Friday Open Thread

Donald Trump has all the delegates he needs. Bernie Sanders does not. But Bernie's trying to stay relevant by debating Donald Trump. Yes, some polls have Hillary and Bernie in a dead heat in California. Others have Hillary with a wide lead. Others say there's a backlash against Bernie brewing.

This is an open thread, all topics welcome.

< Hillary, Donald and Bernie Open Thread
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    Audiobook Recommendation (5.00 / 2) (#8)
    by ruffian on Fri May 27, 2016 at 12:53:41 PM EST
    I'm currently listening to "Life After Death", by Damien Echols, one of the exonerated West Memphis 3, read by the author. We've talked before about the various documentaries about the case. You probably recall Echols was the oldest of the 3, and sentenced to death, and also seemed to me anyway, very intelligent and articulate on screen.

    As it turns out he is also a very good writer and reader of his work. His voice and accent remind me of the readers of the various John Grisham books I have listened to on tape.

     The book is a combination memoir and excerpts from his prison journals. He writes about his extremely impoverished childhood in a very matter of fact yet moving way. Such stories....in particular, one of his only escapes as a child was to read horror stories, so even as a pre-teen he was devouring Stephen King and Dean Koontz books that he could get from the little library, reading them multiple times. The thought that this only pleasure of a child living in extreme poverty was later used against him to put him in prison for a crime he did not commit is just heartbreaking.

    I'm only to about his 7th grade or so years and he has already been moved more times than I can count, each living situation more horrible than the last.

    If you want to know what it is really like to grow up in such conditions, not to mention spend 17 years in prison for a crime you did not commit...you should take a listen.

    I'll have to check that out (none / 0) (#23)
    by McBain on Fri May 27, 2016 at 03:12:40 PM EST
    I wonder how many other Damien Echols there are still in prison, or worse, been executed for crimes they didn't commit?

    Apparently (none / 0) (#25)
    by Ga6thDem on Fri May 27, 2016 at 03:23:14 PM EST
    people have been looking for that innocent person put to death for a long time and I have wondered the same thing myself. Has it a case ever been found?

    They have not been looking very hard (none / 0) (#30)
    by CaptHowdy on Fri May 27, 2016 at 03:49:19 PM EST
    10 people presumed invent after execution

    Pretty sure you coukd find lots more without looking very hard.   That too a 30 sec Google


    There's this (none / 0) (#31)
    by CaptHowdy on Fri May 27, 2016 at 03:52:18 PM EST

    Since 1976, we have executed over 1,397 individuals in this country. As of January 2015, 150 individuals have been exonerated--that is, found to be innocent and set free. In other words, for every 10 people who have been executed since the death penalty was reinstated in 1976, one person has been set free.

    And (none / 0) (#35)
    by CaptHowdy on Fri May 27, 2016 at 04:00:20 PM EST

    8 innocent people who were executed


    The lawsuit (none / 0) (#1)
    by Ga6thDem on Fri May 27, 2016 at 12:11:08 PM EST
    he filed in California is so completely stupid and it reeks of desperation. From the behavior of his campaign I'm guessing the polls showing a wide lead by Hillary are likely more of what he's seeing in his own polls.

    re California (5.00 / 1) (#5)
    by ruffian on Fri May 27, 2016 at 12:37:28 PM EST
    I've always had doubts about Bernie's potential for success there. Yes, it is  a liberal state, but it has been liberal for so long that it is a very establishment liberal state. In many ways he does better in the conservative states that have pockets of liberals.

    A few weeks ago I said there was no way he would win CA - in recent dyas it seems more up for grabs, but the polls are all over the place so it is hard to tell.

    Picking a fight with Barbara Boxer does not seem very smart to me.


    Boxer (none / 0) (#6)
    by CaptHowdy on Fri May 27, 2016 at 12:46:55 PM EST
    Had one of the best debate reactions.

    It would be fun to watch.


    Someone said it would be the Super Bowl of crazy.  Yeah.  Probably.

    I'm still trying to figure out how, as every talking head has been telling me,  that two crazy guys screaming at each other in a stadium full of screaming morons is "bad" for Hillary.

    1" is the new "5"

    I did wonder if maybe the order was being misunderstood.


    That said (none / 0) (#7)
    by CaptHowdy on Fri May 27, 2016 at 12:52:58 PM EST
    I do think there is a backlash brewing against Sanders.  This ridiculous lawsuit is just the latest installment.

    From that link in the other thread the last line was "Sanders has not issued a statement on the matter"
    No kidding.


    Captain, (none / 0) (#12)
    by KeysDan on Fri May 27, 2016 at 01:10:30 PM EST
    you intuit well on these matters, requiring me to re-think this debate.  Firstly, from the Republican line-ups  we saw that Trump has no policies, let alone, details, to debate. He used bluster and oafish behaviors as detractors--his polls, his greatness, including his anatomy, how everyone loves him despite his hatred for them, often expressed.   As the one-eyed man in the land of the blind, he was king.

    Sanders has policies, but they are sketchy and detail-free.  It would be the battle of the platitudes at a high decibel level.  If Sanders uses real attacks on Trump, including his own words, Trump will lie and deny that he said what he said.  This will stymie Sanders to the point of being a reddened-faced stroke candidate.  And, the focus will go there.

    Everyone knows that government is not Trump's field, so they expect nothing and he is prepared to deliver same.  Sanders has a few ideas, that some think are new, easy for Trump to crank out old Commie pinko nostalgia from the wingnuts.

    Of course, no matter what, Trump will be declared the winner by the media.  A good show, but who needs it,  most have Netflix for that.

    But, if it really hurts both of them, I am in favor.


    I'm not so sure about the (none / 0) (#13)
    by CaptHowdy on Fri May 27, 2016 at 01:28:17 PM EST
    Media declaring Trump the winner.  They do love them some Bernie.  I expect they would be very torn.   Just yesterday Tweety was explaining how it would be Bernie who was all but certainly declared the winner.  I can't really remember why and who cares anyway.  I think you are right.  If there was a winner it would be Hillary for not being there.

    Natural- (trying to consolidate comments here)
    I was very intrigued by Trump-ulation so I googled and found and explanation of why Trump won the primary on a site appropriately called "now the end begins"


    For those of you who think I'm crazy, consider the following:

    God raised up the unGodly King Nebuchadnezzar to shake and enslave Israel for 70 years, and He used the unGodly King Cyrus to allow construction of a new Jewish Temple. He allowed the unGodly Pharaoh to enslave His people the Hebrews for over 400 years, and He allowed the Roman emperor Titus to burn Israel to the ground in 70 AD. Furthermore, God allowed the demonic Adolf Hitler to create the Holocaust in order that Israel might be regathered in 1948 according to prophecy in the last days.

    So to those of you who say that "God would never use a man like Donald Trump" say that in violation of how God has already revealed Himself to be with the rulers of nations. Over the past 6 months, Donald Trump has beat every single opponent presented to him, and by whopping margins. Some of those he beat are consummate, powerful politicians who know how the game is played. Yet, one by one, they all fell before Trump.

    As savvy as he is, you would be in grave error to credit Trump with the victory. It is God who sets up the kings of this world, not man. The global shaking is coming...



    Maybe (none / 0) (#18)
    by Ga6thDem on Fri May 27, 2016 at 02:16:14 PM EST
    there really is a silent majority and a debate like that might prove it :).

    Also might prove one of my theories that this election is going fall along the fault lines of crazy/not crazy.


    CNN (none / 0) (#26)
    by FlJoe on Fri May 27, 2016 at 03:24:05 PM EST
    reporting that Trump calls off debate.

    Sanders (none / 0) (#28)
    by Ga6thDem on Fri May 27, 2016 at 03:39:15 PM EST
    got played and so did the media. Trump never was going to debate Bernie. He's talking about how DWS has "denied" Bernie the nomination and then says he's not going to debate the "second place finisher". I have no idea whoever in Bernie's campaign thought tangling with Trump was a good idea but it was a poor decision. Bernie got dirty and the pig liked it.

    I dont know what all that means (none / 0) (#29)
    by CaptHowdy on Fri May 27, 2016 at 03:45:05 PM EST
    But if Trump did call it off it was because he was afraid.   I was right and Maddow was wrong.  Trump had everything to lose and Bernie (and the democrats) had nothing to lose.  

    Bernie did not get "played".   Donald stepped in it.  Now he looks like a sniveling coward for being afraid to debate an octogenarian socialist.


    This is awsum (none / 0) (#32)
    by CaptHowdy on Fri May 27, 2016 at 03:56:05 PM EST
    POLITICS  MAY 27 2016, 4:18 PM ET
    Trump Now Says Debate With Sanders Would Be 'Inappropriate'

    And if there's one thing we know about Donald he is never inappropriate.


    Live Bernie (none / 0) (#34)
    by CaptHowdy on Fri May 27, 2016 at 03:58:13 PM EST
    "I hope he changes his mind.  Again.   He changes his mind a lot.  Trump is a big tough guy, well Mr Trump, waddya afraid of?"



    Well (none / 0) (#36)
    by Ga6thDem on Fri May 27, 2016 at 04:01:26 PM EST
    if you read Trump's statement it's about how he doesn't see the need to debate the "second place finisher" so it doesn't come off as being scared of Bernie at all. It comes off as why bother debating with a "LOSER". However he said he would debate Hillary. We'll see if he actually does debate her or not.

    And you believe this (none / 0) (#37)
    by CaptHowdy on Fri May 27, 2016 at 04:03:47 PM EST

    No one else does


    DailyNews (none / 0) (#38)
    by CaptHowdy on Fri May 27, 2016 at 04:13:29 PM EST
    Donald Trump backs down on Bernie Sanders debate challenge after saying he'd `love to debate' Hillary Clinton's Democratic primary opponent


    (Sanders fries chicken Donald 10m debate flip flop)


    Well (none / 0) (#40)
    by Ga6thDem on Fri May 27, 2016 at 04:23:43 PM EST
    you've got the Hill is simply saying Trump won't debate Bernie. NBC says Trump says it's "inappropriate". Does anyone actually believe he's afraid to debate Bernie? I mean he actually did those stupid GOP primary debates. It's not like Bernie is going to get specific on anything like Trump.

    Unbelievable (none / 0) (#42)
    by CaptHowdy on Fri May 27, 2016 at 04:26:10 PM EST
    Why do you think he said over and over that he would LOVE to debate Bernie?

    Time (none / 0) (#43)
    by Ga6thDem on Fri May 27, 2016 at 04:28:44 PM EST
    says it was a win win for both of them because it's all the news talked about for a few days. Okay. I would agree with that.

    Fwiw (none / 0) (#44)
    by CaptHowdy on Fri May 27, 2016 at 04:29:15 PM EST
    The MSNBC crew is in complete agreement it was a total chicken sh!t moment.  It so obvious it's laughable.  And I'm amazed that you are do blinded by your hate for Bernie that you can't admit it.

    The Bernie Bros (none / 0) (#45)
    by KeysDan on Fri May 27, 2016 at 04:34:15 PM EST
    will be outraged. Trump insulting Bernie, and all.  May make them mad at Trump, and finding out, to their dismay, that Trump lies like a rug (pun intended). Trump is a fraidy cat.

     May distract the Bros from their earlier rage that Mrs. Clinton declined another debate with Bernie and her being distrustful because of the way she emailed. And, did not,at least, copy and file her government business emails in a timely manner, rather than giving up, essentially,  the lot of them when she did.


    Yes! (5.00 / 1) (#46)
    by CaptHowdy on Fri May 27, 2016 at 04:36:39 PM EST
    This is only good for the Sanders supporters flirting with a Trump vote

    Oh, and how is (none / 0) (#47)
    by KeysDan on Fri May 27, 2016 at 04:42:11 PM EST
    Trump going to deal with Putin?

    Ignore the noise (none / 0) (#9)
    by CoralGables on Fri May 27, 2016 at 12:54:20 PM EST
    RCP average has Clinton +8
    538 weighted average has Clinton +14

    But it will be over before the polls close in California so a double digit Clinton win (or a double digit Sanders win) won't make a difference.


    Just minutes ago (none / 0) (#10)
    by CaptHowdy on Fri May 27, 2016 at 12:56:56 PM EST
    Sanders campaign manager said they are going to the convention to make as much trouble as possible no matter what.  

    He's hoping to avoid the unemployment line (5.00 / 1) (#11)
    by CoralGables on Fri May 27, 2016 at 12:59:02 PM EST
    for a couple more months

    And Jane (none / 0) (#19)
    by Ga6thDem on Fri May 27, 2016 at 02:18:00 PM EST
    the other day announced that Bernie was going back to the senate on June 8th and then quickly turned around and realized what she had said and started talking about the voting that still has to go forward.

    2 months from now Weaver is going to start to look like those Japanese soldiers that never realized WW2 was over.


    The demographics (none / 0) (#17)
    by Ga6thDem on Fri May 27, 2016 at 02:13:49 PM EST
    are not favorable to Bernie and he's been unable to change that since the beginning. I miss BTD doing his demographic analysis for sure.

    Bernie's campaign acts like the entire state is Berkeley. Oddly enough so does the GOP.


    The funny thing is (none / 0) (#2)
    by jbindc on Fri May 27, 2016 at 12:25:39 PM EST
    The judge has set the hearing date for August - after the primary and after the convention.  Shows you what he thinks of the merits.

    Won't matter (none / 0) (#4)
    by CoralGables on Fri May 27, 2016 at 12:35:38 PM EST
    If Sanders wins California 100% to 0% he will still lose the nomination.

    Yes, Sanders would lose the nomination, (none / 0) (#15)
    by caseyOR on Fri May 27, 2016 at 01:34:19 PM EST
    but a win in California would be a much better lead-in to the convention for Clinton than a loss in California.

    A Clinton win, and the bigger the better, in California would also take whatever wind there is remaining out of Sanders' sails. And, perhaps, diminish any leverage he might take to the convention.


    There is no wind in the Sanders' sails (none / 0) (#16)
    by CoralGables on Fri May 27, 2016 at 01:50:01 PM EST
    that ship has floundered

    Is that "floundered" or (5.00 / 1) (#20)
    by Peter G on Fri May 27, 2016 at 02:25:59 PM EST
    "foundered"? I'm always getting confused on that one.

    I meant floundered (5.00 / 1) (#21)
    by CoralGables on Fri May 27, 2016 at 02:49:43 PM EST
    but you could be right and that ship may have foundered.

    To flounder is to struggle haplessly with ... (none / 0) (#22)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Fri May 27, 2016 at 02:54:15 PM EST
    ... a strong likelihood of failure, whereas to founder is to 1. sink below the surface of the water; 2. to collapse and fail absolutely; or 3. if used in reference to a horse, to stumble badly and come up lame.

    Lame (none / 0) (#24)
    by CaptHowdy on Fri May 27, 2016 at 03:16:31 PM EST
    Definitely lame

    Our party's state convention ... (none / 0) (#3)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Fri May 27, 2016 at 12:34:05 PM EST
    ... opens this afternoon in Honolulu at the Sheraton Waikiki hotel. We're flying over there at noon. Should be interesting.

    Next up (none / 0) (#14)
    by jbindc on Fri May 27, 2016 at 01:32:49 PM EST
    Big sky country. (none / 0) (#27)
    by fishcamp on Fri May 27, 2016 at 03:29:50 PM EST
    Montana (none / 0) (#33)
    by MileHi Hawkeye on Fri May 27, 2016 at 03:57:04 PM EST
    The Libertarian nominating convention (none / 0) (#39)
    by CaptHowdy on Fri May 27, 2016 at 04:18:29 PM EST
    Is happening this weekend.  Gary Johnson is on right now pushing Weld as a VP.

    (As a republican) (none / 0) (#41)
    by CaptHowdy on Fri May 27, 2016 at 04:24:34 PM EST
    Are you comfortable being spoiler?



    World's Loneliest Elephant dies in Japan (none / 0) (#48)
    by Mr Natural on Fri May 27, 2016 at 04:51:28 PM EST
    After decades confined alone in the Zoo Industry equivalent of an ADX Florence cell, Hanako the elephant died at Tokyo's Inokashira Park Zoo at the age of 69.