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Vietnam War Deserter Arrested at U.S. Canadian Border

By Jeralyn, Section War In Iraq
Posted on Mon Mar 13, 2006 at 12:02:44 PM EST
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Last week I wrote about a new effort by the Marines to arrest Vietnam War deserters. On Thursday, former Marine Allen Abney, 56, who moved to Canada in 1968 and holds dual citizenship, was arrested by U.S. Border Agents at the Vancouver-Idaho border. He's being transferred to Camp Pendleton to face desertion charges.

Abney, 56, lives in Kingsgate, BC, close to the Canada/US border, which he crossed often to go shopping, to do errands, and for other purposes. He is retired. Originally from Louisville, Kentucky, Abney came to Canada with his family in 1959. In 1968 he enlisted in the US Marines. Later that year, he joined thousands of others who fled to Canada because of their opposition to the Vietnam War. He has lived here ever since.

This is a shameful publicity ploy to prevent the increasing number of unhappy Iraq soldiers from joining the 8,000 who have already deserted. War Resisters Support Campaign Coordinator Lee Zaslofsky says:

"The detention and possible punishment of Mr. Abney comes at a time when growing numbers of US military personnel, including Marines, are coming to Canada because of their opposition to the Iraq War. It seems pretty clear that Mr. Abney's sudden difficulties are a response to this. As well, it seems the Marine Corps is trying to prevent further desertions by making an example of Mr. Abney. Besides being vindictive, this is unlikely to be effective. The best way to end the US military's problems is to end the war in Iraq immediately."

[Hat tip Patriot Daily.]

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    Vietnam War Deserter Arrested at U.S. Canadian Border | 24 comments (24 topical)
    Re: Vietnam War Deserter Arrested at U.S. Canadian (none / 0) (#1)
    by Al on Mon Mar 13, 2006 at 12:29:18 PM EST
    I doubt very much an Iraq deserter will be deterred by this. I'm afraid Mr. Abney's suffering will be in vain.

    Re: Vietnam War Deserter Arrested at U.S. Canadian (none / 0) (#2)
    by TomStewart on Mon Mar 13, 2006 at 12:40:17 PM EST
    Ah, I feel safer already.

    Re: Vietnam War Deserter Arrested at U.S. Canadian (none / 0) (#3)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Mon Mar 13, 2006 at 12:55:37 PM EST
    I thought Jimmy Carter gave all those guys amnesty??

    Re: Vietnam War Deserter Arrested at U.S. Canadian (none / 0) (#4)
    by kdog on Mon Mar 13, 2006 at 12:56:28 PM EST
    Does anyone else find this ironic, when half of the WH consists of Vietnam era deserters? ***Cheney and Bush may not be "deserters" by legal standards, but that's just semantics. They were absent when their country called...hence de-facto deserters.

    Re: Vietnam War Deserter Arrested at U.S. Canadian (none / 0) (#5)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Mon Mar 13, 2006 at 01:00:32 PM EST
    I'm with BB, I thought that there was a mass pardon in the Carter Administration. Does anyone know the details?

    Re: Vietnam War Deserter Arrested at U.S. Canadian (none / 0) (#6)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Mon Mar 13, 2006 at 01:03:04 PM EST
    I see that TL is doing selective reporting. First, which part of "crime" is hard for you to understand? This guy deserted in wartime; it's that simple. The fact that you didn't like the war he deserted from doesn't really enter into it. A crime is a crime. If you have a problem with that, act responsible and advocate for a general legal amnesty. Second, your highlighting of the "8000 deserters" is disingenuous, because you don't include the point of the story. First, the talking point TL seems to believe:
    Some lawyers who represent deserters say the war in Iraq is driving more soldiers to question their service and that the Pentagon is cracking down on deserters.
    Then the actual facts
    Desertion numbers have dropped since 9/11. The Army, Navy and Air Force reported 7,978 desertions in 2001, compared with 3,456 in 2005. The Marine Corps showed 1,603 Marines in desertion status in 2001. That had declined by 148 in 2005.
    Wow, that kind of destroys your point, doesn't it? No wonder you omitted it. Gee, it's almost as if the soldiers serving think they are fighting for something. I notice that the "oh no, the draft is coming" posts have dried up too. That might have something to do with this:
    The Army Guard said Friday that it signed up more than 26,000 soldiers in the first five months of fiscal 2006, exceeding its target by 7 percent in its best performance in 13 years. At this pace, Guard leaders say they are confident they will reach their goal of boosting manpower from the current 336,000 to the congressionally authorized level of 350,000 by the end of the year. "Will we make 350,000? The answer is: Absolutely," said Lt. Gen. H Steven Blum, chief of the National Guard Bureau.
    Desertion rates way down, recruitment and retention up - seems that people of service age, at least, aren't paying much attention to the doom and gloom put out daily here and elsewhere on the left.

    Re: Vietnam War Deserter Arrested at U.S. Canadian (none / 0) (#7)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Mon Mar 13, 2006 at 01:03:39 PM EST
    Found the details:
    Just a day after Jimmy Carter's inaguration, he followed through on a contentious campaign promise, granting a presidential pardon to those who had avoided the draft during the Vietnam war by either not registering or traveling abroad. The pardon meant the government was giving up forever the right to prosecute what the administration said were hundreds of thousands of draft-dodgers. Some in veterans' groups, like Tip Marlow of the Veterans of Foreign Wars organization, said Carter did too much by allowing those who evaded the draft to come home without fear of prosecution. "We were very displeased with the pardon," Marlow said. "We feel that there is a better way for people who have broken laws to come back into the country, and that's though one of the pillars of the formation of our nation -- and that is our present system of justice." Meanwhile, many in amnesty groups say that Carter's pardon did too little. They pointed out that the president did not include deserters -- those who served in the war and left before their tour was completed -- or soldiers who recieved a less-than-honorable discharge.


    Re: Vietnam War Deserter Arrested at U.S. Canadian (none / 0) (#8)
    by roxtar on Mon Mar 13, 2006 at 01:05:30 PM EST
    Draft evaders received an automatic amnesty. Deserters and AWOLs had to apply, and could receive a less than honorable discharge, plus loss of benefits. An "upgrade" was available after a certain period of time.

    Re: Vietnam War Deserter Arrested at U.S. Canadian (none / 0) (#9)
    by jimakaPPJ on Mon Mar 13, 2006 at 01:10:09 PM EST
    ohwelleke - Yes indeed. It does not cover those who joined, and then deserted. JR - Thanks. kdog - I assume you include Clinton, Kennedy, etc, etc. Al - The point is to make everyone really understand that desertion is a heinous crime, and will be punished. If done in battle, the penalty should be death.

    Re: Vietnam War Deserter Arrested at U.S. Canadian (none / 0) (#10)
    by jondee on Mon Mar 13, 2006 at 01:14:38 PM EST
    "heinous crime." As opposed to ducking out all together as all good chickensh*t hawks do.

    Re: Vietnam War Deserter Arrested at U.S. Canadian (none / 0) (#11)
    by scarshapedstar on Mon Mar 13, 2006 at 01:15:01 PM EST
    First, which part of "crime" is hard for you to understand? ... A crime is a crime.
    For christ's sake, JR, we get it. You've made this exact same post every day for the past year, on drugs, on immigration, on copyrights. If you think it gets more interesting each time, you're wrong. That said, the law is an ass, and you would be well served to look up at the title bar where it says "The Politics of Crime". Believe it or not, many attorneys do not share your childish notion of a purely objective legal system where God himself hands 100% consistent judgments to everyone who commits a crime, and nobody is ever unjustly accused or convicted. I know, I know; their minds are clearly poisoned by the thousands of hours spent in actual courtrooms and whatnot.

    Re: Vietnam War Deserter Arrested at U.S. Canadian (none / 0) (#12)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Mon Mar 13, 2006 at 01:18:03 PM EST
    IIRC, the Roman army in the 4th century marked the soldiers with a tattoo to prevent them from deserting. Maybe something for the American empire to emulate. (Of course, some soldiers deserted anyway. They were flogged in public and sometimes beheaded.)

    Re: Vietnam War Deserter Arrested at U.S. Canadian (none / 0) (#13)
    by jondee on Mon Mar 13, 2006 at 01:19:24 PM EST
    "Heinous crime." This from the guy who believes that the Vietnamese family thats napalmed together stays together.

    Re: Vietnam War Deserter Arrested at U.S. Canadian (none / 0) (#14)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Mon Mar 13, 2006 at 01:31:04 PM EST
    Jondee: "For christ's sake, JR, we get it. You've made this exact same post every day for the past year, on drugs, on immigration, on copyrights. If you think it gets more interesting each time, you're wrong." Hmm - care to find a quote from me where I said that I supported the war on drugs? IMHO, and I've mentioned it here, the war on drugs is as idiotic as Prohibition was - and every bit as useful. We've traded lower levels of drug use for higher levels of violence (and higher levels of violence to our civil rights as well). Prohibition had the same effects - lower alcohol consumption overall, but higher levels of violence and ill effects on civil rights. If you want to criticize me, take the time to know where I'm coming from.

    Re: Vietnam War Deserter Arrested at U.S. Canadian (none / 0) (#15)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Mon Mar 13, 2006 at 02:55:41 PM EST
    The notion that walking away from military service is so heinous that it should be prosecuted 38 years after the fact, the legal fiction that it is a continuing violation notwithstanding, just doesn't cut it. It should have some sort of statute of limitations running from the date of desertion, even if it does not. It isn't as if this is someone who walked away from a firefight to join the Vietcong, resulting in the deaths of fellow unit members. Our nation's resources would be better directed at people out there commiting crimes now.

    Re: Vietnam War Deserter Arrested at U.S. Canadian (none / 0) (#16)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Mon Mar 13, 2006 at 03:10:12 PM EST
    "It should have some sort of statute of limitations running from the date of desertion, even if it does not." Well, go ahead and advocate for that. It's the way the law works now. "Our nation's resources would be better directed at people out there commiting crimes now." Hmm - It was an ID check at the border, hardly a wild use of resources.

    Re: Vietnam War Deserter Arrested at U.S. Canadian (none / 0) (#17)
    by jimakaPPJ on Mon Mar 13, 2006 at 04:35:52 PM EST
    jondee writes:
    "heinous crime." As opposed to ducking out all together as all good chickensh*t hawks do.
    Hmmm. Same question as I gave Kdog. I assume you also condemn Clinton, Kennedy, Edwards, Feingold... You slur:
    "Heinous crime." This from the guy who believes that the Vietnamese family thats napalmed together stays together.
    Oh really? What proof do you have for that slur? The answer, of course, is none. It is merely another personal attack, although a little worse than average. It is obvious that you can not debate the issues, so you satisfy yourself with trollish activity. Enjoy, you have defined yourself quite well. ohwilleke - You should remember that since he didn't go, someone else went in his place. That makes it heinous.

    Re: Vietnam War Deserter Arrested at U.S. Canadian (none / 0) (#18)
    by Sailor on Mon Mar 13, 2006 at 05:06:23 PM EST
    Oh really? What proof do you have for that slur? The answer, of course, is none. It is merely another personal attack, although a little worse than average. It is obvious that you can not debate the issues, so you satisfy yourself with trollish activity. Enjoy, you have defined yourself quite well.
    Since personal insults are against the blog's rules, I wonder when this commenter will be warned and deleted?

    Re: Vietnam War Deserter Arrested at U.S. Canadian (none / 0) (#19)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Mon Mar 13, 2006 at 05:08:49 PM EST
    In 1974, President Ford offered clemency to Vietnam draft resisters and deserters. Only 27,000 of 350,000 eligible applied. The offer expired on April 1, 1975. Roxtar is right the deserters had to apply. This pardon gave the deserters their veteran benefits. This happened to a friend of mine. He deserted the Navy (Jim, he joined the Navy) before his time was up. He took advantage of this pardon and he now is eligible for veteran benefits. Ford showed that Viet Nam was indeed a mistake and that people who deserted or resisted should in fact be forgiven. Why should this fact be changed now? During Viet Nam men joined the Navy, Marine, and Air Force, upon receiving their draft notices. This "joining" was hardly freely done, since they would not have "joined" if not for the draft notices.

    Re: Vietnam War Deserter Arrested at U.S. Canadian (none / 0) (#20)
    by jimcee on Mon Mar 13, 2006 at 07:55:39 PM EST
    I doubt very much that the Marine Corps was looking for Mr Abney as an individual but had put his name onto a 'border crossing' checklist. Trust me I know about this stuff because I share a first name and sur-name that was also used by an IRA operative in N. America. I was harrassed by both the Canadian and US authorities whenever I crossed the border which was and is often. I was able to eventually quell the zealousness of both gov'ts but not without considerable hassle. This started in the early eighties and ended by 1999. Mr Abney broke the law and he is rightly charged and held. He should be tried quickly and he will most likely walk away with a slap on the wrist. Considering that historically speaking deserters were almost always executed if they were lucky. Personally I forgive the man but the rest is up to the courts.

    Re: Vietnam War Deserter Arrested at U.S. Canadian (none / 0) (#21)
    by Aaron on Mon Mar 13, 2006 at 11:15:53 PM EST
    Knowing the Marine Corps, they'll probably put the ultimatum to these deserters; re-up for the coming war with Iran and you won't have to spend the rest of your life in Leavenworth. We've already got people in Iraq who are in their 50s, the geriatric brigade. At least they'll have someone to reminisce with about the bad old days. And they've got to find someone to replace the thousands of Marine casualties we've incurred in Iraq. I wonder how many Marine arms and legs, not to mention various other organs, we've left over there in the desert sands. So now it's just a countdown to see if we can indict George Bush as a well criminal, before the 1st Marine division rolls into Tehran See the faces of dead Marines and other assorted deceased military personnel (kids) here Faces of the Fallen

    Re: Vietnam War Deserter Arrested at U.S. Canadian (none / 0) (#22)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Mon Mar 13, 2006 at 11:26:15 PM EST
    Not content to occupy themselves shilling for the current War based on lies and deceit, our less-than dynamic duo dredges up that golden oldie, blast from the past that no one wants to dance to, Vietnam. Let's play rate a lie. Gulf of Tonkin Incident v WMD -mushroom cloud malarkey. You make the call. Never content to let it go and move on, our paisans continue to pretend that Jimmy Carter Pardons don't count because they don't like him. They whine and moan about Clinton and others who got out of the War while giving their chicken hawk chums a pass. They continue to fail to grasp the distinction that it's one thing to protest against the war and do what you can to get out of the draft and serving in it while it's altogether different when you endorse the war, just as long as someone else does the fighting and dying because you'd rather be a drunken frat boy male cheerleader and have assorted other priorities like getting your Varsity Letter in DWI fixed by Daddy.

    Re: Vietnam War Deserter Arrested at U.S. Canadian (none / 0) (#23)
    by jimakaPPJ on Tue Mar 14, 2006 at 05:11:27 AM EST
    sailor - Nice out of context comment there. Perhaps you need to learn to "connect the dots."

    Re: Vietnam War Deserter Arrested at U.S. Canadian (none / 0) (#25)
    by aw on Tue Mar 14, 2006 at 08:36:06 AM EST
    Posted by JimakaPPJ ... kdog - I assume you include Clinton, Kennedy, etc, etc.
    Senator Kennedy was in the Army 1951-1953.

    Vietnam War Deserter Arrested at U.S. Canadian Border | 24 comments (24 topical)