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This Is Funny

By Big Tent Democrat, Section Media
Posted on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 04:36:18 PM EST
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By Big Tent Democrat

Speaking for me only

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    This Is Funny | 129 comments (129 topical)
    ooooh (5.00 / 2) (#1)
    by andgarden on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 04:42:57 PM EST
    You know, it says something when a comedy show does a more compelling job of talking about the curvature of the race than supposedly serious news shows.

    I guess my sense of humor has left me (5.00 / 5) (#8)
    by Dr Molly on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:03:30 PM EST
    I don't like the way he talked about Hillary.

    Yeah (5.00 / 3) (#14)
    by TeresaInSnow2 on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:08:20 PM EST
    belittling women isn't funny to me either.

    Parent
    If you think that was what it was about (2.00 / 1) (#16)
    by clapclappointpoint on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:11:17 PM EST
    you must not have been paying much attention.

    Parent
    Wow (5.00 / 4) (#19)
    by TeresaInSnow2 on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:14:22 PM EST
    Of course I was paying attention.

    It was all quite Chris Matthewsesque.  All he had to add was that it was all because Bill slept around, then the comparison would be perfect.

    Parent

    Did you think the Hillary sketches were funny? (1.00 / 1) (#23)
    by clapclappointpoint on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:17:21 PM EST
    They featured an actor in blackface portraying Obama in a "belittling" fashion.

    Parent
    Not blackface (5.00 / 2) (#56)
    by dianem on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:38:31 PM EST
    Blackface is this:

    The actor in SNL was wearing cosmetics to slightly darken his skin, which is not even close to "blackface".

    Parent

    Oops (none / 0) (#58)
    by dianem on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:39:18 PM EST
    I tried to use the link button... here is another shot.


    Parent
    Maybe you parse things differently. (2.00 / 1) (#63)
    by clapclappointpoint on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:44:06 PM EST
    Having a non-black actor play a disparaging caricature of a black person is close enough, in my book.

    Parent
    No parsing necessary (5.00 / 3) (#65)
    by Dr Molly on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:47:08 PM EST
    It was actually a mixed-race person playing a mixed-race person.

    Parent
    I guess all "mixed race" people (1.00 / 1) (#73)
    by clapclappointpoint on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:56:02 PM EST
    are the same to you then.  

    Most African Americans are part white and therefore "mixed race".  Obama is black, Fred Armisen is not black.

    Parent

    So, is it sexism... (4.00 / 1) (#89)
    by dianem on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 06:07:27 PM EST
    ...when a male actor plays disparaging caricatures of women? Usually it's considered quite humorous. I distinctly don't recall anybody criticizing John Travolta for his sexism when he played a fat woman in Hairspray, and it seems that Eddie Murphy's "Norbit" was panned for it's poor quality, not it's lack of gender sensitivity.

    Actors have been putting on make-up to play characters of other ethnicities. Comedians have always done caricatures of famous characters. SNL was in a difficult position. If they chose an actor with darker skin than Obama they would have been criticized for making him look "blacker" (although I fail to see why it's bad to be "blacker"). They also couldn't just ignore him. They found the best balance they could.  

    Parent

    the difference is (5.00 / 2) (#93)
    by JJE on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 06:13:04 PM EST
    that there is no long and sordid history of men dressing as women in order to portray women as inferior.  I think you have to look at the context and Armisen's portrayal wasn't traditional blackface by any stretch, so I wasn't offended by that.  The sketch wasn't racially offensive, though its stupidity and clumsiness did offend my sense of humor.

    Parent
    If you want to find some way (2.00 / 1) (#94)
    by clapclappointpoint on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 06:13:10 PM EST
    to argue for blackface, have at it.  

    Parent
    Why would I do that? (5.00 / 2) (#102)
    by dianem on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 06:17:23 PM EST
    I find blackface as offensive as anybody here finds it. I am simply pointing out that there is a huge difference between somebody wearing make-up to play a black character and "blackface".

    Parent
    I would never argue for blackface (5.00 / 1) (#104)
    by JJE on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 06:18:44 PM EST
    I will point out the difference between a non-black person playing a black person and actual minstrel show blackface.

    Look, I support Obama, but I'm not going to go around looking for stuff to be offended by.

    Are you offended by the new Ben Stiller movie where Robert Downey Jr. plays a black man?



    Parent

    Sorry - it worked in preview (none / 0) (#61)
    by dianem on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:40:05 PM EST
    Look it up on Wikipedia. Fascinating article.

    Parent
    I'm with you Teresa (5.00 / 2) (#28)
    by Dr Molly on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:20:17 PM EST
    Parts of it were funny, but he didn't miss any chances to throw in numerous contemptuous remarks about Hillary -- only being where she was because of Bill, etc.

    Parent
    Yeah, Morgan's ignorance about HRC's career (5.00 / 2) (#110)
    by Ellie on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 06:23:43 PM EST
    ... as a Senator in a state where he's lived (or just worked) for years was pretty funny.

    I didn't get the joke about HRC thinking she was experienced to lead just because she was married to fmr. Prez Clinton, though. (Yup, that would be like Robin Wright being HW champeen of the world for being married to Mike Tyson.)

    Wow.

    I could only be criticizing Morgan because he's black and I'm being a racist, or beating on him because he's a man and I'm being a humorless feminist, but given my menu of options, I think I'll just go after him because he's both stupid and not funny in this particular bit.

    REALLY.

    Parent

    Yes, it's true, a comedian (5.00 / 1) (#120)
    by JJE on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 06:28:44 PM EST
    Did not make a rigorous, nuanced argument re: the relative experience of Clinton, but rather drew an analogy to pop culture.  I don't think you'll find sophisticated political analysis on Saturday Night Live.

    It's Robin Givens, not Robin Wright, btw.  Both are actresses once married to men with a predilection for punching people, but the similarities end there.

    Parent

    Yet TeamO's cried foul about HRC's SNL bump (5.00 / 1) (#130)
    by Ellie on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 06:41:55 PM EST
    Discounting these slurs because it's a mere comedy show, but then crying that the same mere comedy show boosted HRC's performance in a primary is a perfect example of Obama's handlers and supporters playing with a two-sided coin.

    TeamO can't continue to insist on having it both ways, all the time, and btw HRC's a monstger always.

    I stand corrected for not keeping my Robins organized on my Givens/ Wright brain defrag.

    Odd that THAT would get more contempt from you than Morgan apparently not knowing about HRC's individual achievemant as a Senator of HIS OWN FRICKEN STATE, and that does indeed qualify her beyond merely being married to a particular man, and qualify her more than Obama.

    Parent

    Steve Martin (none / 0) (#37)
    by MKS on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:25:00 PM EST
    slapping Tina Fey....B*tch is the new black.....It seemed like things feminists would not like...

    Parent
    The slapping (none / 0) (#44)
    by clapclappointpoint on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:29:15 PM EST
    really surprised me and I wondered why there wasn't more talk about it.

    The b-word was a little less surprising after Tina Fey's appropriation of it previously.

    Parent

    Sometimes... (5.00 / 2) (#43)
    by Jerrymcl89 on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:28:23 PM EST
    ... the answer to whether something is offensive or funny is that it's both. I thought it was fair in the sense that it balanced Tina Fey's unapologetic editorializing for Hillary, but Tina didn't really attack Obama at all.

    Parent
    No she didn't and.... (5.00 / 0) (#68)
    by Maria Garcia on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:48:48 PM EST
    ..maybe it says something about the difference between men and women, which is why b*tch will never really be the new pr*ck.

    Parent
    Right (5.00 / 1) (#113)
    by sas on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 06:24:36 PM EST
    Tina Fey did not criticize Obama.

    This guy directly criticized Hillary.

    When I read blogs (except for TalkLeft, to it's credit) I am constantly angered at the Hillary putdowns.  It's real vitriolic stuff.

    I don't like those people.  It makes it really hard to be a Democrat, and not change my registration to Independent.

    It never used to be like this.

    Parent

    Right (none / 0) (#114)
    by sas on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 06:24:54 PM EST
    Tina Fey did not criticize Obama.

    This guy directly criticized Hillary.

    When I read blogs (except for TalkLeft, to it's credit) I am constantly angered at the Hillary putdowns.  It's real vitriolic stuff.

    I don't like those people.  It makes it really hard to be a Democrat, and not change my registration to Independent.

    It never used to be like this.

    Parent

    Nor do I (5.00 / 3) (#69)
    by Kathy on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:49:49 PM EST
    I don't like the way he talked about Hillary.

    I don't like the way he talked about Tina Fey.  That "b*tch" at the end was used exactly as it shouldn't be.  Nasty, nasty, nasty.  Meant to put her in her place.  Could have easily been prefaced by "suck this."

    Bleh.

    Parent

    He works for Tina Fey... (3.00 / 1) (#108)
    by Jerrymcl89 on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 06:21:38 PM EST
    ... so I really don't think he'd have done this without her approval. I'm not going to tell you you are wrong to dislike it, but I really can't see it in "putting her in her place" terms.

    Parent
    I didn't like it either (5.00 / 2) (#109)
    by litigatormom on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 06:21:54 PM EST
    The part about Barack answering the phone, being from Chicago -- funny.

    The part about what kind of woman Hillary is, not wanting a "woman like her" answering the phone, and the tag line were all spectacularly unfunny.  Quite apart from the content of the language, it was quite clear Morgan was not joking.

    Parent

    Right (5.00 / 1) (#126)
    by Kathy on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 06:32:09 PM EST
    I think that's what got me--at the end, you realize that he's not joking.  The audience is really, really uncomfortable with it, too.  It's apparent from the way they are nervously laughing.

    Parent
    Well (3.50 / 2) (#10)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:04:25 PM EST
    To each his own.

    Parent
    BTD, which part did you find the most funny? (5.00 / 1) (#25)
    by FoxholeAtheist on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:18:44 PM EST
    I'm still rolling it around.

    Parent
    I love his (3.00 / 1) (#80)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:59:00 PM EST
    "I got integrity" line myself.

    Parent
    Most of it was funny, but I (5.00 / 1) (#38)
    by oculus on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:26:10 PM EST
    wouldn't have anticipated the defender against malign sexism would think it funny to joke HRC has no credientials except for being married to Bill Clinton; also what is funny about joking about HRC's alleged sex life or lack of same?  Weren't you eloquently defending McCain against the NYT's insinuation on that subject?

    Parent
    It was an over the top (3.00 / 1) (#79)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:58:37 PM EST
    joke. Do you really think it was meant seriously? I mean Tracy Morgan for crissakes.

    Parent
    Time to talk about Florida again. (5.00 / 1) (#101)
    by oculus on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 06:16:54 PM EST
    Did you see my link below?

    Parent
    I guess it was not (5.00 / 2) (#18)
    by Andy08 on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:11:33 PM EST
    a joke after all that the Obama camp went to complain to SNL about the previous skits last week.

    I heard it last night and thought....Funny Tracy Morgan was brought in instead of having the cast deliver them.

    Wonder...who might have suggested him... uhm...

    I had forgotten (5.00 / 1) (#21)
    by waldenpond on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:15:41 PM EST
    his campaign had called to complain.  I thought it was interesting.  Well, it looks like it worked.

    Parent
    Did they really call to complain? (none / 0) (#24)
    by stillife on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:17:34 PM EST
    Or was that just a joke?

    Parent
    Called (none / 0) (#27)
    by waldenpond on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:19:26 PM EST
    to complain.  Really, no joke.  It was even reported over at Politico.

    Parent
    For realz? (none / 0) (#32)
    by stillife on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:21:50 PM EST
    Wow.  That sort of casts this skit in a whole new light.

    Parent
    that was a joke (none / 0) (#31)
    by cannondaddy on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:21:15 PM EST


    Parent
    I heard a rumor (none / 0) (#35)
    by Steve M on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:23:42 PM EST
    that some of the alums, like Chris Rock, had lobbied for a response.  Which seems fair enough.

    Parent
    I didn't find it funny either (5.00 / 1) (#26)
    by stillife on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:19:25 PM EST
    but my husband tells me I've turned into a bitter obsessed witch in this election season.  I thought the timing was particularly bad, after the Rev. Wright kerfluffle.

    That said, I do like Tracy Morgan a lot, and I love Tina Fey and 30 Rock.

    I think there's an edge to it (4.00 / 1) (#36)
    by Edgar08 on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:24:59 PM EST
    In any case. They can call off their SNL boycotts now over at the big orange.


    Parent
    Normalizing (5.00 / 2) (#30)
    by MKS on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:20:38 PM EST
    "b*tch" and the "n" word....is generally not worth it.....Better to not use the epithets at all....

    But since all is now fair game....it was funny...

    N*****r is not fair game (none / 0) (#55)
    by Edgar08 on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:37:26 PM EST
    And for good reason.
    \

    Parent
    I find it telling... (5.00 / 6) (#33)
    by amelia windrose on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:21:59 PM EST
    that while Tina Fey barely mentioned Obama in her piece a few weeks ago (I just went back and checked -- there's one reference, and it's entirely neutral), Morgan felt compelled to spend some of his time belittling Clinton.  He's a funny guy, but I wish he could have steered clear of the Matthews-esque stuff.

    Yes (5.00 / 2) (#41)
    by Edgar08 on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:27:18 PM EST
    I believe a compare contrast of the two monologs would reveal something about the underlying tone of two different sets of supporters.


    Parent
    May be hard to make a positive (5.00 / 1) (#88)
    by RalphB on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 06:05:40 PM EST
    case for BHO.  That only leaves tearing the other down.  I'm also sure it does reveal something about the two groups of supporters as well.


    Parent
    not so funny (5.00 / 3) (#46)
    by superjude on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:30:55 PM EST
    I'm actually surprised that more of you didn't dislike the demeaning attitude Tracy exhibited in his remarks on Hillary's candidacy. We heard Matthews say Hillary was only in the Senate because Bill slept around - the woman cannot possibly get anywhere on her own hard work. This is the same misogynistic story and boy is it not funny. I agree with commenter above...BO's complaint to Lorne Michaels paid off. Also, Tracy could have supported BO without attacking HRC.

    Here's a quarter (1.00 / 3) (#47)
    by clapclappointpoint on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:32:39 PM EST
    go buy yourself some humor.

    Parent
    very nice (5.00 / 1) (#64)
    by Dr Molly on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:44:34 PM EST


    Parent
    Condescending. (5.00 / 2) (#66)
    by oculus on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:47:53 PM EST


    Parent
    Here's a dollar (5.00 / 3) (#86)
    by tree on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 06:03:53 PM EST
    Go buy yourself some civility. It won't buy much but every little bit will help.

    Parent
    Obama Camp Complained Repeatedly to SNL (4.00 / 1) (#50)
    by FoxholeAtheist on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:36:05 PM EST
    The New York Times wrote about the Obama camp complaining to SNL i.e. to Lorne Michaels and the political skit writer Jim Downey. An exercpt:

    "Immediately after that (first) show Mr. Downey said he started hearing from Obama supporters that he was trying to undermine their candidate. Those complaints have only increased in subsequent weeks after two more election sketches have appeared, with Mr. Obama being played by Fred Armisen. That choice has raised a few eyebrows because Mr. Armisen's ancestry is Venezuelan, German and Japanese but not African-American."


    Parent

    Obama supporters (1.00 / 1) (#59)
    by clapclappointpoint on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:39:21 PM EST
    not "the Obama camp".  BTD is self-described Obama supporter. He is not part of the Obama camp.

    And really, is blackface something you really want to bring back?

    Parent

    Do you really think (5.00 / 2) (#71)
    by lilburro on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:50:31 PM EST
    it was blackface??

    I don't.

    Parent

    Was he wearing black makeup? (5.00 / 1) (#87)
    by Maria Garcia on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 06:04:18 PM EST
    I seriously can't remember. But this isn't new. Joe Piscopo played Jesse Jackson.

    Parent
    I believe (5.00 / 1) (#105)
    by lilburro on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 06:20:24 PM EST
    they darken his skin tone a little for the role.  It is not drastic nor does the makeup come from the blackface tradition.  I think Armisen does a decent job.  He's played all kinds of people including Prince, Tony Danza, Ahmadinejad, and uh, Camilla Parker-Bowles.


    Parent
    His skin was darkened /eom (3.00 / 1) (#90)
    by clapclappointpoint on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 06:11:09 PM EST


    Parent
    Yeah, right (5.00 / 2) (#48)
    by dianem on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:33:21 PM EST
    And the n-word is actually simply an innocent reference to the latin word for black. I'm not buying, although your treatise makes for fascinating dissection.

    I think the two words are very different (none / 0) (#60)
    by jerry on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:39:51 PM EST
    And I don't believe I have ever used the b* word.  Though I do admit to thinking it more than a few times regarding one particular individual in my life.

    But I do think the two words are very different in who uses them and how they are used.

    I also think the feminists that use them to reclaim them are at the height of their double talk and nonsense.  Or at least that their thought they are somehow reclaiming the word shows their lack of ability to observe and understand the real world.

    Parent

    Only in social acceptance (5.00 / 2) (#72)
    by dianem on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:53:14 PM EST
    If you think of the common usage of the b-word, it is used to denigrate women, to insult and diminish them. This is socially acceptable in modern America. There was a time when it was similarly acceptable to use the n-word to diminish black people. We've moved forward a lot in terms of race. We're slowly moving forward in terms of gender, as well, but the institutionalized sexism in our society (and most others) is difficult to deal with, since it is so widespread that we don't notice it.

    For example, the idea that women can't fight in a war zone is widespread, but ridiculous. Why should women not be able to carry a weapon into battle? Women have fought wars throughout history. The widespread social custom of women being responsible for childcare is very slowly fading, but anybody who works in an office will tell you that a woman is far more likely to have to take a day off to care for a sick child, and women routinely put their careers on hold to bear and care for their children. If they don't, if they choose to not bear children or not care for them personally they are subject to criticism. And what about the idea that "leadership" qualities are "masculine"? Any woman who has led a team will tell you that there is a fine line between  being assertive enough to lead and being considered a "b*tch".

    We have a long way to go.

    Parent

    Well said n/t (none / 0) (#77)
    by JJE on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:58:03 PM EST


    Parent
    What color (none / 0) (#78)
    by clapclappointpoint on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:58:34 PM EST
    is the sky on your planet?

    On mine, the N-word is still primarily used to denigrate people and there is a substantial amount of racism.

    Parent

    the point is (5.00 / 1) (#85)
    by JJE on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 06:02:48 PM EST
    that while both words are used to denigrate the person at whom they are directed, one is more socially acceptable than the other.  If Tina Fey had used the n-word, her career would be over.

    Parent
    It is not acceptable in polite society (5.00 / 1) (#96)
    by dianem on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 06:14:21 PM EST
    I do not use the word. I have not seen it used on television. I will not tolerate it's use in my presence. The n-word is not accepted in our society, except when used by (some) black people and in satire. The b-word is in common usage. To put it simply, nobody ever lost their job for using the b-word in public. Racism exists, but it is frowned upon. Sexism exists, and it is accepted.

    Parent
    God help us (5.00 / 1) (#52)
    by Dr Molly on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:36:18 PM EST
    Now we're channelling social darwinism here.

    This is actually evolutionary psychology (none / 0) (#83)
    by JJE on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 06:00:17 PM EST
    rather than social darwinism.  They're both pretty dubious, however.

    Parent
    One came from the other; they are closely related (none / 0) (#99)
    by Dr Molly on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 06:16:05 PM EST
    And, yes, they are both very dubious. It just won't die.

    Parent
    You kind of just have to accept it (5.00 / 2) (#57)
    by Edgar08 on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:38:53 PM EST
    Or risk being branded the humorless feminist.
    Like black people who danced in movies (5.00 / 2) (#75)
    by dianem on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:57:11 PM EST
    It was what they had to do, and they did it, because it was the "thing to do". When there are no choices, people cooperate in their own oppression. Society demands it.

    Parent
    Political Humor: has to be clever!! (5.00 / 0) (#84)
    by Stellaaa on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 06:02:16 PM EST
    It was not so clever because we   we have read Obama supporters say the : " if her qualification is just because she was married then____________   would be qualified to be ____________".

    Played out joke.  

    The Tina Fay thing... B$*^(^, is the new Black, was clever.  

    Michaels came out apologizing that they are not pro HIllary last week.  Who cares who they are for, their job is to satirize and be clever about it.  Throw a twist not mimic or play to the mob.  

    I am going to try very hard to be polite here (5.00 / 1) (#106)
    by Dr Molly on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 06:20:49 PM EST
    and then I am going to leave. As an evolutionary biologist, I'm telling you that your attempt to use loose jargon from evolutionary theory to justify describing womens as b**ches is pathetic. And, if you're trying to play in the world of evolutionary psychology, the legitimacy of that field to respectable scientists died already so give it up.

    How Does Humor (none / 0) (#117)
    by squeaky on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 06:26:29 PM EST
    Fit into evolutionary biology? I Hope that it does not go the way of the dodo.

    Parent
    I don't know (5.00 / 3) (#125)
    by Dr Molly on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 06:31:18 PM EST
    But I do know that it's not funny to compare women to female dogs using a pseudo-scientific veneer of evolutionary jargon.

    Parent
    Respectable scientists? (none / 0) (#124)
    by jerry on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 06:31:04 PM EST
    Last time I checked there were tens or hundreds of programs giving out ph.d degrees in evolutionary psychology, and literally thousands of ph.ds wandering around working in the field.

    I am not so certain you have a good understanding or ability to tell us how respectable scientists feel about the field, any more than I have a good understanding or ability to tell you how respectable scientists feel about the field of womens's studies, a field based on equally shaky grounds with one hell of an untestable theory at its heart.

    Parent

    Evolutionary psychology (none / 0) (#127)
    by Dr Molly on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 06:33:21 PM EST
    is extremely controversial, as I suspect you know, for the very reason that people use it as you have done in this thread.

    I can't speak to women's studies - not my area.

    Parent

    Untestable theory? (none / 0) (#129)
    by tree on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 06:40:53 PM EST
    You mean that no one has yet proved that there are actually "women" out there to be studied? Who knew?
    I thought women existed. Hey, I even thought I was one. I must go ponder this.

    And thanks for making crystal clear exactly where you are coming from. I suppose I could do a riff on the evolution of myomycetes, but I'll refrain.

    Parent

    No it's not (5.00 / 2) (#112)
    by ChrisM on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 06:24:28 PM EST
    It's the same kind of sexism we've deplored throughout this campaign, the very same sexism that Tina Fey funnily and aptly debunked... and what can the other side come back with, an unfunny sexist rant.

    I think Morgan was actually (4.00 / 1) (#119)
    by lilburro on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 06:28:05 PM EST
    making fun of people who make the "just because she's married to Bill" argument.  But like Steve M I'm not looking forward to people using Morgan's rant, esp the last line, as a confirmation of things they actually take quite seriously.

    Parent
    I groaned. (5.00 / 2) (#134)
    by Dancing Bear on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 07:35:29 PM EST
    I didn't find it terribly funny or terribly awful.
    I think the "blackface" argument is stupid.

    Remember "White Chicks" with the Wayans Brothers?  Was that whiteface? When Tyler Perry does women do we call him sexist? No, it's called parody in make-up. Now that stuff is funny.

    Would it have made more sense to have someone who couldn't do a good rendition of him?  Maybe Barack could have done it himself. He would have had that same blank stare.

    Tina Fey was much funnier however.  And her color reference is fashion related. Not skin color related as Tracey Morgan's was.

    You know in fashion they say Brown is the "new black".  They are referring to clothes. Not skin color.  He was totally referring to skin color.  

    Supposedly (4.00 / 1) (#6)
    by clapclappointpoint on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:00:46 PM EST
    most of the SNL cast and writers are Obama supporters.  

    At the end of the monologue, it looked like the Amy Pohler had a pretty sour look on her face.  I don't know if it was the "Black is the new president" comment or the "b----", but she didn't look happy (imo).

    Apparently (5.00 / 1) (#7)
    by waldenpond on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:02:24 PM EST
    Yep, some of the cast wanted to have Clinton back on.  This did not go over well.

    Parent
    Yes (5.00 / 2) (#12)
    by TeresaInSnow2 on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:07:53 PM EST
    And Morgan brought up that the only reason Hillary has a chance at pres was because her husband was president.  Otherwise, she'd just be a b*tch shouting at me at 3:00am, or whatever it was that he said.

    Well it's true.

    We won't see another viable woman presidential candidate in my lifetime, and the only thing that made Hillary viable was Bill's popularity.  Sad, but I think it's absolutely true.  Otherwise, a mere woman would never get there.

    But this election is all about the racism, isn't it. Nothing else matters. So easily I forget.

    And BTW, as you can tell, I didn't even laugh once.

    Parent

    Oh please (1.00 / 1) (#9)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:03:46 PM EST
    It was funny.

    Parent
    Just say "I believe" it was funny. (5.00 / 1) (#54)
    by oculus on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:37:10 PM EST


    Parent
    I don't disagree (3.00 / 1) (#11)
    by clapclappointpoint on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:06:17 PM EST
    I was laughing out loud when I heard it. It just seemed to me like Amy was peeved after Tracy's comment.

    Parent
    Maybe she was annoyed (4.00 / 1) (#22)
    by stillife on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:16:33 PM EST
    (and I say this as a Clinton supporter) b/c if Obama gets the nomination, her career as Clinton impersonator will be over.

    Parent
    I thought It was funny (4.00 / 1) (#51)
    by vj on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:36:08 PM EST
    but not in the same way as the debate sketches. I saw it more as a rebuttal to Tina Fey's routine. It was also more like a stand-up routine, where more risque stuff is generally tolerated. I did cringe a bit on that last line. I definitely don't think Amy Poehler liked it. We should remember that it is comedy, and not political commentary.

    It was all fair game (5.00 / 1) (#76)
    by Kathy on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:57:24 PM EST
    to me until the last line.  I can see where up to that point, it would have been funny for some, but that nasty ending was too far and too demeaning.  And the way he looks into the camera when he says it makes it obvious that he knows exactly what he is saying.

    I dunno, I laughed at the Clinton parodies where she said she'd get things done by annoying the crap out of people and where she said it was 3am and she had no idea where Bill was.  Those were funny.  This just smacked of a personal attack and it was very nasty at the end.

    Anyway, humor is in the ear of the beholder, so there's no use nattering on about it.  I will say that Morgan is my least favorite on 30 Rock, so I may be biased.  He takes way too much screen time from Kenneth, who is HILARIOUS.  

    Parent

    I'm with you (5.00 / 2) (#103)
    by Democratic Cat on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 06:17:38 PM EST
    It was over the top yet funny until the end. It's one thing for Tina Fey to use the word in reference to herself and other women--it defuses the meaning, it takes it back from being a slur.  To have a man use it in an especially nasty way made me really cringe.

    At another reader's suggestion, I went back and looked at the Tina Fey piece again. Completely different tone, no attack.

    Parent

    it wasn't clever or funny.... (4.00 / 1) (#82)
    by CentristDemocrat on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:59:31 PM EST
    Maybe it's just me, but a monologue has to be clever if it's going to be funny, but there was nothing very clever in that piece. Further, the only reason that the previous HRC-pieces were funny were cause they were well-executed parodies.

    This came of more of a improptu rant.

    Pathetic attempt (4.00 / 1) (#91)
    by GOPmurderedconscience on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 06:11:25 PM EST
    to respond to Tina Fey.

    Tina Fey did not trash Obama but built up Hillary. Tracy Morgan has never been funny, so I am not surprised.

    comments now closed (3.50 / 2) (#133)
    by Jeralyn on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 07:11:16 PM EST
    finally.

    After two very positive sketches for HRC from SNL (2.50 / 2) (#40)
    by clapclappointpoint on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:26:28 PM EST
    the Obama campaign deserved a crumb thrown their way.  

    I can't believe this became (2.00 / 1) (#95)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 06:13:11 PM EST
    the most rancorous thread of the day.

    I am thisclose to closing the comment here.

    BTD, perhaps you could have taken (5.00 / 1) (#122)
    by FoxholeAtheist on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 06:29:35 PM EST
    a less in-your-face stance than a headline which stated, unequivocally, "This is Funny". It set the all-or-nothing tone for the subsequent comments.

    Parent
    Hlarious (none / 0) (#2)
    by squeaky on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 04:43:41 PM EST
    Thanks for that one, made laugh.

    concur 100%! (none / 0) (#13)
    by scribe on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:08:19 PM EST
    B*tch is the new black.
    Black is the new President, b*tch.

    Love it.

    Parent

    lol (none / 0) (#17)
    by squeaky on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:11:28 PM EST
    Again.

    Parent
    Well Done, Tracy Morgan (none / 0) (#4)
    by catfish on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 04:51:17 PM EST
    He wasn't hostile, he was friendly to Tina "Tina, you know you my girl." And he made some good points.

    I thought he was very hostile (5.00 / 2) (#115)
    by litigatormom on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 06:25:20 PM EST
    to Clinton, and rather condescending to Fey.

    The only bits that were funny were the bits that were about Obama being tough enough ("He's from Chicago, he's gangsta.").

    The parts about Hillary were quite nasty.

    Parent

    Funny and a relief from the rest! (none / 0) (#5)
    by RalphB on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 04:55:08 PM EST


    BTD (none / 0) (#15)
    by clapclappointpoint on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:09:17 PM EST
    would you be able to post the McCain segment from last night as well?  It's pretty good.

    No. just call it b*tch, and we'll all know (none / 0) (#29)
    by scribe on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:20:25 PM EST
    what you mean.

    Just like we did when Bushie commuted Scooter's sentence and I titled my diary "Libby's B*tches".

    Ok then (none / 0) (#39)
    by Edgar08 on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:26:14 PM EST
    B*tch it is going forward.


    Parent
    Yes (none / 0) (#34)
    by Steve M on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:22:35 PM EST
    It was quite funny.  I laughed throughout.  I'm not sure my wife was paying attention, which is just as well.  I can see why it's easier for a man to find it funny.

    I do not look forward to encountering hordes of Internet commentors with the "b*tch* line as their sig.  It was fine for Tracy Morgan to say it, in context, but that still doesn't make it a nice word for Obama supporters to hurl at generic Clinton supporters.

    I agree with your last para. (5.00 / 2) (#67)
    by lilburro on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:48:32 PM EST
    I thought Morgan was pretty funny, making jokes at both Obama and Clinton (I didn't think he was so serious about his Clinton criticisms).  Not super happy about his use of b*tch at the very end.  And I will not accept that phrase being bandied about by anyone else out of context.  

    I wasn't pleased with Fey saying "B*tch is the new black" either...I took it as a reference to the popular fashion slogan "gray is the new black" but obviously it could be interpreted as the 'new AA' (as stupid as that would be).

    Parent

    I wasn't entirely comfortable with it myself (none / 0) (#107)
    by JJE on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 06:21:17 PM EST
    but he was obviously riffing on Fey's explicit use of the word, so ultimately I think this usage was permissible.

    Parent
    And Then There Is Stud (none / 0) (#45)
    by squeaky on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:30:47 PM EST
    Oh, right, sorry the reference is a piece of wood. Dumb as a plank.

    I forgot stud! (none / 0) (#49)
    by jerry on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:34:59 PM EST
    I suffer from low self esteem :(

    Parent
    Hmm, stud refers to horse, doesn't it? (none / 0) (#62)
    by jerry on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:42:52 PM EST
    Stud, stallion, ...

    In Animal House the "hero's" frat name was Pinto, because, uh, .... Well, you'll have to read the book. (It's not in the movie.)

    Parent

    It depends on whether you say (none / 0) (#53)
    by oculus on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:36:23 PM EST
    it "nicely."  See Jeremiah Wright comments for explanation.

    The Eliot Spitzer comment in the Weekend Update (none / 0) (#70)
    by BarnBabe on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:50:07 PM EST
    was funny too. The Really segment. I LOL at the one where they said that ES wanted unprotected sex. That was fine if he was Client #1 but he was Client #9. It is on the SNL site. BTW, Tina Fey is back as hostess on March 22nd, next Saturday. Hope she is good as recently.

    I'm glad to see her back (5.00 / 1) (#74)
    by vj on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:57:08 PM EST
    I really like Tina Fey, and her writing. Although I confess I have not watched 30 Rock.

    Parent
    no you can't say that here (none / 0) (#92)
    by Jeralyn on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 06:12:53 PM EST
    use asterisks.

    Good Idea (none / 0) (#97)
    by Jeralyn on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 06:15:11 PM EST
    as soon as you've had enough. I have.

    I'm really troubled by the (5.00 / 2) (#128)
    by FoxholeAtheist on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 06:39:58 PM EST
    upstream allegation that Armisen (who is of Venezuelan, German and Japanese descent) played the part of Obama in "black face". That  was incendiary, and unsubstantiated. In my opinion, it diverted the discourse, caused rancor and had a very chilling effect.

    Parent
    Jeralyn, was it funny? (4.00 / 1) (#111)
    by oculus on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 06:23:45 PM EST
    Yes
    No
    Mostly

    Parent
    I do not see the comparison (none / 0) (#100)
    by Joan in VA on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 06:16:44 PM EST
    at all and I find your entire comment offensive.

    Well, Joan (5.00 / 1) (#123)
    by Dr Molly on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 06:29:49 PM EST
    That's because it's a tortured attempt to compare non-comparable things in a pathetic way to disguise being completely offensive! So, no wonder you don't see it!

    Or else, er, let's see - we can justify anything that humans do by looking at the evolutionary history of mammals! Not.

    Parent

    It's true Hillary wouldn't be considered (none / 0) (#116)
    by esmense on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 06:26:09 PM EST
    ... the first "viable" female presidential candidate if she wasn't married to a powerful politician with a brand name. Every step of the way, women have broken political barriers by being associated with powerful males -- dead or living husbands or fathers. But of course she also has credentials of her own -- she has a lifetime of public service experience and more time in the Senate than Obama. And it IS sexist to dismiss her years of experience on issues pertaining to children, legal services for the poor, education, child care, human rights, etc.

    There are several female politicians who, based on the kind of qualifications and experience enjoyed by past nominees and presidents, are qualified to run for president. But there is not one other than Clinton that establishment politicians and financial backers would put their money on -- that's just reality.

    And, let's face it, no African American would be considered "viable" as a presidential candidate if he had a more conventional political background, including most especially, a more activist, civil rights resume than Obama has. Or, if that candidate was a woman. How many of you Obama supporters backed Carol Mosely Braun in 2004? (She wasn't running "on her husband's name." She was a MUCH more articulate, attractive and authentic personality and candidate than Kerry. And, she had as much or more experience as either candidate duking it out for the nomination this time around.)

    It's simply not true that ANY qualified African American, or ANY qualified woman, would have an equal chance at the presidency today. The simple truth is, both Obama and Clinton are where they are today not only because they are "qualified," but also because of special circumstances that make them exceptions to the rule.

    Tina Fey defended Hillary... (none / 0) (#121)
    by cloudspitter on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 06:29:10 PM EST
    ...yet Liz Lemon supports Obama!  WTF??!?

    Anyway Tracy Morgan killed.  Hope the show can go on.  

    Tom Watson (none / 0) (#132)
    by herb the verb on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 07:02:30 PM EST
    and I agree;

    http://tomwatson.typepad.com/tom_watson/2008/03/tracy-morgans-s.html

    Come on folks, lighten up, Tracey Morgan is a comedian and this is satire.....

    Benefit of the doubt (none / 0) (#136)
    by sleepingdogs on Mon Mar 17, 2008 at 05:52:10 AM EST
    Did I think it was funny?  Not particularly.  But then I am a Clinton supporter.  I think there were some parts the audience found funny but some parts were met with only nervous laughter.

    The last line really stung though.  I think it was intended as a real slap to women.  The feeling I had was that this was not Tracy's line originally but that it was given to him by someone who wanted to "slap the b*tches back into place."  

    I didn't think it was funny because I never interpreted the line of Tina's to be racial.  Apparently some folks did.  It's a sensitive area all around.

    I will give Tracy the benefit of the doubt because I genuinely believe he knew it would hurt Tina and it looks like he had to psych himself up before delivering the line.  The rest of his routine was typical Tracy.  A little obvious and juvenile but not horribly clever.  I think he's a likeable guy though.  I didn't mind him having a chance to do this for Obama, but there may have been a better pick on the SNL staff.  

    My hope is that this is some part of a smart and cool plan on Tina's part to continue a back and forth during this next week's show.  That's the best reason I can think of why Michaels had Tracy on to give this commentary.  I agree it's only comedy, but it is my opinion that the final line was not delivered in jest-even if that's the way Tracy intended it to come off.  

    A comedian on a comedy show (none / 0) (#137)
    by Deconstructionist on Mon Mar 17, 2008 at 08:43:18 AM EST
     saying absurd and edgy things, mocking pretty much everything and everyone he mentioned. A comedian whose role on his own show is to farcically lampoon  stereotypes often applied to black men.

      Hmmm, what sort of bio-psycho-socio-athro-...ology can  plumb the depths of this one?

      Sometimes, a cigar is just a cigar.

     

    This Is Funny | 129 comments (129 topical)