Wednesday Open Thread

Thanks to all who donated to TalkLeft yesterday -- please keep the contributions coming, they are a huge help!

Articles I recommend reading:

  • Reuters: Ivanka and Fugitive From Panama
    Exclusive: How an alleged fraudster in Panama, working with Donald Trump's daughter, helped make Trump's first international hotel venture a success. The broker was in business with a money-launderer and two criminals from the former Soviet Union. Then he fled.
  • The ramped up security and forced removal of beggars in Hyderabad, India in preparation for Ivanka's visit next week, where she will resume her role as the Administration's spokeswoman for empowering female entrepreneurs.
    A US Secret Service team has made several rounds of visits to the hotels and the GES venue and reviewed security arrangements for Ivanka. They would bring their own bullet-proof vehicles for Ivanka to travel within Hyderabad, besides carrying their own specialised weapons and bringing squads of trained sniffer dogs.

Even worse, the local government is now accused of killing stray dogs in preparation for her visit.

Local police say the Secret Service is "peppering them with unacceptable demands."

How bizarre is this?

The police have already conducted a cordon and search operation in Falaknuma and advised nearly 3,500 residential areas to not allow strangers or their relatives and friends to come to their houses during this period.

When the event was first announced, one Indian diplomat compared her to a "half-witted Saudi Prince."

There are also articles on the Trump Organizations' falling business numbers, based on the new list from Crain's.

That might be the key to Trump leaving the office early: If his sons prove incapable of managing the family business, maybe he'll feel the need to step back into it. One can hope.

Once again, here is what will be the new site, so don't forget to register. And since it's Thanksgiving, and we all need a little appreciation, please consider a donation.

This is an open thread, all topics welcome.

< Donald Trump: An Exhaustive List of You Know What | Thanksgiving Open Thread: Alice's Restaurant Edition >
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  • Display: Sort:
    Jeralyn, what is the mailing address (5.00 / 1) (#1)
    by caseyOR on Wed Nov 22, 2017 at 01:50:46 PM EST
    for those who want to send a check instead of using PayPal?

    I'm sure that J's office address (none / 0) (#17)
    by Peter G on Thu Nov 23, 2017 at 09:59:58 PM EST
    I stumbled across (none / 0) (#2)
    by Repack Rider on Wed Nov 22, 2017 at 02:15:05 PM EST
    ...a website devoted to collecting all the news on the Russia investigation.

    Committee to investigate Russia

    Rob Reiner (none / 0) (#4)
    by CaptHowdy on Wed Nov 22, 2017 at 02:48:34 PM EST
    Morgan Freeman and others plus Max Boot and lots of other never Trump republicans.

    I posted about this when it went online.

    Very good thing.


    I (none / 0) (#6)
    by FlJoe on Wed Nov 22, 2017 at 03:29:28 PM EST
    don't know how I missed this, I've beenall about the Russia thing, I have found most of this info elsewhere but this looks a great resource, with a lot of data in one place.

    Here's a thought for India. (none / 0) (#3)
    by Chuck0 on Wed Nov 22, 2017 at 02:15:20 PM EST
    Refuse her entry into the country. The US does it often enough. I doubt she has much to offer anyway.

    A Thanksgiving Fastee (none / 0) (#5)
    by CaptHowdy on Wed Nov 22, 2017 at 03:00:09 PM EST
    You may be like me.  Thanksgiving is a mixed blessing.  I love seeing some of my family and I hate seeing the rest of my family.

    I found a solution this year.

    My sister has not been well.  Who is one of the love to see family.  Her husband too.  Sort of.
    Anyway my sister's children and their children are the ones I hate.  In fact I have skipped Thanksgiving with the last 2 years just because I refuse.
    The thing is they don't really enjoy seeing them any more, well much more, than I do but it's, you know Thanksgiving.  What a you gonna do?

    Last weekend I called my brother in law and said, here's the plan.  Call them and say my sister is not up to it.  That you guys are not going to cook.  That you are just going to get food from the school or the church or where ever.  There are several places.  Since they are to lazy to do anything else they will do the same since the only reason they come is for the food.

    What you will forget to tell them is that I will show up "unexpectedly" at your house early tomorrow morning and make Thanksgiving dinner for the 3 of us.

    Having just read (none / 0) (#8)
    by Towanda on Wed Nov 22, 2017 at 06:40:57 PM EST
    the seventy-eleventh email to snf from my fsmily about who is bringing what,-- withthe usual lecture from the gluten-free niece about everything that we ought not bring -- c'mon, some of these dishes are traditinal, and with dozens of  dishrs from which to choose, she can fill a gliten-free plate just fine; aftr all, the vegans among is do not ban turkey, and the others of us with dietary restrictions, like me, jusst figure it out (I cannot have bro. Oli, and I figure that just leaves more room for more dessert) . . . well, I like your plan to skip the organizing for weeks now.

    Just focus on the day, I say, and all fo which I can be thwnkful.  Such as that the Republicans in the family live too far to come home here.


    Ha (none / 0) (#9)
    by CaptHowdy on Wed Nov 22, 2017 at 07:00:50 PM EST
    I always laugh when people talk about Thanksgiving with the  crazy uncle who listens to Limbaugh and forwards chain emails.

    Well, I'm the crazy uncle who listens to Maddow and hangs out at TalkLEFT


    I'll be here until mid to late afternoon (5.00 / 1) (#12)
    by Jeralyn on Wed Nov 22, 2017 at 08:10:21 PM EST
    and again at night. The TL kids have so many parents they have to stop at each with the baby. They are going to pick me up mid to late afternoon and we'll go to Ms. TL kid's parents' home (my third year in a row) for a very traditional Thanksgiving dinner.  I bring the pies and ice cream. This year I got a cherry pie, a pecan pie and a pumpkin pie, and 1/2 gallon of organic vanilla ice cream and another one of coffee ice cream. No, I didn't cook them, but they are specialty (not supermarket) pies and much better than anything I could cook.

    I don't think I would enjoy Thanksgiving with 20 relatives like my family had when I was a kid. I remember it would take an hour to drive from our house in Westchester to my aunt's house on Long Island. It would take more hours for the food to be served, there were great uncles and aunts and cousins we only saw once a year, dinner was consumed in 10 minutes, and then there was a mess to clean up. Then the long drive home. I would be exhausted and except for my great uncle Lou who was a pretty famous children's magician and always pulled quarters out from behind our ears, it wasn't much fun. At least I have all my grandmother's recipes, hand written by my mother, from sweet potato pudding to noodle kugel.

    I'll be putting up a Thanksgiving Day open thread late tonight -- I love reading everyone's comments about how their day went and what they ate.

    And don't forget to listen to the long verison of Alice's Restaurant on the radio. KBCO  in Boulder is playing it twice, at noon and 6 pm. You can listen online here.


    I have a brother and a sister here (none / 0) (#10)
    by CaptHowdy on Wed Nov 22, 2017 at 07:07:48 PM EST
    And they usually do not do thanksgiving together.  They each do it with their extended families.  So I have a choice of Alex Jones and Rush Limbaugh or James Dobson and Tony Perkins.

    For the last couple of years I have passed on both.

    My sister and her husband are old school democrats.  They have been involved in state and local politics pretty much forever.  My brother in law was an elected democrat until he retired.

    We often muse a out they went do wrong as parents to raise two Alex Jones and Rush Limbaugh fans.


    Watched the Netflix documentary (none / 0) (#7)
    by McBain on Wed Nov 22, 2017 at 05:11:04 PM EST
    Let It Fall... about the 1992 LA riots.  I thought it was excellent, good interviews with people directly involved.  Brought back memories from 1982-1992 I had forgotten, like the Latasha Harlins shooting.

    One thing for sure, former LA Police Chief Daryl Gates did not come across well. I'm not sure what to think about Lieutenant Michael Moulin who unsuccessfully sued Gates for slander.  His controversial decision to order cops to leave the riot was criticized by Gates and others.  

    Coalition Talks Collapse (none / 0) (#11)
    by linea on Wed Nov 22, 2017 at 07:37:28 PM EST
    spiegel.de (english)
    Germany Wins, Merkel Loses

    By walking away from the talks, the FDP made a contribution to political clarity in Germany - even if that wasn't the party's intention. Those who vote for the Greens aren't generally hoping for a coalition with the FDP, while supporters of the CSU tend to have nothing but disdain for the Greens.... Calling new elections would be akin to forcing voters into detention until they produce a result agreeable to the political apparatus. And were that to happen, it seems likely that the right-wing populist Alternative for Germany (AfD) would be one of the only parties to profit.

    huffingtonpost (none / 0) (#13)
    by linea on Wed Nov 22, 2017 at 10:11:44 PM EST
    and 36 women from SNL (5.00 / 1) (#15)
    by Jeralyn on Thu Nov 23, 2017 at 04:08:41 PM EST
    wrote a letter defending him.

    Don't guilt-monger here.

    Not (none / 0) (#14)
    by FlJoe on Thu Nov 23, 2017 at 10:08:23 AM EST
    a big fan of anonymity for allegations like this, but the reporting seems solid. I have now seen enough to sadly conclude that Franken is indeed a serial groper (I still think Tweeden is lying).

    This story does point out some fascinating details of societal/political/sexual dynamics of the recent past.

    The first woman, a 38-year-old book editor who was living in Minneapolis at the time, told HuffPost that she had just finished performing with a feminist choir at the Women's Political Caucus event, which Franken and his wife, Franni Bryson, attended. After the ceremony, she and other members of the choir approached him for photos.
    I will take a WAG and presume that this choir was not composed of subservient types yet they seemed to default to the typical male talking points
    One fellow choir member, Sarah, remembers not only being there for the groping incident but hearing another choir member say that Franken wouldn't stop looking at her chest.

    Ten years ago, it was easier to shrug off predatory behavior as "boys being boys," Sarah said, especially when that predatory behavior came from a political ally.

    Sounds a lot like the tribalism that got tRump and possibly Moore elected. "I know he's a creep, but he's our creep"

    The victim herself  "I'm a liberal person. ... I voted for him after this happened." Was this a vote for the lesser of two evils or an affirmative vote for a flawed but immensely useful ally? I lean toward the latter.

    To me this story it's rather indicative of the incredibly narrow line women have always been forced to walk in this society of the males, by the males and for the males (and man how we have fkd it up).


    this looks promising (none / 0) (#16)
    by linea on Thu Nov 23, 2017 at 08:11:48 PM EST
    The Brady Center to Prevent Gun Violence and Eglet Prince Law Firm have filed a class action lawsuit against the makers and sellers of bump stocks

    It's normally difficult to win lawsuits against the gun industry for making or selling products that are used to commit crimes. That's because, in 2005, President George W. Bush signed the Protection of Lawful Commerce in Arms Act (PLCAA), which gives firearms and ammunition manufacturers and retailers broad immunities from civil liability. In this instance though, the suit isn't against a gun manufacturer.... Without that immunity, Slide Fire faces potentially the largest lawsuit the shooting industry has ever seen. "This is a class that could be over 20,000 people," says Jonathan Lowy, Vice President of the Brady Campaign's Legal Action Project. "We expect the damages to be very, very significant."

    i hope they lose (none / 0) (#18)
    by Jeralyn on Fri Nov 24, 2017 at 09:38:01 AM EST
    i oppose the brady center, always have

    When you learn of the latest (none / 0) (#19)
    by oculus on Fri Nov 24, 2017 at 01:05:33 PM EST
    report of multiple lives lost to a person wielding a firearm, what is your immediate reaction?

    I give thanks (5.00 / 1) (#20)
    by Repack Rider on Fri Nov 24, 2017 at 11:02:39 PM EST
    ...to Congress for their thoughts and prayers.  Without those, think how much worse it would have been.

    Neighbor mistakes naeighbor (none / 0) (#21)
    by oculus on Sat Nov 25, 2017 at 12:29:00 AM EST
    for a deer at 200 yds.  Kills her w/his pistol shot.

    what (none / 0) (#22)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Nov 25, 2017 at 09:57:34 AM EST
    is your solution to that unfortunate story.

    please share.


    Mandatory training ... (5.00 / 3) (#34)
    by Yman on Sat Nov 25, 2017 at 04:16:55 PM EST
    ... for anyone who owns a gun.  Severe penalties (civil and criminal) for anyone who kills someone negligently.

    Plus, I'm not buying the guys story of hunting a deer from 200 yards with a handgun.


    Works for me (none / 0) (#35)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Nov 25, 2017 at 04:26:18 PM EST
    I personally got several days of training from my law enforcement nephew before he would give it to me.

    And I agree with you about the long shot.  If true it's like that story of the guy who shot someone falling past his window while cleaning his gun.


    Hmm, interesting point (none / 0) (#38)
    by MKS on Sat Nov 25, 2017 at 06:09:30 PM EST
    Arm the deer (none / 0) (#23)
    by MKS on Sat Nov 25, 2017 at 10:30:41 AM EST
    so they can be protected too.....

    i feed the deer (1.50 / 2) (#24)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Nov 25, 2017 at 10:38:54 AM EST
    i have a salt lick in my yard.

    i love and enjoy them.

    hunting is not allowed in my area.

    i have no controll at all over crazy people who shoot their neighbor thinking they are a deer.

    that said.

    i have a hand gun i just bought at some considerable expense.  i love it and intend to keep it.  anyone who wants it, including linea or occulus, can choose a cheek of my ass to kiss.  


    Your comment is unnecessarily (5.00 / 3) (#27)
    by oculus on Sat Nov 25, 2017 at 12:11:52 PM EST

    Thats how it starts (5.00 / 1) (#29)
    by jondee on Sat Nov 25, 2017 at 12:36:04 PM EST
    next thing, before you know it, comes the sudden urge to put up a Don't Tread On Me flag on the porch, go to Confederate reenactments, and build a meth-shack in the woods.

    Winter's Bone, here we come.

    Don't say you weren't warned.


    What the hell does that (none / 0) (#32)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Nov 25, 2017 at 03:39:16 PM EST
    Even mean.

    Screw cryptic drive bys

    If either of you have something to say try saying it


    ANY (none / 0) (#33)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Nov 25, 2017 at 03:49:01 PM EST
    Of you

    Speaking for myself only (5.00 / 2) (#36)
    by Ga6thDem on Sat Nov 25, 2017 at 05:30:24 PM EST
    treat guns like cars. Need to get some sort of training and actually pass the training before owning a gun. Wanna carry one around? You need insurance and if you are walking about with one and no insurance it gets treated like speeding and you are fined and if you are fined enough you lose your right to own a gun. As far as guns in your house, I'll let your homeowner's insurance deal with that but generally speaking insurance companies are fine with one or two guns but not fine with people who load their house up with guns because it is a fire hazard and they are charged extra premiums as being a high risk insured.

    i agree with this. (none / 0) (#42)
    by linea on Sun Nov 26, 2017 at 05:13:56 PM EST

    by Ga6thDem
    treat guns like cars.

    Hanguns are not the (none / 0) (#37)
    by MKS on Sat Nov 25, 2017 at 06:08:52 PM EST
    problem imo.

    The Heller decision, which held contrary to long standing precedent, that the Second Amendment confers an individual rather than a collective right--was a 5-4 decision.  The facts of that case as I recall were that D.C. banned handguns inside people's home.....a very bad overreach.

    Proving the axiom that bad facts make bad law.

    If D.C. had stuck to automatics or even handguns in public, then maybe Heller would not have happened or even gone the other way.


    Kidding. Mostly. (none / 0) (#41)
    by jondee on Sun Nov 26, 2017 at 09:23:00 AM EST
    I have more than 1 handgun. (none / 0) (#39)
    by Chuck0 on Sat Nov 25, 2017 at 08:42:06 PM EST
    One of which I have owned for 40 years. Somehow managed to never shoot anyone with it. Or any deer. (Who the heck hunts deer with a handgun?). I knew a guy who shot a bear with a .38. It made the bear very angry.

    Better yet (none / 0) (#25)
    by MKS on Sat Nov 25, 2017 at 10:39:51 AM EST
    Wear bright blue jacket.  Blue stands out more than any other color.  The traditional orange vest can blend in very easily with earth tones.... and orange and brown leaves...

    Like this, for example.


    works for me (none / 0) (#26)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Nov 25, 2017 at 10:46:52 AM EST
    also getting better neighbors.

    that is a really fu@king stupid thing.  i have noknowledge of it but i expect they are being prosecuted.

    they damn sure would be here.


    Turkey hunters (none / 0) (#28)
    by jondee on Sat Nov 25, 2017 at 12:21:56 PM EST
    get accidentally shot more than any other hunters, because wild turkeys are so smart that you practically have to get dolled up like a giant turkey in order to get close enough to have a shot at one. Probably hiding in heavy cover and making turkey calls doesn't help either.

    One guy around here got it right in the face, when he created a red turkey "waddle" by pulling out a pack of Marlboros in the bushes.


    Hate to disagree jondee (none / 0) (#30)
    by fishcamp on Sat Nov 25, 2017 at 12:41:12 PM EST
    but turkeys are the dumbest birds I have ever hunted.  They are so dumb they will stand in the rain with their chicks until the babies drown.  I have snuck up to within ten feet of them while wearing my bright orange elk hunting vest.  Turkeys are stupid.

    Not around here (none / 0) (#31)
    by jondee on Sat Nov 25, 2017 at 12:47:46 PM EST
    either that or the hunters around here are dumber. Which could very well be, for all I know.

    Documentary.... (5.00 / 1) (#40)
    by desertswine on Sat Nov 25, 2017 at 10:26:30 PM EST
    "My Life as a Turkey" -  fascinating birds.