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FL/MI Rules Hearing: Reader's Open Thread II

By Jeralyn, Section Elections 2008
Posted on Sat May 31, 2008 at 08:32:41 AM EST
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The Rules and Bylaws Committee Hearing should begin momentarily. Here's a thread for readers to live-blog or post reactions.

We'll be joining you shortly.

Comments now closed, new threads open.

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    FL/MI Rules Hearing: Reader's Open Thread II | 100 comments (100 topical)
    Bonior will argue for 50-50. That would anger (5.00 / 1) (#11)
    by Teresa on Sat May 31, 2008 at 08:41:42 AM EST
    me as bad as not counting. Or worse.

    Theresa (5.00 / 1) (#45)
    by JON15 on Sat May 31, 2008 at 08:54:06 AM EST
    I second that.It's the only way to make this worse
    than it is now.

    Parent
    Teresa, why is it (none / 0) (#93)
    by TeresaInSnow2 on Sat May 31, 2008 at 09:34:05 AM EST
    that people always have to add the H to the spelling of our name.

    There is NO 'H' in Teresa!

    ;-0

    Parent

    Much worse than not counting (none / 0) (#95)
    by ghost2 on Sat May 31, 2008 at 10:42:56 AM EST
    It sets an extremely bad precedent.

    Because next time, politicians can get together behind the scenes and screw voters over, and then award themselves vote or delegates.

    Votes should not be given freely.  Voting is sacred and should remain so.

    Parent

    The hearing didn't start on time. (5.00 / 2) (#12)
    by vicsan on Sat May 31, 2008 at 08:42:26 AM EST
    Do these people have a hard time knowing how to read a clock too? Do they do anything right?

    ONE of my pet peeves: people who are late.

    Meetings in Washington (none / 0) (#14)
    by andgarden on Sat May 31, 2008 at 08:43:16 AM EST
    never start on time.

    Parent
    Well, then, don't ever attend a (none / 0) (#40)
    by zfran on Sat May 31, 2008 at 08:53:16 AM EST
    Jewish wedding...always starts late (usually because uncle so and so isn't there yet!) HAH!

    Parent
    Howard Dean looks terrible (5.00 / 2) (#13)
    by andgarden on Sat May 31, 2008 at 08:42:39 AM EST
    and has a REALLY BAD haircut.

    He (5.00 / 1) (#16)
    by Ga6thDem on Sat May 31, 2008 at 08:44:50 AM EST
    should look terrible. He's been a disaster. There's no other way to put it.

    Parent
    Why is he there? (none / 0) (#24)
    by Valhalla on Sat May 31, 2008 at 08:47:06 AM EST
    He wouldn't usually show up at a RBC meeting, would he?

    Parent
    I have (none / 0) (#27)
    by Ga6thDem on Sat May 31, 2008 at 08:48:57 AM EST
    no idea.

    Parent
    More Makeup (5.00 / 2) (#20)
    by Petey on Sat May 31, 2008 at 08:46:07 AM EST
    "Howard Dean looks terrible"

    Maybe he needs more makeup.  After all, Dean is busy doing his best Katherine Harris imitation...

    Parent

    The best that could happen (5.00 / 3) (#26)
    by Makarov on Sat May 31, 2008 at 08:48:46 AM EST
    today is Donna Brazile quitting the DNC over the results of this meeting.  She DID say she would if FL and MI were seated some time back in Jan, Feb or Mar didn't she?

    We should be so lucky (5.00 / 2) (#28)
    by americanincanada on Sat May 31, 2008 at 08:49:45 AM EST


    Parent
    I would walk to work (5.00 / 1) (#90)
    by suki on Sat May 31, 2008 at 09:13:09 AM EST
    nude (7 miles) if that would remove Donna from any position of power in the party.

    Parent
    We should be so lucky. (5.00 / 1) (#29)
    by vicsan on Sat May 31, 2008 at 08:49:57 AM EST
    That would make my day.

    Parent
    They're really doing the pledge? (5.00 / 1) (#30)
    by andgarden on Sat May 31, 2008 at 08:50:27 AM EST
    That's one good way to tell that the fix is in. . .

    I was thinking that some of their heads (none / 0) (#33)
    by Valhalla on Sat May 31, 2008 at 08:51:09 AM EST
    should be exploding.  Pledge of Allegiance, indeed.

    Parent
    With hands over their hearts (none / 0) (#34)
    by americanincanada on Sat May 31, 2008 at 08:51:30 AM EST
    I notice.

    Parent
    they know that (none / 0) (#43)
    by txpolitico67 on Sat May 31, 2008 at 08:53:48 AM EST
    everyone is watching

    Parent
    the audience is stacked.... (5.00 / 1) (#37)
    by p lukasiak on Sat May 31, 2008 at 08:52:37 AM EST
    no way that Dean would have gotten that reception if it was the people who signed up on the internet...

    Not sure, watch the audience (none / 0) (#51)
    by Valhalla on Sat May 31, 2008 at 08:55:47 AM EST
    not everyone's clapping, it's mostly the committee clapping for itself.

    Parent
    Hillary supporters will not (5.00 / 2) (#55)
    by americanincanada on Sat May 31, 2008 at 08:56:40 AM EST
    be rude.

    Parent
    Dean sounds (5.00 / 3) (#38)
    by txpolitico67 on Sat May 31, 2008 at 08:52:52 AM EST
    incompetent

    If it looks like a duck and quacks like a duck.. (none / 0) (#44)
    by ruffian on Sat May 31, 2008 at 08:54:01 AM EST


    Parent
    I wish Howard Dean wouldn't make a speech (5.00 / 1) (#46)
    by andgarden on Sat May 31, 2008 at 08:54:09 AM EST
    This is a no business business meeting.

    Rules committee extraordinarily? (5.00 / 2) (#47)
    by kredwyn on Sat May 31, 2008 at 08:54:15 AM EST
    Extraordinarily bad maybe...

    How many times (5.00 / 1) (#48)
    by txpolitico67 on Sat May 31, 2008 at 08:55:09 AM EST
    is dean going to say extraordinary?

    Howard... Thesaurus: extraordinary: (5.00 / 2) (#57)
    by ding7777 on Sat May 31, 2008 at 08:57:08 AM EST
    remarkable, special, wonderful, outstanding, rare, amazing, fantastic, astonishing, marvellous, exceptional, notable, serious (informal) phenomenal, singular, wondrous

    Energy, Passion, Enthusiasm. . . (5.00 / 1) (#61)
    by andgarden on Sat May 31, 2008 at 08:58:02 AM EST


    Parent
    No Howard (5.00 / 1) (#62)
    by ruffian on Sat May 31, 2008 at 08:58:32 AM EST
    We the cynics are looking for your fake unity - we know about the the real conflict.

    Actually, he's making a good point (none / 0) (#67)
    by andgarden on Sat May 31, 2008 at 08:59:49 AM EST
    about how nasty the 2004 party got.

    Parent
    howard says it's about country (5.00 / 1) (#70)
    by debbie f on Sat May 31, 2008 at 09:00:32 AM EST
    is that his way of guilting us back in novemeber

    Bingo - and so is the DNC (5.00 / 1) (#74)
    by ruffian on Sat May 31, 2008 at 09:01:34 AM EST


    Parent
    Sexist call out of media. Too late Howard. (5.00 / 2) (#73)
    by Teresa on Sat May 31, 2008 at 09:01:27 AM EST


    Yes (none / 0) (#83)
    by PlayInPeoria on Sat May 31, 2008 at 09:04:28 AM EST
    and racism was just racism... hummmm!

    Parent
    DNC (5.00 / 1) (#78)
    by melro on Sat May 31, 2008 at 09:02:15 AM EST
    Healing will begin with a fair tally.

    Howard Dean (5.00 / 2) (#80)
    by joanneleon on Sat May 31, 2008 at 09:02:42 AM EST
    Now he is speaking out against the sexist remarks in the media and the racist remarks.  He says that will stop.  

    This is good, but where were you Howard, when it was happening?  Why aren't you calling out specific people and incidents?  Too little, too late.

    Oh oh. If he says media sexism will stop (5.00 / 1) (#92)
    by Cream City on Sat May 31, 2008 at 09:22:44 AM EST
    that means the DNC is stopping Clinton.  

    And of course, Howard, that will not stop media sexism, because Clinton didn't cause it.  Media sexism has been there all along, and she is only its most recent target.  Howard, you have just shown again how clueless you are to the everyday lives of most of the Dems, women, because we have been seeing the sexism every day of our lives.  But you have not seen it before?  Uh huh.  Once again, Howard, you would have done better to not say anything today -- because today is 'way too late to say something about the sexism aimed at Clinton in this campaign.

    Parent

    "5 intellectually bankrupt (5.00 / 4) (#81)
    by Kensdad on Sat May 31, 2008 at 09:02:49 AM EST
    supreme court  justices did the wrong thing" (tumultuous applause)...  will it be followed by something similar by the DNC rules and bylaws committee...  how ironic...

    ARTHENIA JOYNER IS SUCH A CUTIE.... (5.00 / 1) (#97)
    by PssttCmere08 on Sat May 31, 2008 at 10:48:04 AM EST
    And she has a solid argument...got a standing ovation, but I didn't notice Donna Brazile standing up...lol

    I really enjoyed hearing her speak! (5.00 / 0) (#99)
    by Grace on Sat May 31, 2008 at 11:28:36 AM EST
    Such passion!  She should run for a higher office.  It's readily apparent that she cares a great deal about people.  

    Parent
    So, I'm not in the room (none / 0) (#1)
    by andgarden on Sat May 31, 2008 at 08:34:41 AM EST
    But I've got C-SPAN. I must say that I'm not much liking the outside theater: C-SPAN is featuring a white man with a Michigan t-shirt arguing with a black woman. They are quite animated. . .

    Meanwhile, Carl Levin and Bill Nelson (none / 0) (#2)
    by andgarden on Sat May 31, 2008 at 08:35:11 AM EST
    are chatting inside.

    Parent
    I think he is for Obama, and she is for Hillary. (none / 0) (#3)
    by Teresa on Sat May 31, 2008 at 08:35:39 AM EST


    Parent
    heh (none / 0) (#4)
    by andgarden on Sat May 31, 2008 at 08:35:53 AM EST


    Parent
    I could be wrong but she was saying give (none / 0) (#9)
    by Teresa on Sat May 31, 2008 at 08:40:16 AM EST
    Hillary 60% and he was asking why 60. She explained but I couldn't understand what she said.

    Parent
    60% of what? (none / 0) (#10)
    by andgarden on Sat May 31, 2008 at 08:41:25 AM EST
    Oh boy, this is going to be one of those "compromises" that doesn't make any sense.

    Parent
    yeah (none / 0) (#18)
    by ruffian on Sat May 31, 2008 at 08:46:03 AM EST
    I'm not going to like this at all.

    I keep picturing Johny Depp as Jack Sparrow in the same tone and shrug that he says "Pirates" saing "Democrats".

    Committee is already in love with the publicity and attention.

    Parent

    Indeed (none / 0) (#23)
    by andgarden on Sat May 31, 2008 at 08:47:05 AM EST
    Jim Roosevelt calls out the news networks. . .

    Parent
    Way too self-aware (5.00 / 1) (#31)
    by ruffian on Sat May 31, 2008 at 08:50:41 AM EST
    That tells me this is going to be a staged affair all the way.

    Parent
    With Faux unity. (5.00 / 1) (#32)
    by andgarden on Sat May 31, 2008 at 08:51:08 AM EST


    Parent
    CNN says they met until 2 am to work out (none / 0) (#5)
    by Teresa on Sat May 31, 2008 at 08:37:34 AM EST
    the FL solution. I guess today will be mainly MI with some FL arguments thrown in for whatever reason. I though it was all public.

    Why, because Donna Brazile told you so? (5.00 / 2) (#7)
    by andgarden on Sat May 31, 2008 at 08:39:02 AM EST
    :D

    Parent
    Interesting (5.00 / 2) (#8)
    by Valhalla on Sat May 31, 2008 at 08:39:15 AM EST
    That's what Donna Brazile said, about a month ago? (maybe less) on CNN, that all their meetings are open to the public.

    Parent
    Except when they're not (5.00 / 2) (#36)
    by ruffian on Sat May 31, 2008 at 08:51:49 AM EST
    like the rules being the rules.

    Parent
    CNN (none / 0) (#6)
    by americanincanada on Sat May 31, 2008 at 08:38:08 AM EST
    On the live stream of the outside protest the CNN camerman just was talking to another and said the crowd has turned on them for not covering the size of the crowd. they are now off to the side.

    Heeer's Donna! (none / 0) (#15)
    by andgarden on Sat May 31, 2008 at 08:44:39 AM EST


    Did Donna (none / 0) (#17)
    by americanincanada on Sat May 31, 2008 at 08:45:16 AM EST
    get booed?

    Parent
    heh (none / 0) (#19)
    by andgarden on Sat May 31, 2008 at 08:46:06 AM EST
    no.

    Parent
    I was watching the protest stream from outside (none / 0) (#25)
    by americanincanada on Sat May 31, 2008 at 08:47:54 AM EST
    Didn't see her enter. It's too bad she didn't get a little of the 'Obama treatment'.

    Parent
    Protest stream? (none / 0) (#35)
    by tnjen on Sat May 31, 2008 at 08:51:35 AM EST
    Where's that at?

    Parent
    CNN (none / 0) (#39)
    by americanincanada on Sat May 31, 2008 at 08:52:56 AM EST
    has several live streams. One for the meeting and one of the outside protest. Hearing the reporters talk about how the crowd turned on them and wondering how to cover this has been very interesting.

    There are thousands outside.

    Parent

    thanks :) (none / 0) (#42)
    by tnjen on Sat May 31, 2008 at 08:53:40 AM EST


    Parent
    I did. Only my dogs heard though. (none / 0) (#22)
    by Teresa on Sat May 31, 2008 at 08:46:29 AM EST


    Parent
    DNC Meeting (none / 0) (#21)
    by melro on Sat May 31, 2008 at 08:46:14 AM EST
    Mostly Hillary supporters outside!

    Aaarh - Dean gives a speech (none / 0) (#41)
    by ruffian on Sat May 31, 2008 at 08:53:22 AM EST
    I have to leave at 10:30 - get on with it already.  Let's have the kumbaya moment afterward.

    last night, when Jeralyn did a poll... (5.00 / 3) (#56)
    by p lukasiak on Sat May 31, 2008 at 08:56:50 AM EST
    asking who would be the biggest loser, I said the right answer wasn't on the poll.  

    That the viewers would be the big losers, precisely because of what we are seeing at this moment---posturing.  

    Dean has no business giving this speech at this meeting.  We are going to have to sit through HOURS of this kind of pure, uncessary, self-serving BS...

    Parent

    Indeed (5.00 / 1) (#59)
    by andgarden on Sat May 31, 2008 at 08:57:37 AM EST
    It's a kind of filibuster.

    Parent
    Why is Dean even there? (none / 0) (#49)
    by americanincanada on Sat May 31, 2008 at 08:55:16 AM EST


    extraordinary - extraordinary - extraordinary (none / 0) (#50)
    by mogal on Sat May 31, 2008 at 08:55:38 AM EST
    extraordinary- extraordinary- extraordinary

    DNC Meeting (none / 0) (#52)
    by melro on Sat May 31, 2008 at 08:56:16 AM EST
    Five hours last night and no compromise? I wonder if they are going to exit among the Hillary supporters outside? Could get ugly.

    good point - I am (5.00 / 1) (#60)
    by nulee on Sat May 31, 2008 at 08:57:37 AM EST
    embarrassed that we have come to this - if Dean had been a strong leader these 2 states would already be seated.

    Parent
    Yup (none / 0) (#66)
    by ruffian on Sat May 31, 2008 at 08:59:39 AM EST
    and he needs to STFU right now

    Parent
    I apologize for my language above. (5.00 / 1) (#86)
    by ruffian on Sat May 31, 2008 at 09:05:39 AM EST
    No place for that.

    Parent
    They reached agreement on FL. Seat all (none / 0) (#58)
    by Teresa on Sat May 31, 2008 at 08:57:36 AM EST
    with 1/2 vote per CNN/Hillary Rosen.

    Parent
    She didn't seem sure (none / 0) (#65)
    by americanincanada on Sat May 31, 2008 at 08:59:09 AM EST
    to me. Did she say that as fact?

    Parent
    I thought so but I has just got out of bed so I (none / 0) (#71)
    by Teresa on Sat May 31, 2008 at 09:00:46 AM EST
    might have heard wrong. I thought CNN reporter (Wolf or Campbell?) confirmed it with her.

    Parent
    If Dean wants PA - seat HRCs (none / 0) (#53)
    by nulee on Sat May 31, 2008 at 08:56:21 AM EST
    delegates.

    Yeah Howard, Texas, where the winner lost. (none / 0) (#54)
    by Teresa on Sat May 31, 2008 at 08:56:31 AM EST


    DNC (none / 0) (#63)
    by melro on Sat May 31, 2008 at 08:58:58 AM EST
    We don't care about your campaign Howard

    He's rallying the troups. (none / 0) (#69)
    by zfran on Sat May 31, 2008 at 08:59:53 AM EST
    Applause tepid (imo)

    Parent
    They just showed Donna B (none / 0) (#64)
    by zfran on Sat May 31, 2008 at 08:59:09 AM EST
    applauding. She didn't look happy, or, she looked bored, as she knows the outcome!! Hmmmm.

    DNC (1.00 / 2) (#68)
    by melro on Sat May 31, 2008 at 08:59:50 AM EST
    She looked like the Biatch she is

    Parent
    Unacceptable word use (5.00 / 1) (#75)
    by DFLer on Sat May 31, 2008 at 09:01:37 AM EST


    Parent
    With language like that (3.00 / 2) (#76)
    by riddlerandy on Sat May 31, 2008 at 09:01:47 AM EST
    I guess you must an Obama supporter, a Hillary supporter would never use that type of Glenn Beck language

    Parent
    Let the commenter... (none / 0) (#94)
    by kdog on Sat May 31, 2008 at 09:38:15 AM EST
    speak his or her mind, will ya please?

    I think the protesters should crash the gates...give the bastards trying to rig this thing a good scare.

    Parent

    On CNN (none / 0) (#72)
    by joanneleon on Sat May 31, 2008 at 09:01:18 AM EST
    Blitzer interviewed a man who he said was going to be arguing for the Obama campaign (I didn't catch his name).  He said that they would be seeking a 50/50 split of the votes in Michigan.

    I simply don't understand how that is a defensible argument.

    Later, a commentator said he predicted that the Clinton campaign would still seek to have all the votes counted as they were cast, and that after today, they may continue on to the credentials committee.  

    One other thing:  Campbell Brown was quite biased, IMO, insisting that Hillary didn't care about the votes before, and only cares about them now that they may be used to her advantage.  A Clinton supporter then very calmly and effectively refuted that statement.  It was telling.

    WOW (none / 0) (#77)
    by americanincanada on Sat May 31, 2008 at 09:02:12 AM EST
    Interesting he is bringing up Gore so much. Really interesting what he is saying now.

    Did he just acknowledge the sexism and talk about healing?!?

    And when did Dean step in at any time (none / 0) (#79)
    by zfran on Sat May 31, 2008 at 09:02:21 AM EST
    during all those sexist/racist comments. I've not heard him and if he did (and I missed it) his voice was not loud enough!!!!!!!

    DNC (none / 0) (#82)
    by melro on Sat May 31, 2008 at 09:03:18 AM EST
    No -alls!

    Parent
    Donna B. (none / 0) (#84)
    by americanincanada on Sat May 31, 2008 at 09:04:31 AM EST
    does NOT look happy.

    Does she ever? n/t (none / 0) (#87)
    by DEM on Sat May 31, 2008 at 09:06:39 AM EST


    Parent
    Does Dean know that not all of the other 48 (none / 0) (#85)
    by kempis on Sat May 31, 2008 at 09:05:23 AM EST
    states "abided by the rules"? Isn't it more accurate to say that the DNC just decided to lower the boom on two of the rules-violators?

    I agree (none / 0) (#88)
    by pammc on Sat May 31, 2008 at 09:08:58 AM EST
    Donna does not look happy to be there

    GOOD! (none / 0) (#91)
    by Fabian on Sat May 31, 2008 at 09:21:18 AM EST
    I fondly remember GWB's terse, seriously unhappy presser when he announced AG was resigning.  That's when I knew he was being forced to do something he really didn't want to.

    DB unhappy?  Probably good news.

    Parent

    Pre-window? Official window? (none / 0) (#89)
    by ruffian on Sat May 31, 2008 at 09:09:02 AM EST
    That's not in the rules, I believe BTD pointed out yesterday.

    So doesn't it seem that the Obama camp.... (none / 0) (#96)
    by Maria Garcia on Sat May 31, 2008 at 10:43:16 AM EST
    ....is advocating for the people in Florida who didn't vote? That's an awkward position.

    Wexler screaming sounds (none / 0) (#98)
    by Stellaaa on Sat May 31, 2008 at 11:23:56 AM EST
    like a typical bully, yelling at a woman.  I hate all of them.  No friggin manners

    If the committee agrees with (none / 0) (#100)
    by sander60tx on Sat May 31, 2008 at 11:52:38 AM EST
    the FL and MI proposals, how will it look to have one state get 50% and the other state get 100%?  What is the difference between what happened it those states that would justify penalizing one state but not the other?

    FL/MI Rules Hearing: Reader's Open Thread II | 100 comments (100 topical)