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Habeas Amendment to Tribunal Bill Defeated

By TChris, Section Terror Trials
Posted on Thu Sep 28, 2006 at 10:19:44 AM EST
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by TChris

Dennis Kucinich, speaking about the White House proposal to expand presidential power while denying fundamental rights to anyone it accuses of terrorism, says it all:

"This bill is everything we don't believe in."

Even Arlen Specter objected to the White House plan to eliminate habeas corpus protections for anyone accused of terrorism. Specter proposed an amendment to permit habeas review of military tribunal decisions, but that amendment was predictably opposed by nearly all Republicans in the Senate. It failed. Will that prompt Specter to vote against the bill, or to support a filibuster? Don't count on it.

That leaves the Democrats, who need to know that their constitutents support a filibuster. Senator Feingold explains why the bill deserves to die.

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    Habeas Amendment to Tribunal Bill Defeated | 20 comments (20 topical)
    Re: Habeas Amendment to Tribunal Bill Defeated (none / 0) (#2)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Thu Sep 28, 2006 at 12:33:04 PM EST
    well, we can't filibuster now. the only put the amendment up for consideration because the Dems promised they wouldn't filibuster. Talk about a boneheaded play.

    Re: Habeas Amendment to Tribunal Bill Defeated (none / 0) (#3)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Thu Sep 28, 2006 at 12:33:04 PM EST
    How can legislation shield people from prosecution for committing acts that were illegal at the time? Isn't that an ex post facto law? Or am I unclear and outdated as to that concept?

    Re: Habeas Amendment to Tribunal Bill Defeated (none / 0) (#4)
    by Punchy on Thu Sep 28, 2006 at 12:33:04 PM EST
    Other bloggers have noted: This bill basically wipes away the entire judicial system. Gone. If a trial is going poorly (Padilla), Bush just steps in and jails the individual. And there's no recourse. So anyone, anywhere, in court or not...can just be picked up, locked up, with no way to defend themselves? How, again, is this any different than the Soviet Union?

    Re: Habeas Amendment to Tribunal Bill Defeated (none / 0) (#5)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Thu Sep 28, 2006 at 12:33:04 PM EST
    I was watching this last night on C-SPAN and I have to applaud Dennis Kucinich from my home state of Ohio. He hit the nail on the head about this bill. This bill goes against everything this country was founded on, and will only serve to alienate this country further from our former or future allies. This bill must be defeated in entirety.

    Re: Habeas Amendment to Tribunal Bill Defeated (none / 0) (#6)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Thu Sep 28, 2006 at 12:33:04 PM EST
    I was watching this last night on C-SPAN and I have to applaud Dennis Kucinich from my home state of Ohio. He hit the nail on the head about this bill. This bill goes against everything this country was founded on, and will only serve to alienate this country further from our former or future allies. This bill must be defeated in entirety.

    Re: Habeas Amendment to Tribunal Bill Defeated (none / 0) (#8)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Thu Sep 28, 2006 at 12:33:04 PM EST
    Were I to ask; why? (are bushco doing this) I could forgive anyone thinking "What a niave question" But let the cynic in me ask the same. Why, what is the ultimate end game here? The cynic in me can't help but wonder, but I can't come up with a long term answer. Why? Anybody?

    Re: Habeas Amendment to Tribunal Bill Defeated (none / 0) (#10)
    by txpublicdefender on Thu Sep 28, 2006 at 12:54:17 PM EST
    This all just makes me want to vomit. I don't even recognize my country anymore.

    Re: Habeas Amendment to Tribunal Bill Defeated (none / 0) (#12)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Thu Sep 28, 2006 at 01:33:02 PM EST
    It was a nice 20 experiment... ---edger

    Re: Habeas Amendment to Tribunal Bill Defeated (none / 0) (#14)
    by theologicus on Thu Sep 28, 2006 at 02:46:06 PM EST
    Sen. Reid says he doesn't have the votes for a filibuster. This is not good enough. He needs to put the question to a vote. Flush out the Democrats who are soft on torture. If you care about this, call or Fax the offices of Sens. Reid, Kennedy and Kerry. They've been inundated with calls today. Keep up the pressure. If we have to go down, let it be with flags flying.

    Re: Habeas Amendment to Tribunal Bill Defeated (none / 0) (#15)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Thu Sep 28, 2006 at 03:01:28 PM EST
    As a resident of Ohio, I am so downtrodden by Sherrod Brown's capitulation on this. I certainly cannot vote for Mike DeWine, but now I cannot in good conscience reward Brown with my vote either. How can we trust a man who would throw constitutional protections into the wind in order to win some political contest?

    Re: Habeas Amendment to Tribunal Bill Defeated (none / 0) (#18)
    by Sailor on Thu Sep 28, 2006 at 03:25:24 PM EST
    Congress has the power to NOT adhere to international treaties like the GenCon, right?
    Uhhh, no. Not unless the 'unsign' them, like bush has already done. And it ain't just the international treaties, it's the US Constitution that just got trampled. Perhaps the courts will eventually weigh in, but since folks like you have approved every step of our rights being taken away and allowed bush to appoint rightwing extremists, I'm not sure that will happen. Good luck to y'all when you suddenly remember when you used to have rights.

    Re: Habeas Amendment to Tribunal Bill Defeated (none / 0) (#1)
    by Ernesto Del Mundo on Thu Sep 28, 2006 at 03:40:49 PM EST
    That leaves the Democrats...
    Translation: we...are...screwed.

    Re: Habeas Amendment to Tribunal Bill Defeated (none / 0) (#9)
    by Rich on Thu Sep 28, 2006 at 03:40:49 PM EST
    Unfortunately, a grandstander like Kucinich is the last person you want on CSPAN making these points. Reid & Pelosi should be saying this. I'm from Cleveland and he's the same ultimately ineffective putz he was years ago.

    Re: Habeas Amendment to Tribunal Bill Defeated (none / 0) (#11)
    by roxtar on Thu Sep 28, 2006 at 03:40:49 PM EST
    Does anyone have any ideas as to what effect these changes will have on international treaties regarding extradition? Will France, or the Netherlands (for example) allow extradition to a country that endorses torture as its official policy?

    Re: Habeas Amendment to Tribunal Bill Defeated (none / 0) (#13)
    by dutchfox on Thu Sep 28, 2006 at 03:40:49 PM EST
    I just phoned my Senators, Jeffords and Leahy and my representative, Sanders (I'm in Vermont) to express my sadness and concerns about this defeat. I urged Leahy to filibuster.

    Re: Habeas Amendment to Tribunal Bill Defeated (none / 0) (#19)
    by Edger on Thu Sep 28, 2006 at 03:57:13 PM EST
    The terrorists struck on Sept. 11.... ...and again on Sept. 28. I guess they really do hate freedom.

    Re: Habeas Amendment to Tribunal Bill Defeated (none / 0) (#20)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Thu Sep 28, 2006 at 05:41:23 PM EST
    Specter voted for the bill even without habeas. Also 12 democrats voted for it, final roll call 65 in favor and 34 against. Dems who voted for torture and repealing habeas and retroactive immunity: Carper, Johnson from SD, Landrieu, Lautenbert, Lieberman, Menendez, Nelson and Nelson, Pryor, Rockefeller, Salazar, Stabenow

    Re: Habeas Amendment to Tribunal Bill Defeated (none / 0) (#22)
    by jimakaPPJ on Fri Sep 29, 2006 at 07:14:11 AM EST
    kevin mccabe writes:
    I havent read the bill yet,
    Anybody here read it? Anybody here have a link??

    Re: Habeas Amendment to Tribunal Bill Defeated (none / 0) (#21)
    by kdog on Fri Sep 29, 2006 at 09:31:05 AM EST
    Dennis is wrong...this bill is everything our country used to not believe in. The USA as it exists today is a different animal...pro-torture, anti-habeus...I don't recognize the place anymore. A stranger at home I am.

    Re: Habeas Amendment to Tribunal Bill Defeated (none / 0) (#23)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Fri Sep 29, 2006 at 09:31:05 AM EST
    actually, it would be not extending to individuals it have never been extended to(rather than repealing). one small step for sanity, in other words.

    Habeas Amendment to Tribunal Bill Defeated | 20 comments (20 topical)