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My Day of Agreement: This Time With Kevin Drum

By Big Tent Democrat, Section War In Iraq
Posted on Fri Nov 24, 2006 at 06:54:15 PM EST
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Kevin links to Richard Clarke getting to the point:

In The March of Folly, Barbara Tuchman documented repeated instances when leaders persisted in disastrous policies well after they knew that success was no longer an available outcome. They did so because the personal consequences of admitting failure would be very high. So they postponed the disastrous end to their policy adventures, hoping for a deus ex machina or to eventually shift the blame. There is no need to do that now. Everyone already knows who is to blame. It is time to stop the adventure, lower our sights, and focus on America's core interests. And that means withdrawal of major combat units.

Exactly.

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    My Day of Agreement: This Time With Kevin Drum | 13 comments (13 topical)

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    Scary world.... (5.00 / 1) (#3)
    by squeaky on Fri Nov 24, 2006 at 11:55:34 PM EST
    If you get your wish, we'll see a regional war in the middle east, and sky-rocketing oil prices (and no, what happened last summer was not skyrocketing in the same sense).

    Oh and what was it before, Saddam was going to destabilize the mid east and:

    ..... we'll see a regional war in the middle east, and sky-rocketing oil prices (and no, what happened last summer was not skyrocketing in the same sense).

    and then:

    Such a war will do fairly large scale damage to the economies of the entire developed world

    Hmmm it never seems to end, all that danger constantly threatening to erupt. Great for the bedwetter society.

    so then:

    If that doesn't make Iran part of our core interests, then we don't have any.

    Did you say Iran?

    Great Book (3.00 / 1) (#4)
    by john horse on Sat Nov 25, 2006 at 12:00:38 AM EST
    I second your recommendation of March of Folly.  Its amazing how many times I've seen this book referenced by columnists and TL posters.

    In Tuchman's book it was amazing the number of times the leaders she examined pursued a course of action that turned out to be counterproductive even though there were those who offered a more rational alternative.  

    This is a book which complements well the many recent books written about Iraq (such as Thomas Rick's Fiasco and David Corn's Hubris).

    Core Interests? (1.00 / 1) (#1)
    by jarober on Fri Nov 24, 2006 at 11:36:22 PM EST
    If you get your wish, we'll see a regional war in the middle east, and sky-rocketing oil prices (and no, what happened last summer was not skyrocketing in the same sense).

    Such a war will do fairly large scale damage to the economies of the entire developed world.  

    If that doesn't make Iraq part of our core interests, then we don't have any.

    If? (none / 0) (#2)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Fri Nov 24, 2006 at 11:51:22 PM EST

    So what is going on now is . . .?

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    I don't think it is possible for you... (none / 0) (#7)
    by Bill Arnett on Sat Nov 25, 2006 at 03:20:28 PM EST
    ...to be more wrong, where you state:

    Such a war will do fairly large scale damage to the economies of the entire developed world.

    I've go news for you, but you have to keep it secret: This war doesn't affect the economy of any other nation on the face of the earth except America, Great Britain, and Iraq.

    China is just buying up every drop of oil in sight, for pennies on the dollar, compared to the astronomical cost we are paying in Iraq. India, Japan, Vietnam, Philippines, Singapore, Indonesia, Saudi Arabia, UAE, and just about any developed country you can name has no dog in this fight and nothing at all to lose when we suffer the inevitable defeat being meted out to us in Iraq.

    The rest of the world could care less how much damage we do to ourselves because they recognize a failing state (America) just as they did another failed state that thought a hugh military and lots of weapons were to answer to everything (Russia).

    They are much too busy engaging in commerce, providing universal health care for their citizens, and looking out for the common good of their countries to worry about the fate America has brought upon itself.

    And some of them are greatly amused by the antics of our neocon leadership, which is, after all, the ultimate sick joke.

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    Good point (none / 0) (#9)
    by squeaky on Sat Nov 25, 2006 at 03:42:33 PM EST
    A bit like rope a dope, if you ask me.

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    Or is that dopes smoking rope? (none / 0) (#10)
    by Bill Arnett on Sat Nov 25, 2006 at 03:51:01 PM EST


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    hahaha (none / 0) (#11)
    by squeaky on Sat Nov 25, 2006 at 04:25:44 PM EST
    good one

    Parent
    Get over it (1.00 / 2) (#5)
    by jarober on Sat Nov 25, 2006 at 08:29:36 AM EST
    Squeaky,

    How or why we got into Iraq, and whether you thought it was a good or bad idea at the time are of absolutely no relevance now.  We are there, and leaving will set the stage for a regional war.  That's the way it is.  No one has to like it - it just is.  

    Stunning... (4.00 / 1) (#6)
    by Edger on Sat Nov 25, 2006 at 08:50:53 AM EST
    ...obtuseness.

    IOW: Don't confuse me with history.

    Incredible.

    Parent

    Yes (none / 0) (#8)
    by squeaky on Sat Nov 25, 2006 at 03:39:53 PM EST
    I agree, absolutely stunning.

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    There are none so blind as those who... (none / 0) (#13)
    by Bill Arnett on Sun Nov 26, 2006 at 01:47:59 PM EST
    ...will not see.

    And when a blind fool could see that Iraq has devolved to a Civil War, what does it say about the rethug leaders who refuse to acknowledge it?

    Parent

    Sure (none / 0) (#12)
    by Repack Rider on Sun Nov 26, 2006 at 01:04:32 PM EST
    How or why we got into Iraq, and whether you thought it was a good or bad idea at the time are of absolutely no relevance now.

    Accountability is SOOO "9/10."  Putting the killer on trial doesn't bring back the victim, so what's the point?

    This is the end result of corporate immunity, in which those who harm others are protected from answering for their decisions.

    Parent

    My Day of Agreement: This Time With Kevin Drum | 13 comments (13 topical)

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