Thursday Open Thread

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    this is interesting (5.00 / 1) (#5)
    by CaptHowdy on Thu Oct 12, 2017 at 05:04:26 PM EST
    President's lawyers may offer Mueller a meeting with Trump

    im pretty sure this is fake.  right?   he cant possibly want to do this unless he thinks he can throw everyone else under the bus, including his children, to save himself.

    watching all the wacky behaviour ive been wondering if they were maybe thinking of having him resign "for health reasons".  plead temporary chronic insanity.

    More (none / 0) (#8)
    by FlJoe on Thu Oct 12, 2017 at 06:07:45 PM EST
    like a head fake if you ask me. tRump still thinks he is playing small ball civil contract law, where he can dodge, delay and outlast his opponents.

    I'm guessing Trump will use this as a fig leaf to stonewall the congressional probes until when and if Mueller takes him up on the deal, then tRump will renege (or start a war).

    It's likely the Mueller does want to have this "talk" but I'm pretty sure he would prefer to have it much further down the road, buying tRump time if nothing else.

    Or maybe tRump really believes he can lay his out his typical BS and bluster, make a deal and walk out with some kind of settlement(NDA included) and carry on as he always has.


    benjaim witte (none / 0) (#13)
    by Ga6thDem on Thu Oct 12, 2017 at 06:54:24 PM EST
    said Trump has fools for lawyers if they are doing this. So more than likely it's a head fake from Trump pretending to cooperate.

    Hanlons razor (none / 0) (#14)
    by CaptHowdy on Thu Oct 12, 2017 at 06:58:01 PM EST
     "Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity"

    George Pal PUPPETOONS (5.00 / 1) (#6)
    by CaptHowdy on Thu Oct 12, 2017 at 05:57:21 PM EST
    last night and tonight on TCM they are doing George Pal.  last night they showed THE PUPPETOONS MOVIE.  

    Pal began his film making career as an animator.   a great one.  some of those short films are the best stop action animation ever done.  but they cant be shown in this country.

    heres a pretty good piece

    it includes this quote

    The shorts could be presented to the modern audience, I believe, with explanatory context, in a program hosted perhaps by someone like Whoopi Goldberg, who as a New Yorker, I'm certain, also grew up with these films.

    the funny thing about that is they are shown to modern audiences every day.  in Canada.  this i only learned by visiting there for work twice.  both times my favorite thing about Canada was the 2 or 3 animation channels that show all the lost, to americans, classics like PUPPETOONS and the great uncut classics from Fleischer and Warner Bros.  

    for me it was like seeing old friends i had not seen since childhood.  at a very critical time in my life one of the only tv channels we could get clearly showed nothing but classic movies and classic animation all day and all night.  including all the ones now banned by political correctness.  it made a serious impression.

    anyway, short of going to Canada you should try to see some of these wonderful things.  

    i will look around for links.

    ahem (none / 0) (#7)
    by CaptHowdy on Thu Oct 12, 2017 at 06:04:26 PM EST
    Jasper and the Watermelons

    Ming Dings House of Noodle

    these are small productions.  im lookingg for one of the extravaganzas with thousands of moving parts.  


    more (none / 0) (#9)
    by CaptHowdy on Thu Oct 12, 2017 at 06:22:48 PM EST
    Strange (5.00 / 3) (#18)
    by FlJoe on Fri Oct 13, 2017 at 10:53:56 AM EST
    behavior from a man who went to the mat for the ten commandments.
    Former Alabama judge Roy Moore, a Republican candidate for U.S. Senate, once said publicly that he did not take a "regular salary" from the small charity he founded to promote Christian values because he did not want to be a financial burden.

    But privately, Moore had arranged to receive a salary of $180,000 a year for part-time work at the Foundation for Moral Law, internal charity documents show. He collected more than $1 million as president from 2007 to 2012, compensation that far surpassed what the group disclosed in its public tax filings most of those years.


    I guess #9 at least is optional.

    I see "just a clerical error" in 10,9,8.........

    "Foundation of Moral Law" (5.00 / 4) (#19)
    by kdog on Fri Oct 13, 2017 at 11:12:18 AM EST
    that's rich....more like Foundation of Immoral Grift, as the prophet might have sayeth.

    Good lucking passing that camel through the gates of heaven, Roy my boy.


    Trump added another war. (5.00 / 4) (#20)
    by KeysDan on Fri Oct 13, 2017 at 12:24:43 PM EST
    First, War on the Little Rocket Man, then the Ayatollahs, and now to fight, head on, the War on Christmas.  Maybe, and hopefully, Trump will stick with the latter for his kicks.  

    Trump, the first US President to speak at the hate group (according to the SPLC) Values Voters Summit, promised that we will be celebrating Christmas, once again.  We can't say Merry Christmas because it is politically incorrect; department stores say Happy New Year (maybe he meant happy holidays), but that is now over.  He did not outline his battle strategy, but maybe employees will be fired if they don't say Merry Christmas...even if it is New Year's Eve.

    Trump did stumble over a few matters in his speech, such as calling the governor of the Virgin Islands, the president of the VI (Trump is president of the VI).  

    But, then, Trump has been a little mixed up this week, being called a moron and all by a cabinet officer he appointed. Trump assembled some complicit morons in the Oval Office to sign an executive order to weaken the ACA, took his bows and enjoyed the applause and started to leave--  but he forgot one thing during the signing ceremony: to sign his executive order.

    Other Values Voters speakers in the line up include White House alums, Steve Bannon and Sebastian Gorka.  Should be quite a hate fest.

    I (5.00 / 2) (#21)
    by FlJoe on Fri Oct 13, 2017 at 12:28:12 PM EST
    am so confused on this war on Christmas, are we supposed to kneel or stand before the baby Jesus?

    The Bible states... (5.00 / 1) (#22)
    by kdog on Fri Oct 13, 2017 at 01:01:24 PM EST
    you should stand when you swipe your card making the Christmas purchases at our lord retailer, and kneel before our lord banker when you pay the interest.

    If you don't know... (5.00 / 1) (#23)
    by kdog on Fri Oct 13, 2017 at 01:12:54 PM EST
    JJ Grey and Mofro, then I pity you mofo...their brand of southern fried soul, funk, and blues coming at you live from the old Loews Astor Place Theater on Broadway tonight.  Almost time to cut some rugs!

    Here's a little taste of one of their slow jams...A Woman

    Dayum. (none / 0) (#24)
    by sarcastic unnamed one on Fri Oct 13, 2017 at 01:37:35 PM EST
    And the records... (none / 0) (#25)
    by kdog on Fri Oct 13, 2017 at 02:50:19 PM EST
    don't do them justice...these boys a live band in every sense of the words.

    You seen anybody good lately?


    of a concert series out in the woods. Venue holds maybe 100. Every band killed.

    Looks like JJ stays back east? (none / 0) (#27)
    by sarcastic unnamed one on Fri Oct 13, 2017 at 03:04:50 PM EST
    Hey, SUO (none / 0) (#29)
    by NYShooter on Fri Oct 13, 2017 at 03:13:43 PM EST
    How 'bout you 'splain who "JJ" is (for us Dinosaurs out here)  

    I'm pretty sure Janis Joplin's been dead for quite a while, or, so I hear.


    Ah, got it, , (none / 0) (#34)
    by NYShooter on Fri Oct 13, 2017 at 04:39:33 PM EST
    and, thank you for not adding, "JJ Grey and Mofro, the band Kdog linked to,"........You freak'n Dimwit!

    I was tempted! :-) (none / 0) (#35)
    by sarcastic unnamed one on Fri Oct 13, 2017 at 04:45:04 PM EST
    lol, (none / 0) (#36)
    by NYShooter on Fri Oct 13, 2017 at 05:01:32 PM EST
    I don't even want to speculate what your response would've been if I had blurted out my first guess, "Jim Jeffries."

    The (none / 0) (#37)
    by FlJoe on Fri Oct 13, 2017 at 05:14:09 PM EST
    word of the week is moron, get with the program people.

    He's a Jacksonville Florida boy... (none / 0) (#30)
    by kdog on Fri Oct 13, 2017 at 03:15:22 PM EST
    but I'm sure he will head west eventually.

    The Porch looks very cool... (none / 0) (#28)
    by kdog on Fri Oct 13, 2017 at 03:13:13 PM EST
    right up my alley...almost like a Midnight Ramble at Levon's intimate vibe.

    Find it harder and harder to do the bigger arenas and stadiums when you're used to getting spoiled by the intimate venues with superior sound qualities.  


    Word. (none / 0) (#32)
    by sarcastic unnamed one on Fri Oct 13, 2017 at 03:25:43 PM EST
    Ha, just looked at the "venue" link. (none / 0) (#33)
    by sarcastic unnamed one on Fri Oct 13, 2017 at 03:30:16 PM EST
    I'm in photo 9/15...

    Peter, I did hear (5.00 / 2) (#41)
    by fishcamp on Sat Oct 14, 2017 at 12:36:39 PM EST
    the winds are supposed to drop slightly this afternoon, but just like hurricanes they really don't know.  I hope your sister and her family are safe and their house didn't burn like so many did.  

    The fires out in California are much worse than the hurricane we just went through, and that's hard to believe since hurricane Irma was the worst disaster I have been through.  I think fifteen people have perished down here however they are still digging out house trailers and bringing boats up from the bottom.  Keep us posted regarding your California family.

    Peloton Update? (none / 0) (#1)
    by McBain on Thu Oct 12, 2017 at 02:36:07 PM EST
    How are the workouts going, Jeralyn?  I've been getting back into indoor rowing.  My Concept2 model C is probably 20 years old and still going strong.

    Anyone else exercise at home?  I'm not a big fan of commercial gyms.  

    Enjoyed a small (none / 0) (#2)
    by KeysDan on Thu Oct 12, 2017 at 04:01:02 PM EST
    commercial gym and the personal trainer....until both moved away.  Now, have a home gym, pretty fully equipped; tried a personal trainer who came to the house, but found I could work out on my own, save for the disciple that comes with a regular trainer appointment.

    I wish I had the space for a full gym (5.00 / 1) (#15)
    by McBain on Thu Oct 12, 2017 at 07:10:02 PM EST
    I like parking my car in the garage so I have to park it somewhere else and move things around to get in a full workout.  Moving the equipment is part of the warmup/cool down.  

    General Kelly on Trump: (none / 0) (#3)
    by KeysDan on Thu Oct 12, 2017 at 04:23:03 PM EST
    "He's a very thoughtful man. He takes information in from any avenue he can receive it."  Yes, any avenue, although I fear that avenue is more Tverskaya Street than Avenue of the Americas.

    Kelly, after being introduced by Miss Huckabee, charmed the audience with the above pronouncement and assurances that, after talking with Trump, he does not think he will be fired today; nor is he so frustrated running the country that he will resign.  Not SO frustrated.

    Kelly is acclaimed as one of the adults in the room separating the country from chaos (per Corker), and ready to tackle or otherwise physically  restrain Trump from pushing the button (per Gabe Sherman, Vanity Fair).  Unless someone detected Kelly blinking for help in Morse Code, I am not entirely enthralled ...his short tenure at Homeland Security showed he was an eager soldier on Muslim Ban #1; and he found those Kushner back channels at the Russian embassy to be a good thing. He took the job (two jobs) in the Trump Administration, when one is more than enough to sully even a good reputation. And, too, I worry about Kelly's compromised cell phone and  what, if anything, that may play in his assessment of Trump's thoughtfulness and expansive mind.

    Didn't sound very bright today (none / 0) (#16)
    by Militarytracy on Thu Oct 12, 2017 at 07:59:13 PM EST
    His utter lack of understanding economics vs. some jacka$$ "president's agenda" fully on display. And of all things...did you know members of Congress have constituents that they must consider and serve too? Who knew? Wait long enough in this life and you'll see everything, stuff you never even imagined :)

    But those Democrats, they voted for a fence and when he was at DHS he didn't appreciate how wishy washy they were on fence enforcement and they made him feel bad. Those losers Obama and Clinton and Pelosi and Schumer, they voted fencing!


    Hope everyone is doing well. (none / 0) (#4)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Thu Oct 12, 2017 at 04:31:15 PM EST
    I've been absolutely buried in work this fall, which has unfortunately involved much more inter-island travel -- all day trips but one -- than I had initially anticipated.

    I've been to Kauai and Honolulu (two separate trips) just this week alone, and I'm going back to Honolulu tomorrow for a client's board meeting. And so of course, I've been out of touch and too tired by the time I get back home to pay much attention to the news.

    Hopefully, this will slow down next month after I go to Bend, OR but right now, I'm racking up those Hawaiian Airlines frequent flier miles. The airline awards 500 per interisland flight segment, so I received 2,000 miles R/T from Hilo to Lihue, Kauai and back because I have to change planes in Honolulu -- even though the actual distance between the two towns is only 320 miles.

    Anyway, hope everyone is doing well. Aloha.

    It's part of the new strategy. (none / 0) (#10)
    by KeysDan on Thu Oct 12, 2017 at 06:40:07 PM EST
    Seem to be very, very cooperative.  Offer an interview with Trump...next comes the terms and conditions.  Not under oath. ....and so many things, that happen that prevent it from happening.  But, that is OK, it is the public relations offensive against the facts.  The deplorables will be taken in.

    Sorry, Donald, (none / 0) (#11)
    by KeysDan on Thu Oct 12, 2017 at 06:41:17 PM EST
    intended as a response to the Captain.

    i dont think (none / 0) (#12)
    by CaptHowdy on Thu Oct 12, 2017 at 06:46:31 PM EST
    the remaining deplorables are being taken in at all.  i think they are fully onboard.  they know he lies everytime he speaks.  they dont care.

    i would say we are within a point or two of as low as he will go.  no matter what happens.  last i saw was a 32% approval.  high twenties maybe.

    they dont care.  


    The "deplorables" have one goal: (none / 0) (#48)
    by NYShooter on Sun Oct 15, 2017 at 11:56:32 PM EST
    "Stick it" to the establishment. Whether it makes sense, or, not, they felt (feel) they have been screwed over by whoever is in power (even if they don't understand all the issues involved,) they figured only Trump, of the 18/19 candidates, wasn't a member of the Club, and, only Trump could make the 1%'s lives miserable. I can even see some similarity between their actions and those of the AA community when they rioted and burned huge parts of the cities they lived in, even at the expense of destroying their own homes. Desperation makes people do weird stuff.
    We didn't call them "stupid," and much, much worse. Like I said, desperate, neglected, and, hopeless. Quite a combination. Think about it.

    As far as the feelers going out about a potential Trump/Mueller meeting, it might make some sense. Look, the fact that the guy in question is about the worst nightmare anyone could imagine, there are some really big issues involved. Unless we're now going to accept the consequences of what, "The end justifies the means," really means, this investigation should be as "pure as Caesar's wife," as they say. So far, after all these months, and, all this high talent, hi priced legal talent assembled against Trump, odds are they're not going to find any direct collusion between Trump and the Russian Gov't insofar as the 2016 election was concerned. And, let's not be naïve, there's a reason the saying, "A prosecutor could indict a ham sandwich," has stuck. Because it's true....just ask Bill Clinton. Is there any chance the impeachment would have been started against Clinton if the public were told, "hey, we're going to "get" Clinton even if it means we're going to dig into his sex life?" I don't think so.

    Anyway, this could be the olive branch Trump offers to Mueller. He could say something like, "Well, you can't get me on collusion with the Russians." "But, we're all big boys here and we know what the game is really about, and, how its played. Of course you can get me, I've done tens of thousands of transactions in my lifetime. And who could be stupid enough to deny that you'll find something (a "blue dress?") So, let's make a deal: You state there was no collusion on my part, and, I'll confess to some wrong doing, however tangentially connected, and, we'll let the political process work this thing out."

    I'm afraid, as it stands now, Mueller will "get" Trump. It won't be collusion, and, it will be argued by some, not so wrongly, imo, that it was a lynching from the get go. And, don't get me wrong, I won't shed any tears seeing him leave the stage, but, I might shed a tear or two at what this unjust deterioration of our constitution will do.

    Just look what misusing the 2'nd. amendment has done......or, the 1'st.


    You may have a bit of a point (5.00 / 1) (#51)
    by CaptHowdy on Mon Oct 16, 2017 at 08:52:45 AM EST
    With the stuff about the deplorables.  I don't completely agree but I do think there is something to the idea that the problems in this country are now often, certainly not always but often, more about class than race.

    If there is any truth in it then it's also true one big difference it seems to me is AAs for the most part tried and wanted to be part of the larger society and the "deplorables" seem to embrace their other-ness and seem to do everything they can to maintain and expand it.

    As far as lynching.  You lost me.  Even if Trump goes down for something like fraud or money laundering it will of course be said "we were out to get him".  Which will make those of us who lived through the Clinton and Obama years laugh out loud.

    But I don't think that will be the outcome.  I think it's entirely likely Trump, and several around him, will be exposed as a Russian agent,  literally the "Manchurian Candidate" the same looney low infos accused Obama of being.  Because, btw, he was black.  Which brings us full circle I guess.

    I think the case Mueller brings will rock our government to its foundations and exceed our wildest fantasy of comeuppance for the Trump dynasty.  Just a hunch.


    A "lynching" ... seriously??? (5.00 / 2) (#53)
    by Yman on Mon Oct 16, 2017 at 09:13:21 AM EST
    Apart from the obvious poor choice of words, how exactly is this a "lynching"?  At the very LEAST - just from the publicly available information - we know:

    1.  Trump Jr., one of his main campaign advisers - met with Russians with the express purpose of receiving oppo research on HC, an act which if completed would be illegal.  The meeting seeing up the email explicitly stated it was part of the Russian government's support of his campaign.  We don't know if they received anything.

    2.  Donald Jr. lied several times about the meeting occurring and its purpose.  Trump himself helped craft the false statement about that meeting.

    3.  Trump himself pressured Comey to publicly exonerate him.  Then he fired him Because of the Russia investigation.

    4.  Several of Trump's primary advisers and his campaign manager are being investigated for taking payments and/or using their positions to make money from the Russians.  

    5.  Several advisers have lied about their contracts with the Russians on their security clearances and in public statements.

    This investigation is a serious and legitimate investigation.  It is nowhere near a "lynching".

    I don't think there's any question (none / 0) (#55)
    by jondee on Mon Oct 16, 2017 at 10:26:30 AM EST
    that no matter what the ultimate results of the investigation, it'll be deftly and relentlessly spun by many all-too-influential outlets into an unconstitutional "lynching and witch-hunt" orchestrated by "establishment elites" to usurp the popular will of the people.

    Lets face it, if tens-of-millions of people can be hornswoggled into believing Trump had a rightful place in the grand American Presidential lineage, they can be made to believe anything.

    If people think the conspiracy theories expressed now about Sandy Hook and Las Vegas are loony beyond belief, you ain't seen nothin' yet.

    Whatever you can say about Clinton's diehard supporters in the nineties, not many of them stockpiled AR-15s and armor piercing bullets with a view toward a final show down with the anti-christ and the shape-shifting reptilian overlords.


    It's all part of George Soros' (none / 0) (#56)
    by Chuck0 on Mon Oct 16, 2017 at 11:17:36 AM EST
    secret plan to turn the world into a communist utopia. Even Newt Gingrich brought up Soros in a Munk debate I saw on Cspan last night

    How you feeling, Chuck? (none / 0) (#57)
    by jondee on Mon Oct 16, 2017 at 11:34:01 AM EST
    better I hope.

    Gingrich has always been so fos (none / 0) (#58)
    by jondee on Mon Oct 16, 2017 at 11:44:28 AM EST
    that if you gave him an enema, he could be buried in a matchbox. Not to put too fine a point on it.

    Still in hospital. (none / 0) (#60)
    by Chuck0 on Mon Oct 16, 2017 at 12:55:44 PM EST
    Breathing is better. On beacoup blood thinners. Hope to go home this evening.

    Sounds like things are looking up (5.00 / 1) (#64)
    by jondee on Mon Oct 16, 2017 at 03:44:49 PM EST
    take it easy and get better and don't let the bastards get you down.

    Oh, there's no doubt ... (none / 0) (#63)
    by Yman on Mon Oct 16, 2017 at 02:32:36 PM EST
    ... that a lot of Trumpers will try to spin it into some kind or grand witchhunt.  As he said, he could shoot someone in the middle of 5th Ave. and not lose a vote.  But NYShooter isn't saying that some will try to spin it into a witchhunt.  He's saying they'll make that claim and he agrees with it.

    Oh, my goodness; I don't know where to (none / 0) (#50)
    by Anne on Mon Oct 16, 2017 at 08:50:27 AM EST

    On a Trump/Mueller meeting making sense:

    No, it makes no sense at all. - not for Trump.  When you are in the crosshairs of an experienced prosecutor, you don't make it easier for him.  And given Trump's habit of changing his story, I don't think he wants Mueller to have a record - anymore than he already does from Trump's public statements.

    On this being an "ends justifies the means" investigation:

    This isn't an "ends justify the means" investigation, at least not as I interpret the broad scope and powers given by Rosenstein when he appointed Mueller:

    In appointing Mueller, however, Deputy Attorney General Rod Rosenstein gave him broad authority not only to investigate "any links and/or coordination between the Russian government and individuals associated" with Trump's campaign, but also to examine "any matters that arose or may arise directly from the investigation."
    Rosenstein also gave Mueller the power to investigate "any other matters within the scope of 28 C.F.R. § 600.4(a)" -- including perjury, obstruction of justice, destruction of evidence, and intimidation of witnesses.

    The mandate's scope is similar to that given by then-Acting Attorney General James Comey to special counsel Patrick Fitzgerald in 2003 to investigate who leaked the identity of former CIA operative Valerie Plame.

    Unless you are accusing Rosenstein of having an agenda, it seems to me that Mueller is just doing the job with which he was tasked.

    On the odds of not linking Trump to collusion:

    The collusion is just one aspect of the investigation, and I don't believe it can be separated from the other avenues being investigated.  Nor do I think it would be good strategy to you're your cards without being sure you have all of them in hand.  

    On the olive branch:

    My guess is that Trump would see the offering of an olive branch as a sign of weakness, not strength.  That hasn't stopped it from being teased, but I don't think we can take the teasing of a possible meeting as being a serious indication that it might happen.  

    On the unjust deterioration of the Constitution:

    What about this investigation isn't constitutional?  Let's remember where this all started, with a finding that Russia meddled in the 2016 election.  Have you kept track of all the Russia connections to Trump and members of his campaign and administration?  Do we want to know if there was a connection between what Russia was doing and the campaign, or not?  Do we want to take Trump's word on this? Why would anyone want to do that, when Trump's word means nothing?  

    Mueller's been given a job to do; I think he should be allowed to do it.


    Indeed (none / 0) (#52)
    by CaptHowdy on Mon Oct 16, 2017 at 09:00:03 AM EST
    That idea though, of a witch hunt, which I believe he is correct will the primary response of his supporters, shows how much better the right is at creating and enforcing stupid lying memes than we are.

    Clinton (Bill) used to say "we will win without cheating because our ideas are better"

    A quaint idea that may have been because even he was blind to the "personality cult" nature of our politics.


    Hey, Anne, I'll try to respond to you (none / 0) (#65)
    by NYShooter on Mon Oct 16, 2017 at 04:04:26 PM EST
    but, it's really hard in a venue like this one here. Let me do it item by item, and see if we can agree, or, at least agree that we disagree, before moving on to another one. Because, based on the responses I got, not everyone is looking for a conversation, or, understanding. This may take some time, and, if you don't mind, let me try to do this a new way. You brought up a lot of points, let's, at least try to explain a couple of them today. There's no rush.

    And, Howdy, I'll address your comment in my dialogue with Anne, o.k?

    Hey, let's give it a shot.

    Anne, I'm in my office right now, and, I just re-read your post. I see already, to answer your first couple of sentences is going to take more thought, and, time than the usual one liners. Apples & oranges, I'll get back to you as soon as I can.


    tend to agree (none / 0) (#54)
    by Ga6thDem on Mon Oct 16, 2017 at 09:56:49 AM EST
    re "the establishment" but mostly because the GOP has been promising them a return to the "uptopian 1950's" since Reagan and has not delivered and they are tired of waiting. So here comes Trump telling them everything they want to hear. So what if he has no actual plans for healthcare? Doesn't matter because it's all about sticking it to those "uppity" poc and those white people that think all races are created equal.

    For the sake of our democracy we should hope that Mueller does a thorough job and we all are informed as to exactly how and what the Russians did. With Trump's completely erratic behavior it could be that the 25th amendment gets invoked long before Mueller finishes.


    SouthWest is adding Hawaii to it's (none / 0) (#17)
    by oculus on Thu Oct 12, 2017 at 10:59:03 PM EST

    I discussed that on a local PBS news show ... (none / 0) (#66)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Tue Oct 17, 2017 at 06:26:07 PM EST
    ... in which I noted my failure to see how Southwest's entry next year into an already crowded California-Hawaii air corridor -- where United, Delta, American, Hawaiian and Alaska / Virgin America are competing quite vigorously -- could be construed by our governor's staff as an example of economic diversification, as they were trying to do.

    Southwest's presence will probably have a negligible effect on air fares, since fares on various CA-HI routes are already pretty low by industry standards as it is. I really don't see any tactical advantage business-wise for them to fly out here. They'll add some seat capacity, but that's about it.

    Further, Southwest's arrival will coincide with Hawaiian's own significant expansion of service, as that airline takes delivery of 25 additional A321neo and A330-300 aircraft over the next 15 months.

    I think that for Southwest to compete successfully, it would be best if they forgo Hawaii departures altogether from California's main international hub airports at LAX and SFO, where they'll bump up against all the other airlines mentioned above. Instead, they should look to serve the islands from secondary regional airports like Burbank, Santa Ana / Orange County, Ontario, San Jose and Oakland, all of which already enjoy a significant Southwest presence at their facilities. (In fact, Oakland is Southwest's primary west coast hub.)



    Just watched the live stream... (none / 0) (#38)
    by MileHi Hawkeye on Fri Oct 13, 2017 at 11:02:00 PM EST
    of Jason Isbell and the 400 Unit @ the Ryman. They  closed the night with a blistering cover of American Girl. Wow - tears still rolling down my face.

    Jason Isbell is fantastic... (none / 0) (#49)
    by kdog on Mon Oct 16, 2017 at 08:40:32 AM EST
    I bet that was some tribute, and some run at the legendary Ryman.  

    His "White Man's World" is one of the best songs of the year, so powerfully poignant.


    I drove through the burn zone last night (none / 0) (#39)
    by Repack Rider on Sat Oct 14, 2017 at 12:39:45 AM EST
    Took some people from the Oakland airport to their home in Windsor, six miles north of Santa Rosa.  They had cut a Hawaiian vacation short to see if they still had a house, which they did, half a mile from complete devastation. We got there about midnight, so I did not see very much.

    Many of the major roads are closed. US 101 isn't, although the fire crossed it and burned houses on the west side also.  I drove past neighborhoods where I had delivered pianos to big houses, not a light to be seen except a few vehicles moving in darkness. The stink of the fire was intense.

    I couldn't see anything past the sides of the road, because there were no highway lights. We are not used to utter, black darkness in our urban areas. Exits were blocked. I noticed one sign for the exit to a major road had been removed entirely, and later saw on a map that the road ran through the heart of the fire. I had driven that road many times.

    Back home, about 30 miles south of the nearest fire, the smoke limits visibility to to a few blocks. Everybody knows somebody who lost their house.

    My sister and her family live another (none / 0) (#40)
    by Peter G on Sat Oct 14, 2017 at 12:11:33 PM EST
    hour or more north of there. They are still under evacuation from the Redwood Valley fire, after 5+ days. I guess because it is a much less populated area than Santa Rosa, there has been a lot less coverage in the news, despite dozens of homes lost and several people killed. Yesterday, their fire was supposedly 50% contained and there was a chance they could return home today, being a few miles from where houses were burned (including on a forest road where they used to live). Today, they were told No. Winds picking up and potentially changing direction to threaten their area again. I have been worried and on edge all week about them.

    What a terrible worry, Peter. (5.00 / 1) (#42)
    by Anne on Sat Oct 14, 2017 at 01:23:15 PM EST
    I hope your sister and her family continue to be safe, and that the threat of fire ends soon.

    I know people always say that it isn't the "things" that are important, it's people's lives - and of course, people's lives are the most important thing - but we all know that things hold meaning for us, and losing them is a blow to the heart and the spirit.

    So many of our people have lately suffered the trauma of Mother Nature, and some are suffering the additional trauma of feeling abandoned in their time of need.  I've been struggling to make some sense of it all, and not having much luck.

    Hope it won't be long before your sister and her family are safely home.


    Peter, sending (5.00 / 2) (#43)
    by Zorba on Sat Oct 14, 2017 at 03:00:36 PM EST
    Hopeful thoughts and wishes to your sister and her family.
    What a terrifying thing to go through.

    Giant sigh of relief. My sister and our (5.00 / 2) (#46)
    by Peter G on Sun Oct 15, 2017 at 08:12:55 PM EST
    brother-in-law are back home, after seven days' evacuation. The fire turned -- or was controlled (not clear which) -- a few miles short of the area where they live. Home is intact; all the animals are also accounted for. Likewise their daughter (my niece) and her husband, with their two kids under six, who live a half mile from my sister. But they have many friends, and some relatives (in my niece's husband's family) who were not so lucky.

    So happy to hear this, Peter... (5.00 / 1) (#47)
    by Anne on Sun Oct 15, 2017 at 08:17:33 PM EST
    I just can't even imagine how scary it is to be in that situation - but being on the other side of the country, waiting for news?  It has to be like time stops and doesn't really start again until you know everyone's okay.

    my cousin posted on FB (none / 0) (#44)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Oct 14, 2017 at 04:43:59 PM EST
    this morning they were still safe,  i guess they briefly evacuated bur are now back.

    they know lots of people who lost everything.   they are just south of Sonoma.


    thats Santa Rosa (none / 0) (#45)
    by CaptHowdy on Sun Oct 15, 2017 at 06:30:45 PM EST
    not sonoma

    Saw heavy smoke coming over the Sierras (none / 0) (#59)
    by sarcastic unnamed one on Mon Oct 16, 2017 at 12:34:17 PM EST
    into the Owens Valley yesterday. The OV is a long way from the fires.

    Sarc, were you (none / 0) (#61)
    by fishcamp on Mon Oct 16, 2017 at 01:30:06 PM EST
    fishing up there?

    Ya, fishing and exploring with my son. (none / 0) (#62)
    by sarcastic unnamed one on Mon Oct 16, 2017 at 01:55:49 PM EST
    My soul is replenished.

    Sounds like you had a good time. (none / 0) (#67)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Tue Oct 17, 2017 at 06:35:21 PM EST
    The Owens Valley is beautiful, and one of California's truly unsung getaway destinations, particularly in the summer and fall. Wintertime, of course, you run into the crowds heading to and from the Mammoth Lakes ski resorts. Last time we went to Mammoth eight years ago, we flew rather than drive. Alaska-Horizon Airlines serves there from LAX.