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NYC Mayor Bloomberg Approves Terror Trial

By Big Tent Democrat, Section Terror Trials
Posted on Fri Nov 13, 2009 at 05:13:11 PM EST
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While Republicans (and Democrats like Jim Webb) quake in their boots all over the Red States, the Mayor of New York City, where, you might remember, the 9/11 attacks struck, says:

I support the Obama Administration’s decision to prosecute 9/11 terrorists here in New York. It is fitting that 9/11 suspects face justice near the World Trade Center site where so many New Yorkers were murdered. We have hosted terrorism trials before, including the trial of Omar Abdel-Rahman, the mastermind of the 1993 World Trade Center bombing.

New Yorkers are not afraid. Apparently, Virginians like Jim Webb are scared senseless.

Speaking for me only

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    NYC Mayor Bloomberg Approves Terror Trial | 39 comments (39 topical)

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    Sounds exactly (5.00 / 2) (#1)
    by Steve M on Fri Nov 13, 2009 at 05:18:03 PM EST
    like what Congressman Nadler said earlier.

    Long Islanders like Peter King are wetting their beds as usual.

    So is the courageous Rudy Giuliani (none / 0) (#23)
    by gyrfalcon on Fri Nov 13, 2009 at 10:51:52 PM EST
    who is apoplectic about the terrible danger to NYC.

    Parent
    You might remember ... (5.00 / 1) (#3)
    by Maryb2004 on Fri Nov 13, 2009 at 05:48:47 PM EST
    that the 9/11 terrorists struck Virgina too.

    Hard to believe, though, that it was more traumatic for them than for New Yorkers.

    Good point. (5.00 / 2) (#8)
    by Cream City on Fri Nov 13, 2009 at 05:56:13 PM EST
    I have a sibling in Virginia, near the Pentagon, and married intoto a military family including some in the Pentagon that day.  (And my sib was out of town that day (for his law practice, actually), and adding to the fears for his wife was that he could not get back for many days to help her through the loss of so many they knew.)

    I have a family member who was a few blocks from Ground Zero in New York that day.  And adding to the fears for his wife and kids, once we even knew he was alive, is that he also could not get home here for many days -- as he stayed there in part to help, and sometimes he could not get in touch with us back here at all, and we wondered if he had gotten injured or worse in helping. But when we did hear from him, and other relatives who live in Manhattan, the fears they went through. . . .

    Anyway, I would not attempt to measure who had it worse, New Yorkers or Virginians.  Or others across this country and world who lost family and friends.  It's useless, at the least, to attempt to do so.  At worst, there's another name for it!

    I could not say which

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    I remember the Pentagon was hit (none / 0) (#4)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Fri Nov 13, 2009 at 05:51:24 PM EST
    Yet, no one is proposing trials in Virginia.

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    Your post doesn't remember it. (none / 0) (#9)
    by Maryb2004 on Fri Nov 13, 2009 at 05:57:40 PM EST


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    There are no trials proposed for Virignia (none / 0) (#12)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Fri Nov 13, 2009 at 06:23:32 PM EST
    Your point eludes me.

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    According to the NYT, some prosecutors from (none / 0) (#15)
    by steviez314 on Fri Nov 13, 2009 at 06:31:43 PM EST
    the Eastern District of VA will be assisting in NY.

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    I think you are being intentionally dense. (none / 0) (#25)
    by Maryb2004 on Fri Nov 13, 2009 at 11:17:41 PM EST


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    At least it is intentional (5.00 / 3) (#28)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Sat Nov 14, 2009 at 09:46:12 AM EST


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    LOL! (none / 0) (#34)
    by ChiTownDenny on Sat Nov 14, 2009 at 08:31:38 PM EST


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    Didn't you know (5.00 / 2) (#6)
    by andgarden on Fri Nov 13, 2009 at 05:52:17 PM EST
    that only real Americans have feelings?

    Or only real Americans (5.00 / 1) (#7)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Fri Nov 13, 2009 at 05:53:23 PM EST
    are cowards.

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    Maybe they need a hug (5.00 / 3) (#10)
    by andgarden on Fri Nov 13, 2009 at 06:02:58 PM EST
    from Saxby Chambliss.

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    Are these the same defendants (none / 0) (#2)
    by themomcat on Fri Nov 13, 2009 at 05:45:06 PM EST
    who attempted to enter guilty pleas in a military court?
    ....

    More or less (none / 0) (#5)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Fri Nov 13, 2009 at 05:51:48 PM EST
    They will probably do the same here.

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    Realistically, how could you possibly find an (none / 0) (#11)
    by steviez314 on Fri Nov 13, 2009 at 06:05:02 PM EST
    impartial jury for this trial?

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    You can't (5.00 / 1) (#13)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Fri Nov 13, 2009 at 06:24:09 PM EST
    These defendants will be found guilty and sentenced to the death penalty.

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    Found guilty (5.00 / 1) (#16)
    by themomcat on Fri Nov 13, 2009 at 06:42:05 PM EST
    no doubt that a jury would do that in NYC. but death penalty? Not one of the men prosecuted for the 1993 WTC bombing received the death penalty. NYC jurors are an unpredictable lot.

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    I'll give you 5-1 odds. (none / 0) (#18)
    by jpe on Fri Nov 13, 2009 at 08:14:55 PM EST
    They'll give 'em the DP.  I'm happy to bet on it (revealed preference and whatnot)

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    Heh (none / 0) (#19)
    by themomcat on Fri Nov 13, 2009 at 08:32:57 PM EST
    I'm a NYC woman. I know better than to bet on NYC juries. Everyone thought the same thing in 1994 that they would vote for the death penalty. No, all got life sentences. I doubt these defendants will ever get to a jury. All will plea guilty then it will be up to a judge, iirc. If that's the case then I would count on  the DP.

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    I'm a New Yorker (none / 0) (#38)
    by norris morris on Mon Nov 16, 2009 at 04:27:30 PM EST
    It's eather to blather on about how safwe Bloomberg thinks this is, etc. I voted for Obama, so mine is not a right wing response. I think it's dumb as hell for disrupting this city, ruining business for all those in trial area, and lotsa extra expense for a city in dire economic shape.

    Safety? Of course if one even mentions it, they're a cowardly right wing assh..le.  I truly believe that if anyone lived through 9/11 and is looking forward to this, good luck. This should have been either a military trial, or held elsewhere.  How about DC?  Really what this will do to NY with the mess,expense,& inconvenience, will be irreperable.

    This will prove to be a terrible decision, perhaps even a tragic one.

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    I'm a New Yorker (none / 0) (#39)
    by norris morris on Mon Nov 16, 2009 at 04:28:41 PM EST
    I apologize for the sloppy typos in my previous post.

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    My understanding is (none / 0) (#22)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Fri Nov 13, 2009 at 10:17:38 PM EST
    the prosecution did not seek the death penalty in those cases.

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    IIRC (none / 0) (#33)
    by themomcat on Sat Nov 14, 2009 at 08:25:54 PM EST
    There as a death penalty phase after the initial verdicts. I'm not sure what the prosecution's stand was, but whether or not the defendants were to face the DP was entirely up to the jury.

    ...

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    I know that is wrong (none / 0) (#35)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Sun Nov 15, 2009 at 09:18:04 AM EST
    The prosecutors must seek the death penalty before the jury can apply it.

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    So basically, everyone--lawyers, judges, (none / 0) (#14)
    by steviez314 on Fri Nov 13, 2009 at 06:28:00 PM EST
    prospective jurors--will be lying during voir dire.

    I can't wait for that episode of Law and Order!

    Parent

    I dunno (none / 0) (#24)
    by gyrfalcon on Fri Nov 13, 2009 at 10:57:50 PM EST
    I could certainly say with all honesty that I had an open mind about it.  All I know about any of the is that KSM was waterboarded a hundred times.  I know zippo, nor does anybody else, of the actual evidence against any of them.  If you have half a brain, you can have utter horror at the event without buying the idea that these guys had anything much to do with it.

    I'd say NYC would be pretty easy to get a fair jury.  How many NYers have, shall we say, a skeptical attitude about "evidence" gathered under the Bush administration?

    I can tell you I sure wouldn't take any of it for granted.

    The greater danger, seems to me, is that the prosecution has to be absolutely scrupulous to avoid having any of its evidence thrown out by the judge for one reason or another.

    Holder must think they have enough untainted evidence to have a pretty air-tight case or they'd never risk doing this, seems to me.  We'll see.

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    KSM said he did it (none / 0) (#29)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Sat Nov 14, 2009 at 09:47:08 AM EST
    in an open proceeding.

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    He was also tortured (none / 0) (#32)
    by gyrfalcon on Sat Nov 14, 2009 at 03:55:36 PM EST
    If he pleads guilty here, that's the end of that.  If he doesn't, he'll be contesting the validity of that open court confession.  I'd wait to hear the arguments and evidence presesnted.

    I'm just making the point that I don't think it'd be particularly difficult to get an open-minded jury in NY to hear this case.

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    I see no basis for questioning the open court (none / 0) (#36)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Sun Nov 15, 2009 at 09:19:40 AM EST
    confession.

    The fact he was tortured years before to try and extract other information is evidence of heinous criminality by Americans, but KSM has steadfastly maintained his involvement in 9/11.

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    Fine (none / 0) (#37)
    by gyrfalcon on Sun Nov 15, 2009 at 05:31:35 PM EST
    You're the attorney, not me.  If that's the case, it's all open and shut as far as KSM is concerned and there will be no trial for him, presumably.

    I don't get why we appear to be having an argument here.  The point I was making was one of general principle, not the specifis of any individual's case.

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    Do you think (none / 0) (#17)
    by themomcat on Fri Nov 13, 2009 at 06:44:00 PM EST
    tath is what Holder is hoping? I strongly suspect he is.

    ...

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    juries are uneven indeed (none / 0) (#20)
    by diogenes on Fri Nov 13, 2009 at 08:33:43 PM EST
    Probably 10% of people believe in 911 conspiracy theories (heck, that one Obama staffer did); if one of them gets on the jury by lying, then it'll just hang.
    All of this for what?

    Perhaps for the sake of being (none / 0) (#21)
    by Cream City on Fri Nov 13, 2009 at 09:01:54 PM EST
    bold?

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    I'm fairly sure that (none / 0) (#30)
    by Edger on Sat Nov 14, 2009 at 09:50:55 AM EST
    the percentage of people who believe the Bush/Cheney conspiracy theory is much higher than 10%.

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    Virginia (none / 0) (#26)
    by jbindc on Sat Nov 14, 2009 at 07:17:34 AM EST
    is a Red State?  I thought it's been said all over (including here many times) that Virginia is a purple state turning blue?

    Somebody lied to you (none / 0) (#27)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Sat Nov 14, 2009 at 09:45:44 AM EST


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    I was being facetious (none / 0) (#31)
    by jbindc on Sat Nov 14, 2009 at 01:19:32 PM EST
    Just making a crack about reading comments here and elsewhere (and listening to pundits) who kept insisting that Obama had turned Virginia purple to blue.

    Parent
    NYC Mayor Bloomberg Approves Terror Trial | 39 comments (39 topical)

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