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Andrea Yates Granted Bond

By Jeralyn, Section Crime in the News
Posted on Wed Feb 01, 2006 at 05:20:00 PM EST
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Andrea Yates, awaiting a retrial on charges she drowned her five children, has been granted $200,000. bail. She must reside in a mental hospital until the retrial.

This is what she has needed all along.

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    Andrea Yates Granted Bond | 22 comments (22 topical)
    Re: Andrea Yates Granted Bond (none / 0) (#1)
    by squeaky on Wed Feb 01, 2006 at 05:30:23 PM EST
    Thank god someone showed sense here.

    Re: Andrea Yates Granted Bond (none / 0) (#2)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Wed Feb 01, 2006 at 06:51:30 PM EST
    Justice is a strange thing. Still trying to make money on a lost cause. I can't see how this could happen.

    Re: Andrea Yates Granted Bond (none / 0) (#3)
    by Lww on Wed Feb 01, 2006 at 08:38:14 PM EST
    When you kill your kids and call the cops and then open the door for them when they show up; you've got some serious culpablity issues. Mentally. This isn't Susan Smith. There was a case in the early 80's in Great Falls Va; the wife of a millionaire lawyer stabbed her children to death, made a half-assed attempt on her own life and set the house on fire. Money talks. She spent 2(TWO) yrs in a hospital until her husband petitioned for her release, which was granted. Two yrs in a hospital...

    Re: Andrea Yates Granted Bond (none / 0) (#4)
    by jimcee on Wed Feb 01, 2006 at 08:50:18 PM EST
    I don't care if she never leaves a prison or a mental hospital. As long as she never leaves. She killed her own kids so she should never be allowed to be free. Now can we gaurantee that she'll never be free? I can live with that but somehow I get the feeling that there wil be some (will that be you TL?) who think she should go free once she has been 'cured' of that child killing thing....

    Re: Andrea Yates Granted Bond (none / 0) (#5)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Wed Feb 01, 2006 at 10:45:47 PM EST
    So I flipped on Little *ucker Carlson just as he was slamming and haranguing her lawyer about how there was no excuse and her defense was lame, and demanding to know who put up the bond money and all my regard goes to that lawyer, who just calmly revealed the extent of her mental illness. 'Struth, I only ever turn on that show to see Rachel Maddow push his pasty face into a cow pie. Thanks for blogging this, this woman does not belong in prison.

    Re: Andrea Yates Granted Bond (none / 0) (#6)
    by Edger on Wed Feb 01, 2006 at 11:32:31 PM EST
    ever notice how painful it is to watch some people try to think? Yup. One of them read a speech to Congress the other night.

    Re: Andrea Yates Granted Bond (none / 0) (#7)
    by Edger on Wed Feb 01, 2006 at 11:54:10 PM EST
    Now can we gaurantee that she'll never be free? Sure. No problem. Convince the courts to deny her medical and psychiatric treatment. Done deal. Jeeze... read what you write sometime. Amazing... She is a very ill woman. If she had brain cancer or something else, instead of whatever illness(s) she's suffering from, would you be saying that? On second though, never mind. Forget I asked.

    Re: Andrea Yates Granted Bond (none / 0) (#8)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Thu Feb 02, 2006 at 05:01:21 AM EST
    I have a client who had a psychotic break, escaped from a mental eval and killed a police officer. After diagnosis he is on the meds he needed all along and is totally capable of living amongst us. He can't because of the stone age mindset that says mental illness is no excuse.

    Re: Andrea Yates Granted Bond (none / 0) (#9)
    by jimakaPPJ on Thu Feb 02, 2006 at 05:23:55 AM EST
    Tennessee - This works for me except for one thing. Who insures he stays on his medications? Who supervises?

    Re: Andrea Yates Granted Bond (none / 0) (#10)
    by Edger on Thu Feb 02, 2006 at 05:32:21 AM EST
    Tennessee: I think this "stone age mindset" itself is mental illness. It seems to be flat out "denial" that mental illness is as disabling as a physical handicap or maiming. Both result in loss of ability. One of physical ability, e.g. movement, etc., and the other of ability to think or reason or distinguish between right and wrong or between reality and fantasy or delusion. The stone age mindset also seems to be a handicap that precludes understanding that. No one, for example, would deny that as MS advances it makes it impossible to walk "properly", nor would anyone consider it a moral failing.

    Re: Andrea Yates Granted Bond (none / 0) (#11)
    by Edger on Thu Feb 02, 2006 at 05:50:16 AM EST
    Telly, It would have been the shortest SOT[F]U in history, I think. ;-)

    Re: Andrea Yates Granted Bond (none / 0) (#12)
    by Edger on Thu Feb 02, 2006 at 05:55:21 AM EST
    The republicans are responsible for this. They wanted to get rid of the insanity defense Yea, I don't get that at all. See, it is mental ilness. If I was one of them I'd want to keep the insanity defense in my back pocket, as my last line of defense...

    Re: Andrea Yates Granted Bond (none / 0) (#13)
    by Edger on Thu Feb 02, 2006 at 06:01:00 AM EST
    One day the insanity defense might be the only thing that will save dick and george. They better keep it around...

    Re: Andrea Yates Granted Bond (none / 0) (#14)
    by jimakaPPJ on Thu Feb 02, 2006 at 06:54:28 AM EST
    In the meantime no one has answered my question to Tennessee. Who supervises the patient taking the meds? Who is responsible for that itsy bitsy detail?

    Re: Andrea Yates Granted Bond (none / 0) (#15)
    by Edger on Thu Feb 02, 2006 at 07:04:55 AM EST
    Who supervises the patient taking the meds? The patient. No one likes to remain in pain, even psychic pain. Doctor. Family. Friends. Court ordered medication always requires a social worker or mental health worker that delivers meds and makes sure the patient takes them, and who can call in police escorted psychiatrists when needed. There is no perfect solution. Even prison, as Tennessee's client shows. The point is to treat the person and the disease.

    Re: Andrea Yates Granted Bond (none / 0) (#16)
    by Edger on Thu Feb 02, 2006 at 07:14:05 AM EST
    always requires a social worker or mental health worker that delivers Sorry. Usually. Depending on the severity and whether the person is dangerous to him/herself or others without it. If not, then the responsibility is left to the patient.

    Re: Andrea Yates Granted Bond (none / 0) (#17)
    by jen on Thu Feb 02, 2006 at 08:20:27 AM EST
    I have never understood the legal definitions of sanity or insanity. When that maniac (I forget his name) started shooting people in the Capitol a few years ago, he killed innocent people. He was arrested and hospitalized. According to his family he rarely or never took his meds before the murders. His defense attorney kept him off meds because without them he was unfit to stand trial. The prosecuter went to court to force the doctors to give the man his meds so he would be sane enough to stand trial for something he did when he was NOT on meds and not sane enough to be tried. Where is the logic in this kind of thing?

    Re: Andrea Yates Granted Bond (none / 0) (#18)
    by jimakaPPJ on Thu Feb 02, 2006 at 08:25:16 AM EST
    edger - The fact is that depending on the severity of the disease, out patient care may not be effective. There are just too many ways for the situation to fall apart. The drugs may cease being effective because of dosage size or other reasons. The out patient's social worker may fail to get the drugs to the person for any number of reasons. If the crime committed was murder, the person should be confined, under supervision. The danger to the public is too great.

    Re: Andrea Yates Granted Bond (none / 0) (#19)
    by Edger on Thu Feb 02, 2006 at 09:21:54 AM EST
    Jim, Theory is fine. Real world experience takes it to the next level, however. I've managed rooming houses in the past in skid row areas. 95% of tenants were unemployeable welfare recipients. Many were mental health outpatients. I had murderers, bank robbers, thieves, psychotics, paranoid schizophrenics, heroin and crystal meth and cocaine and crack addicts as tenants. Many of the mental patients had addictions as well as mental illnesses. My girlfriend Cara was murdered by a guy with overlapping mental health and addiction problems. For the the truly dangerous to themselves and/or others, the mental health workers who delivered meds and supervised that they were taken were police accompanied psychiatrists or police accompanied mental health workers. Sometimes I did it myself. Because I dealt with my tenants daily I was often able to develop a mutual trust relationship with them. These people are not bogeymen. It was not a movie or TV. It was real life and they were real people. With diseases. People who needed help. Not incarceration. Are they scary? Yes... As scary as you seem to think? No? Again, there is no perfect solution. Even prison, as Tennessee's client shows. If you're looking for one you are dreaming, my friend. The point is to treat the person and the disease. I know from real experience whereof I speak on this. Thanks for listening.

    Re: Andrea Yates Granted Bond (none / 0) (#20)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Thu Feb 02, 2006 at 02:50:20 PM EST
    I had the opportunity to interact with Wendell Odom (Yates's lawyer who appeared on The Situation) on a case several years ago. He's always struck me as a class act. I'm not surprised that he'd respond to Tucker Carlson's baloney with dignity.

    Re: Andrea Yates Granted Bond (none / 0) (#21)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Thu Feb 02, 2006 at 05:05:37 PM EST
    There are just too many ways for the situation to fall apart. The drugs may cease being effective because of dosage size or other reasons. The out patient's social worker may fail to get the drugs to the person for any number of reasons.
    These medications don't just stop working overnight. Missing a single dose doesn't result in a sudden return of symtpoms. Should a patient stop responding to a particular medication or dosage, that too occurs over time. A qualified person monitoring such an individual would notice the changes before they became dangerous. But specifically to Ms. Yates - her psychosis was specific to her children and her religion. She has no more children left to kill, even if she stopped taking her medication. Who is she a threat to, except perhaps herself? And someone else said:
    He can't because of the stone age mindset that says mental illness is no excuse.
    Mental illness is not an excuse. Certain mental states, like, say, psychosis, are. But these states can be induced by a simple brain injury as well as mental illness. Being mentally ill myself I find the distinction important. Forcing someone to take medication should be done only when truly necessary.

    Re: Andrea Yates Granted Bond (none / 0) (#22)
    by Edger on Thu Feb 02, 2006 at 06:22:10 PM EST
    allen: Who is she a threat to, except perhaps herself? Probably no one, Allen. And probably not even to herself unless she develops very deep clinical depression. And not even then hopefully, if treated properly and by qualified prefessionls with some compassion. In fact, I suspect that NOT being incarcerated would lessen the chances of her being a threat even to herself, because it may lessen depression.

    Andrea Yates Granted Bond | 22 comments (22 topical)