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FL And MI Are Dems' Problem

By Big Tent Democrat, Section Elections 2008
Posted on Thu Mar 06, 2008 at 01:59:14 PM EST
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By Big Tent Democrat

Perhaps Howard Dean wants to clarify his remarks in light of this from Marc Ambinder:

The Democratic Congressional Campaign Committee is targeting several Republican House seats in both states (FL-08, FL-09, FL-13, FL-24, MI-07, MI-9).

Democratic strategists are worried about the DNC's tough no-compromise-on-the-rules stance and want a compromise. Dem candidates in these districts are getting pummeled in town hall meetings on the subjects of getting their delegates seated. And many of their major donors are beginning to pressure them to pressure the presidential candidates.

Michigan and Florida is EVERY Democrats' problem.

< FL Sen. Bill Nelson Calls For Florida Revote | Wyoming Hits the National Radar, Hillary Campaigning There Too >

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    FL And MI Are Dems' Problem | 40 comments (40 topical)

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    so much for downticket candidates. (5.00 / 2) (#1)
    by Kathy on Thu Mar 06, 2008 at 02:09:59 PM EST


    But it is not their Problem : ) (5.00 / 1) (#2)
    by Florida Resident on Thu Mar 06, 2008 at 02:12:03 PM EST


    I'm all for a redo (5.00 / 1) (#12)
    by cannondaddy on Thu Mar 06, 2008 at 02:32:45 PM EST
    But Dean said funding the revote is not their problem.

    Let's have a bake sale (5.00 / 1) (#16)
    by wasabi on Thu Mar 06, 2008 at 02:41:13 PM EST
    Let's have a bake sale to fund the Democratic primaries in Florida and Michigan.  It doesn't seem like it will get done any other way.
    How sad.  We are going to lose Florida and possibly the election in November because nobody will pay for a re-do.

    "Pressure the Presidential Candidates" (5.00 / 1) (#21)
    by hookfan on Thu Mar 06, 2008 at 02:55:15 PM EST
    Hillary has supported either the seating of delegates per the current election or have a revote. Is Obama cutting his own throat by not pushing for a revote? If Florida turns on him won't he have a hard time in the GE? And if so, cannot Hillary make that as part of her case for electability to the Superdelegates? Obama's pushing it off on the DNC and the State party seems weak. If he wins the nomination through not seating the Florida delegates, he lessens the Democratic chances in the GE. The word "boneheaded" comes to mind.

    $20M for revote in Florida (none / 0) (#3)
    by Josey on Thu Mar 06, 2008 at 02:12:16 PM EST
    Who pays the bill?
    IS that what REALLY worries you? (5.00 / 1) (#4)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Thu Mar 06, 2008 at 02:13:41 PM EST


    Parent
    Relevant (5.00 / 1) (#9)
    by QuakerInABasement on Thu Mar 06, 2008 at 02:27:29 PM EST
    It's a relevant question.

    Any solution that proposes a new vote will have to include an answer.

    Parent

    Raising 20 million (5.00 / 1) (#10)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Thu Mar 06, 2008 at 02:29:38 PM EST
    will not be a problem.

    Parent
    For whom? (5.00 / 1) (#20)
    by QuakerInABasement on Thu Mar 06, 2008 at 02:52:55 PM EST
    Not a problem to raise it? Then why the dismissive response to the question?

    Parent
    The Question (none / 0) (#22)
    by squeaky on Thu Mar 06, 2008 at 02:59:46 PM EST
    Was not sincere, possibly. Many HRC supporters are against a revote.

    Parent
    Um, no. (none / 0) (#27)
    by echinopsia on Thu Mar 06, 2008 at 03:14:00 PM EST
    I believe it's the Obama camp saying "no do-overs."

    Parent
    OK (none / 0) (#28)
    by squeaky on Thu Mar 06, 2008 at 03:17:17 PM EST
    But the comment in question is from a HRC supporter.

    Parent
    for future reference - (none / 0) (#38)
    by Josey on Fri Mar 07, 2008 at 08:51:08 AM EST
    when I asked a question, it's sincere.


    Parent
    Good To Know (5.00 / 1) (#39)
    by squeaky on Fri Mar 07, 2008 at 09:39:24 AM EST
    Sorry for questioning your sincerity.

    Parent
    Thank you :) (none / 0) (#40)
    by Josey on Fri Mar 07, 2008 at 01:33:00 PM EST


    Parent
    I think the concern is dismissable (none / 0) (#23)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Thu Mar 06, 2008 at 03:00:08 PM EST


    Parent
    Who then? (5.00 / 1) (#29)
    by QuakerInABasement on Thu Mar 06, 2008 at 03:24:02 PM EST
    Ben Nelson, a Clinton supporter, says he supports a re-vote, but doesn't want to pay for it:
    Nelson -- who'd previously said the original Jan. 29 primary was sufficient -- said he's opposed to the idea of Florida taxpayers picking up the tab for a new election. But interestingly, he revealed that he was pressing DNC chair Howard Dean to stage and pay for the revote:

    But Dr. Dean doesn't want to pay for it either:

    Dean says having the DNC pay for a new primary is not an option because they have to focus their resources on the general election against presumptive Republican nominee John McCain.

    It's a valid question.

    Parent

    although costs are certainly an issue, (none / 0) (#31)
    by kangeroo on Thu Mar 06, 2008 at 03:43:40 PM EST
    i'm starting to suspect it's just a superficial excuse to deliberately avoid seating the MI & FL delegates.  i agree with anglachel's analysis (she's fast becoming my digby) here:  "The Florida and Michigan delegates are not being seated because they would allow Hillary to win. Period."

    Parent
    Maybe all those little donors who (5.00 / 1) (#5)
    by Florida Resident on Thu Mar 06, 2008 at 02:13:49 PM EST
    are donating to the Campaign?  : >

    Parent
    thats about what they have (none / 0) (#6)
    by Capt Howdy on Thu Mar 06, 2008 at 02:16:59 PM EST
    paid Mark Penn so far.

    Parent
    Wonder what Axelrod's share (5.00 / 1) (#11)
    by Kathy on Thu Mar 06, 2008 at 02:31:29 PM EST
    of all the media-including the 2 minute commercials-adds up to?

    I still want to know what Obama's cash on hand is right now.  Also, if those online donations from the youth voters are paid with credit cards that mom and dad pay off every month...

    Parent

    just read 55 mil (none / 0) (#13)
    by Capt Howdy on Thu Mar 06, 2008 at 02:35:03 PM EST
    in feb.

    Parent
    it seem like (none / 0) (#7)
    by Capt Howdy on Thu Mar 06, 2008 at 02:24:31 PM EST
    voting in Florida would be something Gore might have some thoughts about.
    come on out and play Al.

    Hmmm. (none / 0) (#8)
    by TeresaInSnow2 on Thu Mar 06, 2008 at 02:27:17 PM EST
    Should we assume he's an Obama guy?

    (I suspect so.  Otherwise, you'd think he'd REALLY have something to say about this.)

    Parent

    well (none / 0) (#14)
    by Capt Howdy on Thu Mar 06, 2008 at 02:36:43 PM EST
    we know there is no love lost between him and the clintons, particularly Hillary, so you have to think  he is not sure at all about Obama or he would have said something publicly.
    but maybe not.

    Parent
    On endorsements (none / 0) (#19)
    by TeresaInSnow2 on Thu Mar 06, 2008 at 02:47:27 PM EST
    He's trying to stay above the fray...

    However, in the case of something like a REVOTE IN "FLORIDUH," I think it's "beneath the fray" not to say anything....

    Parent

    let's hope that (none / 0) (#25)
    by ghost2 on Thu Mar 06, 2008 at 03:03:42 PM EST
    Gore is working behind the scenes to come up with a solution agreed by all concerned, and then will back it up in public.  

    Parent
    How can proponents of a 50 state strategy (none / 0) (#15)
    by liminal on Thu Mar 06, 2008 at 02:40:13 PM EST
    - not support a redo, or some other compromise?  Why on earth is Howard Dean sitting back and letting this stuff happen?  Why isn't he leading on this issue?

    i haven't agreed with steve soto much (none / 0) (#32)
    by kangeroo on Thu Mar 06, 2008 at 03:53:53 PM EST
    in the recent past, but i think his analysis here is spot on, i.e., dems are being told and/or threatened that "African Americans, young voters, independents, newly-engaged voters, and wayward Republicans from Obama's states will be angered, stay home, or vote for John McCain."  of course the corollary of this, as steve points out, is the presumption that hillary's supporters don't matter.

    Parent
    Firm. (none / 0) (#33)
    by QuakerInABasement on Thu Mar 06, 2008 at 04:55:58 PM EST
    It's not sitting back, it's standing firm.

    Florida and Michigan broke the rules. They wanted to have an important voice in choosing the candidates.

    Ironic, ain't it?

    Now it's up to the state parties to come up with a plan to allocate their delegates by the rules--or leave it up to the credentials committee.

    Dean may be working behind the scenes, but publicly, he's got to hold the line. If he doesn't, we'll start holding primaries for 2012 next week.

    Parent

    Both Decisions (none / 0) (#34)
    by squeaky on Thu Mar 06, 2008 at 05:32:48 PM EST
    Were decided by GOP. In Michigan all 21 Republicans voted against all 17 Democrats.

    In Florida, also GOP controlled, the house vote was unanimous although the Dems complained that they were hamstrung:

    With that defiance in mind, the committee took a hard line. Several members suggested state Democrats should have fought harder against the Republican-led charge to move up the primary date.

    Florida Democrats argued that they were outnumbered 2 to 1 in the Legislature and that Republicans made it impossible for Democrats to vote against the measure by including language requiring paper voting machine trails in the bill.




    Parent
    Is 20 million dollars an (none / 0) (#17)
    by Joike on Thu Mar 06, 2008 at 02:46:42 PM EST
    accurate figure for holding a primary?

    My initial feeling is that number is significantly overblown.

    Or is Florida just assuming extra costs for having to recount all the ballots by hand and having to get the Supreme Court to ratify the results?

    The primary already held in FL (5.00 / 1) (#24)
    by Cream City on Thu Mar 06, 2008 at 03:02:19 PM EST
    cost $18 million, per several reliable sources there (officials, media, etc.). It was a record turnout. It can be presumed that the next one might turn out even more, and that could mean increased costs.

    Parent
    Disagree (none / 0) (#26)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Thu Mar 06, 2008 at 03:10:30 PM EST
    18MM likely includes fixed costs that are  already sunk in. I think it is more likely 12-14MM IF you do it exactly the same way.

    Mail in balloting is an obvious alternative.

    Parent

    Okay, but keep in mind that (none / 0) (#36)
    by Cream City on Thu Mar 06, 2008 at 06:31:07 PM EST
    mail balloting has been prone to higher levels of vote fraud.

    Parent
    I don't think so (none / 0) (#37)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Thu Mar 06, 2008 at 07:07:23 PM EST


    Parent
    I agree (none / 0) (#18)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Thu Mar 06, 2008 at 02:47:16 PM EST


    Parent
    i'm trying not to be (none / 0) (#30)
    by kangeroo on Thu Mar 06, 2008 at 03:30:09 PM EST
    royally pissed at howard dean, donna brazile, et al, but it is getting increasingly difficult.

    i already am! but i'll get over it. (none / 0) (#35)
    by hellothere on Thu Mar 06, 2008 at 06:15:14 PM EST
    i won't forget however.

    Parent
    FL And MI Are Dems' Problem | 40 comments (40 topical)

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