Monday Open Thread: A New Network to Watch

It's a jail day for me, open thread for you.

All topics welcome, but speaking of TV: Has anyone been watching the Viceland shows? Vice launched its own channel at the end of February and has about 8 shows. From what I've read (no time for links right now) the network is geared towards millenials and the first month ratings via cable were not good. (There are many ways to watch.) This New York Times article sums

I actually liked F*ck That's Delicious, with rapper Action Bronson. It's part of their "Munchies" series. I never heard of him before. Physically, he resembles one of the guys in Duck Dynasty. But he's from Queens, NY, NY, , the son of an Albanian Muslim and an American Jewish mother, so any similarity ends there.

Anyway, Action used to be a chef before he broke his leg and became a rapper. The New York Times has this pretty extensive write-up on Action and Viceland. [More...]

He dropped out of high school, sold drugs, did a stint in culinary school and then spent several years working in kitchens throughout the city, including his fatherís bar and restaurant in Forest Hills, Queens.

The show is about the guys traveling around the world, bonding with each other, eating really good food at locally owned places (in very copious quantities), getting into the local culture of wherever they are, smoking weed and having fun. There are six or seven episodes as of now, I've watched six. (There are more on You Tube where the show first ran.

The best episodes are the one in Morocco, and the one in New York (Note: corrected from earlier when I referenced this episode as being filmed both in London and New York. That's a different one. I meant the episode filmed entirely in NY, I think it's number three) The Queens part of the New York episode -- especially the King David's Bakery (aka Tandoory Bread) is really interesting.

Three of the guys (Action, Meyhem Lauren and Big Body Bes) are big and fat. They are diverse and multi-cultural and supportive of each other. They use profanity in their music, but they seem like very nice guys and are very polite with the restaurants and tourists. I can't even imagine the advance work the Network had to do with the restaurant and market owners to prepare so much food for Action and friends who wolf it down.

There's a bit of a Diners, Drive-in and Dives' feel to it at first, but that goes pretty quickly. Action is a bit more articulate than Fiore. Also, there aren't many cooking lessons and the guys really explore the other cultures they visit.

Interestingly, one of the guys (Big Body Bes) has some kind of legal issue (here's an interview with him when he got out of jail) so he couldn't go to Canada or London with the group because those countries wouldn't let him in. They filmed without him, but then added in segments of what he was doing in New York so he didn't get left out. (He was able to go to Morocco and Amsterdam.)

Another Viceland series is States of Undress, which uses Fashion Week in odd places (Pakistan, the Congo) to opine about women's rights (gay rights, everybody's rights.) I'm not crazy about the host, a model who used to be advertising director for the Paris Review (according to them, others report she was an editorial director). For example, I did not find it amusing (and in fact slightly insulting to the store owner) when she was trying on a burqa in a store -- she was buying it so she'd have something appropriate to wear when meeting with an Islamic cleric -- and she came out of the dressing room with a "Da Da" and her arms outstretched, asking how she looked while batting her eyes. She is not as cool or pretty as she thinks she is. (Action and his guys don't pretend to be cool, they just are.) [Added after episode 3: I've changed my mind about the host of States of Undress. She's really grown on me. And the show offers a glimpse of life in countries I'm unlikely to visit and otherwise wouldn't otherwise get to see. It's as much about social and economic injustice in these countries as it is about fashion.

So, apparently Viceland doesn't care about ratings (Vice is a billion dollar parent company)and is just having fun with the TV medium, hoping to bring "personal stories." I'm not a big documentary fan, so these "reality trips" are more watchable and interesting to me. But I don't really get what makes one person's stories "interesting." Maybe if I keep watching, I'll figure it out.

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    SCOTUS unanimously holds (5.00 / 3) (#7)
    by oculus on Mon Apr 04, 2016 at 04:54:14 PM EST
    in Evenwel v. Abbott that a state or locality may draw its legislative disctricts based on total population (as opposed to only the population eligible to vote).  Justice Ginsburg wrote the opinion.

    Am I the only one who sees this (none / 0) (#84)
    by kramartini on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 10:16:07 AM EST
    as an abandonment of "One Person, One Vote"?

    After this ruling, state legislatures can safely engineer districts with widely differing voting populations, immune from judicial review of even the most egregious abuses.


    Well, this is how Congressional districts (none / 0) (#89)
    by oculus on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 10:43:50 AM EST
    are drwn now. Plaintiff sought to exclude.anyone ineligible to vote: age, felony conviction, non-citizen, etc.  

    You are sort of right, except (none / 0) (#94)
    by kramartini on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 10:51:31 AM EST
    now legislatures are free from any constraint that could have come from fear of a lawsuit alleging unequal voting populations. Now, they can really go all out!

    Expect Texas to mix conservative suburban families with prisoners and illegal aliens while corralling progressive singles into a handful of "Super Blue" districts.


    Of course, SCOTUS' majority opinion (5.00 / 1) (#106)
    by oculus on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 11:23:17 AM EST
    in Shelby County v. Holder already accomplished this.

    NY debate is set (5.00 / 4) (#23)
    by jbindc on Mon Apr 04, 2016 at 07:54:37 PM EST
    April 14, but of course Bernie had to take cheap shots at HRC since he had to give in on the date.

    The meltdown (5.00 / 4) (#26)
    by Ga6thDem on Mon Apr 04, 2016 at 08:09:48 PM EST
    has become very ugly.

    Pretty much out of control (5.00 / 1) (#27)
    by jbindc on Mon Apr 04, 2016 at 08:11:42 PM EST
    Bernie as just another flash (none / 0) (#29)
    by Mr Natural on Mon Apr 04, 2016 at 08:26:51 PM EST
    There's probably nothing to it (none / 0) (#60)
    by Nemi on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 07:47:18 AM EST
    and I read too much into his reaction, but his facial expression in the Jake Tapper interview, around the 5:40 mark, when he answered

    You know who does our tax returns? ... [grimaces] ... My wife does our tax returns ...

    bothered me. As did the answer to the nudge-nudge wink-wink question from Tapper at the end of the clip, which Sanders is just about to answer in a civil way - then he catches the innuendo, grins and answers "Who knows".

    And I fully admit, that I probably read far too much into it.

    But over all he seemed to be very low key and aware of not making faces in that interview, to the point of coming across as almost sedated. I just hope he brings that self discipline with him into the upcoming debate. For everyones sake.


    I have to agree on one point... (none / 0) (#123)
    by Cashmere on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 01:08:50 PM EST
    This certainly got less interest than when Hillary was asked if Obama was a Christian, and she said, something like, Well, I think so.

    My TV watching tonight (5.00 / 1) (#28)
    by ragebot on Mon Apr 04, 2016 at 08:22:57 PM EST
    is the men's final BB game.

    Final: Villanova 77, North Carolina 74. (5.00 / 2) (#44)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Mon Apr 04, 2016 at 10:33:11 PM EST
    Instant classic! The Wildcats' Kris Jenkins hit a 3-pt. buzzer beater, and Villanova claims their first national title in 31 years.

    4:42 2H: Villanova 67, North Carolina 57. (none / 0) (#39)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Mon Apr 04, 2016 at 10:06:34 PM EST
    The announcers' comments about North Carolina players overcoming adversity this season are starting to wear thin. This is one of the most well-funded, well-connected and pampered basketball programs in the country, and given that the school's athletic department got caught cheating academically, the Tar Heels have led a rather charmed life this season. By all rights, they should have been sanctioned and placed on probation over that phony course scandal.

    'Nova was one of the most (none / 0) (#115)
    by jondee on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 11:58:15 AM EST
    well-disciplined, mature, cool- under-pressure basketball teams I've seen in a long time..

    They dictated the pace in every one of their games.

    They don't run-and-gun well, so they slowed things down just enough to make all their oponents play to their strength, and they rarely took reckless, bad shots.

    Well done.


    I really enjoyed watching their style of play (none / 0) (#126)
    by ruffian on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 01:23:06 PM EST
    Seemed to be a lot of thought and discipline behind it, as you say.

    ... was a masterpiece, arguably the most complete single game ever played by any team in the history of the NCAA Men's Final Four.

    What made that particular victory even more remarkable and impressive was that in an earlier matchup at the Pearl Harbor Classic between these same two teams out here in Honolulu last December, the Sooners had blown the Wildcats out the door by 23, 78-55. It proved to be their worst performance and lowest point total of the entire season.

    So we can clearly see how much Villanova had improved during the intervening 14 weeks. By the time the Wildcats had disposed of top-ranked Kansas in the South Regional final, they were a team firing on all cylinders and peaking at just the right moment. And in one-and-done tournaments like March Madness, getting hot at the right time means everything.



    Nothing against Nova (none / 0) (#200)
    by ragebot on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 09:44:35 PM EST
    but Bill Walton scored 44 points (missing only one shot) when John Wooden coached UCLA won the natty in 1973.  My choice for best game

    1:00 2H: Villanova 70, North Carolina 69. (none / 0) (#41)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Mon Apr 04, 2016 at 10:21:27 PM EST
    After the twin bust that was the lopsided games in Saturday's semifinals, tonight's exciting matchup provided a fitting conclusion on an exciting men's tournament.

    This is pretty stunning (5.00 / 6) (#31)
    by jbindc on Mon Apr 04, 2016 at 08:40:02 PM EST
    Sanders admits he doesn't know how to break up the big banks

    It's his ONE issue - how can he not have a thorough understanding and ideas about this???

    This is just sad (5.00 / 1) (#97)
    by FreakyBeaky on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 10:56:40 AM EST
    But not the first indication we've had of his not thinking things through. Or that he is writing checks with his rhetoric that he can't cash.

    Not presidential if you ask me.


    Not to make excuses for Bernie.. (none / 0) (#146)
    by jondee on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 02:26:34 PM EST
    I know, I know, why stop now? but, writing some checks one can't cash has always been the stock-in-trade of anyone who's ever run for President.

    Let's get real here.

    Just because he can't give all the specifics on how it can be done, doesn't mean it shouldn't be done..

    Imo, it absolutely needs to be done.


    I would like World Peace and an end to (5.00 / 5) (#164)
    by vml68 on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 04:43:54 PM EST
    world hunger.
    Can you vote for me for President?

    C'mon Jondee, lofty ideals are great but they are not enough.
    If I am interviewing someone to help me improve my company's bottom line, I want to hear more than "I will improve it by 50%!". I want to hear how, so I can evaluate whether your plan is realistic, whether you know how to go about accomplishing it or if you are some loon who will sink my company because you don't understand anything besides making grandiose claims.

    Bernie is running for POTUS. He absolutely does not get a pass on not having a plan together for what is his signature issue. If anything, it angers me that he is so woefully unprepared at this stage of the game. He is basically the Trump of the left.


    Can't say I am too surprised. (none / 0) (#35)
    by vml68 on Mon Apr 04, 2016 at 09:04:54 PM EST
    I was starting to question his knowledge and competency of financial matters when I read about his net worth, considering how much he earns in the Senate.

    What about Sanders net worth/income (none / 0) (#38)
    by caseyOR on Mon Apr 04, 2016 at 09:24:19 PM EST
    made you question his financial knowledge?

    Casey, I was/am being a bit of a (5.00 / 1) (#42)
    by vml68 on Mon Apr 04, 2016 at 10:23:47 PM EST
    Judgemental Judy.

    Anyway, my opinion was based on the numbers from this article and a couple of others that showed similar numbers.

    He has been earning close to $100k since 1990 and $165k since 2006. His wife apparently earned about $160k from 2004-2011. Yet, his net worth in 2013-2014 has been reported to be anywhere from $300k-$450k.
    That is a surprisingly low net worth for about 26 years of pretty good income. My inclination is to think that they are mismanaging their finances but that is pure speculation on my part.

    Also, I found the whole "my wife does our taxes and we've been busy" comment as an excuse for not releasing them a bit odd. It makes me wonder if he is hiding something or if he is just clueless.
    I am tending towards clueless.
    The reason I think that is, I do the taxes for my husband and myself. He trusts me to take care of it and he pays very little attention to it. He is probably not aware that I could post 10 years worth of our taxes within an hour.


    He got 4 Pinocchios (5.00 / 1) (#52)
    by jbindc on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 05:27:47 AM EST
    Not a very deep financial analysis, vml (3.00 / 2) (#114)
    by Mr Natural on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 11:53:29 AM EST
    Bernie lives in Washington D.C.  Some of the most expensive living conditions, if you choose, in the United States.  $325K/year is chump change in that milieu.

    $325k in DC (5.00 / 1) (#124)
    by jbindc on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 01:13:05 PM EST
    Is still doing fairly well. Bernie doesn't seem the type to have a big ostentatious lifestyle, so he and Jane could be VERY comfortable here in DC and with a second residence in VT on $325k.

    Actually, jb, you are wrong (none / 0) (#173)
    by Mr Natural on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 05:37:08 PM EST
    and Bernie's financials prove it.

    Jb, strike my last comment, (none / 0) (#178)
    by Mr Natural on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 05:57:19 PM EST
    I've been looking at the pieces of the Sanders financials and cannot find enough to assemble a real picture.  At one point he listed $165,000 in credit card debt, which appalls me.

    That deserved a 1? Really? (5.00 / 1) (#153)
    by jondee on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 03:10:57 PM EST
    this is getting like one of those nineties mean-girls-in-the-lunchroom movies.

    I agree that it is not a deep (none / 0) (#121)
    by vml68 on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 12:54:22 PM EST
    financial analysis. Yes, $325k does not go as far in D.C. as it would in Ohio but I would not characterize $325k as chump change.

    I guess, we will have to wait for, if/when Bernie decides to release his complete tax filings for the last few years, to get a better understanding as to how he manages his finances.
    The more I dig, the less confident I am that he knows what he is doing.


    And at her blog Shakesville (none / 0) (#62)
    by Nemi on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 08:01:00 AM EST
    the commenters chime in on her, Melissa McEwan's, post there aptly titled Holy Mackerel. :)

    Great piece, great comments.


    It is stunning to me (none / 0) (#128)
    by mm on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 01:27:26 PM EST
    That with all the debates and all town halls and all the one on one interviews with all the major journalists, it took the tabloid NY Daily News to nail him on some of these things.

    Daily News: ...Do you have a sense that there is a particular statute or statutes that a prosecutor could have or should have invoked to bring indictments?

    Sanders: I suspect that there are. Yes.

    Daily News: You believe that? But do you know?

    Sanders: I believe that that is the case. Do I have them in front of me, now, legal statutes? No, I don't. But if I would...yeah, that's what I believe, yes.


    This is the freaking foundation of his entire campaign, the raison d'etre of his quixotic campaign, and he shoots a total blank.

    "The business model of Wall Street is fraud"

    A big noxious bag of hot air.

    When it comes to his campaign promise to break up the large financial institutions, Sanders clearly has given little thought to how he would actually carry it out. In the span of a few questions, Sanders told the Daily News he will pass a law to do it, then claimed the administration already has the power to do so under Dodd-Frank, and then claimed the Federal Reserve has the power to do so by fiat.

    Mark Halperin just tweeted (5.00 / 4) (#136)
    by jbindc on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 02:05:12 PM EST
    re:  Bernie's disastrous interview with the NYDN:

    Typical extreme anti-Clinton double standard: if Hillary gave answers like this to ed board, she would be crucified.

    Wow.  You KNOW it was bad if it can get Halperin to say something like this.


    Just (none / 0) (#157)
    by TrevorBolder on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 04:05:47 PM EST
    Task Elizabeth Warren with the project

    The weird thing (none / 0) (#163)
    by FlJoe on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 04:32:43 PM EST
    is he actually introduced a bill last May

    Too Big to Fail, Too Big to Exist Act:

    Light on details of course, but certainly talking point worthy.


    Millennials (5.00 / 1) (#49)
    by MKS on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 01:23:32 AM EST
    can be so unintentionally hilarious.

    Case No. 1.  I was at the gym earlier today and a couple of Marines from the local base were in the locker room talking about getting dinner at Chipotle.  And one of them goes on an extended riff about Marine Corps chow and how they usually have to all eat the same thing and how they should have their choice about different menus items.  And it was all Big Pharma's and Corporate America's fault.

    Case No. 2.  At Big Orange today, a Bernie supporter is saying what a selling point it is the Bernie is a "pauper."  So, I say, JFK and FDR were wealthy.  The response?  At least

    Case No. 2 cont. (5.00 / 1) (#50)
    by MKS on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 01:28:52 AM EST
    At least, JFK and FDR did not sell out to corporate interests after they left the WH. Said without irony.

    Millennials have this Millionaire and Billionaire thing down pat.

    (Don't know how that comment got cut off--I sent the whole thing.)


    Speaking of JFK.. (none / 0) (#125)
    by jondee on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 01:21:57 PM EST
    I wonder if Hillary would've pushed that same line about the Cubans/Rooskies getting ready to launch a first strike at any moment..

    It's a rhetorical question of course, because I think we all know the answer.


    Well, in your jaundiced view (5.00 / 2) (#135)
    by MKS on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 01:55:31 PM EST
    your can create whatever negative and cynical hypothetical you want.

    No, she is not Gen. Curtis LeMay.

    Your penchant for exaggeration is ruining your opinions.    


    I like think of it (none / 0) (#141)
    by jondee on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 02:12:45 PM EST
    as poetic liscense.

    And there's quite a bit of jaundice flying around in different directions in these quarters lately..

    When in Rome..


    As the (5.00 / 2) (#54)
    by Ga6thDem on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 06:51:49 AM EST
    mother of a millennial I can tell you they are very susceptible to dumbed down talking points. I blame NCLB and the continuous testing in school for that.

    This generation is going to have an extremely hard time in life and a lot of it is their own doing.  


    Again (none / 0) (#93)
    by CST on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 10:50:52 AM EST
    NCLB was implemented in 2001, when the older millennials were turning 21.  It didn't have any impact on the education of a significant portion of us.

    Yes, well (none / 0) (#99)
    by Ga6thDem on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 11:07:51 AM EST
    mine was born in 1993. So unfortunately it did him and he's pretty much my point of reference with the generation. He was in elementary school when it started and it followed him all the way through high school.

    I always felt I was lucky ... (5.00 / 1) (#110)
    by Robot Porter on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 11:36:04 AM EST
    because as a Gen Xer, I got a little bit of every kind of education.

    When I started school in seventies, there was still a lot of fifties tools being used. Then things went all hippy and crunchy granola. (Including a lot of common core style ideas, which people think are new.) And then I finished school during the Reagan era with a return to fundamentals.  Toss in a few years at schools in the UK, and I really covered the waterfront with educational styles.

    I have high hopes for the generation following the millennials. But they aren't being pushed enough academically.


    I'll always remember... (5.00 / 1) (#113)
    by kdog on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 11:49:21 AM EST
    the smell of those mimeographs

    I feel like I got a much higher quality public education in the 80's-90's that wasn't so geared towards standardized tests than my nieces are getting today.  We had standardized tests, but we just took them, we didn't spend half the term prepping for them.  


    Yeah, the purple ink (5.00 / 2) (#137)
    by MKS on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 02:06:13 PM EST
    The biggest difference between today and yesterday is we would just out and play unsupervised for hours and be expected to come home before dinner.

    Does anyone remember what "three Mississippis" meant?

    And, Vietnam is more in the distant past for today's kids than WWII was for us.  We all knew a WWII vet--they were everywhere....dads, neighbors, teachers....Vietnam is such an abstraction now.

    We boomers were spoiled in some ways:  we were always told we were the largest class, the class with the highest test scores, and we were getting taller too as better nutrition percolated through the generations.  Things were just getting better.  


    I remember trying to do ... (none / 0) (#142)
    by Robot Porter on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 02:14:33 PM EST
    drawings on mimeographs. It was quite a challenge.

    I remember drawing a baby seal on a mimeo for a story about Greenpeace. My drawing got picked over another student's. Because my seal's eyes looked sadder.

    But it was quite a trick to get any kind of subtlety in the line.

    I think this was middle school.


    Oh my, you are Gen X? (none / 0) (#134)
    by MKS on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 01:52:55 PM EST
    I thought you were Silent Generation, right out of Eisenhower.....

    Hardy har har ... (none / 0) (#138)
    by Robot Porter on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 02:07:53 PM EST
    I'm a very typical Gen Xer. Punked and slacked with the best of them.

    My parents are silent generation.

    I used to be one of the younger people here. And I'd get the "calm down, youngster" vibe.



    Like Me... (none / 0) (#149)
    by ScottW714 on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 02:43:56 PM EST
    ... Ted Cruz, Scott Walker, Marco Rubio, and Paul Ryan are GenXers.  3 of them running for president and the other is speaker of the house.

    If someone has asked me, I would have put Robot at over retirement age or just out of high school.


    Okay, enough with ... (5.00 / 1) (#162)
    by Robot Porter on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 04:23:09 PM EST
    the insults.

    I have a rhino hide.

    But c'mon.


    Grow Up... (none / 0) (#168)
    by ScottW714 on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 05:07:40 PM EST
    ... you are the king of insults and now you want to say enough, after you spend months insulting anyone who likes what Sanders has to say.  And while you may think I was insulting you, I was simply stating that I thought you were a child or an old man based on your comments.

    From Saturdays Open Thread:
    •  Hilarious most Bernie supporters couldn't tell you what NAFTA or TAPP even stand for. Let alone care about them.
    • I bet there a lot of Bernie supporters who've never held more than a work study or summer job.
    •  Trust me, prior to Sanders bringing up trade agreements, you could have talked to the typical Bernie supporter for 72 hours straight. And the issue would never have come up.
    • I live in the land of Bernie supporters. My FB feed is full of their fulsome nonsense.
    •  Give them participation trophies and I'm sure they'll leave.
    • You win campaigns by beating your opponent. And when your opponent's supporters are acting like fools, you make sure they and everyone around them knows it.

    Keep in mind, I didn't include the insults to Sanders himself, since Sanders doesn't comment here, that would have basically doubled the list.

    This is hardly out of the norm for you, and I have called you out on it several times.  Don't want people to think you are a child, don't act like one.


    I don't think ... (5.00 / 1) (#174)
    by Robot Porter on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 05:45:48 PM EST
    I personally insulted anyone other Talk Left user.

    I sometimes tease Captain Howdy. But we've known each other for years.  

    I don't know you at all.  

    So give the personal insults a rest.


    which is why (none / 0) (#104)
    by CST on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 11:22:42 AM EST
    Anecdotes are just that.

    Also, maybe it was just the particular way that NCLB was implemented in your school district or region.  Maybe it doesn't apply in the same ways to everyone born in 1993 all over the country.


    Millennials.. (5.00 / 1) (#120)
    by jondee on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 12:51:45 PM EST
    I'm not one myself, but I have say that some folks lately are reminding me of an older cat or dog who wants nothing more than to hunker down and nap in the sun in some corner and who gets immediately irritated and irascible in the response to the exurbence and energy of any young whippersnappers in their vicinity..

    Don't stand in the doorway, don't block up the hall..

    Of course a lot of the blame for
    this fuzzy-focused fixation on
    abstractions like Big Pharma and Corporate America can traced to the wreckage and heartache left in the wake of 2007-2008..

    If only all the proles and the little people understood that "portfolio decisions" and things like unregulated Free Trade are just expressions of the organic unfolding of the hidden laws of nature, with no relation whatsoever to quaint notions of human moral agency and civic responsibility..


    I quite like ... (none / 0) (#78)
    by Robot Porter on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 09:42:53 AM EST
    the millennials I know and work with.

    But they do have an odd view of things. I was having a discussion with one millennial, and she was arguing that her generation was still suffering from "growing up in fear".

    I honestly had no idea what she was talking about. She explained that she was referring to growing up afraid that she would be shot in school by a classmate.

    I mentioned that previous generations had grow up with fear of nuclear obliteration. And I also mentioned that living in NYC in the eighties, I had some experience with actual gun violence.

    She said, "I'm not talking about things that actually happened. I'm talking about fear."

    After being left speechless for a few moments by the absurdity of that statement, I tried to point out the problem with what she was saying. She struggled to see her statement as anything but the complete, unvarnished truth.


    To me it seems like the parents (5.00 / 1) (#79)
    by ruffian on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 09:57:54 AM EST
    of millennials passed on a lot of that ill-defined fear.  Those parents are my generation - being childless myself, I have tried to ask friends about why the 'helicopter parent' phenomena came to be - why did those kids not get to grow up as free and confident as we ourselves did. I never got a good answer. People wanting the best for their children led to a culture of over-protectiveness,

    IMO. I know righties think it is a government led "nanny state" mentality, but I don't see it that way - it is more at the personal level.


    Yes, I guess it may ... (none / 0) (#80)
    by Robot Porter on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 10:12:01 AM EST
    come from the parents.

    I'd had some experiences dealing with millennial "entitlement" before. I just didn't realize it extended to their fear.

    That just seems kind of sad.


    I (none / 0) (#87)
    by FlJoe on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 10:33:32 AM EST
    think it came more from watching their parents struggle or even go backwards in terms of wealth and income. They, unlike previous generations, have personally witnessed the degradation of the middle class in a very up close and personal way.

    Previous generations have always had the luxury of seeing no obstacles for them to equal or surpass their parents in income, wealth and quality of life. From direct experience many or even most of them have seen they can make no such assumptions anymore.


    That would only ... (none / 0) (#91)
    by Robot Porter on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 10:48:29 AM EST
    apply to the millennials whose parents are Gen Xers, many of them have baby boomer parents.

    But, whatever the cause, there's never a good excuse for stupid.

    Especially in this day and age.


    9/11.... (none / 0) (#83)
    by kdog on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 10:14:29 AM EST
    was the defining moment of these kids childhood's...I think that's a factor too in "the fear".  And their uncertain economic situation.

    It's a perfect storm of over-protective parents, nanny state, police state, and economic/higher education systems not working so well for young people.


    9/11 (none / 0) (#92)
    by CST on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 10:48:31 AM EST
    happened when I was a senior in High School.

    In a way for me it marked the end of childhood, or at least the beginning of war.

    Then there is the market crash that happened just as we were entering the job market (or in my case, shortly after entering).

    I think a lot of people hear millennial and think 22 year olds.  But the generation starts with people born in 1980, who are 35-36 now.  And it ends with people born in 2000, who were 1 year-olds when 9-11 happened.  There's a pretty big range in how these events shaped your life experiences, depending on where you sat.


    Lots of excuses ... (none / 0) (#95)
    by Robot Porter on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 10:51:31 AM EST
    for stupid.

    Doesn't cut with me.

    I quite like millennials, as I said, but they need to be called out on their nonsense.


    at least (5.00 / 1) (#96)
    by CST on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 10:53:39 AM EST
    Or simply accepted ... (none / 0) (#98)
    by Robot Porter on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 11:06:06 AM EST
    a widely popular meme


    And that term only seems to apply to so-called "climate change".

    There are many areas where millennials seem devoid of scientific reasoning. Such as an irrational fear of GMOs. Or a belief in the value of a gluten-free diet.

    Of course, there are many millennials who display little or none of their generation's classic characteristics. But that's usually because they have a stubborn streak. Or parents who actively fought the primary cultural influences. Or both.


    That's (none / 0) (#100)
    by Ga6thDem on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 11:08:59 AM EST
    just not millennials. I have some Gen X friends who are the same way.

    Ish. (none / 0) (#101)
    by Robot Porter on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 11:15:25 AM EST
    I'm a Gen Xer.

    And one of my best friends, who I'd describe as a poster child for the Gen X generation, is all-in on the gluten-free thing.

    But it does seem like her way of being "down with the kids".

    I've spent the last few decades in the hipster capital of America (Williamsburg, Brooklyn); and the Gluten-Free notion wasn't on anyone's radar until a few years ago. It's clearly a millennial obsession.


    not really (none / 0) (#102)
    by CST on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 11:18:46 AM EST
    On GMOs: "people under 45 are about 10 points more likely than their elders to think genetically modified foods are safe to eat."

    You got me on the gluten-free.  Could've thrown anti-vaccers in there too.

    But again, I'm mostly just anti-blanket statements here.

    People of all ages are highly susceptible to nonsense.


    People of all ages and ... (none / 0) (#186)
    by Robot Porter on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 06:31:25 PM EST
    political stripes are susceptible to nonsense.

    And, personally, I think believing in science isn't merely accepting the orthodoxy on one issue. It's being open to challenges to any issue.

    It wasn't that long ago that the big bang theory, global warming and comet dinosaur extinction hypothesis were fringe theories.


    And... (none / 0) (#103)
    by ScottW714 on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 11:20:28 AM EST
    ... when the government fails as spectacularly as it did during the economic collapse, the polls are looking to blame someone, and fear is part of that equation, can't blame someone without first establishing how dangerous they are.

    ISIS, Mexicans, liberals, gay folks, terrorists, someone is always out there waiting to destroy America when the politicians fail at doing there jobs, which is suppose to be protecting us from enemies, foreign and domestic.  But most of the domestic enemies have put our politicians on the payroll.

    Millennials biggest problem seems to be that they actually understand exactly what is going down, and don't like it one GD bit.  They are essentially the first generation in which going to college isn't really giving them the edge they were promised.  That no matter what they do, they will be lucky to have it as good as their parents, but most likely, the will fall far behind.

    Some of the fear is ginned up fear and some of that fear is the reality of our political system bought and paid for by Corporate America and neither party is all that concerned about shutting the dirty money spigot that is the lifeblood of modern day politics.

    It will take millennials to cure us of that evil because as far as I can tell, no other generation gives a F, including mine, because we keep voting for the same idiots who, like minorities, give us, the middle class, nothing but grand lip service before the election, but once that's over go back to serving their employers.


    This is the smallest part of the economic woes (5.00 / 1) (#118)
    by vicndabx on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 12:44:53 PM EST
    Some of the fear is ginned up fear and some of that fear is the reality of our political system bought and paid for by Corporate America and neither party is all that concerned about shutting the dirty money spigot that is the lifeblood of modern day politics.

    Millenials have it harder because the world is more interconnected and wealth in the form of higher wages (but still lower than here) is flowing to China, India, Mexico, Brazil, etc.

    The irony here is that those who support Bernie and his stop the trade screeds are working against the very core of the liberalism they claim to support. That is, in an interconnected world, everyone needs to be lifted up, not just those in wealthy countries.

    Liberalism for me, none for thee.


    I can (none / 0) (#86)
    by Ga6thDem on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 10:28:23 AM EST
    answer some of that. First of all the idea of holding parents responsible for the behavior of their children took hold sometime in those years. Secondly cable news with the nonstop child abduction stories made people think that their children were just waiting to be abducted by some pedophile. Then you have NCLB and not teaching thinking skills in the school. I can see the big difference between my two boys who are 8 1/2 years apart. The younger one growing up without NCLB thinks a lot more than the older one.

    9/11 has pretty much nothing to do with it as far as mine is concerned. They have moved past that or least that is what I see with my 23 year old.

    Also the criminal laws are a problem. Back when I was growing up you screwed up, got yelled at by a judge and that was the end of it. These days you can carry a criminal record for the rest of your life over one stupid mistake. A friend of my 23 year old son's was with someone who was shoplifting. She got charged with accessory just for going shopping with her even though she had no idea the girl was shoplifting.

    Nanny state? That one just leaves me shaking my head. What nanny state? Parents have never had less help with their children than they have had this last 10 years or so.


    Enough with the millennial bashing. (none / 0) (#108)
    by caseyOR on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 11:33:19 AM EST
    They are young people, just as many of us once were. And, IIRC, our parents were just as critical and despairing of us as so many commenters here seem to be of millennials.

    Young people today react to the world, and form their opinions, based on their experiences, both individual and collective, and the general culture of their social group. Just like baby boomers did, and really, still do. Their world experience is limited due to their age. So, some of the opinions they hold now may well change as they accrue more life experience.

    Additionally, just as there is no standard one-size-fits-all boomer or Gen Xer, millennials are not monolithic. Their worldviews differ based on a number of things- class status, location, parents, quality of education, race, sexual orientation, etc.

    From what I can tell, the bulk of Sanders supporters in the millennial group are white, middle class, in college, intending to go to college or recently finished with college. Not all of his young supporters fit this description, but that is mostly who I see at his rallies and whose comments pepper the online forums I read. Hardly representative of all young people.

    We all make decisions, including for whom to vote, based the multiple facets of our life experience and what we hope is our enlightened self interest.. Why should young people be any different?


    Funny, ain't it, CaseyOR, (5.00 / 1) (#117)
    by Mr Natural on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 12:06:21 PM EST
    that description - "young, college age, idealists" - fit a lot of us, a few or more years ago.

    I'm perfectly willing to be crotchety regarding local politics.

    But I'm not willing to sneer off the aspirations and ideals of a generation that I once was, thirty or so years ago.


    Neither am I (none / 0) (#122)
    by jondee on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 01:03:41 PM EST
    though, the new bumpsticker around here seems to be Never Trust Anyone Under Thirty (or anyone who can still get it up) ;-)

    Revision needed sir... (none / 0) (#155)
    by kdog on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 03:30:20 PM EST
    trust no one under 30, and no over 75 who speaks in a way that those under 30 can hear it.  

    Are you suggesting, Mr. Natural, (none / 0) (#166)
    by caseyOR on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 04:52:42 PM EST
    that I am sneering off the aspirations and ideals of the millenials, or any other group? If that is your takeaway from my comment then I worded that comment poorly.

    The point I was trying to make was that we all, regardless of demographic group, form opinions based on our experiences. My life experience as a baby boomer may be different from that of a Gen-Xer or millenial, but it is neither more valid nor less valid than theirs.


    You weren't sneering or disparaging anyone, Casey (none / 0) (#175)
    by Mr Natural on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 05:50:10 PM EST
    Why do we jump to ... (5.00 / 1) (#145)
    by Robot Porter on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 02:26:04 PM EST
    a term like "bashing" so quickly?  One can be critical without "bashing" anyone.

    I like millennials. I said that from the jump. I work in the entertainment biz. So they're a regular part of my life.

    And, remember, they're not all kids. The oldest millennials are now in their thirties. So they can't get away with the "we're kids" excuse anymore.

    They seem similar to baby boomers in many ways. But I'm a Gen Xer. And my parents are silent generation. And they're very different than both those groups in how they approach almost everything.


    Etan Patz (none / 0) (#112)
    by jmacWA on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 11:43:15 AM EST
    IMO the way the media played this got all those rotors spinning.

    I think anytime (none / 0) (#88)
    by CST on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 10:43:20 AM EST
    You try to make blanket statements about a group that contains 83 million people you're going to run into some trouble.

    For example, as a group, millennials are significantly less white than previous generations (43% non-white).  But I have a sneaking suspicion most of the comments here are primarily referring to white millennials.

    Also, anecdotes are just that.


    To be fair (none / 0) (#132)
    by jbindc on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 01:39:24 PM EST
    That's where the vast majority of Bernie's millenial support is coming from - white college-educated (or some college), middle to uppper middle class millenials.

    true (none / 0) (#144)
    by CST on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 02:25:49 PM EST
    But the original comment didn't say anything about Bernie.  Although I guess considering the subject it could be implied.

    Inferred, (none / 0) (#148)
    by NYShooter on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 02:40:44 PM EST
    "....it could be inferred."

    (yeah, I know, I suck)


    touche (none / 0) (#150)
    by CST on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 02:46:56 PM EST
    Sorry about my terrible edumacation.

    Sanders Garners the Four Pinocchios (5.00 / 2) (#53)
    by CoralGables on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 06:49:08 AM EST
    from the Washington Post on his claim that he has released his tax returns.

    And Three Pinocchios ... (5.00 / 3) (#73)
    by Robot Porter on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 09:13:39 AM EST
    a few days ago for the fossil fuel thing.

    He's building a Pinocchio army!


    DWS update (5.00 / 2) (#55)
    by ragebot on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 07:31:26 AM EST
    Not sure how big a deal half a mill is but it is better than any other challenger has done.  Seems like Debbie may face a some what real contest in the primary.

    I need to point out this link came up in a group I think all folks (fishcamp, Coral Gables, FlJoe I am looking at you) not only in Florida but the US as well should follow.  The sugar barons have been destroying South Florida for well over fifty years.  But the recent water release has made a mockery of claims by pols they care about the environment.  Both Hillary and Debbie have a history of being pawns of big sugar.  Hope they both pay for this.

    Note however I said mockery of all pols since this is a bipartisan issue.  Both the Republicans and Democrats are guilty of destroying the Florida coast South of Lake O.

    ragebot (none / 0) (#65)
    by CoralGables on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 08:37:24 AM EST
    your "one is as bad as the other" attempt is like saying the child molesting murderer is the same as the guy hustling cigarettes from the Indian reservation on the street corner.

    I'm not buying what you're selling. Republicans run the state of Florida and have been Big Sugar's biggest benefactors and you know that no matter your attempt to link the two parties.


    One more time (none / 0) (#69)
    by ragebot on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 09:03:05 AM EST
    When Castro took over Cuba the US stopped buying sugar from them and the Fuljal brothers fled with their fortune and bought up EAA land to grow and produce sugar.  Later not only quotas on foreign sugar but price supports as well not only increased domestic sugar prices above the world market price but also increased the bill to US tax payers.  These are federal programs.  It is true federal pols ceded federal EPA control to the FDEP of pollution from the sugar barons, but again this was a federal issue.

    Not saying Florida pols have not done their part in supporting the sugar barons, just that Florida is a single state.  The sugar barons have been bipartisan in bribing pols on both sides of the aisle.  But for many years Florida was run by Democrats when the sugar barons began their destruction of the EAA.  The jonney come lately Republicans just continued the policy the Democrats started in the 1960s.   A pox on both their houses.


    One (none / 0) (#75)
    by FlJoe on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 09:34:03 AM EST
    more time, WTF does Hillary have to do with all this? I agree that there should be a POX on both houses for the sins of big sugar but to lay the malfeasance of Democrats from half a century ago on Hillary's shoulders is pure unadulterated CDS.

    Just for reference, this cycles donations from Agribusiness

    Rubio, Marco (R)  $6,283,970
    Bush, Jeb (R)     $3,228,405
    Huckabee, Mike    $3,088,542
    Paul, Rand (R)    $1,285,952
    Carson, Ben (R)   $969,607
    Cruz, Ted (R)     $890,276
    Clinton, Hillary  $722,616
    Christie, Chris   $396,300
    Perry, Rick       $381,600
    Kasich, John (R)  $340,912
    Sanders, Bernie   $318,579

    Source: OpenSecrets.org

     You tell me who is in who's pocket.


    If the Florida problem isn't being fixed, (none / 0) (#85)
    by CoralGables on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 10:16:19 AM EST
    then those running the Florida shop are the problem.

    The four people at the helm are:

    Governor Rick Scott (R),  Florida Commissioner of Agriculture Adam Putnam (R), Florida State Senator Joe Negron (R), and Florida State House Representative Matt Caldwell (R).


    If federal price supports and subsidies ... (none / 0) (#147)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 02:38:59 PM EST
    ... are primarily responsible for maintaining Florida's sugar production at its current level, then why is the last sugar plantation in the Hawaiian Islands closing on Maui later this year?

    If you really seek much-needed change to this ecologically unfriendly industry, then you ought to look to Tallahassee and not Washington for your solution. Big Sugar phased out in Hawaii because local government support in terms of providing a lax regulatory environment and cheap labor supply was no longer the given it once was, back in the day when the plantation system was in its prime and our islands provided up to one-third the total amount of sugar consumed in this country.



    For your edification (none / 0) (#170)
    by Mr Natural on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 05:21:12 PM EST
    Wikipedia's list of Florida governors.

    The republicans may be in charge now, but that's a relatively new phenomenon.

    the information age: it's what's for dinner.


    More Sanders being uncorrupt and prescient (5.00 / 1) (#57)
    by Dadler on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 07:40:17 AM EST
    Why are you (5.00 / 2) (#58)
    by jbindc on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 07:41:24 AM EST
    Repeating this Sanders / right wing lie?

    And for heaven's sake TIME PHUCKING WARNER is a huge contributor to her campaign, for one, and that has gotten her the kid gloves treatment from them.

    It Just Isn't True.

    Here is the chart (5.00 / 3) (#59)
    by jbindc on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 07:46:46 AM EST
    from OpenSecrets.

    Please look at the chart carefully and then read the bottom paragraph:

    This table lists the top donors to this candidate in 1999-2016. The organizations themselves did not donate, rather the money came from the organizations' PACs, their individual members or employees or owners, and those individuals' immediate families.

    So,people who work for (and are families of) gave money to her over a 20 year period.

    Jeebus, Bernie supporters keep telling us they're smarter than everyone, but they can't read a simple chart.


    I find it funny (5.00 / 2) (#158)
    by Anc260 on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 04:09:01 PM EST
    That most Sanders supporters are fundamentally ignorant regarding how campaign donations work. Considering they never shut up about it, you'd think they'd take 5 minutes to research the topic.

    Where are the Americans in the Panama Papers? (5.00 / 2) (#67)
    by Dadler on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 08:42:02 AM EST
    When the going gets weird (none / 0) (#202)
    by ragebot on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 09:48:55 PM EST
    Dadler, congratulations to your wife on (5.00 / 3) (#90)
    by vml68 on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 10:43:55 AM EST
    her promotion.

    And heaven forbid Sanders hasn't decided the best way to go about it yet, hasn't tried to spin bullsh*t.

    Sanders has been railing against the Big banks and financial corruption for years. How is it even remotely possible that he has not decided on the best way to go about it yet? Breaking up the banks will have global repercussions. If he is not able to articulate how he is going to do this by now and expects to be elected President by the end of this year, he is an even bigger dreamer than I thought.

    I am not going to comment on your rant about Hillary. For some reason you get a bit unhinged where she is concerned.
    Sanders is not a bad man but he is no saint and now that he is in the limelight, it is becoming more apparent day by day, just how much of a regular politician he truly is.


    If you get a chance (5.00 / 1) (#188)
    by jbindc on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 07:45:07 PM EST
    Check out tomorrow's NYDN front page (sorry, I can't link, but it"s all iver Twitter).

    Positively brutal for Bernie, and no it doesn't have anything to do with his disastrous interview yestetday).

    Do you mean this "Sandy Hook" (5.00 / 2) (#191)
    by caseyOR on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 08:10:12 PM EST
    Well (none / 0) (#192)
    by Ga6thDem on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 08:46:24 PM EST
    that is what is all over twitter besides Bernie's disastrous interview.

    Oh no... The Antonin Scalia (5.00 / 2) (#203)
    by desertswine on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 09:55:09 PM EST
    School of Law, or ASSOL.  I guess they're going to change it.

    Dadler's rant (5.00 / 1) (#204)
    by Jeralyn on Wed Apr 06, 2016 at 03:15:00 AM EST
    against Hillary was deleted. It was libelous, failed to present his view as his opinion rather than fact, and was a personal attack on her.  

    I have caught a couple of episodes (none / 0) (#1)
    by CaptHowdy on Mon Apr 04, 2016 at 02:35:18 PM EST
    Of Weediquitte and Gaycation on VICE.   I've really liked some of the docs on HBO.   I think I like the idea of the channel maybe more than the channel itself.

    Speaking of HBO docs (5.00 / 1) (#3)
    by ruffian on Mon Apr 04, 2016 at 03:05:50 PM EST
    I was up way too late last night watching the 'Paradise Lost' 3 film series about the West Memphis 3. I only had a vague idea that is was going to be about 3 young men that were wrongfully convicted. Did not expect the series to span 17 years and be so well done and powerful. And I did not know anything about the victims and horrible nature of the crime. The doc starts right off with that. What struck me was how the powers that be really took advantage of the economically disadvantaged, and in some cases emotionally and mentally disadvantaged, nature of the town. They were so ready to believe these kids did the crime because the smart sounding people in the suits told them so. And a low IQ kid interrogated for 12 hours gives a false confession to get the heck out of there....and of course he does not get out and neither do his friends, not for a long time.

    Anyway I highly recommend if you have not seen it yet. But maybe don't start the 6 hours at 7:30 pm!  It is available on Netflix DVDs, but not Netflix streaming. I hadn't realized it was an HBO production until watching the first one off my Netflix Q, so I watched the other 2 on HBO Go.


    I have been pushing this story (none / 0) (#4)
    by CaptHowdy on Mon Apr 04, 2016 at 03:15:53 PM EST
    And set of docs for decades.  I use to talk about it here but n one seemed to interested.   There is those three Paradise Lost films and there is another more recent one called West of Memphis.

    West of Memphis is excellent also.

    And if you are into it I really recommend Mara Leveretts great book The Devils Knot.  The book is absolutely chilling.  It's a breathtaking miscarriage of justice. And it makes the point that the injustices in the justice system are often as much about class as race.

    I followed that story from the very beginning not only because it's less than 100 miles from here but I actually knew relatives of Stevie Branch.

    Yes highly recommend.  


    I was wondering if you had followed it at the time (none / 0) (#5)
    by ruffian on Mon Apr 04, 2016 at 03:22:10 PM EST
    Thanks for the book recommendation - I saw that book listed on wiki and was wondering if it was good.

    Those poor families. Just heartbreaking to begin with, and then not have any answers after all these years. Any theories about who did it? I was hoping for something more definitive but I guess that's not the way life works.

    The turnaround on the one adopted father they focused on for a while was amazing. I cried at the letters he exchanged with one of the convicted ones toward the end.


    The Atom Egoyan film, "Devil's Knot" (5.00 / 1) (#37)
    by McBain on Mon Apr 04, 2016 at 09:17:45 PM EST
    is also worth seeing if you're into this story.  It has a different feel/style than the docs do.  Damien Echols didn't want to be a part of it for some reason that had to do with his wife, I believe, but the other two (Baldwin and Misskelley) were involved.

    It's pretty scary how quickly people were willing to believe the satanic cult story pitched by the prosecution and their "expert".  Something similar happened in the Amanda Knox case.... forced confession, satanic ritual BS... so it's not just our country that's a little crazy.


    Me and a Friend.... (none / 0) (#8)
    by ScottW714 on Mon Apr 04, 2016 at 04:54:46 PM EST
    ... did that with Making a Murderer.  Stayed up all night watching the 10 episodes I think, but it was on a weekend.

    It was like at some point, we were like 'WTF are the cops gonna pull out the A's, next ?'

    They never failed to shock, and that is bone chilling.  I saw Paradise Lost a long time ago, will have to check this out. on a non-school night.


    I did that one the night before Christmas (none / 0) (#33)
    by ruffian on Mon Apr 04, 2016 at 08:51:59 PM EST
    Eve when I had to make a 7 hr drive. That was crazy!

    Bone chilling is a perfect word.


    Without those docs they would still be in prison (none / 0) (#36)
    by McBain on Mon Apr 04, 2016 at 09:06:38 PM EST
    if not executed.

    And a low IQ kid interrogated for 12 hours gives a false confession to get the heck out of there....and of course he does not get out and neither do his friends, not for a long time.

    How many times does that have to happen before someone puts an end to the nonsense?  Same thing happened to Brendan Dassey/Steve Avery.

    Stories like these are why I believe money trumps race in regards to getting a fair shake in the legal system.


    I agree it is justa as much about class (none / 0) (#77)
    by ruffian on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 09:39:21 AM EST
    than race. Of course there is a huge overlap also.

    Anyone the authorities think they can take advantage of is vulnerable.

    Before I saw the doc, I admit my prejudices about the south made me assume the defendants were black kids. then it became clear how disadvantaged these guys were : economically, emotionally, mentally...it is just infuriating in so many ways. The state railroading these guys just to get the case closed and the public off their backs, while the killer remains free. God knows how many other kids have been killed, if this was done by someone off the highway. I don't now how the investigators and judge sleep at night.


    The host of Weediquette... (none / 0) (#2)
    by kdog on Mon Apr 04, 2016 at 02:55:26 PM EST
    seems pretty cool, I like him.  I caught the episode about medical marijuana to treat ptsd in the war vets, as opposed to VA dispensed opiates. It was interesting and infuriating.

    I cracked up when the host is on the phone with his mom and she's like "don't smoke it on television!", cut to the host toking on a fat bowl on television.



    Yes very funny (none / 0) (#6)
    by CaptHowdy on Mon Apr 04, 2016 at 04:40:52 PM EST
    I saw that.

    Wiscosin Weirdness (none / 0) (#9)
    by Robot Porter on Mon Apr 04, 2016 at 05:21:40 PM EST
    There's something weird about the numbers in the state on the Dem side. And I think this explains the divergent polls.

    Two polls were released today. One had Clinton up by 1%, the other had Sanders up by 8%.  Even more divergence was seen last week, Thursday also saw two polls released. One had Clinton up by 6%, the other had Sanders up by 6%.

    And I believe this has happened because the raw data doesn't make sense. What I can intuit from the some of these polls is that both candidates are weaker than expected in the geographic areas they should be strong. And polling firms are trying to adjust for this as best they can.

    This suggests greater homogeneity than is common for the state.

    What do you make out of (5.00 / 1) (#10)
    by jbindc on Mon Apr 04, 2016 at 05:28:58 PM EST
    The fact that Bernie had a rally in MADISON last night in what looked like the UW basketball arena that only had about 5000 people at it?  Very empty.

    More weirdness. (none / 0) (#12)
    by Robot Porter on Mon Apr 04, 2016 at 06:11:41 PM EST
    Madison should be Sanders country.

    But as some of the polling indicates, and that incident suggests, it's not as strong for Bernie as you would think.

    One wonders if something about Sanders doesn't jibe with the Wisconsin progressive tradition.  On the surface, he would seem to fit the La Follette model. But Wisconsin is very much its own place. With its own idiosyncrasies. And I don't pretend to fully understand them.


    Sanders' anti-stem cell research votes (5.00 / 4) (#15)
    by Towanda on Mon Apr 04, 2016 at 06:31:24 PM EST
    are being talked about by former governor Jim Doyle -- who also points out Clinton's support for stem cell research.  That is a big issue in Madison, as  a leader in stem cell research at the university, which has led to a lot of spinoff businesses there.

    But Madison still will go big for Sanders, for other reasons.  As for the crowd of 4,400 at the Sanders rally, in a venue for 17,000, that was poor planning.  And it was the third Sanders rally on the campus in little more than a week, for pity's sake.  Who wants to hear the same speech again?


    I have (5.00 / 1) (#20)
    by Ga6thDem on Mon Apr 04, 2016 at 06:42:49 PM EST
    to wonder if it hasn't set in with some that Sanders is pretty much done and voting for him is more or less pointless at this point.

    I have no idea why ... (none / 0) (#16)
    by Robot Porter on Mon Apr 04, 2016 at 06:35:19 PM EST
    anyone wants to hear Sanders' stump speech once.

    So, do you think Wisconsin (none / 0) (#24)
    by caseyOR on Mon Apr 04, 2016 at 07:58:26 PM EST
    will be a Sanders win? Or will Clinton win outside of Madison?

    Sanders (5.00 / 3) (#40)
    by Towanda on Mon Apr 04, 2016 at 10:10:45 PM EST
    and not only because it's an open primary.  Wisconsin is not a good state for women (in this and many things.  Remember, its 17-point margin for Obama was a major blow for Clinton in 2008.

    But there are so many factors that make it crazy to predict; for example, to open-primary add same-day registration.  It's a state that's always second in the nation for youth turnout, and that will be even more yuuuge tomorrow -- if the youth have gotten the message as to all that they have to do with Walker's voter ID and other voter-suppression laws.  That could cause problems for Sanders in Madison -- but far more so for Clinton in Milwaukee, because the main target of the voter-ID and voter-suppression laws is minorities.  (Obama's DoJ really let us down on prosecuting those laws, despite an excellent team of researchers who put together a perfect case.)  

    So, I do predict that there will be talk of problems at the polls -- but because too many media will not have done the homework to understand how predictable are the problems . . . just as Walker and the Kochs planned.  


    It's an open primary (none / 0) (#25)
    by jbindc on Mon Apr 04, 2016 at 08:06:09 PM EST
    Sanders tends to do well in open primaries.

    Just (5.00 / 4) (#18)
    by Ga6thDem on Mon Apr 04, 2016 at 06:39:53 PM EST
    my 2 cents but outside of the hardcore Bernie supporters most are admitting it is over. His campaign staff spilling to the NYT that they know it's over kind of says it all. It's all about woulda coulda shoulda.

    Of course, Patrick Healy who wrote the article can't even write an article about Hillary without sliming her. I will never figure these people out and what is wrong with them and why they can't write a normal article.


    Ga6th: Patrick Healy is a doozy (5.00 / 1) (#43)
    by christinep on Mon Apr 04, 2016 at 10:32:56 PM EST
    Leading up to the 2008 primary, the same Healy authored a NYT article that focused on what he calculated to be the number of nights the Clintons spent under the same roof in Chappaqua, etc.  Talk about sleaze ... at least, tho,  that would-be journalist didn't try to calculate the amount of toilet paper used or when they clipped their toenails.  Since that article, I assume that whenever Healy writes about anything Clinton, he will include a side jab or sneer at HRC. He always meets that assumption.

    Emerson poll is useless (5.00 / 1) (#14)
    by Towanda on Mon Apr 04, 2016 at 06:27:58 PM EST
    as it only uses landlines.  

    I would think landline-only favors Clinton (none / 0) (#51)
    by Anc260 on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 03:21:09 AM EST
    Thats why I'm expecting a significant loss for her. That and the fact that Sanders seems to be winning the early voting. The signs seem to point to a big win for him.

    Depends on what theyve done to compensate (none / 0) (#82)
    by FreakyBeaky on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 10:14:07 AM EST
    If anything. It's still possible to get a representative sample - but a lot harder / less likely.

    I really (5.00 / 1) (#17)
    by FlJoe on Mon Apr 04, 2016 at 06:36:05 PM EST
    just see noise in a very tight race, Sanders got a bit of a momentum bump winning 5 out of the last states roiling the numbers a bit in his favor. I think at this moment a  Bernie has a slight lead and should pull out a low single digit win, at least if the independents show up and vote on the Democratic side, which is probably the hardest thing to model in this crazy year.

    Not many contests this ... (none / 0) (#19)
    by Robot Porter on Mon Apr 04, 2016 at 06:42:29 PM EST
    cycle have shown a 12 point variance less than a week out that flips the results. And the Madison and Milwaukee numbers look wrong.

    Definitely (none / 0) (#30)
    by FlJoe on Mon Apr 04, 2016 at 08:30:33 PM EST
    throw out the Emerson poll, but every poll, but one, after the 22nd after pegs Bernie  48 or 49 Link with Hillary's numbers being more volatile (but not wildy so) 43-49. Bottom line, throw out the outliers and Bernie has remained very steady in the upper 40's while Hillary has hung around the mid forties swapping points with undecided depending on the pollster.

    I haven't looked at any geographical splits, but the topline steadiness of Bernie's numbers doesn't seem to indicate any underlying problem in that regard.


    So other than the ... (none / 0) (#34)
    by Robot Porter on Mon Apr 04, 2016 at 08:55:34 PM EST
    fact that you haven't look at the issue I'm discussing, you see no problem.



    The (none / 0) (#68)
    by FlJoe on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 08:55:04 AM EST
    original discussion was about your view of the "divergent" poll numbers. I merely asserted that by applying a reasonable filter(IE. disregarding some outliers)the polling seems very reasonable for a ~48/~46 race with typical noise.

    If you want to argue that it is not a 48/46 race, that's fine, but you cite zero specifics, just some completely vague "weirdness" and "strangeness" in the numbers. Kind of hard to even discuss that.


    Even if Sanders wins (none / 0) (#81)
    by Towanda on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 10:13:03 AM EST
    by 20 points in Wisconsin, 60-40, keep in mind that by the end of the day (or night), Clinton still would be more than 200 delegates ahead -- in pledged delegates.  

    And the Sanders campaign then would follow with another blowout in fundraising -- including from students who think that they can afford to keep adding their donations to their credit-card debt, in addition to their student-loan debt, because they are counting on "free college."  I overheard exactly that conversation in a student lounge last week.  Sad.    


    Speaking of docs (none / 0) (#11)
    by CaptHowdy on Mon Apr 04, 2016 at 06:10:32 PM EST
    HBO has a Maplethorpe doc tonight "Mapplethorpe: Look at the Pictures".  

    NYTimes review

    Mapplethorpe didn't flinch. (5.00 / 1) (#21)
    by Mr Natural on Mon Apr 04, 2016 at 07:23:05 PM EST
    But America sure did! (none / 0) (#46)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Mon Apr 04, 2016 at 11:11:13 PM EST
    Then again, where exactly is it written that one's artistic expression necessarily has to be both pleasing to another's sense of good taste AND within the acceptable (if highly arbitrary) bounds of conventional propriety?

    Oh, that's right. It's in the GOP platform. Never mind. My bad. I'm going to go stare at a painting of gods playing poker for an hour as penance.


    lol, with an homage (none / 0) (#47)
    by Mr Natural on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 01:08:02 AM EST
    to the acrylic on velvet dogs on the wall.

    My first exposure to Maplethorpe's work (5.00 / 1) (#32)
    by vml68 on Mon Apr 04, 2016 at 08:48:11 PM EST
    was my freshman year in college. My job was to catalog all the new books that came in.
    Picture me, fresh of the boat from an arab country that censors any reference or images of sexuality, nudity, etc. As bizarre as it may sound, I was not aware of the concept of homosexuality when I first came to this country.

    To say that the Maplethorpe book was an "eye opener", would be a major understatement to say the least!


    Coming to the U.S. must (5.00 / 1) (#45)
    by caseyOR on Mon Apr 04, 2016 at 10:46:06 PM EST
    have been such a cultural shock for you.

    Wow (none / 0) (#172)
    by CaptHowdy on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 05:35:54 PM EST
    Welcome to America!

    Watching that doc last night, which was excellent, was quite the trip down memory lane.   I was in NY in this period.   One thing that made me laugh was the parts about the Mineshaft.  The notorious gay club that was one of the first places to be closed when the AIDS crisis hit.
    True story.  One night I went to this club with some other folks.   The truth is a very small percentage of the customers participated in the "floor show" but the show was all customers.   Most people went there for the show.  It has a bit of a freak show feel. Even tho you may have known some of the freaks.  Anyway, one of the people in my party that I met for the first time that night was a man who had just been kicked out f his home (arguably understandably) by his wife because he had realized he was gay after 10 years of marriage and two kids.  She never allowed him to see his kids again, that's another story.
    So we, our little group, was standing around watching one of the "attractions".  
    Keep in mind this guy was not that different from you in this environment.  He had never seen anything like this before.  Or even anything close..
    So we are standing there, he is standing in front of me and he faints   Dead away.  Just drops like a stone.  I was in love before he hit the floor.
    From that day forward we were involved for about 10 years.


    LOL! Speaking of fainting... (5.00 / 1) (#179)
    by vml68 on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 06:05:10 PM EST
    I was talking to my parents a couple of weeks ago and my mother mentioned a transvestite that she saw when she was on a trip with some friends. She commented that the transvestite was so beautiful that she could not imagine any guy not falling for her.
    Somehow, the topic turned to homosexuality (something I have never ever discussed with them before because I was afraid to hear their views on it) and my mom looks at me sternly and says "gay people are normal" and my father chimes in with "plus gay marriage is legal", like they were expecting me to argue with them. I about fell of my chair. Words I never expected to hear from my very conservative Catholic parents!
    And, to think I have hidden the fact that my best friend is a lesbian from them all these years because I was afraid they would say something rude to her!

    That's awsum (none / 0) (#181)
    by CaptHowdy on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 06:12:38 PM EST
    And a sign of the times.  In a sense that was the core meaning of that documentary.   The changing times.

    The title "Look at the Pictures" is taken from a senate floor speech by Jesse Helms, which is the opening scenes, in which he is denouncing Mapplethorpe and his work by saying just "look at the pictures"  and ends with his towering artistic and financial success.


    Infinity (none / 0) (#180)
    by TrevorBolder on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 06:05:48 PM EST
    A college friend was interning in NYC one summer, and and invited me to a club in Manhattan his city friends introduced him to.

    This naive young suburbanite had a jaw dropping night.

    Will always have fond memories when I hear the song, Disco Inferno.
    Burn Baby Burn , Disco INferno

    The night Infinity burned to the ground



    What year was this (none / 0) (#182)
    by CaptHowdy on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 06:13:39 PM EST
    If I can ask?  

    Probably (none / 0) (#183)
    by TrevorBolder on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 06:19:28 PM EST
    Summer of 77 or 78. Made a couple more trips back, brought some suburbanite friends, wanted to see their jaws drop, lol

    Ah (none / 0) (#184)
    by CaptHowdy on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 06:22:25 PM EST
    I ask because as you probably know everything changed right around that time or shortly after that.  But that was definitely early enough to see some jaw dropping stuff.

    It was (none / 0) (#185)
    by TrevorBolder on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 06:27:47 PM EST
    Quite different than what we frequented on Long Island.
    The guys that my friend met were Bensonhurst Bennies, Tony Manero all the way.
    People selling and smoking joints, veritable drug store in there.
    The professional party people dancing on the ledge  around the building.
    Then some girl asked me to go to the Mattress room,
    I almost passed out.

    It's a funny thing (none / 0) (#187)
    by CaptHowdy on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 06:42:18 PM EST
    I spent a bit less than 10 years in Manhattan but it was a defining time in my life.

    As evidence of that a very large percentage of my dreams to this day take place in NYC.  Not a few revolve around nightlife and the preparation for nightlife.

    I am totally ok with this.


    I like that it's runnng (none / 0) (#13)
    by CaptHowdy on Mon Apr 04, 2016 at 06:26:12 PM EST
    Right after Magic Mike XXL

    The saddest part of that doc (none / 0) (#176)
    by CaptHowdy on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 05:51:51 PM EST
    Was seeing what happened to all those beautiful people.

    Peter Berlin.  Omg no.   I don't want to see and remember Peter Berlin in his 60s.  That's just to sad.

    I joke of course.  To a point.  The really sad part was that Mapplethorpe never was officially able to age but the last images of him looked as if he did.   The thing ends with his huge triumphant show that he attended looking just terrible.  One commenter described it as a massive wake with a living corpse.

    Very sad.  But somehow uplifting.  Robert got what he always wanted.  It cost him his life.  But he might have thought that was a fair price.

    One thing for sure.  He will forever be the living afflatus of that sad era.


    I saw (none / 0) (#22)
    by Ga6thDem on Mon Apr 04, 2016 at 07:40:31 PM EST
    a tweet today that opined is this going to be the first time that people who have the most money (Bush and Sanders) lose a primary to candidates with less money (Hillary and Trump).

    With all the screaming about money in politics it is an interesting thought.

    Hillary has far more money than Sanders (5.00 / 2) (#61)
    by Dadler on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 07:51:40 AM EST
    Just researched that claim. Hillary has a much bigger campaign chest still, and has almost twice as much cash on hand.

    Yes (5.00 / 3) (#63)
    by Ga6thDem on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 08:15:22 AM EST
    she has more cash on hand however I believe Sanders has raised more money but has blown through it at an alarming rate.

    If, and that's a big if, (none / 0) (#156)
    by jondee on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 03:33:49 PM EST
    it was the first time in history, how does that in any way refute the thesis that money has played too much of a part in politics?

    Just ironic (none / 0) (#159)
    by Ga6thDem on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 04:13:49 PM EST
    that the candidate screaming the most about it has the most of it. But since it's St. Bernard it's okay. His money is pure and unsullied unlike everybody else's money.

    To Say You Have Lost All Objectivity... (none / 0) (#161)
    by ScottW714 on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 04:17:05 PM EST
    ... would be putting it mildly.

    I left (none / 0) (#171)
    by Ga6thDem on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 05:23:24 PM EST
    off the snark tag. I forget sometimes sarcasm doesn't translate on blogs.

    Comedy Gold (none / 0) (#48)
    by Mr Natural on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 01:10:03 AM EST
    Former U.S. tax judge charged with cheating on her tax returns

    A retired U.S. tax judge and her husband have been charged in Minnesota with cheating the government of $400,000 in taxes in a scheme that treated personal spending such as jewelry, pilates classes and overseas vacations as business expenses, prosecutors said on Monday.

    I know so many people that play (none / 0) (#130)
    by ruffian on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 01:32:06 PM EST
    games with business expenses like that. Of course they are not tax judges...I guess the tax judges thought they had learned a few tricks.  

    I Have a Friend... (none / 0) (#133)
    by ScottW714 on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 01:50:35 PM EST
    ... that used to have his own business, same silly S, anything his shady accountant told him was deductible, he ran with full speed.

    Willful ignorance, he once tried to deduct a home theater projector that 'fell off a truck'.

    Much like the judge, that didn't work out well for my friend.  No charges, just a humongous bill once they audited.


    How much do the super-rich hide from taxes? (none / 0) (#66)
    by Dadler on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 08:39:07 AM EST
    Fox owns part of Vice (none / 0) (#70)
    by Dadler on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 09:06:40 AM EST
    The absurdities never end.

    Jeff Weaver (none / 0) (#71)
    by jbindc on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 09:08:40 AM EST
    Sanders' campaign manager, just said on TV that a) Sanders thinks he can win at the convention and b) they would not encourage young people to vote for Hillary if she's the nominee.

    Jeff Weaver (5.00 / 1) (#72)
    by Ga6thDem on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 09:12:13 AM EST
    enabling Trump one voter at a time.

    I understand that losing ... (5.00 / 1) (#74)
    by Robot Porter on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 09:17:31 AM EST
    sucks. Most of the campaigns I worked on were losing campaigns.

    But Weaver et al are getting silly. Someone needs to have a chat with them.


    Krugman (5.00 / 2) (#76)
    by Ga6thDem on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 09:38:58 AM EST
    already told them they need to start acting like responsible grown ups. I guess that message fell on deaf ears.

    There are also (none / 0) (#105)
    by jbindc on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 11:23:06 AM EST
    Superdelegate "hit lists" being put out by some Sanders supporters that list the contact information of all the superdelegates, with the idea that these people can be harassed in to supporting Sanders.

    Question... (none / 0) (#107)
    by ScottW714 on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 11:28:39 AM EST
    ... would it be physically possible for Sanders or Trump to run as Independents if they don't get the nomination?  Would they have the credentials or the time to get on the ballot as an 'I' ?

    Either one could almost guarantee their party a loss and from what I can tell, neither would lose much sleep over it.  Sanders would do it thinking he could win, and Trump doing it because he is a man-child.


    fwiw (none / 0) (#109)
    by CST on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 11:33:55 AM EST
    Sanders has stated multiple times he has no intention of doing this.  I have no reason not to believe him.

    Trump on the other hand...


    As a Person Who Has Like Sanders... (none / 0) (#127)
    by ScottW714 on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 01:27:15 PM EST
    ... ideas, a lot, seems like he can't see the writing on the wall and with all the cash coming in, and his sincere belief he could win...

    I just feel like the conditions are right, not that I am suggesting it, just saying it doesn't seem like Sanders is going to pack it up and call it a day when he should.


    I think Sanders is committed to ... (5.00 / 1) (#151)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 02:46:57 PM EST
    ... running out the string, and I believe he owes that to his supporters. Further, arriving in Philadelphia with 40% of pledged delegates is going to give him no small amount of leverage in influencing the party platform and leadership, which was his primary goal for entering the race in the first place.

    Donald, do you see many (none / 0) (#152)
    by jondee on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 03:01:15 PM EST
    similarities between Sander's run and Jerry Brown's run in 1990?

    Not really. (5.00 / 1) (#199)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 09:42:30 PM EST
    For starters, Bernie Sanders is currently doing much better than did Jerry Brown, whose last win in 1992 was in the Connecticut primary. That proved to be his last hurrah, after that he was decisively beaten.

    Secondly, I'm not currently supporting Sanders, whereas I supported Brown. But once the '92 nomination was decided, I was fully on board with Bill Clinton and didn't think twice about it.

    So, if Sanders somehow does manage to pull it off and gain the nomination, I wouldn't hesitate for one nanosecond to do the same for him. The times are such right now that if the greater Democratic community doesn't hang together as a collective, then we'll all likely hang separately.

    To that extent, I expect everyone who calls himself or herself a liberal or progressive to rally around the Democratic nominee, regardless of whoever that nominee is. Anyone who doesn't or who refuses is really nothing more than a leftist poseur whose concerns begin and end in the first person singular, any and all protestations to the contrary notwithstanding.



    True (none / 0) (#131)
    by jbindc on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 01:36:07 PM EST
    He has stated he decided to run as a Democrat for the money and media exposure.

    If course, he also said he was going to run a positive campaign on issues, and he's gone back on that,  proving he's a regular old politician like everyone else, so who knows if would decide to run as an Independent.


    Trump will do it iff - (none / 0) (#111)
    by Mr Natural on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 11:40:05 AM EST
    he can find a bank willing to loan the money to his campaign.

    And after the belly flop, have the campaign declare bankruptcy.  Voila and F/U to another set of debts.


    If He Doesn't Get the Nomination... (none / 0) (#129)
    by ScottW714 on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 01:28:22 PM EST
    ... with the lead in delegates he is going to break something.

    Regulatory capture is the way it's played (none / 0) (#116)
    by Mr Natural on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 11:59:36 AM EST
    Dadler.  We don't hear much about it here, do we?  No, it's all about the brave and empty promises of Don Quixotes and Joan d'Arcs.  

    Years ago I read an article about Clark Clifford, an extremely successful D.C. insider/attorney.  He said it wasn't who you knew at the top that got things done, it was who you knew in the middle.  

    The Donald Trump Factor (none / 0) (#119)
    by CST on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 12:45:37 PM EST
    First it was Utah, now Mississippi appears to be in play.

    Obviously it's early, Trump may not be the nominee, and general election polls don't mean much yet.  In other words, I'll believe it when I see it.  Still - this would be pretty cool.

    Utah will never vote for a GOP (none / 0) (#165)
    by MKS on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 04:44:07 PM EST
    Presidential candidate.  Never.  Ever. Ever.

    It does not matter what Bernie's margin of victory in the caucuses was.  Or how high the turnout was.

    The Democrats who have won statewide races in Utah in the last fifty years are very, very few and turn to a unique pro-LDS formula to get there.


    You mean Dem, right? (5.00 / 1) (#190)
    by ruffian on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 07:52:44 PM EST
    I tend to agree, though my only real friends in Utah are Dems and tell me things are changing.

    License to Discriminate, (none / 0) (#139)
    by KeysDan on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 02:10:11 PM EST
    signed into Mississippi law by Republican Governor, Phil Bryant. This hateful anti-gay and ignorant treatment of trans people has the distinction among such laws of not just permitting state government to ignore private individuals, businesses, and government employees who target a class of citizens, but also, enables the state government to target same.

    The law has a wide reach. Section 3 says the sincerely held religious beliefs or moral convictions protected by this act are belief or conviction that (1) marriage is or should be recognized as a union of one man and one woman, (2) sexual relations are properly reserved to such a marriage, (3) male (man) or female (woman) refer to an individual's immutable biological sex as objectively determined by anatomy and genetics at the time of birth.

    The law, as crafted, applies to single parents, unwed opposite sex couples, and adulterous couples. Perhaps, not intended, and that part will likely be overlooked, unless, for some case, and for some reason, it is useful.

    The government sanctioned discrimination provides for denial, by individuals, businesses, organizations and private associations, of wedding-related goods and services, marriage licenses by government employees (licenses must be provided by someone), denial of housing and employment, denial of adoption services, space in a homeless shelter, retirement homes, hospice, and provision of medical care. Employers are permitted to set dress codes, permitting the firing of women who may wear pants suits, in violation of a skirt policy.

     Hospitals, may deny visitation rights to a same sex spouse, or deny that spouse the right to make medical decisions for an incapacitated spouse.

    The state, of course, has placed itself in line for challenges to the Constitutionality of the law. But, it demonstrates the fear and hate held for a class of citizens.Not surprising for a state that continues to include the stars and bars in its state flag. A death rattle, but still dangerous.

    Great news, a first in world history (none / 0) (#140)
    by Abdul Abulbul Amir on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 02:11:23 PM EST
    Obesity is symptomatic of a poor diet, ... (none / 0) (#154)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 03:23:14 PM EST
    ... and is not a harbinger of an end to the nagging and persistent problem of pervasive hunger, which remains particularly acute in sub-Saharan Africa, the Indian subcontinent, Indonesia and the Philippines.

    That two-thirds of obese people now reside in third-world countries is due to the increasing prevalence of cheap processed foods in their regions, coupled by a corresponding lack of availability of locally-grown produce and fresh meat, fish and poultry.

    Further, this problem will only become increasingly exacerbated as more people around the world continue to abandon rural locales for the cities and these countries undergo the stress of urbanization. Eating "healthy" is not an inexpensive proposition in an urban environment.

    But more to the point, you really ought to actually read the articles you post here, and not simply make assumptions about them based upon their headlines. Because if you had in fact read this particular article, then you surely would have noticed the following statements:

    "The authors warn that global trends in rising obesity should not overshadow the continuing underweight problem in poor countries. Almost a fifth of the world's obese adults, 118 million of them, live in six high-income English-speaking countries - Australia, Canada, Ireland, New Zealand, UK and the US."



    What's the deal (none / 0) (#167)
    by MKS on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 04:52:56 PM EST
    with Obama's job approval numbers?  Today, Gallup has him 53-43 approve.  10 points.  

    It has been in positive territory for weeks now, so it is not statistical noise.

    No mystery, IMO. (5.00 / 1) (#169)
    by Mr Natural on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 05:14:21 PM EST
    People have had a real good look at the alternatives.

    Yeah...maybe he is already entering the (5.00 / 2) (#189)
    by ruffian on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 07:50:34 PM EST
    phase of beloved ex-president in people's minds.

    Better Call Saul (none / 0) (#193)
    by ruffian on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 08:55:07 PM EST
    Now they're just showing off. That opening tracking shot last night was wonderful. I've watched it 3 times.

    Nate Silver (none / 0) (#194)
    by Robot Porter on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 08:57:02 PM EST
    A large block of Milwaukee just reported, narrowing Clinton's deficit with Sanders to 5 points, but The Upshot's model expects Sanders's lead to expand again as more of the state reports. As a benchmark, Sanders would need to beat Clinton in Wisconsin by something like 16 percentage points to make up significant ground in his pledged-delegate disadvantage with her.

    And 16 points looks unlikely. So nice win for Sanders. But nothing close to a reset.

    The Cruz will could be more significant. But anti-Trump forces need to switch to Kasich if they expect to have successes in the Northeast.

    It's over (5.00 / 1) (#195)
    by Ga6thDem on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 09:02:53 PM EST
    for Sanders. It's all downhill for him from here because the next states are very large delegate rich closed primaries.

    Yup. (5.00 / 1) (#196)
    by Robot Porter on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 09:06:58 PM EST
    It's been over for a month ... really.

    But had he won like Cruz is winning on the GOP side, he would have had some kind of argument to make. This doesn't look commanding enough for that.


    Well (5.00 / 1) (#197)
    by sallywally on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 09:17:51 PM EST
    CNN, MSNBC figures are showing an 8 point lead for Sanders, but early on it was up more around 16. Sanders about to speak, must change channel.

    It apparently (5.00 / 2) (#198)
    by Ga6thDem on Tue Apr 05, 2016 at 09:27:56 PM EST
    isn't going to be a huge win for Sanders. Really at this point there's nothing he can do. He would have to win by 75/25 in big states with closed to garner the nomination. He's losing all those according to polling.

    Well (none / 0) (#205)
    by sallywally on Wed Apr 06, 2016 at 07:22:39 AM EST
    More or less final numbers, Sanders won by 14. Of course, there were a fair number of Independent voters, and the delegate count is good for Hillary.

    Chuck Todd... (none / 0) (#206)
    by ScottW714 on Wed Apr 06, 2016 at 09:33:17 AM EST
    ... who is a clown, said today on the TV that there is a 70% chance of a contested convention after WI.

    I can't recall a talking head putting actual probabilities on one of their predictions.  Not saying he right, only that I think he feels pretty confident about it.