Friday Open Thread

ISIS has claimed credit for the Philippines casino bombing.

The U.S. took out the significant ISIS cleric, Turki al-Binali, and the co-founder of the Amaq News Agency.

Al Qaida continues to regroup, with Osama bin Laden's son Hamza bin Laden taking on a more public spokesman role.

Ansar al-Sharia folded in Libya. Al Qaida has not. ISIS is still making noise there, but it no longer is in control of a major city.

Donald Trump and Paris: Absent from the Rose Garden ceremony yesterday: Jared and Ivanka. Guess their feelings were hurt that Ivanka's time spent putting meetings together was for nothing. She really doesn't hold any power over her erratic father. There's no reason for anyone to "court" her.

Who has fun plans this weekend? This is an open thread, all topics welcome.

< CNN and Others Cancel Kathy Griffin Contracts | London Bridge is Latest Attack Target >
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    ... said yesterday that solar energy is an unreliable source of power because the weather is occasionally cloudy and the sun sets every night. Today, he goes to Twitter and doubles down on stupid.

    Word to Wolf Blitzer, Gloria Borger and CNN: Political experience no more readily connotes a sense of scientific expertise on the subject of climate change, than will the subsequent effects of climate change itself either pause or retreat in the face of our country's political polarization.

    And then, we wonder aloud how vast segments of our society can be so consistently and egregiously misinformed on such an urgent topic of considerable consequence.

    Here's a novel thought. Talk to the scientists themselves.

    And the French Open tennis (5.00 / 3) (#4)
    by fishcamp on Fri Jun 02, 2017 at 12:40:05 PM EST
    live at five am from Paris.  That's when my cats start bouncing on the bed for food.  An hour later is the time to secure a location on the water to catch a giant tarpon as they come lumbering past in a long 200 fish prehistoric mating ritual daisy chain.  We try to make them eat chicken feathers tied to a hook instead of a tasty mullet.  They fall for it once in a while.

    Tarpon Toad? (none / 0) (#8)
    by sarcastic unnamed one on Fri Jun 02, 2017 at 01:38:43 PM EST
    Enjoyed (none / 0) (#11)
    by CoralGables on Fri Jun 02, 2017 at 03:24:33 PM EST
    watching a few monsters cruising the docks of Key West harbor a couple weekends back.

    Dept of Justice shows its cards at S.Ct. (5.00 / 1) (#6)
    by Peter G on Fri Jun 02, 2017 at 12:54:52 PM EST
    re: Travel Ban 2.0.  In filings last night, they have asked that the Supremes grant a stay of the injunctions issued by the federal judges in Hawaii and in Maryland (which both the Fourth and Ninth Circuits refused to do). Let the appeal of the Hawaii injunction otherwise play out at the Ninth Circuit. Grant review of the Fourth Cir case that upheld the Maryland injunction against the revised Exec Order, on a semi-expedited schedule that would have the case heard this coming October.

    Given that: (5.00 / 3) (#12)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Fri Jun 02, 2017 at 03:25:31 PM EST
    • The ban on Muslim immigration from first seven and now six predominantly Islamic countries was to be for 90 days;

    • The then-expressed purpose for this 90-day ban was to afford the Trump administration the time necessary to conduct a comprehensive review of current and applicable immigration policies;

    • The aforementioned 90 days has long passed since the executive order was first signed and put into effect;

    • No review of the aforementioned applicable immigration policies has apparently been conducted during the intervening period;

    • Trump has not once sought to either walk back or tone down his own noxious campaign rhetoric on the subject of Muslim residents and immigrants in the United States; and

    • Trump's aforementioned rhetoric has proved wildly appealing to his own bigoted and narrow-minded white-wing political base, which constitutes about 35-40% of the U.S. eletorate;

    I would therefore offer that the administration's own unstated yet thinly-veiled motive for seeking the ban on Muslim immigration is entirely self-evident from both legal and public policy perspectives.

    If Trump has a demonstrable knack for anything of late, it would be for his capacity to tarnish and diminish the formerly impeccable personal reputations of once-respected individuals who've chosen to associate themselves with him for whatever their reasons.

    SCOTUS would therefore be wise to decline the administration's request to consider its cause in this case, lest its faction of conservative justices otherwise further burnish their own already-dubious collective reputation for conflating the GOP's partisan political aspirations with the law itself.



    Nevertheless, the Court has called for (none / 0) (#25)
    by Peter G on Fri Jun 02, 2017 at 07:28:48 PM EST
    responses to the Administration's submissions to be filed by the ACLU and other plaintiffs by June 12, a very short response time. Not unreasonable, but much shorter than the rules normally establish. Seems the Court intends to decide by July 1 whether or not to take the case (and whether to grant the stay), and on what schedule the case will be heard, if accepted for review.

    That's too bad. I should've known better ... (none / 0) (#28)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Fri Jun 02, 2017 at 08:05:58 PM EST
    ... than to rely on SCOTUS conservatives to err on the side of simple common decency. After all, these are the same birds who blithely tossed aside a century's worth of legal precedents in campaign finance law to rule in favor of dark money in the Citizens United case.

    It seems, (none / 0) (#9)
    by KeysDan on Fri Jun 02, 2017 at 02:45:52 PM EST
    to me, that the Supreme Court would want to be the final decider on the constitutionality of a presidential executive order, despite the devastating Fourth Circuit (10-3) ruling and the yet to be decided ruling of the Ninth Circuit (which is likely to be more in accord with the Fourth Circuit than not). And, the option exists to wait until the Ninth Circuit decides. But, in any event, it is unlikely to be considered in a fast track special session, before customary adjournment.

    But, my view is that the initial vote of whether to let the travel ban take effect while the Court weighs the case, which takes five votes, is less likely. However, if the Court does vote to let the travel ban take effect, there is a better chance that the policy might be upheld later.

    My guess is that the President of Pittsburgh would prefer to have the travel ban go into effect; what happens later, after the TV cameras are gone, rallies are over, and time passes, is not as important to making America great again.


    The Supreme Court's general practice (none / 0) (#10)
    by Peter G on Fri Jun 02, 2017 at 03:17:58 PM EST
    is to defer on the question of a stay to the judgment of the two levels of lower federal courts, when those two (or, here, really four) lower courts are in full agreement with one another.

    More (5.00 / 1) (#16)
    by FlJoe on Fri Jun 02, 2017 at 04:59:14 PM EST
    from the quid meets quo files
    In the early weeks of the Trump administration, former Obama administration officials and State Department staffers fought an intense, behind-the-scenes battle to head off efforts by incoming officials to normalize relations with Russia, according to multiple sources familiar with the events.

    Unknown to the public at the time, top Trump administration officials, almost as soon as they took office, tasked State Department staffers with developing proposals for the lifting of economic sanctions, the return of diplomatic compounds and other steps to relieve tensions with Moscow.

    Named sources too!
    "There was serious consideration by the White House to unilaterally rescind the sanctions," said Dan Fried, a veteran State Department official who served as chief U.S. coordinator for sanctions policy until he retired in late February. He said in the first few weeks of the administration, he received several "panicky" calls from U.S. government officials who told him they had been directed to develop a sanctions-lifting package and imploring him, "Please, my God, can't you stop this?"
    Back Channel, front channel, around the world, these guys were pucker up for Putin  24/7.

    Kathy Griffin (5.00 / 1) (#36)
    by Ladyjustice on Sat Jun 03, 2017 at 08:36:35 AM EST
    I'm sorry but I'm with Kathy Griffin on this.  Bill Mahsr once said we need more Elliott Spitzers, more Anthony Weiners, more Keith Olbermans---people with spines who won't apologize for every human foible.  Could you imagine JFK apologizing for Marilyn or any others?  
    The only thing Repubs understand is outrageous. We need more outrageous against this POS, aka POTUS.  If KG is going to be the ONLY powerful voice making media headlines, in this outrageous way, I'm all in. I will RESIST in this way.  I look at KG as another true suffragette, willing to be fired and still continue to speak. I hope women will not have to again be ostracized and murdered for speaking her mind. She/we have been warned, but we WILL PERSIST.  

    I'm not happy with what Kathy Griffin did. (5.00 / 1) (#69)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Sat Jun 03, 2017 at 09:52:45 PM EST
    I thought it was over the top and offensive. But that said, the continued media pile-on is even more over the top and totally uncalled for, given the nature of the offense. She quickly apologized for her part in this misguided attempt at political shock humor within hours of the photo's release, and that really should've been the end of the story. It wasn't. Why?

    I mean, a right-wing millionaire rodeo clown running for federal office in Montana body-slams and punches out a reporter for asking a legitimate question, then publicly lies about the encounter, and only finally apologizes for it after he gets elected to Congress. Yet few people in the media are batting so much as an eyelash at it right now, even though it was one of their own who was victimized and the congressman-elect was charged with criminal assault. Where's the outrage there?

    The double standard at play here is appalling. And as CaptHowdy said earlier, nobody is holding the photographer accountable -- and given his earlier work (thanks, Cap'n), it was more likely than not his idea.



    Great distraction (5.00 / 2) (#75)
    by Lora on Sun Jun 04, 2017 at 11:59:44 AM EST
    Now everyone is all jazzed up about Kathy Griffin's head shot.  

    Good cover to draw heat away from the important stuff like the FBI, special prosecutor, Senate and House investigations of potential collusion with the Russians to elect Trump and get sanctions eased.


    it should be obvious (none / 0) (#37)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Jun 03, 2017 at 10:26:39 AM EST
    from my pervious comments about this i am sympathetic to this point of view.  and also clear im not sure this is a productive path.

    i thought this from Wyclef Jean was a useful and thoughtful take

    Wyclef Jean to anti-Trump celebs: `Be very careful'

    Wyclef Jean's advice for celebrities who want to get political: Don't be like Kathy Griffin.

    Read up, said the musician of Fugees fame, and one-time aspiring celebrity-turned-president himself. And if you're a high-profile person, think about how what you're doing and saying might be interpreted, or maybe misinterpreted.

    Otherwise, the cause you could just end up hurting the cause you think you're trying to help.

    "If you're the celebrity that's speaking based on emotion, you don't know what policy you're talking about, they're going to take that sound bite and make a whole movie out of it," Jean said, speaking to me for POLITICO's Off Message podcast. "So, I encourage every celebrity ... let's be as smart as [Jimmy] Kimmel."

    Though he says he feels obligated to give the president a chance, he can't stand what he's seen so far--like with the travel ban: "as someone who considers my group being Fugees, short for refugees, I find it crazy."

    She should just roll right over the top of it (none / 0) (#40)
    by Militarytracy on Sat Jun 03, 2017 at 10:48:16 AM EST
    Everyone is watching her next move. Kathy, Do it with Chelsea Handler and Sandra Bullock. We need a new getting slapped for peeing in the public shower skit. So much to work with there girls, so much to work with.

    IMO (none / 0) (#41)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Jun 03, 2017 at 11:04:34 AM EST
    its a mistake to ty to make this about gender.

    that said (none / 0) (#46)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Jun 03, 2017 at 11:51:04 AM EST
    if there is a gender angle IMO its one that has been largely ignored.

    the fact that all the scorn has been heaped on Griffin and basicaly none on the photographer Tyler Shields who has literally made his name on pushing the envelope with ever more outrageous photo shoots.

    which have included Griffin before.

    just sayin.


    Lindsey Lohan (none / 0) (#61)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Jun 03, 2017 at 03:14:28 PM EST
    The photographer made me do it (none / 0) (#71)
    by Lora on Sun Jun 04, 2017 at 08:25:52 AM EST
    Ummm :)

    I don't have much scorn for either (none / 0) (#80)
    by Militarytracy on Sun Jun 04, 2017 at 01:59:11 PM EST
    But I don't for just about any art form. Sometimes artists miss. They missed on this one. IMO only because it was too bloody looking really. If it had had a more clowning approach it would have probably gone unnoticed. He and his supporters are searching for anything though to cling to to feel victimized with. Bad timing.

    I went to a comedy show years ago, and the comedian on stage was trying to mimic Andrew Dice Clay. I didn't go specifically to see him, he was just in the line up. He picked me out of the audience and said, "Hey, didn't I pay you last night?" I still hate him. He didn't go anyplace, he is not famous, I still hate him. It was comedy, I went knowing comedians do things like that, he found my nerve though and I hate hate hate that guy. Still can't talk myself down from it.


    Wasn't making it about gender (none / 0) (#73)
    by Militarytracy on Sun Jun 04, 2017 at 10:17:10 AM EST
    Just one of my favorite skits about being a comedic disappointment that also involved peeing :) There are so many possibilities now for peeing.

    But she did apologize (none / 0) (#42)
    by McBain on Sat Jun 03, 2017 at 11:17:17 AM EST
    I found her apology to be worse than the photo.  Had she not apologized I would have more respect for her.  

    Could you imagine JFK apologizing for Marilyn or any others?

    I couldn't imagine JFK having to deal with media coverage like we have today.  Not only would it be much harder for him to hide his affairs, it would be difficult to hide his illnesses.  

    The 3rd of June... (5.00 / 2) (#58)
    by desertswine on Sat Jun 03, 2017 at 02:24:26 PM EST
    another sleepy, dusty, delta day.

    2016 illusion of the year (5.00 / 1) (#68)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Jun 03, 2017 at 07:14:13 PM EST

    Really the most amazing thing is the eye brows of the guy in the elbow video

    seriously tho (none / 0) (#76)
    by CaptHowdy on Sun Jun 04, 2017 at 12:00:21 PM EST
    im sure that is a really smart guy but i watched that like 3 times and i could not tell you a single thing he said because i could not tear one bit of my attention from the hynotic dance of the gigantic  Mothra caterpillars that live on his forehead.  i think it would be next to impossible for me to have a live conversation with this guy.

    that said those circle to square thing really made my head hurt.


    no weekend plans (none / 0) (#1)
    by CaptHowdy on Fri Jun 02, 2017 at 12:07:00 PM EST
    beyond the series finale of LEFTOVERS, The Son, Twin Peaks and AMERICAN GODS.

    but wow
    Putin is totally trolling Trump.  first givin an interview with Megan Kelly?  seriously?  is there a less favored American journalist?  and saying that "patriotic russians hacked the DNC?


    they IMO are clearly cutting their losses with the DOOMED tRump administration.

    and the (none / 0) (#2)
    by CaptHowdy on Fri Jun 02, 2017 at 12:13:51 PM EST
    season premier of THE WALKING DEAD

    I guess I'll watch that (none / 0) (#18)
    by McBain on Fri Jun 02, 2017 at 05:07:39 PM EST
    Last season was bad and that finale was ridiculous.  How did the tiger know who the bad guys were and why would it care?  And the garbage queen might be the worst character ever.  

    Fear the Walking Dead (none / 0) (#83)
    by KD on Sun Jun 04, 2017 at 03:25:07 PM EST
    It's the spinoff.

    mea culpa (none / 0) (#84)
    by CaptHowdy on Sun Jun 04, 2017 at 04:46:36 PM EST
    mea culpa

    maxima culpa mea

    so it it.


    Aloha from SoCal! (none / 0) (#23)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Fri Jun 02, 2017 at 06:41:53 PM EST
    We're going with my brother and his family tomorrow morning to the San Diego County Fair down in Del Mar. My wife just called her younger brother and his wife, who live in San Diego's Hillcrest District, and they're going to meet us there as well. I haven't been to a county fair in years. Should be a lot of fun.

    have fun, that does sound like fun (none / 0) (#24)
    by CaptHowdy on Fri Jun 02, 2017 at 06:55:09 PM EST
    im surprised how little i have ever missed SoCal.  course thanks to climate change we now have SoCal weather without the traffic or the a$$holes or the danger of falling into the pacific.

    there are the tornados, torrential rain, 80 MPH straight winds and hail but its always something


    ... throughout the region, SoCal will always hold an attraction for me. Funny, though, in that when I lived here, I couldn't wait to get away. Now that I live somewhere else, I'm a lot more cognizant of the region's inherent charms.

    But if I did have to live here again, I'd probably choose to reside closer to the ocean in one of the beach communities between Manhattan Beach and San Diego. Pasadena's a lot nicer now than it used to be back when I was a child, and today's trendy "Old Town Pasadena" was pretty run down and derelict back then.

    But it still gets awfully warm in the San Gabriel Valley during the summer, and I'm not a fan of triple-digit heat. (I've never understood why people love to live in Palm Springs.) It's not too bad today in the valley, though, with blue skies and 83 degrees.

    Have a great weekend.


    I miss Ocean Beach. (none / 0) (#29)
    by Chuck0 on Fri Jun 02, 2017 at 09:43:52 PM EST
    Best part of my life were the years living there (my 20s, then again s couple years in my late 30s).

    Ocean Beach? You lived right under ... (none / 0) (#30)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Fri Jun 02, 2017 at 10:16:00 PM EST
    ... the departure route for aircraft flying out of San Diego Int'l Airport. I have a friend who lives in South Park on the other side of Balboa Park near 29th St. and Cedar St., and his house is under SAN's short final route for arriving aircraft. Descending planes pass overhead all day and evening at about 1,000 feet above him. And every afternoon at about 4:00 p.m., there's a big British Airways B777 -- or occasionally, a B747 -- widebody aircraft that comes roaring in from the east, and the power in the engines is such that the house's windows rattle as it passes overhead. He insists that you get used to it after a while, but I don't know if that's something I'd want to get used to.

    Street Rod Nationals East this weekend. (none / 0) (#5)
    by Chuck0 on Fri Jun 02, 2017 at 12:46:52 PM EST
    Lots of cool hot rods and classic cars cruising the streets of York, PA.

    A little Tab Benoit... (none / 0) (#7)
    by kdog on Fri Jun 02, 2017 at 01:24:58 PM EST
    and his cajun blues stylings on tap tonight in Hipsterville Brooklyn USA.  Final tune up for the concert crew before the annual trek to Mountain Jam in two weeks.  Summer Concert Series 2017 kickin' into gear Baby!  

    In addition to kick arse guitar and vocals, Mr. Benoit is a dedicated environmental conservationist doing his part to preserve and protect Louisiana's wetlands...so he's an enemy of the current state, just like us.  We are the 80%!

    Tillerson (none / 0) (#13)
    by CaptHowdy on Fri Jun 02, 2017 at 04:17:00 PM EST
    was also absent fromthe rose garden.  its said he worked hard to stop this and is pretty pi$$ed.

    i heard a guy yesterday talking about why that is and it might not be about saving the planet.  he said oil companies have been taking a beating (relatively speaking to what they were taking in for a while) partly because of other competeing energy sources and that they had really thought that coal as something they had to compete with was in the rear view mirror.  all this talk about coal, he said, was the last thing they wanted to hear.

    Rex might be the first to have had enough.  Rexit.

    tRump (none / 0) (#14)
    by FlJoe on Fri Jun 02, 2017 at 04:26:13 PM EST
    unleashes a new swamp draining tool, the dreaded Retroactive Ethics Waiver.... the scum must be shivering in their ponds.

    swamp draining (none / 0) (#17)
    by CaptHowdy on Fri Jun 02, 2017 at 05:06:42 PM EST
    and the effect of climate change

    The New York billionaire is applying for permission to erect a coastal protection works to prevent erosion at his seaside golf resort, Trump International Golf Links & Hotel Ireland, in County Clare.

    A permit application for the wall, filed by Trump International Golf Links Ireland and reviewed by POLITICO, explicitly cites global warming and its consequences -- increased erosion due to rising sea levels and extreme weather this century -- as a chief justification for building the structure.



    its called a "free press" Sergey (none / 0) (#15)
    by CaptHowdy on Fri Jun 02, 2017 at 04:31:36 PM EST
    hows it working for ya
    Sergey Gorkov runs for cover

    Foghorn Sessions in the crosshairs (none / 0) (#19)
    by CaptHowdy on Fri Jun 02, 2017 at 05:38:41 PM EST
    There are so many (5.00 / 4) (#20)
    by Chuck0 on Fri Jun 02, 2017 at 06:17:41 PM EST
    turds in this punchbowl, I don't know who I will delight in see going down first. But I must say that seeing Jeff Sessions being perped walked on TV will make my life complete.

    the thing is (none / 0) (#21)
    by CaptHowdy on Fri Jun 02, 2017 at 06:22:07 PM EST
    Foghorn has officially and flatly denied this latest thing happened.  problem is its being leaked there is classified information that says otherwise.

    if thats true he could be charged with purgery.  and thats just the one i as a non lawyer know about.


    heh (none / 0) (#22)
    by CaptHowdy on Fri Jun 02, 2017 at 06:26:50 PM EST

    its a big bowl of terd punch and we are all gonna have to take a sip.


    Inventor of the modern day wetsuit died today (none / 0) (#27)
    by McBain on Fri Jun 02, 2017 at 08:02:14 PM EST
    Jack O'Neill, a giant in the surfing industry and the man credited with the invention of the modern-day wetsuit, died Friday at his home near Pleasure Point in Santa Cruz. He was 94.

    Santa Cruz is definitely an area where a wetsuit comes in handy.

    I guess I'm spoiled, living in Hawaii. (none / 0) (#31)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Fri Jun 02, 2017 at 10:23:41 PM EST
    Whenever I get into the ocean in SoCal, I find the water to be absolutely freezing. I didn't before, when I was growing up there. But the water temperature in Hawaii is about 20 degrees warmer, and I definitely notice the difference. Whenever I surf SoCal, I use a wetsuit.

    It is all what you are used to. (5.00 / 1) (#32)
    by caseyOR on Fri Jun 02, 2017 at 10:58:26 PM EST
    After freezing every body part in the Pacific Ocean at the Oregon coast, I found the waters off SoCal to be soothingly warm.

    Hawaiian waters are 80 degrees in summertime. (none / 0) (#34)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Sat Jun 03, 2017 at 02:07:04 AM EST
    San Diego waters, by contrast, are about 60 degrees, and of course, it gets colder the farther north you go.

    Once when I was in college at UW, there was an absolutely gorgeous and very warm summer day in Seattle where it was 90 which, as you well know, is blistering hot in the Northwest. So we decided to go to Alki Beach, which is the only sandy beach in the city.

    And I, being all of 18, was wondering why nobody was going in the water, so I got up and raced down and dove straight into Puget Sound. It was so friggin' cold, it was like I'd been instantly skinned alive. I mean, it HURT. Everybody had a good laugh at my expense.

    The only place in Seattle I ever swam at after that was Green Lake, which is much warmer than the Sound in the long days of summer.



    The ocean water temperature (none / 0) (#35)
    by fishcamp on Sat Jun 03, 2017 at 07:01:58 AM EST
    gets up to 90 degrees down here in the Florida keys by next month.

    im not a beach person (none / 0) (#38)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Jun 03, 2017 at 10:37:07 AM EST
    ive been know to say i would like the beach if it was paved.  got a thing about sand.   anyway.

    i would never get in the water off the LA beaches.  for the reason above but another.  very soon after i arrived in LA i had a close encounter with LA sea water.

    Digital Domain, the company i moved there to work for in 1993, is very close to the beach.  Venice Beach.  i rented a house on 7th street and rose ave 4 blocks from DD.  so i lived very close to the beach as well.  on the first afternoon i was there i walked down to the beach and out on a jetty, i think its called, to have a contmeplative sit and gaze out at the pacific.

    fine,  all is well.  so, im sitting there fully dressed and a monster wave come crashing in and soaks me head to toe.  not the first to have this happen no doubt.

    but heres the thing, by the time i walked the 7 blocks back home my clothes had dried with a crust so dense they would hardly bend.  and no, this was NOT just salt.  it was whatever.  whatthehellever is in that water.  it was gross.  it was disgusting.  i could not take a shower fast enough and that was the last time i got wet at venice beach.


    should mention (none / 0) (#39)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Jun 03, 2017 at 10:47:18 AM EST
    after soaking i noticed, with some horror, a group of drain pipes very near my perch.

    which was mere yards away from the most popular and populated part of Venice Beach.


    The Venice Beach area was always particularly prone to flooding during heavy winter rains, because it otherwise doesn't drain quickly. In fact, much of west and south L.A. is also susceptible to the same, which is why the U.S. Army Corps of Engineers substantively altered the state of the Los Angeles River flood plain after the disastrous floods of 1938. And that allowed the region's residential communities to be fully developed in the 1940s.

    It's a gorgeous day in Del Mar. And the wife is staring at me, so it's time to put the electronic devices away. I'm as bad as the kids.



    That's bizarre (none / 0) (#49)
    by Yman on Sat Jun 03, 2017 at 12:09:27 PM EST
    I'm curious what could've caused that kind of dense crust.  Weird.

    I'm just the opposite when it comes to the beach.  Usually spend most of the time in the water when it's not cold, but also love the feel of the warm sand.  We have friends from DC that come to visit in the summer and all 3 of the husbands HATE the sand.  They will go into the very shallow water when the kids are playing in it, but otherwise stay on beach chairs and 2 of them will even wear flip-flops/sandals or put a towel down for their feet.


    might also (none / 0) (#52)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Jun 03, 2017 at 01:16:45 PM EST
    be worth mentioning that was in the literal middle of the 1994 Northridge earthquake.  quite a story really.  i left Boston on Jan 17, as i remember, driving with a van load of pets and art having given the rest to the movers which was heading for Venice.  i said 1993.  actually i interviewed and was hired in 93, i arrived in Jan 94.  the earth quake happened when i was snowbound in a motel in Tennessee.  the tv made it look like LA was in ruins.  i could not go back.  i could reach no one.  phones were down.  i had no idea if i had a house to move into or a job to start but all i could do was go.  on my way in i drove right past the famous 18 wheeler on an island of freeway.

    i mention this because it occurred to me later it seems possible the quake caused "something" to be released into those drain pipes that might not normally be there.  

    whatever.  like i said.  not really a beach person anyway.


    Clearly memory fogged (none / 0) (#55)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Jun 03, 2017 at 01:42:05 PM EST
    Big surprise.

    Google just told me the quake was the 17th.  So I must have left Boston a day or two earlier.

    I do remember arriving early on the 20th.  While aftershocks were still happening


    San Diego water temp (none / 0) (#57)
    by MKS on Sat Jun 03, 2017 at 02:04:20 PM EST
    is cooler than LA and Orange County.

    I used to be a part time scuba instructor and the dives off of San Diego were the coldest.  I can still remember shivering in 48 degree water near one of the wrecks.   Just toughing it out to complete the dive in a wetsuit.

    Off of Orange County and LA, the water temp does average 60 but is easily doable in a wetsuit. 72 degrees is very warm for here.

    Oregon....dry suit diving.   Just very, very cold.

    San Diego is just colder than LA.....Air temp too.


    Agreed. San Diego waters are indeed cooler. (none / 0) (#82)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Sun Jun 04, 2017 at 03:23:10 PM EST
    I'm not sure why that's the case, but I think it's because the coastline at San Diego (La Jolla to Point Loma) protrudes out into the Pacific, relative to the rest of the SoCal coast. And there's also a deep underwater canyon off La Jolla which doesn't exist elsewhere along that coast, which might be a conduit for the funneling of colder deep ocean waters to the region's shoreline.

    Speaking as a surfer, I know that the waters off L.A.'s Palos Verdes Peninsula are also generally cooler than those off the neighboring South Bay communities and Long Beach, perhaps for the same reason. Those communities have an offshore shelf, and so the waters are shallower there than they are off Palos Verdes. Anyway, that my educated guess.

    We used to spend a lot of time at Estero Beach just south of Ensenada, B.C., where my aunt and uncle owned a beach house. I always found the waters in the Bahia de Todos Santos to be significantly warmer than those off of San Diego, even though Ensenada is just 70 miles south of there.



    Jam-packed weekend soaking (none / 0) (#33)
    by oculus on Sat Jun 03, 2017 at 12:45:30 AM EST
    up NYC culture. Love it.

    Help Wanted. (none / 0) (#43)
    by KeysDan on Sat Jun 03, 2017 at 11:27:55 AM EST
    George Conway, husband of alternate facts Kellyanne, has withdrawn from consideration to become head of DOJ's Civil Division--an office of about 1000 attorneys with a large range of responsibilities, including national security and actions of the president.  Mr. Conway cited his preference to spend more time with his family.

    James Donovan, Goldman Sachs executive, nominated as deputy secretary of the Treasury, dropped out just three days later, citing family considerations.

    Mark Green, TN legislator and ER medic, withdrew last month as prospective Secretary of the Army. Dr. Green said "tragically, my life in public service and my Christian beliefs have been attacked," apparently referring to his own statements on Islam, evolution, and gay rights. About 40 groups took issue with Dr. Green, and, many, seem to feel that his withdrawal was tragic, at all.

    Mark Green was the second nominee for the post, so far.  The first, Vinnie Viola, billionaire Wall Street trader, abruptly withdrew claiming it was too difficult to untangle his businesses.

    WH Communications Director, Mike Dubke, was noticed more by his departure from his three-month tenure than his arrival.  Mr. Dubke cited "personal reasons."

    Of course, the help wanted ads continue to seek a replacement for James Comey, who Trump described as a nut job and crazy.  The search has been reported as being "chaotic," with candidate interviews with Trump lasting just 10 minutes.  


    Bill Maher criticized for using N-word on show (none / 0) (#44)
    by McBain on Sat Jun 03, 2017 at 11:34:10 AM EST
    He's obviously trying to make a joke here.  I'm not sure what's going to happen... probably an apology.
    The quip drew a few laughs and several audible groans from Maher's live audience. Sasse appeared uncomfortable with the joke, but Maher continued with the segment.

    But on Twitter the outcry was near immediate. Many users called for the comedian's show to be canceled, while others pointed out that Maher has a history of toeing the line between comedy and insensitivity toward race and religion.

    There is no possible joke that (5.00 / 1) (#48)
    by caseyOR on Sat Jun 03, 2017 at 12:05:27 PM EST
    a white man can make using that word. Absolutely none. Maher is an assh**e who thinks racist comments are somehow "edgy" comedy. They are not.

    HBO will decide the best way for the corporation to respond to this. If HBO thinks he can weather this with little to no damage to the company brand Maher will keep his job.

    As for me, I can't stand him. His brand of humor, based on degradation, condescension, and just plain nastiness, does not appeal to me.


    Michael Richards (Kramer) paid the price (5.00 / 1) (#50)
    by McBain on Sat Jun 03, 2017 at 12:16:29 PM EST
    for trying to be edgy like that years ago.  

    I often watch Real Time but I'm not a big fan of Maher for many of the reasons you listed.  


    I can't stand him either (5.00 / 2) (#77)
    by Lora on Sun Jun 04, 2017 at 12:08:32 PM EST
    I've tried to watch Maher a few times but within about 5 minutes the misogyny comes through so loud and clear that I turn him off in disgust.

    Just watched last night's Realtime. (none / 0) (#63)
    by Chuck0 on Sat Jun 03, 2017 at 04:45:32 PM EST
    What a nothingburger! C'mon stop the faux liberal outrage. Again. Stop attacking your friends. You may not like Maher's sense of humor, but believe it or not, he's on our side. He hates tRump, I hate tRump. That works for me.

    I DVR the show (none / 0) (#65)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Jun 03, 2017 at 05:24:27 PM EST
    But I don't usually watch the panel part, sometimes depending on who is on, and the interview only depending on who it is.  Sasse did not interest me.

    I usually watch the opening monologue (which was great btw) then FF to the part where he has some kind of humor insert then FF again to NEW RULES.

    That's what I did here so I missed this until the kerfuffel erupted and I had to go back to the DVR.  Like you I was underwhelmed


    I do love that Sasse (5.00 / 1) (#66)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Jun 03, 2017 at 05:29:40 PM EST
    Sits there smilin when it happens but is now full of righteous indignation.  

    Now that everyone else is.  Talk about a nothing burger.  If you look up that term you might find his pic.  What a spineless wiener.  


    Bill Maher (5.00 / 2) (#51)
    by KeysDan on Sat Jun 03, 2017 at 01:11:46 PM EST
    didn't use the word to address anyone or anything. he put himself in an historically repressed role in response to Senator Sasse's cagey attack on "elites" as opposed to the hardworking Nebraskans who get their hands dirty with real work in real America.

    Sasse did not suggest that he come to see the nice campus at Lincoln or the major health science center at Omaha. Or even the country life of Ox Bow.

    The exchange was started with Bill's gracious treatment of the right wing senator, indicating that he should come to Nebraska.  Sasse responded by saying (paraphrase) good, come on over, we will put you in the fields. Learn what hard work is, although Sasse, the Harvard (BA), Yale (PhD) guy, is unlikely to offer much first-hand experiences. But, it would go a long way to justify his book pushing appearance on a lefty show that has swear words.

    Since the discussion was about climate change, Bill could have used the field reference to compare coal going to oil, natural gas and green energy with the loss of jobs and changes in agriculture over the past 100 years...less farm workers in Nebraska thanks to John Deere equipment.  Unless, Sasse wants to ban farm equipment to return jobs to the farm. And, I doubt that given his fondness for the Koch Brothers and Big Agriculture.

    Bill's response seemed to be intended to be funny and self-deprecating.  It turned out to be neither.

    There was some laughter from the audience from the  startling response, but it came across to me more as nervous and uncomfortable laughter. Use of the word is so degrading and insensitive, that Maher should have been able to respond in any number of different ways: such as, working in the fields, you mean like exploited immigrants.

    The panel and remainder of the show was particularly good.  Rebecca Traister (who authored the great article in New York magazine about Hillary Clinton, May 29-June 11) noted that Sasse was "smart and dangerous."

     Whether or not one appreciates Bill Maher, it is no time for divide and conquer.  The Republican specialty of "mistakes were made" should do.


    Sasse is dangerous. Smart, conventionally (5.00 / 1) (#53)
    by caseyOR on Sat Jun 03, 2017 at 01:31:49 PM EST
    good looking, critical of Trump without actually opposing his actions, good on TV.

    Sasse is getting ready for a run at the White House .


    Perhaps "mistakes were made"" (none / 0) (#54)
    by caseyOR on Sat Jun 03, 2017 at 01:35:29 PM EST
    would do if Maher did not have a history of this kind of thing. I do not believe my distaste for Maher rises to the level of aiding and abetting the GOP.

    Yes, he should have been able to respond in a number of different ways, but he didn't. This is just the way he rolls.


    i wouldnt hold my breath (none / 0) (#45)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Jun 03, 2017 at 11:36:58 AM EST
    well (none / 0) (#56)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Jun 03, 2017 at 02:02:57 PM EST
    look at that
    "Friday nights are always my worst night of sleep because I'm up reflecting on the things I should or shouldn't have said on my live show," Maher said in a brief statement Saturday. "Last night was a particularly long night as a I regret the word I used in the banter of a live moment. The word was offensive and I regret saying it and am very sorry."

    those who know Maher will insert an eye roll there at the end.


    I doubt he's a racist (none / 0) (#59)
    by McBain on Sat Jun 03, 2017 at 02:26:26 PM EST
    but this does seem like a bit of karma here.  He's been calling people who opposed Obama racists for years.



    ALL of them? (5.00 / 1) (#70)
    by Yman on Sun Jun 04, 2017 at 08:21:42 AM EST
    Because many of them are.

    And...? (5.00 / 4) (#72)
    by Repack Rider on Sun Jun 04, 2017 at 09:05:18 AM EST
    He's been calling people who opposed Obama racists for years.

    A blanket statement with no equivocation. Please supply a quote or a link in which Mr. Maher said that EVERYONE who opposed Obama was racist.

    Can't do it?  There's a surprise.

    Not everyone who opposed Obama was racist. You have to realize that stupidity is just as common as racism, and there is considerable overlap. But a significant percentage of the opposition was based on nothing else.

    It's not like the racism directed at Mr. Obama was muted, concealed, or any sort of secret.  It was open, loud and proud.  Every Confederate flag displayed between 2009 and 2016 was flown by a racist opponent of Mr. Obama, and there was no shortage of them.

    Any statement on the part of Mr. Maher attributing SOME of the opposition to Obama to racism is like pointing out that the sun comes up in the East. Most of the world already has this information.


    No the blanket statemetns are from Maher (none / 0) (#74)
    by McBain on Sun Jun 04, 2017 at 11:36:22 AM EST
    "I have to say, I know you hate to hear this Republicans, this is just, in their gut they want to feel `this is what Obama did to America,' " Mr. Maher said, Mediaite reported. "I know they don't think they're racist, but there is no other explanation for a delusion on this level."

    Where are your links and quotes, Repack?  Can you provide any information that proves your statements?

    Many Republicans, conservatives, Libertarians and moderates vote for a Republican candidate because of economic policies.  


    Seriously? (5.00 / 5) (#78)
    by Yman on Sun Jun 04, 2017 at 12:26:28 PM EST
    Thanks for the quote (5.00 / 1) (#79)
    by Repack Rider on Sun Jun 04, 2017 at 12:28:30 PM EST
    I don't see anything to argue with in Mr. Maher's statement.

    Do you?

    He was referring to the delusion that Mr. Obama had harmed America, not the opposition to Mr. Obama in general.  

    A delusion held by some, is not "all Republicans." A delusion does not refer to people, it refers to a state of mind held by some people.

    There is a difference, and I should not have had to explain it to you.

    Many Republicans, conservatives, Libertarians and moderates vote for a Republican candidate because of economic policies.

    Hurting poor people?  Sending jobs to other countries?  Denying medical care? I agree that while GOP economic policies aren't exactly racism, they accomplish the same goals racists would pursue.  They're just plain old cruelty and sadism that have a disproportionate effect on racial minorities.  

    If you wanted to be racist while disguising that intent, you could enact Republican policies. Is there any reason to respect that position?


    Repack Rider: "Hurting poor people?  Sending jobs to other countries?  Denying medical care? I agree that while GOP economic policies aren't exactly racism, they accomplish the same goals racists would pursue.  They're just plain old cruelty and sadism that have a disproportionate effect on racial minorities."

    ... by those regressive policies you cited are white, even as it disproportionally affects minority communities as you said. The supreme irony of it all is that many of those prospective white victims are die-hard political supporters of Trump and the GOP, who if given the opportunity would enact such draconian measures.

    And all Republicans had to do to garner that support was make people of color the poster children for the so-called "welfare state." Because while Republican leaders may be duplicitous, they're also not stupid. They recognized early on that by and large, white racists tend to be appallingly ignorant and fearful people. The GOP weaponized that ignorance and fear, merely by pandering to the white-wing's worst instincts about "The Others."

    Meet Arthur Christopher Schaper, an unemployed 36-year-old white male living in Torrance, CA who's president of the Beach Cities Republican Club and one of those aforementioned die-hard Trumpsters:

    "Schaper is involved with numerous right-wing groups, including MassResistance, an anti-LGBTQ organization that the Southern Poverty Law Center has labeled a hate group. He said financial support from MassResistance helps fund his activism.

    "He and roughly a dozen supporters and anti-illegal immigration activists have become a particularly unwelcome presence at city council meetings in places with large Latino immigrant populations such as Cudahy, El Monte and Huntington Park.

    "In recent weeks, they have shouted down a Riverside speech by state Senate leader Kevin de León (screaming 'Anchor baby!') and a Redondo Beach town hall by Democratic U.S. Rep. Ted Lieu.

    "They temporarily stopped an immigration town hall led by Rep. Lou Correa (D-Santa Ana) on May 30, interrupting his speech. Schaper got in Correa's face, recording video as he screamed about 'illegal aliens.' Three people -- including a man who hit a Trump supporter over the head with a flagpole bearing an anti-fascism banner -- were detained or arrested.

    "In March, they cut short an Ontario meeting led by California Atty. Gen. Xavier Becerra, then gathered at a Coco's Bakery afterward, vowing over dinner to 'take California back.' The fracas was gleefully covered by Breitbart."

    Regardless of whether or not Republican leaders choose to acknowledge it, Arthur Schaper and his merry band of white-wing ne'er do wells have become the angry face of today's GOP. (The Republican Party of Los Angeles County recently pulled the charter of Schaper's Beach Cities club after he instigated an altercation at Congresswoman Maxine Waters' office in L.A.)

    And yet those same Republican leaders will disingenuously wonder aloud why people of color aren't flocking to their banner, and will accuse those same minority citizens of "reverse discrimination," which only further fuels the rage of Schaper and othrs like him, who now constitute a majority of the GOP's base.



    republicans (5.00 / 1) (#88)
    by CaptHowdy on Sun Jun 04, 2017 at 06:35:57 PM EST
    have for decades been refining the art of getting people to vote against their own interest.  it is the story of the Southern Strategy.  it worked.  its working.

    They prefer small goverement and not (none / 0) (#96)
    by McBain on Sun Jun 04, 2017 at 11:43:09 PM EST
    giving away as much free stuff.  Big picture vs. small picture. Logic and common sense vs. emotion.  

    Yes I have a problem with that particular Maher statement.    


    More like your own fiction vs. actual fact. (5.00 / 3) (#98)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Mon Jun 05, 2017 at 05:35:29 AM EST
    McBain: "They prefer small government and not giving away as much free stuff. Big picture vs. small picture. Logic and common sense vs. emotion."

    Look, if you guys want to live in your own parallel universe full of black welfare queens having more babies just to get a bigger monthly check, that's fine. We can't do anything to stop you.

    But that universe doesn't have any relation to the reality that many poor people face, whether they're white, black, latino, Pacific Islander, or whatever. They're not getting "free stuff." They're barely eeking out a living in the face of little or no meaningful economic opportunity, underfunded schools and run-down communities. They are generally hardworking folks and are not freeloaders.

    I so happen to work within these communities in my profession, while you quite obviously don't. You ought to be grateful for the life of relative privilege you lead, rather than resent and begrudge others who are living in challenging circumstances what little they have. And for heaven's sake, stop dreaming up ways to make their lives even more miserable, because but for the grace of the Lord, there go you.

    Clean up your own act first, before you go telling others what they're doing wrong in their lives.

    Have a nice day.


    It's a different philosophy of what is best (none / 0) (#104)
    by McBain on Mon Jun 05, 2017 at 10:17:11 AM EST
    for the country in the long run.  It's why many people don't vote they way you want them too.  

    "Best for the country in the long run"? (5.00 / 1) (#109)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Mon Jun 05, 2017 at 01:01:59 PM EST
    That's less a philosophy than sheer personal hubris on your part. Were we better off in 2008 than we were in 2000? Hardly. Miring the country in two unwinnable wars AND crashing the economy is one helluva way to improve our fortunes.

    You just sit there in your privileged white bread suburban community, gorging yourself aurally upon a steady diet of manipulative AM radio squawk jocks, watching Fox News and your "48 Hours"-like crime shows on TV, and resenting people of color what little they have because you mistakenly believe that they're somehow taking something away from you.

    You don't have a clue as to what's best for the country in the long run, because you clearly don't know how either government or business actually functions.

    You trust authority figures to an alarmingly unhealthy degree, and you don't undertake to educate yourself or even ask questions about what's really going on, because you naturally assume that you already know better by virtue of your station in life -- even when the evidence is screaming at you otherwise.

    Nope, far better that you remain comfortably cocooned in your self-serving white suburban myths about the way things ought to be, than to have to confront some uncomfortable and ugly truths about the world around you.

    So, people like you keep telling yourselves and others that you'll always vote for "what's best for the country," rather than admit publicly or even privately to your own selves that your actual motivations when filling out your ballots are often far less altruistic.

    Have a wonderful day in Stepford.


    Childlike responses won't help you (none / 0) (#117)
    by McBain on Mon Jun 05, 2017 at 04:34:32 PM EST
    or the politicians you vote for.  

    You must learn to ignore your instincts because they're often wrong. I live in one of the most liberal, racially diverse areas on the planet.  I seek information from a variety of sources, not just one view.  

    If you consider yourself to be liberal, try acting like one and be a little more tolerant of other views.  Less hate, more understanding will do everyone soon good.    


    You have no idea what you're talking about. (5.00 / 2) (#118)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Mon Jun 05, 2017 at 05:15:29 PM EST
    I respect opinions that are thoughtful, knowledgeable and fact-based, all of which tend to reflect well on the person who's offering them. Yours are anything but that.

    You showed disdain for both fact and truth, and you insulted the intelligence of other people here, when you blithely offered your derogatory comment about the poor "getting free stuff" as you did above. That's a shopworn right-wing cliché which has no basis in evidence, and not some pearl of wisdom. Your basic understanding of government and public policy is at best shallow and ill-informed, and you're punching way above your weight class.

    Have a nice evening.


    Wrong again Donald (none / 0) (#123)
    by McBain on Mon Jun 05, 2017 at 09:32:35 PM EST
    I never said anything about "the poor".  

    I live a good life but in most years my income is low enough to qualify me for ACA subsidies.  The problem is, I don't need them.  Other people shouldn't have to pay more because I choose to work less.

    Then there's a friend of mine who stopped working in his 40s because he got "burned out".  He had a nice job and saved enough money to do OK for several years but now he's punishing 60 with virtually no income and very little savings. He pays nothing for his ACA premiums.  Are you OK with that? He chose not to work.

    I'm not expecting the Republican version to be much better but I'm hoping the subsidies/tax breaks won't be based on income.  


    All the more reason (none / 0) (#125)
    by Chuck0 on Tue Jun 06, 2017 at 08:50:16 AM EST
    to have FREE healthcare for all. Free, free, free. Give it away. Free for the workers, free for loafer, free for my 82 year old mother (cause you just KNOW she's loafing around the house all day).

    This always cracks me up (5.00 / 2) (#100)
    by Yman on Mon Jun 05, 2017 at 08:45:21 AM EST
    Logic and common sense vs. emotion.  

    The party of denialism, creationism and anti-intellectualism is the party that values "common sense" over emotion.



    How do they feel about this free stuff? (5.00 / 2) (#105)
    by Lora on Mon Jun 05, 2017 at 10:46:58 AM EST
    You and your "free stuff." (5.00 / 2) (#106)
    by Repack Rider on Mon Jun 05, 2017 at 11:32:42 AM EST
    They prefer small government and not giving away as much free stuff

    Didn't Jesus command us to take care of the sick and feed the poor?

    Is health care "free stuff?"  Every other industrial nation accepts health care as one of the reasons we band together in "governments."  People without insurance are forced to use the ER for treatment, which costs the taxpayers many times what it would cost to treat the same people in a clinic.  Why don't conservatives want to shrink THAT cost to taxpayers by using a method that works everywhere else in the world?

    Is Social Security, which I paid into for 40+ years, "free stuff?"

    Are roads and bridges "free stuff?'  Clean water?  Clean air?

    We dump more than half our budget into the military, which absorbs resources while producing nothing.  How many tractors or solar arrays could we pay for if we canceled one aircraft carrier?  We already own most of the aircraft carriers in the world, now as obsolete as battleships, but we still build them.



    Not "about half." 19% if you add in veterans benefits (4%).

    Most of the "free stuff" (33%) is SS, unemployment and labor.

    After that it's Medicare and health (28%).

    Military is next with its 15% (19% w/vet bennies.)

    According to this.


    Do the math (5.00 / 2) (#113)
    by Repack Rider on Mon Jun 05, 2017 at 02:41:15 PM EST
    Um, military takes up about 15% of fed budget

    How to lie with statistics 101.

    The military accounts for 54% of DISCRETIONARY spending, according to what I found online.  IOW, it's more than half of what Congress budgets every year.

    The 16% figure for military spending is based on a budget that includes spending that Congress does not control.  For example, your 16% military "budget" assigns 25% of the spending to Social Security, i.e. more than the military.  But SS is not paid out of the general fund, it is not part of the congressional budget like the military is, it is ITS OWN fund, paid out of payroll contributions, and not subject to congressional modification.

    By lumping two dissimilar budget items together you get to make a spurious claim.  How Republican of you.


    Well, you wrote this: (none / 0) (#116)
    by sarcastic unnamed one on Mon Jun 05, 2017 at 04:18:24 PM EST
    We dump more than half our budget into the military

    Which, of course, as I pointed out, is completely false.

    But now you tell us that what you really, really, meant was this:

    The military accounts for 54% of DISCRETIONARY spending

    And then you get all butthurt that you got called on your false claim. Heck, that's not even Republican nor Democratic of you, that's simply  puerile.


    To get the true "military spending" (none / 0) (#120)
    by Peter G on Mon Jun 05, 2017 at 07:36:27 PM EST
    figure, you also have to include the cost of servicing (paying interest on, to big banks and other investors in Treasury bills) that portion of the national debt which was incurred due to unfunded military spending.

    Now now Peter (5.00 / 1) (#121)
    by Militarytracy on Mon Jun 05, 2017 at 07:48:55 PM EST
    That is off the books

    I did not mean to say "unfunded" (none / 0) (#122)
    by Peter G on Mon Jun 05, 2017 at 09:13:00 PM EST
    I just meant to refer to "deficit spending" for wars.

    Those were on a credit card Peter :) (none / 0) (#124)
    by Militarytracy on Mon Jun 05, 2017 at 10:39:45 PM EST
    of the budget we can "ballpark" that portion of the national debt which was incurred due to unfunded military spending at 15%.

    Interest on debt is 7% of the budget, so 15% of 7% is 1%. Add that 1% to the 15% and you have Military spending at 16%.


    Sure, many vote (none / 0) (#110)
    by MKS on Mon Jun 05, 2017 at 01:05:53 PM EST
    for Trump because of the "economic" policies; or vote for the GOP for the same reason.

    The issue is that such voters do so in spite of the racism and bigotry of the candidates they vote for.

    This is the issue that infects Paul Ryan and all those "good" GOP officials who fail to meaningfully condemn or oppose Trump.  That is why even Trump's offenses in obstructing justice and giving away intelligence secrets to the Russians are worse than anything Nixon did, it would be a surprise to see the GOP Congress actually do anything to oppose Trump.

    Just like electing a GOP bully to the House who had assaulted, beaten and body slammed a reporter.  People who vote for GOP candidates have proven that they lack principles.  


    this seems somewhat uninformed (none / 0) (#60)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Jun 03, 2017 at 02:49:05 PM EST
    since 99% of the charges of racism against him have been from Muslims.  Just my opinion but he is not a racist.  

    as far as the use of that word, far be it from me to try to advise others on how and when to deploy their outrage.

    i will say that IMO one of the smartest and most effective things the gay movement ever did was to realize they were never going to stop people from using certain words.  and not only that the increasing volume of outrage at each usage only increased their power over them.

    so they instead embraced them and by doing so disarmed them.  this has to an extent been done within the black community with the word in question.  but it seems only they are allowed to use it.  shrug.


    Maher should've called Sasse (none / 0) (#64)
    by jondee on Sat Jun 03, 2017 at 05:12:00 PM EST
    on his laughable "work with us in the fields" bullsh*t.

    Sasse may know how to spread a lot of manure around, but that doesn't mean he ever, at any time, worked in any "fields."

    The GOP these days is top heavy with these oily suits from privileged backgrounds talk as if they was all borned in shotgun shacks and grew up huntin' and trappin' and knowin' all about gettin' yer hands dirty.


    He did (5.00 / 1) (#67)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Jun 03, 2017 at 05:36:48 PM EST
    That's exactly what he was doing.

    wow (none / 0) (#62)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Jun 03, 2017 at 03:50:51 PM EST
    that person i was calling out the other day for being unable to give any credit to Scarborough for his withering attacks on Trump has actually put up a nonjudgmental post about Banjo Boys Trump coverage.
    Scarborough Says Steve Bannon Is Leaking Kushner Russia Stories

    The White Princess (none / 0) (#85)
    by CaptHowdy on Sun Jun 04, 2017 at 05:34:24 PM EST
    fans of costume drama would probably like this.  its the story ot the reign of Henry VII, his (one) wife Elizabeth of York being the white princess.

    its very well done if not entirely historically accurate as far as i can tell from my limited WIKI knowledge of the real history.

    great performances including a great turn by Catelyn Stark as the mother of the king.


    the smartly placed it before AMERICAN GODS to hook people like me.  totally worked.

    Re: "The White Princess." (none / 0) (#86)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Sun Jun 04, 2017 at 05:39:15 PM EST
    When I saw the tag line, my very first thought was of Ivanka Trump. Silly me.

    Beige Princess (none / 0) (#87)
    by CaptHowdy on Sun Jun 04, 2017 at 06:08:06 PM EST
    at best.  

    Based on Philippa Gregory's work (none / 0) (#89)
    by Militarytracy on Sun Jun 04, 2017 at 09:32:49 PM EST
    It was good, but I liked the White Queen series better. The White Queen was based on 4 of her books. She writes historical fiction about women, since the women's stories were mostly not recorded. The White Queen addressed the cousin wars from the perspectives of 4 different women.

    The White Princess just 1 perspective. Things that differed from the book. Elizabeth never openly acknowledged to anyone that she knew Perkin was her brother Richard. The King's mother never admitted to murdering little Edward in the Tower. And there was no initial stand in hung in Perkin/Richard's place. The Earl of Warwick died alone. His cousin was not there to comfort him. But in the book he did not seem to understand they were ending his life at his beheading.

    And the Tudor line died out. Stewarts took the English throne.


    Oops Stuarts (none / 0) (#90)
    by Militarytracy on Sun Jun 04, 2017 at 09:52:44 PM EST
    LEFTOVERS (none / 0) (#91)
    by CaptHowdy on Sun Jun 04, 2017 at 10:20:02 PM EST
    I am not a person who get misty eyed watching dramatized romance.  
    i just not.  never.
    but i totally got misty watching the finale.  it was so good.  so well done.  Carrie Coon is just amazing.  and the guy too (whos name escapes me).  so good.

    a perfect ending to a near perfect story,


    I have not watched this season (none / 0) (#93)
    by Militarytracy on Sun Jun 04, 2017 at 10:33:28 PM EST
    It's recorded. Between Trump and preparing home for sale, and moving I couldn't give it the focus that it obviously deserved. I was losing track of story lines, seemed like that was not going to do me a service. So saving it for after the move. It jumps around so much my husband doesn't  watch it. But he can track American Gods just fine while I miss the gist sometimes there.

    I did put on the new House of Cards last night when I couldn't sleep. 3 episodes in and I thought Jesus this is boring. A Trump White House makes the Underwoods a couple of snowflakes :)


    i wonder (none / 0) (#92)
    by CaptHowdy on Sun Jun 04, 2017 at 10:21:47 PM EST
    if there will be another season.   lots more to the story.  Arthur dies after marrying the Spanish princess,  chaos ensues.

    so wiki tells me.


    A bit more in the book (none / 0) (#94)
    by Militarytracy on Sun Jun 04, 2017 at 10:47:44 PM EST
    She goes into Elizabeth dying in childbirth trying to produce another prince for the Tudor line after Arthur passes. And she touches on how this is part of what damaged Henry VIII. He was close to his mother. Felt like her later in life pregnancy (she was 37) and her death a senseless loss.

    Gregory's best work so far IMO was Cleopatra. Read that on oculus' recommendation. What a work, lots of research notes too

    She wrote The Other Boleyn Girl. I have not read it yet. Should have, but somehow it gets pushed aside.


    may have asked you this before (5.00 / 1) (#101)
    by CaptHowdy on Mon Jun 05, 2017 at 09:27:51 AM EST
    ever read "The Mists od Avalon"?

    one of the few books ive read more than once.  the Legend of King Arthur told from the point of view of the women in the story.  Morgan is the protagonist.


    Mists of Avalon also is one of my favorites (5.00 / 1) (#127)
    by Towanda on Tue Jun 06, 2017 at 03:05:42 PM EST
    although my heart already had gone to Once and Future King -- and the final part of it, the Book of Merlin, published later owing to the context of the times of the first book, the eve of Wolrd War II.  Knowing that context adds much to reading all of it, the increasing sense of doom and darkness in Camelot, inspiring the musical ofmthat name.  But the first part is the absolutely delightful first part that became better known as the children's story, The Sword and the Stone.

    But then to read Mists of Avalon, retelling the story from women's perspective, actually taught me about inherent bias of sources. (Another favorite for that turnabout is Wicked and its sequels, as I also loved and read all dozens of the Wizard of Oz books . . . but ought to have suspected that Glinda the Good Witch really was just one of those mean girls.)

    And The Once and Future King as well as Mists of Avalon led me to many more books about the myth  . . . and the history that suggests the reality of the local King who gave rise to the marvelous Arthurian legend that has enthralled readers for a millennium.


    I haven't read the Mists of Avalon (none / 0) (#102)
    by Militarytracy on Mon Jun 05, 2017 at 10:03:16 AM EST
    But my daughter did. I think there was a series involving that book. She loved them. And she talked about it a lot with her dad, he loves all that King Arthur stuff.

    What I know about King Arthur? In the White Princess and real life, Henry VII's first born was named Arthur in an attempt to rip off the legend. The Tudor claim to the throne was sullied by Queen Catherine secretly marrying Owen Tudor after the death of her husband....not noble enough Owen impregnated her (supposedly). So when Tudor took the throne, a son King Arthur following him was hoped to secure Tudor rule in the minds of Englishmen.

    Donald Trump calls this "branding" ;)


    Marion Zimmer Bradley (none / 0) (#107)
    by CaptHowdy on Mon Jun 05, 2017 at 11:50:08 AM EST

    read it.


    btw (none / 0) (#108)
    by CaptHowdy on Mon Jun 05, 2017 at 12:28:59 PM EST
    but who is not?

    Just as well, I think. (none / 0) (#95)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Sun Jun 04, 2017 at 11:18:20 PM EST
    With the exception of Elizabeth I, the Tudors were probably not the best monarchs England had, and the entire family was a rather ruthless lot.

    Henry VIII, who greatly expanded the royal prerogative during his 38-year reign, was arguably the biggest tyrant in British history. In his very first act as sovereign at the age of 18, just to show everyone who was in charge, he had two of his late father's ministers, Sir Richard Empson and Edmund Dudley, arrested and charged with high treason.

    Both Empson and Dudley were subsequently executed the following year without benefit of trial, for the new king had introduced a writ of attainder to that effect, which he then bullied members of Parliament into approving. They were certainly not the last to be sent to the block during his despotic rule.

    Executions, primarily by beheading and occasionally by burning at the stake, quickly became Henry VIII's favored means for dealing those persons whom he perceived as being in his way and / or thwarting his desires. As is well known, he disposed of two of his queens in this manner. In some cases, he had relatives arrested and executed as well, for the mere crime of being related to the person who had incurred the king's disfavor.

    Even those ministers who labored mightily on the king's behalf, such as Chief Minister Thomas Cromwell, were not immune from His Majesty's mercurial wrath. Cromwell had arranged for Henry VIII's 4th marriage to Anne of Cleves, but the king found her unattractive and blamed his first minister, who was quickly arrested under a writ of attainder and executed for treason and heresy in July 1540. The king later regretted his hasty decision and apologized to his late minister's family.

    Henry VIII was a true scoundrel for his times. No doubt that on the occasion of his death at age 55 in January 1547, a not-insignificant number of people in England breathed a sigh of relief.



    Phillipa Gregory implies that Henry VII (none / 0) (#97)
    by Militarytracy on Mon Jun 05, 2017 at 12:00:48 AM EST
    Was paranoid as all get out. Taxed everyone to the breaking point too. His Uncle Henry VI seemed to be a royal SOB as well who mentally snapped. I wonder if there wasn't some inherited issues? And Henry VII mum Margaret Beaufort appears to have been a real lunatic as well, seeing visions from God and what not. Being married off and giving birth at 14 couldn't have helped. And all that inbreeding :)

    Margaret Beaufort was a very powerful woman. (none / 0) (#99)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Mon Jun 05, 2017 at 06:15:10 AM EST
    It was Lady Margaret who secured the English throne for her son Henry Tudor (later Henry VII), by orchestrating a strategic alliance with the Tudors' erstwhile rivals, the House of York. And it was that alliance which ultimately landed King Richard III under a parking lot in Leicester.

    Richard's army was defeated by the combined York-Tudor forces at the Battle of Bosworth Field in 1485, in what was the climactic campaign in the War of the Roses. He was killed in that battle, and after his body was put on display to prove to everyone that he was dead, he was buried in Leicester and his grave was ultimately lost as the town developed, hence the discovery of his remains under that parking lot in 2012. Once Richard was gone, Henry VII took the throne.

    Richard III was reburied with full royal honors at Leicester Cathedral in August 2015.



    Time. But that's not very powerful in modern understanding. Buckingham was much more a force getting Henry to the throne along with Margaret's husband Stanley. The Stanley's always wielded enormous power during the cousin wars. Commanded armies that could be for or against you, and you wouldn't know until you took to the battlefield. Real first class political manipulators

    Most manor houses in England at the time ... (none / 0) (#112)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Mon Jun 05, 2017 at 01:44:00 PM EST
    ... were entirely self-serving, because the reach o the Crown was far less extensive. Most barons called their own shots, because for the most part manor houses had to be self-sufficient. While they may have professed fealty to the Crown, for all practical purposes they were on their own.

    Lords Buckingham and Stanley may have had the titles and the foot soldiers, but Margaret possessed the personal connections to build the alliances that were necessary to eventually overcome their adversaries. Foremost amongst those adversaries was the late King Edward IV's duplicitous brother Richard, Duke of Gloucester, who betrayed young Edward V in 1483 and seized the kingdom for himself as Richard III.

    Once Richard was killed and Henry VII and his successors occupied the throne, the Tudors aggressively consolidated power and authority in the Crown and brought the nobility to heel. If nothing else, they brought a modicum of political stability to England that was sorely needed at the time. But such stability came with a hefty price tag.

    These were ruthless people, because at that level and time they had to be. If you backed the wrong side or faction, the consequences were often fierce. The once-powerful House of Lancaster became extinct as a direct result of the War of the Roses. That's why many nobles kept their presence at Court to a minimum and avoided the palace intrigue altogether if they could. It's hard to draw His Majesty's attention and ire, when you're not in his line of sight personally.



    Stanleys didn't enter the battlefield though (none / 0) (#114)
    by Militarytracy on Mon Jun 05, 2017 at 03:18:07 PM EST
    Until Richard appeared to have over exposed himself. Richard unhorsed to go directly after Henry, who was not fighting and laying behind his Uncle Jasper and his men. Richard left the saddle and chased Henry on the ground, killed two men Henry was hiding behind.

    Then Stanley took the field, because Richard was overly exposed and likely to be killed before Henry. So get out there and fight for Henry. He didn't fight for anyone though until it looked bad for Richard. And Richard's goal was simply to kill Henry, war over.

    These conclusions drawn from notes of those who were at the battle that day. Not the "official" Tudor version.


    The Stanleys are an enigma. (none / 0) (#119)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Mon Jun 05, 2017 at 07:08:58 PM EST
    While Sir William Stanley was a professed Yorkist and supporter of Richard III, his older brother Lord Thomas Stanley was less so inclined. While Sir William initially declined to join Buckingham's 1483 rebellion against the Crown, contemporaneous accounts suggest that there was no love lost between Lord Thomas and the king.

    But because the outcome of the conflict between the Tudors and King Richard was still very much in doubt, the Stanleys initially declined to take sides, as did other noble families at the time. Can't say as I blame them. If they chose wrong, their lives and property would be forfeit and their families left destitute.

    But Richard clearly erred when he took Lord Stanley's son Lord Strange hostage just prior to the Battle of Bosworth Field, as an inducement for the father to join his side against the Tudors. It had the opposite effect. Lord Stanley merely sent word to Richard that he had other sons. So, it's pretty apparent that as William and Thomas Stanley and their men marched to Bosworth, if they were going to intervene on anyone's side in the forthcoming battle, it would be on the Tudors' behalf.

    Richard III's army at Bosworth Field was far larger and much better armed than the Tudor forces. (They had cannons, which the Tudors did not.) His impetuous decision to personally lead a charge with his own small contingent of mounted men directly at Henry Tudor was an extraordinarily reckless and unnecessary gamble, because as you noted, he had foolishly rendered himself exposed. The king's main force was too far away to come to his immediate assistance when William Stanley and his men intervened to save Tudor, and Richard and his men were driven back against a marsh.

    Whether Richard had actually dismounted to pursue Henry Tudor personally may be somewhat ambiguous. One account says that he killed the two men who were guarding Tudor with a lance, which suggests that he may have still been on horseback. And per Michael Jones' and Phillipa Langley's 2013 book "The Search for Richard III" (what's with all these authors named Phillipa?), after they had been driven back, Richard's horse lost its footing in the swampy ground and fell, unseating the king, who then was quickly surrounded by Sir William's men and killed.

    Upon hearing word that Richard was dead, his allies the Dukes of Northumberland and Norfolk quit the field and fled north. Norfolk was also killed shortly thereafter and Northumberland imprisoned, and Henry Tudor was master of England. After he was crowned as Henry VII, Sir William and Lord Thomas Stanley were generously rewarded for their decisive (if somewhat opportunistic) intervention at Bosworth Field.

    A post-mortem examination was performed in 2013 on Richard III's remains, after they were discovered under that Leicester parking lot the year prior. It revealed that he had suffered two wounds to the torso and eight wounds to the head which were clearly inflicted in battle, and further suggested that he had likely been surrounded by his enemies and had probably lost his helmet at that point, perhaps when (or if) he fell from his horse. One blow from a heavy sword blade had cleaved the rear of the king's skull.

    As you've no doubt discovered, the Tudors are a fascinating subject of study and a great topic for discussion. I hope you enjoy reading more about them. And if you have time and haven't seen it, I'd also recommend the six-part PBS miniseries "Wolf Hall," which stars Oscar winner Mark Rylance ("Bridge of Spies") as Sir Thomas Cromwell and centers on his own tempestuous relationship as First Minister with Henry VIII. It's excellent.



    Margaret of Anjou could and (none / 0) (#115)
    by Militarytracy on Mon Jun 05, 2017 at 03:24:23 PM EST
    Elizabeth Woodville through connections in Burgundy could raise armies, Margaret Beaufort not so much.

    I want to have Angus King's babies (none / 0) (#128)
    by Militarytracy on Wed Jun 07, 2017 at 10:48:07 AM EST
    But that boat has sailed :(

    Angus King rocks (none / 0) (#129)
    by CaptHowdy on Wed Jun 07, 2017 at 11:35:19 AM EST
    Kamala Harris rocks.

    everyone should watch Morning Joe tomorrow.


    And once (none / 0) (#130)
    by Ga6thDem on Wed Jun 07, 2017 at 12:09:22 PM EST
    again the little lady, Kamala Harris, basically gets told to shut up and sit down.

    I will try (none / 0) (#131)
    by Militarytracy on Wed Jun 07, 2017 at 12:25:16 PM EST
    Nobody denied the WaPo story. As terrible as their joint contempt in not answering was, I forgot that Trump had proposed to have that Stephen A. Feinberg puke overlord the intelligence community. Trump could do some $hit. They say they've never felt threatened, okay.

    Are they all crooks? I don't think so. I think they are doing everything they can to take Trump down without triggering him to go all out lawless and really jack us all up.

    Thank God for Angus though