's uncorroborated hearsay.

    Parent
    Jeralyn (5.00 / 4) (#36)
    by CoralGables on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 11:01:55 AM EST
    I would agree with you entirely, until you referred to the victim of a carjacking at gunpoint as someone getting his 15 minutes of fame. That's beneath you.

    Parent
    Agreed. (none / 0) (#47)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 11:52:13 AM EST
    Low blow, Jeralyn. I'd really like to think that given the opportunity, most everyone would gladly take a pass at attaining their Andy Warhol-granted moments in such a traumatic fashion.

    Parent
    I'm quoting the NYT (none / 0) (#35)
    by jbindc on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 10:59:38 AM EST
    About what is being reported.  I'm certainly not quoting something like Religious News Service.

    Parent
    they are reporting the cops assumption (none / 0) (#37)
    by Jeralyn on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 11:02:25 AM EST
    is based on nothing more than the number of explosives found. You can also listen to his interview. He has nothing else to support his assessment. Just because the news reports it doesn't mean it's a valid assumption.

    And what difference does it make if he's in custody and his brother is dead? They have been neutralized and the cops so far have no evidence anyone else was involved in their actions.

    Parent

    Well, there's nothing like going (none / 0) (#40)
    by jimakaPPJ on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 11:12:42 AM EST
    to an unbiased source....

    Omid Safi is a Professor of Islamic Studies at University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill, specializing in contemporary Islamic thought and classical Islam. He leads educational tours to Turkey every summer, through Illuminated Tours:

    (Sarcasm alert)

    Parent

    I'm sure, though, that if his (5.00 / 2) (#42)
    by Anne on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 11:36:59 AM EST
    name was William Robert Smith, and he was a Professor of Christian Studies, specializing in contemporary Christian thought and classical Christianity, leading tours to Jerusalem every summer, you'd go into a Jesus-swoon over the impeccability of his credentials and his objectivity, right?

    Really, jim, your comments are to the point where I fully expect you to get a call from SNL to appear on Weekend Update; the rest of the world will think you are playing a caricature, and laugh themselves sick, but we at TL will know you are just being yourself, which is nothing to laugh about.

    Although it is pretty sickening.

    Parent

    Yeah, because we all know how ... (none / 0) (#43)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 11:37:15 AM EST
    ... those people always stick together, right, Jim?

    One must wonder, though -- had the perpetrators of this atrocity been Roman Catholic, would you be similarly denouncing the Vatican and calling for the U.S. military to neutralize France's nuclear arms capabilities?

    Parent

    No, chances are his target would be (5.00 / 2) (#44)
    by Anne on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 11:40:31 AM EST
    the Catholic school system, for failing to sufficiently indoctrinate its students in the glory of America, choosing instead to foster loyalty and allegiance to the Pope.

    Parent
    I think (5.00 / 2) (#56)
    by Ga6thDem on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 12:36:32 PM EST
    I need to kind of explain what this line of thinking is. Southern conservatives hate Massachusetts. They hate that state with a passion for a variety of reasons mostly because they've been told over and over it's an evil place. The vast majority of these conservatives have never gone there so they have no idea whether what they are saying is true or not. Conservatives tend to be extremely gullible especially in the south and will believe anything that their authoritarian person they look up to tells them.

    Facts, numbers and statistics do no make a difference. They are too emotionally invested in what ever the story is.

    Parent

    Reminded me of this yahoo ... (none / 0) (#59)
    by Yman on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 12:46:34 PM EST
    ... (a state rep no less) who tweeted this in the middle of the manhunt:

    I wonder how many Boston liberals spent the night cowering in their homes wishing they had an AR-15 with a hi-capacity magazine? #2A



    Parent
    I stand corrected. (none / 0) (#48)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 11:56:49 AM EST
    And let's please not get Jim started about all those unpatriotic Nuns in the Bus.
    :-P

    Parent
    Jim, have you seen this recent post by Jeralyn? (none / 0) (#54)
    by Angel on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 12:14:18 PM EST
    By the Numbers: Homegrown Muslim-American Attacks Decline

    Parent
    At least he's not... (none / 0) (#81)
    by unitron on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 06:31:46 PM EST
    ...an uninformed source.

    Although he does seem to be someone who, when someone who happens to be Muslim does something he thinks is wrong (like hijacking planes and flying them into buildings), is willing to say that he thinks that what they did was wrong, either regardless of their being Muslim, or especially so in light of it.

    Parent

    Charges filed on Boston Bombing (none / 0) (#61)
    by CoralGables on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 12:52:20 PM EST
    can be read here

    The criminal complaint was issued (none / 0) (#64)
    by Peter G on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 01:21:41 PM EST
    at about 6:45 pm Sunday.  The accused should have been brought before the US Magistrate Judge who signed off on that complaint -- or she should have been brought to him, if he cannot leave the hospital -- by midnight or 1 a.m. last night, pursuant to Rule 5 of the Federal Rules of Criminal Procedure and 18 U.S.C. sec 3501(c), so that a lawyer could be appointed.  

    Parent
    I just posted the complaint and (none / 0) (#65)
    by Jeralyn on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 01:34:50 PM EST
    affidavit and court minutes, see new post at top

    Parent
    he was advised at hospital today (none / 0) (#66)
    by Jeralyn on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 01:37:14 PM EST
    with lawyer present and custody changed from FBI to US Marshals. Prelim set for May 30 (Indictment will certainly be returned before then so he won't get one.)

    He refused to answer questions for bail and agreed to detention.

    Parent

    So actually, Monday morning arraignment (5.00 / 1) (#67)
    by Peter G on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 01:46:07 PM EST
    by the Magistrate at bedside is not too bad, and not out of the ordinary, for a Friday evening arrest with injuries, and where the charges were filed Sunday late afternoon.  Not perfect, but not too bad, really.

    Parent
    agree (none / 0) (#70)
    by Jeralyn on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 02:34:32 PM EST
    I wonder if the federal defender was given a few minutes to meet with him before the advisement began.

    Parent
    CNN reporting (none / 0) (#69)
    by jbindc on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 02:19:51 PM EST
    Royal Canadian Mounted Police are expected to announce that they have "thwarted a plot to carry out a major terrorist attack, arresting suspects in Ontario and Quebec."

    More from linked article (none / 0) (#72)
    by MO Blue on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 02:41:53 PM EST
    No connection exists between the disrupted plot in Canada and the Boston Marathon bombings, U.S. government sources told CNN's Carol Cratty.


    Parent
    Right (none / 0) (#73)
    by jbindc on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 02:48:27 PM EST


    Parent
    SC-1 (none / 0) (#75)
    by CoralGables on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 03:09:24 PM EST
    PPP releases a new poll today showing Elizabeth Colbert Busch leading Mark Sanford 50-41.

    Interesting to note that 86% of SC-1 was in favor of expanded background checks.

    Favorabable/Unfavorable:
    Colbert Busch 56/31
    Sanford 38/56

    Nice (none / 0) (#76)
    by MO Blue on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 03:42:42 PM EST
    On both counts.

    Parent
    Richie Havens, folk singer and guitarist who (none / 0) (#79)
    by caseyOR on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 04:41:28 PM EST
    famously played the opening set at Woodstock, has died at age 72. According to his family, Havens died of a heart attack.

    Here is Havens performing Freedom at Woodstock in 1969.

    Here is Richie playing George Harrison's beautiful song Here Comes the Sun.

    Aww. That's too bad. (5.00 / 1) (#85)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 07:31:38 PM EST
    I loved Havens' cover of Here Comes the Sun. May he rest in peace.

    For my part, I'm going to break out my DVD of the acclaimed documentary Woodstock tonight -- which, coincidentally, I have here in one of my desk drawers -- and invite all the youngsters working for House leadership to watch it (and anyone else who wants to see it, too).

    We all have to stay late tonight anyway, as the legislature will be in night session starting at 6:30 p.m. While most of our work is done, we can't leave until they adjourn, which'll probably be about 10:30 p.m. So, everyone might as well kick back, watch a great film and listen to some great music.

    (I don't think it would be a good idea to break out the bong, though -- this IS the State Capitol, after all!)

    Aloha.

    Parent

    R.I.P., Chrissy Amphlett (1959-2013). (none / 0) (#86)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 08:59:41 PM EST
    The former lead singer of the Australian rock group The Divinyls, 53, died very early this morning at her home in New York City after a prolonged battle with both breast cancer and multiple sclerosis.

    Just last month, Ms. Amphlett had been named by the Australian Recording Industry Association as one of her country's top ten singers of all time. While The Divinyls' successful career stretched over the better part of three decades, they are perhaps best known in this country for their Top Ten hit "I Touch Myself," which reached No. 4 on the U.S. charts in 1991 despite radio stations' reluctance to play the song due to its suggestive lyrics.

    (Please don't judge Chrissy and The Divinyls on the basis of that one bubble-gummish tune, which is actually one of my least favorites of their catalogue. Their work was both eclectic and varied, and tended greatly toward the rock side of the equation.)

    Her equally famous '60s pop star cousin, Patricia "Little Pattie" Thompson, released the following statement this morning on behalf of the family:

    "Our beloved Chrissy peacefully made her transition this morning. Christine Joy Amphlett succumbed to the effects of breast cancer and multiple sclerosis, diseases she vigorously fought with exceptional bravery and dignity. She passed gently, in her sleep, surrounded by close friends and family, including husband of fourteen years, musician Charley Drayton, her sister, Leigh, nephew, Matt, and cousin Patricia Thompson. Chrissy's light burns so very brightly. Hers was a life of passion and creativity; she always lived it to the fullest. With her force of character and vocal strength she paved the way for strong, sexy, outspoken women. [...] Chrissy expressed hope that her worldwide hit I Touch Myself would remind women to perform annual breast examinations. Chrissy was a true pioneer and a treasure to all whose lives her music and spirit touched."

    Aloha, Chrissy. You will be missed, but your spirit lives on in your work. Rest in peace.

    West, Texas fertilizer plant explosion 911 calls (none / 0) (#87)
    by Angel on Mon Apr 22, 2013 at 09:40:01 PM EST
    EMS left with only one ambulance after the "ambulance station just completely exploded".

    Sunday Night Open Thread | 89 comments (89 topical)

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