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Today's Republican Whining Point

by TChris

Republicans are complaining that intelligence agencies aren't doing enough to scare Americans with "ominous warnings" about Iran. Why is the GOP trying to terrorize the country? Why not a rational and calm review of the facts, rather than an endless series of dire warnings?

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  • Re: Today's Republican Whining Point (none / 0) (#1)
    by pax on Wed Aug 23, 2006 at 11:23:51 PM EST
    Maybe if the administration hadn't burned Valerie Plame and her network, there would be better intelligence.

    Re: Today's Republican Whining Point (none / 0) (#2)
    by Al on Wed Aug 23, 2006 at 11:28:12 PM EST
    Because these idiots want to start a war with Iran. They are using exactly the same arguments, heck they are even using the same words, as in the prelude to the invasion of Iraq. They're not too worried about the lack of troops. A ground war is not necessary. A few surgical air strikes will encourage Iranians to topple their own government, which will be shocked and awed into submission in two weeks. Actual troops will only be needed to topple statues and parade into Teheran, greeted with flowers by the grateful populace.

    Re: Today's Republican Whining Point (none / 0) (#4)
    by bad Jim on Thu Aug 24, 2006 at 12:33:12 AM EST
    Saints preserve us. Take a look at Ray Close's take on the same topic. This is insanity. What has happened? Did we wind up with so many bombs that we feel diminished as a nation that we never deployed them? Are we so freaked that we'd rather deal death than let Madonna slither on a stage, demonstrating blasphemy? I've had the "I'm already against the next war" bumper sticker on my car for a couple of months already. Please make it not so.

    Re: Today's Republican Whining Point (none / 0) (#5)
    by fafnir on Thu Aug 24, 2006 at 06:15:16 AM EST
    The neocons worms in our government are shamelessly relentless. They didn't get the Iraq "do-over" they expected in Lebanon, but they're determine to get a crack at Iran. Apparently, the Iran chop-shop equivalent to little Dougie Feith's OSP shop for Iraq is starving from a lack of false, incomplete and outdated intel to substantiate their pack of lies about Iran's WMD capability. Where's Cheney?

    Re: Today's Republican Whining Point (none / 0) (#6)
    by orionATL on Thu Aug 24, 2006 at 06:19:51 AM EST
    the bush admin's concern at present is not iran, it is the november congressional elections. iran is a foreign policy means to a domestic political end. the bush folks know very well that iran is no threat whatsoever at this moment. the bush-rove political strategy is to try to create a loud, long public discussion on iran that will carry into november. a discussion that will take all the oxygen out of any complaints about the long list of bush foreign policy or domestic failures over these six long years. rove pulled off this trick in 2002 with the drumbeat for an iraq invasion. in doing so, he avoided the off-year congressional losses that are typical for a ruling party. soooo. why not go back to the well one more time? the best defense against this manipulation of public discourse is to do what many sites are doing - to say: hey, have we seen this act before. don't i recognize those guys. didn't we hear this about iraq just before we stepped into that middle eastern quicksand. see for example matthew iglesias' comment at josh marshall's "talking points memo" this morning. it is no accident that william krystol has been ALL over teevee talking up the new, new war for democracy and freedom. will the tactic work for this election? only if the bush-rove team can stampede the mainstream media. on that score, chris matthews seems to be willing to help.

    Re: Today's Republican Whining Point (none / 0) (#7)
    by kdog on Thu Aug 24, 2006 at 06:42:20 AM EST
    I hope the American people will realize there is a lot more pressing, emminent threat to the Republic a lot closer to home...a nefarious group of evil-doers...headquarters in Washington DC.

    Re: Today's Republican Whining Point (none / 0) (#8)
    by Che's Lounge on Thu Aug 24, 2006 at 07:02:48 AM EST
    Why should the Bush administration care what the CIA says? According to them, this whole Iraq fiasco is the CIA's fault. Ironic that I would back the CIA against anyone. Welcome to Bizarro World.

    Re: Today's Republican Whining Point (none / 0) (#9)
    by Bob In Pacifica on Thu Aug 24, 2006 at 08:09:36 AM EST
    BushCo and the current group of Rethugs can only hold power by scaring people. Really, the strategy is as simple as that. That's how terrorists work. Scare people. I heard a stupid talk show host in San Fran yesterday who kept saying that the Demos can't win because they're not as tough on terrorism as Bush. Never mind that Bush has been unprepared, keeps trying to cut funds for port security and has created a whole generation of new terrorists who hate the U.S. Never mind, it's the fear that sells.

    Re: Today's Republican Whining Point (none / 0) (#10)
    by oldtree on Thu Aug 24, 2006 at 08:13:18 AM EST
    intelligence about things outside the country are not important, remember Oceania has always been our enemy(ally) this admin has fired the people responsible for gathering intelligence and replaced them with people that report to the top and then draft intelligence reports based on what the top wants them to say. reality is a funny thing. particularly when you can shape it into pretending that we have been attacked by terrorists. funny, wonder where there is any proof that we have ever been attacked by terrorists? I can't find any evidence that isn't tainted with the stained glove of the black hand

    Re: Today's Republican Whining Point (none / 0) (#11)
    by lewke on Thu Aug 24, 2006 at 08:22:59 AM EST
    I realize that this post and the one before it were made by two different people, but I have to say the irony of the two one right after the other gave me a nice chuckle.

    Re: Today's Republican Whining Point (none / 0) (#12)
    by Edger on Thu Aug 24, 2006 at 09:32:19 AM EST
    Why is the GOP trying to terrorize the country?
    Well... Because the've got nothing else to offer. Because they're politically and morally bankrupt. Because they're only capable of playing to the lowest common denominator in anything they try to do. Because they're pandering to the basest grunting limbic reptilian fears of the most uneducated segments of society. Because they're finished unless they can.

    Re: Today's Republican Whining Point (none / 0) (#13)
    by desertswine on Thu Aug 24, 2006 at 10:44:35 AM EST
    Those dang Islammyfascists... cain't trust 'em nohow.

    Re: Today's Republican Whining Point (none / 0) (#14)
    by Bill Arnett on Thu Aug 24, 2006 at 11:01:40 AM EST
    Aw, geez, edger, you done said all the good stuff! (Side note: I can't seem to be able to "right click" on my iBook. Oh, well, I'll "finger' it out sooner or later.) And top o' the mornin' to all. urright, are you there?

    Re: Today's Republican Whining Point (none / 0) (#15)
    by Edger on Thu Aug 24, 2006 at 11:06:21 AM EST
    Hey, Bill - morning! ... If you just click on the DT stamp of the comment you want to link to it willl open, and then you can copy the URL from the address bar in your browser.

    Re: Today's Republican Whining Point (none / 0) (#16)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Thu Aug 24, 2006 at 11:14:44 AM EST
    Aw, gee, those nasty 'telligence agencies are just not beating the war drum hard enough, and we've got Nu-Q-Lar weapons lying around doin' nothin'! Now, isn't that a problem?

    Re: Today's Republican Whining Point (none / 0) (#17)
    by Bill Arnett on Thu Aug 24, 2006 at 11:44:00 AM EST
    Thanx, edger- If my battery doesn't explode or burst into flames I'll try it. Do ya reckon we could just deal with all our enemies if we gave 'em laptops with Sony batteries?

    Re: Today's Republican Whining Point (none / 0) (#18)
    by Sailor on Thu Aug 24, 2006 at 11:47:13 AM EST
    Bill, try [control] clicking on it. You should get a list of options including 'copy link'

    Re: Today's Republican Whining Point (none / 0) (#19)
    by Edger on Thu Aug 24, 2006 at 11:53:17 AM EST
    Do ya reckon we could just deal with all our enemies if we gave 'em laptops with Sony batteries? How about if we just put them all on an island somewhere (the arctic comes to mind for some strange reason), and give the clay tablets and stone chisels and hammers. Let them start over. ;-)

    Re: Today's Republican Whining Point (none / 0) (#20)
    by Sailor on Thu Aug 24, 2006 at 12:10:39 PM EST
    Hey Bill, do you know about this? Apple has determined that certain lithium-ion batteries containing cells manufactured by Sony Corporation of Japan pose a safety risk that may result in overheating under rare circumstances. The affected batteries were sold worldwide from October 2003 through August 2006 To determine if your system is affected by this recall and to start the exchange process go to this web page:

    Re: Today's Republican Whining Point (none / 0) (#21)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Thu Aug 24, 2006 at 12:31:34 PM EST
    as i commented earlier on this thread: maybe the Chenyites wanted Chalabi to remove the US's ability to listen in on Iran's encrypted messages because the intel pointed to the fact that Iran was a long way off from getting nuclear warheads. Chalabi feted in US after he was implicated in leaking intel to Iran about US capability to eavesdrop/decode Iranian communiques

    Re: Today's Republican Whining Point (none / 0) (#22)
    by Bill Arnett on Thu Aug 24, 2006 at 02:01:56 PM EST
    Thanx, Sailor, I have my son checking whether I have a defective battery thru Apple. I purchased this during that time frame and ther battery has crapped out on me, but not exploded, YET, w-o-o-o-o-o-o-ah! And edger- whatever island we put them on, let's make sure global warming melts the ice right out from underneath them - and pray they can't swim! (Although I suspect they would float to the surface as most turds do!)

    Re: Today's Republican Whining Point (none / 0) (#23)
    by Edger on Thu Aug 24, 2006 at 02:11:44 PM EST
    Bill: whatever island we put them on, let's make sure global warming melts the ice right out from underneath them - and pray they can't swim! Now that's downright tough love ,and I love the idea! ;-)

    Re: Today's Republican Whining Point (none / 0) (#25)
    by peacrevol on Thu Aug 24, 2006 at 02:43:10 PM EST
    reality is a funny thing. particularly when you can shape it into pretending that we have been attacked by terrorists. funny, wonder where there is any proof that we have ever been attacked by terrorists? I can't find any evidence that isn't tainted with the stained glove of the black hand
    ? i think i found somebody that has checked out of reality...at least for a minute. any evidence that we've been attacked by terrorists? you mean before or after 9/11? before or after the USS Cole? before or after the world trade center bombing in 1993? before or after the us embassy bombing in nairobi in 1998? before or after the us embassy bombing in beirut? stained by the black hand? you did see the cnn coverage of these incidents as they happened right? perhaps the reaction was off key from what it could have/should have been. that being said, iran, if they developed nuclear weapons could decide to sell them to terrorists like al qaeda. but our foreign policy should be to work with the governments of these nations to let them understand our points of why we dont want the terrorists to have any more power/money/weapons than they already have...not to unnecessarily take another arab country to war and reinforce the negative perceptions of the us in those parts of the world.

    Re: Today's Republican Whining Point (none / 0) (#26)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Thu Aug 24, 2006 at 04:30:57 PM EST
    This is cuz Rummy said that all the good targets in Iraq have already been bombed.

    Re: Today's Republican Whining Point (none / 0) (#27)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Thu Aug 24, 2006 at 08:59:11 PM EST
    The Political Construction of Collective Insecurity: From Moral Panic to Blame Avoidance and Organized Irresponsibility (PDF) by Daniel BĂ©land Department of Sociology University of Calgary
    Abstract This theoretical contribution explores the role of political actors in the social construction of collective insecurity. Two parts comprise the article. The first one briefly defines the concept of collective insecurity and the second one bridges existing sociological and political science literatures relevant for the analysis of the politics of insecurity. This theoretical framework articulates five main claims. First, although interesting, the concept of moral panic applies only to a limited range of insecurity episodes. Second, citizens of contemporary societies exhibit acute risk awareness and, when new collective threats emerge, the logic of "organized irresponsibility" often leads citizens and interest groups alike to blame elected officials. Third, political actors mobilize credit claiming and blame avoidance strategies to respond to these threats in a way that enhances their position within the political field. Fourth, powerful interests and institutional forces as well as the "threat infrastructure" specific to a policy area create constraints and opportunities for these strategic actors. Finally, their behavior is proactive or reactive, as political actors can either help push a threat onto the agenda early, or, at a later stage, simply attempt to shape the perception of this threat after other forces have transformed it into a major political issue.


    Re: Today's Republican Whining Point (none / 0) (#28)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Fri Aug 25, 2006 at 12:20:56 AM EST
    Apparently, antiwar.com sees the effect of the Cheneyites on our Iranian intel capabilities: "Another blow to our intelligence-gathering capabilities was the "outing" of Valerie Plame, who headed up a CIA unit specializing in Iran's nuclear and other WMD programs. Bosom buddies Scooter Libby and Chalabi effectively delivered a one-two knockout punch to our intelligence-gathering capabilities inside Iran - leaving the field wide open for these guys."

    Re: Today's Republican Whining Point (none / 0) (#29)
    by john horse on Fri Aug 25, 2006 at 04:03:45 AM EST
    Now here is the type of intelligence that I think the GOP Congress has in mind (link found through talkingpointmemo). What the Bush administration and the GOP Congress wants is an intelligence that will provide truthiness, not the truth.

    Re: Today's Republican Whining Point (none / 0) (#3)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sun Aug 27, 2006 at 10:47:56 PM EST
    i've been thinking about how the US got triple-crossed by Ahmed Chalbi. It was reported that Chalabi had betrayed to Iran the fact that the US could intercept and translate Iranian encryptions. Then the US had feted Chalabi and wouldn't allow for the FBI to interview him while he was here in the States. Maybe the White House approved of Chalabi cutting off that vital source of intelligence on Iran's inner doings because the evidence showed that it would be many years before Iran could develop nuclear warheads?