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Thurdsay Night Open Thread

By TChris, Section Blog Related
Posted on Thu Nov 13, 2008 at 11:04:59 PM EST
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Today's political rumor is that Hillary Clinton is on the Obama team's short list for Secretary of State, along with Bill Richardson, John Kerry, and Tom Daschle. Some are wondering why rumors are flowing out of the formerly leak-proof Obama organization. Here's a space to talk about the Hillary Clinton rumor, the leakage, or anything else.

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    Thurdsay Night Open Thread | 38 comments (38 topical)

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    It's the kind of leaks that matter (5.00 / 2) (#1)
    by blogtopus on Thu Nov 13, 2008 at 11:08:27 PM EST
    Bad leaks: No
    Useful leaks: Yes

    They're seeing what the reaction is to various names. The 'Murkan People might not like the name Clinton very much, but the world Loves them some Bill, and Hillary will be a welcome face. I can't think of a better candidate.

    Agreed (5.00 / 2) (#2)
    by zvs888 on Thu Nov 13, 2008 at 11:26:34 PM EST
    Like with the whole Summers for Treasury business, it seems as if that's been aired out and put to rest as too controversial.

    These kinds of leaks are a pretty good way of making sure that it's a smooth transition.

    Parent

    Might Want to Add (5.00 / 1) (#3)
    by zvs888 on Thu Nov 13, 2008 at 11:28:47 PM EST
    That the buzz around Hillary for State has been growing hugely over the past few hours.  Seems as if Obama's actually discussed it with some of his advisors.

    I think it'd be great to have her there.  Puts her in a position of more power than her current spot in the distant Senate seniority.

    Parent

    I'm not being genderist here (5.00 / 3) (#12)
    by Fabian on Fri Nov 14, 2008 at 05:58:52 AM EST
    but I'd rather see Hillary in charge of something domestic.  (I want UHC, dagnabit!)

    OTOH - she could continue the string of Dem Nobels if she helps create peace in the Middle East.  I hadn't thought about Carter peace initiative - he did that in one term, not two.  That is impressive.  Not much since then.

    Parent

    the american people like the Clinton name (5.00 / 1) (#24)
    by TeresaInPa on Fri Nov 14, 2008 at 11:14:36 AM EST
    in fact exit polls are showing that she would have beat McCain by larger numbers than Obama did... about four percentage votes more.

    Parent
    exit polls (5.00 / 1) (#29)
    by TChris on Fri Nov 14, 2008 at 01:18:35 PM EST
    aren't a useful measure because the pollsters only talk to the people who show up to vote, not the people who might have showed up if Hillary had been on the ticket (whether to vote for her or against her).

    Parent
    what nonsense (none / 0) (#33)
    by TeresaInPa on Fri Nov 14, 2008 at 05:49:33 PM EST
    sorry, but of those who voted they would have prefered to vote for Hillary.  In fact 16 percent of McCain voters would have voted for her instead.
    Face it the DNC chose the weaker candidate.

    Parent
    Not nonsense (5.00 / 1) (#37)
    by TChris on Fri Nov 14, 2008 at 09:17:49 PM EST
    because we don't know how many more Republicans would have come to the polls if Hillary had been on the ticket instead of Obama.  Exit polls just don't give enough data to answer the question because they are confined only to people who showed up to vote in an election where Hillary wasn't on the ticket.  That is my point and also point 4 of this 5 point refutation of the story that claims this data shows that Hillary would have won by a wider margin.

    Parent
    I think the "Murkan people" (5.00 / 1) (#25)
    by sallywally on Fri Nov 14, 2008 at 11:17:44 AM EST
    love the Clintons - especially Bill at this point, but Hillary really gained respect for her campaign. I think people know she is brilliant, thoughtful and able to get things done.

    Parent
    I hope Obama's not "vetting" (5.00 / 3) (#4)
    by Radiowalla on Thu Nov 13, 2008 at 11:38:40 PM EST
    her in the same way he "vetted" her for VP.   Another position that is dangled but not offered would be one too many.  

    It would be beyond insulting to consider her for Secretary of State and then reject her.  Better to leave her alone and let her maintain her dignity.

    I wonder if (5.00 / 1) (#5)
    by cal1942 on Fri Nov 14, 2008 at 12:41:32 AM EST
    he wants her out of the Senate.

    I do think he might like to get her where (5.00 / 1) (#20)
    by sallywally on Fri Nov 14, 2008 at 11:04:26 AM EST
    she is basically out of commission as a force for the center-left, which is what she'd be in the Senate.

    I thought the SCOTUS idea was a way to do that very thing.

    I'd hate to think he would do this and try to put her out of commission while seeming to honor her. I've been feeling he was more presidential lately, and he will be decidedly un-presidential if he tries to "disarm" her.

    I'm not sure he would actually want her at the Cabinet table, but this would make her views and comments less public, and if she did defy him, he could fire her (see the comment below) and really eliminate her.

    I could not support him in my heart if he does this. I've been happy to see him as presidential and to buy into the possibility of our nation becoming America again. And I think he has the potential to be an exceptional president.

    I know presidents are human, but viciously eliminating the power of one (or two) of the best minds and diplomats of in Dem history would be mind-bogglingly stupid and breathtakingly petty.

    Parent

    Er, the comment a couple of comments above....nt (none / 0) (#21)
    by sallywally on Fri Nov 14, 2008 at 11:07:03 AM EST


    Parent
    My friend (none / 0) (#13)
    by SM on Fri Nov 14, 2008 at 06:12:15 AM EST
    who is well-abreast of these affairs - he told me about Hillary for SoS rumour on the 11th, and the story broke two days later - is certain that Obama is trying to get Hillary out of the senate, and will eventually fire her as SoS with no career to go back to.

    I think that's a bit of a controversy theory, but then my friend thinks Obama has it in for the Clintons. I'd like to believe that's not the case.

    Parent

    Even if Firing Her as SoS (5.00 / 1) (#18)
    by BackFromOhio on Fri Nov 14, 2008 at 09:09:45 AM EST
    is not in the planning, he certainly wants her out of the Senate.

    And Hillary would have to suck up any differences she has with Obama on foreign policy.

    I say thanks, but I'll stay where I am for now.

    Parent

    Interesting (5.00 / 2) (#8)
    by Manuel on Fri Nov 14, 2008 at 03:14:49 AM EST
    I wonder how Smantha Powers and Hillary would get along on the foreign policy team.

    I would like Hillary in the cabinet but at HHS.

    And Bill should be made Middle East envoy and join Tony Blair in trying to hammer out a Peace accord.

    Who Could Be Better than Hillary! (5.00 / 1) (#34)
    by Folkwolf101 on Fri Nov 14, 2008 at 05:52:31 PM EST
    It's the least Obama can do, in addition to fulfilling his promise to help retire her debt. She would be great at the position--much, much better than Dashle, Richardson, Kerry, or any Replubican.  Remember, people on the international stage have always liked the Clintons and manhy of them were supporting Hillary for Pres, as they followed our elections. Posting Hillary as the new Secretary of State would be a win-win-win for everyone involved, and it would be Barack Obama's first smart move.

    I Can't Believe She (3.00 / 1) (#11)
    by bob h on Fri Nov 14, 2008 at 05:28:42 AM EST
    would take the job.  Richard Holbrooke is the pick here, and I would guess Hillary would say so, too.

    Holbrooke (4.00 / 1) (#19)
    by BackFromOhio on Fri Nov 14, 2008 at 09:12:11 AM EST
    is not liked by some in the Obama camp; so although he is probably the most talented person available, he won't be picked. Personalities I think.  
    Wesley Clark might also make a terrific SoS, but we know how the Obama camp seems to feel about Wes.

    Parent
    Yes. Talk about Clintons' (4.00 / 1) (#23)
    by sallywally on Fri Nov 14, 2008 at 11:13:35 AM EST
    not forgetting a slight......

    That is the one thing that could really hurt Obama's success. He needs the best people, regardless of his personal insecurities.

    Of course, some of those folks, like the Clintons and Wes Clark, are pretty good at playing the game, and their general views are clear.

    Obama may fear this.

    Parent

    These rumors, from what (2.00 / 1) (#32)
    by mg7505 on Fri Nov 14, 2008 at 01:52:55 PM EST
    I hear, are coming from people far removed from Obama's circle of actual advisers -- they should not under any circumstances be taken seriously unless you're a mainstream media outlet looking for a story, or a "left"-wing blog whose CDS is acting up.

    Rumors shmumors (none / 0) (#6)
    by s5 on Fri Nov 14, 2008 at 01:37:05 AM EST
    Surely they can find talent from places other than the Senate.

    they supposedly want the BEST (5.00 / 1) (#26)
    by TeresaInPa on Fri Nov 14, 2008 at 11:17:48 AM EST
    and Robert Kennedy would win her spot easily.

    Parent
    wait (none / 0) (#7)
    by mpBBagain on Fri Nov 14, 2008 at 02:32:38 AM EST
    Whats interesting to me is if  OBAMA does tap her for Sec of State and she accepts...   The Hardcore Hillary people who hate Obama will be really perplexed.

    Perplexed? (5.00 / 3) (#9)
    by nycstray on Fri Nov 14, 2008 at 03:24:13 AM EST
    I don't think so. She's obviously someone who could be good in that position, I'm betting her tea sipping skills are much better than Kerry's or Richardson's!

    I think the reality of the situation is not Obama picking her (if he does), but what would she do and what is best for her/us. Interesting to speculate, but far from perplexing. Most can see her in either role and working hard as usual. She's an asset either way.

    Parent

    Perplexed x 2 (none / 0) (#10)
    by mpBBagain on Fri Nov 14, 2008 at 05:10:48 AM EST
    I mean if u are one of these groups that hates OBAMA... like the jungle felines and love HILL... how can u rip OBAMA as hard if he gives Hill that kind of role and power as sec of state

    Parent
    Easy (5.00 / 1) (#14)
    by SM on Fri Nov 14, 2008 at 06:13:35 AM EST
    You claim Obama is trying to get Hillary out of the Senate and will probably fire her as SoS in a few months anyways.

    Parent
    hmm (1.00 / 1) (#15)
    by mpBBagain on Fri Nov 14, 2008 at 07:16:51 AM EST
    yeah i guess if i was an obama basher...i would use that line of lunacy too....

    Parent
    I'm not an Obama fan (5.00 / 1) (#17)
    by SM on Fri Nov 14, 2008 at 08:02:25 AM EST
    But I think that line of reasoning is a little far-fetched myself. But then I think Alice Palmer and suddenly not so much. But then I think - well he is the President, highest office, so what's in it for him. And then I just let it go and take on the "Wait and watch" stance.

    Parent
    Yes, scary. nt (1.00 / 1) (#22)
    by sallywally on Fri Nov 14, 2008 at 11:07:57 AM EST


    Parent
    not necessarily (5.00 / 4) (#16)
    by Dr Molly on Fri Nov 14, 2008 at 07:22:23 AM EST
    People continue to confuse dislike or non-support for Obama with love for Hillary, no matter how many times other people have said it's not about Hillary, it's about Obama. At least, that's what I have always seen written.

    Parent
    Well (5.00 / 1) (#30)
    by TChris on Fri Nov 14, 2008 at 01:20:14 PM EST
    if someone dislikes both Obama and Hillary, they're probably a Republican.

    Parent
    Not necessarily.... (1.00 / 1) (#31)
    by kdog on Fri Nov 14, 2008 at 01:27:11 PM EST
    lots of people fed up with both parties and want no part of either.

    I got no love for either of them.

    Parent

    Reading comprehension (none / 0) (#35)
    by Dr Molly on Fri Nov 14, 2008 at 06:43:11 PM EST
    That's not what I said.

    It is possible to dislike Obama whether or not you like or dislike Hillary.

    Also, what you say is just false. Plenty of non-republicans dislike both of them.

    Parent

    why? (5.00 / 3) (#27)
    by TeresaInPa on Fri Nov 14, 2008 at 11:18:41 AM EST
    I'll still dispise the manm but I will be glad someone with a soul is in the whitehouse with him.

    Parent
    not I (none / 0) (#36)
    by jedimom on Fri Nov 14, 2008 at 09:06:08 PM EST
    as a 'hardcore' HRC supporter I am not perplexed, I am hopeful bordering on ecstatic!

    I would feel much better about everything were HRC SoS. I think she would be truly wonderful in the role and it would go a long way I believe for many who are hoping to see a unification post election but have not felt welcomes aboard....

    Parent

    I am so sick of Sarah Palin!!!! (none / 0) (#38)
    by gentlyweepingguitar on Fri Nov 14, 2008 at 10:48:03 PM EST
    Can't she just go back to Alaska? And shut up? Doesn't she have a wedding to plan or some untouched open space in Alaska to drill? I want her off of my tv. Enough already. I'm done with her.

    Funny (5.00 / 1) (#39)
    by squeaky on Sat Nov 15, 2008 at 12:11:59 AM EST
    She is a GOP star. I do not think that she is going to disappear into the woodwork anytime soon.  

    Parent
    Thurdsay Night Open Thread | 38 comments (38 topical)

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