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By TChris, Section Law Related
Posted on Wed Dec 24, 2008 at 01:14:13 PM EST
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As if there weren't enough lawyers in the country already:

A new law school opening next fall in Southern California is offering a big incentive to top students who might be thinking twice about the cost of a legal education during the recession: free tuition for three years.

Erwin Chemerinsky, dean of the new law school at UC - Irvine, is trying to give the school instant top-tier status by offering full scholarships to the 60 best and brightest applicants. Only the inaugural class will get a free pass, so go for it, TalkLeft readers. This is your chance to get the law degree you've always wanted, for free. (Our many readers whose law degrees were purchased the old fashioned way -- with borrowed money supplemented by menial jobs -- have permission to wince.)

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    Learn the Law for Free | 23 comments (23 topical)

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    Ah, the law (5.00 / 1) (#6)
    by Steve M on Wed Dec 24, 2008 at 01:56:05 PM EST
    When I first came to NYC a decade ago, I was responsible for supervising a team of contract lawyers, or what you might call "temps," working on a large-scale document review project.  These temps were mostly recent graduates of the local second- and third-tier law schools who weren't fortunate enough to find jobs after graduation.

    Under prevailing rates in the NYC market, these contract lawyers were getting paid $20/hour, plus time and a half after 40 hours a week.  Living in NYC on $20 an hour is no picnic.  Paying down your presumed six-figure student loan debt while doing so is even more challenging.

    Maybe it's not a secret any more, but I think there were a lot of young folks a decade ago who failed to appreciate that law school is no longer the guaranteed ticket it once was.  If you can't get into a top school, or at least possess the acumen to graduate near the top of your class at a lower-ranked school, it's worth thinking about whether that six-figure investment is really such a great idea.

    I'll wait for an honorary law degree (5.00 / 1) (#10)
    by Ben Masel on Wed Dec 24, 2008 at 02:55:59 PM EST


    Ben Masel gets his wish! (5.00 / 1) (#15)
    by Jacob Freeze on Wed Dec 24, 2008 at 06:47:30 PM EST
    Ever since Woody Woodpecker became President of Willamette University, I pretty much have authority to mess around with their diplomas in Photoshop. So...

    Behold your shiny new J.D. right here!

    Many happy returns!

    Parent

    Do you do Presidential Pardons as well? (5.00 / 2) (#17)
    by Ben Masel on Thu Dec 25, 2008 at 10:20:58 PM EST


    Parent
    Pardon. (none / 0) (#22)
    by Jacob Freeze on Sun Dec 28, 2008 at 08:26:25 PM EST
    You can pick up your pardon here.

    Now get busy and commit some crimes to go with it!

    Parent

    Oh, crap! (none / 0) (#23)
    by Jacob Freeze on Sun Dec 28, 2008 at 08:31:24 PM EST
    I put "Ben Masel" on the title line, but for some strange reason, "Richard Nixon" appears in the text.

    This may not fool the FBI, but it still might get you out of a traffic ticket somewhere!

    Parent

    heh (none / 0) (#11)
    by andgarden on Wed Dec 24, 2008 at 03:03:22 PM EST


    Parent
    Second Thoughts (5.00 / 2) (#16)
    by john horse on Thu Dec 25, 2008 at 10:18:37 PM EST
    My initial reaction to this offer of a free education to the "best and brightest" was great.  Then I started having second thoughts.

    One problem with merit based scholarships is that they award students who come from families that can afford to send their son or daughter through college.  Here in Florida we have a merit based scholarship called Bright Futures that provides a for 75% to 100% of tuition and fees for high achieving Florida students.  Many students from well-to-do families get a free ride off of this scholarship.  In Florida we have seen the growth of luxury dorms and/or expensive cars on campus which is partly the result of wealthy parents not having to spend that money on tuition.

    I'm not against merit based scholarships.  What I am against is pure merit based scholarships.  Lets have merit based scholarships after you first eliminate those families that have no financial need.  Why should the state have to fund education for wealthy families that can easily afford to fund their children's education?  

    This is the least (none / 0) (#18)
    by Cream City on Fri Dec 26, 2008 at 02:24:37 AM EST
    of Florida's state universities' problems.  Yikes, around the country in academe, we're getting flooded with faculty wanting to get out of Florida's system.  Word is that your budget is crashing even worse than in other states' public universities?  And that's saying something. . . .

    The biggest losers in all this will be students at all public universities, with the inability of those without endowments to plan -- because promise after promise of funding for programs planned has been pulled, long before the current economic crash.

    So the number-one word heard in academic hiring these days is: private.  As in, please let me be hired by a private campus, where years of hard work in building a program or writing a book or the like won't be smashed to bits by budget cuts.  And it's hear more from Florida faculty than just about any out there, so we hear. . . .

    Parent

    Type of Scholarships A Funding Issue Too (none / 0) (#20)
    by john horse on Fri Dec 26, 2008 at 07:44:25 AM EST
    Cream City,
    I had no idea about this problem with retaining Florida's faculty.  But it makes sense.  

    In hard times such as these the only thing that may prevent people from leaving their jobs is that that there may not be any openings due to layoffs elsewhere.  

    The situation of faculty may be affected by Bright Futures.  Financial aid funds our universities, including faculty salaries. Bright Futures is an expensive program.  In 2007-2008 it cost about $380 million, with an average award amount of $2,386. The state's top need based program only received half that amount (the average award amount for need is about half too).  

    Personally as I mentioned before, I am not against merit based programs.  I think Bright Futures provides an incentive to high school students to do well academically and needed assistance to many middle class families.  What I am against is providing the scholarship to wealthy families that can afford to foot the bill.  

    Getting back to the offer from the law school, lets talk about what is fair.  A merit based system rewards individual effort and achievement but, as a group, academic achievement is correlated to one's socio-economic class.  In other words, people from higher income groups do well because they have more resources at home and they go to better schools.  As a result, they start off ahead and the gap only increases.  So why should state funds go to students from wealthy families (and I am assuming that some of the best and the brightest will be from wealthy families) that need it the least?

    Parent

    Whats ironic is (none / 0) (#1)
    by SOS on Wed Dec 24, 2008 at 01:28:17 PM EST
    an independent Plumber can gross $1000 a day if your energetic and dedicated and have a reputation for good work.

    With the law degree though (5.00 / 1) (#2)
    by SOS on Wed Dec 24, 2008 at 01:31:46 PM EST
    obviously your social status will be slightly elevated above the Plumber.

    LOL

    Parent

    Unless of course (none / 0) (#12)
    by CoralGables on Wed Dec 24, 2008 at 04:37:12 PM EST
    your name is Joe, in which case there are many in the GOP that hold your worldly knowledge in the highest regard.

    Parent
    Actually, The Dean is Right (none / 0) (#8)
    by msaroff on Wed Dec 24, 2008 at 02:15:02 PM EST
    I've followed schools that have tried to improve their status, most notably Texas A&M in the 1970s, and the pattern is:
    1. Get lots of money.
    2. Get new buildings, labs, etc.
    3. Hire top flight professors.
    4. Wait for 5-10 years until the quality of the students catches up.
    5. School is better regarded.

    It turns out that the quality of a school is determined almost completely by the quality of its students, and the other stuff only works to the degree that it attracts better students.

    Parent
    just what we need (none / 0) (#3)
    by candideinnc on Wed Dec 24, 2008 at 01:33:08 PM EST
    If there is one thing this nation doesn't need, it is more lawyers.  In my state there is such an overabundance of them, they can't make a decent living and are forced to become ambulance chasers (or worse).  The law schools are churning them out because that is what they do and how they make a living.  We need engineers and scientists, not more lawyers.

    Personally, I would be utterly useless (5.00 / 1) (#7)
    by andgarden on Wed Dec 24, 2008 at 02:04:56 PM EST
    as an engineer or a scientist. Those jobs are for people who can do math. I would like to know what other groups of people you complain we have "too many" of?

    Parent
    Lawyers don't just practice law (5.00 / 3) (#9)
    by Cream City on Wed Dec 24, 2008 at 02:44:09 PM EST
    . . . and a lot of businesses benefit from them as vp's, etc. (I've read that half of law school classes don't practice law but go into business?).  The more that businesses are cautioned by lawyers on staff to behave legally, the better for workers.

    And in academe, I can tell you that many fields benefit from profs who have both Ph.D.'s and law degrees; we need more of them to do, for example, better research and recommendations in legal history, media law, and the like.

    But there also are many areas that could use more practicing lawyers like one of my bros, who specialized in labor history to do labor law, then clerked and then went into private practice for a while -- but gave it up to do what he wanted to do from the start, which is to be a litigator for the EEOC.  It came at great cost, monetarily, but he gets a lot back in other ways for the time he gives to workers getting back their rights . . . such as migrant women workers for big agribusinesses who acceded to repeatedly being raped so that they and their families could keep their jobs.

    More lawyers like that is fine with me.

    Parent

    60 is not a large increase (none / 0) (#4)
    by koshembos on Wed Dec 24, 2008 at 01:50:59 PM EST
    The idea to attract the best and brightest is always positive, for any vocation. God knows, we could use more good lawyers and drop some terrible ones. True for physician, plumbers (whose status is fine thanks you), etc.

    Adding 60 lawyers doesn't "increase" the number of lawyer when the total number is, my guess, in the tens of thousands.

    More than (none / 0) (#5)
    by TChris on Wed Dec 24, 2008 at 01:55:09 PM EST
    20,000 in Wisconsin alone.

    Parent
    well over 1.1 million (none / 0) (#14)
    by Sui Juris on Wed Dec 24, 2008 at 06:43:37 PM EST
    according to the ABA.

    Parent
    Free isn't nearly (none / 0) (#13)
    by Sui Juris on Wed Dec 24, 2008 at 06:41:22 PM EST
    enough money to make me go through three years of that again.

    As a 1L... (none / 0) (#19)
    by jr on Fri Dec 26, 2008 at 02:54:49 AM EST
    ...who is now suffering under mounds of newly-minted debt and who would likely have sacrificed parts of his body to get a free ride under Chemerinsky a year ago, may I just say:

    "Bah, humbug."

    Plumber vs. lawyer (none / 0) (#21)
    by asdfgh on Fri Dec 26, 2008 at 11:34:26 AM EST
    A lawyer calls a plumber because his faucet is dripping.

    The plumber fixes the faucet, doing about 30 minutes worth of work, and hands the lawyer a bill for $300.60.

    The lawyer is shocked,and askes the plumber what's this for?

    The plumber replies. Well, 2 washers at 30 cents each and $300.00 for labor.

    The lawyer exclaims, $300.00 for labor, that's $600.00 per hour, that more than I make!

    The plumber replies, well, when I was a lawyer, I didn't make that much either!

    Learn the Law for Free | 23 comments (23 topical)

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