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Friday Open Thread

It's a jail day for me, here's an open thread for you. All topics welcome.

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    It's time... (5.00 / 5) (#1)
    by kdog on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 10:00:33 AM EST
    for the annual McArab family reunion, otherwise known as the weekend uber-bender...many ancestors to toast...and toast and toast and toast.  If ya get sick, ya can always blame it on too much kibbeh nayeh:)

    A special guest this year, my moms tracked down one of my dad's old dear friends no one has seen or heard from in 30 years.  Word is he is or was a serious character, can't wait to grill him on some of my dad's antics even my moms does not know about from back in the day:)  This is the guy my dad up and ran off to Vegas with one time, he left a note to my moms on the kitchen table "Gone to Vegas, I gotta do what I gotta do."  

    Always a pleasure to hang with my dad's brothers, their wives, and all my crazy cousins...we're a tight knit clan, and thats what its all about.

    To Family!

    As a guy who's never really had that... (none / 0) (#16)
    by Dadler on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 11:29:41 AM EST
    ...you are a lucky man.  Though, I must say, my wife's functional and intact family does a great job with their semi-annual get-togethers of making me feel a part of something bigger.  

    As for hangovers in the morning, just keep drinking when you wake up, works every time. ;-)

    Parent

    Don't I know it... (none / 0) (#20)
    by kdog on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 11:42:18 AM EST
    when one is a bind, ya got a couple dirty dozen ready to drop everything and assist.  All for one and one for all, we are blessed.

    My moms side of the fam is another issue, my mom doesn't talk to one of her sisters at all, my witch of an aunt cut all ties...breaks my moms heart, she's reached out with an olive branch so many times only to be rebuffed.  

    My sister, the gracious host of this raging affair, serves bloody marys and mimosas each morning...hangovers we hardly know ye till Monday!

    Parent

    We got common ground, my man (none / 0) (#22)
    by Dadler on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 11:48:30 AM EST
    My moms doesn't talk to her only sister, mostly because sis is a bitter and vengeful lush, who coerced their mother, when she was completely mentally addled at the end of her life, into signing away to her, my aunt, a bunch of money set aside for the grandkids.  My mom, sweet soul that she is, sometimes acts as if she doesn't even remember this, because she just wants a normal relationship with her only living relative again.

    Parent
    Mad common ground.... (5.00 / 1) (#25)
    by kdog on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 11:58:31 AM EST
    my moms family fued started much the same...over a meager inheritance from my grandfather.  Money, the root of all evil.

    My grandpa, bless his heart, knew the score before he died...changed his will to give my moms everything, as she is the one who cared for him in his last years, while working and caring for her own family.  My aunt who did d*ck for nobody but herself held a grudge over the will.  My moms even cut her in anyway and still she holds a grudge...taking her anger at her father for cutting her selfish arse out of the will out on my moms. F*ck her.


    Parent

    It's funny, my dad did the same thing (5.00 / 1) (#28)
    by Dadler on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 12:06:44 PM EST
    Now that I think about it.  His bachelor brother died in NYC in '93.  He left money to everyone in the family whom he believed really needed it.  That meant my old man, who was a scuffling actor/teacher his whole life.  My uncle knew his little bro was a starving artist and could use the extra help, so he stake my dad a little extra.  Well, this sets my dad's oldest brother off like you can't believe, and initiates a New York lower east side Jewish fued of unimaginable proportions.  My dad, of course, wants none of it, so he gives in and gives older brother's son a nice chunk, even though older bros kid is a well paid corporate exec and doesn't need the money at all.  To this day, the whole thing is a sore spot for the nieces and nephews, of whom I'm one, and I want nothing to do with it.  I always tell my wife that my New York family are like Jerry's colorful clan from Seinfeld EXCEPT they have none of that endearing sitcom charm.

    Parent
    Not that it would ever happen... (5.00 / 1) (#44)
    by kdog on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 12:51:54 PM EST
    between me and my siblings, but I already told moms if she leaves anything to us I will be p*ssed and find her beyond the grave for a kick in the keister...enjoy spending every f*ckin' penny while you're hear, sh*t run up your credit cards too moms...party up.

    Parent
    Fisehatak! (none / 0) (#43)
    by vml68 on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 12:50:55 PM EST
    Drink a few for me, my McArab brother! (none / 0) (#105)
    by jeffinalabama on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 06:18:19 PM EST
    Have Fun... (none / 0) (#109)
    by easilydistracted on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 08:00:56 PM EST
    and be safe.

    Parent
    I've got a complaint! (5.00 / 1) (#13)
    by Militarytracy on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 11:19:13 AM EST
    Just got home from taking Joshua to the doctor.  He has another expansion on his scoliosis rods coming up soon and he started having a problem with anxiety last time.  His anxiety built up so large that he was still throwing up after the surgery two days out, that was why I didn't know that cop was on my tail when they were looking for my make of car on that amber alert.  My other eye was on him in the passenger seat because he was so sick to his stomach and vomiting.

    Anyhow his doctor gave him a prescription for xanax, the doctor approved it but had to leave the office so his nurse practitioner who has permission working under him to prescribe (and this prescription has his specific blessing) wrote the script.

    I kept Josh in the dark as to how close his surgery was so he would not anxiety build before I hopefully got some medication for him.  But when your mom takes you to the doctor this morning the cat is out of the bag.

    The nurse practitioner asked me who usually fills our prescriptions and I told her Walgreens.  She asked me to not take it to them though because they kick back all of her prescriptions in some attempt to boycott nurse practitioners prescribing?  She said they would probably kick it back again and demand to speak directly to the doctor because of Josh's age, they would say that she was making a prescribing error and she said by the time they could track the doctor down and get his voiced prescription it could easily be tomorrow and Josh starting to already throw up and not be able to eat properly.

    So my husband took it on post with him to get it from the on post pharmacy who will just read the script and fill it.  That's right, some of us have to go ONTO an Army base to get a legal drug for sedation that has been legally prescribed to you now that you need now.  How stoooopid, and nurse practitioners save us money and make healthcare affordable but let's boycott them and make their life and their patients lives hell!  Walgreens loses all the rest of my business now.  I don't need this crap in my life on the family's next deployment.

    And to think... (5.00 / 1) (#15)
    by kdog on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 11:28:32 AM EST
    in more civilized, less crony-fied countries, you wouldn't need a piece of paper at all.

    Sorry the beuracracy and rackets are making difficult times more difficult...ain't that always the way.

    Parent

    I'm happy (5.00 / 2) (#21)
    by TeresaInSnow2 on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 11:43:03 AM EST
    that you're in the military system and have an alternate place to go to get scripts filled....imagine if you were civilian....

    Parent
    I can't even imagine (none / 0) (#23)
    by Militarytracy on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 11:50:06 AM EST
    How this is for our counterpart in the civilian world.  My husband just phoned, they filled it no problems no questions.  I told Josh if he started feeling overwhelmed to have his teacher call me and I will go get the meds from his dad and bring a dose right to school for him.  Once the stomach kicks in it is really hard to get all that turned around.

    Parent
    Poor sweet kid (none / 0) (#26)
    by TeresaInSnow2 on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 11:59:53 AM EST
    I can't imagine his h*ll....and yours.

    Parent
    Might be a local problem (5.00 / 1) (#33)
    by MO Blue on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 12:34:47 PM EST
    I get nurse practitioner scripts filled at Walgreens all the time. Love my nurse practitioner and think that they do a great job.

    Parent
    Maybe they're looking for license (5.00 / 1) (#49)
    by Madeline on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 01:03:22 PM EST
    I have a great psychiatric nurse practitioner who prescribes.  She is really better than a psychiatrist in re to connecting as she actually spends a lot of time with patients and they love her for that.

    In my state, NP have to be licensed to prescribe. Even with licensure, they have to work with an MD.

    Parent

    Oh Tracy....Poor Joshua... (5.00 / 1) (#57)
    by samsguy18 on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 01:27:17 PM EST
    This is hard stuff for a child especially when you're dealing with rods...When they complain of pain and discomfort they are usually at the suffering stage.He's a brave boy ! Re-NP this must be a local or state policy.

    Parent
    Don't Even Get Me Going (5.00 / 1) (#75)
    by ScottW714 on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 01:59:57 PM EST
    My friend gets heavy duty pain meds and sometimes she is just unable to fill them because of the very condition she needs them for.

    The games I have to play, the hoops, the BS, all of it.  And then I found out last year, that the brand-name manufacture pays the generic manufacture to limit production.  With insurance, generic is $30 and brand name is around $180, and I end up running around town between Walgreen's and CVS to find the extremely limited generics.  And everyone in that field knows this is happening and apparently no bothered by it.  Professional indeed.

    Here what burns me, they are such prix about the entire process, but when you look at the process, it's archaic, permission slips and phone calls, the two things every kid in high school has tried to fake.

    Which would be fine, but please don't act so GD rigid in a system that is anything but efficient when that systems involves human health.  I swear half the time I want to scan the script, and find a printer who will print me a box.  Not because I am trying to get something I shouldn't be, but because it would save me a lot of headaches.

    I will say this, I have never had an issue of them not filling the scripts, and my friend has a lot of them.  And living in a big city, although it's a hassle, someone will eventually help.  I can't imagine living somewhere w/o a Wallgreens or CVS every 3 blocks.

    What really sucks, if she couldn't get the scripts, I could go see a person or two and get her something similar in no time flat. That system is far more efficient and the hours far more conclusive to my lifestyle.  

    They ask me how many I want, maybe even toss in a couple bonus to a loyal customer from time to time.  No lab coat, no permission slips, no faux-professionalism, no dumb questions, and no hassles, just the stuff that I want.  And if I run out tomorrow, although not free, refills are just a call away.  And for a Jackson, I can have it delivered.

    Parent

    Not everyone can take (5.00 / 2) (#86)
    by the capstan on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 03:23:32 PM EST
    the meds often prescribed.  My son winds up in the er; my daughter becomes full-blown psychotic, and my aunt went totally nuts with one med, and my mother wound up in a locked ward for awhile. Personally, I think the anti-psychotics are too easy to get and are often prescribed indiscriminately.  Doctors and druggists simply don't take time to listen--after I told a doctor I can't take narcotics,I was given hydrocodone.  I am willing to believe some people enjoy the sensation, but I do not.

    Parent
    Josh has had so many surgeries though (none / 0) (#103)
    by Militarytracy on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 05:36:55 PM EST
    and had so many anesthetics and opioids in the past there is no reason to think he will have any difficulty taking this.  And his doctor knows this and has his whole medical history on file, the pharmicist does not.  

    Parent
    My very best wishes (none / 0) (#111)
    by the capstan on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 09:25:55 PM EST
    for Josh!  His doctor knows best, for sure.  But I am always surprised at the number of doctors who are willing to prescribe the heavy stuff--and do not listen when you say no.  My mother had permanent brain damage--and my son won't go to a doctor because he's afraid of what might happen.  There is scary stuff out there.

    Parent
    This is a particular (none / 0) (#115)
    by gyrfalcon on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 10:56:12 PM EST
    problem with both frail elderly and very small kids.  Too often, they prescribe the regular adult dose, which is calibrated to adult men, and it's way too much for either very young or very old.

    My mother became a flagrant paranoid schizophrenic when the hospital gave her a full dose of Vicodin post-surgery, and the only thing that saved her from the permanent cognitive damage this can apparently cause is that she was so paranoid, she wouldn't take anything the hospital gave her and the stuff washed out of her system in about three days.

    I've since heard dozens of stories of similar things happening to elderly people with this drug.


    Parent

    He's never taken xanax before, though? (none / 0) (#118)
    by Towanda on Sat Aug 13, 2011 at 09:19:41 AM EST
    Then do read the detailed side-effects info, completely and carefully, and watch him.

    It's unlike any other drug, it seems.

    Parent

    He has taken valium (none / 0) (#123)
    by Militarytracy on Sat Aug 13, 2011 at 01:00:33 PM EST
    It is related.  He is given a dose right before going into the operating room, and he has to take a dose to have dental work done because due to his genetic disorder his mouth is very small.  When he is knocked out his dentist then has to clamp his mouth open to work on his back teeth.  It is terrible, but it is what we have to do to keep him healthy.  Rotten teeth are a horrible health destroyer and because his mouth is even more confined than ours is his dental decay problems are more severe.

    And Josh's doctor knows he has taken valium at times since he was three years old.  It disturbs how everyone wants to accuse Josh's doctor of some kind of negligence or lack of knowledge in this discussion.


    Parent

    Not at all -- (none / 0) (#125)
    by Towanda on Sat Aug 13, 2011 at 01:34:40 PM EST
    just concerned.  I've had great docs who prescribed meds that ought to have been just fine for me and mine, too, but had awful side effects.

    And a young relative given xanax was one of those.

    For my mom, it was valium.  So I'm glad that it works well for your son, and that it's related to the xanax, so that indicators are good for him.  

    Parent

    I really worry about the demonization (none / 0) (#126)
    by Militarytracy on Sat Aug 13, 2011 at 02:45:22 PM EST
    of legal prescribed narcotic drugs.  My first reason for worry is for my son and the loss of quality of life for him.  His dentist uses Versed ALL THE TIME on young children having extensive dental work because he said the worst thing you can do to someone is give them dental nightmares from their childhood.  It often prevents them from caring for their teeth properly and seeing a dentist regularly.

    The second reason is that narcotics appear to be the ONLY drug we have on hand to treat PTSD.  I should probably say prevent PTSD. PTSD can happen to ALL OF US, not just soldiers.  All it takes is trauma and just growing up in some neighborhoods in the United States can cause some to form PTSD.

    But all these new soldiers with PTSD are fresh guinea pigs.  We had hoped that all the new SSRIs and drugs like Abilify would make PTSD treatment something we could do now.  A new report out says NO though, our soldiers that are phucked are just as phucked as if they had PTSD from Vietnam once they have it. None of those new drugs have been able to treat or improve PTSD once you have it.  One thing has worked though, a nice dose of narcotics soon after the trauma.  We are talking emotional trauma though, not traumatic brain injury and surviving concussion blasts.  That is a completely different ballgame.

    A dose of narcotics right after the trauma prevents the brain from saving the extreme memories in a form that will forever trigger fight or flight responses and give people nightmares and no REM sleep for the rest of their lives.  I think it is an important discovery and it is important for sake of the future sanity of others to understand that narcotics have life saving pluses to them too.

    Parent

    I Noticed... (none / 0) (#127)
    by ScottW714 on Mon Aug 15, 2011 at 01:47:04 PM EST
     ... the comments seem a little... not fat based.  Valium and Xanax are pretty tame.  My Vet gave me script for Valium for my dog so we cut his hair without the freakout.  He was was a street dog ready for the executioner and so pitiful looking if I didn't adopt him he would have been doomed.

    Pitiful thing, pretty sure he never spent a day indoors, and stuff just freaked him out, especially the clippers and vacuum.  20 lbs and he needed about 30mgs to remain calm, which scalled up to me would be like 330mg, or 33, 10mg pills which is the normal dosage.  

    Xanax is stronger but still one of those hard to over do it drugs.

    I can't help notice that whenever there is a drug discussion the same old tired misnomers are tossed out as fact.  Reasonable and educated people who, as in post I will never forget, was convicted that taking cocaine once would result in addiction.

    What is even more disturbing, we used to go to Mexico and buy the Valium and Xanax (zanny bars).  At the time you could bring back a months worth of each drug legally, yet one of my friends was popped at a concert with a couple Valiums and changed with possession of a dangerous drug.

    On one hand the Feds thought it was so dangerous, they allowed a person bring back a months worth, while Harris County considered a couple pills worthy of a felony.  For the record, which makes no sense, my friend got a post-prescription and the charges were dropped.

    I know this post wasn't about drug policy, but the wildly varying views are leaving people who really need them to suffer.  One doctor is open to all, prescribing to anyone that requests, then the next won't give a pill to save needless suffering.  Ditto for the pharmacists and pharmacies, it's a crap shoot, a game in which the same variables almost always end with different results.

    Parent

    Thank you for taking care of your (5.00 / 1) (#104)
    by Militarytracy on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 05:38:51 PM EST
    friend, some people need help and they are making things impossible for them and those helping them.  It is getting ridiculous IMO.

    Parent
    Get your friend connected with a Canadian (none / 0) (#110)
    by jimakaPPJ on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 08:17:25 PM EST
    pharmacy. You can fax them the RX and she will save big time on many generics.

    Parent
    is that illegal? (5.00 / 1) (#112)
    by Jeralyn on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 09:29:03 PM EST
    Please don't suggest breaking the law on this site.

    You can't fax in a prescription for many painkiller prescriptions in this country, they must be delivered and there are some prescription drugs that cannot be refilled. If Canada does it, but it's not legal here, I wouldn't recommend doing it in Canada. I'm not giving legal advice as to what's legal, just reminding people not to accept blog comments as accurate, especially on what's legal or not.

    Parent

    I don't know about pain killers (none / 0) (#122)
    by jimakaPPJ on Sat Aug 13, 2011 at 10:02:44 AM EST
    I can see why they wouldn't.

    Parent
    Jim (none / 0) (#129)
    by ScottW714 on Mon Aug 15, 2011 at 02:04:58 PM EST
    Please, the scripts my friend gets can't even be called in.  She has to pick them up from their office and they can only prescribe 30 days worth.  That is law, not doctor policy.  Controlled substances do no leave Walgreens w/o a drivers license and signature, which is law as well, but that one might be a Texas law.

    I guarantee the meds she takes are illegal to purchase from anywhere in the world and have them delivered here even with a script.


    Parent

    Just trying to help (none / 0) (#130)
    by jimakaPPJ on Mon Aug 15, 2011 at 06:02:52 PM EST
    and didn't really think about the controlled substance connection.

    But many people have none pain killer Rx filled in Canada and the meds are shipped to them in the US.

    Parent

    Scott, I've noticed Walgreen and CVS (none / 0) (#131)
    by easilydistracted on Mon Aug 15, 2011 at 08:14:30 PM EST
    require the ID in Texas when picking up one of the so-called "triplicate" scrips. I think Randalls, too. Yet, Walmart doesn't. You might tell your friend to ask the doctor to write more than 30 days. I also thought the triplicate was limited to 30 day supply. Not so, according to my doctor. He now writes it for 90 day supply, saving me two trips to his office.

    Parent
    Not Even an Option (none / 0) (#128)
    by ScottW714 on Mon Aug 15, 2011 at 01:55:08 PM EST
    Ditto with my little spiel about seeing the man.

    If you have meet a person with chronic pain, you would know the last thing they would ever attempt anything that might result in them not getting prescriptions through the current debacle.

    As a side note, she gets randomly drug tested.  Not only are they looking for illegal drugs, they test to ensure she is actually using the ones prescribed.  To me that is wrong on at least 5 levels, but it's part of the game.

    The real kicker, they test everyone the same day, and the pain doctor's office is almost exclusively old people and on testing day, the wait time is an afternoon.  I will repeat, the waiting time for people in chronic pain is hours so that the government can ensure their urine is to their liking.  

    It's GD crying shame.

    Parent

    Filling a prescription for Methylphenidate (none / 0) (#124)
    by andgarden on Sat Aug 13, 2011 at 01:17:39 PM EST
    for the first time at a pharmacy can be a bit unnerving . . .

    Parent
    Xanax (none / 0) (#71)
    by the capstan on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 01:51:40 PM EST
    can cause very unpleasant reactions when stopped.  See if he will be able to quit it while at the hospital.  At least ask specifically about its use with teens.

    Parent
    I pay a doctor and a doctor (none / 0) (#102)
    by Militarytracy on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 05:33:05 PM EST
    goes to school to make the calls on what he needs.  I can tell the doctor what is going on, and then he does what he must.  I'm not worried about the xanax, he will only be taking it briefly presurgery to stop the anxiety cycle that has him vomiting against fresh incisions and trying to travel home.  What I do worry about is when a doctor prescribes something like this and the pharmacy decides to be a doctor and say this medication should not have been prescribed and accuses the doctor and his staff about not weighing benefits.....which was what they figured would happen and we decided to get around in advance.  Do they really think that the doctor and his practitioner didn't already do that, weigh out all the known risks and benefits?  When doctors have to plan around dysfunctional pharmacists in order to get their patients what they need that isn't appropriate.  For some reason the only pharmacy doing this to Josh's doctor is Walgreens. I understand that pharmacists are supposed to warn about drug interactions but not filling prescriptions that are needed immediately and giving everyone the run around is not their call but someone around here thinks it is.

    They wouldn't fill an iron supplement that was prescribed recently I was told and they phoned Josh's doctor and told him his practitioner was incorrectly prescribing and didn't know what she was doing. They were going by the child's age though when children....particularly special needs children are prescribed by weight.  When the pharmacist found out that it was for a child based on weight they then had to be forced to apologize to everyone for what they told the patient's parents about the doctor and his staff.  But the problem with Walgreens here continues I'm told.

    Parent

    Short term use usually results in no problems. (none / 0) (#108)
    by jeffinalabama on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 07:33:11 PM EST
    When it's a "daily...as needed..." like my prescription, then one can have hives, and over-reactions. Short term, less than one month, prolly not a worry. are they .25s?

    Anything stronger is too damm strong. I only take 5s.

    Parent

    It is a half of a .25 (none / 0) (#117)
    by Militarytracy on Sat Aug 13, 2011 at 03:09:16 AM EST
    Jeezus! (none / 0) (#114)
    by gyrfalcon on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 10:52:07 PM EST
    This really sounds like something that oughta be complained about to the attorney general's office or something.  Whoever is in charge of this place is out of control.

    Parent
    Let's do this! (5.00 / 2) (#14)
    by CST on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 11:25:51 AM EST
    "Elizabeth Warren, the architect of the new Consumer Financial Protection Bureau, sent her clearest signal yet yesterday that she will challenge Republican Scott Brown for his Senate seat."

    ""If the question is `Will she run,' I think she's putting her track shoes on,'' said Tufts University political science professor James M. Glazer. "It's pretty clear.''"

    Link

    Chances of ultimately winning?  Honestly, not great.  But it's possible, and would be awesome.  I think she takes the Dem nomination hands down.  Although she'll need to raise $$$ ASAP.  And even if she doesn't win, as long as she doesn't $uck as a candidate, I think this will put her in a solid spot to run for Kerry's seat should he ultimately get the SOS job he's gunning for.

    Martha Coakley redux (1.00 / 1) (#91)
    by itscookin on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 03:50:43 PM EST
    And it will give the boyz club another woman to say "ran a bad campaign". Let one of the guys take the hit for losing to Brown.

    Parent
    Why no chance... (none / 0) (#17)
    by kdog on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 11:31:42 AM EST
    we geeks know her advocacy all too well, once the gen-pop of Mass. gets wind, I think she smokes Scotty.  People are thirsty for true representation.

    I'd be more worried about the Dem. nomination...the party might sabatoge her.

    Parent

    Citizens United (none / 0) (#19)
    by waldenpond on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 11:36:39 AM EST
    They have already made clear that they will spend whatever it takes to keep Scott and whatever it takes to defeat a Warren type.  It's a twofer.  I agree the Dems will secretly donate to Scott and refuse more than token support.

    Parent
    that's crazy (none / 0) (#38)
    by CST on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 12:41:49 PM EST
    there is every indication that it is the Dems who have been putting a lot of effort into convincing her to run.

    Ultimately they really want to win this seat back, and she has the best chance of everyone out there.  The only reason we're even having this conversation, IMO, is because of a fairly extensive recruitment effort by the local and national Dem party.  I mean she's a harvard professor who has never run for office before.  I don't think she'd have even considered this without the full party backing and recruiting her.

    Parent

    Why on earth (none / 0) (#64)
    by gyrfalcon on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 01:38:11 PM EST
    would they do that?

    Parent
    the "party" (none / 0) (#35)
    by CST on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 12:38:31 PM EST
    will not sabotage her. People have been more or less recruiting her since the current batch of candidates is less than enthusing.  The "party" wants to win.  Plus, she's not hated by the establishment, Obama did pick her to set up that agency so it's not like she's persona-non-grata.

    Plus, the local "party" is not the national "party".  We have Barney Frank... for example.

    If she runs she will get the full party backing.  But for some inexplicable reason Scott Brown is really popular.  He has kept his head down, hasn't done anything controversial, and generally tries really hard to not give liberals in MA anything to freak out over.  It's more effective than I like to admit.

    Parent

    No concern about... (5.00 / 1) (#39)
    by kdog on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 12:47:23 PM EST
    the national party dropping the hammer on the locals?

    They might like her to head some ineffectual agency as a token gesture, but the DNC doesn't want her voting on anything.  If they really were behind the E. Warren agenda she'd be our new Treasury Secretary.

    Parent

    I think (5.00 / 1) (#41)
    by CST on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 12:50:21 PM EST
    the national party can count to 50.

    Parent
    Okay (5.00 / 1) (#45)
    by CoralGables on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 12:53:00 PM EST
    it's time to cut you off from the mimosas.

    Parent
    I agree and certainly have seen (none / 0) (#119)
    by Towanda on Sat Aug 13, 2011 at 09:22:55 AM EST
    the national party, the White House, at war with a state party -- and candidates suffering for it.

    And, of course, the people suffering for it.

    See:  Walker in Wisconsin.

    Parent

    I'm not so sure about this. (none / 0) (#46)
    by dk on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 12:56:01 PM EST
    I'd like to believe it, but on the other hand the MA Democratic machine (like most political machines but perhaps more so) is often so hierarchical that I could see some current congressman try to swoop in feeling they "deserve" it and getting machine support.  My biggest fear would be Capuano.  He's a non-starter for me due to his vote for the house bill of the health insurance act that included the Stupak amendment.

    That said, though, I really do hope she runs (assuming, of course, she continues to espouse policies representing the Democratic wing of the Democratic party...if she starts bending to the national party leadership's current policy prescriptions I'll lose interest and probably stay home).

    Parent

    I actually like Capuano a lot (5.00 / 1) (#48)
    by CST on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 12:58:25 PM EST
    but we've had this one out before so I'll let that go.

    But that being said, I would have expected him to announce a while ago if he was going to run.  I think the house Dems are all sitting scared thinking that if they run for senate they will be redistricted out of a seat and they probably won't win the senate either.  So they are all digging in, hoping that someone else's seat is taken away.

    Parent

    Scott Brown (none / 0) (#81)
    by MKS on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 02:22:47 PM EST
    did vote against Kagan--that puts him in the middle of the la la land of conservatives....

     I think publicly discussing his molestation as a boy makes a difference--especially in Boston....

    And just a handful of "moderate" votes helps him too--just enought to pretend he is not a Republican.

    Also, how hard is it for a woman to win state-wide in Massachusetts?

    Parent

    Honestly? I would rather she primary Obama. (none / 0) (#24)
    by Anne on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 11:58:03 AM EST
    Bigger stage, bigger message, bigger audience, bigger donation pool.

    Could she win?  Probably not.  But she sure as hell could tap into the growing feeling - and anger - that average people have no voice.

    And, as someone Obama allegedly thought enough of to get the CFPB up and running, how does he attack her competence?

    Parent

    Why in the world do you think she would? (5.00 / 1) (#29)
    by andgarden on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 12:10:10 PM EST
    Note: that is NOT the same question as "why do you want her to?"

    Parent
    andgarden, I don't actually think she would; (none / 0) (#97)
    by Anne on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 04:02:32 PM EST
    I think it's just my yearning for a real populist voice...someome who understands that while the average person may be welcomed to the polls, whatever interest candidates have in their issues and concerns pretty much stops there.

    I think the people of Massachusetts would be well-represented by her, but I'm not sure how welcome she would be in the Senate by Dems who don't take kindly to upstarts who don't understand "the system."

    If you saw any of her testimony before the Senate, you know she knows her stuff, she doesn't suffer fools, and she doesn't back down - she's just not afraid of them or anyone.

    We need more voices like hers, that's for sure.

    Parent

    personally (5.00 / 1) (#31)
    by CST on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 12:28:27 PM EST
    I actually want her in the senate.  She doesn't have a shot in hell at being president, so I'll take her where I can maybe get her.

    And I agree with andgarden, there is no way she chooses to take that route no matter what other people want.

    Parent

    Warren in Mass. (none / 0) (#42)
    by noholib on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 12:50:28 PM EST
    Why deprive us of a great voice here in Massachusetts? How about a little experience holding office first on the state level before thinking national?:)

    Parent
    Well, on inexperience (none / 0) (#27)
    by KeysDan on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 12:04:55 PM EST
    and the lack of any voting record.

    Parent
    How manypeople (none / 0) (#30)
    by jbindc on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 12:25:38 PM EST
    outside of political junkies have even heard of the CFPB - do you think that will be a problem for her?

    Parent
    how many people (5.00 / 1) (#32)
    by CST on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 12:30:39 PM EST
    had ever heard of Scott Brown before he was senator?

    I sure hadn't.  She's got decent name recognition.  Plus the globe has been writing at least one or two articles a week about her for the last month or so.  I bet by now a lot more people know who she is.  And she was probably covered more in local papers during that whole affair than in most places.

    Parent

    Unfortunately (5.00 / 1) (#36)
    by jbindc on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 12:38:59 PM EST
    Scott Brown had going for him that he was (is) an extremely attractive man.  That alone would make people want to stop and listen to him.  There was also the interest based on the fact that it was "Teddy Kennedy's seat".

    I hope you're right about Warren - I really like her, and hope she would do it.  My fear is, she will run into the same kind of stonewalling she faced from the administration - being the junior senator from Massachusetts won't get her much power and access.

    Parent

    well i have no illusions (5.00 / 1) (#40)
    by CST on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 12:48:54 PM EST
    that she will singlehandedly fix all the problems with this administration.

    Still, it'd be nice to have another actual solid Dem in the senate, like Bernie or even Franken and Gillibrand who are also both newbies.  Get enough of them and it starts to look like an effective "wing".  Certainly better than either Scott or Kerry.

    Parent

    look! over there! (5.00 / 1) (#73)
    by The Addams Family on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 01:55:58 PM EST
    That Really Burns Me (5.00 / 1) (#79)
    by ScottW714 on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 02:13:10 PM EST
    Obama keeps playing lip service with gay marriage.  Against it all the time except when a mic is near.

    For christ sake, I just read it, the guy is Australian ?  Since when do we not want affluent Australians as citizens, apparently when they are gay.  Shameful.

    Parent

    Kevin Drum (5.00 / 2) (#94)
    by lilburro on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 03:58:56 PM EST
    makes a good point today about the GOP debate last night and the ridiculous willingness of ALL the candidates to reject a plan that included tax increases.  Even at a 10-to-1 ratio.

    This is now unshakeable dogma within the Republican Party regardless of circumstances and regardless of how it's accomplished. And yet, when the congressional super committee fails to reach agreement on a deficit reduction package later this year? It'll be a failure of "Washington," of course. Some things never change.

    No kidding.  The problem truly is with the GOP...Dems just need to wake up and highlight this.  Otherwise the cycle will continue, over and over again.

    Perhaps jeffinalabama will (none / 0) (#2)
    by oculus on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 10:03:56 AM EST
    have report today.

    Also, in my mini-breifing yesterday I forgot to mention Norway imposes a very high tax on alcohol and severely restricts amount of alcohol Norwegians may bring home from other countries.

    F*ckin' taxes and customs... (none / 0) (#3)
    by kdog on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 10:10:15 AM EST
    the scourges of the drinker and smoker:)

    Vice is like the geeky kid forever bullied in schoolyard.

    Parent

    Just makes beer brewing (none / 0) (#6)
    by Militarytracy on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 10:51:59 AM EST
    and winemaking fun.  And moonshine in this state can still be found and purchased and the amount of shining that goes on seems silly but they have at it around here.  I did hear recently that making your own beer in Alabama is illegal, but I don't know that for certain.

    Parent
    See below... (none / 0) (#8)
    by kdog on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 10:56:28 AM EST
    so many crimes ya can't keep track.

    I saw some neo-hippies drinking moonshine out a glass jar at the Vibes festival...in 105 degree heat!  I thought it might be liquid sunshine, so I had to ask, twas moonshine. Impressive.

    Parent

    I wouldn't have any in my freezer :) (none / 0) (#10)
    by Militarytracy on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 11:00:46 AM EST
    But everyone has some around here or you ain't nuthin.  I asked for a distiller though a few years ago for my bday, because you can distill other things, flower essence....  My husband said I was just going to get in trouble and he told me NO.  It isn't my fault you can make your own triple sec and such things with a distiller.

    Parent
    As it is not my fault... (5.00 / 1) (#12)
    by kdog on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 11:08:10 AM EST
    nitrous oxide canisters used to make homemade whipped cream have other more euphoric uses.

    Parent
    A great documentary about moonshine country (5.00 / 1) (#18)
    by Dadler on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 11:33:42 AM EST
    About Norway (none / 0) (#101)
    by christinep on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 05:00:52 PM EST
    oculus: Where oh where are you in the Norwegian travels.  Sorry I've missed some of the updates...I love to read/hear about fjords and vistas Norwegian.

    It has been several years since my husband & I spent a few beautiful weeks along Norway's coast. It is surprising how an image of waterfalls, mist, jagged green mountains, even goat-farms dance suddenly to mind from time to time. Reverie about: Walking up that overlook hill in Alesund, the unfolding fjords, a delightul Grieg concert at his home's small concert hall surrounded by simple green leaves, and the surprises of Oslo (Vigaland, for example; oh...and the state art museum is like finding a pearl.)

    I'll watch for your journals.

    Parent

    3 Hundo... (none / 0) (#4)
    by kdog on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 10:33:06 AM EST
    for 3 cucumbers, an apple, and a tomato?

    Not your future grocery bill caused by hyperinflation, but the fine for violating federal law...I sh*t you not.

    Federal crimes...so many no one knows how many there are...literally too many to count.  Thanks Congress.

    That's an older law and pretty commonly known (none / 0) (#54)
    by nycstray on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 01:22:40 PM EST
    Haven't you heard of the beagle brigade?
    There's ag issues between certain states also. You can't ship fruit/veggies from some states to others.

    That said, they (customs) should have just tossed the items. Obviously was just for personal eating.

    Parent

    Insects, diseases, etc., (none / 0) (#62)
    by gyrfalcon on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 01:36:28 PM EST
    can come into the country even on a couple pieces of fruit for personal eating.  Sounds like they came down way too hard on these people, but I'd be very much in favor of very big signs at airports and a no-tolerance rule that fruits and veg. aren't allowed, period, even for personal eating.

    Parent
    Last flight I took (5.00 / 1) (#70)
    by nycstray on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 01:50:10 PM EST
    many people had their own food. Kind of a sticky area, since food service on planes has changed. That said, they should make sure everyone is informed. They could make in-flight announcements also.

    Napa has a campaign out right now trying to battle a non-native bug that could destroy wine crops . . . (the things you learn at the county fair!)

    Parent

    together and they all brought microwave noodles and the matron of the family just brought all 12 or so noodle containers back to the galley and used the plane's microwave. Smelled delicious!

    Parent
    Food doesn't have to include (none / 0) (#92)
    by gyrfalcon on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 03:50:58 PM EST
    fresh fruits and vegetables, though, for eating on an airplane. (Sorry, Michelle!)

    Parent
    I knew about international... (none / 0) (#63)
    by kdog on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 01:37:25 PM EST
    had no clue there were domestic restrictions as well.

    Regardless, your 2nd paragraph is spot on...common sense and common courtesy, blind adherence to the law knows neither.

    Parent

    If you drive into California, you (5.00 / 1) (#68)
    by caseyOR on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 01:47:08 PM EST
    get shunted off the interstate to an inspection area where you are asked about any fruits and veggies in your car. It used to be you had to toss any and all fruits and veggies at the checkpoint.

    The last time I made the drive down from Oregon, though, the inspectors okayed my keeping apples that had been purchased at a grocery store, but if I'd had anything homegrown or from a farmers market or a roadside stand, well, those would have had to be surrendered.

    There was a time when it was illegal to bring any plants into California. If you were moving there you had to leave your african violets and spider plants behind in your former state. Moving vans were stopped at the border and inspected. Don't know if this is still the practice.

    Parent

    Hawaii (5.00 / 1) (#72)
    by jbindc on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 01:55:36 PM EST
    When I flew back from Hawaii in 2001 (pre - 9/11), there was a Dept of Agriculture (state officer, I think), walking around the boarding area with a dog, who was randomly sniffing people's carry-ons for taking fruit (pineapples) out of the state.  That stuff had to be shipped cargo.

    Parent
    I Don't See a Problem (none / 0) (#82)
    by ScottW714 on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 02:48:30 PM EST
    There are all kinds of pests rooming American that have no predators because some dumb A didn't think the fruit rule applied to them.

    Red ants in Texas we brought in from S America, killing all the indigenous ground burrowing animals and killing local ecologies because some idiot let an infested load of produce though a port.  And they are spreading rapidly w/o a species to keep their growth in check.
    Red Imported Fire Ant

    Flying carp are getting a year out from the Great Lakes, they have decimated the ecologies in the Mississippi and Illinois rivers.  They were brought here to contain algae growth and surprise/surprise, they escaped.
    Flying Carp

    It's not like they got cavity searches, a stupid $300 fine and some embarrassment for being idiots.

    And although it's fruit, it's big deal.

    Parent

    Thanks for that report (5.00 / 1) (#85)
    by NYShooter on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 03:23:27 PM EST
    And yet, I have "winger" friends that whenever we get together have all their Limbaugh ditto talking points at the ready: "So, did you hear about that big construction job those wacko environmentalists stopped, and all those jobs lost over a stupid, one inch long rasmatuza bug?" "Can you imagine....one inch long bug, and all those jobs, and all that money.......gone!"

    To morons, who have been brainwashed to reject science, the length of a predator is the deciding factor as to its danger to indigenous plants and animals.

    Once again, Limbaugh, at $300,000,000 is underpaid.


    Parent

    Morons, wingers and ditto head talking points (none / 0) (#121)
    by Rojas on Sat Aug 13, 2011 at 09:52:11 AM EST
    All the components are there in Scott's reactionary and self righteous tirade.  The script could have been written by Limbaugh himself.

    Hell, the examples he uses in his justification for slapping this family were cases of government failure. Inadvertently in the fire ant issue and ignorantly with respect to silver carp.

    By the mid 1970s the silver carp was being raised at six state, federal, and private facilities, and by the late 1970s it had been stocked in several municipal sewage lagoons

    I recall when liberals still considered mens rea an necessary element. I think it's no coincidence that the trajectory of the wingers has tracked with the zero tolerance attitudes of those claiming to be liberals.

    Parent

    Points taken... (none / 0) (#84)
    by kdog on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 03:01:08 PM EST
    I see the reason behind such rules, and they are good reasons.  The reservation for the campsite I'll be going to states ya can't bring your own firewood because of some insect causing problems in the ecosystem.

    That being said, stray said it best, toss the fruit, mention the stuff you mention with the earning, and give them a break...there are so few to be found.

    Parent

    That bug is a really serious (none / 0) (#93)
    by gyrfalcon on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 03:55:07 PM EST
    problem.  States in the Northeast are desperately trying to stall its inevitable arrival until somebody can figure out what to do about it.  It's devastating forests west of here.  One of the prime ways it jumps distances is through firewood carried around by human beings.  You wouldn't think people would drive across three or four states to go camping with firewood in the trunk of the car, but apparently some people do!


    Parent
    Seriously... (none / 0) (#95)
    by kdog on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 03:59:57 PM EST
    its those lazy folks who buy bags of it at 7-11, and it ain't cheap!  Weird.


    Parent
    No longer are the carp a year out (none / 0) (#120)
    by Towanda on Sat Aug 13, 2011 at 09:29:56 AM EST
    as this week, they were found in inland waters in a Great Lakes state -- one where tourism is the number-one industry, already suffering from the Army Corps of Engineers' screwup of the Seaway that is dropping lake levels, already suffering from the Obama economy, and now will lose the fishermen who come from all over to the inland lakes and rivers soon to be overrun by Asian carp.

    And every fisherman has seen those youtubes of the huge Asian carp flying into boats, baring teeth.  I suspect swimming beaches will be suffering, too.

    But, of course, my Chicago continues to claim that there's no such thing there so won't take steps.

    Parent

    "Cage 'em up" Cameron... (none / 0) (#5)
    by kdog on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 10:41:27 AM EST
    is contemplating Operation Purple Rain...same tactic S. Africa used to tag anti-apartheid protestors.

    Isn't that vandalism?  Never mind, different rules different fools.

    How could getting hit with dye (none / 0) (#9)
    by Militarytracy on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 10:56:46 AM EST
    mean anything?  You could have just got stuck in the middle of it all.  How crazy, and easy to set someone up....got any purple dye or whatever the color of the day is?  It must change shade a little when you are trying to let it wear off or wash it off so would you even have to get a really good color match?  People could easily get set up by someone wishing them harm.

    Parent
    Article said... (5.00 / 1) (#11)
    by kdog on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 11:00:49 AM EST
    its a bad fit, too many bystanders mixed in...but collateral damage never stopped these clowns before, sending innocents to jail is a small price, yada yada yada.

    Parent
    In addition to shutting down social media... (none / 0) (#52)
    by Dadler on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 01:11:24 PM EST
    ...when "riots" happen.  That was the new meme from Cameron I read of.  Just like any middle east tyrant.  Why not just shut off everyone's phone and internet, scramble all walkie talkie frequencies, hell, slaughter all homing pigeons while you're at it.  

    Regular genius convention going on now, working on "solutions."  Lord help us all.

    Parent

    I Have a New Game (none / 0) (#83)
    by ScottW714 on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 02:58:49 PM EST
    Damascus or London ?

    Especially with the almost psychopathic view of social networking's role.  "Can't have a riot without Twitter", seems to be the logic.

    What really blows my mind, the right's take.  If it's unrest in the Middle East, thumbs up, unrest in the West, thumbs down.  No connection, one is people yearning for freedom, the other is drunken idiots who want free S.

    Parent

    Ron Paul droppin'... (none / 0) (#7)
    by kdog on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 10:53:43 AM EST
    foreign policy science at the Brand R debate...when you're right you're right Ron...spending trillions on senseless war and occupation, and beating the drum for yet another with Iran.  Not just stupid, but immoral.

    Now if Ron would only reference his love for liberty in regards to the undocumented, and the right to choose. But nobody is perfect:)

    From Voice of America (none / 0) (#34)
    by sarcastic unnamed one on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 12:37:40 PM EST
    The riots broke out after a still-unresolved shooting by police in a poor North London neighborhood. However, that was just the spark.

    Many Londoners initially assumed the violence was a backlash from chronic unemployment, slow economic recovery and cuts to public service spending by the country's new government.

    But there were no slogans, no chanting, no demands. And it soon became clear to many that this was something different.

    Geography Professor Chris Hamnett, of King's College, lives in North London, not far from some of the worst rioting.  

    "Essentially, what we've seen is rioting for fun and profit. This is not people expressing their anger against an oppressive state," said Hamnett. This is people thinking it would be nice to get a slice of the action."

    The riots were concentrated in neighborhoods with large African and Caribbean populations, which have a history of tension with the police.  Hamnett said those Londoners generally have less education, more unemployment and higher crime rates than other Britons.

    "There's a racial dimension to the rioting and the looting, but it's not one of racial oppression. But there is undoubtedly a quite strong class and economic element," said Hamnett.

    Not far from the professor's house, police stood guard as crews worked to clean up the damage from the previous night's rioting. Basani Mabyalane lives in the neighborhood.

    "I feel there is maybe more that could be done to empower the young people because, from what I saw yesterday, to me it looked like they don't have much to do," said Mabyalane. "They have got the time. They have got the energy. But they are using that energy on negative things."

    In the North London neighborhood of Haringey, some young people are trying to do something positive, through a group called HYPE - "Haringey's Young People Empowered." One of them is Erica Lopez.

    "To be honest, I think at the moment it's mainly to do with looting. A majority of people are just looting to loot, with no reason, just because they want to do it. Simple as that," said Lopez.



    Not for nothin'... (5.00 / 2) (#47)
    by kdog on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 12:56:50 PM EST
    Doesn't this...

    This is not people expressing their anger against an oppressive state

    Realte to this....

    This is people thinking it would be nice to get a slice of the action

    when you live in a kleptocracy?

    Parent

    You know, when I put the quote up (5.00 / 1) (#53)
    by sarcastic unnamed one on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 01:15:14 PM EST
    I knew there were different ways to interpret all that was written.

    I think the "slice of the action" referred to is a slice of the looting action. iow, "A bunch of guys are scoring some great stuff by looting, and I want to get me some of that too!"

    While some may have had the concept of "kleptocracy" or whatever in mind when they decided to go loot a store or burn it down or whatever, I think the majority were merely excited about the opportunity to steal and/or trash something and, likely, avoid any consequences.

    Parent

    Exactly... (none / 0) (#55)
    by kdog on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 01:23:35 PM EST
    look at all that sh*t the grifters and got from looting the nation, I want mines too!

    Or more in line with your interpretation, the "excitement" factor is the same reason people take the Series 7...an exciting opportunity to get rich burning and looting.

    Parent

    Well, again, I find it hard to believe, (none / 0) (#65)
    by sarcastic unnamed one on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 01:44:57 PM EST
    outside of perhaps a tiny few, that any of them are thinking nearly as broadly as you describe.

    They see/hear of/are acquainted with people who are on the street physically looting stores for alcohol, tv's, designer-name clothes, whatever, and they decide they want a slice of that action.

    Parent

    Need not... (5.00 / 1) (#76)
    by kdog on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 02:02:30 PM EST
    even be a concious thought...maybe this brews in the subconcious of those with rage.

    We may disagree on the guesstimate percentages of those participating in the unrest, certainly some are just career thieves seizing a golden opportunity and dumb kids being dumb kids.

    Parent

    I agree (none / 0) (#69)
    by jbindc on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 01:48:36 PM EST
    I highly doubt many people are thinking this is their opportunity to "stick it to the man" (especially when they aren't hurting "the man", but rather, other poor schlebs and small business owners in their own community.

    Not to mention I doubt there's a large majority of people out their willing to do jail time for lootng or get shot with a water cannon to stick it to the man.  That'll show 'em!

    Parent

    One question (none / 0) (#96)
    by gyrfalcon on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 04:01:04 PM EST
    How often do people with jobs and homes and at least one foot on the ladder of economic security engage in rioting and looting?

    Parent
    From a charity worker to a postman to a millionaire's daughter, all appeared in courts here to answer charges over the riots that have plagued parts of England this week, a media report said on Thursday.

    While the trouble has been largely blamed on teenagers, many of those paraded before the courts on Wednesday led apparently respectable lives, Daily Mail reported.

    [...]

    Many of those in court were young men apparently caught red-handed with stolen TVs, laptops and mobile phones worth thousands of pounds.

    They were joined by supposedly respectable professionals and tradesmen whose lawyers said they had been caught up in a 'moment of madness' as anarchy took hold of the streets.

    [...]

    A millionaire's daughter Laura Johnson, 19, was charged with stealing 5,000-pound worth of electronic goods, including a Toshiba TV, Goodmans TV, microwave and mobile phones.

    Johnson, whose father is a businessman with directorships in several companies, attended St Olave's Grammar School in Orpington, fourth best performing state school in Britain.

    She was granted bail on condition that she must wear an electronic tag and does not associate with the two men allegedly found with her.

    Charity worker Barry Naine, 42, who works for a St Mungo's homeless hostel in Lewisham, appeared in court charged with burglary. He is accused of breaking into Primark in Peckham and was remanded in custody, the newspaper said.

    Postman Jeffrey Ebanks, 32, and his student nephew Jamal Ebanks, 18, were allegedly caught in a car stuffed with electrical goods near a looted Croydon superstore.



    Parent
    As commentators debate at length over the reasons behind the unrest, four teenagers who looted goods from various shops during the days and nights of mayhem in London, audaciously called it a "shopping spree" on Friday.

    The police have arrested over 1,000 people for the riots, but Sky News spoke to four teenagers who covered their faces while speaking on camera, and admitted to looting electronic and other goods from shops.

    Speaking on condition of anonymity, the teenagers aged 16 or 17 said their chances of not being arrested were 'pretty good'. They were shown speaking before cameras on the bank of the Thames in London.

    [...]

    They claim they used a transit van to move between different boroughs and grabbed so many different items that the van was filled several times over and emptied between their sprees, Sky News reported.



    Parent
    If you think none of the looters (none / 0) (#98)
    by sarcastic unnamed one on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 04:19:13 PM EST
    had jobs and homes, think again.

    Parent
    Cameron (none / 0) (#113)
    by Politalkix on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 10:01:23 PM EST
    Yep (none / 0) (#37)
    by jbindc on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 12:39:50 PM EST
    Today's PGA Update (none / 0) (#50)
    by CoralGables on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 01:03:33 PM EST
    He who shall not be named has moved up 13 spots in the standings without taking a club out of the bag. Early line says he needs to be 3 under par today to be welcomed back tomorrow. Thus far there are 48 more players over par for the day than under. It's the type of day that kills pros and makes the duffer smile.

    The leader Steve Stricker tees off in about 20 minutes.

    Stricker is due (none / 0) (#51)
    by Dadler on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 01:09:02 PM EST
    It feels like his time to me, feels like a nice follow up to fellow 40-something Darren Clarke capturing the Open Championship last month.  But never doubt a young gun to swoop down and take one.  Go Strick (or any other, um, geezer).

    Parent
    New Co-Leader (none / 0) (#87)
    by CoralGables on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 03:32:41 PM EST
    Adam Scott. The media is going to love this.

    Stricker 2 over thus far on the day. Scott is 4 under.

    Parent

    Eleventh Circuit (none / 0) (#56)
    by jbindc on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 01:24:10 PM EST
    Rules individual mandate of the ACA is unconstitutional.

    (I can't get the opinion to come up on my 'puter right now).

    More (none / 0) (#58)
    by jbindc on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 01:27:36 PM EST
    From Volokh:

    The 11th Circuit Court of Appeals has just issued a 2-1 ruling striking down the individual mandate in a suit brought by 26 state governments, the National Federation of Independent Business, and others. This is the first court of appeals decision striking down the mandate, and creates a circuit split with the recent Sixth Circuit decision going the other way. The opinion is available here. It's easily the most important victory for the anti-mandate side so far.

    Significantly, Judge Frank Hull, a Clinton appointee has now become the first Democratic-appointed judge to vote to strike down the mandate, balancing Republican Sixth Circuit Judge Jeffrey Sutton who voted to uphold it. The decision further undermines claims that the individual mandate suit is a sure loser that goes against a supposed expert consensus that the mandate is clearly constitutional.



    Parent
    Go-go-go (none / 0) (#66)
    by TeresaInSnow2 on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 01:45:13 PM EST
    Rah-rah-rah!

    Please, please, please, strike it down.  Please!  

    Parent

    So, now we have a split in the Circuits (none / 0) (#88)
    by christinep on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 03:37:49 PM EST
    Today's from the 11th & the earlier affirmation from the 6th. Expect en banc decisions this fall.

    A factoid? I recall reading that the chief author of the 2 to 1 decision today has a daughter who is a legislator who openly campaigns against the ACA & wants its repeal. If that is accurate, that would be most "fascinating."

    Parent

    11th. Court of Appeals (none / 0) (#59)
    by MO Blue on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 01:28:30 PM EST
    rules individual mandate in Obama's health insurance legislation is unconstitutional.

    ATLANTA (AP) -- A federal appeals court panel on Friday struck down the requirement in President Barack Obama's health care overhaul package that virtually all Americans must carry health insurance or face penalties.

    The divided three-judge panel of the 11th Circuit Court of Appeals struck down the so-called individual mandate, which is considered the centerpiece of the law, siding with 26 states that had sued to block the law. But the panel didn't go as far as a lower court that had invalidated the entire overhaul as unconstitutional.

    Government attorneys can -- and likely will -- ask the full 11th Circuit to review the panel's ruling. They also can appeal to the U.S. Supreme Court, which many legal observers expect to have the final say on the issue. link



    Great minds :) (none / 0) (#60)
    by jbindc on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 01:29:19 PM EST
    Sao Sarc... (none / 0) (#61)
    by kdog on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 01:34:23 PM EST
    the junky theft story real quick, moved to more appropriate open thread.

    Roomate throws a little shindig, lets an obvious junky dirtbag in the house with the other guests, dude lifted some cash off my dresser.  More p*ssed at my roomate than the thief, he shoulda known better.  And p*ssed at myself for leaving cash laying around.

    Took it all out on the junky thief's junky pad when I attempted to retrieve the loot, which was in his arm or down his throat by then...dumb thing to do, but satisfying:)  Very out of character for me, but the principle ya know...water under the bridge now, never seen the guy since.

     

    Sorry to hear, glad no one got hurt. (none / 0) (#67)
    by sarcastic unnamed one on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 01:46:45 PM EST
    Just a funny story now... (none / 0) (#74)
    by kdog on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 01:58:07 PM EST
    "remember when kdog went apesh*t and trashed that mofo's crib".

    They'll never let my usual "never hurt a fly" arse forget it...I am proud of myself for not cracking the dude's dome, good sense showed up in the nick of time...I might be commenting from the prison library if I had:)

    Parent

    Hey, aren't you the guy who claims to be a (none / 0) (#78)
    by vml68 on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 02:09:31 PM EST
    lover not a fighter. I thought I knew you.... :-)!

    Parent
    I thought I did too... (5.00 / 1) (#80)
    by kdog on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 02:14:36 PM EST
    I do not recognize that guy that day now...first, err second, time I raised an angry hand since junior high.

    Parent
    For Kdog and the pirate crew (none / 0) (#89)
    by Yman on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 03:41:05 PM EST
    Not sure who's the captain in that crew, but thought this would be up your alley.

    Accused Massachusetts Pirate Was Looking For A Party.

    Captain Casey Swashbuckle... (none / 0) (#90)
    by kdog on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 03:47:57 PM EST
    out of Portland is our Captain, the finest on all the seven seas.

    And it seems a most reasonable defense, I mean who hasn't accidentally stumbled onto the wrong party boat under the skull and bones, quite a common error in pirate circles...we're party people.

    Parent

    They certainly wouldn't be the first (none / 0) (#106)
    by caseyOR on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 06:59:36 PM EST
    pirates to stumble onto the wrong boat.

    The article doesn't say, but I hope they apologized for their error and offered a bottle of rum, the polite thing to do, to the sailboat owners.

    Even the best of pirates goes off course on occasion, but an acknowledgment of the error and a sincere apology go a long way to resolving any upset feelings. :-)

    Parent

    Jimmy Buffett (none / 0) (#107)
    by CoralGables on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 07:11:15 PM EST
    has maintained this is why he keeps his seaplane and sailboat stocked with CD's and t-shirts. You just never know when some swag may be necessary.

    Parent
    And just think (none / 0) (#116)
    by NYShooter on Fri Aug 12, 2011 at 11:05:27 PM EST
    If one of those candidates just had the ba!!s to break out and say , "Are you CRAZY?? Ten to one? Where do I sign? My fellow Americans, do you hear what they're saying? Imagine your employer saying to you, give me 10 minutes more a week of your work and I'll pay you an extra hundred dollars? And these 9 nuts say NO?  Do want them representing you?

    Not one.