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Bill Clinton Promises A Hillary-McCain Lovefest GE

By Big Tent Democrat, Section Elections 2008
Posted on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 07:49:28 PM EST
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Speaking for me only.

If this is true, then the Clintons are promising more of the same triangulation of the 1990s:

"[Hillary] and John McCain are very close. They always laugh that if they wind up being the nominees of their parties, it would be the most civilized election in American history and probably put the voters to sleep," Bill Clinton said.

Excuse me Mr. President, but if that is the case, I see no reason not to nominate the unity schtick candidate who can actually get good press for his unity schtick.

If Hillary is not going to fight for Dem values against a John McCain candidacy, then what is the logic of nominating her?

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    Bill Clinton Promises A Hillary-McCain Lovefest GE | 129 comments (129 topical)

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    Bill was doing a B'rer Rabbit (5.00 / 2) (#4)
    by oculus on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 07:57:48 PM EST
    imitation.  Don't you Republicans worry.  Go ahead and nominate McCain.  We won't lay a glove on him.

    I think (5.00 / 1) (#10)
    by athyrio on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 08:01:46 PM EST
    it was Clintons clumsy way of saying no fireworks general election and I would never interpret that as endorseing a republican standard...That is a  bit of a reach me thinks....

    Excuse me (5.00 / 4) (#15)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 08:06:57 PM EST
    I guess some people think I am just kidding when I say we need to be ruthless with the Republicans in our politics of contrast/Fighting Dems approach.

    I am not. Throwaway lines like this are emblematic of a fundamental misunderstanding of our current political climate.

    Parent

    new meme about to develop? (5.00 / 2) (#20)
    by diplomatic on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 08:11:30 PM EST
    The Clintons: not ruthless enough?

    Parent
    Ha Ha Ha Ha that made me LOL (5.00 / 1) (#22)
    by athyrio on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 08:12:46 PM EST


    Parent
    Vicious (none / 0) (#30)
    by Stellaaa on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 08:16:42 PM EST
    The preferred term is the Clintons are vicious.  

    Parent
    I guess you forgot (5.00 / 1) (#29)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 08:16:41 PM EST
    the meme about DLC-loving corporatist.

    Parent
    I am a political junkie now (none / 0) (#39)
    by diplomatic on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 08:26:30 PM EST
    You'd be amazed at how little I'd forget when it comes to the details of this campaign season.  I've got sooooo much information swimming around my head it's probably unhealthy.

    If only I could go on some trivia show right now, I'd be golden.

    Parent

    ok for $1000.00 (none / 0) (#42)
    by athyrio on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 08:30:05 PM EST
    Who sounded shrill at the last debate? :-)

    Parent
    the answer is always Hillary (none / 0) (#44)
    by diplomatic on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 08:34:53 PM EST


    Parent
    speaking for the media of course (5.00 / 1) (#49)
    by diplomatic on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 08:39:11 PM EST


    Parent
    I really think (5.00 / 3) (#60)
    by Kathy on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 09:05:10 PM EST
    he was using some  southern charm there.  "Well, bless his heart--John McCain is an old friend of ours.  Y'all don't think we'd hurt him, do you?"

    Said the spider to the fly.

    And John McCain knows it.

    Parent

    Ha... (none / 0) (#82)
    by Stellaaa on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 10:05:03 PM EST
    Yes, in the south..you can say anything as long as it starts with "bless your heart"

    Parent
    Stellaaa (none / 0) (#122)
    by Kathy on Sat Jan 26, 2008 at 10:22:02 AM EST
    bless your heart, you're right.

    Parent
    Bill Clinton said it. Not Hillary (none / 0) (#106)
    by felizarte on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 11:17:21 PM EST
    She did say she will punch back in reference to Obama.  (without reference to McCain) But this would be another opportunity to say, "I'm running, not him." Besides, is this really the time to telegraph your strategy especially when it comes time to debate.  I think ALL of the republicans are apprehensive about their guy, whoever it is, about debating Hillary.  This is probably the reason they want so much for Obama to win.  McCain can contend with Obama with his "straight talk" folksy manner, never mind any debating rules or how win/loss is determined.  Similar to how Gore was rated as losing to George W. in the debates.

    Hillary can dish back whatever McCain dishes out--with a smile.

    Parent

    what was clumsy about it? (none / 0) (#24)
    by diplomatic on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 08:13:18 PM EST
    I've had the thought myself.  McCain vs Clinton would be a cordial affair, but the media sycophants will get ugly(ier) on behalf of McCain.

    Parent
    I don't know how well McCain would (5.00 / 6) (#13)
    by Teresa on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 08:05:43 PM EST
    fight back but I have no doubt that the first time he argues the wrong point with Hillary, she will let it fly at him. I don't care what Bill thinks. The one doubt I don't have about HC is her ability to be PO'd and fight back.

    Same with McCain. He's pretty blunt (5.00 / 1) (#71)
    by byteb on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 09:48:24 PM EST
    and when he's angry, he sarcastic and mocking. I think if Hillary gets the nod, we can expect to see some real fireworks between the two.

    Parent
    Feisty... (5.00 / 1) (#18)
    by Stellaaa on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 08:09:54 PM EST
    Well, it would look bad if she was beating up an avuncular old guy.  

    Remember those kid's punching bags (none / 0) (#23)
    by oculus on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 08:13:06 PM EST
    that sit on the floor and are weighted on the bottom, with a clown face?

    Parent
    Debating style (5.00 / 2) (#31)
    by Stellaaa on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 08:18:33 PM EST
    Last night McCain, when he got asked a question about the economy, ranted about who he would hire.  Imagine him facing Hillary, when she will cite specific policies, numbers, programs, trends and do it under one minute.  Yikes...it actually will be sad.  

    Ha, ha, ha, ha! (5.00 / 2) (#41)
    by LarryInNYC on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 08:29:47 PM EST
    it would be the most civilized election in American history and probably put the voters to sleep," Bill Clinton said.

    Excuse me Mr. President, but if that is the case, I see no reason not to nominate the unity schtick candidate who can actually get good press for his unity schtick.

    You're joking, right?

    If you really believe what Bill said, I'd like to sell you some shares in a bridge I happen to own. . .

    I do not believe it (none / 0) (#45)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 08:36:07 PM EST
    I do not believe he was stupid enough to say it.

    Parent
    I'm checking HRC's campaign (none / 0) (#48)
    by oculus on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 08:39:01 PM EST
    website, which is usually quite up to the minute on refuting what Obama says.  Nothing yet.  Must handle with care.

    Parent
    With respect. . . (none / 0) (#52)
    by LarryInNYC on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 08:46:53 PM EST
    what I feel you've always failed to understand is that people like the unity schtick.  Obama has a real chance of getting the nomination based on it.

    That doesn't negate the idea of having strong positions, identifying an enemy, and taking the battle to the enemy.  It simply means you have to identify an enemy small enough to still be able to have a chance with 70% of the electorate and imprecise enough so that people can easily remove themselves psychologically from that enemy group.

    Hence the Republicans generally campaign against "liberals".  We're now in a good position to campaign against conservatives, or at least "neo-conservatives" (who even come with the wonderful diminutive name "neo-cons").

    But in terms of the candidate's personality people do not want someone who's personally strident.  They want to believe that they will be heard by the candidate.

    The unity schtick is fine -- necessary even -- as long as it remains schtick.

    Parent

    No one does it better than Obama (none / 0) (#72)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 09:50:19 PM EST
    You should support him then.

    Parent
    I like Obama fine. . . (5.00 / 2) (#77)
    by LarryInNYC on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 09:59:10 PM EST
    and I'm undecided between him and Clinton.  With Clinton, however, I'm 100% certain she has absolutely no illusions what governing the country will be like.  With Obama, I'm just not that sure.

    That's what I mean when I say the unity schtick is fine as long as it remains schtick.  I'm a little bit worried that Obama actually believes it.  But it's not the fact that he says it that bothers me -- I think that demonstrably is allowing him to pull a very good share of the Independent vote.

    A sincere belief in post-partisanship is critical to governing -- once you can fake that convincingly, you're ready to eviscerate your opponents.

    Parent

    Bill Clinton's presidency was hallmarked by (none / 0) (#73)
    by byteb on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 09:53:01 PM EST
    triangulation. Hillary Clinton's senate history is replete with alliances with Republicans. She might characterize it as reaching across the aisle but if she's elected, she will govern the same way she acted in the Senate and the same way her husband governed as President...by practicing the fine art of triangulation.

    Parent
    This is true (5.00 / 1) (#79)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 10:03:02 PM EST
    and one of the reasons Bill Clinton should not be saying this crap.

    Parent
    I don't have a big problem. . . (none / 0) (#80)
    by LarryInNYC on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 10:03:31 PM EST
    with triangulation -- along with being controlled and calculating it's one of those things that I think has gotten an undeservedly bad reputation from people who seek short-term emotional satisfaction from their candidates instead of victory.

    I see Senator Clinton in the same light as someone like Trent Lott.  Lott was the master of the deal, and worked with Democrats to actually get legislation passed.  But no one would describe him as a lefty, or a centrist, or wishy-washy.

    Parent

    He's had a couple of (none / 0) (#85)
    by oldpro on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 10:18:06 PM EST
    stupid weeks.  Out of his element...out of his comfort zone.  Awkward and not himself.

    No.  He didn't mean it.

    She'll rip McCain to pieces and so will Bill.

    Hey!  Sharapova WINS!  She's baaaaaack....

    Which reminds me...I was just thinking if Hillary had been a pro tennis player, she'd have been Billie Jean King.  "Hey, Bobby....wanna play?"

    Parent

    It's jes' sayin', heck, we wanna be nice (none / 0) (#62)
    by Cream City on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 09:14:46 PM EST
    . . . if we're treated nice, y'all.  But if that city slicker from Chicago gets nasty, what are we to do?

    Parent
    Thanks, BTD, I needed a laugh ... (5.00 / 2) (#53)
    by robrecht on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 08:47:21 PM EST
    ... but I'm not worried about this comment at all.  I think they want to run against McCain and are planning on destroying him in the debates.  The appeal of McCain will not stand up in the long haul.  Has anyone listened to him talk lately?  He's slow and mushy, living off his well earned reputation and media soft focus good guy image.  Clintons will kill him with kindness, but kill him nonetheless.

    i am thinking about killing him (none / 0) (#125)
    by hellothere on Sat Jan 26, 2008 at 12:31:39 PM EST
    with a smile, a good quote and not a fist. there are so many ways of putting mccain to bed that don't involve burhahha. however having said that i believe that mccain, his possee, and media will make it necessary for a real fight.

    then bill will simply smile and say, they left us no choice. this is a setup for exactly that approach in my opinion.

    Parent

    "President Putin of Germany" (none / 0) (#129)
    by robrecht on Sun Jan 27, 2008 at 09:11:46 AM EST
    YouTube Link

    Parent
    That Is Just (none / 0) (#130)
    by squeaky on Sun Jan 27, 2008 at 01:54:45 PM EST
    McCain showing voters that he can be just as Predesental as Bush.

    Parent
    The Dems cave (5.00 / 1) (#69)
    by tnthorpe on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 09:42:06 PM EST
    yet again on the so-called stimulus package, abandoning unemployment extensions and foodstamp expansion, in favor of  handing more to people who aren't in real dire need.

    I am seriously tired of civility, of the sort of caving/bipartisanship mastered by Dems from Rockefeller to Reid to Pelosi.

    Does anyone here think that even if it's a big blue wave in Nov that the repubs are going to play nice? Can you say filibuster? Are their mouthpieces on FauxNoise going to suddenly grow hearts and brains? Will the Heritage and American Enterprise Institutes be shutting down?

    Yeah, I'll be writing in Eugene Debs too.

    O.K. After a great deal of thought, I've (5.00 / 1) (#113)
    by oculus on Sat Jan 26, 2008 at 01:06:56 AM EST
    got it.  Edwards is representing himself in South Carolina as the guy why doesn't get into fights in the Dem. debates.  In fact, that is the premise of his ad.  So Bill is horning in on that territory.  

    apparently (5.00 / 1) (#121)
    by athyrio on Sat Jan 26, 2008 at 09:52:42 AM EST
    the big dog had a plan after all in saying that and that is to make the republicans worried about nominating McCain.....Very very smart and subtle....Go Big Dog!!!

    Haha! (4.00 / 1) (#123)
    by Kathy on Sat Jan 26, 2008 at 11:37:30 AM EST
    Has anyone noticed what the republicans are doing with Bill Clinton's statement?  They are tearing apart McCain big time.  Romney already has an ad calling him a liberal in disguise.

    My God, I love Bill Clinton.  He's got to be chuckling over how easy this stuff is.  Crazy like a fox!

    Awesome (none / 0) (#127)
    by Stellaaa on Sat Jan 26, 2008 at 12:57:48 PM EST
    It worked...I love it.  

    Parent
    100 years in Iraq (none / 0) (#1)
    by diplomatic on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 07:52:39 PM EST
    it defeats itself.

    Noooo (5.00 / 1) (#9)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 08:01:42 PM EST
    It does not.

    Parent
    My comment was tricky (none / 0) (#46)
    by diplomatic on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 08:36:21 PM EST
    100 years in Iraq does defeat itself.  But you could take the comment two ways.

    Parent
    Oh man, now I'm sorry I even brought (none / 0) (#2)
    by oculus on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 07:55:57 PM EST
    this up, you Hillary-basher you.  Maybe she should put duct tape over Bill's mouth after all.

    What did you think (none / 0) (#6)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 07:58:57 PM EST
    I would say about it?

    This is Reagan praise like.

    They can be friends off stage.

    This is incredibly stupid of Clinton and frankly, worrisome.

    Parent

    Well, frankly, I can't always anticipate, (none / 0) (#7)
    by oculus on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 08:01:01 PM EST
    although I try.  I will say you are really quick!

    Some of the endorsements of HRC have pointed out how bright and feisty she is and much more prone to fight than her husband.  Lets see what she has to say about hubby's off the cuff remarks.

    Parent

    Remember her retort to (none / 0) (#81)
    by oldpro on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 10:03:44 PM EST
    Tim Russert's persistent quoting of Bill to Hillary in an early debate, hinting that they weren't in agreement about...whatever the Hell it was...?

    She said, "Well, I'll talk to him when I get home!"

    It was a savvy response, countering those who think she'd just be a front for a 3rd term for Bill...and not her own person.  Hah...

    Parent

    well there was the comment about (none / 0) (#126)
    by hellothere on Sat Jan 26, 2008 at 12:33:47 PM EST
    taking bush senior around the world restoring good will. i sure didn't care for that.

    Parent
    probably means (none / 0) (#3)
    by rilkefan on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 07:56:29 PM EST
    entirely substantive, hence entirely boring to 98% of the electorate.  I was out of the country at the time, but wasn't Clinton-Dole like that?

    Civilized does not mean without conflict (5.00 / 1) (#114)
    by echinopsia on Sat Jan 26, 2008 at 01:17:57 AM EST
    It means not primitive, ordered.

    I have no doubt that she can debate McCain on all the issues and kick his ancient ass with aplomb. She'll courteously cut him off at the knees so subtlely and completely that he'll take two steps before he realizes it.

    Parent

    the generous interpretation (none / 0) (#5)
    by Nasarius on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 07:58:47 PM EST
    Is that Bill is saying it wouldn't degenerate into personal nastiness, as in 2004. McCain at least had the tiny shred of integrity to condemn the Swiftboat attacks, so who knows, maybe he's right.

    what Bill meant (5.00 / 4) (#8)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 08:01:07 PM EST
    Reminds me of the WhatObama meant comments from Obama supporters.

    Sorry, no sale for me.

    Parent

    I'll just run over to DK and see what's up. (none / 0) (#14)
    by oculus on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 08:05:49 PM EST


    Parent
    heh, true enough (none / 0) (#47)
    by diplomatic on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 08:37:41 PM EST
    But to be equivalent, they will now have to explain a Bill Clinton comment about 100 more times in one week to catch up to Obama supporters on this front.

    Parent
    I don't really believe him (none / 0) (#11)
    by andgarden on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 08:03:47 PM EST
    Has McCain ever voted against Medicare anything? I'll bet he has, and Hillary is going to run the campaign against McCain as Bill did against Bob Dole.

    In this case, I think Bill is "just saying that."

    Just saying that (none / 0) (#16)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 08:08:51 PM EST
    is the Obama explanation.

    I do not buy it from him OR Bill.

    Parent

    I really just don't believe him at all (none / 0) (#19)
    by andgarden on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 08:10:32 PM EST
    But I agree--if it's true, it's stupid.

    Parent
    Saying it even (none / 0) (#26)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 08:14:43 PM EST
    is stupid.

    Think about a Dem base voter in the primary.

    You think THEY want to hear this?

    Parent

    Your "base voter" comment is apropos of (5.00 / 1) (#32)
    by andgarden on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 08:19:26 PM EST
    Beeton's latest.

    I think the campaign Hillary is running against Obama is pretty smart, and about as civil as anything we could expect.

    Parent

    Civil to Dems (5.00 / 1) (#36)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 08:23:34 PM EST
    does not mean proclaiming a truce with the leading GOP candidate.

    Parent
    "civil as we could expect" (none / 0) (#38)
    by andgarden on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 08:25:35 PM EST
    is not the same thing as "civil."

    I mean, just listen to the Obama boosters--she's supposedly being a you know what you know what.

    Parent

    I think (5.00 / 1) (#40)
    by athyrio on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 08:27:39 PM EST
    that the Clintons are damned if they do and damned if they don't...what a mess....

    Parent
    Well, Obama, not Michelle, made the (none / 0) (#21)
    by oculus on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 08:12:21 PM EST
    remarks about Reagan.  I'm thinking Bill's leash will be much tighter the next few days.

    Parent
    Come now (none / 0) (#27)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 08:15:21 PM EST
    You are not really comparing Bill to Michelle are you?

    Parent
    No. Just saying, what if Michelle (none / 0) (#33)
    by oculus on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 08:19:38 PM EST
    went off the farm about Reagan.  She is certainly out there on the stump and not just standing demurrely behind her spouse.

    Parent
    Plus, Bill is a real press hound, despite (none / 0) (#12)
    by oculus on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 08:04:03 PM EST
    his testy interchange with CNN reporter recently.  Its got to be really hard campaigning for your wife when you used to be the honcho in the spotlight.  

    Which is one of the reasons why I worry if (none / 0) (#70)
    by byteb on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 09:45:12 PM EST
    Hillary is elected. What do we do about Bill? And he's not the Bill of old. He seems to be developing a case of foot in mouth disease. He seems to have lost that ability to monitor what comes out of his mouth. This McCain comment was something that he never would have said years ago. Maybe he was trying to backtrack from getting a bit carried away with Obama, but I think he got carried away to some dim, sloppy place.

    Parent
    Sly like a fox (5.00 / 1) (#118)
    by robrecht on Sat Jan 26, 2008 at 05:42:50 AM EST
    Maybe he was trying to backtrack from getting a bit carried away with Obama, but I think he got carried away to some dim, sloppy place.

    That's part of what was crafty about this comment.  It's blaming Obama for the negative tone of their contest.  Not backtracking, but being subtle ... sly, like a fox.


    Parent

    I wonder if this is to take the spotlight off (none / 0) (#78)
    by Cream City on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 09:59:44 PM EST
    Hillary at times, intentionally -- so she can go hang around in Latino living rooms . . . no, really.  Maybe this is so no one notices what she is doing, maybe meeting low-profile with women's groups, with consultants, maybe even getting a bit of a rest -- but the Clinton campaign still gets in the news?

    Parent
    Another Clinton blowup (none / 0) (#17)
    by diplomatic on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 08:08:57 PM EST
    "An angry and red-faced Bill Clinton threatened reporters with the prospect of a civil and substantive general election campaign."

    The meltdown continues...

    Look (none / 0) (#25)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 08:13:55 PM EST
    You are either going to worry about the Media coverage on this, in which case might as well nominate Obama, or you are not.

    We need a Politics of Contrast. We need Fighting Dems.

    We need to negatively brand the GOP and its candidate.

    Clinton seems not to get that in this comment.

    Parent

    otoh....Bill Clinton: Crazy like a fox (5.00 / 1) (#119)
    by trillian on Sat Jan 26, 2008 at 07:06:06 AM EST
    From Jonathan Martin at Politico...

    Bill Clinton doing McCain no favors

    snip

    Not surprisingly, Romney's camp has already seized on the remarks and blasted them out to reporters.

    And just as predictably, a link to the story also now sits atop Drudge.

    This is not what John McCain needs going into a Republican-only primary in Florida Tuesday just as he's trying to prove his conservative credentials to those in the party's base who are still hesitant.



    Parent
    Hillary (none / 0) (#28)
    by athyrio on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 08:16:08 PM EST
    I truly believe to my bones that Hillary is a counter puncher....She will definately punch back if punched first as evidenced by the last debate...She ain't no wall flower....

    Parent
    Next time you are accused of never posting (none / 0) (#34)
    by oculus on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 08:21:18 PM EST
    an anti-HRC piece, here will be the evidence to refute.  

    Parent
    Oh to heck with those fools (none / 0) (#35)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 08:22:30 PM EST
    I have criticized Hillary more times than I can count.

    This is not posturing as you seem to be implying.

    Parent

    Definitely not posturing. Tepid Obama supporter, (5.00 / 1) (#37)
    by oculus on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 08:25:20 PM EST
    faith based; more electable, get rid of Cuba embargo, driver licenses for undocumented immigrants.  Did I miss anything?  

    Parent
    Oh God (none / 0) (#43)
    by diplomatic on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 08:33:35 PM EST
    Make it stop!  I agree with you.

    Please entertain yourself with this clip from Jon Stewart:

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/01/22/stewart-debunks-bill-moc_n_82644.html

    It is worth watching, I promise...

    Parent

    sarcasm alert (none / 0) (#54)
    by diplomatic on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 08:55:25 PM EST
    there is no meltdown.  I love Bill Clinton campaigning for his wife.

    Parent
    Me too I fail to see why it isnt OK (none / 0) (#58)
    by athyrio on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 08:59:57 PM EST
    for him to campaign for his wife if the other spouses are too...double standard....However, I am scared to watch Bill Maher tonite for fear he will be another shill and that would break my heart....

    Parent
    you know what they say (none / 0) (#59)
    by diplomatic on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 09:04:13 PM EST
    The lack of happiness comes from unmet expectations.  Lower them.

    Expecting Bill Maher to be fair to Hillary would be like hoping he'd respect religion.

    Parent

    LOL (none / 0) (#61)
    by athyrio on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 09:13:09 PM EST
    Well thats true he always gives her jabs, but he usually called Obama "slick" too....Hope he doesnt change that.....

    Parent
    Come on, you've got to be kidding? (none / 0) (#65)
    by RalphB on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 09:21:26 PM EST
    Bill Clinton doesn't get it.  There hasn't been a democrat who knew how to win the big one who wasn't named Clinton in 30 years.

    Something tells me he hasn't forgotten how to do it and the campaign will be whatever it has to be to kick some republican butt.


    Parent

    must be a slow news day in the MSM (none / 0) (#50)
    by Judith on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 08:39:46 PM EST
    if this is all you could find to tick you off.

    Or the Gators are dark tonight. (none / 0) (#51)
    by oculus on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 08:46:35 PM EST


    Parent
    ahhhhh (none / 0) (#56)
    by Judith on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 08:57:02 PM EST


    Parent
    Tommorrow will be better (none / 0) (#55)
    by diplomatic on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 08:56:33 PM EST


    Parent
    no doubt (none / 0) (#57)
    by Judith on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 08:58:46 PM EST
    somebody somewhere will be quoted out of context and send somebody into a tizzy.  What will it be and who will it be...

    stay tuned...

    Parent

    Well, now that Clinton (none / 0) (#64)
    by phat on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 09:19:48 PM EST
    has said that she thinks Bill got out of had, I'm sure that's evidence that she and Bill are evil.

    I can't wait.

    phat

    Parent

    Hillary (none / 0) (#84)
    by Judith on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 10:15:22 PM EST
    said what?

    Now I cant wait either!  

    Parent

    Here's the link. (none / 0) (#87)
    by phat on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 10:36:47 PM EST
    Clinton Seeks to Smooth Relations...

    WASHINGTON (Reuters) - Former President Bill Clinton said he might have gone too far in attacking Barack Obama, Hillary Clinton said on Friday, adding that both Democratic presidential campaigns should focus on issues.

    "He said several times yesterday that maybe he got a little bit carried away," Hillary Clinton said on CBS' "Early Show."

    "So we're all going to, on both sides I think, you know, try to bring this debate and this campaign back to the issues that are important," said the New York senator, who would be the first woman U.S. president.

    The campaigns of Clinton and Obama, the top two contenders for the Democratic nomination, have engaged in an increasingly bitter war of words, including a debate on Monday that featured sometimes personal attacks.

    I would expect that this is just more evidence of how evil they are. You know, it's a ploy.

    phat

    Parent

    hmmm (none / 0) (#90)
    by Judith on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 10:41:22 PM EST
    it would take imagination beyond my poor limits to do anything with this. But hey, it made the news!

    Parent
    it is those 527's that get nasty (none / 0) (#63)
    by athyrio on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 09:17:07 PM EST
    Obama just unleashed another one in San Francisco area I hear....Republicans love those too....

    But (none / 0) (#66)
    by phat on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 09:22:39 PM EST
    he wrote a letter!

    phat

    Parent

    Bleh (none / 0) (#67)
    by spit on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 09:25:34 PM EST
    why, why in a primary, are our candidates so eager to show off their bipartisan cred?

    I'm tempted to write in Eugene V. Debs, and fight hard for our middling nominee in the general.

    Well spit, he may have given (5.00 / 3) (#68)
    by Teresa on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 09:38:04 PM EST
    McCain the kiss of death to the Republicans. Now that they think he and Hillary are buds, they'll probably go for Mitt.

    Besides, I've yet to hear Hillary say she won't fight McCain or anyone else who gets in her way.

    Parent

    Nice One (none / 0) (#74)
    by squeaky on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 09:53:16 PM EST
    Well spit, he may have given McCain the kiss of death...

    I was shocked and surprised by Reagan, Bush I & IIn winning.

    This time I would be super shocked but not surprised if Guiliani gets the nomination and then wins the Election.

    Parent

    Well, if Rudy comes back at this (none / 0) (#75)
    by Teresa on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 09:58:56 PM EST
    point, super shocked wouldn't even begin to describe me. I'd fall out of my chair laughing. I think Hillary vs Rudy would be lots of fun actually.

    I was surprised that in the debate last night, Rudy was the only one who got some nasty questions from Brian Williams. I almost felt sorry for him. Actually, I'm such a bleeding heart, I did fell sorry for him.

    Parent

    Rudy looked suprised (5.00 / 1) (#83)
    by Judith on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 10:14:20 PM EST
    and touched when McCain was kind to him.  I dont like Rudy as a candidate - but that was a nice moment.

    Parent
    IF that was the goal (none / 0) (#124)
    by spit on Sat Jan 26, 2008 at 11:40:19 AM EST
    then it wasn't an unwise move, I agree.

    It's hard to tell what the point was.

    Parent

    pretty sure he knows what he's doing... (none / 0) (#76)
    by cdo on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 09:58:58 PM EST
    I really don't think this is a misstep on bill's part. i am pretty sure the clinton's already have a strategy for a run against mccain, and this is part of it. she isn't going to run the same campaign against him as she would against romney.
    mccain's strength is with independents, not the republican base. hammering the republican record of the last 8 years isn't going to get the job done in a matchup with mccain. he is tied to iraq, but whether he really is or not, he has that "maverick" perception thing she has to deal with. whatever the clinton's have in store, i am damn sure buying a ticket to see it.

    Disagree strongly. (none / 0) (#86)
    by MarkL on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 10:27:58 PM EST
    Bill is being clever in a way Obama couldn't possibly imitate. He is preemptively claiming the high road.
    Besides, there's a big difference between personal animosity and political rivalry---something Obama seems not to understand, in either direction.

    A new program (none / 0) (#88)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 10:40:45 PM EST
    "What Bill Meant"

    Parent
    Heh (none / 0) (#91)
    by phat on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 10:42:26 PM EST
    Is there a "What Edwards Meant" game too?

    phat

    Parent

    Uh oh. (none / 0) (#95)
    by phat on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 10:45:13 PM EST
    I just realized I might want to say this.

    Don't get me wrong. I agree with you about these remarks of Clinton.

    phat

    Parent

    Come on, BTD, you're being silly (none / 0) (#93)
    by MarkL on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 10:44:56 PM EST
    Do you really believe the Clintons will not fight tooth and nail? You're the one who's interpretation flies in the face of the evidence.

    Parent
    Excuse me (none / 0) (#102)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 10:58:21 PM EST
    Bill Clinton's track record in the 90s does ot inspire confidence that triangulation will not be a part fo his game.

    Parent
    We're talking about the campaign! (none / 0) (#104)
    by MarkL on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 11:03:11 PM EST
    You think they're not going to fight to win?
    You're off base.


    Parent
    Obama says he is tryoing to win too (none / 0) (#112)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 11:44:41 PM EST
    I believe him.

    I think he is going about it the wrong way.

    Parent

    The problem's how they define winning. (none / 0) (#115)
    by Ben Masel on Sat Jan 26, 2008 at 01:36:42 AM EST
    60 New Deat Penalties. Free Speech Zones. Clinton "victories."

    Parent
    This is the kind of sloppy post that (none / 0) (#107)
    by MarkL on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 11:21:50 PM EST
    you would eviscerate Ezra Klein for.
    There's nothing in what Bill Clinton says which indicates that Hillary's politics will be influenced by her friendship with McCain.

    Parent
    What Bill Meant? (none / 0) (#111)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 11:44:01 PM EST
    This is the type of hypocritical comment I will rebuke.

    Parent
    If these comments (none / 0) (#89)
    by phat on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 10:41:15 PM EST
    weren't planned out months ago or at least a couple weeks ago, I'd be surprised.

    That may reflect badly on big politics, but that's how it is, I figure.

    phat

    Parent

    I dont get it (none / 0) (#94)
    by Judith on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 10:45:03 PM EST
    what is the big deal?  I saw McCain and HRC share a chagrined smile at the end of the GOP debate when the Dems came on stage.  I think it is true that they have some cordiality between them.  I think it is also true that they will fight with more equilibrium than we are seeing now. I look forward to it, frankly.  HRC will sink him.  Politely.

     

    Parent

    Well (none / 0) (#97)
    by phat on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 10:49:53 PM EST
    I hope that if it takes being impolite to sink him she'll stop being polite.

    I think these comments were more of a long-term strategy.

    Maybe it's just to see how people would react? I don't think the McCain or any of the right-wing attack dogs will be polite. That's not how they operate.

    phat

    Parent

    of course (none / 0) (#99)
    by Judith on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 10:53:37 PM EST
    she will do what she has to - and I am sure they will go at it big time.  I have people I debate and we go at it too - but we know when to shut up and not let it get personal. You can be heated and passionate and still be in the boundries of polite.  

    as for strategy - sometimes people just say stuff. even Bill. so I dont know - you may be right.

    Parent

    It's very hard to tell (none / 0) (#101)
    by phat on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 10:56:00 PM EST
    when Bill Clinton "just says stuff".

    He does do it though. The "fairy-tale" thing was him just saying stuff, I suspect.

    phat

    Parent

    oh not that again (none / 0) (#103)
    by Judith on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 10:59:44 PM EST
    whatever phat - go read whatever you want into it. He said they would get along like adults OH MY GOD WHAT CAN HE MEAN???

    Forgive me, but I think this is just silly.

    So I am wrecking your fun and that isnt fair so I will say g'night and happy times!  Your posts are great and I am glad you are here...

    bye

    Parent

    Please don't misunderstand (none / 0) (#108)
    by phat on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 11:22:36 PM EST
    I'm never very clear...

    I don't know what's strategic or not in any of these comments.

    I'm not upset by any of them.

    Just talking...

    phat

    Parent

    please excuse me (none / 0) (#110)
    by Judith on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 11:38:14 PM EST
    I am getting tired so I was less than clear myself.  I didnt want to be a spoilsport and stop you from having fun talking - that isnt right for me to do.

    You may indeed be right in what you say - I dont really know. If he is strategizing it is over my hear that is for sure and I havent been convinced by anything else in the thread other than the person who thought he was being sarcastic.  But we'll see what happens.
    cheers -

    Parent

    Oh puke. I have on CNN and just saw (none / 0) (#92)
    by Teresa on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 10:44:26 PM EST
    Obama's unity ad for the first time. "There is no blue America, no red American, only the United States of America". Then Claire McCaskill (very disappointing to me) comes on and talks about what a new kind of politics he brings, etc.

    Yuck.

    is it too late for - (5.00 / 1) (#96)
    by Judith on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 10:46:13 PM EST
    there is only one race - the human race?

    Parent
    And Bill just said the same thing (none / 0) (#120)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Sat Jan 26, 2008 at 07:56:03 AM EST


    Parent
    Bill Mahr (none / 0) (#98)
    by athyrio on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 10:51:01 PM EST
    was interesting tonite....He seems a bit more in favor of Hillary....He had alot of commentation about Obama and the "black vote"....He never really came out and endorsed Hillary....but at least he didnt tear her down....
    I actually liked his show and thought it was quite fair....I like it when a commentator doesnt try to swing my opinion and just discusses issues...

    Amazing (none / 0) (#100)
    by phat on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 10:54:10 PM EST
    Seriously, I'm shocked.

    I wouldn't have expected that at all.

    phat

    Parent

    I wonder (5.00 / 1) (#105)
    by athyrio on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 11:13:47 PM EST
    I wonder if the reason that Hillary keeps rising in the polls everytime the media critizies her, is because we Democrats have had to learn not to believe everything we hear in the news media due to Fox News....Sad but at least Hillary has a ton of loyalty out there to help her...

    Parent
    It's not just Fox (5.00 / 1) (#109)
    by phat on Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 11:25:03 PM EST
    Everybody's been attacking Hillary for years.

    I don't like a lot of the things she's done. But I've had to do some work to find out if any of the press have been reporting what she's done accurately.

    I don't believe they do very often.

    It's not just her, of course.

    But the Clinton's are singular(?) in how they have been treated.

    phat

    Parent

    It Would Be Civilized (none / 0) (#117)
    by bob h on Sat Jan 26, 2008 at 05:08:10 AM EST
    in the sense that fundamentalist religiosity and immigrant-bashing would probably be off the table.  But I am expecting Bill to do Giuliani Time on the Republican.

    "lovefest" (none / 0) (#128)
    by diogenes on Sat Jan 26, 2008 at 07:01:53 PM EST
    Since Kerry asked McCain to be his VP, maybe McCain will return the favor and ask Hillary to be his VP :)

    Bill Clinton Promises A Hillary-McCain Lovefest GE | 129 comments (129 topical)

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