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Sen. Durbin Apologizes Again for Remarks

By Jeralyn, Section War In Iraq
Posted on Sun Jun 26, 2005 at 09:23:27 AM EST
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Count me among those that think Sen. Dick Durbin owed no one an apology for his remarks (pdf) about our treatment of the detainees and that the frenzy over them was just an attempt by Republicans to distract the public from the real issue. Nonetheless, he apologized again yesterday, this time to troops:

U.S. Sen. Dick Durbin apologized to war veterans Saturday for his remarks earlier this month comparing interrogators at an American-run prison camp in Cuba to Nazis and other historically infamous regimes.

"I think when you've done something hurtful to people you have to stand up and say I'm sorry," Durbin said at a Veterans of Foreign Wars convention in Peoria, five days after he apologized for the comments on the Senate floor.

Durbin was correct in his remarks. The techniques used by the U.S. on prisoners are torture. He never blamed U.S. servicepeople to begin with. He was blaming the top brass who approved the techniques.

We need to keep the discussion going and raise the heat level on the Administration. They shouldn't get a pass on this issue.

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    Sen. Durbin Apologizes Again for Remarks | 31 comments (31 topical)
    Re: Sen. Durbin Apologizes Again for Remarks (none / 0) (#1)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:00:34 PM EST
    Durbin should never have apolotized! The problem is that sending an e-mail to a member of Congress other than one's Senator or Representative is a hard thing to do. If I could I'd send Drubin an e-mail telling him to quit apologizing!

    Re: Sen. Durbin Apologizes Again for Remarks (none / 0) (#2)
    by ppjakajim on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:00:34 PM EST
    et al - From the post:
    He never blamed U.S. servicepeople to begin with. He was blaming the top brass who approved the techniques.
    What he said was impossible to misunderstand, and the comparsion was to our troops. Durbin understands that, and he understands that his political career, much less any aspirations for higher office, hangs in the balance.

    Re: Sen. Durbin Apologizes Again for Remarks (none / 0) (#3)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:00:34 PM EST
    I think you need to read what Durbin actually said.

    Re: Sen. Durbin Apologizes Again for Remarks (none / 0) (#4)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:00:34 PM EST
    Impossible to misunderstand, indeed, though quite easy to misrepresent. It's really quite simple: either you agree with Durbin that the torture described by the FBI agent is un-American, or you agree with Bush/Rumsfeld/Gonzales that such torture is perfectly American.

    Re: Sen. Durbin Apologizes Again for Remarks (none / 0) (#5)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:00:34 PM EST
    His remarks can be read in full here, as I've mentioned several times.

    Re: Sen. Durbin Apologizes Again for Remarks (none / 0) (#6)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:00:34 PM EST
    I wish I could read his whole apology. Its too bad that his whole speach was nulified for this one sentence, true as it was. As soon as I heard this I knew it was going to be the talking point. Slobering rightwingers always do this. Even when you talk to them in some of these threads, you can misspell a word and thats what their next comment will be about. People see Durbin apologizing, people see Rove inc. not apologizing. So I dont know. As long as he dosnt apologize for what he said, but how he said it. I recently refered to someone, on this site, as an idiot who "didnt have a father" (a bas....) and it was taken out of my comments.

    Re: Sen. Durbin Apologizes Again for Remarks (none / 0) (#7)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:00:35 PM EST
    Well, maybe if we're really lucky, we can get Durbin to apologize for the recent south Aisan tsunami, since it was all his fault anyway, and we can get him to apologize for killing off all the dinosaurs, and maybe we can get him to do a full mea culpa for the AIDS virus, since he invented it and all.....jeezuz christ, whipping boy scapegoat, what other world faults would you rightwingers like weak kneed Durbin to apologize for next? That does it, next time I stub my toe, a tersly worded letter is going straight out to Durbin, demanding an apology!

    Re: Sen. Durbin Apologizes Again for Remarks (none / 0) (#8)
    by desertswine on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:00:35 PM EST
    Get a spine, Durbin.

    Re: Sen. Durbin Apologizes Again for Remarks (none / 0) (#9)
    by Sailor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:00:35 PM EST
    Durbin's remarks were the equivalent of saying 'we use the same wrenches as the russians'. It doesn't make us russians. Any other take is a deliberate attempt by the rw noise machine to distract from the real issue; the US is torturing prisoners in gitmo. The US has now admitted it. All Durbin's apology did was encourage rove et al to step up their vitriol. You can't give an inch to these war criminals, they have no shame.

    Re: Sen. Durbin Apologizes Again for Remarks (none / 0) (#10)
    by Sailor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:00:35 PM EST
    Cognitive dissonance: 1) Bush says US seeks to eliminate torture worldwide 2) US acknowledges torture at Guantanamo; in Iraq, Afghanistan - UN

    Re: Sen. Durbin Apologizes Again for Remarks (none / 0) (#11)
    by Andreas on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:00:35 PM EST
    With these apologies Durbin is actively supporting the regime of war criminals.

    Re: Sen. Durbin Apologizes Again for Remarks (none / 0) (#12)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:00:35 PM EST
    Has anyone considered emailing this dude and telling him to shut his f#cking pie-hole? Because there's nothing more pathetic than a dude who backs off from his tough-talk and starts snivelling his regrets? Just a thought...

    Re: Sen. Durbin Apologizes Again for Remarks (none / 0) (#13)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:00:35 PM EST
    Blaghdaddy, I have done just that. Maybe not in your exact colorful, and entirely appropriate, terminology, but close.

    Re: Sen. Durbin Apologizes Again for Remarks (none / 0) (#14)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:00:35 PM EST
    Good Stuff, Cheetah...you know, everyone should...maybe then he'll get the message that he's not looking very manly next to the "Hell no, we don't apologize for nuthin'" conservatives pushing his f#cking face in the sand... The milquetoast wuss.... He should have kept his GabGap closed if he wasn't going to grow the gonads to back up his earlier statements...

    Re: Sen. Durbin Apologizes Again for Remarks (none / 0) (#15)
    by jarober on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:00:35 PM EST
    Your argument is absurd. You know as well as I do that - pace Nuremburg - that "following orders" is not a sufficient argument. So, if you blame the "higher ups" for condoning "torture", then by extension you also blame any and all troops that have engaged in it or allowed it to knowingly take place. Durbin's argument - and yours - is not merely a proposed indictment of the administration. It is a proposed indictment of the soldiers. Are you arguing that all the soldiers who have passed through Gitmo have "looked the other way" and should be prosecuted? Because if you aren't, then your argument is just so much partisan hackery.

    Re: Sen. Durbin Apologizes Again for Remarks (none / 0) (#16)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:00:35 PM EST
    James Robertson,

    "Are you arguing that all the soldiers who have passed through Gitmo have "looked the other way" and should be prosecuted?"

    No.

    Re: Sen. Durbin Apologizes Again for Remarks (none / 0) (#17)
    by jarober on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:00:36 PM EST
    Cheetah, If you aren't arguing that, then you are either: 1) Saying that the "Nuremburg defense" is valid 2) Tacitly admitting that no actual abuses took place, but saying so is a useful political attack Which is it?

    Re: Sen. Durbin Apologizes Again for Remarks (none / 0) (#18)
    by glanton on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:00:36 PM EST
    The "Nurmnberg defense" is not valid. That doesn't lessen the terrible nature of the position in which the White House and Pentagon have placed our soldiers. It's the American rulers who are most to blame. And JR, as you know, in this uber-jingoistic climate any soldier who refused to do the bidding of these blood-sucking monsters would both be sternly punished and, if the situation got any press at all, that soldier would be roundly skewered in the MSM. Durbin's apologies constitute yet another nail in the coffin of truth in American political discourse.

    Re: Sen. Durbin Apologizes Again for Remarks (none / 0) (#19)
    by kdog on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:00:36 PM EST
    There is no room for the truth when you have to worry about being re-elected. Durbin let us all down, his political career is more important to him. Any soldier who witnessed torture and did nothing, or practiced in torture, should be prosecuted. The harshest punishment should be reserved for the top officials who made torture standard policy.

    Re: Sen. Durbin Apologizes Again for Remarks (none / 0) (#20)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:00:36 PM EST
    Fenria... we can get Durbin to apologize for the recent south Aisan tsunami, since it was all his fault anyway, and we can get him to apologize for killing off all the dinosaurs, and maybe we can get him to do a full mea culpa for the AIDS virus, LOL..... How can Dickie apologize for all these things when everyone on the left already knows these things are all GW's fault? Isn't that right? Why the big deal Fenria? Nobody is blaming big dick for anything other than what he actually did...and that was to compare our military to Nazis..!

    Re: Sen. Durbin Apologizes Again for Remarks (none / 0) (#21)
    by ppjakajim on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:00:36 PM EST
    et al - I have to remember this. What we have here is people saying a man didn't say something he has apologized for saying. If we had some ham we'd have some ham and eggs, if we had some eggs.

    Re: Sen. Durbin Apologizes Again for Remarks (none / 0) (#22)
    by glanton on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:00:36 PM EST
    Ahhh, PPJ's vacuousness is like an Icelandic saga, it just goes on and on and on..... Here's something funny, though. The question he has repeatedly refused to answer in these "Durbin threads": Presented with the abuses, not knowing what regime did them, would PPJ guess they represented White House policy? Or would he be more likely to guess the other regimes Durbin named? That was Durbin's question, his statement, the whole tamale. Nothing more nothing less. PPJ and the GOP thugs whose asses he regularly licks have avoided confronting that question by--SURPRISE! attacking Durbin instead. As Patty Heaton said so well over the course of nine seasons, "Idiot."

    Re: Sen. Durbin Apologizes Again for Remarks (none / 0) (#23)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:00:36 PM EST
    JR, "Which is it?"

    Your argument is lame. I can think of two, possibly three, scenarios where neither of you two "choices" apply. Here's a hint for you: RESEARCH. Here's another: THINK while you are reading what you've researched. I refuse to do your homework for you.

    Re: Sen. Durbin Apologizes Again for Remarks (none / 0) (#24)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:00:36 PM EST
    glanton.... would PPJ guess they represented White House policy? See.... this is the issue. So many on the left hate GW so much that anything bad that happens must have been directed by him! Is it possible that some people in the military are so pumped up to do their jobs that they took it a little too far? (I might have done that myself if given the chance) That it isn't a "Government directive"? This is why so many people took offense to big dick's remarks. It isn't government policy. If it was, don't you think there would be many more cases? No Korans issued....no good meals issued... etc..etc. but just a few soldiers out of hand? Everything can't be directly traced back to GW...as much as you'd all like that to be so

    Re: Sen. Durbin Apologizes Again for Remarks (none / 0) (#25)
    by Slado on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:00:37 PM EST
    You guys (liberals) have lost this one. Move on. Durbin said something stupid. No matter you misguided hopes that he'd stand behind it he isn't so you continueing to stand up for someone who's abandoned his position is ludicrous. Gitmo is a temporary prison camp and we don't handle TERRORISTS with kids gloves on very RARE ocasions. What's the problem? Oh yeah I remember, liberals still think they can turn back the clock and ruin this war effort. They disguise it as moral indignation towards Bush when all it really is is sore loserdome being played out on an international stage. It's good guys (America) vs. bad guys (terrorists) in Iraq. I for one am rooting for the good guys and not holding them to some impossible standard as a way to take cheap shots at Bush. Rack me.

    Re: Sen. Durbin Apologizes Again for Remarks (none / 0) (#26)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:00:37 PM EST
    What's the problem? Oh yeah I remember, liberals still think they can turn back the clock and ruin this war effort.
    You fools ruined you own war effort by not sending in enough troops, not arming your troops with the proper body armor, not having a decent plan of occupation, and not having any exit strategy. Sh*t, even your man Powel came up with a decent war doctrine that you guys can't even follow. How sad. Yet you want to blame us lefties for your incompetence, how typical. Cry me a river, rightwinger.

    Re: Sen. Durbin Apologizes Again for Remarks (none / 0) (#27)
    by glanton on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:00:37 PM EST
    B.B.: You write, "Is it possible that some people in the military are so pumped up to do their jobs that they took it a little too far? (I might have done that myself if given the chance) That it isn't a "Government directive"?" I've thought of this often, and cheerfully conceded that some of what you describe is likely at play. And I think those who take their jobs, as you cavalierly quip over your $6.00 Cappicino, "a little too far," those people ought to be transparently and fairly brought to account for their crimes. But this phenomenon alone cannot account for the sheer size of the issue. I know, I know, you want to blame the media and act as though it's all out of proportion, but you really can't substantiate that. I tell you what, though: the media saturated us with claims of WMD day and night night and day for over a year, and turned out to be nothing more than freedy snake oil sellers all of them. So maybe you're right and they're just making it all up. But if they're not making it up, then that's just way too many isolated incidences. I smell directives in the air, and if I'm right, that's a huge problem. Unless you want to be like PPJ and just adjust your ballcap, spit, and say "Awwww, it aitn a problem, they never had it so good." But surely you don't wanna sink that low.

    Re: Sen. Durbin Apologizes Again for Remarks (none / 0) (#28)
    by ppjakajim on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:00:37 PM EST
    Glanton - Nonsense becomes you. You can argue about White House policy, but Durbin's commemnts compared our military to nazis, etc. That's what he did. It is called over stating something to make a political point, and he is paying the price. And BTW - I have no idea, but I would suspect they are not. Rove is too smart for that. ;-) And I don't spit. How dare you.

    Re: Sen. Durbin Apologizes Again for Remarks (none / 0) (#30)
    by glanton on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:00:38 PM EST
    It's amazing to me, Jim, that you even post anything at all on the "Durbin threads," since not once have you ever attempted to deny what he really said. Just leave it alone or refute, or accept. Here is yet another chance, Jim, for you to be intellectually honest on this topic: If you were shown these documented abuses and didn't know who did them would you guess it was the Americans? Or one of the other regimes Durbin names? Again, those in the military who commit these crimes ought to be transparently prosecuted. More importantly the ones giving the orders ought to be transparently proscuted as well.

    Re: Sen. Durbin Apologizes Again for Remarks (none / 0) (#31)
    by jarober on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:00:38 PM EST
    Cheetah says: "Your argument is lame. I can think of two, possibly three, scenarios where neither of you two "choices" apply. Here's a hint for you: RESEARCH. Here's another: THINK while you are reading what you've researched. I refuse to do your homework for you." translation: I have no response to your argument, so I'll make obscure references to research instead. If you actually have an argument, make it.

    Re: Sen. Durbin Apologizes Again for Remarks (none / 0) (#32)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Dec 17, 2005 at 01:00:41 PM EST
    James R, "If you actually have an argument, make it." Recall that this is YOUR argument, James. I simply answered your question from my point of view. That is not an argument. If the word "no" implies an argument to you, I can only imagine how often you believe yourself to be involved in one.

    Sen. Durbin Apologizes Again for Remarks | 31 comments (31 topical)