Sunday Evening Open Thread

By Big Tent Democrat, Section Blog Related
Posted on Sun Dec 11, 2011 at 06:27:11 PM EST
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Teeeeeeebooooooooowwwwwwwwwwww!!!!

Open Thread.

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Sunday Evening Open Thread | 129 comments (129 topical)

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Whatever Denver pays Matt Prater... (5.00 / 2) (#10)
by desertswine on Sun Dec 11, 2011 at 07:12:12 PM EST

it's not enough.

High altitude in Denver (none / 0) (#15)
by MKS on Sun Dec 11, 2011 at 07:23:38 PM EST

Ball goes further.

Parent

It goes farther (5.00 / 1) (#32)
by rdandrea on Sun Dec 11, 2011 at 09:07:25 PM EST

For both teams.

Parent

Yep, and it did today (none / 0) (#34)
by MKS on Sun Dec 11, 2011 at 09:15:34 PM EST

Three field goals over 50 yards....

But the key feature is that Tebow is closer to heaven when he plays in Denver....because of its higher altitude. Anyone ever think of that?

Could explain it.

But Tebow is just a rookie, and if Elway & Co can teach him to take less than 5 seconds for his wind-up, then watch out. Tebow has everything else.

Parent

No... (5.00 / 1) (#51)
by ks on Sun Dec 11, 2011 at 11:05:10 PM EST

Tebow is not a rookie.

Parent

Six (none / 0) (#38)
by CoralGables on Sun Dec 11, 2011 at 09:25:25 PM EST

fourth-quarter comeback victories in 11 career starts is a new NFL record since the merger. Sadly, the record he broke was held by two relative unknowns in Scott Brunner and Marc Wilson (both had five)

Parent

Sadly? (none / 0) (#49)
by ks on Sun Dec 11, 2011 at 11:02:49 PM EST

That's the whole point. It's a fluke "NFL record/stat".

Parent

Wondering if that's how Trevor feels (none / 0) (#52)
by oculus on Sun Dec 11, 2011 at 11:11:06 PM EST

about Rivera breading Trevor's "saves" record, previously held by Lee Smith.

Parent

Seriously? (none / 0) (#53)
by ks on Sun Dec 11, 2011 at 11:16:26 PM EST

You're comparing the all time saves record which denotes a significant long tern career achievement to a bogus and arbitrary "record" like "the number of 4qt comebacks in the first 11? (why 11 vs 12 or 13 or 14, etc.) career starts? Really? C'mon now...

Parent

: Forgot to mention I'm not a football fan. (none / 0) (#55)
by oculus on Sun Dec 11, 2011 at 11:33:20 PM EST

Parent

From my own blog tonight (none / 0) (#41)
by rdandrea on Sun Dec 11, 2011 at 09:34:35 PM EST

In the postgame show after the Broncos' 13-10 victory over the Chicago Bears, quarterback Tim Tebow thanked his Lord and Savior for the Broncos' victory.
I'd also like to thank Tebow's Lord and Savior for the victory. But just in case there's anyone who Tebow forgot in the adrenalin rush of a post-game interview, I'd also like to thank Wesley Woodyard for forcing a Chicago fumble in overtime. And Elvis Dumervil for recovering it. And Matt Prater for kicking the winning field goal.
In case Tebow forgot, you know?
Maybe this week I'll go to St. Joe's and light a candle for the Broncos to be ahead at halftime for a change.
Just in case Tebow's Lord and Savior is listening.

Parent

If you're going to quote (5.00 / 1) (#42)
by CoralGables on Sun Dec 11, 2011 at 09:39:01 PM EST

give the entire thing so you don't look so foolish to those that actually listened.

Parent

I don't believe in blog-whoring (none / 0) (#43)
by rdandrea on Sun Dec 11, 2011 at 09:40:35 PM EST

You'll just have to make do with the quote.

Parent

Well here you go (5.00 / 1) (#45)
by CoralGables on Sun Dec 11, 2011 at 09:46:58 PM EST

the rest of the statement so you don't mislead terribly going forward.

"and after that I want to thank my teammates and my coaches. I want to thank Coach Fox and the coaches for giving me the opportunity and believing in me for the entire game, and for the defense for keeping us in it, and my receivers and offensive line who at the end of the game made me look a lot better than I really am."

Parent

I think it would be nice (none / 0) (#50)
by NYShooter on Sun Dec 11, 2011 at 11:04:19 PM EST

if Tebow thanked his Lord for the opportunity to play, or keeping him/them healthy, or something along those lines....not for a victory.

It would also be smart PR, and help take some of the negativity some folks express towards him.

I listened tonight to see if I could catch his exact words. While he didn't specifically say he thanked J.C. for the victory, from the context of the reporter's question, and the manner in which Tebow expressed his "thanks" I can see where it could be interpretted as thanking God for the Win.

Could be wrong.

Parent

: How do you know he doesn't? (none / 0) (#91)
by jbindc on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 10:53:45 AM EST

Parent

For whatever reason, (none / 0) (#39)
by Amiss on Sun Dec 11, 2011 at 09:27:30 PM EST

He kicks arse, and I saw a young QB give him the credit, too. How often does a Tom Brady do that? I have to pull for Timmeh cuz I was born and bred to be a Gator, but there is just something "special" about him that seems to have him give the credit to the players their due. He seems to "know" he wouldnt be anything without them and in his way, he tries to let everyone else know it too.

Parent

Some days (5.00 / 3) (#37)
by Edger on Sun Dec 11, 2011 at 09:21:24 PM EST

I wonder if maybe the human race just doesn't have what it takes to make it, after all...

It's probably wrong, but that (5.00 / 1) (#62)
by sj on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 12:52:59 AM EST

made me laugh really hard. All by myself, here in front of the computer.

Parent

: you are not alone - lolsob (5.00 / 1) (#64)
by The Addams Family on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 12:57:27 AM EST

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: Could have been worse I suppose (none / 0) (#68)
by Edger on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 04:43:06 AM EST

He could have been paneled to death? ;-)

Parent

Nihilism does seem to be going (none / 0) (#66)
by MKS on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 01:23:12 AM EST

around.

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Nihilists! (5.00 / 2) (#71)
by kdog on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 08:37:33 AM EST

Nihilists! F*ck me. I mean, say what you like about the tenets of National Socialism, Dude, at least it's an ethos.

Parent

thanks, dude (5.00 / 1) (#138)
by jeffinalabama on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 03:45:11 PM EST

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Is this from Big L? (5.00 / 1) (#139)
by oculus on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 03:52:04 PM EST

Parent

: yup! (5.00 / 2) (#140)
by CST on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 03:57:06 PM EST

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Tebow, the GWB of Football (5.00 / 0) (#76)
by ScottW714 on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 09:39:04 AM EST

I forget the famous GWB saying, something, something of low expectations.

I'm glad they beat they beat the Bears, but:

They weren't the only team to make an amazing 4th quarter/OT comeback, but they are the only ones getting the press.
They aren't the only team to with an 8-5 record or better, around 10, but the only ones getting the press.
They aren't the only team with a 6 game winning streak, but they are the only ones getting the press.
They aren't the only ones who might win their division, several have wrapped it up, but they are the ones getting the press.
They aren't the only team to win a game they were favored to win, some teams actually pulled upsets, but of course they are the only ones getting the press.

The comeback was amazing, a delight for any fan, especially one who hates the Bears as much as your truly. But the Giants pulled off nearly the same impossible feat, maybe even more unbelievable one, and the Texans did it with the 3rd string QB. Yet all I hear today on the radio is Tebow this and Tebow that.

If they finish with 10 wins, they will will surely suck up all the oxygen.

Low expectations indeed...

: Bingo. (none / 0) (#87)
by ks on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 10:38:10 AM EST

All of that times 10000....
I guess "we've never seen anything like this before" if we simply ignore the many other times we've seen things like it before.
As you point out, what made Sunday's hype particularly wild was that just a few hours earlier we watched a 3rd string QB lead a team to a Division Title with a last second TD drive but, if you don't like one-off comparisons, just a few hours later we watched a team score 2TDs, a 2Pt conversion and block a last second FG (on a second try!) in the last 5 minutes to win a game on the road. The QB of that team completed his 5th 4QT comback of the year, has the 2nd highest paaser rating in the 4QT and is now tied with his brother and, imo, the greatest QB ever - Johnny U - for the most 4QT TD passes in a season. But, it's all Tebow all the time even to the point of NY Times Op-Ed pieces.
To me what's especially interesting is hearing ALL of the announcers (FOX, CBS, NBC, ESPN, Yahoo, etc.) brazenly lie about never seeing anything like "Tebow Magic". For example, ALL of them watched Doug Flutie who was a better QB than Tebow will ever be. They watched "Flutie Magic" "just win" at Boston College and onto the Heisman Trophy then to multiple championships in the CFL where he was arguably the greatest QB or player ever then to the NFL where he became a Pro Bowler.
They watched all this from a guy who, physically, makes Dree Brees look like Hulk Hogan amd was drafted as the 285th pick in the 11th round, but yet are yapping on the TV about "never seeing anything like this before" when it comes to Tebow. Right....

Parent
: Heh..it's not just you (none / 0) (#96)
by ks on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 11:07:25 AM EST

Chris Berman can go away now and, among others, take Stuart Scott and the horrible Skip Bayless with him.
High wire act is a good way of putting it.

Parent
: I Like It... (none / 0) (#122)
by ScottW714 on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 01:42:26 PM EST

...maybe "Mile High Wire Act"...

Parent

Tebow (none / 0) (#1)
by PatHat on Sun Dec 11, 2011 at 06:34:30 PM EST

I guess he really IS for real. MVP! MVP!

Marian Barber, (none / 0) (#2)
by NYShooter on Sun Dec 11, 2011 at 06:39:19 PM EST

27 carries, 107 yards, scored go-ahead touchdown in 4th.

Fumbled ball, Broncs go on to win.

Now, let's all whip'em out and use Barber as a fire hydrant.

He doesn't feel bad enough

fools

I waited to post over here (none / 0) (#26)
by NYShooter on Sun Dec 11, 2011 at 08:15:39 PM EST

rather than the other thread specifically to not single you out, Donald.

Every fan is certainly entitled to express themselves any way they wish. In my personal sports history, having been in Tebow's current position, and, of course,in Barber's, it was considered pretty bush-league to dump on a guy who had a bad episode.

But that's athletes. Fans get a freer hand to enjoy a game any way they want to.

No offense meant, just hit a temporary sensitive chord.

Parent

Well, hard to believe but we actually (none / 0) (#103)
by jimakaPPJ on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 12:18:06 PM EST

agree on something. Must be yesterday's full moon.

On Barber's going out of bound, many football fields have a crown to aid in water being run off. Thus when you near the sideline the slope is towards out of bounds. I have never paid any attention to that in pro stadiums, just always assumed it was there. And while it doesn't excuse him not knowing and just falling down, it may have been that he meant to but his momentum was just too great.

Parent

Hey, a threesome! (none / 0) (#120)
by NYShooter on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 01:30:13 PM EST

a first! Let's not make it a habit.

I agree with everything said in these few comments, but in all the years I've followed sports, what Barber did is very common. How many times does a back catch a short pass for a first down in the critical last minutes of a game? And, with the game on the line, that back's assignment: just get a first down. 10 yards. Period. 11, 12, or 13 doesn't help any more than ten. And, how many times does that back struggle for that extra yard, after crossing the ten yard marker, only to fumble the ball, or have it knocked out of his hands?

Ask Kdog, as a gambler, I've knocked my head into semi-unconsciousness more than a few times at some of those dumb ass, worthless plays. Or a receiver, with the game already won, and the team playing out the clock, doesn't just catch the safe pass, but has to fight for that extra worthless yard, or two, and, naturally lose the ball?

My point was, this wasn't the dumbest play in history, happens all the time. And, even though I got a scholarship to pitch at a major sports university, my respect for the pro-players I've had the good fortune to mess around with just humbles me so that I can't bring myself to criticize them (in a mean spirited way) when they occasionally screw up.

They are not like you and me. They are truly in a class all alone.

Parent

Your Being Cheeky, Right ? (none / 0) (#130)
by ScottW714 on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 02:42:45 PM EST

But since you brought it up, the old Texas Stadium's crown was the highest in the NFL, so high, something like 24" that people would complain that it was an unfair advantage. And since Barber played there most of his career, he should have no issues with other less crowned stadiums.

That mistake to me was a dumb as someone not going out of bounds when they should. But barber's teammates should have mentioned that in the huddle, not just for him, but so everyone was on the same page should something funky happen, "stay in bounds no matter what".

And it was a lunar eclipse yesterday.

Parent

: But the lunar eclipse (none / 0) (#132)
by Zorba on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 03:07:27 PM EST

was on Saturday. (Photos here.) Obviously, the effects of a total lunar eclipse are powerful and not at all transient. ;-)

Parent
: exactly (none / 0) (#135)
by NYShooter on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 03:14:51 PM EST

"stay in bounds no matter what".
Like I said, you see these dopey things all the time, whether football, baseball, basketball, whatever. I catch myself screaming "You're Professionals!!! Even I wouldn't do a dumb thing like that, but the beat goes on and on, year, after year, after year.

Parent

Hey, there are few Bears that have (none / 0) (#72)
by ruffian on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 08:55:15 AM EST

not made the big mistake in games this year. I'm sure his teammates are sympathetic. Everyone else should leave him alone too.

Parent

You win as a team (none / 0) (#75)
by jimakaPPJ on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 09:34:06 AM EST

You lose as a team.

Anybody who has ever played knows that.

Parent

P.S. (none / 0) (#3)
by NYShooter on Sun Dec 11, 2011 at 06:42:09 PM EST

P.S.

Hat tip to Mr. Tebow

"Enjoy it, you earned it, you deserve it."

A fan

Great quote from a sports website.... (none / 0) (#4)
by ks on Sun Dec 11, 2011 at 06:56:09 PM EST

Tim Tebow is amazing. He causes guys (Marion Barber) to run out of bounds when they just need to stay in to burn clock. He makes 58 yard field goals (Mike Prater). He forces fumbles (Wesley Woodyard) when the opponent is about to score. He leads offenses that win in overtime with less than 20 points.

The ride has been amazing and enjoyable from a fan perspective and it looks like the Broncos will win the bad division but the Pats are going to put it on them next week.

Eh. (none / 0) (#18)
by Addison on Sun Dec 11, 2011 at 07:25:49 PM EST

Broncos have a stronger strength-of-schedule than 13/16 AFC teams. Only Jacksonville, Indy, and Oakland have tougher schedules so far. 8-5 is pretty good no matter how you slice it. If you want to downplay Tebow's role in their 7-1 run to playoff contention by quoting sarcastic and selective put-downs, it's your choice. But they were 1-4 before Tebow, 7-1 after.

Probably the Patriots will win because of their style of play: they can rack up so many points that their defense hardly has to do anything. Oh well. The Raiders just have to lose too (vs. Detroit) and Denver's all good.

Parent

Stop drinking the koolaid. (none / 0) (#21)
by ks on Sun Dec 11, 2011 at 07:34:40 PM EST

Stating key facts is hardly engaging in selective put downs. The sequence of events that took place for Denver to win was pretty remarkable. I understand why the media is doing the Tebow magic thing as its good for ratings but anybody who has watched football for awhile and tries to pretend that there's never been a "Cardiac Kids" type team before who plays over their heads and win a stretch of games in improbable ways is kidding themselves.

Parent

Eh, part 2... (none / 0) (#29)
by Addison on Sun Dec 11, 2011 at 08:34:19 PM EST

...the thing you quoted was just sour grapes, more concerned with what terrible analytics mistakes people are supposed making on Twitter than the transcendentally entertaining games. It's a sad quote because it shows that the person is so intent on being miserable that they're willing to pretend that anyone actually thinks Tebow caused the fumble or kicked those field goals. Enjoy what's enjoyable, don't look for reasons to get pissed off. Tebow makes the games fun, the quarterback usually gets credit for leading the team even if others got the game-winning points, so whatever. Focus on what you want to focus on, I guess.

Parent

Haters gonna hate (none / 0) (#30)
by Big Tent Democrat on Sun Dec 11, 2011 at 08:37:41 PM EST

Parent

"[T]ranscendentally entertaining." (none / 0) (#33)
by oculus on Sun Dec 11, 2011 at 09:07:57 PM EST

Wow.

Parent

Yup... (none / 0) (#35)
by Addison on Sun Dec 11, 2011 at 09:16:00 PM EST

...meant exactly that, too! Taken out of the world of reason and comprehension and causality and into some sort of parallel universe where the only thing that matters is what makes the best sports narrative. Can't think of a better word than transcendent to describe the sort of entertainment it's been.

Parent

I apply that first word to a really fine (none / 0) (#36)
by oculus on Sun Dec 11, 2011 at 09:18:38 PM EST

classical music performance.

Parent

Not sure what you're getting at here. (5.00 / 1) (#40)
by Addison on Sun Dec 11, 2011 at 09:33:26 PM EST

If classical music performances are more transcendent for you than a football game, that's fine. Better than fine -- some people aren't lifted up by anything at all, and it's always good to have something that can lift you out of everyday muck.

But if you think that is not a subjective feeling on you part which one speaks to you, or that one form of cathartic entertainment is objectively more transcendent or something, well, God bless you heart man...

Parent

: Different strokes. I do heart Tebow. (none / 0) (#46)
by oculus on Sun Dec 11, 2011 at 09:49:24 PM EST

Parent

"transcendentally entertaining" (none / 0) (#61)
by sj on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 12:47:40 AM EST

What a lovely idea. I hope I remember that. The last time I was transcendentally entertained was by Cirque du Soliel's Quidam. Perfect description.

Parent

Eh nonsense (none / 0) (#48)
by ks on Sun Dec 11, 2011 at 10:59:40 PM EST

What I quoted was fact. You're bothered because you're caught up in the silly hype. "Transcendental? LOL!

OMG, did you just see the "Eli Manning Magic"? I guess sine he's done it so many times before it's not "transcendental".

Parent

Think what you want... (5.00 / 1) (#54)
by Addison on Sun Dec 11, 2011 at 11:31:55 PM EST

...but if a football fan (save for Chicagoans) watched the Denver/Chicago game, saw the end of that game, and was more focused on the idea that someone, somewhere was misattributing credit for the win to Tebow than with the finish? I would pity that person, not quote them. Again, it's a personal choice.

And what you quoted wasn't fact. Not in any way. It was a series of sarcastic lies meant to act as an absurd comedic straw man for people the author had a problem with. Why are you saying it was fact?

Anyway, am I caught up in the silly hype? Maybe, "silly hype" is subjective and so is whether or not a person is "caught up" in it (though I think Tebow will lose next week and that he'll drift back down toward .500 as he plays). So you can accuse and condemn people based on your opinion how you want. But yeah, I found the game "transcendentally entertaining". I find a lot of sports games and narratives transcendentally entertaining. The US Women's Team at the World Cup is a great recent example. I'm not sure what you're hoping to accomplish by mocking that.

And, by the way, I loved watching the Giants/Dallas game to the extent that a Redskins fan can love watching a game where one of those teams will necessarily win.

Anyway, you should find something to like about football so you can stop commenting about what you hate about it.

Parent

Oh please you are all over the place... (none / 0) (#56)
by ks on Sun Dec 11, 2011 at 11:47:56 PM EST

Stop....of course when all else fails the "hater" or haterz" card get pulled out. Stating that Barber didn't run out of bounds, and fumbled as he was breaking free to ice the game in OT(credit to the Denver defense) and the Denver FG hit clutch bomb FGs (Hi Cowboys!) are not facts but are "sarcastic lies"? That's um...really...ridiculous. Apparently, the difference between us is that I like football AND understand it.

Actually, I'm enjoying the games but the media hype is insane. It's way over the top.

Parent

Okay. (none / 0) (#58)
by Addison on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 12:19:31 AM EST

Of course it's a fact that Barber ran out of bounds and fumbled the ball. And that Prater hit 2 game-saving and game winning field goals. And that Tebow was not on the field during those particular important plays. No one is disputing that. No one.

But you didn't quote a straight account of those facts, did you? The thing you chose to quote was in the "voice" of a straw man Tebow fan. It was designed to be false and sarcastic, to argue (through obvious and absurd misstatements) that people who like Tebow too much for the author's taste were idiots. Again, if making up a fake "idiotic" response targeting Tebow fans was someone's reaction to the Denver/Chicago game, I pity that person.

I'm glad that you can enjoy the games, but I'm sorry that the "media hype" is leading you to comment with such condescension and with such obvious anger on this site. If "media hype" is actually the problem just stop watching ESPN or whatever if it makes you like this, you know?

Parent

Wrong (none / 0) (#59)
by ks on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 12:36:38 AM EST

The quote was not false though it was sarcastic. Effectively so as you can only complain about the tone of it rather the facts it states. It was obviously "designed" to make fun of the people like you who give Tebow too much credit and are swallowing the hype whole though I can understand the hysteria from BTD since he's a Gator and from the casual sports fan. Btw, it's hilarious you put "media hype" in quotes when the media hype is blatantly obvious and spare me the lame dime store psychoanalysis of what "makes me like this". PPfftt, that's a cheap debate tactic especially for a sports debate which tend to be passionate. I mean after all you're the one going on about "transcendental experiences" not me.

Parent

: Okay. (none / 0) (#60)
by Addison on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 12:43:57 AM EST

Parent

Cardiac Kids (none / 0) (#31)
by MKS on Sun Dec 11, 2011 at 08:45:49 PM EST

From decades ago--the original version featured Dan Dierdorf and Jim Hart.

Parent

What? (none / 0) (#20)
by ks on Sun Dec 11, 2011 at 07:27:41 PM EST

I'm not a Pats fan but they have too much on offense and should play well at home. Also, your analogy doesn't make any sense in the case.

Parent

: Damn Donald, 1987 pretty Much Disolves... (none / 0) (#81)
by ScottW714 on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 10:13:58 AM EST

...the point being made, which is 'Any given Sunday', right ? Going back 24 years for an example kinda makes it seem rare, when it's not.
How about the Cards over the 49ers yesterday ? That is actually a bigger upset then if the Broncos pull one out on Sunday.
I wouldn't write off the Broncos, the 4-8, Skins damn near pulled it off against the Pats, and Denver is at home.

Parent

I don't nknow what he did today (none / 0) (#5)
by BobTinKY on Sun Dec 11, 2011 at 06:57:04 PM EST

but as a Pats fan not looking forward to next week. I don;t think Tebow matches up well against the Pats D weakness, pass defense. But the guy wins.

Let's see if Tebow magic (none / 0) (#6)
by jeffinalabama on Sun Dec 11, 2011 at 06:58:32 PM EST

can beat the Pats' skills. Having momentum doesn't hurt confidence.

Parent

Pats D is not good enough to win AFC (none / 0) (#8)
by BobTinKY on Sun Dec 11, 2011 at 07:03:54 PM EST

Parent

But their offense might be (none / 0) (#13)
by brodie on Sun Dec 11, 2011 at 07:21:20 PM EST

Not quite the D though to win it all vs either the Pack or the Saints.

Parent

Pack is back (none / 0) (#16)
by MKS on Sun Dec 11, 2011 at 07:25:12 PM EST

Can't see anyone beating them....right now....

Maybe Pats or Baltimore....

Parent

: The Ravens are easily (none / 0) (#22)
by brodie on Sun Dec 11, 2011 at 07:38:33 PM EST

the most inconsistent of the elite teams. Win one week against quality oppo then play a dog of a game the next week and lose to a mediocre team.
Imagine though if an undefeated Packer team played the Super Bowl against the Pats who would have added motivation to do unto the Pack what the G men did to them in 2007.

Parent

Well (none / 0) (#9)
by CoralGables on Sun Dec 11, 2011 at 07:03:58 PM EST

the Bears did no favors for the Pats today. By shutting down the Denver running game, Tebow put up forty passes as practice for next week.

Parent

: Tebow is underrated (none / 0) (#19)
by brodie on Sun Dec 11, 2011 at 07:25:57 PM EST

as a passer and I see him throwing for a few scores against the suspect Pats secondary. He'll need to score more than usual going up against Brady et al.

Parent

He was good late as usual (none / 0) (#7)
by ks on Sun Dec 11, 2011 at 07:02:17 PM EST

Tebow was very good in the 4QT and his receivers stopped dropping passes. He took advantage of the Bears prevent cover 2 and hit his checkdowns well. Next week is going to be quite the media week and the Pats pass d is horrid but you all have too much on offense and a good run D.

How often have I seen it (none / 0) (#11)
by brodie on Sun Dec 11, 2011 at 07:17:38 PM EST

A team gets a modest lead late and then instead of playing to win they play not to lose. Doubly stupid if you're trying that tired routine against the hottest fourth qtr comeback team and player in the league.

Merian Barber was the on-field goat while an equally culpable idiot was the Bears head coach Lovey Smith. Both should be embarrassed to get their full paychecks this week.

Parent

: Exactly right (none / 0) (#17)
by ks on Sun Dec 11, 2011 at 07:25:39 PM EST

And they didn't even need much. ONR 1st down would have probably won the game. Instead they went to the plow into the line 3 times and punt.

Parent
: Didn't you play in Hawaii against Obama? (none / 0) (#57)
by MKS on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 12:11:07 AM EST

Parent

Half time lead for Broncos? (none / 0) (#44)
by MKS on Sun Dec 11, 2011 at 09:43:47 PM EST

They wouldn't know what to do with themselves.....

But if the Broncos ever got a lead, Tebow and some running would make it very hard on the team to come back....

Armando is shilling for DK subscriptions. (none / 0) (#47)
by oculus on Sun Dec 11, 2011 at 09:51:40 PM EST

We'd better listen up.

Puccini's "La Boheme" w/Sir Thomas (none / 0) (#63)
by oculus on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 12:55:44 AM EST

Beecham conducting. Jussi Bjorling as Rudolfo and Victoria de los Angeles as Mimi. Transcendent. Quite beautiful Thank you KUSC FM.

I'm glad I was at the road production of (5.00 / 1) (#70)
by ruffian on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 07:07:18 AM EST

South Pacific instead of watching that game! Not an entirely rapturous experience- I was hoping for a larger orchestra- but better than watching the Bears lose in OT.

and yes. Lt. Cable died again too.

Parent

At Lincoln Center, people practically were (5.00 / 1) (#95)
by oculus on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 11:03:58 AM EST

humming along--except the younger generation, which seemed kind of puzzled.

Parent

Well, I certainly hummed along (5.00 / 1) (#109)
by Zorba on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 12:32:24 PM EST

Daughter Zorba had to keep poking me to get me to shut up!

Parent

My friend was discussing the sign. of (none / 0) (#123)
by oculus on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 01:58:23 PM EST

"South Pacific" to my generation because the young people next to her hadn't a clue. Not sure why they bought tickets.

Parent

My daughter bought us (none / 0) (#126)
by Zorba on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 02:03:31 PM EST

the tickets. She's in her 30's (how "young" was "young" to your friend?), she has always loved musical theater, and had been in several musicals when she was in high school.

Parent

Interesting. As I recall, they were (5.00 / 0) (#128)
by oculus on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 02:07:22 PM EST

maybe in mid-twenties. I bought my daughter (in her 30s at the time) and myself tickets to "Carousel" (my all time fave) at Lincoln Center. When Billy's daughter asks her mother if a slap can fell like a kiss, tears were streaming down my face. My daughter looked at me w/a "sheesh."

I really liked it that Hugh Jackman sang Billy's soliloquy from "Carousel."

Parent

Her love for musical theater (5.00 / 2) (#129)
by Zorba on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 02:38:34 PM EST

may be my fault. Instead of lullabies and nursery rhymes, I used to sing songs from Mary Poppins, Sound of Music, Oklahoma, The King and I, etc, etc, to the kids when they were little.

Parent

I didn't use lullabies and nursery rhymes either (5.00 / 1) (#131)
by sj on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 03:02:54 PM EST

I used pop music. I had I think 6 songs that I used pretty often. I found out just this year that my son has purchased every one of them from iTunes.

My cup runneth over.

Parent

Early conditioning (5.00 / 1) (#133)
by Zorba on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 03:09:28 PM EST

It obviously works. ;-)

Parent

I recently bought (5.00 / 2) (#134)
by CST on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 03:09:58 PM EST

A bunch of peter, paul and mary songs on itunes. The only relevancy for me is that my mom used to play them on her guitar back when she played the guitar (20 years ago or so).

The best part is I am now singing them to my nephew and my mom can't remember the words anymore. I remember all of them.

In other news, day 1 of being an aunt "I'm never having kids". Day 5 of being an aunt "keep me away from all fertile males before I start making really bad decisions due to excessive maternal emotions".

Parent

: Congratulations!! (5.00 / 2) (#136)
by NYShooter on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 03:19:05 PM EST

you couldn't do better giving your nephew a primer on all that is good and decent in life than P.P. & M.

Parent
: One of my "standards" (none / 0) (#146)
by sj on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 07:25:51 PM EST

was also Peter Paul and Mary. Love them. I guess that's not pop but folk.

Parent

I saw the (none / 0) (#78)
by Zorba on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 09:48:21 AM EST

Lincoln Center revival of South Pacific a couple of years ago, with Tony-winner Paul Szot as Emile de Becque. I loved it, and Szot was wonderful. I have the original cast recording of the first South Pacific (on vinyl)- the one with Ezio Pinza and Mary Martin. To me, Szot came awfully, awfully close to Pinza in quality.

Parent

I saw the LIncoln Center production w/ (5.00 / 0) (#94)
by oculus on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 11:03:10 AM EST

its original cast. Loved it. And the original cast vinyl recording. No one could ever successfully imitate Pinza's accent, which made me laugh.

Parent

Actually, I don't know why they (none / 0) (#107)
by Zorba on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 12:31:02 PM EST

try to imitate Pinza's accent. Emil de Becque is supposed to be French. Pinza was Italian, and was not speaking and singing with a French accent. (BTW, of all the productions I've seen over the years of South Pacific, while Szot's vocal abilities came awfully close to Pinza's, I've never seen any actress/singer come close to Mary Martin as Nellie.)

Parent

I very much enjoyed the orig. Nellie (none / 0) (#124)
by oculus on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 01:59:54 PM EST

at Lincoln Center production.

Parent

: She was very good, (none / 0) (#127)
by Zorba on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 02:04:33 PM EST

but she still didn't approach Mary Martin.

Parent

Oh my gawd, she died again!. No (none / 0) (#65)
by oculus on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 01:00:26 AM EST

wonder "Rent" was so popular.

Parent

The broncos are team clutch. (none / 0) (#67)
by redwolf on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 02:18:03 AM EST

I've never seen a team repeatedly come through in the clutch like the broncos. They looked horrible in until the 4th quarter and all of sudden passes are being caught, long field goals kicked, runners are breaking tackles and that defense, I mean holy crap I've never seen a more clutch defense in the NFL. The defensive turn overs are divinely timed and all happen exactly when you think the game is over. Even in that high scoring Minnesota game the defense pulled the rabbit out of their collective hats exactly when the broncos needed it. What ever you guys put in the teams water it's time to mass market it.

Go team Clutch.

Really bad day to be an ex-Denverite Bears fan (none / 0) (#69)
by ruffian on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 07:02:18 AM EST

I am getting no end of grief from my Colorado friends.

God never did like the Bears,even though the angel Walter did his best to get them in good with the deity.

who is this Tebow fella anyway? (none / 0) (#73)
by CST on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 09:26:51 AM EST

I guess I'll find out this weekend whether I'm a "fan" or a "hater". The only difference is, for me, the worse he plays the bigger a "fan" I'll be. The better he is, the bigger "hater" I will be. So here's hoping I'm Tim Tebow's biggest fan next week :)

: I was ignoring all this Tebow sh*t (none / 0) (#92)
by nycstray on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 11:01:04 AM EST

but now I realize I have to root for him next weekend . . . :/

Parent

All the media needs to do to break the Tebow (none / 0) (#74)
by Farmboy on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 09:30:15 AM EST

string of victories is collectively label him the next Brett Favre.

Boom. The next game he won't know which end of the football to hold. And it sometimes takes weeks to recover. Just ask Rodgers, Romo, Brady, both Mannings, et al.

Heck, the Favre curse knocked down Favre himself more than once.

Favre Factoid (none / 0) (#80)
by ScottW714 on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 09:53:29 AM EST

Who caught Favre's first official Packer pass ?
Brett Favre, it was tipped in the air and Brett Favre caught the pass for negative yards.

His first NFL toss (as a Falcon) was an interception returned for a TD. He never had a completion as a Falcon, but he did have 2 interceptions.

Until Tebow throws a last minute interception in the red zone to lose, no one will label him Favre.

Parent

All the QBs I listed were having fantastic seasons (none / 0) (#82)
by Farmboy on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 10:22:29 AM EST

until the media raised the question, Could (insert name) be The Next Brett Favre?

The question wasn't asked because they were throwing stupid interceptions, on the contrary, they were all doing well. The brain farts happened as a result of the curse.

Parent

: I Got That (none / 0) (#147)
by ScottW714 on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 10:34:29 PM EST

Just thought I would throw in a factoid, wasn't making any point, just like Favre.
Plus Tebow won't get the Favre nod until he throws an last minute interception in the red zone to lose an important game.

Parent

Up until the fourth quarter, (none / 0) (#77)
by Anne on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 09:48:17 AM EST

Chicago/Denver was a snooze-fest marked by a pathetic inability to execute - I lost count of the number of punts, as well as the number of passes that should have been caught, but were dropped, and the ones that landed at the feet of or 20 feet away from apparently invisible receivers.

So, when points finally hit the board, it was up to Chicago to (1) defend against being scored on and (2) try to extend their lead - and they did neither.

So, I saw two teams, neither of which deserved to win based on their overall level of play - wasn't Tebow 0-for-10 at one point? - and it came down to one team snatching defeat from the jaws of victory, and the other doing just the opposite. One team looked marginally better than the other until it decided to ignore the history and pattern of its opponent, and - oops - suddenly, the "W" turns into an "L."

[I think there might be a political metaphor in there somewhere...]

Yeah Tebow was lousy (none / 0) (#98)
by brodie on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 11:34:14 AM EST

in the passing department until the 4th qtr and overtime when he completed 18 of 24 passes for 191 yards as he led his team to victory from 10 pts down. Gotta credit the dude for coming through when it mattered most.

And I'm reminded of what Red Auerbach once said about how to judge the worth of statistics: "Don't tell me about his shooting percentage overall, tell me how well he shoots in the final two minutes."

Parent

Seriously...two games - make that three - (none / 0) (#102)
by Anne on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 11:54:40 AM EST

that were probably not really worth watching until the final two minutes (well, unless one of them was "your" team): Bears/Broncos, Texans/Bengals and Giants/Cowboys.

Occurs to me that for a team like the Broncos, it's dangerous to begin to believe that you will always be able to pull out a win in the final minutes - one of these days (and but for Marion Barber going out of bounds, yesterday would have probably been one of them), the clock is going to expire before they can prevail. And then, rather than all the acclaim for yet another miracle win, the talk will be about poor clock management, opportunities lost earlier in the game - all the hindsight stuff.

But, in the meantine, if nothing else it's getting interesting!

Parent

All due respect, Giants - Cowboys (none / 0) (#106)
by sarcastic unnamed one on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 12:30:56 PM EST

was back and forth the whole game with the division lead on the line. Just sayin'...

Parent

: Have to admit to not really seeing (none / 0) (#116)
by Anne on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 01:12:49 PM EST

much of Giants/Cowboys - was flipping back and forth from other shows, and I turned it off right after the Giants scored the first of their final two touchdowns to win the game.
I'll take your word for it that the quality of the football played was better!

Parent

In other (none / 0) (#79)
by CST on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 09:53:06 AM EST

one-sided football analysis.

Someone better beat the Packers ASAP.

They do NOT get to go undefeated into the post-season. That's my team's record.

Although if we ended up beating them in the Superbowl I might accept that.

Actually that's not (none / 0) (#83)
by CoralGables on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 10:29:01 AM EST

quite your team record, as the Dolphins still reside in the spot matched by no other in NFL history with a complete season of no losses and no ties.

The Pats record is the longest win streak in one season without winning a title.

Parent

I did (none / 0) (#85)
by CST on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 10:33:10 AM EST

know about the Dolphins.

But you know what I mean.

Parent

: I did know what you meant (none / 0) (#89)
by CoralGables on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 10:53:37 AM EST

was just taking a little shot :)
Actually I'm not much of an NFL fan at all and the only team I've followed prior to this year was the Pats who I think have damaged themselves with the size of Brady's contract, which helps explain their defensive woes.
Top heavy salaries to one player do serious damage in the NFL cap-era. Although to Brady's credit, he is the only player with one of the top five NFL salaries this year that right now is headed to the playoffs.

Parent

The Lions have the best shot IMO (none / 0) (#84)
by Farmboy on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 10:31:08 AM EST

between KC, Chicago, and Detroit. Especially with their new play of using the face mask to force a fumble. :-)

Parent

: As a diehard Lions fan (none / 0) (#88)
by jbindc on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 10:51:45 AM EST

I say, whatever works. :)

Parent

Only 'cause I like you I won't jump in on this. (none / 0) (#90)
by sarcastic unnamed one on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 10:53:43 AM EST

Parent

See there, you had to talk smack about Eli... (none / 0) (#110)
by sarcastic unnamed one on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 12:37:09 PM EST

HAHAHA! Really?! You are hanging your hat on an undefeated regular season when the "only" game you lost that season was the SB?!

Dear lord, there are some things you should really shouldn't say out loud...

Parent

Actually, I retract this comment. (none / 0) (#112)
by sarcastic unnamed one on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 12:48:30 PM EST

You really weren't talking smack about Eli, I read it too fast. Sorry!

Parent

hah! (none / 0) (#114)
by CST on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 01:07:41 PM EST

hanging my hat - no.

I'll just say - I feel a lot differently about that season now than I did back than. And I'd probably feel waaay differently about it if the Patriots hadn't already won 3 superbowls.

But there was something special about that team that year, even though they lost the superbowl. And I don't want to share.

No, I wasn't talking trash about Eli, just poking fun about the fact that he gets no love.

Parent

I'm sure that's why (none / 0) (#118)
by CST on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 01:25:15 PM EST

after they cracked down on it the Pats went 18-1.

In other news, some MLB players used steroids.

Parent

You mean, Tom "hey, ref, these guys (none / 0) (#119)
by Anne on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 01:27:44 PM EST

are being mean to me!" Brady?

Immensely talented, but exhibits much too much entitlement to penalties being called if opposing teams so much as breathe on him - worse, he often gets them, as he did yesterday.

Parent

he sure is pretty though :) (none / 0) (#121)
by CST on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 01:34:24 PM EST

Parent

I had a room mate like him (5.00 / 1) (#137)
by NYShooter on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 03:30:13 PM EST

years ago; hate'em to this day.

He was so good looking, we'd be driving down the street, and "the face" would yell to a couple of coeds, "Hey, show me your !i!s." They looked up, and they were dead. Jaws dropped, giggles uncontrolled, and sweaters, up, up, and away.

God, I hated him. Wore all my clothes too:)

"Bobby Taylor....If you're reading this, where's my Captain America Bike shirt you stiole from me, suckah?"

Grrrr

Parent

and yet (none / 0) (#141)
by vicndabx on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 04:10:17 PM EST

you post stories about a dress code for the men's locker room!

Oh, the outrage!

Parent

huh? (none / 0) (#142)
by CST on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 04:17:10 PM EST

yes, I find the MLB "professionalism" requirement to be hypocritical.

Also, it's a sport/game, not a funeral. Really I just don't get it.

Not sure what that has to do with me thinking that Tom Brady is pretty.

Parent

The point being (none / 0) (#143)
by vicndabx on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 04:23:52 PM EST

we look at each other and admire each other, and make comments as a result.

Parent

: agree with that (none / 0) (#144)
by CST on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 04:30:01 PM EST

Not denying it. I just think it's kind of rediculous to pretend that sports are "serious business".

Parent

Giiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiaaaaaaaaaaants!!!! (none / 0) (#86)
by sarcastic unnamed one on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 10:36:37 AM EST

poor Eli (5.00 / 1) (#105)
by CST on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 12:24:02 PM EST

no one cares ;)

Maybe he should start $ucking more in the first 3/4 of the game so people get really excited about the last one. Or praying more.

Parent

: Or (none / 0) (#145)
by CoralGables on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 06:06:56 PM EST

not lose four in a row again. That will make them forget you every time.

Parent

Once again, headlines that Heisman (none / 0) (#125)
by oculus on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 02:02:42 PM EST

trophy win is no guarantee of success in NFL.

Sunday Evening Open Thread | 129 comments (129 topical)

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