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Tuesday Open Thread

I'm at the airport about to return to Denver. Telluride is a winter wonderland, but I'm ready to head home. Here's an open thread for you.

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    Options... (5.00 / 1) (#9)
    by desertswine on Tue Dec 12, 2006 at 03:54:22 PM EST
    Ha Ha Ha

    Let's see...

    Heaven will have Tim LeHaye, Jerry Falwell and James Dobson;

    Hell will have Freud, Kant, Gandhi, and Groucho Marx.

    I choose HELL...

    desertswine (none / 0) (#10)
    by glanton on Tue Dec 12, 2006 at 03:56:55 PM EST
    That's not very "American" of you.  

    Hmmmm.

    Are you quite sure you're staying alert, and staying with Fox?

    Parent

    Choose? Don't think you'll have a choice. (none / 0) (#11)
    by jimakaPPJ on Tue Dec 12, 2006 at 03:58:28 PM EST
    Can't you just choose Heaven (none / 0) (#14)
    by glanton on Tue Dec 12, 2006 at 04:04:33 PM EST
    By killing Arabs for Christ, as the game suggests?

    Parent
    Glanton (none / 0) (#24)
    by jimakaPPJ on Wed Dec 13, 2006 at 09:19:24 AM EST
    Actually there is a debate among the Christian sects about that.

    On the other hand, the Moslem faith promises 72 virgins and paradise...

    That does appear to be a difference...

    Parent

    Well, (none / 0) (#28)
    by glanton on Wed Dec 13, 2006 at 09:30:27 AM EST
    as long as there's a debate among Christian sects, we should all feel much better. I know I do just hearing it.  :-)

    You know, it's just reasonable people hashing out some minor details and all that.....

    The common thread here that needs to be mocked disparaged and generally accorded zero respect across the board, is radical organized religion of any kind.  Wouldn't you agree, Jim?  

    Unless you agree with Michael Medved's celebration of radical organized religion?

    Stay alert, and stay with Fox.

    Parent

    Shorter Medved (none / 0) (#37)
    by aw on Wed Dec 13, 2006 at 01:36:13 PM EST
    Keep fighting and killing each other for religion.  

    Parent
    religious bigots and christofascists ... (none / 0) (#33)
    by Sailor on Wed Dec 13, 2006 at 11:54:23 AM EST
    ... just can't help lying about others' religions

    Anyone wishing to conciously avoid such ignorance may look to Jannah to see the lie of 72 virgins.

    The Arabic for 'virgin' doesn't really translate into English. Descriptions like 'pure being' or 'angel' are closer, and there aren't 72 of them.

    Parent

    You can choose heaven (none / 0) (#16)
    by Jen M on Tue Dec 12, 2006 at 04:59:52 PM EST
    You and I along with Freud, Kant, Gandhi, and Groucho Marx will all just have to tippytoe around the section that contains Tim LeHaye, Jerry Falwell and James Dobson so that they don't find out we're all in heaven with them!

    Parent
    Ahmet Ertegun, ex of Atlantic Records (none / 0) (#1)
    by scribe on Tue Dec 12, 2006 at 01:52:41 PM EST
    reported to have been removed from life support, remaining in critical condition and clinging to life. (scroll down) He's reported to have suffered a head injury after falling at a Stones concert several weeks ago.

    Sometimes T-shirts say it better (none / 0) (#2)
    by Dadler on Tue Dec 12, 2006 at 02:21:00 PM EST
    Moo... ack! (none / 0) (#3)
    by desertswine on Tue Dec 12, 2006 at 02:38:24 PM EST
    Swift's meat processing plants raided. No charges against company.

    Surprise (none / 0) (#4)
    by squeaky on Tue Dec 12, 2006 at 02:40:51 PM EST
    No charges had been filed against the company.


    Parent
    Can't outsource it (none / 0) (#5)
    by aw on Tue Dec 12, 2006 at 02:47:35 PM EST
    so break the unions and bring in the illegals.

    Just like Smithfield

    Parent

    interesting how Swift (none / 0) (#6)
    by scribe on Tue Dec 12, 2006 at 02:53:06 PM EST
    didn't know these folks were (alleged) illegals, when the plants comprised ALL its beef-processing and 77% of its pork-processing capacity.  Maybe they just didn't care to know....

    More tidbits:
    local law enforcement not participating or even  not cooperating.  In Utah, the Sheriff only found out about it by happenstance.  In Grand Island, Neb., the Sheriff won't let his deputies participate - because the community won't trust them in the future if they do.

    The latter is a very NYC attitude - The City is constantly getting grief from the feds over a policy not to turn in people who might be illegal immigrants, just because they came to The City's attention when they sought some other kind of help.  One wonders whether the Sheriff of Grand Island is [shudder] a closet liberal!  

    More likely, he's just a sensible cop.

    This, I guess, is the kind of raid we can expect;  if one looks at the post I put up earlier on nominees who failed to gain confirmation, the recess-appointee ICE head and relative-by-marriage of fmr. JCS Chairman Myers, Julie L. Myers (f/k/a Julie Myers) was behind this.  Nomination fails - alleged illegal immigrants get to spend Christmas in Jail.

    Of course, if this was a Dem admin, the Repugs in Congress would be screaming to find out whether anyone in the WH or ICE had been trading in, say, cattle futures (which, I'd speculate, moved in response to, or after, news of this raid).

    Parent

    Oops! Blocked nominees (none / 0) (#7)
    by scribe on Tue Dec 12, 2006 at 02:55:20 PM EST
    Fighting and killing over details (none / 0) (#12)
    by aw on Tue Dec 12, 2006 at 03:58:45 PM EST
    "When asked about the Arab and Muslim-sounding names, Frichner said the game does not endorse prejudice. But "Muslims are not believers in Jesus Christ" -- and thus can't be on Christ's side in the game."

    Muslims acknowledge Jesus Christ as a prophet, a servant and messenger of God.  

    Shia, Sunni, Christian fundamentalist--fighting over the details.  I can hardly tell the differences among them.

    Uh, (none / 0) (#25)
    by jimakaPPJ on Wed Dec 13, 2006 at 09:22:20 AM EST
    the Christians are the ones who didn't kill dozens in Baghdad last night....

    Parent
    persons unknown (none / 0) (#27)
    by Jen M on Wed Dec 13, 2006 at 09:28:27 AM EST
    invaded their country, destroyed the infrastucture, bombed who knows how many buldings in the country leaving lord knows how much 'colateral damage' and then unleashing uncivil warfare between factions.

    I wonder who

    Parent

    Sure they did, (none / 0) (#34)
    by Sailor on Wed Dec 13, 2006 at 11:58:30 AM EST
    , they just did it the slow way with non-potable water, ruined infrastructure, not securing explosives after invading, 'misplacing' billions of doallrs that are funding the insurgency, the list goes on and started when bush declared a crusade to get the man who shot (at) his paw.

    Parent
    I'm tempted.... (none / 0) (#13)
    by kdog on Tue Dec 12, 2006 at 04:04:03 PM EST
    to buy it just to be the "bad" guys....lol.

    Glanton...wouldn't a better subject header be "War for Christmas"?  Jesus must be so proud...and he must also be wondering why we celebrate his birthday during the winter solstice.  If I was him I'd want my own holiday, thank you very much, not get piggy-backed on a pagan one.  Rude if you ask me, and no way to treat one of the great humanitarians of all time.

    You're a good soul (none / 0) (#15)
    by glanton on Tue Dec 12, 2006 at 04:06:53 PM EST
    kdog, Over the years I've enjoyed and learned from your posts as much as anyone on this board.

    Good lexical point re: "War for Christmas," but then, now that bloggers have ahold of the game, isn't it now a War On Christmas?

    John Gibson would say yes.

    Stay alert and stay with Fox.

    Parent

    Cheers.... (none / 0) (#18)
    by kdog on Tue Dec 12, 2006 at 05:10:11 PM EST
    and likewise glanton, you are aces in my book no matter what they say about you:)

    I'm having serious deja-vu this holiday season, no doubt...is Fox running Gibson re-runs from last year?  

    Stay alert, and keep your eye on Fox.

     

    Parent

    kdog you may be (none / 0) (#26)
    by jimakaPPJ on Wed Dec 13, 2006 at 09:27:47 AM EST
    unaware, but not all Christian sects celebrate Christmas as Christ's birthday, or Easter as the day he rose from death. Rather they make the point that the details are not known, but celebrate the fact of his birth and the fact he came back and ascended.

    There are no "Christmas" or "Easter" services.

    Parent

    Saudi Ambassador quits (none / 0) (#17)
    by squeaky on Tue Dec 12, 2006 at 05:08:49 PM EST
    Prince Turki al-Faisal, Saudi Arabia's ambassador to the United States, flew out of Washington yesterday after informing Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice and his staff that he would be leaving the post after only 15 months on the job, according to U.S. officials and foreign envoys. There has been no formal announcement from the kingdom.

    link

    Wonder if it has anything to do with our Iraq fiasco?

    there's been speculation about this elsewhere (5.00 / 1) (#19)
    by scribe on Tue Dec 12, 2006 at 05:26:55 PM EST
    but the theories I'm giving most credence to are:
    (a) an internal Saudi leadership shakeup-thing he needs to be a part of;
    (b) another step in the Sunni v. Shiite devolution taking place in Iraq - the Saudis will start (or increase) their funding toward Sunnis in Iraq to counter the US tilt toward the Shiites and the Iranian influence.  In other words, the Saudis are getting chapped at US policy and are going to go over to being adversarial.

    Another theory I've seen involves the US getting irritated that the Saudis are funding "insurgents" in Iraq, and the relationship was no longer tenable....

    We'll see, but none of them are really good for the US in the short, medium or long terms.

    Parent

    Foreign Minister (none / 0) (#20)
    by squeaky on Tue Dec 12, 2006 at 06:01:35 PM EST
    As much as I would like to thing that the Saudis are fed up with America's war on sunni moslems, I think it is more likely that he is going to replace his ailing brother Prince Saud al-Faisal as the Saudi foreign minister. In contrast to Prince Bandar, the last Saudi ambassador who was quite a socialite and loved the ways of the west, Turki al-Faisal is more of an acetic. My guess is that he would be much happier in Saudi Arabia.

    Parent
    Or maybe this: (none / 0) (#21)
    by squeaky on Tue Dec 12, 2006 at 10:54:23 PM EST

    CNN's John King reported this afternoon that President Bush is planning a "substantial policy shift" on Iraq and is "very seriously considering...agreeing with Sen. John McCain and increasing U.S. troop levels in the short-term."

    think progress

    Parent

    Or Perhaps This? (none / 0) (#52)
    by squeaky on Thu Dec 14, 2006 at 02:35:02 PM EST

    Cheney is reportedly advocating taking the side of the Shiites in Iraq's civil war, a position which caused him to be "summoned" recently to Saudi Arabia and has stoked fears of a broader war in the Middle East.

    link

    Parent

    And in the unbelievable stupidity department (none / 0) (#22)
    by Edger on Wed Dec 13, 2006 at 06:50:35 AM EST
    Is their some kind of a prize for extreme stupidity being offered, or what? Incredible....

    It's time for a another penile insecurity war. This time a War on Soybeans.

    Columnist claims soy products reduce penis size, make men gay

    A column published today on conservative website World Net Daily claims that use of soy products leads to reduced penis size and higher rates of male homosexuality.

    In "A devil food is turning out kids into homosexuals," author James Rutz claims that soy raises human estrogen levels, causing the shifts.

    It occurs to me that any guy this insecure about the size of his pee pee can fight a war over this and eliminate the threat entirely, with just one bullet. He's have the immediate support of just about the entire world.

    C'mon. Nobody is this stupid. Are they?? Amazing.

    Apparently, they are. (5.00 / 1) (#23)
    by aw on Wed Dec 13, 2006 at 08:43:39 AM EST
    What caused homosexuality before soy products?  

    It occurs to me that any guy this insecure about the size of his pee pee can fight a war over this and eliminate the threat entirely, with just one bullet. He's have the immediate support of just about the entire world.

    Tee hee.

    Parent

    Unfair (none / 0) (#30)
    by Edger on Wed Dec 13, 2006 at 09:47:57 AM EST
    What caused homosexuality before soy products?

    Unfair! You'll just confuse them with hard questions.

    Parent

    The cure? (none / 0) (#31)
    by kdog on Wed Dec 13, 2006 at 10:14:52 AM EST
    Did they mention the cure Edger?  The blood of virgins or something to counter the demon effects of soy?

    Instead of blaming soy, why not blame their god or mother nature?  I mean homosexuality exists because god wants it to exist....god does not make mistakes, or so I've heard.

    Parent

    The cure? (none / 0) (#32)
    by Edger on Wed Dec 13, 2006 at 10:28:18 AM EST
    Bombs? Guns? Steroids? Booze? Mix in a large dollop of extreme insecurity and become a control freak to compensate? Find good strong closet? Spend your life in utter denial, creating deep neuroses and psychosis?

    They use 'em all, don't they? If they get sucked into buying the kind of crap that World Nut Daily is trying to sell.

    Who needs a cure? It's not a disease. Lots less work just being yourself, I would think. No? ;-)


    Parent

    Jeralyn (none / 0) (#29)
    by glanton on Wed Dec 13, 2006 at 09:33:29 AM EST
    What is going on with this thread? A couple of my posts appear to be missing.

    NYC hates our freedoms (none / 0) (#36)
    by Sailor on Wed Dec 13, 2006 at 01:02:35 PM EST
    City Fights Efforts to Release 2004 Convention Arrest Records

    Faced with lawsuits from hundreds of people arrested during the 2004 Republican National Convention, the Bloomberg administration is fighting to keep secret a vast array of records, testimony and videotapes collected that week.

    The city contends the materials could be embarrassing to people who were arrested, disclose police intelligence, or reveal environmental conditions that may hurt commercial development on the West Side waterfront or be useful to terrorists.
    [...]
    For the most part, videotapes of the arrests -- by civilian and police photographers -- have tended to exonerate the people accused.
    [...]
    The city also wants to withhold the "R.N.C. Executive Summary," a police report dated June 24, 2004, that was provided to the Republican National Committee.
    [...]
    The city also asked the judge not to disclose three reports on environmental conditions at Pier 57 [...]  "Disclosures about possible environmental hazards at Pier 57, particularly alleged asbestos hazards, easily could impact the H.R.P.T.'s ability to arrange development partners,"



    This is (none / 0) (#40)
    by aw on Wed Dec 13, 2006 at 07:01:43 PM EST
    one of those "every time I think it can't get worse" moments.  I can't keep up anymore.

    Parent
    Not Good News (none / 0) (#38)
    by squeaky on Wed Dec 13, 2006 at 06:30:25 PM EST
    Democrat Sen. Tim Johnson of South Dakota was taken to a Washington hospital this afternoon after suffering a possible stroke, his office said in a statement.

    ....Should Johnson be unable to continue to serve, it could halt the scheduled Democratic takeover of the Senate. Democrats won a 51-49 majority in the November election.

    ....Because the governor is a Republican, an appointment of this nature could affect the balance of power in the Senate, and thus the entire Congress.

    link

    Good News? (none / 0) (#39)
    by squeaky on Wed Dec 13, 2006 at 06:38:52 PM EST
    According to Think Progress:
    Sen. Tim Johnson (D-SD) did not have a stroke, contrary to previous reports, CBS News reports.

    No link was provided.

    Parent

    Still Serious (none / 0) (#41)
    by squeaky on Wed Dec 13, 2006 at 07:09:15 PM EST
    He is being evaluated and not out of the woods. Although it is not a heart attack or stroke.

    Polonium poisoning? (just kidding, Karl)

    Parent

    14 minutes ago (none / 0) (#42)
    by Edger on Wed Dec 13, 2006 at 07:11:48 PM EST
    WASHINGTON (AP) -- Democratic Sen. Tim Johnson of South Dakota was hospitalized after becoming disoriented Wednesday, weeks before his party is to take control of the Senate by a one-vote margin.

    Johnson, who turns 60 on Dec. 28, was admitted to George Washington University Hospital with an undiagnosed illness, said a spokeswoman, Julianne Fisher.

    She said, however, the senator did not suffer a stroke or heart attack. His office had said earlier it was a possible stroke

    More...

    Parent

    Whew (5.00 / 1) (#45)
    by squeaky on Wed Dec 13, 2006 at 07:35:45 PM EST

    Update on Johnson's Condition

    Word has it that he is speaking and is expected to be fine. More to come...

    link

    Just imagining Cheney as tiebreaker threw me into a cold sweat.

    Parent

    Good for him! (none / 0) (#46)
    by Edger on Wed Dec 13, 2006 at 07:38:17 PM EST
    Even just a dizzy spell or fainting can look like a stroke to nervous people... I hope he makes a full recovery.

    Parent
    I'll (none / 0) (#47)
    by aw on Wed Dec 13, 2006 at 07:41:40 PM EST
    second that.  Whew (I hope).

    Parent
    RE: Senate control (none / 0) (#48)
    by Edger on Wed Dec 13, 2006 at 07:46:56 PM EST
    I had never heard of this before but:
    There is little precedent for forcing a living senator to stand down against his will.

    A predecessor of Mr Johnson, Karl Mundt, continued to hold his Senate seat for three years after a stroke that incapacitated him in 1969, although he was unable to attend Senate sessions.

    More...

    Parent
    Brain Surgery (none / 0) (#51)
    by squeaky on Thu Dec 14, 2006 at 11:47:09 AM EST
    Well Fox and other wingnut media are licking their chops at the notion that Sen. Johnson will be declared incapacitated and have to give up his seat.

    SD election rules state that the governor has to hold a special election to fill the seat. He cannot just appoint someone.

    This is a dangerous situation. The salivating wingnuts should not be underestimated for the evil they would do just to maintain power.

    The NYT haa more.

    Parent

    28 Minutes ago - Dec 14 (none / 0) (#50)
    by Edger on Thu Dec 14, 2006 at 11:45:23 AM EST
    Please wish Tim Johnson and his family a special gift for Xmas this year.

    Senator Tim Johnson Has Brain Surgery, Doctor Says
    Update 3)

    Dec. 14 (Bloomberg) -- Senator Tim Johnson underwent surgery to relieve bleeding in his brain and treat a congenital malformation of his arteries, his doctor said. Control of the new U.S. Senate may depend on Johnson's health.

    Johnson, 59, is recovering "without complication" and it is too early to determine if he will need further surgery, Admiral John Eisold, the attending physician of the U.S. Capitol, said in a statement.

    "Senator Tim Johnson was found to have had an intracerebral bleed caused by a congenital arteriovenous malformation," the statement said. "He underwent successful surgery to evacuate the blood and stabilize the malformation."

    Johnson's wife Barbara said in a statement that the family is "encouraged and optimistic."

    He is in critical condition, said an aide to Johnson who asked to remain anonymous.



    Parent
    53 minutes ago (none / 0) (#54)
    by Edger on Thu Dec 14, 2006 at 05:09:08 PM EST
    [Tim] Johnson, 59, is having an "uncomplicated" recovery, is responsive to word and touch and has not needed further surgery, Admiral John Eisold, the attending physician of the U.S. Capitol, said in a statement this afternoon.

    This seem like good news, and although the article doesn't explicitly say he's talking, at least he is responding to things said to him.

    I wonder if this also means he's conscious?

    Any physicians around who can take a shot at interpretation here?

    Parent

    Stroke LIKE symptoms (none / 0) (#43)
    by Edger on Wed Dec 13, 2006 at 07:24:34 PM EST
    The following drugs, medications, substances or toxins are some of the possible causes of Stroke symptoms as a symptom.
    This list is incomplete and various other drugs or substances may cause your symptoms. Always advise your doctor of any medications or treatments you are using, including prescription, over-the-counter, supplements, herbal or alternative treatments.


    See full list of 149  medications causing Stroke symptoms   

    So can allergy meds, like Contac, antihistamines, etc.

    Oooops (none / 0) (#44)
    by Edger on Wed Dec 13, 2006 at 07:32:50 PM EST
    There are calls in Israel for Olmerts' head after a TV interview he did in Germany Monday night in which he "accidentally acknowledged for the first time that Israel had nuclear weapons."

    "Iran, openly, explicitly and publicly, threatens to wipe Israel off the map. Can you say that this is the same level, when they are aspiring to have nuclear weapons, as America, France, Israel and Russia?"

    Accidentally? Yes of course...

    digby's on fire (none / 0) (#49)
    by squeaky on Wed Dec 13, 2006 at 11:58:26 PM EST
    Regarding the repressive new legislation, drafted by Sen. John McCain:

    St. John wants to escalate the Iraq war and shut down the internet, too. What a guy.

     .....But McCain's proposal is liable to be controversial because it levies the same regulatory scheme--and even stiffer penalties--on even individual bloggers who offer discussion areas on their Web sites.

    "I am concerned that there is a slippery slope here," said Kevin Bankston, an attorney with the Electronic Frontier Foundation in San Francisco. "Once you start creating categories of industries that must report suspicious or criminal behavior, when does that stop?"

    ......No word on whether McCain and his fellow lawmakers are going to pass legislation making it illegal for politicians to pander to people's fears with stupid, useless legislation while their own brethren are hitting on 16 year old pages.

    digby

    Chalabi is back (none / 0) (#53)
    by squeaky on Thu Dec 14, 2006 at 02:54:41 PM EST

    Good News: White House exploring rapprochement with Syria.

    Bad News: Our point man is Ahmed Chalabi.

    TPM

    Wow (none / 0) (#55)
    by squeaky on Fri Dec 15, 2006 at 08:10:28 PM EST
    EXCLUSIVE: White House Forbids Publication Of Op-Ed On Iran By Former Bush Official

    They are fighting for our freedom.

    Think Progress