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The Candidate for Change Goes AWOL in Message Today

By Jeralyn, Section Elections 2008
Posted on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 04:21:41 PM EST
Tags: Hillary Clinton, Barack Obama, 2008 (all tags)
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Update: John Dickerson at Slate on the hypocrisy between what Obama says and what his aides do.

***

As for Obama's positive message of hope and change on the campaign trail and how he won't be a typical politician but one who brings a breath of fresh air to Washington, here's what he said today:

Barack Obama cast his Democratic presidential rival Saturday as a game-player who uses "slash and burn" tactics and will say whatever people want to hear, a sharp jab at her character in the final chapter of the pivotal Pennsylvania primary campaign.

...."Senator Clinton has internalized a lot of the strategies, the tactics, that have made Washington such a miserable place."

...."She's got the kitchen sink flying and the china flying, the buffet is coming at me ... constant distractions, these petty, trivial, slash and burn, back and forth, tit for tat, politics."

Mirror, mirror on the wall? It's politics as usual from the candidate for change. [More...]

As to the numbers, Congressman Tim Ryan of Ohio endorsed Hillary Clinton today. This is her fourth superdelegate gain this week. MSNBC reports:

The superdelegate count now is: Clinton 262, Obama 236

...In total delegates, Obama is up 140.

The superdelegates should factor in the Florida and Michigan primary delegates as they voted in January -- that lead would shrink considerably.

Gallup today has Hillary up in the national tracking poll, the first time since mid-March.

Update: More politics of hypocrisy from the Obama campaign, now claiming on a conference call today that Hillary isn't fit to lay a wreath on the Tomb of the Unknown Soldier because of her Bosnia misstatement. Of course, Obama just said at the debate he wasn't commenting on the Bosnia story.

It's coming down to we can't even trust his words. And words are all he has shown us so far.

< Obama Brings Back Harry And Louise | Passover and Open Thread >

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    The Candidate for Change Goes AWOL in Message Today | 187 comments (187 topical)

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    I'm going to need a nice stiff shot of (5.00 / 2) (#1)
    by MarkL on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 04:25:03 PM EST
    KoolAid if Obama wins on Tuesday.
    Go HILLARY!

    see Jeralyn's update, (5.00 / 1) (#158)
    by kmblue on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 07:39:11 PM EST
    top of thread.

    Now that's charming.

    Hillary apologizes on live TV for her Tuzla remarks.

    And the Obama campaign is so desperate they have a surrogate say she's not fit to lay a wreath at the Tomb of the Unknowns--so don't vote for Clinton.

    All I can say is "wow".


    [ Parent ]

    I'll take Gin with that Cool-Aid (none / 0) (#98)
    by Marvin42 on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 05:50:20 PM EST
    Lots and lots or I can't swallow it.

    But come to think of it Gin and Cool-Aid is gross, even if it is Bombay Sapphire...I'll pass.

    [ Parent ]

    Skip the Kool Aid and go straight up ;) (none / 0) (#107)
    by nycstray on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 06:06:18 PM EST


    [ Parent ]
    And if Obama loses again (none / 0) (#106)
    by frankly0 on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 06:04:42 PM EST
    what can we conclude, other than that he's a choke-artist?

    [ Parent ]
    Is Obama (5.00 / 1) (#2)
    by kmblue on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 04:27:59 PM EST
    still whining? ;)

    Oh, dear.

    Funny, she seems to be the one standing (5.00 / 7) (#3)
    by nycstray on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 04:30:09 PM EST
    her ground on the issues.

    I guess I should throw the same dare out to Obama that I throw out to his supporters:

    What exactly has she said/done that constitutes the kitchen sink? And now the china cabinet? Tell me please, I dare ya.

    Now, now. be fair.... (5.00 / 6) (#5)
    by Maria Garcia on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 04:34:24 PM EST
    ...he didn't say the china cabinet, he said the buffet. ;-)

    [ Parent ]
    armoire please... (5.00 / 1) (#111)
    by Stellaaa on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 06:14:37 PM EST


    [ Parent ]
    Nah, my aunt had it right (5.00 / 2) (#115)
    by Kathy on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 06:19:33 PM EST
    when my budgy got sick and the vet wanted fifty bucks to put him down: put him in a bag and hit him with a brick.

    [ Parent ]
    What's with the kitchen references? (5.00 / 1) (#38)
    by myiq2xu on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 04:55:47 PM EST
    He's dogwhistling the misogyny again.

    [ Parent ]
    I wasn't going to say that cause.... (5.00 / 3) (#50)
    by Maria Garcia on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 05:05:40 PM EST
    ...I'm trying to tone down my sensitivity to it, but  adding the image of him ducking the china was, at the very least, a sexist cliche.

    [ Parent ]
    Hillary was in Arkansas too long to (5.00 / 2) (#140)
    by FlaDemFem on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 07:09:59 PM EST
    toss the china. You never waste the good stuff on some mouthy jerk. If you toss anything it's going to be the cast iron skillet. Which Obama could use a few smacks with, in my opinion. What a whiny cry baby..she's a woman and she's the one with the cojones, not him. I think that is what is getting his goat. Hehehe.

    [ Parent ]
    Maybe when she's done (none / 0) (#156)
    by AnnC on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 07:35:30 PM EST
    "ironing the shirt" of those dumbasses in NH she can smack him with the iron - then he'll be the one feeling down!

    [ Parent ]
    Dogwhistling! Tit for tat thuds forth ... (5.00 / 2) (#104)
    by Ellie on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 06:00:21 PM EST
    ... as tiresomely as C. U. Next Tuesday (or the Debate Finger) when tucked in with all the kitchen sundries and knick knacks flying around.

    I'm kind of disappointed his speechwriting wizards didn't throw a rolling pin or a frying pan in there. Too busy snorting at their funnies, I guess.

    I can just hear them falling over each other at the brilliance of working T!t into the mix.

    [ Parent ]

    Cartoonish caricature of women in the '50s (5.00 / 4) (#63)
    by Cream City on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 05:15:16 PM EST
    i.e., Blondie and Dagwood, etc., often had women throwing dishes at men owing to "periodically feeling down," y'know.  

    No question about this one, yet again.  Can we really imagine Obama saying Edwards was throwing dishes?  I am heartily sick of Obama's imagery, feeding stereotypes from decades ago.  He could at least catch up with the culture.

    [ Parent ]

    Well, he's more than welcome to stop (5.00 / 4) (#91)
    by nycstray on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 05:39:44 PM EST
    by my place. I'm in the middle of cleaning the fridge and freezers. I could lob some fridge 'experiments' at him. I, like most women, am too smart to waste good dishes ;) Oh, and that old porcelain sink, not a chance. It's a classic, lol!~

    The clips they played of him on Thursday reminded me of good ol' boys at the office, before the women walk into the conference room. That attitude just doesn't fly with me. Many of my former co-workers know just what I'm talking about when I say I'm more than happy with my 4-legged, fur covered 'co-workers'.

    [ Parent ]

    Tip for repurposing BAD dishes and knick knacks (none / 0) (#132)
    by Ellie on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 06:50:10 PM EST
    Cathartic, artistic, and plain good fun:

    Save them up to throw against a wall and when you're in a really rotten mood, lay down a tarp and have at'em. In full fastball mode you'll get enough for a cool cement mosaic for the garden, deck or a table top.

    Beautifies your insides, too.

    [ Parent ]

    Really! How cliche! (5.00 / 1) (#161)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 07:42:16 PM EST
    When my vicious stereotypes have to throw a tanrum, my preference has always been the cast-iron frying pan upside the head. It's quick and clean, because there are no broken dishes to sweep up afterward.

    [ Parent ]
    throwing china (none / 0) (#175)
    by kaybeel on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 08:16:51 PM EST
    There is the rumor that she threw something (a vase? an ashtray?) at Bill during a Monica Lewinsky argument.  I do believe Obama is trying to bring that image to the forefront again.  Sneakily.

    [ Parent ]
    Oh - you know how sensitive he is (5.00 / 1) (#146)
    by Josey on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 07:16:10 PM EST
    proving he'd never make it through the general.
    WAAAAAA!!  What a WHINER!!
    If Hillary does have a kitchen sink - it'll never hit him in the kitchen.
    It's much too hot in there for Obama!


    [ Parent ]
    I'd have to say... (5.00 / 4) (#7)
    by Nasarius on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 04:35:51 PM EST
    Mirror, mirror on the wall?

    John Edwards is definitely the prettiest. Or maybe Dennis Kucinich's wife. Sorry, I got distracted.

    Elsewhere in the article:

    Clinton organized five events across the state as both campaigns prepared for the sprint to Tuesday. Nick Clemons, her Pennsylvania director, said the campaign would deploy 5,000 volunteers to place phone calls and knock on doors. "This is not going to be a blowout race," he said. "We're looking for a win, and we think it's going to be a close race."

    Thank goodness, someone finally knows how to play the expectations game.

    "What's she not telling you about her health care plan?" the ad asks. "It forces everyone to buy insurance even if you can't afford it, and you pay a penalty if you don't."

    Ugh. In a few months, my health insurance is going to be coming through the German public health system, which also "forces" you to buy insurance, and penalizes you if you don't. I would link to their English site, which spells out explicitly the argument for why this kind of solidarity is necessary, but it seems to be down at the moment.
    <br/<br>
    How dare the government "force" people to buy insurance? Of course, they heavily subsidize the cost, to the point where it costs nothing for people who earn little. Obama seems to lack that kind of imagination.

    Nasarius... (5.00 / 2) (#58)
    by Rainsong on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 05:11:05 PM EST
    How dare the government "force" people to buy insurance? Of course, they heavily subsidize the cost, to the point where it costs nothing for people who earn little. Obama seems to lack that kind of imagination.

    Roflmao! As a US-born dual citizen who has lived abroad a lot, I'm hoping this will be the time for UHC to be brought in..

    But what will really make me laugh at my birth-country folk is in the years after when Govt then starts "forcing" people to be healthy, so they don't have to use it, as in the UK/Europe and elsewhere :)

    Like the PBS program mentioned about the UK system with "preventative health programs", it can get quite pushy on citizens - to reduce costs. Thats why they pay doctors and clinics more for managing chronic diseases, paid to keep them out of hospital, and keep them healthy enough to keep working.

    [ Parent ]

    Rainsong (5.00 / 2) (#68)
    by Kathy on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 05:17:13 PM EST
    have you not seen employer-implemented programs in the US to make employees lose weight, quit smoking, stop drinking, etc, to bring down healthcare costs?  There was a guy on 60 Minutes who fired people for smoking and would not hire smokers to work for him.

    Preventative healthcare is happening in the US already.  Only here, you can lose your job or not get hired for a job if you're going to be too much of a drain on your potential employer, like a friend of mine who is diabetic who was turned down for a job at a medium sized company when they found out about her condition.  They weren't blatant about it, but the reasons were obvious.  I had another friend with a sick child who was told she could have the job so long as she did not try to put her kid on the company program (which was the only reason she wanted the job in the first place).


    [ Parent ]

    *nodding* Kathy (5.00 / 2) (#85)
    by Rainsong on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 05:31:03 PM EST
     Its another factor in a complicated system, probably why its so difficult to communicate to people in 30-second soundbites and slogans.

    Australia did a twist on the employer part, they got the Unions involved in such programs, forcing the employers to run/fund programs like diabetes risk-reduction in partnership funded through a tri-partite govt, employer and Union deal - and in return employers providing more generous paid and unpaid sick leave conditions, and "graduated return to work" programs etc - so people can't lose their jobs so easily.

    One in car-plants was fun, called "Gut-Busters" program, all these guys getting waist measurements, blood-pressure checks, and doing their aerobics on the assembly-line, with employers saying they had improved productivity 30% with reduced time-off and lowered blood pressure etc in their workers.

    [ Parent ]

    A couple of the larger companies (5.00 / 1) (#97)
    by nycstray on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 05:50:07 PM EST
    I worked for had voluntary programs like weight watchers, yoga, etc promoting good health. They also had company cafeterias with healthy food and support for the programs. You could have your food cooked to your specifications and the price was better than we could find outside unless we went fast food. They supported all types of eating habits. It was great. I often did breakfast, lunch and afternoon snack, lol!~  Most of my co-workers did one of the diet groups and/or workouts at both places.

    [ Parent ]
    And I have a friend (5.00 / 1) (#112)
    by gyrfalcon on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 06:15:03 PM EST
    who was fired on trumped-up charges after she was diagnosed with manic-depressive illness-- but still doing her job diligently and well right up to her last day, when she was in the office until almost 9;00 o'clock PM trying to wrap things up for her successor.

    In truth, it was a small company and the effect on their health insurance premiums of her very expensive illness would have been devastating.

    What a country!

    [ Parent ]

    Darn right (5.00 / 3) (#109)
    by dianem on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 06:07:53 PM EST
    "How dare the government "force" people to buy insurance?"

    The next thing you know they're going to be forcing us to pay for a fund for our retirement and for emergency insurance in case we lose our jobs and for  some kind of health care in our old age. Where will it end?

    [ Parent ]

    Wow! Panicked desperation. (5.00 / 2) (#12)
    by felizarte on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 04:40:40 PM EST
    With his Thelma and Louise ads going, this tirade is bound to make voters scratch their heads in wonderment.  The Kid has definitely lost his cool.  Imagine his diatribe when the Pennsylvania results come out very much in favor of Hillary!

    It seems he himself has lost his big bundle of hope and is now only left with change.

    Maybe (5.00 / 9) (#16)
    by kmblue on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 04:42:33 PM EST
    someone made him watch
    the debate.

    [ Parent ]
    The Obama Camp (5.00 / 3) (#37)
    by Benjamin3 on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 04:54:51 PM EST
    did a conference call today on the pressing issue of "Bosnia."  Wow, I'm sure glad they're taking the high road following his disastrous debate performance.

    [ Parent ]
    Maybe it is just to create an opportunity (5.00 / 1) (#48)
    by felizarte on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 05:03:05 PM EST
    to bring up Hillary's Tuzla tall tale.

    [ Parent ]
    Bingo. What other reason could there be? (none / 0) (#69)
    by Cream City on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 05:17:53 PM EST


    [ Parent ]
    Huh? Have any details? (5.00 / 4) (#65)
    by jawbone on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 05:16:20 PM EST
    What's their approach to bringing this up again--after Obama said it wasn't important and he wouldn't talk about it, that all candidates make mistakes at times.

    Welladay, it's a new day and a new approach. Okay, the ol' okie-doke, that hoodwinin' and bamboozlin' stuff.

    [ Parent ]

    Tuzla is not anywhere near the Kennedy (5.00 / 4) (#100)
    by felizarte on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 05:52:38 PM EST
    connection he detailed in his book; or that his father and mother began their romance at a MLK civil rights march;

    [ Parent ]
    You don't get it (5.00 / 1) (#123)
    by gyrfalcon on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 06:34:39 PM EST
    He's not responsible for what his campaign does, only Hillary is responsible for what everything every supoprter says and does.

    He Himself remains above the fray and has never, ever discussed Tuzla because he is so pure.

    [ Parent ]

    Their approach (5.00 / 2) (#150)
    by americanincanada on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 07:21:19 PM EST
    And I believe there is an update to this post with the link,is to say outright that she is not fit to lay a wreath at the tomb of the unknown soldier. I was sickened when I read the transcript of the Obama conference call:

    General Walter Stewart:

    "One of the inherent duties of the president of the United States is to lay a wreath at the Tomb of the Unknown Soldier on Memorial Day. Now we can assume, and let's keep in mind that Senator Clinton has said she was under sniper fire, or she joked about, which to me was the cruelest part of all this, she joked about it with Jay Leno. We can make an assumption here that the honored dead within the Tomb of the Unknown was killed by a sniper. Imagine the lack of moral authority she has now to lay a wreath at the Tomb of the Unknown Soldier on Memorial Day. I'll say this as a Vietnam veteran, hundreds, we can speculate about how the unknown died. But you go over to the Vietnam Veterans Memorial Wall and will certainty there are hundreds on that wall that died under sniper fire. That's the incident I think in a nutshell."

    "So, let's look at moral authority as the essential element of leadership. President George Bush, Sen. Clinton, Sen. McCain have squandered the moral authority of the United States of America and our ability to lead the free peoples of the world and the oppressed peoples of the world towards freedom."

    [ Parent ]

    It's the politics of hope... (5.00 / 1) (#165)
    by white n az on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 07:45:15 PM EST
    First McPeak accuses Bill of McCarthyism and now this...

    Are all of the quality retired military supporting Hillary so only the hacks are left for Obama?

    [ Parent ]

    Unity my a** (none / 0) (#170)
    by Marvin42 on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 07:54:27 PM EST
    Sorry about the implied profanity, but this is b**s*t.

    I am better now.

    [ Parent ]

    marvin, when i feel like cursing freely, (none / 0) (#191)
    by kangeroo on Sun Apr 20, 2008 at 03:05:08 AM EST
    i go over to the corrente building.  i really let it rip over there recently and it felt so cathartic.  :)

    [ Parent ]
    it's the hypocrisy (5.00 / 1) (#14)
    by Nasarius on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 04:41:25 PM EST
    Of scolding Hillary for her attacks, while simultaneously launching his own.

    As J says, it's entirely typical pol behavior.

    Not just typical pol (5.00 / 2) (#64)
    by felizarte on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 05:15:30 PM EST
    INFANTILE! What makes him think he could single handedly change human nature and a history of thousands of years.  If he is such a Christian and read the bible, he would know what I am talking about.  But I bet he never read the story of Judith in the Apocrypha who single-handedly decapitated  fearsome General Holofernes of the Assyrian army threatening the very existense of Judea, employing her strengths as a woman.  I think of this heroine of the bible especially in light of Hillary's struggle to be leader of the country.

    [ Parent ]
    OBAMA STILL SMARTING FROM THE DEBATE (5.00 / 6) (#17)
    by PssttCmere08 on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 04:42:57 PM EST
    It appears the last debate rattled him and now he feels compelled to get down and dirty.  I don't think it will help him, as it does not portray him as a fighter, it shows him as a liar.

    is he rattled? (5.00 / 1) (#135)
    by Chisoxy on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 06:54:43 PM EST
    Or trying to appear politically "tough" to calm super dels? Bit of both id say.

    [ Parent ]
    I think any super d (5.00 / 3) (#136)
    by Kathy on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 07:03:31 PM EST
    watching his behavior lately has experienced a monumental shift in perception.

    If they are both politicians, and their stated policies are around the same, then Clinton wins hands down.  He doesn't even know how to do this.  It's pathetic watching him trash talk and brush the dirt off his shoulder.  People are being tortured in our name.  People are dying in our name.  The constitution has been shat on.  Our rights as citizens have been stripped.

    We don't need more dirt kicked in our faces.  We need someone who is a hard worker and can get us out of this freaking mess.

    [ Parent ]

    It's the economy, Stu....er Obama! (5.00 / 1) (#149)
    by Josey on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 07:20:56 PM EST


    [ Parent ]
    Just when I thought (5.00 / 5) (#18)
    by stillife on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 04:43:38 PM EST
    I couldn't dislike him any more than I already do - there he goes again.  Seriously, how long can he keep up with these attacks before it begins to undermine his hope/change/unity message?

    Not since Clinton was the front-runner last year has her character been so sharply criticized.

    Is Obama running scared?  How bad are those internal polls?  

    His campaign is certainly pulling out all the stops in PA.  My son and his girlfriend are up from Philly this weekend and they tell me they've been bombarded with messages from the Obama campaign on their cellphones.

    I wonder how that's really playing (5.00 / 2) (#33)
    by Kathy on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 04:52:50 PM EST
    to the crowds?  There have to be some undecideds lumped in there who are looking for hope and change and getting politics as usual.

    Also, it's my humble opinion from a couple of business trips to PA that the folk there don't cotton to that kind of nastiness, but we'll see.

    [ Parent ]

    I can't imagine it's playing well (5.00 / 3) (#52)
    by stillife on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 05:06:24 PM EST
    but I don't get the whole Obama magic so maybe I'm out of touch.  It probably goes over great with those who are already in the tank for him, but it sure as heck wouldn't impress me if I were an undecided voter.  Anybody who's sick of Bush (and who isn't?) is likely to recognize the similarities - arrogance, egotism, attacking the opponent rather than addressing issues.  

    Also, the overkill with ads and phone calls may well backfire.  We'll see. I'm nervously optimistic.

    [ Parent ]

    Only the Governor called me today (5.00 / 2) (#71)
    by BarnBabe on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 05:18:13 PM EST
    When BHO's campaign called me many months ago to raise money, I told them I was for Edwards. Then they sent me a letter and a self addressed stamped envelope. I sent it back with a NO WAY and to take me off their mailing list. I get stuff in the mail still but it is addressed to my cousin and not me.BUT, my neighbor, who only change parties along with her husband to Dem on Mar 21st because they want to vote for Hillary in the primary and GE, she said there were calls all day long. Of course, she is getting calls from the old list and the new list  from both parties. We have one guy here who is in the GOP primary and will be running against Chris Carney. Well, who ever wins. My neighbor asked me about him. I said, do you see on the bottom of the sign, paid for by Club for Growth? Then I proceeded to tell her no no no.    

    [ Parent ]
    Good for you! (5.00 / 1) (#116)
    by stillife on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 06:21:45 PM EST
    I wonder if the reason my son and his girlfriend have received so many calls is b/c they're newly registered Dems.  This will be her first time voting, and he was previously registered as Independent.

    [ Parent ]
    Did they sign up through his efforts? (none / 0) (#130)
    by nycstray on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 06:45:38 PM EST
    I was reading his blog and they talked about how they would keep track and 'follow up' with the newly registered. They were 'making it easy' for the voter by offering to turn in their registration form for them. That way they would have the info . . .

    [ Parent ]
    No (none / 0) (#134)
    by stillife on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 06:53:47 PM EST
    I downloaded an application from the internet for Nick to change his registration from Indy to Dem. I'm not sure how his girlfriend registered, but it certainly wasn't thru the Obama campaign.  That girl loathes Obama - she even refused to make campaign calls (she's working as an intern for a guy who's a big Obama supporter).  Perhaps they're just trolling the records of recently registered Dems?  

    It's weird that they're getting cellphone calls, but they don't have a landline and I guess maybe I put his cell # on his registration form.  

    [ Parent ]

    I count myself lucky (none / 0) (#148)
    by Prabhata on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 07:18:59 PM EST
    I think if you respond with "I support your opponent, and all the money I have to spare goes to that candidate", they stop.  It worded for me when I supported Edwards and the caller wanted me to give to BO anyway to maintain the discourse.  That's when I told them: If I have an extra dollar, it goes to Edwards.  I never got another call.

    [ Parent ]
    I don't have a landline either (none / 0) (#154)
    by nycstray on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 07:28:58 PM EST
    I do have my cell registered on the Do Not Call list. I'd be pissed if I started getting calls on my cell. I dropped my landline for the cell due to business and being reachable (talking to clients while at the dog park, lol!~) I sure don't want to receive spam calls.

    They prob are on the 'new voter' list. I thought it was kinda creepy at first that you could go to campaign sites and get numbers to call. I guess I'm still 'old-skool privacy'  ;)

    [ Parent ]

    It's really creepy (5.00 / 0) (#159)
    by stillife on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 07:41:33 PM EST
    I've never gotten a telemarketing call on my cell, ever.  

    [ Parent ]
    Going negative (5.00 / 10) (#19)
    by andgarden on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 04:44:31 PM EST
    is a good sign that your numbers are going south.

    They banked hard on making her quit before PA (5.00 / 4) (#114)
    by Ellie on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 06:19:26 PM EST
    They rightly foresaw that a long stretch between Obama's last exciting win, flashy endorsement and hyperventilating media about Teh New Coolness would give everyone time to get a better look without all the smoke and mirrors, bells and whistles.

    The rhetoric is just really bad, but to see the campaign, while inert, reveal that it's been powered mostly by pestering, astro-trolling and whining is so sad.

    Plus, Mr. Inspiration himself wrote or vetted this speech? The purported heir to the brilliant JFK and MLK, who had vision, brains and a breathtaking mastery of the power of language?

    I'm just stunned anyone would attempt to hype BO as this.

    [ Parent ]

    Absolutely! (5.00 / 8) (#122)
    by ccpup on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 06:34:35 PM EST
    And the nastier the attack, the farther South the numbers are plummeting.  

    He really, REALLY needed to prove to the Supers that he could make strong in-roads -- or even just in-roads period! -- into those traditionally Democratic voting blocs that have been trending so decidedly toward Hillary in the past.  

    If six weeks, a bottomless bank account and a helping hand from the Press in marginalizing and attacking your Opponent isn't enough for you to show you can close the deal, what, for God's sake, would be?  The Supers will have some interesting questions to ask themselves after Hillary's win in PA on Tuesday.  

    And if Barack can't pull his mouth away from this surprisingly Bitter/Angry/Arrogant spigot he's been sucking on lately, the questions the Supers have may just end up answering themselves!

    [ Parent ]

    Indeed (none / 0) (#24)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 04:47:32 PM EST


    [ Parent ]
    LMAO this makes Obama sound like a complete twit (5.00 / 1) (#22)
    by Ellie on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 04:45:56 PM EST
    ...."She's got the kitchen sink flying and the china flying, the buffet is coming at me ... constant distractions, these petty, trivial, slash and burn, back and forth, tit for tat, politics."

    What's sad about the rhetoric here is that he's trying to make the point that he's being nice while Bad Monster Lady is the one hurling sinks and invective, but the phrase "tit for tat" damns his own behavior too.

    So much for living up to his promise of "new" post-partisan politics, huh?

    And of course, saying something straight up that doesn't require Squirming and WORMing (which doesn't contain a worse gaffe.)

    I wonder if Kerry didn't endorse Obama with the subconscious realization that BO is actually a bigger dud of a candidate than Kerry was.

    It's even worse on video. (5.00 / 1) (#28)
    by Maria Garcia on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 04:49:21 PM EST
    ..he really didn't look very comfortable saying it. I don't think he wrote that line himself.

    [ Parent ]
    I watched this live on CNN (5.00 / 6) (#30)
    by oldpro on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 04:50:39 PM EST
    earlier this afternoon...quite taken aback by the tone as well as the words.

    Snide.  Snotty.

    Not promising in a Democratic (?) candidate.

    [ Parent ]

    But... (1.00 / 4) (#36)
    by RosaLuxemburg on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 04:54:42 PM EST
    I though that Barack was a scary, radical drug user that doesn't believe in Amuuricah.

    Don't mix your memes. If you want your branding of him to really sink in and endure through the general so he loses, you'll have to STAY CONSISTENT.

    [ Parent ]

    How about elitist SNOB? (5.00 / 7) (#42)
    by RalphB on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 04:58:27 PM EST
    that work better for you?  Works for me.

    [ Parent ]
    Ralph... (5.00 / 4) (#84)
    by oldpro on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 05:29:30 PM EST
    I don't want to say it out loud but it is what I'm thinking as I watch him.

    There's another odd quality creeping in to his public persona lately...he looks a bit...well, scared...sort of 'deer in the headlights' as if it is dawning on him that he might actually have to live out this morality play to its third and final act.

    Epilogue, anyone?

    [ Parent ]

    oldpro (5.00 / 3) (#94)
    by RalphB on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 05:45:34 PM EST
    I thought Kerry looked out of touch and a bit snotty in '04, but this has gotten ridiculous.  Now that you mention the 'deer in the headlights', there is a Quayle-esk property there.  

    [ Parent ]
    Well, he DOES ... (5.00 / 2) (#168)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 07:49:27 PM EST
    ... remind me lately of the old Will Smith sitcom, Prince of Bel Aire.

    [ Parent ]
    that's an insult to will smith, either in (5.00 / 1) (#192)
    by kangeroo on Sun Apr 20, 2008 at 03:13:01 AM EST
    the show or in real life.  smith has integrity.

    [ Parent ]
    I actually agree with Jon Stewart here... (1.00 / 3) (#51)
    by RosaLuxemburg on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 05:05:44 PM EST
    I'd prefer my president to be an elitist, someone who is smarter than I am.

    I think we've had EIGHT YEARS TOO LONG of a president that people want to drink pints with.

    [ Parent ]

    Elitist (5.00 / 7) (#61)
    by ChrisM on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 05:13:40 PM EST
    and smart are 2 different things. John Edwards is smart but not elitist (just like elitist is not the same as wealthy).

    Nice try conflating the 2. Try again.

    [ Parent ]

    I will not speak... (5.00 / 1) (#117)
    by Stellaaa on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 06:25:48 PM EST
    TL says I have to be polite, So, I will not comment.  

    [ Parent ]
    Being elitist has nothing to do (5.00 / 4) (#151)
    by Prabhata on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 07:22:48 PM EST
    about how smart or wealthy one is.  Jon is wrong.  I'm somewhat an elitist, and I'm neither smart or wealthy.  I don't like elitists, being one is enough.

    [ Parent ]
    Wanting the president to be smarter (5.00 / 2) (#166)
    by kredwyn on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 07:46:34 PM EST
    than your average bear is a pretty good idea.

    However, the difference between being smarter...and making other people feel less than because they aren't as smart is where you draw the line between being smart and being an elitest.

    I'll bet than I'm smarter than a large chunk of the people I hang out with on Tuesday nights. But I'll be damned if I let them feel less than cause my IQ is higher.

    [ Parent ]

    Echoing lactating (5.00 / 1) (#190)
    by cal1942 on Sun Apr 20, 2008 at 02:13:57 AM EST
    Elitism has nothing to do with either intelligence or money.

    I want a President who is better than I am.  That's why I'm supporting Hillary Clinton.  She's head and shoulders above Obama in both intelligence and character.

    By the way Rosa I wouldn't even want to have a beer with Obama even if he picked up the tab.

    [ Parent ]

    Well, I think Obama does at least know (4.85 / 7) (#56)
    by Practically Lactating on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 05:10:19 PM EST
    the definition of elitist, so you may well get your wish. By the way, intelligence and elitism have nothing to do with each other.

    [ Parent ]
    Jon Stewart (4.66 / 3) (#59)
    by white n az on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 05:11:31 PM EST
    gives all appearances of being an elitist himself but hey, life's been good

    [ Parent ]
    I will challenge you to ever find a post by (5.00 / 4) (#43)
    by Teresa on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 04:59:02 PM EST
    oldpro that states that nonsense.

    [ Parent ]
    Thank you, Teresa. (5.00 / 6) (#57)
    by oldpro on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 05:10:54 PM EST
    You're right...not my style.

    [ Parent ]
    If he gets the nom (5.00 / 2) (#45)
    by Kathy on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 04:59:36 PM EST
    which seems more unlikely by the day, he'll do enough on his own to kill himself in the ge.  Or, one could argue his past speaks volumes for the Right already.

    [ Parent ]
    Obama is doing fine by himself (5.00 / 2) (#78)
    by felizarte on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 05:23:27 PM EST
    what does he need help for my anyone here? I'm sure you have heard the quote: "those whom the gods want to destroy, they first make mad." or something like that.

    Obama cannot seem to stop debating April 16 over and over again. Doesn't he know that the voters are really inclined to change the topic?  What better projection of hope than a candidate like Hillary who could still smile, laugh and explain her policy proposals even with everything she has been through these years and recent months?

    [ Parent ]

    You read that here, did you now? (none / 0) (#125)
    by gyrfalcon on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 06:39:11 PM EST


    [ Parent ]
    Takes a strong woman to fling a kitchen sink (5.00 / 9) (#40)
    by jawbone on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 04:56:30 PM EST
    around like a frisbee!

    Not only Annie Oakley, but Superwoman as well!

    [ Parent ]

    He needs to get on that duckblind (5.00 / 2) (#179)
    by MarkL on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 10:09:31 PM EST
    to protect himself.

    [ Parent ]
    His campaign (5.00 / 11) (#44)
    by Ga6thDem on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 04:59:21 PM EST
    has been careening out of control more or less since the Wright tapes broke. The debate obviously did big damage or he wouldn't be flailing like this.

    It is sooo nice in PA today, (5.00 / 7) (#49)
    by Mrwirez on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 05:03:54 PM EST
    I don't know who is really watching TV anyway it is 80 degrees and sunny in Pittsburgh. We are heading over to Hillary's campaign stop in Mckeesport PA tonight!! OUT IN THE PARK!!

    Have a great time... (5.00 / 2) (#54)
    by Maria Garcia on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 05:09:15 PM EST
    ...it's a beautiful day here in MD too.

    [ Parent ]
    I (5.00 / 9) (#70)
    by sas on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 05:17:57 PM EST
    made calls for Hillary yesterday and today.  There are the usual "hang-ups" and Republicans.  There are undecideds (or else they just don't say).  

    Overall, I got a few Obamas but alot of Hillary supporters.

    Today I'm encouraged.

    [ Parent ]

    x (none / 0) (#67)
    by CognitiveDissonance on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 05:16:59 PM EST
    Must be nice. It was snowing in Salem, Oregon this morning. Extremely weird weather.


    [ Parent ]
    "Something of a role reversal" (5.00 / 5) (#62)
    by barryluda on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 05:15:02 PM EST
    Obama is trying to catch up before Tuesday with Clinton now taking a winner's posture.  If this is as close as Obama is going to get in PA, and that now the trend is back toward Clinton expanding her lead again, then she'll likely get the 10 point plus win she'll need in PA to have a chance to win the nomination.
    Test your knowledge of dirty campaign (5.00 / 2) (#83)
    by nellre on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 05:29:18 PM EST
    Test your knowledge of dirty campaign tactics
    quiz

    Rather an eye opener

    No way... (none / 0) (#90)
    by white n az on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 05:39:06 PM EST
    His is the politics of hope

    ;-)

    Took the quiz...obvious but effective

    [ Parent ]

    Obama's image (5.00 / 7) (#101)
    by Foxx on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 05:57:04 PM EST
    which is all he has, is shattered. He never lived up to it, his campaign was always negative, dirty, divisive and dishonest. But now it is showing on his face.

    I gotta agree (5.00 / 8) (#110)
    by Kathy on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 06:12:52 PM EST
    he just looks contemptuous now, like he's smack talking on the basketball court.

    No wonder women (like me) don't get his "charms."

    [ Parent ]

    He may not be like Bush on policies (5.00 / 1) (#155)
    by Prabhata on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 07:29:53 PM EST
    but he's like Bush in his snobbery, smirk and immature. His finger gesture to Hillary besides being immaturity, demonstrated low class.


    [ Parent ]
    isn't Obama umm.. a Senator in.. umm.. Washington? (5.00 / 2) (#113)
    by BostonIndependent on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 06:17:29 PM EST


    I wonder how much time he's (5.00 / 1) (#139)
    by derridog on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 07:09:42 PM EST
    actually spent in Washington.

    [ Parent ]
    He was sworn in Jan. '07. (5.00 / 1) (#162)
    by FlaDemFem on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 07:42:26 PM EST
    And he has gone on a lot of trips while in office. I read somewhere that he thinks the Senate duties are boring. Here is the link to Wikipedia which gives a good idea of how many trips he has taken and where he has taken them. He seems to have spent more time traveling than working as a Senator. Building up his foreign policy creds, I guess. He doesn't seem to like office work much. In Illinois, he just had to work from Jan to May, four months out of the year. So, perhaps being in the Senate is a bit much for his attention span. Although, he is up on how Washington works enough to get $300 million in earmarks his first year there. His old friend Emil Jones calls it steak, not pork. Oh yeah, Obama is sooooooo not old style DC. Snicker.

    [ Parent ]
    Why mandates are necessary (5.00 / 5) (#124)
    by landjjames on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 06:35:30 PM EST
    I've lived in three countries with universal health care in addition to living here.  Each country's system had different problems, but all were superior in the health care they offered to what those here at home with no health care receive (or rather don't receive.)  Mandates are necessary.  Without some kind of mandate, it's impossible to create a truly universal system (that includes everyone) and thereby gain the benefits of an all-inclusive pool.  Unless you have everyone in the system (ie, participation is compulsory), young, healthy people tend opt out (assuming they'll never need it), and that leaves sick, older, and otherwise heavy users of care in the system.  These are very costly patients, so without the young healthy people (the light users) in the system, you can't create a pool in which everyone is paying in and those needing care are drawing out.  The overarching principle is that eventually everyone needs care and the costs of it always far exceed the amount of money a person has paid in premiums.
    Oops (5.00 / 3) (#126)
    by landjjames on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 06:39:37 PM EST
    Sorry about that.  I added the last message to the wrong thread. My apologies.

    [ Parent ]
    Politics of Ridicule (5.00 / 8) (#127)
    by ruffian on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 06:40:13 PM EST
    Seems to me that people only ridicule their opponent when they feel threatened.  People confident in their lead don't resort to what Obama has been doing since the debate.

    It reminds me of one of those cowardly characters in movies who can't stand up when it counts, and then when the danger has passed can't stop making fun of his opponent.

    Obama had a horrible debate.  He managed to make the MSM story be about the stupid questions in the first part, but real people who saw the debate know that when it did get around to substance, he floundered.  Even Jon Stewart noted that the other night.  Now he is just ridiculing Hillary to act tough.

    Pathetic.  I hope he really gets his clock cleaned in PA.

    Obama's Message Is... (5.00 / 4) (#131)
    by OxyCon on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 06:45:51 PM EST
    "Hate Hillary! She's Bad! She's A Horrible Person! Despise Her!"
    Obama drives all of the Hillary hatred that his "A-List" blogging supporters feel towards her.
    He constantly vilifies her. He isn't satisfied to debate her on policy. He wants to destroy her character and portray her as a loathsome creature worthy of his supporter's wrath.

    Had Obama not attacked Clinton (5.00 / 1) (#145)
    by Kathy on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 07:15:26 PM EST
    we would be saying, "remember that guy...?"

    [ Parent ]
    Yep (5.00 / 2) (#152)
    by phat on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 07:23:24 PM EST
    This was the only way, I think, that he could win the nomination. It's a big, big gamble.

    He's going all in with the Democratic Party, it seems.

    This sounds like hyperbole, I know. And it's certainly a hunch.

    If I'm right, he'd better have the cards do back this up when it's just him and McCain sitting at the table.


    [ Parent ]

    speaking of cards (5.00 / 2) (#163)
    by Kathy on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 07:44:06 PM EST
    I wonder when the story about Obama's poker playing with lobbyists is going to pop up.  Apparently, he was usually a really big winner in these games, despite not betting a lot.

    [ Parent ]
    Wow (5.00 / 1) (#177)
    by phat on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 08:28:32 PM EST
    I didn't have any idea he was a poker player.

    Hmmm...

    [ Parent ]

    Back when I watched Jon Stewart (5.00 / 1) (#180)
    by Kathy on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 10:33:41 PM EST
    he had a very respected political writer on, and the guy was talking about ye olde days when the easiest way to give money to a politician was to play poker with him and let him win.


    [ Parent ]
    I was thinking the same thing (none / 0) (#188)
    by felizarte on Sun Apr 20, 2008 at 12:31:18 AM EST
    because I know this for a fact with another politician I know.

    [ Parent ]
    If BO had not attacked Clinton with racism (5.00 / 4) (#169)
    by Prabhata on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 07:49:57 PM EST
    would be nowhere, but that demonstrates how unaccomplished BO is

    [ Parent ]
    Before he was Washington (5.00 / 6) (#137)
    by facta non verba on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 07:05:00 PM EST
    he was all Chicago. Ask Alice Palmer and the four others he knocked off the ballot. Ask his opponent in the Democratic Primary (Hull) who released private medical information to the press. Ask his first Republican rival who divulged his private sex life to the press.

    Duplicitous is the adjective I think of when it comes to Obama.

    I've been curious about (5.00 / 1) (#138)
    by stillife on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 07:06:37 PM EST
    that first Republican opponent.  Did Obama's campaign leak the sex scandal?

    [ Parent ]
    It's been bandied about (5.00 / 1) (#143)
    by Kathy on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 07:13:29 PM EST
    that they leaked the story about Edwards' haircut.

    I think they'd leak anything that helped them--and, yeah, I've heard they got the divorce papers unsealed, too.  I remember the story at the time (though Obama's name was never mentioned in the national press, just the wife) and all I could think was, "that poor woman.  How humiliating."

    There is a reason things like that get sealed.  I'm not crazy that it helped (or would have) her husband's political career, but she didn't want those details out there, either.

    Just another woman who gets trampled over in the rise to power.

    [ Parent ]

    Really? (none / 0) (#153)
    by stillife on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 07:25:35 PM EST
    I didn't know they were connected to the Edwards haircut ridiculous mini-scandal, but if so, all I can say is - wow.  And at the same time, he was convincing Edwards to take his name off the ballot in Michigan.  And they say Hillary is the one who will do anything in her ruthless rise to power!

    I know I read somewhere that his campaign had something to do with getting those divorce papers unsealed.  Of course, Obama wouldn't care about the feelings of the wife.  Bros before hos!

    [ Parent ]

    Apparently (5.00 / 1) (#184)
    by Serene1 on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 11:54:52 PM EST
    as per a Slate reporter Obama's surrogates were also trying their level best to convince reporters to dig into Bill's post WH affairs.

    Already huffpo (Obama's website in Chief) has been clamouring for McCain's medical records.

    [ Parent ]

    No, he didn't. (5.00 / 1) (#171)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 08:01:11 PM EST
    Those particular rumors about Jack Ryan's kinky habits had been floating around the ether ever since 1999, when he went through a rather nasty divorce with his starlet wife, Jeri Ryan. All court records were initially sealed, and the Chicago Tribune and WLS-TV successfully sued in Los Angeles Superior Court five years later to have them released when Ryan declared his candidacy.

    [ Parent ]
    The Chicago Press (5.00 / 1) (#176)
    by facta non verba on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 08:17:24 PM EST
    suggests it was David Alexrod who did both leaks. There is a story on this in the NYT. It's from April 2007, look for it. I think it was a Sunday magazine piece.

    [ Parent ]
    Hold on. (1.00 / 4) (#31)
    by RosaLuxemburg on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 04:51:55 PM EST
    Barack calling Hillary a divisive, negative campaigner does not make him negative or divisive.

    Let us distinguish, please, between an honest critique of what's happening (i.e. Barack's comments above) and the kind of smear tactics and low-blows that are the mark of the Clinton campaign.

    All criticism is not "slash and burn" and "petty" and "divisive."

    Um ok (5.00 / 3) (#34)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 04:53:07 PM EST


    [ Parent ]
    Clinton Rules v. Obama Rules! (5.00 / 3) (#41)
    by jawbone on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 04:57:58 PM EST
    That which is despised in the opponent it respected from the The One being supported.

    Sheesh.

    [ Parent ]

    Please cite specifics (5.00 / 2) (#46)
    by felizarte on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 04:59:43 PM EST
    and don't just keep throwing phrases around.  Although I do sympathize with you as a supporter of Obama especially when he is this discombobulated.  With me, I can accept Hillary not getting the nomination.  I will just vote for McCain especially when Obama and his supporters do not stop mischaracterizing her policy proposals and treating her like evil incarnate.

    [ Parent ]
    Hillary is not evil (1.57 / 7) (#53)
    by RosaLuxemburg on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 05:08:32 PM EST
    I don't think Hillary is "evil incarnate." I simple think she has dragged our political discourse into the gutter and that she may be intentionally helping John McCain win the GE so she can run again in 2012. Morally obtuse? Yes. Selfish? Yes. Evil? No. Just human, all too human.

    [ Parent ]
    All too human, unlike Obama? (5.00 / 2) (#55)
    by Maria Garcia on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 05:10:16 PM EST


    [ Parent ]
    Obama is posthuman! (5.00 / 13) (#79)
    by Fabian on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 05:24:24 PM EST
    Whatever that means.  I have yet to see any example of "post partisanship" myself - whatever that means.  I personally think that "post partisan" means "not a Democrat".

    [ Parent ]
    Double LOL! (none / 0) (#157)
    by bjorn on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 07:37:03 PM EST


    [ Parent ]
    You don't think she's evil (5.00 / 12) (#60)
    by Kathy on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 05:13:08 PM EST
    but on the other hand, you think she's destroying the democratic party, continuing the war, screwing over the country, etc, just so she can get the spot in 2012?

    I am glad you think so highly of her otherwise.

    Speaking for myself, I'm not worried about Obama's negative, gutter campaigning against Clinton hurting her chances in the ge.  I think that they prove how strong she is because she still keeps winning.  I also think she's running for 2012, but only because that's one of the things you do during your first term: push to win a second one.

    [ Parent ]

    Well (5.00 / 3) (#74)
    by sas on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 05:20:01 PM EST
    thanks for your generosity.

    She isn't destroying this party.  She has every right to run and why shouldn't she?  This race is close, and getting closer.

    Maybe Obama is destroying the party?

    [ Parent ]

    For the love of Zeus (5.00 / 2) (#121)
    by Stellaaa on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 06:34:12 PM EST
    and all the Olympian Pantheon, can you stop whining?  Can you stop plastering the same ideas over and over.  Please show some respect for the Rosa and have some dignity and come up with some new ideas

     

    Freiheit ist immer Freiheit der Andersdenkenden), :  Freedom is always and exclusively freedom for the one who thinks differently


    [ Parent ]
    But you are doing ad homs here (none / 0) (#77)
    by Cream City on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 05:22:12 PM EST
    at another commenter and now making these statements, and it's such a nice day to come across such nasties.  I just have to send some 1's your way before I go off to enjoy better company.

    [ Parent ]
    Excuse me... (none / 0) (#141)
    by kredwyn on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 07:10:07 PM EST
    but the people who drug our political discourse into the gutter started that process a long long time ago.

    They are the Michelle "Let's stalk the Frosts" Malkins, the Ann "Jersey Girlz are scum" Coulters, and others of this world.

    HRC, on the other hand, pointed out this past Wednesday that Barack Obama was electable as POTUS.

    (NB: Not a supporter of either Dem candidate at this point in time...but very fed up with the derogatory memes being bandied about.)

    [ Parent ]

    Right, his own campaign made (5.00 / 2) (#47)
    by RalphB on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 05:00:18 PM EST
    him negative and divisive.  Beginning last June when they attacked Bill Clinton be making money from 9/11.  Classless.

    [ Parent ]
    You mean (5.00 / 4) (#86)
    by felizarte on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 05:31:48 PM EST
    like Hillary claiming she is more ready to be CIC and to receive calls at 3am? Or that she has at least sixteen years more experience than he in foreign affairs and defense matters as an adult compared to his four years spent in Indonesia when he was between six and ten years old? Facts are divisive or slash and burn tactics?

    The truth hurts Obama?

    [ Parent ]

    Is this snark? (5.00 / 7) (#87)
    by dianem on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 05:31:53 PM EST
    The first time I read it I thought you were being sarcastic. Then I read who had written it and started to wonder if you were being serious.

    Assuming you are serious: Obama has been comparing Bill Clinton, the last Democratic President, to George Bush. I don't see how much more "slash and burn" you can get - he is trashing the legacy of the Democratic Party in order to win a primary. As for "smear"... Obama has labelled both Clinton's and a number of their supporter's as racists. These are people who have worked for racial equality for most of their lives. I can't imagine anything more "divisive" than to have highly respected Democrats marked as racists. Obama has divided this nation into "racists" and "anti-racists", with anybody who doesn't support him firmly in the "racist" category.

    Axelrod is running a Rovian campaign in support of obama and Obama is going along with it and even joining in gleefully, when necessary. Whether he wins the election or not, he has divided the Democratic Party for the next generation.

    [ Parent ]

    Division is right and so the next question (5.00 / 4) (#93)
    by Mark Woods on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 05:44:34 PM EST
    has to be, what exactly would be Mr. Obama's plan to 'unite', if he ever actually manages to win the nomination?

    I know that Hillary asked for my vote and that's one of the reasons she's got it, but when did Obama ever ask for anything?

    There's nothing about his approach that appeals to me, and for some reason to none of my 50 or older female friends or family members.

    I've read pronouncements about Obama 'uniting' us once Hillary is 'completely out of the way'.  This does not constitute a real plan for healing the nasty divisions -- which I believe only a Clinton/Obama ticket is going to fix (or Obama/Clinton).

    [ Parent ]

    exactly right (none / 0) (#189)
    by angie on Sun Apr 20, 2008 at 01:48:14 AM EST
    in fact, despite the title of this thread, I don't think Obama is "off message" at all -- the bash Clinton (Bill & Hill) message has been his only real message from the get go.
    As Fat Albert would say -- Obama is like school in the summer time . . .

    [ Parent ]
    Please tell me which tactics of Clinton's (5.00 / 1) (#102)
    by nycstray on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 05:58:25 PM EST
    you are speaking of and how they differ from Obama's.

    [ Parent ]
    An (5.00 / 1) (#108)
    by sas on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 06:07:16 PM EST
    "honest critique of what's happening"   - es[ecially from an "unbiased" source.

    He speaks the truth, ...she smears and uses low blows,....right, unbiased.

    [ Parent ]

    LOL (none / 0) (#95)
    by Edgar08 on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 05:46:21 PM EST
    Comedy gold!

    [ Parent ]
    actually... (none / 0) (#144)
    by kredwyn on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 07:14:04 PM EST
    when you say "X is divisive," you're pretty much playing the divisive card...and being divisive whilst trying to lay it at the door of the other party.

    [ Parent ]
    Ah, its all so clear now. (none / 0) (#147)
    by Chisoxy on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 07:18:39 PM EST
    All criticism is not "slash and burn" and "petty"

    You're right. It seems its only when Hillary is critical that it becomes those things.

    Not to mention smear tactics and low-blows.

    [ Parent ]

    OK. (none / 0) (#172)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 08:05:41 PM EST
    Care to offer details and specifics regarding her smear tactics? Allegations don't become fact simply upon numerous repetitions.

    [ Parent ]
    Do people like (none / 0) (#10)
    by wasabi on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 04:38:54 PM EST
    Do people like all his whining?  I know I don't.  I have a rather large painted board I bought when my kids were quite young that hangs on the wall above my kitchen table.  It says, "Thou Shalt Not Whine".

    I have a button and a mug. (5.00 / 1) (#23)
    by oldpro on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 04:47:29 PM EST
    Wear the button with the international strikeout "NO!" superimposed over the word 'whining' to EVERY meeting I go to.

    Used the mug at my desk in the legislature...filled it with candies...hard to ignore.

    If anyone starts to whine, you can just point to the button or the mug!

    [ Parent ]

    They BOTH do what one could describe (2.00 / 1) (#13)
    by bumblebums on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 04:40:51 PM EST
    as whining. The Clintons have been working the refs for months.

    A little honesty, please.

    [ Parent ]

    Working the refs (5.00 / 2) (#72)
    by wasabi on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 05:18:17 PM EST
    Working the refs is one thing, but Obama has personally been in whine mode for days now.  

    [ Parent ]
    Come on (1.00 / 1) (#82)
    by bumblebums on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 05:28:06 PM EST
    Hillary's no stranger to full bore whine. I needn't trot out all the occasions.

    [ Parent ]
    Please do (5.00 / 2) (#92)
    by Florida Resident on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 05:41:47 PM EST


    [ Parent ]
    We're waiting with bated breath! (5.00 / 1) (#103)
    by jawbone on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 05:59:55 PM EST
    If no reply soon, we may pass out, all this breathing abated and all.

    [ Parent ]
    If Obama's for Change, 'HRC does it too' is no ... (none / 0) (#119)
    by Ellie on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 06:27:23 PM EST
    ... defense of HIS behavior. He promised to set a new standard and hasn't lived up to it one day of his campaign.

    She's held that she knows how politics as they've existed during her long record in the field are played, and she can win. She can, she has, and she's outlasted her enemies.

    Whining that HRC too is a bald admission that Obama is a huckster, a phony and a liar.

    [ Parent ]

    Obama: Just As Good As Hillary! (5.00 / 3) (#142)
    by Fabian on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 07:10:18 PM EST
    I like that campaign slogan!

    [ Parent ]
    I can agree (none / 0) (#193)
    by herb the verb on Sun Apr 20, 2008 at 06:54:15 AM EST
    Obama is complaining/whining now, Clinton was complaining/whining then. I'm sure you also agree that the level of offense against them was not remotely, in any concievable way similar.

    Plus, Obama, his supporters and "neutral" democrats have sat by while the unfair attacks against Clinton raged. He and they can complain/whine if they want, that doesn't make them whiners, it makes them hypocrits.

    [ Parent ]

    Whenever is see the words "the Clintons" (5.00 / 5) (#128)
    by hairspray on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 06:42:36 PM EST
    I know it is an Obamablot.

    [ Parent ]
    Absolutely (none / 0) (#26)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 04:48:00 PM EST
    An A for Bumblebums.

    [ Parent ]
    Whining is what BO does best (none / 0) (#160)
    by Prabhata on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 07:42:08 PM EST
    BO and his camp have been whining since after IA.  In fact it got so bad in SC, I imitated a crying whiny child making fun of BO, and my grandchildren who support BO because my daughter does, got upset that I was making fun of their mom's hero.

    [ Parent ]
    I have one of those... (none / 0) (#133)
    by kredwyn on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 06:53:02 PM EST
    hanging over my desk.

    [ Parent ]
    Now he just leaks weak and whiny (none / 0) (#11)
    by Kathy on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 04:39:51 PM EST
    Lookit, you can't run on being the person who is going to take the high road, who won't do politics as usual, and then turn around and do the very thing you rail against.  Same with taking money from lobbyists, same with that bill he said he passed that didn't get passed.  That is specious and self serving.

    The new ads are interesting to me, because if you go to Emily's List, you'll see on the front page that Bev Perdue, who is running for gov of NC, has decided not to go negative, and put it in an ad.

    That's walking and talking the talk--and being a good enough politician to not only stick by the pledge, but reap rewards for it.

    Worse than that. (5.00 / 5) (#32)
    by felizarte on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 04:52:09 PM EST
    He throws the sink at Hillary and knocks her down; she gets up and dusts herself off and throws the same sink at him and walks away. it hits him down; and he cries "mommy! She hit me!" And Hillary is nowhere around.

    [ Parent ]
    I see you have met my cousin (5.00 / 3) (#35)
    by Kathy on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 04:53:50 PM EST


    [ Parent ]
    LoL between four brothers! (none / 0) (#96)
    by felizarte on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 05:48:45 PM EST
    and Obama is not being cue like Charlie Brown to Lucy.

    [ Parent ]
    No, he looks like...like...well, you know... (5.00 / 6) (#81)
    by Camorrista on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 05:26:35 PM EST
    Lookit, you can't run on being the person who is going to take the high road, who won't do politics as usual, and then turn around and do the very thing you rail against.  

    What is wrong with you?  Of course you can--if you're Senator Obama.

    If you're Senator Obama there is never a contradiction between what you say and do--or between what you say today and what you said yesterday--because you are Senator Obama.

    Unlike Whitman, the contradictions you contain are either invisible or insignificant--except to your sworn and deadly enemies.  

    Your friends, and neutral spectators, know--know, know, know--that because you are good, decent, kindly, noble,prophetic and visionary--a Capra hero for the new Millenium, a multi-cultural, multi-racial Mister Smith--what you say is always, good, decent, kindly, noble, prophetic and visionary--even if were it said by any other male politician it would be petty, spiteful, pouty, vengeful and mysogynistic.  

    To be honest, Kathy, I'm shocked at your comment.  You've demonstrated over and over that you're smart, reasonable and witty.  How could you commit such a post?  Didn't you learn anything from the fallout after the ABC debate?  

    When reporters eviscerate Senator Clinton, that's politics, and she (and her supporters) should stop whining and take the hits.  When reporters eviscerate Senator Obama, the press has never sunk so low, and Obama (and his supporters) should attack those reporters--and of course Senator Clinton--until they run out of breath (hah! wait for that day, I dare you).  

    Kathy, please repeat after me:  Obama is not a pol.  He is above politics.  

    Therefore, he has the right to complain (and complain, and complain) when things don't go his way; he has the right to treat the truth as Turkish taffy, stretchable on demand; he has the right to demean other Democrats (including our only two-term Dem president since Roosevelt) while endlessly batting his come-hither eyelashes at any Republican who strolls by; and, he--not to mention his acolytes--has the right to imply that anyone who questions any part of his resume or skills is a racist.  

    Our very own non-pol.  Heaven help us.

    [ Parent ]

    I think I just choked on some kool-aid (5.00 / 3) (#89)
    by Kathy on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 05:33:21 PM EST


    [ Parent ]
    It is fascinating (5.00 / 2) (#120)
    by gyrfalcon on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 06:31:26 PM EST
    and in some ways, I'm almost sorry he's not ever going to be president because it would be so fascinating to see what he does and what kind of complicated pretzels he would twist himself into and  what spectacular lengths his fans would go to excuse everything he does.

    If I were younger, I would find the prospect less amusing, but at my age, I'm intellectually actually a little disappointed it's a scene we won't get to watch.

    [ Parent ]

    Right (5.00 / 4) (#129)
    by ineedalife on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 06:44:54 PM EST
    Like when he tells a reporter that Russians keep electing Putin's cronies because they are bitter ex-commies clinging to their antipathy of people not like them. After his SoS spends six months smoothing things out and makes a few major concessions he will do it again with another country.

    Actually it will be a test of his leadership to even get his Secretary of State confirmed. It will be some 8 year old Indonesian kid. According to Obama they know more about foreign policy than anyone.

    [ Parent ]

    Humph....!! (5.00 / 3) (#173)
    by FlaDemFem on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 08:08:23 PM EST
    If this is true..
    Obama is not a pol.  He is above politics.  
    then he should not be running for President. You have to do politics if you are President. Perhaps Obama can go back to his day job, writing inspirational semi-fiction, and leave the politics to the professionals, like Hillary Clinton.

    [ Parent ]
    Yes, he can! (5.00 / 1) (#118)
    by gyrfalcon on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 06:27:10 PM EST
    Consistency is the hobgoblin of small minds, doncha know.

    It's very clear he thinks he can get away with absolutely anything, and he's right.  The folks who haven't made up their minds yet haven't been paying very close attention and his adoring supporters will excuse away anything he does or says.

    [ Parent ]

    haha! "Looks weak and whiny" -- sorry! (none / 0) (#15)
    by Kathy on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 04:41:35 PM EST


    [ Parent ]
    funny. (none / 0) (#21)
    by Maria Garcia on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 04:45:05 PM EST


    [ Parent ]
    Leak was better :-) (none / 0) (#39)
    by RalphB on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 04:55:59 PM EST


    [ Parent ]
    I thought leak was good too. LOL (none / 0) (#164)
    by Prabhata on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 07:44:28 PM EST


    [ Parent ]
    WOW, & NEWSWEEK HAS OBAMA UP 20 POINTS?? (none / 0) (#20)
    by PssttCmere08 on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 04:44:47 PM EST
    How wrong is that....things that make you go hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm???

    They probably got their (5.00 / 2) (#174)
    by FlaDemFem on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 08:14:07 PM EST
    numbers from Kos. He works there, after all.

    [ Parent ]
    lol, you could be right. I believe Kos (5.00 / 1) (#178)
    by Teresa on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 09:45:11 PM EST
    predicted Obama by 16 in Texas.

    [ Parent ]
    The "flip-off" speech (none / 0) (#25)
    by nellre on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 04:47:58 PM EST
    Steve Benen is claiming it's silly
    When a momentary facial itch rises to national significance

    Hillary is asking people to think
    Clinton, Obama press for advantage ahead of pivotal primary

    Maybe the glamor will wear off before it's too late.

    It is silly (5.00 / 1) (#75)
    by dianem on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 05:20:07 PM EST
    It's ridiculous, actually. So is the "brushing off" thing he's been doing. I am reluctant to believe that he intentionally used a 6th grade trick in order to be petty, except for two things.  1) His audience roared when he did it, making it seem as if THEY think it's a clever trick (unless people actually applaud when Obama scratches his nose) and 2) this silly brushing thing seems so 6th grade that it makes me wonder.

    [ Parent ]
    Ya never know (none / 0) (#181)
    by wasabi on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 10:39:50 PM EST
    I've seen the video where they applaused when he blew his nose.  Yikes!

    [ Parent ]
    True (none / 0) (#27)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 04:48:38 PM EST
    But the New Politics schtick makes him vulnerable like this.

    Superdelegate update (none / 0) (#29)
    by magster on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 04:49:23 PM EST
    Obama has received 7 to Clinton's 5 this last week.

    Even if accurate bad news for Obama (5.00 / 1) (#99)
    by Marvin42 on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 05:52:28 PM EST
    If Hillary Clinton is starting to get this kind of numbers now, when supposedly its over, its not good news. If Obama campaign's spin on this thing was right she would be getting nothing until they all come to him.

    Bad sign for him imo.

    [ Parent ]

    True - it shows that BO has not made the sale (none / 0) (#167)
    by Prabhata on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 07:47:13 PM EST


    [ Parent ]
    Thanks for the info :) n/t (none / 0) (#66)
    by eleanora on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 05:16:24 PM EST


    [ Parent ]
    Hate to rain on your parade (not really) (5.00 / 1) (#73)
    by Kathy on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 05:18:46 PM EST
    but weren't a couple of those "re-announced" to pump up the numbers?

    [ Parent ]
    Which ones? Clinton's or Obama's? n/t (none / 0) (#76)
    by dianem on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 05:20:46 PM EST


    [ Parent ]
    IDK, but (none / 0) (#105)
    by eleanora on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 06:03:54 PM EST
    good superdelegate trackers are hard to find. I did notice the site linked above seems to have Margaret Campbell of MT still in Obama's column. She had to retract her endorsement because party rules don't let the party vice-chair endorse until after our primary June 3rd. I tried to leave a comment, but that site locked up my computer :(

    [ Parent ]
    That is because (none / 0) (#187)
    by onemanrules on Sun Apr 20, 2008 at 12:14:31 AM EST
    different sites count them differently. Some of them will remove her because of the rule. Others will not because she has stated for whom she will vote for even though it isn't an official SD tally. In other words, they figure her vote is a lock for Obama.

    [ Parent ]
    Newsweek Poll (none / 0) (#182)
    by Serene1 on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 10:41:35 PM EST
    was v.v.v.v.interesting. Didn't know the ABC debate had such an effect on them.

    This particular report by slate gives us a look into the new way of doing politics.

    http://www.slate.com/id/2189485/

    Thanks for the message (none / 0) (#185)
    by Serene1 on Sat Apr 19, 2008 at 11:58:40 PM EST
    Your Messiah has already told us Hillary does not matter, his supporters have told us we do not matter, now you have told us this website does not matter.

    So thanks for stopping by and Good Night and Good Luck!

    So if (none / 0) (#186)
    by onemanrules on Sun Apr 20, 2008 at 12:08:35 AM EST
    he fights back, then he isn't living his message. On the other hand if he says or does nothing, then he is a weak leader. Now I understand. Thanks

    Wrong (none / 0) (#194)
    by herb the verb on Sun Apr 20, 2008 at 07:06:07 AM EST
    On the one hand, if he doesn't fight back, he is backing up his Unity Pony walk. On the other hand, if he runs a positive campaign, he is backing up his Unity Pony walk.

    Or he could run a negative attack campaign like he has already done since last October just another pol.

    I really hope you do understand, this isn't a problem with OTHER PEOPLE'S cognitive dissonance, it is a problem of Obama's own making and the wishful thinking of his supporters. You either ARE the Unity Pony or you are not. There is no try, as Yoda might say.

    [ Parent ]

    The Candidate for Change Goes AWOL in Message Today | 187 comments (187 topical)

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