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Stupid Arrest of the Week

By TChris, Section Crime in the News
Posted on Sat Mar 05, 2005 at 03:15:12 PM EST
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by TChris

Speaking of irrational intolerance of minor law violations, the Williamsburg police arrested and handcuffed an 8-year-old boy "who allegedly had a violent outburst in school, head-butting his teacher and kicking an assistant principal, when he was told he couldn't go outside to play with other students." The child deserved a time out for his temper tantrum, not an arrest for disorderly conduct and battery.

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    Stupid Arrest of the Week | 39 comments (39 topical)
    Re: Stupid Arrest of the Week (none / 0) (#1)
    by cp on Sat Mar 05, 2005 at 03:37:07 PM EST
    i am reminded of the classic comment, nearly always made by some neighbor, or other acquaintence, when a serial killer is finally caught: "he was such a nice man, quiet, kept the yard and house neat, helped out at the church, etc." beware of extreme anal retentives!

    Re: Stupid Arrest of the Week (none / 0) (#2)
    by cp on Sat Mar 05, 2005 at 03:39:56 PM EST
    oops, wrong topic!

    Re: Stupid Arrest of the Week (none / 0) (#3)
    by cp on Sat Mar 05, 2005 at 03:41:03 PM EST
    i assume they'll be trying this kid as an adult. need to set an example!

    Re: Stupid Arrest of the Week (none / 0) (#4)
    by aw on Sat Mar 05, 2005 at 03:51:59 PM EST
    When I was a kid, the only time you saw cops and little kids together was when the cops gave the kid an ice cream cone while they located his parents or when they did one of those "Policemen are our friends" messages. It was always about cops helping kids. This is sad.

    Re: Stupid Arrest of the Week (none / 0) (#5)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Mar 05, 2005 at 03:58:18 PM EST
    Darn. I guess capital punishment is now out of the question.

    Re: Stupid Arrest of the Week (none / 0) (#6)
    by Patrick on Sat Mar 05, 2005 at 03:58:38 PM EST
    Well, no one commenting here was there, so I'd have to say they don't have all the facts. Handcuffs are as much to protect the person they are on as to protect the cops. I'm just surprised they fit.

    Re: Stupid Arrest of the Week (none / 0) (#7)
    by Quaker in a Basement on Sat Mar 05, 2005 at 04:09:39 PM EST
    I have a hard time blaming the cops for this one. School officials called. The cops either had to take the kid in or walk away. The school administrators are another story. These people can't control an 8-year-old, so they call for backup?

    Re: Stupid Arrest of the Week (none / 0) (#8)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Mar 05, 2005 at 04:27:37 PM EST
    One more plus about living in a big city: The police commonly have better things to do.

    Re: Stupid Arrest of the Week (none / 0) (#9)
    by desertswine on Sat Mar 05, 2005 at 05:09:54 PM EST
    I bet, when this kid pulls these antics at home, he gets away with it. I wouldn't want to be this kid's parents (not meaning to excuse the cuffs and that).

    Re: Stupid Arrest of the Week (none / 0) (#10)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Mar 05, 2005 at 05:23:02 PM EST
    Thank God the kid wasn't shot to death, you know you got to be careful around little people, you never know if one is a member of Al Qaeda, the kid needs prison, well maybe 10 years with michael jackson, that will get the "kids mind right" I say prison before 5 or the kid is lost. "bush said that" and he is my living god.

    Re: Stupid Arrest of the Week (none / 0) (#11)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Mar 05, 2005 at 05:25:00 PM EST
    Narch 5 I now know you are over 55 years old, police now just shot kids.

    Re: Stupid Arrest of the Week (none / 0) (#12)
    by jimcee on Sat Mar 05, 2005 at 07:03:20 PM EST
    Hey when I was a kid all the school had to do was call my parents or say as much and all was straightened out, in school. No my parents wouldn't have beaten me but the restrictions would have been unbearable so I took the paddle instead. Oddly the times I was paddled became a badge of honor and I remember them fondly in a pecular way. The bottom line is if parents allow their kids to behave abhorantly in public and defend them in their actions than the parents should be punished with public humiliation. Maybe a public paddling. Shame isn't a bad thing and domestic corporal punishment isn't a bad thing. Time for parents to grow up themselves and face the fact that their kids are well... in need of remedial care.. at home first, at school later. The real answer is in the home environment. Raise your kids so they don't end up in prison. How hard is that?

    Re: Stupid Arrest of the Week (none / 0) (#13)
    by cp on Sat Mar 05, 2005 at 08:04:58 PM EST
    guess what jimcee, it's pretty damn hard nowadays. when i was a kid, there weren't nearly as many distractions: b&w tv, 4 channels, plus pbs, a very clear deliniation between fantasy and reality. today, such is not the case. i won't bore you with details, suffice it to say that i find myself in the position of having to constantly remind my 14 year-old son that what he sees on tv\internet\video games is not, for the most part, reality as the rest of us know it. not too mention that my parents and in-laws have been kidnapped by aliens, and replaced by pod people. the same parents who wouldn't think twice about whacking my butt anytime, any where, now express concern that i might be harming their grandchildren's precious little psyche' if i swat them on the ass. interestingly, the threat of taking things away seems to have no effect at all. i've already disconnected my son's internet access (wireless network) and cable. next on the list is the tv. so far, neither has had one iota's worth of effect on his behaviour. oh, both he and his sister are in counseling, diagnosed adhd, etc., etc., etc. i spend more on drugs and dr's appt's every month than some people spend on a mortgage. the schools throw up their hands and claim they can provide no support whatever. budgets you know. to get them to do their job, i would need to hire an attorney and threaten them with a lawsuit. any advice, oh bearer of penetrating insight?

    Re: Stupid Arrest of the Week (none / 0) (#14)
    by Ed Drone on Sat Mar 05, 2005 at 10:03:22 PM EST
    "any advice, oh bearer of penetrating insight?" With my own son being diagnosed as bipolar, with ODD (obsessive defiance disorder) and PTSD (from 9/11 and the DC snipers), my suggestion is a book I haven't even read yet, called, "The Difficult Child," recommended by our family therapist. From the links on Google and Amazon, it looked like it was good advice. Basically, punishment is attention, which is what the kid craves. He'll take negative attention if he can't get enough positive attention, just as my boy does. So positive attention is the way to go, and I'm expecting the book to have some examples of how that can be accomplished. With my son, it won't be a miracle cure, and the meds will still be needed, but any technique that helps is a God-send. Look up the book and see what you think. Ed

    Re: Stupid Arrest of the Week (none / 0) (#15)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Mar 05, 2005 at 10:12:25 PM EST
    Perhaps you should reexamine your parenting style. I mean, if you are unwilling to discipline your kid, it's no wonder he might have some issues...

    Re: Stupid Arrest of the Week (none / 0) (#16)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Mar 05, 2005 at 10:17:47 PM EST
    As ridiculous as the arrest is, you had to go and make it even moreso, by artificially linking it to a story about a serial killer?

    Re: Stupid Arrest of the Week (none / 0) (#17)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Mar 05, 2005 at 10:30:27 PM EST
    I don't understand anyone who thinks that this is anything but an outrage. Is there anyone who would want their child treated this way? Does anyone deal with their own kids' tantrums by tying them up? The school administrators should be fired immediately. If they can't deal with one upset 8 year old they are not competent to be in charge of children. The cops should be disciplined for child abuse and sent for training on how to deal with children. Some of the responses posted here are positively frightening. Public paddling? Humiliation? Cuffed for his own good? This is still just an upset little kid. If the school administrators are lucky this kid's father won't give them the beating they diserve.

    Re: Stupid Arrest of the Week (none / 0) (#18)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sun Mar 06, 2005 at 01:35:11 AM EST
    Jack1849, you are right, but the fact is we live in an outrage of a social Order that is about to kill millions of us, I worked against bush and i know what he is, do you? this little guy is only one of many and many children will see much more evil from our insane laws and our insane non government.

    Re: Stupid Arrest of the Week (none / 0) (#19)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sun Mar 06, 2005 at 02:06:01 AM EST
    Thank god for the NEA and the teachers unions! When I went to school corporal punichment would have taken care of that.

    Re: Stupid Arrest of the Week (none / 0) (#20)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sun Mar 06, 2005 at 04:45:18 AM EST
    patrick probably would of taserde him

    Re: Stupid Arrest of the Week (none / 0) (#21)
    by Johnny on Sun Mar 06, 2005 at 07:52:37 AM EST
    All the kids that had their a$$es whopped in the 50's are running the country now. Who's to blame? Seriously, cuffing an 8 year old? LOL Public humiliation and violent punishment? Are we talking flogging? pillory? the stocks? drawn and quartered? Caning? Seriously, all you old farts running this country into the ground brag about being beat as a child. Make the connection already.

    Re: Stupid Arrest of the Week (none / 0) (#22)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sun Mar 06, 2005 at 08:30:18 AM EST
    "it's pretty damn hard nowadays." Many of us make hard choices in our lives. Taking responsibility for one's decision to have and raise kids "nowadays" instead of expecting the "Village" to assume that responsibility would be a good first step in avoiding the Village from, well, taking charge. It's easier, though, to claim entitlement and then complain about what you get.

    Re: Stupid Arrest of the Week (none / 0) (#24)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sun Mar 06, 2005 at 10:02:13 AM EST
    Richard. Why are you are so angry? We will never know all the details so in the end we will never know why the school administrators couldn't handle the situation. But I have known a number of little kids with emotional control problems. They were not monsters. Sometimes I thought there was a lack of discipline at home. Some were just kids who needed help learning how to deal with frustration. I have seen kids benched, sent to the office, suspended, expelled. Never arrested. In my opinion the educators at the school should have been able to deal with this. Jack

    Re: Stupid Arrest of the Week (none / 0) (#25)
    by Johnny on Sun Mar 06, 2005 at 10:11:47 AM EST
    Nice talk Richard-don't be surprised if TL deletes your post due to childish language. As a parent, I can verify that time-outs combined with with-holding pf privelage works better than smacking my daughter around. As to your idiotic theory that this kid might have grown up into a killer, I suggest you do a little research into the kind of kid that DOES grow into the kind of killer you mention. I hope my daughter never meets a man like you, Richard. I most definately hope she does not marry an angry, childish, a$$hole like you. A firm hand, indeed.

    Re: Stupid Arrest of the Week (none / 0) (#26)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sun Mar 06, 2005 at 01:57:59 PM EST
    Everyone needs an asswhippin' -- the administrators for such a dumb policy, the parents for coddling and having such a lack of control over their kids, and the kids themselves --just because. I don't care what anyone says, no amount of time-outs is going to teach a kid to behave. I am not a violent person, but damn, little Jonny doesn't care if you take his video games away for a week or the TV from his room. Here's something...IT SHOULDN'T BE THERE IN THE FIRST PLACE! Damn right, that's oldschool. Teaching to hit, no. Teaching not to act a fool unless you want a sore ass. You KNEW that if you messed up at school you were going to get if from the teacher, momma and daddy, so it happened rarely, if ever. That's parental involvement at its finest. =P

    Re: Stupid Arrest of the Week (none / 0) (#27)
    by Sailor on Sun Mar 06, 2005 at 02:41:47 PM EST
    The kid was abused at the age of 5 and has been in foster homes most of te time since. This is a medical problem, not a police problem.

    Re: Stupid Arrest of the Week (none / 0) (#28)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sun Mar 06, 2005 at 02:51:09 PM EST
    It would have been a medical problem if this kid had injured a classmate. The kid was out of control, which is a law and order (ie police) problem.

    Re: Stupid Arrest of the Week (none / 0) (#29)
    by jimcee on Sun Mar 06, 2005 at 04:12:28 PM EST
    cp, I am sorry you are having problems with your kid because it is a very difficult thing to go through, I've been there myself. Having said that all your solutions involve other people. Your kid has a TV in his room? Plays video games all the time? You have wireless internet in your home and allow your kid unfettered access to it? Pardon me for being blunt but it sounds as if your kid is spoiled rotten. Yes I grew up with no cable, no color TV etc as you did and was occassionally whacked on the butt when I deserved it so let me give you some unsolicited advice. No TV, no internet, no video games. Then add some chores that must be completed daily by your kid as well as assigning him appropriate reading tasks as well. If needed take the door off his bedroom because a child has no right to privacy. You mentioned school authorities, counciling, doctors, lawyers and a rather dubious diagnosis of ADD with meds. Perhaps instead of looking to the outside for the causation your kid's problems you should look in the mirror instead. Raising kids is the hardest, most important thing you will do in your life. For you and for society. You must take responsiblity for your family because if you don't no one else will and hardship will most certainly follow. Again I'm sorry for your situation as well as my bluntness but YOU must solve this problem yourself.

    Re: Stupid Arrest of the Week (none / 0) (#31)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sun Mar 06, 2005 at 07:03:56 PM EST
    Sure, RW...40 years ago with non-parents it was, "I'd make 'em toe the line..." Some things never change, including the cluelessness of non-parents. Something tells me you'll be right there with your hand out for the SS from their paychecks though, pal.

    Re: Stupid Arrest of the Week (none / 0) (#32)
    by aw on Sun Mar 06, 2005 at 07:04:13 PM EST
    People with no kids themselves always give good advice.

    Re: Stupid Arrest of the Week (none / 0) (#33)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sun Mar 06, 2005 at 09:00:06 PM EST
    Show me where I offered advice. I did not. I could not care less about whether some cop shoots your kid before he goes postal while you cry it's someone else's fault your brat allegedly has ADHD. "Cluelessness" of non-parents? I'm not the one whining about my assaultive oppositionally defiant disordered mistake being shut down by the cops. Clueless parents who know it all but need everyone else in the "village" to help them do what they've undertaken need to stop calling names and take some responsibility. Right, right people?

    Re: Stupid Arrest of the Week (none / 0) (#34)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Mon Mar 07, 2005 at 05:41:45 AM EST
    "90 seconds with a one hand full of that brat's hair and the other holding a riding crop, and I can guaranfriggintee you I WILL get his attention." Clueless? Q.E.D., RW

    Re: Stupid Arrest of the Week (none / 0) (#35)
    by kdog on Mon Mar 07, 2005 at 07:43:37 AM EST
    My guess is, the school called the fuzz to protect themselves from a lawsuit. If they tried to calm the kid and he got hurt, the school would get their pants sued off. Regardless, handcuffs seem a bit nuts. Just another unfortunate byproduct of our "law and order", "lock 'em up", as well as "avoid all liability" and "get rich without working" society.

    Re: Stupid Arrest of the Week (none / 0) (#36)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Mon Mar 07, 2005 at 07:50:58 AM EST
    As the product of a houshold that believed that sparing the rod spoiled the child, I'd like to tell all of you child abusers and parent blamers to do things that TL would censor. Use your imagination. THIS IS A FREAKING SECOND GRADER THAT COMES UP TO YOUR WAIST. AND HANDCUFFS ARE NOT A RESTRAINING DEVICE. Tell you what. You go to Harvard Medical School and ask the first years students what kind of discipline was used in their childhood. Now go down to your county jail and ask the same questions. Don't have time. I guarantee you that more prisoners had their asses whipped than college students. BTW - public discipline makes you sneaky, not obedient.

    Re: Stupid Arrest of the Week (none / 0) (#37)
    by kdog on Mon Mar 07, 2005 at 08:32:07 AM EST
    FWIW...I was never hit as a child, and I grew up to not hit people. For small children, a quick smack on the arse to keep the kid from running into the street or touching a hot stove is necessary, beyond that I see no need to hit kids.

    Re: Stupid Arrest of the Week (none / 0) (#38)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Mon Mar 07, 2005 at 01:12:14 PM EST
    im would slap the attitude outta my child if they ever headbutted me, children need to know their place in the world. They dont know anything and they sure dont know whats good for them. Ive seen some peoples children who get what they want by crying and complaining, they need to try and earn something the spoiled little brats. This is not to all children obviously, just the ones who think they know everything

    Re: Stupid Arrest of the Week (none / 0) (#39)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Mon Mar 07, 2005 at 02:48:38 PM EST
    The kid was having a violent "head-butting, kicking, desk-turning, chair-tossing" tantrum. And somebody thinks "time out" is the solution? That's almost like a parody of liberal parenting. The thought of an 8-year-old being lead off in handcuffs is unpleasant (though a lot 8-year-olds these days are bigger than me), but I wonder what practical alternative some of you would suggest to handle a child who has flown into a violent, out-of-control rage. Because somehow I just don't think "time-out" is gonna cut it.

    Re: Stupid Arrest of the Week (none / 0) (#40)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Mon Mar 07, 2005 at 03:17:38 PM EST
    As the parent of a very even-keeled 5 year old, and a polar-opposite 3 year-old who, it was obvious from just a few weeks old, deals with frustration by physical violence and anger, my heart goes out to this child and his parents.

    Re: Stupid Arrest of the Week (none / 0) (#41)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Tue Mar 08, 2005 at 09:20:57 AM EST
    btw, Ed Drone, thanks for the book suggestion, we went and got it yesterday.

    Stupid Arrest of the Week | 39 comments (39 topical)