Super Tuesday Results

Super Tuesday results are streaming in. Sanders has Vermont and Utah and Biden has Virginia.

What about Mike? Will his cash seal the deal?

How was the turnout? What do the exit polls show? Most importantly, did those of you in the Super Tuesday states remember to vote?

< Chris Matthews Retires from Hardball, Effective Tonight | Elizabeth Warren Drops Out >
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    The story seems (5.00 / 2) (#1)
    by Ga6thDem on Tue Mar 03, 2020 at 07:58:45 PM EST
    to be young people failed to show up for Bernie again.

    Yes the turnout surge (none / 0) (#35)
    by smott on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 07:47:14 AM EST
    Was against Bernie, no for him

    I am very disappointed - despairing, actually (5.00 / 3) (#2)
    by Peter G on Tue Mar 03, 2020 at 08:04:37 PM EST
    that Warren is not running away with Massachusetts.

    She should get out (5.00 / 1) (#40)
    by CaptHowdy on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 07:59:38 AM EST
    The next debate should be between the two who might be the nominee without he flapping her arms and demanding to be the center of attention.

    She needs to get out.


    Honesly (none / 0) (#90)
    by smott on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 04:34:41 PM EST
    I hope she stays in so Biden has to talk less during the debate.

    apparently she is third (none / 0) (#5)
    by CaptHowdy on Tue Mar 03, 2020 at 08:32:40 PM EST
    Sorry I don't share your despair

    If it's Bernie vs Biden for the Nom (none / 0) (#10)
    by Steve13209 on Tue Mar 03, 2020 at 08:50:51 PM EST
    talk about holding your nose...

    EW will have to suspend her campaign after the results are in.


    By happy coincidence, our first grandchild (5.00 / 7) (#3)
    by Peter G on Tue Mar 03, 2020 at 08:13:10 PM EST
    turns two today. Her parents have declared today "Super Twosday."

    Oh, you have wonderful times ahead (5.00 / 3) (#72)
    by Towanda on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 11:47:24 AM EST
    as I can attest, withh my grandboy now three years old.

    And we are just back from finally meeting my second grandgirl,  two weeks old today. Exposure to flu from the grandboy (despite he and all of us having had flue shots) and then a bad cold kept us away from getting there.

    And even when we were deemed free of contagion, we still -- , with coronavirus confirmed in her city -- went through lots of hand washing and sanitizer and donned almost a hazmat suit.

    The pediatrician still was wary, as are the parents with a newborn. While we were there, they had several deliveries to stockpile supplies and are planning "social distancing" for a while. So sad, as this is the time to show off a firstborn.


    What about next year? (none / 0) (#11)
    by MKS on Tue Mar 03, 2020 at 09:15:34 PM EST
    When she's 3 on 3/3? (5.00 / 2) (#12)
    by Peter G on Tue Mar 03, 2020 at 09:51:22 PM EST
    Seems to take care of itself.

    Better than (none / 0) (#64)
    by Abdul Abulbul Amir on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 09:42:34 AM EST
    Terrible Twosday

    Happily, no sign of that yet (5.00 / 1) (#93)
    by Peter G on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 05:19:55 PM EST
    Still as sweet (and smart) as she can be.

    It goes like that some times. (5.00 / 1) (#108)
    by Abdul Abulbul Amir on Thu Mar 05, 2020 at 07:10:05 AM EST
    Our first was as sweet as can be. The second was a holy terror.

    Barring a complete Joe-meltdown... (5.00 / 2) (#23)
    by kdog on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 05:44:51 AM EST
    I think the dream is over. No way Bernie gets enough delegates to win outright, and no way Bernie comes out on top of a contested convention with this party.

    Though I suppose you can't rule out a total and utter meltdown with loopy Joe.

    Wall St. and insurance co. boardrooms must be popping the finest champagne this morning...another election on tap that they can't lose. Wah Wah.

    It's not the (5.00 / 2) (#24)
    by Ga6thDem on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 05:49:18 AM EST
    boardrooms that are picking Joe. It is the voters. And Bernie and his supporters have spent 5 years driving voters away.

    Yeah I know... (none / 0) (#25)
    by kdog on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 05:55:03 AM EST
    it's like Stockholm Syndrome or something. I just don't get it.

    Come (5.00 / 1) (#26)
    by FlJoe on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 06:44:50 AM EST
    on man, it's called democracy. You are getting into sour grapes territory here.

    Bernie has spent years trying to expand his base and has failed for the most part and the best you can come up is by insinuating that any opposition to him is being held captive by dark evil forces.

    What's next? The Dark State and George Soros?


    Quasi-Democracy... (none / 0) (#47)
    by kdog on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 08:55:08 AM EST
    if you please, Joe.  More democratic would be nationwide popular vote in primaries and elections.  Even ranked-choice voting.  Granted, Biden may well end up winning the nationwide popular vote for the nomination.  Looks that way barring a massive Bernie turn around.  And yeah, damn right I'm sour about it!

    Not implying a conspiracy by Stockholm Syndrome...implying that the American voter has feelings of trust and even affection for an established system that screws them as sure as the sun shines.


    ... rather than just lament and criticize the choices made by others who actually took the time to do so.

    If (none / 0) (#52)
    by FlJoe on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 09:19:02 AM EST
    you please Kdog, STFU, you don't get to decide that democracy is valid only when you are pleased with the results.

    Au contraire... (none / 0) (#63)
    by kdog on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 09:39:17 AM EST
    our very undemocratic tendencies for a so-called democracy are facts, regardless of my or your feelings about a particular result.

    It is Not Democracy (none / 0) (#54)
    by RickyJim on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 09:20:58 AM EST
    The bizarre current US method of giving the voters the choice between unpalatable candidates and how the individual votes are totaled is just one more bizarre example of how Americans have been brainwashed into believing whatever is the norm in the US is "Democracy at its finest."

    What's better?  One way that would make sense is having the presidential candidates be chosen by votes of "elites" like elected officials from all over the country.  Then the people would decide among the 10 highest scoring from the first method by a couple of runoff elections.  We never would have gotten Trump if things were done that way.


    ... 180 years ago, and limit suffrage to white males. Even then, the election turnout in 1840 was only 42.4%. Further, the winner, William Henry Harrison, quickly died only 30 days after becoming president 179 years ago today on March 4, 1841. He was the first president to die in office.

    Now, it was long held as conventional wisdom that President Harrison had succumbed to pneumonia, which was brought on by his stubborn refusal to get out of the cold, driving rain during his inauguration a month earlier.

    And to be sure, the official record of the ceremony that day shows that despite the miserable weather, Harrison had declined to wear a hat and topcoat and further chose to ride to the Capitol for his inauguration ceremony on horseback, rather than use the presidential carriage that was offered to him by outgoing President Martin Van Buren.

    To compound matters, the President-elect further chose to be sworn in outdoors on the Capitol steps rather than inside and under cover and then, after taking the oath of office, he further stood in the cold rain for over two and one-half hours to deliver a still-record-long 8,445-word inaugural speech. So, it's entirely understandable that most people thought President Harrison brought about his own death through reckless personal behavior.

    However, a meticulous re-examination in 2014 by medical professionals of the copious notes and records left by Harrison's doctor regarding his illness and death has since led to an educated speculation that the president more than likely died of typhoid fever, which he probably caught by drinking from a contaminated water supply at the White House, which was then downstream from the District of Columbia's open sewer.

    That is your presidential history lesson for today.


    It's not just that (5.00 / 1) (#85)
    by CST on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 01:56:30 PM EST
    It's that Sanders alienates even his natural allies.  Barney Frank had him pegged.

    I always liked Sanders the Senator.  But in 2016 when he ran an explicitly anti-establishment race while also decrying planned parenthood and the human rights campaign as part of the establishment - he made a lot of people feel pretty damn attached to the establishment even if we often disagree with them.

    You can't just make everyone who ever supported someone else the enemy and then hope to win those people over.  He has never tried meeting people where they are - and I don't mean by tacking right on policy, I mean by not doing the work to convince them that those policies are right or build a coalition big enough to pass it.  It's a lot of rhetoric that's essentially "why are you so stupid and not already supporting me" and "Democrats are the enemy" - shocker, Democratic voters don't like that much.


    It may be (5.00 / 1) (#89)
    by KeysDan on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 03:20:47 PM EST
    the difference between gadfly and leader.  Socrates believed he had been sent as a "gadfly" to the Athenian state---biting and buzzing at the self-satisfied "all day long and in all places".  The intention being getting others to consider matters of virtue.  

    A potential attribute as a legislator, but at odds with leadership characteristics that call for an ability to unite and inspire others toward achievement.

    The gadfly, moreover, appeals to the idealism of youth, challenging and interfering with the status quo.  A mindset re-shaped and recalibrated by life's responsibilities.  


    His plan was always (none / 0) (#94)
    by smott on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 05:25:22 PM EST
    A hostile takeover of the Dem Party, and a plurality win with 30% over a splintered opposition.
    He never planned to reach out or build a coalition. It's why I'm terrified if he gets the nom, he'll pick someone completely toxic for VP like a Gabbard or Turner.
    This was always about subjugating the Dem Establishment and making them Bend the Knee.

    It's actually what Trump did to win in 2016 because the GOP couldn't coalesce around an opponent. Maybe because their voters hate the GOP establishment.
    Whereas Dem voters appear to like the Dem establishment, imperfect as it is.

    They're not going to give the nom to Sanders, they WILL coalesce and vote for the candidate they think has the best chance, even if he spent 0$ and never even set foot in their state.

    And THAT is saying something about the depth of the Not Bernie coalition. The huge turnout he talks about was actually people coming out to stop him.


    Carville (none / 0) (#27)
    by Ga6thDem on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 07:04:55 AM EST
    explained it best. Bernie voters want their issues to be addressed but don't seem to understand that you have to win and get power to get anything. Bernie voters are fine with losing. The other voters understand you go into an election with the voters you have not the voters you want.

    And banking on young voters and uninvolved voters has been a fool's errand for decades.


    Yep (none / 0) (#37)
    by smott on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 07:52:49 AM EST
    Biden did this on like 0 budget.

    He won states like MA (5.00 / 1) (#39)
    by CaptHowdy on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 07:56:21 AM EST
    TN and MA where he had zero field offices.  and NC with one.

    Pretty remarkable


    Fear is powerful (5.00 / 2) (#91)
    by smott on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 04:41:05 PM EST
    This was less about Biden than about a wave of Dem Panic that Bernie cannot beat Trump.

    Well founded IMO.


    People just wanted Joe. (none / 0) (#95)
    by Robot Porter on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 05:27:48 PM EST
    Without ads, without an algorithm, without a massive GOTV operation, in large numbers they went out and voted Biden.

    Disagree (none / 0) (#172)
    by smott on Sat Mar 07, 2020 at 12:10:57 PM EST
    They wanted Not Bernie because Bernie can't win.

    Disagree slightly (none / 0) (#109)
    by Abdul Abulbul Amir on Thu Mar 05, 2020 at 07:12:35 AM EST
    The voters are not picking Joe, they are picking the viable not-Bernie.

    Maybe one of the good things (5.00 / 1) (#69)
    by Abdul Abulbul Amir on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 10:51:38 AM EST
    to come out of this is that money in politics is vastly overrated.

    The (5.00 / 1) (#71)
    by FlJoe on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 11:45:08 AM EST
    interesting question is what is replacing it. Some kind of media driven, reality TV like narrative?

    Might be a good idea (none / 0) (#70)
    by CaptHowdy on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 10:59:37 AM EST
    To hold off on that declaration until November.

    Biden Defends Past Inappropriate Touching Of Women (1.00 / 1) (#192)
    by NoSides on Mon Mar 09, 2020 at 03:05:32 PM EST
    DETROIT--Opening up about the lifelong struggle that has been a source of embarrassment and frustration, Democratic presidential candidate Joe Biden defended Thursday his record of inappropriately touching women as a symptom of his lifelong struggle with stuttering hands. "Since my childhood, I've been burdened with this debilitating problem--anytime I wrap my hands around a woman's waist or give them a shoulder rub, it's because of a nervous medical tick," said Biden, choking up while recounting how much his uncontrollable caressing of women's backs and touching of their faces have hurt him over the years. "I was often too ashamed in the past to speak about it, but I know there's some teenager out there grabbing a classmate's ass who needs to know they are not alone. I've dealt with the misfortune of seeing my hands reach out and pull a woman uncomfortably close to me and the embarrassment of them mocking me and saying `Stop doing that.' I've worked to get it under control, and I want my supporters to be confident that I will only occasionally be touching women over the course of the presidential campaign." At press time, Biden was attributing his support of the Iraq war and opposition to school busing as the result of a challenging brain stutter.

    From The Onion

    Sanders Supporter Urges Importance Of Listening To (none / 0) (#193)
    by CaptHowdy on Mon Mar 09, 2020 at 03:14:01 PM EST
    Minority Voices Just Not Specifically The Ones Who Handed Victory To Biden

    DETROIT--Stressing the need for inclusivity and intersectionality in the 2020 Democratic primaries, local Bernie Sanders supporter Kevin Randall took to Facebook Wednesday to stress the importance of listening to minority voices, just not any of the ones that have handed victory to Joe Biden. "We need to make clear that, with the exception of those who showed up in droves to vote for Biden in South Carolina and on Super Tuesday, our movement has room for all people of color," wrote Randall, who explained that it's important to avoid becoming siloed within one's own narrow worldview and to empathize with Americans from every background who did not just make Biden the new frontrunner last night. "Marginalized groups are being shut out of these conversations, so we need to take a moment to hear what, in particular, 18-to-35-year-old, college-educated, progressive black and Latino voters from western states have to say. They, along with the tiny minority of working-class citizens in disenfranchised minority communities who object to the moderate platform of Joe Biden, should not be made to feel invisible in our democracy." Randall later added that it was also important to listen to older Jewish people, except for the ones who cast ballots for Mike Bloomberg.

    The Onion


    They do have a problem (none / 0) (#196)
    by jondee on Mon Mar 09, 2020 at 04:29:47 PM EST
    with literacy in South Carolina. 38th in the country I believe they are? What do you want to bet there's more people down there who still think shelling Fort Sumpter was the right thing than who think Joe Biden should be President?

    I'd be more worried if Sanders won S.C.

    Meanwhile, Hillary lost America to Clarence the Talking Mule.

    What's the point now in soft-pedaling the fact that we live in an Idiocracy and that the mean, self-serving thing some nasty "Bro" said yesterday or early this morning is the least of our problems?


    Boo HOO (none / 0) (#197)
    by CaptHowdy on Mon Mar 09, 2020 at 04:31:39 PM EST
    Let the dead bury their dead (none / 0) (#199)
    by jondee on Mon Mar 09, 2020 at 04:48:16 PM EST
    I'm almost past caring.

    Bloomberg campaign (none / 0) (#4)
    by CaptHowdy on Tue Mar 03, 2020 at 08:30:31 PM EST
    Released a statement that did not include him saying he was staying in.
    I imagine he will be out in a day or two and Biden will inherit the Bloomberg operation.

    Probably a better way to win.  All things considered.

    Why leave? (5.00 / 1) (#16)
    by Abdul Abulbul Amir on Tue Mar 03, 2020 at 11:13:00 PM EST
    He won Samoa!  Money well spent.

    Well spent indeed (none / 0) (#32)
    by CaptHowdy on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 07:35:33 AM EST
    That money was aimed straight at Trump and Trumps failings.

    If you don't think those ads helped you don't understand how things work.


    Agreed. (5.00 / 1) (#61)
    by KeysDan on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 09:27:56 AM EST
    It re-focused primary voters on the top priority: the absolute necessity to defeat Trump.  And, to retain the House and try to gain the Senate.  The revolution can wait---a return to sane governance along with evolutionary change are seen as a safer course in the face of Trump's existential threat to the nation.

    Good on Bloomberg (5.00 / 2) (#74)
    by Towanda on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 11:49:23 AM EST
    for getting out today but continuing to pay his staff through November to send them out to support other candidates, up and down the ballot. He is said to have a "six-state strategy." This will be interesting to see.

    Bloomberg's TV ads and billboards (5.00 / 3) (#88)
    by Chuck0 on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 02:59:07 PM EST
    are the only ones going straight at orange jesus. He needs to keep it up. Keep reminding America what a lying scumbucket the occupant at 1600 PA truly is.

    Six state (none / 0) (#80)
    by CaptHowdy on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 12:14:27 PM EST
    Flashback Quote of the Day

    March 4, 2020 at 12:09 pm EST By Taegan Goddard 181 Comments

    "Even if Mike was not to become the nominee, and let's say tomorrow he wasn't, this is the one campaign that doesn't end. In fact, what it grows down to is larger than any other campaign that exists. And we would shift down to a six-state operation with a digital operation and a TV overlay. And so that's what it would be if Mike was not the candidate."

    -- Bloomberg campaign manager Kevin Sheekey, quoted last week by Vanity Fair.

    Seriously (none / 0) (#81)
    by CaptHowdy on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 01:00:56 PM EST
    They sound a little like like SkyNet.


    Here (none / 0) (#9)
    by CaptHowdy on Tue Mar 03, 2020 at 08:50:26 PM EST
    Former New York Mayor Michael Bloomberg will reassess his campaign for the Democratic presidential nomination on Wednesday, NBC News reported

    Sanders finally wins one in CO (none / 0) (#6)
    by CaptHowdy on Tue Mar 03, 2020 at 08:37:37 PM EST
    But four candidates are above 15.  So not many delegates.

    Biden and Sanders are close in my state (none / 0) (#7)
    by CaptHowdy on Tue Mar 03, 2020 at 08:42:48 PM EST
    One thing I noticed at the polling places today (I went to two because my friend and I voted in different places because we are in different counties) there was visible rat f'cking.

    People I knew were there to vote for Sanders because they were republicans.  They were laughing about it.  That worried me a bit at the time but it does not seem particularly widespread so far.

    Well (none / 0) (#8)
    by Ga6thDem on Tue Mar 03, 2020 at 08:48:56 PM EST
    judging by the results nationwide I would say there were not effective.

    Not close anymore (none / 0) (#13)
    by Yman on Tue Mar 03, 2020 at 10:15:52 PM EST
    There's been a pattern of closer early voting,  but then Biden pulling away with the same day vote.

    First votes in California (none / 0) (#15)
    by MKS on Tue Mar 03, 2020 at 10:46:04 PM EST
    showed Mayor Pete with about 10%, so those were early votes.....Biden should do better as the votes comes in, which is very, very late in California.

    So far, zero votes in from Orange County, where the Dems swept out the GOP in House races in 2016.


    Almost 20 points (none / 0) (#33)
    by CaptHowdy on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 07:40:16 AM EST
    That surprises me.

    Biden moved (none / 0) (#14)
    by NoSides on Tue Mar 03, 2020 at 10:33:15 PM EST
    us all with his harrowing tale of having been arrested while trying to see Nelson Mandela.

    Tonight, Mr.Biden brought everyone to tears while reciting this stirring passage from the Declaration of Independence:

    "We hold these truths to be self-evident, All men and women created ... by the -- you know -- you know the thing."

    No wonder so many are thrilled by the prospect of this fellow, slightly delusional and slightly doddering, being given the mantle of leadership of the Democratic Party.

    I have a big recipe collection (5.00 / 1) (#28)
    by Yman on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 07:13:54 AM EST
    Do you prefer sweet or savory?

    How about a good brownie recipe? (5.00 / 2) (#98)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 07:29:19 PM EST

    So what? (5.00 / 2) (#56)
    by MKS on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 09:24:06 AM EST
    Seen on the interwebs (none / 0) (#17)
    by Abdul Abulbul Amir on Tue Mar 03, 2020 at 11:16:01 PM EST
    Who cares? (5.00 / 2) (#57)
    by MKS on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 09:24:28 AM EST
    Biden won in states ... (none / 0) (#18)
    by Robot Porter on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 12:28:14 AM EST
    ...where he spent no money, ran no ads, had no campaign offices.

    That's why he terrifies Trump.

    As big a win ... (none / 0) (#19)
    by Robot Porter on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 12:48:27 AM EST
    ... as this night was for Biden.  It was just as big a loss for Sanders.

    It demolished almost all the arguments for his candidacy, from turnout to electability.

    A truly epic failure.

    But (5.00 / 1) (#20)
    by FlJoe on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 05:02:05 AM EST
    it was so obviously rigged, I'm sure we will be filled in on the details soon. Round up the usual suspects.

    Voter Suppression... (1.00 / 1) (#21)
    by kdog on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 05:35:25 AM EST
    in Texas may have played some role in Biden's surprise close win there.

    Amy dropping out helped him in Minnesota.

    Massachusetts I don't know wtf.

    But hey at least it won't be Bloomberg, we can unite around that!

    If only a different VP was selected in '08...thanks Obama :(


    A confluence of events (5.00 / 1) (#36)
    by smott on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 07:51:55 AM EST
    Sanders challenges the Dem establishment in idiotic tweet.
    Good debate for Biden.
    Warren eviscerates Bloomberg who might have been the Biden Lifeboat.
    Sanders shows what a stubborn out of touch old coot he is, praising Castro and (!,!) doubling down on it.
    Clyburn endorsement.
    Amy, Pete.

    All adds up to historic collapse for Bernie. As a front runner, he could not have had a worse week.

    I wonder what his tune will be about plurality delegates now.


    He will stay in to the end (none / 0) (#38)
    by CaptHowdy on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 07:54:41 AM EST
    And split the party as much as he can.

    Warren and Bloomberg are probably out.  But not Bernie


    I (none / 0) (#44)
    by FlJoe on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 08:20:14 AM EST
    wouldn't call it a collapse, he more or less preformed as expected.

    I have long thought that Bernie was a high floor low ceiling candidate, yesterday was just proof of his inability to break through that ceiling. Much of that was already baked into the cake but as you point out some of it was self inflicted.


    People just needed an excuse ... (none / 0) (#96)
    by Robot Porter on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 05:51:57 PM EST
    to vote Biden.

    You may not like him, Jeralyn may not like him, but the party does.


    Great TL campaign slogan: (none / 0) (#99)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 07:33:16 PM EST
    "JOE BIDEN 2020: Well, Okay, I Guess So."

    Not Bad... (5.00 / 1) (#100)
    by kdog on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 07:57:31 PM EST
    How 'bout "Joe Biden 2020: Whaddya Gonna Do"

    or "Joe Biden 2020: Mike Gets It Done"


    Or (none / 0) (#113)
    by CaptHowdy on Thu Mar 05, 2020 at 08:09:09 AM EST

    Could I have screwed that up more? (5.00 / 3) (#114)
    by CaptHowdy on Thu Mar 05, 2020 at 08:10:38 AM EST
    JOE 2020 (at least he's not Sanders)

    I thought Joe... (5.00 / 1) (#125)
    by kdog on Thu Mar 05, 2020 at 11:44:05 AM EST
    hacked your TL account there for a sec the way you typed it the first time ;)

    I've never seen a candidate ... (none / 0) (#117)
    by Robot Porter on Thu Mar 05, 2020 at 08:59:19 AM EST
    that had that kind of turn out and enthusiasm, on no money, no GOTV operation, no ads, and no fawning press corps.

    And it seems weird that people want to deny that happened.

    It happened.

    Politicians dream of outcomes like that. Sanders claimed he'd have an outcome like that.  But they don't. And he didn't.

    Biden did.

    And his wins next week will probably be bigger, and he'll likely win Michigan comfortably.


    That's all true (none / 0) (#118)
    by CaptHowdy on Thu Mar 05, 2020 at 09:06:08 AM EST
    But I have to say I think there is also external factors that led to that result.

    The desire for some sanity and less drama

    The fear of what Sanders is proposing

    The overriding desire to beat Trump by nominating someone who can do that.

    Honestly after Biden's performance in this race it's hard to buy it was all just excitement about Biden.

    I would say it was more like a celebration of his acceptability


    No one gets ... (none / 0) (#144)
    by Robot Porter on Thu Mar 05, 2020 at 02:25:24 PM EST
    700K votes in Virginia on pragmatism and happenstance alone.

    There's got to be a level of enthusiasm behind a number like that.

    That's more than Obama got in '08.  And that was a two person race.


    I think what's behind it (5.00 / 1) (#146)
    by CaptHowdy on Thu Mar 05, 2020 at 02:29:27 PM EST
    Honestly is Trump.  Biden is along for the ride.  

    And btw
    He could still f'ck it up.  Watching him run will be like 8 months of watching a drunk man cross an icy street.



    Hah! (5.00 / 1) (#168)
    by Yman on Fri Mar 06, 2020 at 05:57:35 PM EST
    That was funny.

    But also, not funny.

    I think he'll be fine, but it'll be a little nerve-wracking.


    You don't have to like Joe ... (none / 0) (#148)
    by Robot Porter on Thu Mar 05, 2020 at 02:47:02 PM EST
    but it sounds like it's coloring your reading of those numbers.

    There were 23 other people in this race that were running against Trump.

    Most of them are gone.  And none of them get numbers like that.  Nor the consistent front runner polling for two years.


    I don't dislike him (none / 0) (#153)
    by CaptHowdy on Thu Mar 05, 2020 at 02:54:23 PM EST
    Unlike many here.  I have no dislike for him.  That's what I see.

    Biden was considered most electable from the start according to the polls.  It's not surprising he is winning.  It's surprising he returned from the dead and is winning.  But it's still about perceived electability

    Perceived electability is not really the stuff of cults.


    That would explain 500K. Maybe. (none / 0) (#160)
    by Robot Porter on Thu Mar 05, 2020 at 04:33:16 PM EST
    Which would still be a big win. But not 700K.

    That denotes considerable enthusiasm. Especially in a four person race.


    And not just a little more ... (none / 0) (#145)
    by Robot Porter on Thu Mar 05, 2020 at 02:27:02 PM EST
    it was 75K more than Obama.

    I gotta (none / 0) (#147)
    by Ga6thDem on Thu Mar 05, 2020 at 02:40:32 PM EST
    say considering where Biden was polling a few weeks or even a week ago it's more than Joe. It's a whole host of issues. People really wanting to smack Bernie on behalf of Hillary, people wanting to smack down the bros who have done nothing but insult people for 5 years now. It's a push back from the whole condescending I know better attitude of Bernie and a rejection of Russia and white populism.

    Yes, it's always a host of factors ... (none / 0) (#150)
    by Robot Porter on Thu Mar 05, 2020 at 02:48:30 PM EST
    but it was a host of factors with Obama too.

    But a big chunk of it is Joe.  To deny that is absurd.

    There were lots of other people to choose from.


    There were (none / 0) (#155)
    by Ga6thDem on Thu Mar 05, 2020 at 02:58:35 PM EST
    Frankly I never could figure out why Booker never caught fire in SC. To me he seemed the ideal candidate for SC. I think a lot of it was/is based on a fear of running POC against Trump. Black people don't trust white people after Trump and think only a white guy will beat Trump and Biden is the white guy they trust.

    That "happy warrior" type candidate ... (none / 0) (#159)
    by Robot Porter on Thu Mar 05, 2020 at 04:23:28 PM EST
    just isn't what people are looking for in this cycle.  

    But it is in almost every other cycle.

    So, if he wants to try again, I'm sure he'll find a much more appreciate electorate.

    Plus, Rosario Dawson is his girlfriend.  Causing many to feel:  He's already won the lottery, why does he need the presidency?



    That one seems (none / 0) (#161)
    by KeysDan on Thu Mar 05, 2020 at 05:22:29 PM EST
    yes, (5.00 / 1) (#46)
    by leap on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 08:49:08 AM EST
    if it's Biden, I hope he picks a better VP than did Obama.

    Oh I'm sorry (none / 0) (#29)
    by CaptHowdy on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 07:21:04 AM EST
    It will be Bloomberg.

    His money

    His organization

    His data..

    He won't be president.  But it will be Bloomberg.  And then instead of Bloomberg owning nothing to anyone it will be Biden owing everything to Bloomberg.

    And the fact is he would probably be a better manager.  But the truth is no Bloomberg supporter, which I said many things I never was, will be completely happy with this.

    Well, maybe not completely, it's Joe.  But happy enough.


    PS (none / 0) (#30)
    by CaptHowdy on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 07:23:19 AM EST
    Make no mistake.  All that money on ads was not wasted.  It helped this happen.

    Sorry just woke up (none / 0) (#31)
    by CaptHowdy on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 07:29:18 AM EST
    But the truth is ANY Bloomberg supporter.......

    Old Bloomberg... (none / 0) (#62)
    by kdog on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 09:32:01 AM EST
    never had anything to worry about from Old Joe.  Joe won't owe him nothing he wasn't going to give him anyway, for "free".

    If the 1 billion in ad buys and other support helps defeats Trump, great.  No small thing.  But not a big thing either.


    Bernie was fought to a draw ... (none / 0) (#83)
    by Robot Porter on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 01:24:04 PM EST
    in Maine and even lost delegates in Vermont.

    No, conspiracy, no cabal.

    Democratic voters sent Bernie a clear message.  They don't even love him that much where they love him most.

    And everywhere else, they just don't love him.

    The Biden/Obama brand is very powerful. And, make no mistake, it's not all Obama.  The Biden half of this has a power all its own.

    Trump is terrified today.


    You know (none / 0) (#22)
    by Ga6thDem on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 05:37:45 AM EST
    the irony is he didn't get the message in 2016 and in the years since then.

    oh, but Bernie is now endorsed by Obama (5.00 / 2) (#77)
    by Towanda on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 11:55:13 AM EST
    according to a new  Bernie ad today.

    This hypocrisy, with lots of post-2012 footage, from the guy who wanted to primary Obama in 2012.

    Jeralyn, I share your distaste of Biden, but backing the multimillionaire hypocrite who wants to destroy the party he now also wants to embrace is inexplicable.


    I think (none / 0) (#87)
    by Ga6thDem on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 02:33:20 PM EST
    that is where a lot of people are. Biden is really just a means to get rid of Bernie and Trump. The house and senate are more important.

    I disagree ... (none / 0) (#92)
    by Robot Porter on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 05:02:37 PM EST
    I think people wanted Biden.

    He's lead polls for two years.

    He didn't do great in debates, but his numbers remained pretty solid.

    The thing that knocked him back was the GOP attacks during the Impeachment, and how all that came right before Iowa.

    Once people gave the others a chance, and saw no one could do it, and plus, Bernie wasn't going to reach out to mainstream Dems, they went back to where they'd been ...



    Turnout was amazing (none / 0) (#34)
    by CaptHowdy on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 07:43:04 AM EST
    Sometimes doubling the last time.  

    In VA 1.3 million to 780 thousand in 2016

    And there are stories like that all over.

    Get ready to hear more about Hunter Biden (none / 0) (#43)
    by CaptHowdy on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 08:18:05 AM EST
    Ironically I think Biden has been immunized

    No one except the 30% will believe a word of it.


    Agree (none / 0) (#49)
    by ragebot on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 09:13:15 AM EST
    with the first part, but not the second.

    Almost a week ago Ukraine reopened the investigation into what went on with Hunter.

    Hunter is also facing a paternity suit where his finances will be a key factor in how much he winds up paying the mother.

    Not to mention the pubs holding hearings on the matter.

    The bigger problem I see is Biden does not seem to have good answers when pressed about the issue.


    He has (1.00 / 2) (#103)
    by NoSides on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 10:12:18 PM EST
    no good answers because there are no good answers.

    And (none / 0) (#50)
    by FlJoe on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 09:16:02 AM EST
    tRump's spawn are the paragons of virtue?

    It's not (1.00 / 5) (#104)
    by NoSides on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 10:20:32 PM EST
    a matter of comparing spawn.

    It's a matter of Biden using his office as Vice President to get his son a job on a shaky Ukrainian energy company.  He was paid upwards of $50,000 per month, a shockingly high salary for Hunter Biden's non-existent experience in the energy sector."

    And, "In 2018, Joe Biden bragged about withholding aid from Ukraine until they fired their top prosecutor. At the time, this top prosecutor was investigating Burisma, the very company Hunter Biden was a board member of."

    That's corruption in my book.
    And it will and should be an issue for Joe.


    It's (5.00 / 4) (#105)
    by FlJoe on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 10:34:34 PM EST
    funny how you are resorting to tRumpian tactics, how "progressive" of you.

    Bull$hit (5.00 / 1) (#169)
    by Yman on Fri Mar 06, 2020 at 06:04:49 PM EST
    It's a matter of Biden using his office as Vice President to get his son a job on a shaky Ukrainian energy company.  He was paid upwards of $50,000 per month, a shockingly high salary for Hunter Biden's non-existent experience in the energy sector."

    This is straight-up, tinfoil, Trumper conspiracy trolling.  There is not one iota of evidence that Biden did any such thing.  Moreover, Biden was doing his job when he pushed Ukraine to get rid of a corrupt prosecutor that was NOT following through on investigations.  Not that facts, evidence or truth matter to Bernie/Russian bots ...


    Oh (none / 0) (#53)
    by CaptHowdy on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 09:20:14 AM EST
    Did you know Hillary has to be deposed about emails.

    Seriously.  How did these morons ever beat us last time.


    That happened a couple of days ago (none / 0) (#58)
    by ragebot on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 09:24:52 AM EST
    Thing is she will be deposed instead of providing written answers.

    To answer your question the pubs won because they got more votes in the EC.


    Hillary (5.00 / 1) (#73)
    by Ga6thDem on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 11:49:17 AM EST
    has been deposed already a number of times. The GOP just can't admit to you guys that they have been lying and so Hillary is going to go in front of a bunch of morons and make them look like idiots again. Benghazi redux. You guys just can't quit being stupid it seems. And yet you don't think Trump should answer one question or release his taxes. NY has them though. I bet there's an October surprise coming from the NY AG with regards to that.

    And, Trump spawn-in-law (none / 0) (#162)
    by KeysDan on Thu Mar 05, 2020 at 05:33:17 PM EST
    Jared Kushner, sold his interest in Cadre, a digital platform, for between $25 million and $50 million, based on 2017 Trump tax breaks he pushed for as "Opportunities Zone". Three years ago, Jared's investment was $5 million.

    From the LA Times (none / 0) (#41)
    by ragebot on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 08:04:57 AM EST

    A lot happened on Super Tuesday. But one thing that did not happen was any movement toward reconciliation between these warring wings of the party.
    The ideological battle lines have only hardened. Sanders ticked off his litany of grievances with Biden in an angry, finger-wagging election night speech. Biden has been unrestrained in ripping into the democratic socialist agenda that Sanders is promoting.
    Now that the nomination battle has narrowed down to these two, all signs suggest it will get more personal and the jabs will be more pointed.
    Will they come together once a nominee is chosen? Perhaps. But there is also the potential for lasting damage to the party at a time it is desperate for unity.

    I guess this is all you got (none / 0) (#42)
    by CaptHowdy on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 08:11:02 AM EST
    After democrats showed you they will not be the 2016 republicans

    But if you think, I don't think you actually do, that Democrats are going to let this screw up another election you are missing the bigger picture.


    This is a common (5.00 / 1) (#45)
    by ragebot on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 08:49:02 AM EST
    point of view from a very mainstream, and mostly left leaning, paper.  Plenty of talking heads from all networks have been saying the same thing.

    There is a real fight between the Sanders/Warren camp and the Biden/DNC/et al camp.  It was only a few days ago that a large number of posters on this site were dissing Biden.  Even yesterday there were comments about him needing a hair cut.

    There is no disputing Sanders gets an order of magnitude larger crowds than any other candidate.  I can't recall seeing Sanders using a teleprompter; by the same token I can't recall Biden making a speech without seeming like he gets lost in his thought process.

    Maybe you should go back to the start of the nomination process and see who supported Biden back then.  Peter still thinks Warren is the best choice.  Jeralyn posted Sanders praises a couple of days ago.  You were a Buttigieg guy until he dropped out.  I can't recall a single regular here who supported Biden till he was shoved down the throats of rank and file dems by the DNC.

    Pretending I am the only person who sees a massive split is ignoring reality.


    Thats funny (5.00 / 1) (#48)
    by CaptHowdy on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 09:10:07 AM EST
    The "very mainstream left leaning media" want a split in the Democratic Party.  Just like you.

    They, and you, would get to blather sooooo much about that.
    So much worry.  So much concern trolling..

    As far as going back, I have said many time I want to win.  I was never really a Pete guy.  Or a Bloomberg guy and definitely not a Biden guy.

    That's was mostly because he was losing.  No lose.  Win.

    Biden can beat Trump.  I believe that.  He probably has a better chance than any candidate this year.  Trump got himself impeached, immunizing Biden in the process, because he was so worried about it.

    I'm feeling much better about stuff today.  So sorry if you are not.


    My take is (none / 0) (#55)
    by ragebot on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 09:22:59 AM EST
    Bloomberg had the best chance to beat Trump, even if he came across as a stiff.  I never really saw him go off the rails and he really seemed up to speed on the issues.

    The biggest issue I see for Biden is his gaffs.  Next is the Hunter thing.  There is also the problem of what to do with the very progressive side of the party.

    I don't see a path for Sanders unless Biden really self implodes.  But Sanders/Warren/Omar will be fighting for planks in what the dems advocate.  What happens when they demand a real shift to the left, more than Biden wants.

    The problems Biden had two weeks ago did not magically go away.


    I don't think that's true (none / 0) (#59)
    by CaptHowdy on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 09:26:25 AM EST
    In PA for example Bloomberg was losing or even Biden was winning.

    Bloomberg had serious problems but if Biden collapsed he was the best hope.

    Guess what, Biden lives.

    But the "gaffs", yes.   no way a president who says dumb shi+ could ever be elected.


    The biggest issue for Biden (none / 0) (#110)
    by Abdul Abulbul Amir on Thu Mar 05, 2020 at 07:17:20 AM EST
    Is not the gaffs. It is the approaching senility.

    Why would (5.00 / 1) (#157)
    by jmacWA on Thu Mar 05, 2020 at 03:28:34 PM EST
    it matter... senility is already here with Trump.  Things can't get worse

    Worked (none / 0) (#158)
    by CaptHowdy on Thu Mar 05, 2020 at 03:34:06 PM EST
    For Reagan

    That's the (none / 0) (#102)
    by NoSides on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 10:03:12 PM EST
    way I feel about it.
    Biden is being shoved down our throats by the DNC and the mainstream press - the Times - WashPo, and the broadcast media.

    Any victory by Biden is heralded as a second coming. A great story. A comeback. Rocky.

    A victory by Sanders, instead of being represented as a victory for the underdog - a victory for people who need help - people needing medical care, young people needing a break to start their lives without being knee-deep in dept - is represented as a threat. A victory by Sanders is heralded by the media as "can he be stopped?"

    Yes. He can be stopped. But not by Republicans. By Democrats.


    Drama drama (5.00 / 1) (#112)
    by CaptHowdy on Thu Mar 05, 2020 at 08:03:27 AM EST

    I would say drama queen but you are not really that good at it.


    Yes, (5.00 / 1) (#66)
    by KeysDan on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 09:51:13 AM EST
    Democrats are now at the beginning of unification, not the start  of more divisiveness.  This is the day after.  Hard fought races, competitive candidates, and disappointed supporters.  It will take a little time, but all but the most fanatical understand the stakes and will do the right thing for the country.

    yeah (none / 0) (#75)
    by Ga6thDem on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 11:50:51 AM EST
    we did not let Putin take over our party like you guys did. We have enough fight in us to take him on and win. You guys just laid down and let Putin roll all over you.

    Bloomberg suspends campaing (none / 0) (#51)
    by ragebot on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 09:17:08 AM EST
    endorsed Biden.

    American Samoan hearts (none / 0) (#65)
    by Abdul Abulbul Amir on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 09:44:04 AM EST
    are aching.

    I think Olsen Johnson said it best: (none / 0) (#165)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Fri Mar 06, 2020 at 12:43:31 PM EST
    Bloomberg (none / 0) (#60)
    by FlJoe on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 09:27:08 AM EST
    out and endorsing Biden.

    He screwed up (none / 0) (#84)
    by Abdul Abulbul Amir on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 01:49:10 PM EST
    He should have got the Russians to run $100K's worth of marginally literate Facebook ads and he be Prez for sure.

    No joy in Mudville (none / 0) (#67)
    by CaptHowdy on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 10:15:58 AM EST
    Williamson Says Biden Endorsements Were a `Coup'

    March 4, 2020 at 10:06 am EST By Taegan Goddard 159 Comments

    In a now-deleted tweet, Marianne Williamson called it a "coup" that former Democratic candidates threw their support behind former Joe Biden, USA Today reports.

    Said Williamson: "This was not a resurrection; it was a coup. Russia gate was not a coup. Mueller was not a coup. Impeachment was not a coup. What happened yesterday was a coup. And we will push it back."

    Me. Williamson (5.00 / 1) (#68)
    by KeysDan on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 10:34:44 AM EST
    Needs to realize that core Democratic voters are terrified The coup they seek Is to determine the best shot to defeat Trump. And, by their lights, that is Biden.

    Complete (5.00 / 2) (#76)
    by Ga6thDem on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 11:53:00 AM EST
    genius on Bernie's part to get an anti-vaxxer on board in the middle of a pandemic isn't it?

    The bobble heads are obsessed (none / 0) (#78)
    by CaptHowdy on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 12:06:00 PM EST
    With "the mechanism of how it will work" (just heard that CNN) for Bloomberg to bury Biden in money and resources.

    To be clear (none / 0) (#79)
    by CaptHowdy on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 12:09:38 PM EST
    It's a totally fair question

    In other electoral news: (none / 0) (#97)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 07:25:48 PM EST
    The Trump campaign's former coffee boy -- or perhaps that should be "Covfefe Boy" -- face-planted in his congressional special election open primary in Orange County, CA, netting just 1,421 votes. Oh, boo hoo.

    This headline from the NYTimes (none / 0) (#101)
    by NoSides on Wed Mar 04, 2020 at 09:36:46 PM EST
    kinda tells the whole story:

    Stocks Surge as Wall Street Opens Checkbooks for Biden

    As W.E.B. Dubois said, "I believe that democracy has so far disappeared in the United States that no "two evils" exist. There is but one evil party with two names, and it will be elected despite all I can do or say."

    For me it is a sad day to see a person like Biden put up by the Democratic Party as the alternative to Donald Trump.

    This quote from Firesign Theater (none / 0) (#106)
    by CaptHowdy on Thu Mar 05, 2020 at 12:03:56 AM EST
    Does it better

    "Live it, or live with it"


    Proposals (none / 0) (#107)
    by NoSides on Thu Mar 05, 2020 at 06:37:58 AM EST
    such as medicare for all, available in most civilized countries, is deemed "far left" not only by republicans, but also by many if not most democrats.

    The same goes for the idea of the "green new deal" which aimed to counter the ongoing and worsening defilement of our planet and our chances of surviving on it. Too "far left".

    So - I ask - what is what I would call, for lack of a better phrase, a "regular left"?

    What is left for the left?
    I ask here, because in name, this is a site whose sympathies lie with leftist policies. Freedom of the press included.

    But what comes across is more like a passion for what is commonly called in the media, "moderation".

    Patrick Henry was no moderate.

    Most countries (5.00 / 3) (#115)
    by CST on Thu Mar 05, 2020 at 08:10:47 AM EST
    Have universal healthcare, but not single payer with no private insurance.

    He's dead (none / 0) (#111)
    by CaptHowdy on Thu Mar 05, 2020 at 07:46:27 AM EST
    2 on Michigan (none / 0) (#116)
    by CaptHowdy on Thu Mar 05, 2020 at 08:53:57 AM EST
    Warren (none / 0) (#119)
    by CaptHowdy on Thu Mar 05, 2020 at 09:55:05 AM EST
    Is out

    She is supposed to hold a news conference (5.00 / 1) (#120)
    by CaptHowdy on Thu Mar 05, 2020 at 10:07:30 AM EST
    I would not be surprised if she does not endorse anyone.  I think she avoided that last time until there was a candidate.

    Yes, Senator Warren (none / 0) (#122)
    by KeysDan on Thu Mar 05, 2020 at 11:10:22 AM EST
    stayed neutral during  the primary, but was " with her" in the general election.  It may be the best course for her to endorse Biden now, he did win MA, and it will be a good step toward unity.  She will be criticized whatever she does.

    Senator Warren (5.00 / 2) (#121)
    by KeysDan on Thu Mar 05, 2020 at 11:00:51 AM EST
    would have made a great president.  Like Bernie, she offered progressive ideas; unlike Bernie, she provided defined plans along with a sharp pencil and history of accomplishments. Senator Warren has a compelling life story and towering intellect.

    As in most unsuccessful campaigns there  were mis-steps, but  she was disadvantaged, in my view, in greatest measure, by other forces .  If Bernie did not run this time, or suspended his campaign after his cardiac episode, she and we would be in a different position.  And, too, Warren faced sexism.


    Seriously. Warren is light years beyond (none / 0) (#124)
    by vml68 on Thu Mar 05, 2020 at 11:27:23 AM EST
    Biden and Bernie, in every possible way.

    I've been in Miami the past few days. On Monday, at dinner at a restaurant, I was seated next to a table with 2 older white, very well to-do (based on comments) couples. The tables were close, so I could hear everything they were saying. Their conversation the entire time was basically the pros and cons of Bernie or Biden as nominee. I was waiting to hear who they would eventually settle on. An hour of discussion later, one of the women says, "You know, if we were picking a CEO to run our company, it would be Bloomberg", and just like that, they all agreed Bloomberg needed to be the nominee.

    I am on the record as saying that between Biden, Bernie and Bloomberg, I would pick Bloomberg. I really thought that he would do a lot better on Super Tuesday. I thought Bernie would get the most delegates followed by Bloomberg and then Biden/Warren. Boy, was I wrong!

    Considering my pi$$ poor track record on political prognostications, I believe I am well qualified to become a TV political pundit.


    It seems like a real problem (none / 0) (#126)
    by CaptHowdy on Thu Mar 05, 2020 at 11:58:09 AM EST
    With our system that people who might be very good at the job they are running for just simply are not good candidates.  That is, not good in the sense of not good in our "30 minute news cycle twitter driven politics".

    I agree she would be a great president.  She was not a great candidate IMO.

    like I said.  Seems like a serious problem.  I have no solution.


    I too wonder... (none / 0) (#127)
    by kdog on Thu Mar 05, 2020 at 11:59:39 AM EST
    what the race would look like for Liz if Bernie had not run this time...now better understanding the depth with which many Democrats despise Bernie.  I thought it was just a TL thing...there's more of you out there than I thought!  

    I still think (hope?) the progressive platform is more popular than the moderate one among the commoners.  But when you throw in the personality angle and the various "electability" arguments things get very muddled.



    Bernie has taught you it's personal (none / 0) (#129)
    by CaptHowdy on Thu Mar 05, 2020 at 12:02:51 PM EST
    It isn't.  No one, well not everyone, despises Bernie.  Most like me appreciate many things he has brought into the conversation.

    We want to win. He won't win.  It not personal.  Except that the extent he diligently works to make it so.


    I still say he's the best shot in the general... (none / 0) (#131)
    by kdog on Thu Mar 05, 2020 at 12:10:36 PM EST
    But anyone who says they know for sure is lying.

    IMO (none / 0) (#133)
    by FlJoe on Thu Mar 05, 2020 at 12:36:45 PM EST
    Bernie and his supporters have earned that "hatred".
    Supporters of other candidates are routinely labeled as naive dupes at best and corporate wh0res at worst.

    Warren supporters were at best lost sheep following a false prophet at best and worshiper of a snake goddess at worst.


    IMO... (none / 0) (#135)
    by kdog on Thu Mar 05, 2020 at 01:25:01 PM EST
    that's a dumb reason to oppose or side against progressive policies.

    Say you don't want Medicare for All, say you don't want student loan forgiveness, say you don't want a moratorium on deportations and the abolishment of ICE, say you don't want Glass-Steagal reinstated.  I would disagree, but reasonable people can disagree.  

    Don't say Bernie and a vocal minority of his supporters hurt my feels...that's just lame Brother.


    It's more complicated than that (5.00 / 2) (#136)
    by CST on Thu Mar 05, 2020 at 01:34:20 PM EST
    Like it or not the toxicity makes it harder to accomplish any of those things you mentioned.

    To be clear (5.00 / 2) (#138)
    by CaptHowdy on Thu Mar 05, 2020 at 02:03:58 PM EST
    No one is "sideing against progressive ideas"

    That's a BS insult that only shows your lack of understanding of the whole f'ing thing.


    I don't know... (none / 0) (#140)
    by kdog on Thu Mar 05, 2020 at 02:12:51 PM EST
    What else can you call it? What about Biden's record and current stances is all that progressive? He jumped on the $15 min wage train is all I can think of, and a very late arrival at that.

    The Biden I know sided with a racist criminal justice system over black and brown and poor white folks, sided with the banks on the bankruptcy law over kids crippled by student loan debt, sided with the war machine on the Iraq vote.

    If those who already voted were down with progressive ideals and didn't want Bernie for whatever reason had every opportunity to vote for Liz. And few did.


    I going to stop now (none / 0) (#141)
    by CaptHowdy on Thu Mar 05, 2020 at 02:16:10 PM EST
    Because if I don't I will say things I regret.

    Let me be clear
    You are not more progressive than me.  Or Joe.  Just because you are gullible


    The Biden that exists today (none / 0) (#142)
    by CST on Thu Mar 05, 2020 at 02:16:59 PM EST
    Is a shell of his former self being propped up by mainstream Dems.  Some of us consider that progress, with regard to Biden.  We're not electing a man we're electing an empty suit because we trust the people trying to fill it, not the shell.

    I (none / 0) (#137)
    by FlJoe on Thu Mar 05, 2020 at 01:37:14 PM EST
    got a thick skin bro, but this sht has been going for 5+ years. Bernie and his bros think they can yell their way into the needed change, that's not the way the world works and all your caterwauling will not change that.

    Oh, dear God (none / 0) (#170)
    by Yman on Fri Mar 06, 2020 at 06:18:43 PM EST
    More of the "more progressive than thou" schtick.


    Bernie's tactics and those of his supporters are a legitimate issue - and could cost him the endorsement of Warren, which he badly needs.  More importantly, just because you oppose Bernie or support Biden doesn't mean you "side against progressive policies".  Many of us realize his promised "revolution" is not happening and will not happen.  We want single payer but recognize that his promises to get it passed are empty taking away people's current plans will create more backlash than progress.  


    I, too, believe (none / 0) (#139)
    by KeysDan on Thu Mar 05, 2020 at 02:10:19 PM EST
    the progressive agenda is the most popular one.  And, as such, progressives are the centrists.  The challenge for progressives, is to bring that agenda to fruition.  Bernie's tact seems to be to keep it rhetoric and vague...a revolution .  But, this an election   An election that requires a big tent.  Yes, this includes inspiring youth and non-voters, but that also requires.knowledge of why they are called non-voters. Bernie may have sounded fresh and innovative last time around, but some of the air has run out in the encore. Bernie made his contribution to progressivism and should have retired to bask in his sunlight.

    Senator Warren knows what to do with good ideas, but, apparently , was not a good candidate.  She should have had a plan for that, championing a progressive agenda in light of the core of the Democratic Party being terrified , placing Trump's defeat front and center.  Letting Medicare for All become scarier than Trump was a fatal attraction when it should have been a winning contrast with Trump's plan of Medicare for None.  

    Senator Warren probably was punished, too, with "worrywortism" ---- the sexism derivative of not being electable. Maybe the same unfairness experienced in that regard in 2016.  Again, the fear of another Trump term


    Even if you're basing your vote... (none / 0) (#143)
    by kdog on Thu Mar 05, 2020 at 02:23:52 PM EST
    solely on electability...what makes people think Biden is all that electable?  He has run for president 3 times, the first two nobody wanted him.  Granted he ran against two heavyweights in '08, but in '88 he lost to f*ckin' Michael Dukakis.  

    And we've all seen and heard him speak and debate lately...he's the only one who might lose a debate to Trump unless it boils down to who does more pushups or they settle it outside with a good ol' fashioned donnybrook.  

    Scratch that, Bloomberg might lose a debate with Trump too.


    First of all (none / 0) (#151)
    by Ga6thDem on Thu Mar 05, 2020 at 02:49:33 PM EST
    i seriously doubt that there are going to be any debates. Secondly how do you think Bernie would win a debate when all he can do is shout the same 5 phrases over and over? Biden certainly is not the best debater but he's shown he's better at it than Bernie by miles.

    I hope she doesn't endorse (5.00 / 2) (#130)
    by CST on Thu Mar 05, 2020 at 12:08:56 PM EST
    Until the general.

    Neither one of them deserves it, and either way will prompt backlash.


    I bet no endorsement (none / 0) (#132)
    by CaptHowdy on Thu Mar 05, 2020 at 12:15:27 PM EST
    Will cause as much of a backlash as a Biden endorsement

    Just check out one of the resident trolls below.

    She is truly damned if she does ....

    I don't think she wants to encourage an extended primary.


    Welll that's why she dropped out (none / 0) (#134)
    by CST on Thu Mar 05, 2020 at 01:17:21 PM EST
    Primary doesn't really need her Biden endorsement at this point.  And he definitely hasn't earned it.  Bernie would just be counter-productive.

    Since Elizabeth Warren (none / 0) (#123)
    by NoSides on Thu Mar 05, 2020 at 11:26:24 AM EST
    dropped out, the question for me is will she endorse Sanders, or go with the flow and go with Biden.

    Her positions are clearly closer to Sanders, - a 2% tax on the wealthiest Americans to pay for new benefits including tuition-free college, universal day care, student debt forgiveness and support for the "Green New Deal"

    Sadly, these progressive positions are scorned by "moderates" - including Mr. Biden.

    My guess is, based on her past behavior, she will go with Biden - probably in hopes of getting something in return should he win.

    I hope I'm wrong and that she will have the courage of her convictions and support Sanders, but courage does not seem to be in abundance these days.

    You're wrong (none / 0) (#128)
    by CaptHowdy on Thu Mar 05, 2020 at 11:59:49 AM EST
    And it's the tip of the iceberg of your wrongness

    You're funny (none / 0) (#171)
    by Yman on Fri Mar 06, 2020 at 06:23:41 PM EST
    If she goes with your candidate, she's "going with the courage of her convictions".  if she goes with Biden, she's selfishly angling for some imaginary reward.

    I think she'll endorse whomever she wants, but it's this kind of Bernie-Bros garbage that really makes me hope it's Biden.  Just to watch their heads explode.


    Boom (none / 0) (#149)
    by CaptHowdy on Thu Mar 05, 2020 at 02:47:03 PM EST
    Bloomberg to Form Super PAC to Defeat Trump

    March 5, 2020 at 2:56 pm EST By Taegan Goddard 208 Comments

    "Michael Bloomberg has decided to form a new independent expenditure campaign that will absorb hundreds of his presidential campaign staff in six swing states to work to elect the Democratic nominee this fall," the Washington Post reports.

    "The new group, with a name that is still undisclosed because its trademark application is in process, would also be a vehicle for Bloomberg to spend money on advertising to attack President Trump and support the Democratic nominee."

    The battleground states: Wisconsin, Michigan, Pennsylvania, Arizona, Florida and North Carolina. The consensus electoral map shows all of these states as Toss Ups, with the exception of Michigan which leans blue.

    What About Flipping the Senate Blue? (5.00 / 2) (#163)
    by RickyJim on Thu Mar 05, 2020 at 06:34:09 PM EST
    I think that is at least as important as taking the presidency. I hope Bloomberg can be convinced to support that to the degree it deserves.

    He should have just taken the 700MM (none / 0) (#164)
    by sarcastic unnamed one on Fri Mar 06, 2020 at 11:19:14 AM EST
    he spent and gave it to us all. 2 million for each of us. I think he could have gotten his presidency and a blue senate. Easily.

    ?? ¿Math? (5.00 / 3) (#166)
    by leap on Fri Mar 06, 2020 at 03:20:46 PM EST
    2 million for each of us.

    Really? I think you fell into this trap!


    SUO, that's some fuzzy math you've (5.00 / 2) (#167)
    by vml68 on Fri Mar 06, 2020 at 05:20:49 PM EST
    got going on there :-)!

    Ha! Sorry all! What was I thinking?! (none / 0) (#174)
    by sarcastic unnamed one on Sat Mar 07, 2020 at 02:36:06 PM EST
    A carry-over from a conversation I was part of the previous night. Doh! :-)

    Bitecofer (none / 0) (#173)
    by smott on Sat Mar 07, 2020 at 12:16:15 PM EST
    Thinks very possible w Biden.
    Maine, Colorado, AZ all flipping per her model.

    Here's hoping for Montana, and holding Jones seat in AL, that one seems most risky.

    To be clear, NO Chance of any of that happening w Sanders as the nominee. Downstream Dems would have to disavow and run away from him in many cases, such as FL and PA.


    I hope (none / 0) (#152)
    by Ga6thDem on Thu Mar 05, 2020 at 02:52:21 PM EST
    he expands that into GA. We might just flip in 2020.

    I was surprised GA (none / 0) (#154)
    by CaptHowdy on Thu Mar 05, 2020 at 02:56:44 PM EST
    Was not included.  I'm sure it will not be ignored.

    Well, any of (none / 0) (#156)
    by Ga6thDem on Thu Mar 05, 2020 at 03:21:11 PM EST
    us that ever watch TV no matter what state will get the anti-Trump ads. They will probably be everywhere. :)

    Hey Ga (none / 0) (#175)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Mar 07, 2020 at 06:10:01 PM EST
    Or anyone else
    What is this about?

    the Georgia Senate race, where Republicans are facing an intra-party battle with a special election twist that could push the final result until January, and after the next Senate is sworn in.

    It was in a blurb on Political Wire about a member only article

    To lazy to google

    To the best (none / 0) (#179)
    by Ga6thDem on Sun Mar 08, 2020 at 07:42:04 PM EST
    of my ability this would be because they are having a jungle primary with Kremlin Kelly and Doug Collins and Raphael Warnock as the Dem running. There's some rule about a candidate having to get over 50%. The only way it would go into January is if there are going to be more than one runoff.

    Thanks (none / 0) (#180)
    by CaptHowdy on Sun Mar 08, 2020 at 09:09:24 PM EST
    Makes sense

    Corona virus does a good thing (none / 0) (#176)
    by CaptHowdy on Sun Mar 08, 2020 at 09:06:54 AM EST
    Trump has no rallies scheduled.  Zero.  None planned.  It's said this is directly because of the warnings to old people particularly to not attend large gatherings.

    Credit where credit is due.

    If this continues (none / 0) (#177)
    by CaptHowdy on Sun Mar 08, 2020 at 10:47:11 AM EST
    This could really seriously cause him to have some kind of psychotic break.

    And leave the cult addicts itchy and twitchy for a fix of REAL NEWS.


    Ted Cruz is a potential carrier (none / 0) (#178)
    by CaptHowdy on Sun Mar 08, 2020 at 06:18:09 PM EST
    There was a diagnosed case at CPAC.  Cruz says he interacted with that person.

    Here is the link, btw, to the CDC fact sheet (none / 0) (#181)
    by Peter G on Sun Mar 08, 2020 at 09:25:49 PM EST
    which is calm, rational and informative (one-page PDF).

    Read earlier this morning that Pence (none / 0) (#182)
    by fishcamp on Mon Mar 09, 2020 at 11:01:53 AM EST
    was at a location where someone tested positive, but I can't find that now.

    Some Australian lady tested positive after returning home from Aspen.  They are now frantically trying to find out where she had been while in town.  If they close the ski lifts it will be down to one run a day after hiking to the top.  I've done that.

    No news of the virus here in the Florida keys.

    Other than CPAC? (none / 0) (#183)
    by CaptHowdy on Mon Mar 09, 2020 at 11:15:59 AM EST
    He was there.  They are reporting the President is not being very smart

    Business as Usual for Trump

    March 9, 2020 at 11:00 am EDT By Taegan Goddard 76 Comments

    CNN: "For a self-described germophobe, Trump has continued to shake hands and interact with people like normal. While a bottle of hand sanitizer has been a staple in his life for decades now, people said they did not notice the President taking any extra precautions, despite being in the age bracket that health officials say should be most concerned about coronavirus."

    We can only hope irony is not dead.


    Thoughts and prayers (none / 0) (#184)
    by CaptHowdy on Mon Mar 09, 2020 at 11:55:06 AM EST
    Trump Flouts Advice of Medical Experts

    March 9, 2020 at 12:22 pm EDT By Taegan Goddard 89 Comments

    "President Trump landed in Orlando on Monday morning for a fundraiser -- and proceeded to ignore public health professionals' advice that older Americans should limit person-to-person contact," the Washington Post reports.

    "As he made his way off Air Force One and toward the presidential motorcade, Trump greeted supporters gathered on the tarmac, shaking hands with many of them."

    Oh, (none / 0) (#185)
    by Ga6thDem on Mon Mar 09, 2020 at 12:02:57 PM EST
    how much karma would be unloaded into the atmosphere if Trump came down with coronavirus?

    But if he did, the White House physician (5.00 / 1) (#187)
    by Peter G on Mon Mar 09, 2020 at 12:29:52 PM EST
    and press secretary would not announce it, and in fact might outright deny it. They would say he was in Walter Reed for an early physical or some routine testing.

    P Wire (none / 0) (#188)
    by CaptHowdy on Mon Mar 09, 2020 at 01:33:05 PM EST
    Trump Said to Be Terrified of Coronovirus

    March 9, 2020 at 2:24 pm EDT By Taegan Goddard Leave a Comment

    Gabriel Sherman: "As Trump pushes a nothing-to-see-here message in public, sources said he's privately terrified about getting the virus... Stories about Trump's coronavirus fears have spread through the White House. Last week Trump told aides he's afraid journalists will try to purposefully contract coronavirus to give it to him on Air Force One... The source also said Trump has asked the Secret Service to set up a screening program and bar anyone who has a cough from the White House grounds."

    Said a source: "He's definitely melting down over this."

    "But thus far Trump's private concerns haven't affected his public response."

    I love the part (none / 0) (#189)
    by CaptHowdy on Mon Mar 09, 2020 at 01:35:35 PM EST
    About the fear of viral suicide bombers.

    Tells you a lot about how he sees himself


    If he really believes this (5.00 / 1) (#190)
    by Zorba on Mon Mar 09, 2020 at 01:45:09 PM EST
    might happen, it's past time to 25th Amendment him.

    One more (none / 0) (#191)
    by CaptHowdy on Mon Mar 09, 2020 at 03:00:47 PM EST
    Doug Collins Will Self-Quarantine

    March 9, 2020 at 3:55 pm EDT By Taegan Goddard 1 Comment

    Rep. Doug Collins (R-GA) announced that he would self-quarantine at his home after coming into contact with a person who later tested positive for the novel coronavirus, The Hill reports.

    Said Collins: "This afternoon, I was notified by CPAC that they discovered a photo of myself and the patient who has tested positive for coronavirus. While I feel completely healthy and I am not experiencing any symptoms, I have decided to self-quarantine at my home for the remainder of the 14-day period out of an abundance of caution."

    Collins recently joined President Trump and Vice President Pence on a CDC tour in Atlanta.

    Of Course... (none / 0) (#194)
    by jmacWA on Mon Mar 09, 2020 at 03:27:00 PM EST
    and press secretary would not announce it, and in fact might outright deny it

    It would keep the numbers down by 1... something he cares about


    I honestly don't care (none / 0) (#195)
    by CaptHowdy on Mon Mar 09, 2020 at 03:30:59 PM EST
    If they conceal it.  I'm happy for him to get it and try to keep it a secret.

    If he croaks they can try stuffing him and sitting him up in cabinet meetings.  It would probably work longer than it should.


    Well, it's been working (5.00 / 1) (#201)
    by Zorba on Mon Mar 09, 2020 at 05:06:15 PM EST
    a long time with televangelist Pat Robertson, after all.  /s

    Just keeps on (none / 0) (#198)
    by CaptHowdy on Mon Mar 09, 2020 at 04:35:32 PM EST
    Do viruses have a sense of humor?

    Matt Gaetz Will Self-Quarantine

    March 9, 2020 at 4:18 pm EDT By Taegan Goddard 196 Comments

    Rep. Matt Gaetz (R-FL), who made light of the coronavirus outbreak by wearing a gas mask, is now self-quarantining after coming into contact with a person who tested positive for the coronavirus.

    Gaetz was on Air Force One with President Trump earlier today, CBS News reports.

    It enough that with the whole virus hoax stuff on the right, starring the above, pretty much every congress person effected are not just republicans but fringe loonies.

    The gas mask guy is just the best.


    Could you repeat that for the President (none / 0) (#200)
    by CaptHowdy on Mon Mar 09, 2020 at 05:01:37 PM EST
    As a numbers guy I have to point out (none / 0) (#186)
    by ragebot on Mon Mar 09, 2020 at 12:27:55 PM EST
    the highest risk group for corona virus is those over 80 years of age with health issues.  In that group the death rate is just over 15%; all other age groups have a much lower rate.

    One bright spot is no one under ten years of age has died from the corona virus.  As summer approaches and temps go up the likely hood of the rate of virus spread in the Norther Hemisphere will go down.

    As with most health issues those at most risk are folks with limited access to health care.  As someone who spends most of my time anchored out on my boat or cruising solo from one anchorage to the next my contacts are quite limited so I am not all that worried.  If worst comes to worst I could go for six months never touching land (and by extension exposing myself to possible corona virus infection.

    Bottom line is for most folks there is not a huge risk; and that risk can be greatly decreased by good personal health habits.

    Wishing pols you don't like catching the corona virus is likely a waste of time.  Face it high profile pols have great health care and as a rule are well protected from risks of all types.