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The Reid Conference Call Transcript

Greg Sargent got it:

REID: Look what this Justice Department has done. And now, with the Surgeon General, we have a man here who has written articles that I think are a little questionable as to in our modern society. He's a medical doctor. And don't worry, he's gonna be looked at very closely.

BLOGGER QUESTION: What's the next step on Gonzales?

REID: Well, I guess the President, he's gotten rid of Pace because he could not get confirmed here in the Senate. Pace is also a yes-man for the President. I told him to his face, I laid it out last time he came in to see me. I told him what an incompetent man I thought he was. But he got rid of his Joint Chiefs of Staff chair, but he still hangs on to this failed Attorney General. And I guess he's gonna [inaudible]. We're gonna keep focusing on it. Every day that goes by, it seems he keeps giving. Now we've learned that the immigration judges are all graduates of Regent University I guess.

Update [2007-6-14 21:47:26 by Big Tent Democrat]: Maybe Reid is talking about Gonzales? Interesting question would be when was the last time Reid saw Pace and when was the last time he saw Gonzales.

I'm sorry Greg, who concludes Reid did call Pace incompetent, but the plain reading of this is he called Bush "incompetent." I really sympathize now with the bloggers. If I heard that, I never would interpret it as Reid calling Pace incompetent. He call Pace a "yes man."

I told him what an incompetent man I thought he was. But he got rid of his Joint Chiefs of Staff chair . . .

How is he not talking about Bush? Reid is never the most articulate speaker in the world but I don't see how he called Pace incompetent. One thing for sure, this sure was not "Red meat" for the bloggers as Politico claims. That is a fabrication by Politico.

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    He's talking about Gonzales (5.00 / 2) (#52)
    by Alien Abductee on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 09:28:03 PM EST
    It's clear from the logic of what he's saying even it's phrased in a jumbled fashion. Can you really see Reid telling Pace to his face that he's incompetent? I can't. But I can very much see Reid telling Bush that Gonzales is incompetent.

    Odd wording for sure on that "several sources familiar with the interview" in the Politico article. It leaped out at me the first time I read it. It implies arm's length knowledge rather than a participant, doesn't it? Someone told about it secondhand? A mole on Reid's staff? Or maybe those warrantless wiretaps come in even handier than we thought...

    So this is the tack they're going to take to counter Reid's pressure strategy - "regrouping for a new round of Iraq votes." Hasn't Reid learned by now that he shouldn't telegraph his moves ahead of time? The Rethugs don't just sit around waiting for Reid to make a move - they always take the initiative, they always keep moving.

    Exactly (none / 0) (#54)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 09:30:41 PM EST
    I am convinced that is right.

    Parent
    The Joint Chiefs of Staff (none / 0) (#59)
    by Alien Abductee on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 09:42:04 PM EST
    report to the president. "I told him..." followed immediately by "But he got rid of his Joint Chiefs of Staff chair..." Clearly the "he" being told is Bush, in the context of what to do about Gonzales, from the question and from the logic of He got rid of Pace, now he needs to get rid of Gonzales.

    No question about it in my mind.

    Parent

    What Reid Says Now (5.00 / 1) (#63)
    by Jeralyn on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 09:46:10 PM EST
    He was meeting with Pace:

    REID: Well, first of all, with General Pace, there's a long line of people who have indicated in various ways that General Pace was not the person to be the chairman of the Joint Chiefs. That's why the name was pulled.

    Peter Pace, I talked to him in my conference room, just him and I, and I told him how I felt, that he had not done a very good job in speaking out for some obvious things that weren't going right in Iraq. I told him that to his face.

    Now, with General Petraeus, which you didn't ask the question, but I will answer it, I have high regard for General Petraeus. When I was in Iraq, he was responsible for training the Iraqi troops. He told us it was going great. As we've looked back, it didn't go so well.

    He is a highly decorated veteran. I was a little disappointed, to say the least, today reading USA Today newspaper where he's saying things are going fine, kids are playing soccer. And I don't know what other examples he gave.

    The truth is, you look at another newspaper and look at a different page of USA Today, the bloodiest three months of the war has been since the surge took place.

    So I am waiting to see if General Petraeus can be a little more candid with us. What took place in USA Today is not being very candid.

    QUESTION: Can you give us your take on General Petraeus as it is right now (inaudible)?

    REID: I just did.

    QUESTION: Did you say anything yesterday of a critical nature similar to what you said about General Pace?

    REID: No, I said basically what I said today, just here. Pace, as I said, you have to stand in line for people to criticize Pace, but Petraeus, I've told you how I feel about Petraeus.

    So it appears Pace went to see Reid in Reid's conference room at which time Reid told Pace that Reid thought Pace  was incompetent.

    I don't think so (5.00 / 1) (#65)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 09:53:54 PM EST
    He gave a floor speech on Gonzales, calling him incompetent the day of the blogger call.

    I really believe the word INCOMPETENT was about Gonzales.

    The phrase YES MAN was about Pace.

    Parent

    Then how do you explain this (none / 0) (#72)
    by Jeralyn on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 10:03:49 PM EST
    Peter Pace, I talked to him in my conference room, just him and I, and I told him how I felt, that he had not done a very good job in speaking out for some obvious things that weren't going right in Iraq. I told him that to his face.

    It sounds so similar to what he said on the blogger call.

    Parent

    You know (none / 0) (#76)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 10:12:16 PM EST
    I think he could have said all that but I simply do not believe he would call him incompetent.

    I took care of the issue by the way.

    Parent

    I agree (none / 0) (#95)
    by Demi Moaned on Fri Jun 15, 2007 at 12:39:40 AM EST
    Yes, Reid is probably flummoxed by all the flap over this and doesn't quite remember what exactly he said.

    Parent
    I think that's a mistaken interpretation (none / 0) (#66)
    by Alien Abductee on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 09:54:06 PM EST
    All Reid said was that "he (Pace) had not done a very good job in speaking out." That's very far from saying he called the man incompetent to his face.

    Parent
    A Yes Man (none / 0) (#68)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 09:57:05 PM EST
    is what that describes.

    Parent
    Yes, exactly (5.00 / 1) (#73)
    by Alien Abductee on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 10:04:12 PM EST
    It all fits, psychologically and otherwise.

    But the question is how to make this heard over the GOP media machine's version?

    Parent

    Too late now? (none / 0) (#86)
    by Edger on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 10:34:06 PM EST
    Which was the point of Politico's publishing Bresnahan's article?

    Parent
    the same point as always (none / 0) (#99)
    by Sailor on Fri Jun 15, 2007 at 10:08:07 AM EST
    Bresnahan (and politico) are part of the rethuglican smear machine. he writes something untrue or slanted, drudge, (who he worships), picks it up, then powerlie, lamebaugh, et al  screeches about it. The the rethuglican candidates raise the level of screeching and then the msm picks it up, swallowing and regurgitating the wrongwings' talking points like they were facts.

    Then it gets vetted and proved wrong, and either no one notices or the msm just says 'hey, we just reported what they said.'

    john bresnahan is a dishonest hack who smears with half lies, innuendo and downright fabrication.

    Even john harris (Chief Ed of Politico) says:  

    Transparency should mean being less defensive about criticism, and/but also more candid in saying what we really think.
    When you write what you think, it's called an editorial. This is not reporting.

    the fact that bush and rove endorse politico prettty much says it all.

    Parent

    Reid is a lawyer and has practiced (none / 0) (#78)
    by oculus on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 10:14:57 PM EST
    law but he clearly forgot that all-important admonition:  just listen to the question, abd answer ibkt that question in as few words as possible.

    What a rambler.

    [Also, doubtless totally irrelevant to what "he" means, per Wiki, he and his wife are Morman.  Didn't know that.]  

    Parent

    Reid never used the word "incompetent" (none / 0) (#87)
    by Edger on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 10:43:45 PM EST
    talking about Pace in your quote above, Jeralyn.

    Yet "incompetent" is the only word Politico quoted.

    Parent

    New, from Microsoft: (5.00 / 1) (#69)
    by andgarden on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 09:59:41 PM EST
    it's the Reid to English translator!

    Heh (none / 0) (#71)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 10:03:35 PM EST
    We do need one.

    Parent
    It can run on weak tea. . . (none / 0) (#92)
    by andgarden on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 11:31:09 PM EST
    that's week old!

    Parent
    Babelfish (none / 0) (#80)
    by oculus on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 10:19:40 PM EST
    Heh (5.00 / 1) (#88)
    by chemoelectric on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 10:45:09 PM EST
    O only woe cometh to the slaves of the weaknesses of English grammar! They are afflicted with boils and cursed with an eternity of competition in Spelling Bees. No way did Reid say he told Bush to his face that Bush was incompetent, therefore the strict grammar interpretation must be wrong. We must picture the situation, and thus realize that Reid must have meant he told Bush, or perhaps Pace himself, that Pace was incompetent. Which is an unremarkable observation, by the way.

    Argh! (5.00 / 1) (#93)
    by Alien Abductee on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 11:42:27 PM EST
    Now ThinkProgress is "confirming" that Reid meant Pace...with FoxNews as its source!

    Reid confirms Pace, Petraeus comments.

    "Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid confirmed Thursday that he told liberal bloggers [this] week that he thinks outgoing Joint Chiefs of Staff Chairman Peter Pace is `incompetent.'"

    Reid said he told Pace face-to-face recently that he had performed poorly as an adviser on the conduct of the Iraq war.

    Are they out of their minds falling for the Fox spin?

    Here's the (5.00 / 1) (#94)
    by Alien Abductee on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 11:46:54 PM EST
    link

    Frustrating though it is, it's amazing watching the story spread. And it all goes back to that one piece in the Politico.

    Parent

    I vote that Reid was not referring to (5.00 / 2) (#98)
    by Militarytracy on Fri Jun 15, 2007 at 09:15:59 AM EST
    Pace when he used the descriptive incompetent.  He called Pace a "yes man" and with what Jeralyn shared he is expressing a bit of disappointment with Petraeus.  I like Reid but I find something in the read transcripts above very very troubling!  He is expecting whoever the Commander in Iraq is to have the conscience and outspokeness that the civilian authority over the military is supposed to have. This is extremely twisted!!  #1. Soldiers don't talk back to their Command to include their President and that is beaten into their skulls from day one of soldierhood.  It is blasphemy to do so so anything any Commander in Iraq will ever say to anyone will be filtered through that beating.  #2. When soldiers are in Iraq they lose certain sensitivities that we have when we populate a peaceful society.  I witnessed it in my husband when he was there and I witnessed his shift back to living in a climate of peacefulness.  Once you have been in Iraq for awhile, things that did not seem normal to you upon arriving begin to be perceived as normal.  It begins to take instances of extreme violence to trigger concern in those living in that climate.  #3.  A soldiers conscience when he is in combat becomes the Rules of Engagement and the Geneva Conventions.  That is why they are expected to know those things backwards and forwards and sideways because in combat survival takes over and survival has no rules other than survive.  WE CAN'T EXPECT OUR SOLDIERS, EVEN THOSE WITH THE MOST RANK, TO BE OUR CONSCIENCE IN THIS.  WE THE CIVILIAN LEADERSHIP OUTRANK THEM FOR A REASON AND WE ARE SUPPOSED TO BE THE CONSCIENCE OF THE FORCE OUR SOLDIERS USE!

    Keep the pressure on. Lets see the (none / 0) (#1)
    by oculus on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 08:12:47 PM EST
    entire transcript.

    You don't need the entire transcript (none / 0) (#7)
    by Kitt on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 08:18:00 PM EST
    to decipher what was said. The pertinent parts are there - before and after - and the context is clear.

    Reid is a fumbler sometimes when speaking, but many people are when it comes to subject/verb compatibility.


    Parent

    Not to determine what Reid sd. about Pace (none / 0) (#8)
    by oculus on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 08:21:24 PM EST
    or Petraeus, true.  But I'd really like to know what everyone (bloggers and Reid) sd. during this partially-veiled-in-secrecy telephone conference with "prominent" bloggers.  BTD has done a great job of springing part of the info.  I'd like it all.  

    Parent
    Gotcha..... (n/t) (none / 0) (#11)
    by Kitt on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 08:28:02 PM EST
    A purposeful fabrication. (none / 0) (#2)
    by Edger on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 08:12:53 PM EST
    Also slander or libel of Sen. Reid, in this layman's understanding of those terms, by Politico & John Bresnahan, and by Fox News.

    This would not be the first time Reid has called BUSH incompetent, and given BUSH's track record he's right.

    And it wouldn't be surprising to hear him call BUSH incompetent again... link

    Hmmm.....it depends..... (none / 0) (#3)
    by Kitt on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 08:14:48 PM EST
    In the paragraph, Reid starts out apparently talking about the president. It's that sentence thrown in ('Pace is also a yes-man for the President.') It's like it should be attached to the preceeding sentence with a semi-colon.

    Well, I guess the President, he's gotten rid of Pace because he could not get confirmed here in the Senate; Pace is also a yes-man for the President.

    As it is, the sentences - "I told him to his face, I laid it out last time he came in to see me. I told him what an incompetent man I thought he was." can actually be read either way because THE SUBJECT isn't clear. Then it becomes apparent from this:

    But he got rid of his Joint Chiefs of Staff chair, but he still hangs on to this failed Attorney General
    that Reid is talking about Bush due to the references to Pace and Gonzo.

    So if you read it as you suggest, Harry Reid is saying that he told Bush to his face that he is an incompetent man, which I have no problem with Reid telling Bush.

    Either way (5.00 / 1) (#4)
    by nolo on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 08:15:36 PM EST
    He was calling Bush the incompetent, not Pace.

    Parent
    And Bush has no issues (none / 0) (#5)
    by Edger on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 08:17:08 PM EST
    with truth, right?

    Parent
    That's (none / 0) (#10)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 08:25:54 PM EST
    how I read it.

    Parent
    Doesn't it depend on who came in to see (none / 0) (#6)
    by oculus on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 08:17:41 PM EST
    Reid?  Pace or the President?  I doubt it was the latter.

    No (none / 0) (#9)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 08:23:02 PM EST
    First he may have misspoke as to who visited whom. Reid may have been thinking of his famous dressing down of the Prez in the WH.

    Further, Reid calls Bush he immediately before and after the incompetent.

    Further, Reid may have been telling Pace he thought Bush was incompetent.

    Parent

    Not so sure Reid knew the taperecorder was on. (none / 0) (#12)
    by oculus on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 08:29:00 PM EST
    His syntax is as confused as W's.    

    Parent
    Actually, (none / 0) (#13)
    by Kitt on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 08:30:43 PM EST
    I don't have a problem with Reid calling either one of these dumb f*cks incompentent.

    I was going to say earlier - I've been referred to 'the politico' before via blog links. I'm just not impressed. I'm not one for b.s., half-truths, etc.

    Parent

    So, which one is "he" and why (none / 0) (#14)
    by andgarden on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 08:41:21 PM EST
    aren't we allowed the audio? I think Reid is talking about Bush, but this story still stinks to high h311.

    This is starting to remind me of the flap (none / 0) (#15)
    by oculus on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 08:47:43 PM EST
    about the typed v. word processed memo re W's national guard stint.

    Parent
    Thinking on it (none / 0) (#17)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 08:49:41 PM EST
    I think he was talking about Gonzales.

    I really do.

    Parent

    Good, because #2 was stretching it a bit. (none / 0) (#20)
    by oculus on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 08:56:51 PM EST
    This part doesn't fit, though: (none / 0) (#23)
    by oculus on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 09:05:42 PM EST
    But he got rid of his Joint Chiefs of Staff chair, . . .


    Parent
    Two Hes (none / 0) (#34)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 09:11:29 PM EST
    Bush and Gonzo.

    Pace is never a he.

    Look at it.

    Parent

    Wrong (5.00 / 1) (#37)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 09:12:51 PM EST
    One he is clearly Pace. "He'll never be confirmed."

    Parent
    Identifying the "He"s (none / 0) (#16)
    by Jeralyn on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 08:48:59 PM EST
    I'm coming very late to this discussion but let me see if I have it right.  Reid said:

    Well, I guess the President, he's gotten rid of Pace because he could not get confirmed here in the Senate. Pace is also a yes-man for the President. I told him to his face, I laid it out last time he came in to see me. I told him what an incompetent man I thought he was. But he got rid of his Joint Chiefs of Staff chair, but he still hangs on to this failed Attorney General..

    Did he mean:

    Pace is also a yes-man for the President. I told Bush to his face, I laid it out last time Bush came in to see me. I told Bush what an incompetent man I thought Pace was. But he got rid of his Joint Chiefs of Staff chair, but he still hangs on to this failed Attorney General..

    Or, did he mean:

    Pace is also a yes-man for the President. I told Bush to his face, I laid it out last time Bush came in to see me. I told Bush what an incompetent man I thought Gonzales was. But he got rid of his Joint Chiefs of Staff chair, but he still hangs on to this failed Attorney General.

    Are there other variations?

    I am now in Camp 3 with a twist (none / 0) (#18)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 08:51:06 PM EST
    He told Gonzales to his face what an incompetent man he is.

    Remember Gonzo was making the rounds . He muyst have come seen Reid. When was the last time Pace came to see Reid?

    Parent

    Reid calling Gonzo incompetent (5.00 / 1) (#30)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 09:09:22 PM EST
    2 days ago:

    Time and time again, Alberto Gonzales has proven beyond a doubt his incompetence, misjudgment and lack of independence. He is profoundly unworthy to hold one of the highest and most important offices in the land. I urge my colleagues to support this resolution reflecting the facts before us. I urge Attorney General Gonzales to resign his office to allow America the chance to recover from his catastrophic tenure. If he does not, I urge President Bush to finally remove him.

    I think he meant Gonzales.


    Parent

    Speech delivered the day of the (none / 0) (#67)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 09:55:53 PM EST
    blogger call.

    Parent
    Rashomon. Assuming Reid (none / 0) (#19)
    by oculus on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 08:55:39 PM EST
    permits records to be maintained of visitors to his (Reid's, that is) office, there is an answer to these questions.  Public record, no less.  

    Politico live chat (none / 0) (#21)
    by PoliticoRichard on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 08:58:12 PM EST
    Politico reporter John Bresnahan is doing a live chat on the conference call controversy on Friday at noon Eastern. He'll be taking questions starting Friday morning at www.politico.com.

    Richard Allen Greene
    Web Editor, politico.com

    Truly, I don't care on a made up story ..... (5.00 / 1) (#29)
    by Kitt on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 09:09:13 PM EST
    ...because Harry Reid is correct. Actually, he didn't go far enough!

    Parent
    He'll be taking questions (none / 0) (#22)
    by Edger on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 09:03:28 PM EST
    He'll have as much help to work out the spin for that by Friday as he had help to work out the spin on Reid? Will you be assisting him?

    Parent
    Talk about cynics! (none / 0) (#25)
    by oculus on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 09:07:09 PM EST
    And mega free publicity. (5.00 / 1) (#27)
    by oculus on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 09:08:16 PM EST
    Aww. jeeze. (none / 0) (#33)
    by Edger on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 09:11:13 PM EST
    Now I have to second guess my rating, because I'm not sure which way you meant that.

    Parent
    Puhlease. I was referring to Politico's (5.00 / 1) (#41)
    by oculus on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 09:14:31 PM EST
    clever tactic to up the "hits" by hosting tomorrow's q & a session (w/the q part submitted in writing in advance--kind of like a town hall presidential conclave).

    Parent
    It took me a few minutes (none / 0) (#44)
    by Edger on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 09:18:12 PM EST
    But I figured that after rereading - I changed the  rating.

    Parent
    John's not running for president (none / 0) (#70)
    by PoliticoRichard on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 10:02:22 PM EST
    You're welcome to submit your question during the live chat itself (12-12:45 Eastern) if you don't want John to have time to think about it in advance.
    Richard

    Parent
    No argument there! (none / 0) (#28)
    by Edger on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 09:09:04 PM EST
    Why the delay? (none / 0) (#49)
    by Edger on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 09:26:24 PM EST
    You guys had the smear published on shorter notice than that.

    Put Bresnahan on a live chat this evening.

    Parent

    Reid is not talking about Gonzales (none / 0) (#24)
    by Kitt on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 09:07:03 PM EST
    Yeah...this is getting too much for me. Hopefully, ole' Harry will clarify.

    I told him what an incompetent man I thought he was. But he got rid of his Joint Chiefs of Staff chair, but he still hangs on to this failed Attorney General.

    The incompetent reference has no reference to Gonzales. It's either Bush or Pace (because the subject of 'he' is unclear), and I think it's Bush.

    Its obviously not Bush (none / 0) (#26)
    by zAmboni on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 09:07:31 PM EST
    You can tell that Reid is not talking about Bush...

    I told him to his face, I laid it out last time he came in to see me.

    When was the last time (has he ever?) that Bush actually "came to see" Reid (or any Democrat for that matter).

    precisely. (none / 0) (#31)
    by oculus on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 09:09:44 PM EST
    Syntax and word choice (none / 0) (#32)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 09:10:13 PM EST
    Not Reid's forte. That siad I agree with you.

    He was talking about gonzales.

    Parent

    Really, Reid was just intimidated by all those (none / 0) (#35)
    by oculus on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 09:11:42 PM EST
    prominent bloggers and didn't know waht he was saying.

    Parent
    Have you listened to read much? (none / 0) (#39)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 09:13:40 PM EST
    He is terrible at speaking clearly.

    Parent
    'Fraid to. Having enough (none / 0) (#48)
    by oculus on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 09:25:03 PM EST
    trouble with the PARTIAL written transcript.

    Parent
    Well (none / 0) (#47)
    by Edger on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 09:24:01 PM EST
    He did wade into a pool of circling highly critical sharks. You have to give him credit.

    Parent
    But were the bloggers (none / 0) (#50)
    by oculus on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 09:26:46 PM EST
    "highly critical"?  Let's see the whole transcript.  

    Parent
    Of the caving on the supplemental (none / 0) (#56)
    by Edger on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 09:33:46 PM EST
    Exactamente. (none / 0) (#62)
    by oculus on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 09:44:48 PM EST
    Stop flip-flopping! (none / 0) (#38)
    by Kitt on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 09:13:13 PM EST
    You're making me dizzy.

    Parent
    This is the final flip (none / 0) (#40)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 09:14:17 PM EST
    I really believe he meant Gonzales.

    Parent
    Here are the key sentences (none / 0) (#43)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 09:17:15 PM EST
    I told him to his face, I laid it out last time he came in to see me. I told him what an incompetent man I thought he was. But he got rid of his Joint Chiefs of Staff chair, but he still hangs on to this failed Attorney General . . .

    See? Reid is saying I told Gonzo to his face and bush did get rid of his YES MAN CJS but he won;t cut loose this INCOMPETENT AG.

    I really believe that is what Reid was saying.

    Parent

    I can't believe I'm going to do this. (5.00 / 1) (#55)
    by Kitt on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 09:32:59 PM EST
    You know what - ya could be correct. Bear with me....

    He's talking to Bush about Gonzales:

    I told him to his face, I laid it out last time he came in to see me.

    Here -

    I told him what an incompetent man I thought he was.

    Reid is saying he told Bush that he (Reid) thought Gonzales is "an incompetent man." Reid is NOT saying he thinks Bush or even Peter Pace are incompetent men, although you know where I stand on that.

    Then - it's Bush again as the subject:

    But he got rid of his Joint Chiefs of Staff chair, but he still hangs on to this failed Attorney General . . .

    All right - that's it. I'm done.

    Please I beg you - end it now! I'm not getting any work done.  :)

    Parent

    But, but, but--this President would never (none / 0) (#58)
    by oculus on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 09:37:00 PM EST
    go to Reid's office.  LBJ maybe.  Not W.

    Parent
    My head hurts a bit from the vertigo (none / 0) (#45)
    by Edger on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 09:21:24 PM EST
    but it looks like it makes sense.

    Parent
    Fairly convincing.. (none / 0) (#46)
    by oculus on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 09:23:26 PM EST
    Reid just switched who "he" meant.  

    Now you should retire to draft your written questions for tomorrow on politico.com

    Parent

    Query: does this flip- (none / 0) (#51)
    by oculus on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 09:27:22 PM EST
    flopper wind surf?

    Parent
    Reid has met (none / 0) (#36)
    by Kitt on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 09:12:03 PM EST
    numerous times with the president. Reid may have been incorrect in stating 'when he came to see me' as meaning in Reid's office.  But don't take the tack that the president doesn't meet with congressional leaders, because he does and he has - Democrats and ReThuglicans. Those of us who follow politics, especially the dealings of this administration, know you're incorrect.

    Parent
    But we all know from that famous photo (none / 0) (#42)
    by oculus on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 09:16:48 PM EST
    that, at least once, Cheney sat glumly whilst Reid set the President straight.  Let's ask the VP what Reid meant.

    Parent
    2 days ago (none / 0) (#61)
    by Edger on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 09:44:41 PM EST
    CBS/AP:
    President Bush, right, accompanied by Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell of Kentucky, waves upon his arrival for a luncheon with Republican lawmakers on Capitol Hill on June 12, 2007.


    Parent
    Would protocol (none / 0) (#64)
    by Edger on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 09:52:07 PM EST
    mean a handshake with the Senate Majority Leader as well, during that visit?

    Parent
    Maybe, but in Reid's office? (none / 0) (#79)
    by oculus on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 10:17:27 PM EST
    Courtesy and respect? (none / 0) (#85)
    by Edger on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 10:31:33 PM EST
    He's on Reid's turf in the Capitol, no?

    Parent
    This is the Prez who addressed the (none / 0) (#90)
    by oculus on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 11:19:19 PM EST
    Pope as "sir."

    Parent
    Heh. (none / 0) (#97)
    by Edger on Fri Jun 15, 2007 at 02:50:57 AM EST
    Well, yes. His schedulers and handlers do their jobs, but they must cringe inwardly a lot.

    Parent
    Regardless (none / 0) (#53)
    by talex on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 09:28:28 PM EST
    of what was said and what it actually meant what I would like to know is who was the mole(s) who leaked this to Politico?

    Someone has lose lips and either says things to Politico that they should not be saying or at the very least tells others, who happen to have loose lips, inside info.

    Still, how did Politico get it? (none / 0) (#57)
    by Ben Masel on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 09:36:55 PM EST
    I'm wondering if their ultimate source was a Bushco wiretap. Have I missed anything which suggests, or proves, otherwise?

    Here's mcjoan's theory, from (none / 0) (#60)
    by oculus on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 09:42:25 PM EST
    earlier discussion on Talk Left today:

    The chances are, someone infiltrated the call, which would be pretty easy to do. There very easily could have been someone else on the call, because the system doesn't require you to announce who you are.


    Parent
    Wiretap Act (none / 0) (#96)
    by Ben Masel on Fri Jun 15, 2007 at 02:40:22 AM EST
    TITLE 18 > PART I > CHAPTER 119
    § 2511. Interception and disclosure of wire, oral, or electronic communications prohibited

    (1) Except as otherwise specifically provided in this chapter any person who--
    (a) intentionally intercepts, endeavors to intercept, or procures any other person to intercept or endeavor to intercept, any wire, oral, or electronic communication;
    ...
    (c) intentionally discloses, or endeavors to disclose, to any other person the contents of any wire, oral, or electronic communication, knowing or having reason to know that the information was obtained through the interception of a wire, oral, or electronic communication in violation of this subsection;
    (d) intentionally uses, or endeavors to use, the contents of any wire, oral, or electronic communication, knowing or having reason to know that the information was obtained through the interception of a wire, oral, or electronic communication in violation of this subsection;
    ...
    shall be punished as provided in subsection (4)

    (4)
    (a) Except as provided in paragraph (b) of this subsection or in subsection (5), whoever violates subsection (1) of this section shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than five years, or both.

    § 2510. Definitions

    (4) "intercept" means the aural or other acquisition of the contents of any wire, electronic, or oral communication through the use of any electronic, mechanical, or other device.



    Parent
    Before we get ahead of ourselves (none / 0) (#75)
    by andgarden on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 10:06:58 PM EST
    Is it fair to say that Pace is incompetent? I'd say probably yes. There's a reason why he can't be reconfirmed.

    Good point. (none / 0) (#77)
    by Edger on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 10:12:57 PM EST
    Was actually joking... (none / 0) (#81)
    by zAmboni on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 10:20:20 PM EST
    about Bush never meeting with the Reid (and the Dems earlier).

    I originally thought that Reid was calling Bush incompetent, then I switched to Pace, but now I am leaning towards Gonzales.

    One of the reasons why there is so much confusion over this is that I believe that Greg Sargent called Reid's office and they wouldn't either confirm or deny the Politico story. Because of this it led many to believe that Reid was actually talking about Pace.

    I would think that is a no brainer for Reid to come out and clarify his conference call statement saying that he told Bush (or Gonzales to his face) that Gonzales was incompetent.

    Maybe Reid was unsure of exactly what he said during the call to feel confident enough to respond. Now that the transcript is out there, I think that he should now clarify things.

    #3 w/ or w/o a twist? (none / 0) (#82)
    by oculus on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 10:24:59 PM EST
    "Now that the transcript (none / 0) (#83)
    by oculus on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 10:26:27 PM EST
    is out there, . . ."  Where--or just the excerpt about this particular statement of Reid's?

    Parent
    This is a subject (none / 0) (#84)
    by zAmboni on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 10:28:52 PM EST
    I was meaning the transcript that was in the original post (not the complete conference call transcript)

    Parent
    I gotta side with Jeralyn here. (none / 0) (#89)
    by Geekesque on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 11:15:31 PM EST
    Moreover, ambiguity is resolved against the drafter, or in this case the speaker (or Majority Leader as it were).

    Huh? (none / 0) (#91)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Thu Jun 14, 2007 at 11:28:35 PM EST
    Ambiguity against the Speaker?

    Ummm, this is not contract interpretation. Where'd you come up with that tranference?

    Parent

    So what? (none / 0) (#100)
    by Fritz on Fri Jun 15, 2007 at 10:10:25 AM EST
    What we will never hear from Senator Reid is at issue and why he uses derogatory partisan language instead.  What he should say, but will never say; "Mr. President, Generals Pace & Petreaus, what can I do as Majority Leader of the United States Senate to help you to succeed in our mission in Iraq?"  Victory for the US is a victory for Bush, leftists would rather the US fail than to allow any success of Bush.  Keep trying to spin Reid's comments, the independents that put him in power are seeing the beast they mistakenly elected.

    wrong as always (5.00 / 1) (#101)
    by Sailor on Fri Jun 15, 2007 at 11:19:11 AM EST
    What he should say, but will never say; "Mr. President, Generals Pace & Petreaus, what can I do as Majority Leader of the United States Senate to help you to succeed in our mission in Iraq?"
    No, a responsible person in a checks and balances democracy should say (paraphrasing): You lied us into an unecessary war now stop lying, obstructing justice and get us the f**k out now!

    Parent
    Reid should have sd., I expend (5.00 / 1) (#102)
    by oculus on Fri Jun 15, 2007 at 11:35:01 AM EST
    every bit of energy I have to persuade my colleagues to cease funding this war.  

    Parent
    Fritz (1.00 / 0) (#103)
    by jimakaPPJ on Sat Jun 16, 2007 at 09:30:56 AM EST
    Exactly.

    But won't happen. Reid is now in thrall to what has become the Demo base, the far Left, and can't get loose.

    There once was a lady from Niger
    Who went riding on the back of a tiger..
    They came back from the ride
    With the lady inside
    And a smile on the face of the tiger.

    ---unknown by me



    Parent
    enthrall to ... (none / 0) (#104)
    by Sailor on Sat Jun 16, 2007 at 12:26:27 PM EST
    ... the 70% of Americans who want the war over.

    Parent