Friday Open Thread

Here's tomorrow's open thread, a few hours early. Thank you, Showtime. I just re-watched the last hour of the 2013 History of the Eagles documentary. It's over three hours long, and will re-air in full on Saturday, 4pm Mountain Time.

It's gradually dawning on me I will never again see this band perform. Such a loss. From Denver to Aspen to Red Rocks and Boulder's Folsom Field, I got to see them so many times. I've watched hundreds of videos of shows I didn't see in person -- and I've saved dozens on my various computers. It's never enough.

Personally, I could care less about politics right now -- but this is an open thread, all topics welcome. [More...]

Glenn Frey: "A rock band is not a perfect democracy."

On a lighter note: For something a little different: Two "random guys from Vietnam" do an incredible job playing Hotel California at an outdoor cafe. (With English lyrics contributed by a female at the table.)

Here's Glenn Frye singing Desperado on Letterman in 1984.

Jackson Browne in Clearwater, FL sang "Take it Easy which he co-wrote with Frey two nights ago during an encore. And in Walton, Beach, Fl 2 days before Frye's death. And in New York last month:

Again, this is an open thread, all topics welcome.

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    Thought you might like this Jeralyn (5.00 / 1) (#2)
    by dissenter on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 03:51:29 AM EST
    It's from the Westword. A little Glenn Frey/Eagles Colorado history.

    Why Did Glenn Frey Wear All Those CU T-Shirts?

    Never expected losing Glenn Frey to make (none / 0) (#5)
    by ruffian on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 06:47:54 AM EST
    me miss Colorado even more...I expected my southern California homesick pangs (I lived both places for about 12 years each) but not the CO connection. I forgot they were so tied to Aspen, and did not know the Boulder connection.

    I lost all interest in work this week...I can still handle politics though.


    Closing Ad for Bernie (5.00 / 1) (#3)
    by dissenter on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 04:06:55 AM EST
    This is Bernie Sanders closing ad for the Iowa Caucuses and the New Hampshire Primary. As a media person, I have to say this is a brilliant ad.

    As a voter and citizen,  I love this ad because I love the promise of America and I am sick of hearing the alternatives which boil down to "hate your neighbors" or "eat your vegetables."  Leadership begins with inspiring a nation to do bigger things. It's what gets people off their butts to vote, participate and care. It isn't suppose to be easy.

    In the words of another president - "We choose to go to the moon in this decade and do the other things, not because they are easy, but because they are hard. " JFK, Sept 12, 1962

    Ah, it's a lovely song, so a lovely ad, but (5.00 / 2) (#79)
    by Towanda on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 02:52:02 PM EST
    I never anticipate an understanding of the country by looking at one of the most atypical states in the country.  

    I would stay on I-80 and keep looking.


    Paul (none / 0) (#90)
    by FlJoe on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 03:56:41 PM EST
    Simon is second to none as a songwriter.

     I would like to thank Bernie for planting a new set of ear worms in my head, to replace the the Eagles loop, and the Bowie loop before that.

    I thought it would break the melancholy of the sound track but when I finally sat down and listened to the song, it made me cry. Ultimately it's a song about being badly lost, no matter how much comfort you are in the moment.

    Maybe a perfect metaphor for Bernie's Campaign(YMMV by parsecs by that one)


    I first heard Bookends on 7" reel to reel (none / 0) (#92)
    by Mr Natural on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 04:02:07 PM EST
    It wasn't a dub.  They were sold that way.  The box cover looked like the album cover.  Weird.  Man, was that a while ago.  

    Inspirational (none / 0) (#20)
    by FlJoe on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 08:57:59 AM EST
    yes, but one more time where's the perspiration?

    Yes we all cling to the promise of America but...
    take the ending to the song

    "Kathy, I'm lost", I said,
    Thought I knew she was sleeping.
    "I'm empty and aching and
    I don't know why."
    Counting the cars
    On the New Jersey Turnpike.
    They've all come
    To look for America,
    All come to look for America,
    All come to look for America.

    Well Kathy, we are still lost, and the cars are still out there searching for America, but more likely to find a crumbling bridge to nowhere.

    You have probably zeroed I on the zeitgeist of the American electorate here,

    I am sick of hearing the alternatives which boil down to "hate your neighbors" or "eat your vegetables."  

    We know which choice the Trumpeteers are making, dystopia. By your analogy, I take it you think Hillary is "only" offering us vegetables, probably true, but the third choice you imply, can be described as pie in the sky, but then again "how can you have any pudding, if you don't eat your meat?"


    Pink Floyd! (none / 0) (#22)
    by CaptHowdy on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 09:01:04 AM EST

    now there's a campaign song.


    lol; the soundtrack for somebody's (none / 0) (#29)
    by Mr Natural on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 09:21:50 AM EST
    Dystopian Blues

    Pudding, meat (none / 0) (#30)
    by CaptHowdy on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 09:24:46 AM EST
    And (none / 0) (#31)
    by FlJoe on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 09:31:32 AM EST
    let me once again defer to Simon when it comes to self made thought control.
    I have squandered my resistance
    For a pocketful of mumbles
    Such are promises
    All lies and jests
    Still a man hears what he wants to hear
    And disregards the rest

    My favorite Simon & Garfunkle song (none / 0) (#116)
    by christinep on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 05:40:28 PM EST
    The numbers of listening times--beginning with an end of finals in law school dinner with husband, myself, good friends and too many martinis(w/cucumber as it was June)--and the number of my recordings ... too numerous.

    Then, I felt as infused with defiance, hard learning, & life-learning pain as The Boxer.  Intense, and with pulsating awareness.  (Heck, I can hear it even now; and, I'm dancing to my internal music.)  The times of Bergmann movies and an unending zeitgeist of foreign films.

    Now, I happened to see on one of the threads here the other day a reference to a favorite phrasing: "Ah, but I was so much older then; I'm younger than that now."  Maybe it really is true that the longer we live and the more we learn, the more we come to realize how much more there is to learn. (That has been my experience so far.)


    Holly Crop... (none / 0) (#34)
    by ScottW714 on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 10:42:15 AM EST
    That's my favorite cut (5.00 / 1) (#36)
    by CaptHowdy on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 11:01:02 AM EST
    From that album and my favorite part of the movie.   Animation without cuteness .

    I like carrots (& peas & limas) (none / 0) (#110)
    by christinep on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 05:20:51 PM EST
    Actually, I like a variety of food.  From time to time, do I ever splurge on the richest or most complex of foods or the junk food favorite lovingly named potato chips.  Ultimately, tho, those good & balanced meals--with veggies--can give you the healthy real zoom to do many things, to meet many challenges.  And, all that....  Especially when some good wine accompanies those dinners....

    About the ad: Very good technique and good music.  Myself tho prefers the look and energy of a diverse America.  Being lost in the past, whether or not its the 50s or later years....that is sort of nostalgic sad.


    All I'm hearing is (none / 0) (#21)
    by Kmkmiller on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 08:59:20 AM EST
    The dem party is corrupt.

    Very subtly this morning (5.00 / 1) (#9)
    by CoralGables on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 07:40:14 AM EST
    Paul Krugman gives a thumbs up to the Clinton candidacy going forward over all others.

    Pragmatism and idealism, (5.00 / 1) (#42)
    by KeysDan on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 11:44:24 AM EST
    in governance for a nation of 330 million. An excellent opinion piece.  Definitely in support of Mrs. Clinton--as subtle as Ben Carson's hammer blow to his mother's head.

    I wonder is it... (5.00 / 5) (#44)
    by kdog on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 11:50:28 AM EST
    fact or assumption that Sanders can't be pragmatic?  Is it really pragmatic to start in the middle when negotiating with scorched earth Republicans?  

    Isn't it wise to start with the ideal, and compromise from there...rather than starting with the compromise position and compromising even more?


    Depends...do you already know what their limit is? (5.00 / 2) (#49)
    by ruffian on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 12:27:10 PM EST
    on health care, for example, where do you think the compromise position would end up being between single payer and whatever the GOP has in mind? It is not a number question, it is a systemic question - are they really going to give up private insurance?

    You have to have some clue of what the end game will look like going in.  Sure, you can ask for the moon as a showy opening act, but things will have to get serious from there.

    In budget negotiations I think it does make sense to go in way high, because those are for the most part purely number negotiations and not about systemic changes.


    No... (5.00 / 3) (#63)
    by kdog on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 01:37:55 PM EST
    Republicans, and some beholden Democrats, will never willingly give up private insurance.  Unless it will cost them re-election.

    But for the next go around on health care reforms, if we started with a strong advocacy for single payer instead of blind acceptance of the private insurance model, stands to reason we'd get more concessions from Sen. Soandso (R, Oxford) and Rep. Suchandsuch (D, Pfizer).


    Beholden (2.00 / 1) (#70)
    by Kmkmiller on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 02:10:31 PM EST
    Meh. It's getting old.

    Let's try considering the possibility that those who disagree with us do so without impediments.  


    Maybe you should try considering (5.00 / 2) (#72)
    by shoephone on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 02:21:27 PM EST
    that elected officials who take thousands--and sometimes millons--of dollars from corporations, and then vote on legislation to benefit those corporations are proving that they are beholden to them. Because that's actually how it works in the real world. The fantasy world...not so much.

    If given a choice (2.00 / 1) (#86)
    by Kmkmiller on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 03:36:51 PM EST
    A) politician believes in xyz and therefore industry interested in xyz funds politician...

    B) politician doesn't believe in xyz but supports xyz anyway because funded by industry interested in xyz...

    Occams razor...

    Just meh, even trying to argue otherwise, even THATS getting old.


    Another thoroughly meaningless attempt (5.00 / 2) (#94)
    by shoephone on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 04:08:45 PM EST
    to excuse the politician/corporation/lobbyist revolving door.

    Apparently, you really have nothing to offer besides a repeated "meh".


    Not Excusing Option B (none / 0) (#143)
    by Kmkmiller on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 11:23:26 PM EST
    Just sayin option A more likely.

    What does that mean? (5.00 / 2) (#75)
    by jondee on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 02:31:13 PM EST
    Should we now NEVER talk about the fact that so many politicians become very-well-compensated lobbyists after they leave office and pretend that that their connections in no way influenced their policy decisons while they were still in office?

    Beat me to it.. (none / 0) (#76)
    by jondee on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 02:34:01 PM EST
    must be them fast guitar-playing fingers. ;-)

    Always got to know where that flatted 5th is... (5.00 / 1) (#84)
    by shoephone on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 03:16:51 PM EST
    Talk About It (none / 0) (#144)
    by Kmkmiller on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 11:24:41 PM EST
    Like you can consider other possibilities.

    Yes, a good question. (5.00 / 1) (#59)
    by KeysDan on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 01:15:47 PM EST
    I do not know if it is a fact or an assumption that Senator Sanders can or can't be pragmatic. But, I do think, as president, he would have to be pragmatic.

    In my view, however, pragmatism and negotiation are not identical. Pragmatism, to be effective, needs to be informed by ideals--having a vision and setting realistic goals for successful negotiations.

     Senator Sanders recognizes the llimits of idealism, for example, his acknowledgement that his health insurance re-organization would not come on day one (symbolically indicating the difficulties in both adjusting ideas and negotiating the differences).

     There is the liability that supporters (as was the case with some Obama supporters of then Candidate Obama) will soon become disillusioned by a betrayal of ideals. Compromise, a component of negotiation, may be seen as the enemy of idealism. Not an uncommon reaction, especially, in the young.  There, of course, are good negotiations and not so good. But, I do not see these skills as being hinged to pragmatism.



    Disillusioned Sanders Voters... (5.00 / 2) (#67)
    by kdog on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 02:02:08 PM EST
    would be a good problem to have!

    I don't know...I'd like to think voters, even younger uber-idealistic ones, understand Rome wasn't built in a day.  Look at Obama, despite the disappointment and disillusionment of many of his supporters, he still won a second term handily.


    Four more years of post-election (5.00 / 2) (#73)
    by oculus on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 02:26:38 PM EST
    idealism shattered by reality. Please, gawd, no.  

    Is 4 years... (5.00 / 2) (#87)
    by kdog on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 03:49:19 PM EST
    of cold "best we can do" porridge any better?  

    yes (none / 0) (#147)
    by FlJoe on Sat Jan 23, 2016 at 08:29:07 AM EST
    Bernie's Revolution Restaurant is promoting a wonderful menu, with such items as Single Payer Souffle and Free Tuition Tacos, mouth watering for sure. Yet when the doors open and  only thing really on the menu is the same old porridge there will be a lot of disappointment.

    Nothing kills a revolution faster than disillusionment, I think this country would be b etter off for Sanders to continue to sell his  tasty Tacos in the Senate, I hear Senator Warren's Weenie Wagon serves up a mean Chili dog also. Between them they should be able to provide enough nourishment to keep the dre4am alive.


    The (none / 0) (#149)
    by Ga6thDem on Sat Jan 23, 2016 at 08:35:30 AM EST
    interesting thing is Warren has been able to create something and convince other senators to follow her and create a coalition. There seems to be no evidence that Bernie has done this in his 25 years in Washington.

    The irony to me is some of the stuff about a ground up "revolution" is the same thing Obama was selling in 2008. People were going to "rise up" to get his agenda passed. This kind of thing apparently does not work judging by that.


    Yep... It's a cycle (none / 0) (#153)
    by Kmkmiller on Sat Jan 23, 2016 at 09:34:06 AM EST
    It's the safest of bets if Bernie was pres we'd be defending his pesidency to the Overton window pushers.

    I'm all for Overton window, btw, except the part where you vilify people who actually do get stuff done.  And promise things you know can't be done.


    It's (none / 0) (#77)
    by Ga6thDem on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 02:39:00 PM EST
    not just insurance companies. There's doctors and hospitals and medical appliance manufacturers too.

    It wasn't all that handily, kdog. (none / 0) (#95)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 04:10:50 PM EST
    There was only a 4%-point differential in the nationwide popular vote in 2012, and in several key swing states, the margin was even narrower. Had a few score thousand votes gone the other way in states like Ohio and Florida, we'd be complaining about President Mitt Romney.

    And given that result described above, it's also pretty apparent that far too many American voters would have a very hard time noting the general location of Rome on an unmarked map of Europe, never mind any realization that the city wasn't built in a day.

    Here's the hard truth. We have a thoroughly polarized electorate, and the militant right has checked their already-tenuous grasp of fact and reason at the door, in their eagerness to avenge themselves upon people who don't look and think like them. That's the Trump / Cruz base, and as crazy and unhinged as they are, they are also reliable and dependable. They show up at the polls on Election Day.

    For our part, we Democrats have supporters who check and out of the political process at will, and who engage only sporadically, i.e., every four years during presidential campaigns. Electorally, we overly tend to take things for granted, assuming that our truths are somehow self-evident.

    Well, guess what? They're not. Even a cursory review of off-year election results should tell us that we need to get out there every single day, and talk up and live our values. We can't just wait for a Bernie Sanders or Barack Obama to ride forth on a white horse every four years, while we stand on the sidelines cheering, "Yeah, what he said!"

    In that regard, we apparently have a very hard time comprehending what the legendary UCLA basketball coach John Wooden used to regularly preach to his players: The true measure of success in life is the amount of effort you put forth to attain it.

    When Democratic voters show up on Election Day, Democrats generally win. And when we don't show up for whatever our reasons, our candidates don't win. (See "Matt Blevins, KY Gov. race 2015.") So in that respect, liberal and progressive Democrats need to realize what Paul Krugman is saying to them:

    "Sorry, but there's nothing noble about seeing your values defeated because you preferred happy dreams to hard thinking about means and ends. Don't let idealism veer into destructive self-indulgence."

    The only way we're going to keep reality from biting us on the a$$ at the polls is to get real ourselves. And that means showing up and being counted.



    That's the argument (2.00 / 1) (#50)
    by Kmkmiller on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 12:45:15 PM EST
    But we know it doesn't always work that way.....

    I mean you can tell an employer you're worth 100k per year in hopes you'll get 90k but if you didn't do the research and know going into the interview that the range for the position is 75k to 85k DOE then it's just as likely the employer is going to conclude you dont do the research and they'll hire someone who does.

    But more than that, I think it is dishonest.  how this plays out in electoral politics.  I get dreaming big and it's great to make the most progressive agenda something we can talk about (Overton window right?) but is a dream really a plan?  Is it a promise?

    I will put it this way....

    I feel like Bernie is setting up an online dating profile, he advertises he makes 500k per year when he only makes 50k per year.... but that's ok cause he dreams of making 500k per year one day.


    And he'll be really popular (5.00 / 2) (#54)
    by ruffian on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 12:51:17 PM EST
    if people think he makes 500k.

    Looking at Obama in the ACA crafting for example - he took a lot of grief, from people like me as a matter of fact, for taking single payer off the table. But he did not seem to care about scoring brownie points with all of us when it was not going to do him any good in getting a program enacted.


    Part of the integrity of Obama (none / 0) (#56)
    by Kmkmiller on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 01:08:03 PM EST
    ...saying "yes we can" is that yes you could.

    Is it difficult? (5.00 / 2) (#55)
    by sj on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 01:05:05 PM EST
    To come up with this type of irrelevant "argument"?

    A dating profile? Really?

    An employer?

    And when did a negotiating starting point become a "promise"?

    It creates "good" diversions, though, I guess.


    I'll ahve to watch more of his speeches (5.00 / 1) (#60)
    by ruffian on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 01:17:18 PM EST
    Seems to me he is presenting it as a plan of what he intends to do, not a negotiation starting point.

    Much like his tweet last night that one of the first things his SCOTUS nominees will do is repeal Citizens United.

    Seems to me that a lot of time he is playing on the emotional impact of such statements to the politically ignorant or naive.


    I don't really see how those are different... (none / 0) (#68)
    by sj on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 02:03:02 PM EST
    Seems to me he is presenting it as a plan of what he intends to do, not a negotiation starting point.
    ...in an effort of this magnitude.

    If that is clear to all.... (5.00 / 1) (#74)
    by ruffian on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 02:29:02 PM EST
    but it seems to me I have been told that he would never bargain that away.

    I have to stop opining on this since it is approaching the pointless to me. Admittedly a low threshold.


    "I have been told" (none / 0) (#165)
    by sj on Sat Jan 23, 2016 at 02:33:12 PM EST
    lots of things. I have been told things are simple. I have been told things are impossible. I have been told some people have no chance. I have been told some people have all the advantages.

    "I have been told" is a pretty soft footing to stand on, IMO. So yeah, pretty pointless.


    I feel like (3.00 / 3) (#58)
    by Kmkmiller on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 01:11:25 PM EST
    He's getting credit for it as if it is a promise.

    The media isn't vetting his dream when he calls it a plan.

    He doesn't say starting point, he says plan.  Now you're telling me his plan is just a starting point?


    It was a bit more than subtle ... (5.00 / 1) (#111)
    by christinep on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 05:22:57 PM EST
    and, I like it.  I like the straight-talking Krugman.

    But... (none / 0) (#10)
    by CaptHowdy on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 07:43:29 AM EST
    Simon and Garfunkle....

    Shouldn't (none / 0) (#13)
    by Ga6thDem on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 08:03:14 AM EST
    surprise anyone IIRC he was an Edwards/Clinton supporter in '08.

    Previous Krugman: Hillary's healh plan (none / 0) (#52)
    by oculus on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 12:50:29 PM EST
    compared to Bernie's.

    Glen Frey sponsored a project (5.00 / 7) (#11)
    by fishcamp on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 07:51:42 AM EST
    in Aspen for underprivileged, inner city and ghetto kids for week long learning visits.  He asked me to film a luncheon speaking and singing segment at a local restaurant.  Jimmie's restaurant isn't open for lunch, so we had the whole joint to ourselves.  There were twenty kids, and they had been on a river hike that morning, with a break before lunch.  Some of them acted out around town, but none of them missed a meal.  Glenn came in early to set up and help me with the lights.  The kids came trickling in and one kid kept messing with the lights and wires.  Glenn immediately went over to the kid and started talking with him.  The boy had a bully streak that Glenn ironed out with kindness.  The pep talk speech by Glenn was extremely funny and the songs he played were very moving.  He liked helping kids and was a very talented man.  We will miss him.

    You really (5.00 / 3) (#12)
    by Ga6thDem on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 08:02:09 AM EST
    should write a book. You have some of the most fascinating stories.

    And when you write that book (5.00 / 4) (#28)
    by Mr Natural on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 09:20:28 AM EST
    Don't forget to mention that you know us!

    He probably would (5.00 / 1) (#33)
    by Jeralyn on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 10:05:57 AM EST
    mention you all in a book. Fishcamp really appreciates the commenters here, he even talks about what you all write about at the gym --and the best part about his stories is they are all true.

    Republican "establishment" problems (5.00 / 1) (#16)
    by CaptHowdy on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 08:31:30 AM EST

    The Republican National Committee has disinvited National Review from a presidential debate partnership following the release of an edition devoted to taking down Donald Trump, the conservative magazine reported late Thursday.
    Jack Fowler, publisher of National Review, outlined the RNC's rationale in a piece published on the magazine's website.


    Trump is now calling them part of the establishment

    Speaking of pragmatism.. (5.00 / 1) (#51)
    by jondee on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 12:49:03 PM EST
    the National Review has calculated that Trump isn't "electable" and will damage the conservative brand in the long term by making them a world-wide laughingstock, and they're probably right.

    Most of the folks crazy for Trump are folks who, imo, at bottom don't give a flying frick about the future so much as they have an overpowering desire to have their prejudices, superstitions, and fears emotionally validated in the present.


    This is bad for us (none / 0) (#53)
    by CaptHowdy on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 12:50:36 PM EST

    Who said it was bad? It's practically (none / 0) (#57)
    by jondee on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 01:09:29 PM EST
    an ideal situation if we're thinking strictly in terms of winning elections..

    Though, for the overall health of the country, having a contingent of thirty million or so people who think like an angry mob and who are capable of being whipped into a gun-wielding frenzy isn't exactly what Jefferson had in mind for our Grand Experiment..


    I am (none / 0) (#61)
    by CaptHowdy on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 01:18:48 PM EST
    Thinking in terms of winning elections.

    Thank you.


    And how many (none / 0) (#98)
    by jimakaPPJ on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 04:26:50 PM EST
    of these "most of the folks" do you actually know???

    And I confess that Eve Ensler who is part of a group  calling out the media over its coverage of Trump...has never ever been heard of by 99% of "these folks."

    Simply put, the Trumpster's support is not a conservative thing. It is a competence  thing.


    Simply put is right (5.00 / 1) (#99)
    by jondee on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 04:35:15 PM EST
    So the answer is, "None." (none / 0) (#156)
    by jimakaPPJ on Sat Jan 23, 2016 at 11:08:29 AM EST
    Tell me, why don't you address the issue? You wrote:

    Most of the folks crazy for Trump are folks who, imo, at bottom don't give a flying frick about the future so much as they have an overpowering desire to have their prejudices, superstitions, and fears emotionally validated in the present.

    Then we can say that insider Conservatives do care about the future?? And if that's true you must view the contest between the elite's on the Left, and how they help Joe and Jane Sixpack vs how the insider Conservatives will "help" Joe and Jane.

    The problem is that Joe and Jane have watched what the Left and the Right have done/not done and are rejecting both.

    Do these "at the bottom" folks care about the future?? Well, Trump has promised to return jobs, restore the economy, institute true "fair" trade,  block Muslim immigrants from entering the country until we can properly vet them.....

    It seems to me that is a very much forward looking agenda.


    There (none / 0) (#112)
    by FlJoe on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 05:23:09 PM EST
    some interesting fault lines developing in the conservative movement. The "intellectuals" loath Trump but the mouth breathers love him. Sounds simple right? But there's more, the "intellectuals" love Cruz(at least they should) but the "establishment" loathes him up to the point of signaling they would support Trump rather than him. Now the "intellectuals" really have little love for the rinos in the establishment, but they realize must coexist for mutual survival.

    This, mind you, is just the mainstream, on the fringes the same fractures are appearing among the radio talkers and even the evangelicals.These guys are giving Syria a run for the money in the complexity of their civil war.


    Very true (none / 0) (#113)
    by CaptHowdy on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 05:29:57 PM EST
    I've been thinking if it more in X-Men terms.  Good mutants vs bad mutants.  Good/good mutants vs good bad mutants.  Good/bad mutants vs bad/good mutants. Bad/good mutants vs bad/bad mutants.   Then there are just total freak outliers who are a threat to everyone.  Even themselves.

    and (none / 0) (#117)
    by FlJoe on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 05:58:53 PM EST
    they have all come to search for America, like it or not.

    For the last hour or so (none / 0) (#119)
    by CaptHowdy on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 06:10:22 PM EST
    I've been watching and reading about the right wing freak out over what's happening in the primary.    It's awsum.  They are truly in complete meltdown.   And I think it will get way worse after Trump wins a couple of primaries.  Expect Mit/Rudy/whoever conniptions in no particular order.

    I do think that National Review thing is just as good as a campaign contribution.   He will probably be passing copies of  it out at rallys.


    and now we know (none / 0) (#121)
    by jondee on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 06:29:12 PM EST
    how many right-wing crazies it takes to fill the Albert Hall.

    Please (5.00 / 1) (#125)
    by FlJoe on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 06:43:21 PM EST
    don't make me count them all.

    Ha (none / 0) (#17)
    by CoralGables on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 08:36:43 AM EST
    I see what you did there.

    It's turning into (none / 0) (#19)
    by CaptHowdy on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 08:52:54 AM EST
    A very interesting bout of finger pointing because the establishment actually IS starting to line up for Trump.   I haven't figured out if it's really because they hate Ted Cruz that much or that they think it's some kind of 11 demensional Kung-fu that will bring Trump down.

    Very confusing cycle.


    speaking of Pragmatism. (none / 0) (#145)
    by NYShooter on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 11:26:09 PM EST
    ".......the establishment actually IS starting to line up for Trump."

    Pragmatism, or simply, reality check?

    The, so-called, "establishment," is coming to grips with the very real possibility (probability?) that Trump will win this thing.....at least, for now, the Nomination. So, as any good tactician would do, they have to calculate, "then what?"

    In other words, on the morning of the day Trump is declared The Republican Candidate, what is the best position (from a list of bad, badder, and/or, baddest positions) pragmatingly speaking, what is their "best" choice of positions?

    By then, the fighting will be over. They will have miscalculated almost everything by then, their worst nightmare will have come true. But, speaking as a business man, even really bad results can be broken down into different levels of "Bad." So, it seems to me, they will have concluded that being on the inside, even disingenuously, to live & fight another day will be their option of choice.

    The problem with that plan, however, is.......Trump knows it. He is not about to sit idly by, accepting The Establishment's 11'th. hour conversion to friendship. Allowing such a Trojan Horse will not happen. The Donald, as he's told us emphatically, and often, is into retribution.

    I see this Reich's "Night of the Long Knives," coming. Trump will have to separate the true believers from the fair-weather believers, and, do it fast.

    There's a General Election to plan for.

    And, with the Democrats having shown they can be just as incompetent as the Republicans, and, having reduced "snatching defeat from the jaws of victory," to an art form, I wouldn't be feeling too sanguine here. Trump, having proven that the 100% consensus of a Trump Republican Nomination victory being impossible, became 100% wrong, and  the giddy Democratic chant that "A Trump Nomination victory would be a "Gift too good to be true," could also prove to be wrong.

    All I know is that Trump is much, much stronger today than anyone predicted on the day he announced his candidacy, and Hillary, with years of planning, and, hundreds of millions of dollars in her coffers, is much weaker today than, at least, I, would have believed possible.


    Yep. I agree with all of that (5.00 / 1) (#150)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Jan 23, 2016 at 08:46:21 AM EST
    Except maybe the long knives part.  Trump is a deal maker.  First and most.   I think he will welcome them.  Be happy to keep his friends close and enemies closer as they say.
    I still wouldn't be surprised with Cruz as a running mate.  Particularly if he keeps it a race.  It's the pragmatic thing to do.  Bring the party together.  Trump wants to win.   More than anything.

    The other day some one sent me some bits from The Art of The Deal.  It's remarkable how much of his campaign is taken right out of that book.  Swoop in create chaos then take advantage of that chaos.

    I've heard it said he is "winging it". If you believe that read some of the book..  


    Trump (none / 0) (#148)
    by Ga6thDem on Sat Jan 23, 2016 at 08:30:41 AM EST
    absolutely should be taken seriously.

    Did you read (none / 0) (#18)
    by Ga6thDem on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 08:36:58 AM EST
    any of the National Review article? I read a synopsis and basically it's just a rehash of the same arguments they have been making for months it seemed to me.

    I recommend reading it (none / 0) (#126)
    by CaptHowdy on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 06:58:27 PM EST
    It's basically a short argument from each conservative "opinion leader" against The Donald.

    Some are literally laugh out loud.  Like this from William Kristol-

    In a letter to National Review, Leo Strauss wrote that "a conservative, I take it, is a man who despises vulgarity; but the argument which is concerned exclusively with calculations of success, and is based on blindness to the nobility of the effort, is vulgar." Isn't Donald Trump the very epitome of vulgarity? In sum: Isn't Trumpism a two-bit Caesarism of a kind that American conservatives have always disdained? Isn't the task of conservatives today to stand athwart Trumpism, yelling Stop?

    Can't you just feel that changing the minds of Trump supporters right across the country?



    They (none / 0) (#128)
    by Ga6thDem on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 07:04:55 PM EST
    seem to have forgotten history along with all their rantings. They are just as bad as the tea party but in a different way. And no, it is going to make no difference to any of the GOP primary voters IMO. The people that care about that kind of thing are already not voting for Trump.

    The NR and (none / 0) (#25)
    by jimakaPPJ on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 09:13:23 AM EST
    the pundits writing/appearing on Megan Kelly's show, in the view of Trump supporters, are just as much a part of the establishment as any Democrat or Republican who has been in the Congress or in the media.



    Joe Walsh on (5.00 / 2) (#27)
    by Mr Natural on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 09:18:38 AM EST
    the music business today.

    "Records, Record stores, Record sales - it's all gone...  Nobody's playing at the same time.  Everybody's adding on virtual instruments that don't exist onto a drum machine that somebody programmed. And you can tell in the music that's out now.  It's all been programmed.  There's no mojo.  There's nobody testifying.  There's not the magic of a human performance, which is never perfect.  And the magic of a human performances is what we all know and love in the old records.   "

    Many years ago, I was on a plane coming back from Australia.  There was a goofy guy with a big loopy grin, half or completely drunk, wandering the aisles.  He looked half familiar but I didn't know until we hit customs.  His buddy said, "Joe!"  pause "Walsh!"


    Ah Mr. Walsh. (5.00 / 1) (#47)
    by Chuck0 on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 12:19:31 PM EST
    My favorite presidential candidate. He ran for president in 1980 under the Party Party Party. I think I've written his name in at least once since then.

    Joe... (none / 0) (#88)
    by kdog on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 03:52:32 PM EST
    should give it one more go...in these strange political days, this could be his year!

    If nothing else, the inauguration party would be the most epic since Jackson's.


    The snow has started falling (5.00 / 3) (#65)
    by jbindc on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 01:49:22 PM EST
    We are both home, have food, flashlights, candles batteries, and Netflix / Hulu / Amazon Prime ready to go, as well as lots of books and a jigsaw puzzle.  

    Bring it on, Winter Storm Jonas!

    I'm kind of jealous (5.00 / 2) (#66)
    by CST on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 01:51:48 PM EST
    Looks like it's going to miss us for the most part.

    If it's going to be cold and winter, it might as well snow.

    And no, that doesn't mean I want 8' again, but I wouldn't complain about a 2' storm as long as it wasn't followed by 6 more immediately after the fact.


    Be careful (5.00 / 1) (#69)
    by sj on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 02:08:43 PM EST
    I didn't realize they had named the storm. Thankfully it passed us by here in Denver and we are at a sunshine-y 40+ degrees before the Bronco game.

    And at this altitude, the sunshine makes it warmer. That was really hard for me to get used to when I lived in Baltimore -- that it would be warmer when it was cloudy and foggy than it was when the sun came out.


    Thanks (5.00 / 1) (#71)
    by jbindc on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 02:19:43 PM EST
    We have no plans to do anything but stay inside!

    Man I Wish We Had a Snow Day... (5.00 / 2) (#78)
    by ScottW714 on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 02:50:49 PM EST
    ...especially a Friday.  Enjoy.

    Same with us (5.00 / 1) (#109)
    by Zorba on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 05:16:43 PM EST
    We have plenty of food, plenty of wood for the woodstove, gas for the generator and the tractor, which has its snowplow blade attached and ready to go.
    Plus, of course, the really important things- lots of wine, beer, and booze.  :-D
    Stay safe and warm, jb!

    Good luck (5.00 / 1) (#114)
    by CaptHowdy on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 05:31:56 PM EST
    It passed us last night.  Just got grazed by a couple of inches.  I just ventured out fir the first time.  It's mostly gone.

    I've said it before (5.00 / 1) (#120)
    by sj on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 06:20:05 PM EST
    and I'll say it again.

    Come the revolution I definitely want to be at Castle Zorba. I didn't want to say anything about jb's lack of mention of "spirits" because, well ... liberal. And I make no judgments :)


    I'm sure that (5.00 / 1) (#135)
    by Zorba on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 07:18:23 PM EST
    jb has plenty of spirits, as well.   ;-)
    CaseyOR and Kdog have already dubbed our farm "the Republic of Zorba," by the way.  You have to be willing to share some space with them, too, because they asked for sanctuary space up here long ago.
    We'll teach you all how to garden, preserve food, hunt, and fish as well, if you don't already know how.  And Mr. Zorba knows how to make beer and mead.

    Ha! (5.00 / 2) (#146)
    by jbindc on Sat Jan 23, 2016 at 07:05:12 AM EST
    I don't drink, but there is beer for the BF.  We can literally walk across the street to a grocery store and two drug stores, so as long as they are open and have stock, all is well.

    My drug of choice is chocolate, and we have that and plenty of milk.  :)


    I almost feel guilty (5.00 / 1) (#190)
    by sj on Sat Jan 23, 2016 at 06:49:05 PM EST
    telling you that we just took my girl for an hour and half walk. It was 60+ sunshine-y degrees and hoodie weather when we left. And it's still mid-fifties right now.

    ::sighs happily:: I just love Colorado.

    But seriously, I hope you are all doing fine.


    Allow me to be the first today to say (5.00 / 1) (#164)
    by christinep on Sat Jan 23, 2016 at 02:30:00 PM EST

    GO BRONCOS!  And, if our Offense shows up tomorrow--as they do from time to time--it will really be Go Broncos.

    While I would love to see Brady (none / 0) (#195)
    by NYShooter on Sat Jan 23, 2016 at 07:48:55 PM EST
    win another Super Bowl ring, the fact that it would come at the expense of Payton Manning would make that victory a bitter-sweet one for me.
    I'm sure psychologists/psychiatrists would have a field day trying to analyze, and, explain Manning's tragically sad playoff/Super Bowl record (of failures.) His over-all record puts him up there as one of the top 2-3 greatest quarterbacks of all time, yet, he'll be remembered mostly for failing to win the "big ones."

    But, I think it's a credit to both quarterbacks that, after having played against each other some 15-16 times, they remain great friends, and, the respect they display for each other gives one hope that you really can be a super-star, and, not, automatically be a jerk also, like some of the (un-named) new breed of up-and-comers.

    The game should be great (I hope.)

    Also, I wonder if the sportscasters of this game will bring up the NY Times article, written by a scientist from The Massachusetts Institute of Technology, John Leonard. Using pure science he completely debunks the charges against Tom Brady. He is also supported in his conclusion by scientists from Carnegie Mellon, the University of Chicago, Boston College, and Rockefeller University, the University of Illinois and Bowdoin College-- and others.

    So, yes, it seems there is a scientific method to prove, or, disprove, the charge of whether Tom Brady is a "cheater, or, not.

    If anyone is interested in the facts, and, the truth, the article is here:

    True Scandal of Deflategate Lies in the N.F.L.'s Behavior

    JOE NOCERA, NY Times, JAN. 22, 2016


    Pepper links (5.00 / 1) (#203)
    by CaptHowdy on Mon Jan 25, 2016 at 10:39:40 AM EST
    Watching trailer for comedian (none / 0) (#1)
    by Militarytracy on Thu Jan 21, 2016 at 10:48:17 PM EST
    Whitney Cummings HBO special. Looks and sounds amazing, sign me up!

    Within (none / 0) (#4)
    by lentinel on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 05:46:23 AM EST
    the last few days, I've seen about four different articles in which Bernie Sanders is described as being insensitive to the needs of Black people.

    Before that, I've seen his supporters described as old white people.


    In 2008, it was Hillary and Bill who were tarred as being soft on racism.

    This is our democracy at work.

    The pits.

    If Sanders ever leads in a state (5.00 / 1) (#6)
    by CoralGables on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 06:48:07 AM EST
    that isn't over 90% white (only 8 states fall in this category and his only polling leads are in 3 of them) then that argument could be laid to rest.

    For the sake of (none / 0) (#127)
    by lentinel on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 07:03:23 PM EST
    argument, is there anything wrong with "old"?
    Is there anything wrong with "white", whatever the fk that means?

    In this nightmare of an election, I don't think that "young black people" would carry the same stigma.

    I don't like any of these categories.
    They all sound racist to me.

    This is about economics.
    Not race.

    Old people have it really hard in this terrible economy. So do young people. So do people in the middle.

    Putting out these racial stereotypes only seeks to divide us by race - and divert us from the overarching reality that everyone is doing poorly compared to those at the very top.

    I also would say that I have listened to Sanders and also Clinton. Neither of them are racists imo.

    So this whole thing is just one big red herring designed to smear a candidate.

    And it really stinks.


    It's not (none / 0) (#129)
    by Ga6thDem on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 07:07:09 PM EST
    just about economics though. The GOP wants to roll back the rights of women and gays. It's really about everything. Voting rights, you name it.

    "Roll back?" (none / 0) (#133)
    by lentinel on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 07:15:46 PM EST
    The rights of women have been under assault during the entire 8 years of the Obama presidency.

    Yes, I'm quite (none / 0) (#138)
    by Ga6thDem on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 07:29:55 PM EST
    aware however my point was economics are not the only concern of people.

    Actually it's not (none / 0) (#130)
    by vicndabx on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 07:08:29 PM EST
    There are issues the black community faces that other communities do not. It's not racist to seek acknowledgement of that distinction.

    Quite apart from the fact (none / 0) (#132)
    by CaptHowdy on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 07:13:51 PM EST
    No serious person has called him a "racist"

    Oh please... (5.00 / 1) (#136)
    by lentinel on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 07:24:05 PM EST
    The Atlantic Monthly just did a hatchet job on him...

    Whether serious or not, the campaign is thick with innuendo.

    They did the same thing with Clinton in 2008.

    I remember Chris Rock during that horrible campaign - getting up in front of an audience at the Apollo theater in NYC admonishing the audience for even thinking about voting for "that white woman'. With Obama in the wings - who said nothing.

    You seriously underestimate the slime being tossed around. Read the comments on the post by Jeralyn on the media...

    This whole spectacle is sickening and getting more so as the candidates scratch for votes.


    BAHA (none / 0) (#139)
    by CaptHowdy on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 07:30:34 PM EST
    Oh, yes.  That tabloid The Atlantic Monthly.  Im actually glad you are completely unaware of how over the top most of what you say really is.  
    It's very entertaining.  

    Not going there (none / 0) (#141)
    by vicndabx on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 07:46:49 PM EST
    I would suggest you watch this

    and read this

    Gain additional perspective. You need not be so offended.


    Maybe (2.00 / 1) (#23)
    by Kmkmiller on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 09:03:06 AM EST
    Pissing on the Obama legacy is turning off some voters.

    It seems (none / 0) (#26)
    by Ga6thDem on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 09:17:49 AM EST
    to be with African Americans though I'm not sure with other groups.

    She did (none / 0) (#131)
    by lentinel on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 07:10:58 PM EST
    pizz on him during the second debate.. If he had only listened to her there wouldn't be that mess in Syria...

    But in the third one, in South Carolina, she was all mushy and gooey - pandering up a storm for the "black" vote.

    As to Obama's "legacy" - all I see is three wars instead of two - and an economy that favors the very very rich. The three wars trumps everything for me because of the total amorality of them, the pointlessness of them, and also the incredible drain on our dwindling economic resources.

    No free tuition.
    No Medicare for all.
    Crumbling infrastructure.

    Just war.


    I think ever reader (5.00 / 1) (#134)
    by CaptHowdy on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 07:16:10 PM EST
    Of these comments knows VERY well all you see is war.

    Others see things like healthcare for the first time in their lives or the right to marry or serve in the military.


    You see (none / 0) (#137)
    by lentinel on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 07:28:35 PM EST
    what you want to see.
    It is pretty obvious as well.

    You want to serve in the military - to go to Iraq or Afghanistan or Syria or some other hellhole - go.
    What a marvelous opportunity.

    It is undeniable what this scourge of war is doing to our country - to our economy - to our right to privacy.

    But - go ahead.
    Call me whiny.
    Look on what you consider the bright side and have a nice day.


    Yes lentinel (none / 0) (#140)
    by CaptHowdy on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 07:34:10 PM EST
    It's important to some who do not match your towering moral superiority to be able to serve their country.  

    Pity them.  If only they were as evolved as you.


    In my perfect world (none / 0) (#154)
    by Kmkmiller on Sat Jan 23, 2016 at 09:52:48 AM EST
    That kind of stuff wouldn't happen.

    In my perfect world....there also would not be stupid attacks on a politician's integrity cause they received donations from people who work on Wall Street.  Cause you it's actually possible there might be people on wall street who ALSO want Wall Street reformed too!  It's possible.

    So let's just agree that neither of us are getting our perfect world election.  


    Jeralyn, that's Take it Easy on the Jackson Browne (none / 0) (#7)
    by ruffian on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 06:50:07 AM EST
    clip...but I would love to hear him do Peaceful Easy Feeling too.

    thans, fixed now (none / 0) (#32)
    by Jeralyn on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 10:01:18 AM EST
    much appreciated

    I'm so ready (none / 0) (#8)
    by CaptHowdy on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 07:21:56 AM EST
    For the voting to start.

    Starting to wish I could just take a nap till Feb 1st

    D. J. Trumps first attack ad (none / 0) (#14)
    by CaptHowdy on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 08:05:56 AM EST
    looks like he might spend some money after all

    Sadly, no Simon and Garfunkel

    To Date, How Many People... (none / 0) (#35)
    by ScottW714 on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 10:59:19 AM EST
    ... have said no one likes Ted Cruz.

    ONE - Donald Trump

    TWO - Bob Dole

    THREE - GWB "I just don't like the guy."

    FOUR - Bohner "a pain in the you-know-what." & Jack@ss

    The list of GOP politicians and operatives willing to take open shots at Cruz has grown long: Sen. John McCain (Ariz.), Sen. Rand Paul (Ky.), former Arkansas governor Mike Huckabee, former House speaker John A. Boehner (Ohio), Sen. Lindsey O. Graham (S.C.), fellow Texas Sen. John Cornyn, Sen. John Thune (S.D.), former senator Tom Coburn (Okla.) -- and on and on

    And these just for fun:

    College Roommate, "I would rather have anybody else be the president of the United States. Anyone. I would rather pick somebody from the phone book."

    Colleague on Bush campaign in 2000, "Why do people take such an instant dislike to Ted Cruz? It just saves time."

    The stories that have emerged from Cruz's time at the Bush campaign have suggested that his colleagues had good reason to dislike him. According to former staffers, Cruz used to send his colleagues regular updates on his accomplishments, and shoot off late-night work emails so often that people thought he must have programmed them to go out while everyone was speaking. It's no wonder that Cruz was the only high-level staffer not to get a White House job -- instead he was sent off to the Federal Trade Commission, which writers regularly refer to as a sort of Siberian exile.

    That is new to politics, at least for me, where it doesn't seem like you can find anyone beyond his family to say anything nice about him.




    He has worked (5.00 / 1) (#37)
    by CaptHowdy on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 11:02:33 AM EST
    Tirelessly for that distinction.  

    It's So Odd to Me... (none / 0) (#38)
    by ScottW714 on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 11:12:07 AM EST
    ...to want a job that basically requires people like you, when he has to know that they don't.

    It's the whole square hole round peg thing and there is certainly easier ways to earn a buck with a Harvard Law Degree.

    Cruz seems to almost take pride in being disliked.


    To be fair (none / 0) (#40)
    by CaptHowdy on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 11:22:33 AM EST
    Some people love him.  He is the fair haired boy of the hateful evangelical set.  Fortunately for the rest of us they comprise a pretty small percentage of the population.  
    But for some, more than we would like to admit probably, he is literally a dream candidate.  

    I know some supporters.   They, to a person, are the most hateful, paranoid, bitter, fearful, spiteful and angry people I encounter.

    As I said, my deeply religious and very conservative brother hates him.


    I Agree He is Popular... (none / 0) (#43)
    by ScottW714 on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 11:46:19 AM EST
    ... with the folks who have never met him.  I live in Texas, he is one of my Senators, thanks to those folks.

    I meant people that know him or have worked with him, not his supporters.


    I have a good friend (none / 0) (#48)
    by Chuck0 on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 12:25:28 PM EST
    who still lives around Fort Worth. He starts out every conversation apologizing for Texas bringing forth to the world, Ted Cruz.

    As opposed to being a US Senator (none / 0) (#81)
    by jimakaPPJ on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 02:57:49 PM EST
    and running for Prez...The "Chosen Ones" are doing what??

    It's no wonder that Cruz was the only high-level staffer not to get a White House job -- instead he was sent off to the Federal Trade Commission, which writers regularly refer to as a sort of Siberian exile.

    A Dynasty divided against itself..... (none / 0) (#15)
    by CaptHowdy on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 08:19:11 AM EST
    .....gets kickbacks from everybody!!

    Earlier this week one of the members of the Duck Dynasty family had endorsed Cruz, and in the endorsement he had said he was endorsing Cruz for ALL OF THEM... Well, that does not seem to be the case now...because one of their family members just announced the Presidential Candidate HE'LL be endorsing...and it's not Cruz!
    January 21st, 2016 - Today Donald J. Trump announced yet another coveted endorsement, with Duck Dynasty star Willie Robertson touting his support for the candidate in Las Vegas. Willie is an extremely popular figure in conservative circles and previously attended a rally in Oklahoma with Mr. Trump where he praised the GOP frontrunner's brash style and truthful talk in front of 25,000 people.

    Does anybody actually (none / 0) (#82)
    by jimakaPPJ on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 02:59:26 PM EST
    care who Willie Robertson supports???

    The Persian version of Hotel California (none / 0) (#24)
    by Mr Natural on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 09:08:46 AM EST
    - via Youtube.

    Hotel California by (Los) Cubanos, A Capella

    Hotel California and Handel, the Ukulele Orchestra of Great Britain.  ( they're both in there, I promise)

    No one seriously injured, so this is kinda funny (none / 0) (#39)
    by McBain on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 11:13:07 AM EST

    I'm not sure why she went crazy.  

    What Scott said. (5.00 / 1) (#101)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 04:38:54 PM EST
    That wasn't "kinda funny" at all. Rather, I found that woman's immature and abusive behavior to be appalling, pathetic and completely unacceptable. That driver was truly magnanimous in his response, because I'd have pressed charges against her just on principle. Good for Jackson Memorial Hospital administrators for placing that little brat on leave, and considering her termination as an employee. She fully deserves to reap the consequences of her actions.

    If everyone that had a drunk and stupid night (2.00 / 1) (#106)
    by CoralGables on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 04:51:11 PM EST
    lost their job half the country would be unemployed.

    She wasn't just drunk and stupid (5.00 / 1) (#107)
    by jondee on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 05:03:56 PM EST
    she physically assaulted a complete stranger.

    And she's now the kind of youtube star the hospital doesn't want working for them.


    I Would Love to Know... (5.00 / 1) (#115)
    by ScottW714 on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 05:34:48 PM EST
    ...how one assaults someone publicly in drunken rage and doesn't get arrested.  If I hit someone, no cop is going to walk away just because I hand the victim cash, especially if I was drinking.

    I Think It's Disgusting... (none / 0) (#80)
    by ScottW714 on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 02:56:46 PM EST
    ...and had I been the driver, she would have been arrested, but he declined.

    She's been put on leave and I would imagine she will get canned, and rightfully so.  That video will follow her, her whole life.  I sure as would never want that operating on me or a loved one.

    What is funny about it, a privileged brat treating a driver like a piece of garbage, hilarious.


    Charges weren't pressed (none / 0) (#96)
    by CoralGables on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 04:16:11 PM EST
    because she came to a financial agreement with the driver.

    What I don't particularly care for is her being suspending from work. Since there was no arrest it shouldn't concern them.


    Yeah, Cause People Only Care... (none / 0) (#103)
    by ScottW714 on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 04:43:58 PM EST
    ...if their neurosurgeon actually gets arrested...

    neurosurgeons these days (5.00 / 1) (#105)
    by jondee on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 04:48:31 PM EST
    aren't viewed exactly the way they used to be.

    Well Dr Carson proved brain surgery isn't exactly (none / 0) (#122)
    by Molly Bloom on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 06:34:29 PM EST
    rocket science.

    4th yr. neurology (none / 0) (#118)
    by oculus on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 06:04:51 PM EST
    resident. Clinical. Not a neuro-surgery residency.  

    It's called public relations. (none / 0) (#108)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 05:14:30 PM EST
    Had this video not gone viral, I seriously doubt that anything would've happened to Dr. Ramkissoon at work. But once word got out publicly that this woman was a 4th-year resident at Jackson Memorial Hospital, administrators really had no choice but to respond to her now-documented off-duty behavior.

    Suffice to say that Jackson Health officials neither sought nor desired the dubious public attention which Dr. Ramkissoon's newfound notoriety has brought upon their facility. Further, they have every right as her employer to not expect it.

    In that regard, I believe their expressed concerns about her public behavior to be entirely legitimate, as is their decision to place her on leave, pending an administrative review of her present standing as their employee.



    I won't have a problem if she gets fired (none / 0) (#142)
    by McBain on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 10:17:51 PM EST
    and, like you, I would have pressed charges. Who knows what else I would have done had I been the one assaulted? I give that driver a lot of credit for staying calm.

    What I find amusing is the sense of entitlement people like her have. She didn't get her way about something so, she was going to let everyone know it.  


    Jeb received a big endorsement today (none / 0) (#41)
    by CoralGables on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 11:32:31 AM EST
    Could be a game changer.

    You're bad (none / 0) (#45)
    by CaptHowdy on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 11:55:43 AM EST
    She's been on the fence (none / 0) (#46)
    by CoralGables on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 12:04:30 PM EST
    Maybe was thinking of endorsing her home state Senator?

    Yes, a game changer. (none / 0) (#62)
    by KeysDan on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 01:37:50 PM EST
    "of all the people running he seems to be the one who could solve the problems."   Gee, thanks, Mom. I told you I was the smrt one.

    The "smart one," we have decided (5.00 / 3) (#83)
    by Towanda on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 03:01:19 PM EST
    in this house, is a designation that must be due to Jeb being able to construct complete sentences.

    Apparently, though, that is not the way to win with a lot of Republican voters.

    This occurred to us in realizing that, like Jeb's presidential brother and father (see Dana Carvey's superb imitation), Trump speaks in phrases . . . or just hot-button words.


    I would warn against (5.00 / 1) (#91)
    by CaptHowdy on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 04:01:38 PM EST
    Assuming it's only republican voters and say again anyone who thinks a general election against Donald would be a cakewalk is missing the point.  

    I would warn against (none / 0) (#184)
    by Towanda on Sat Jan 23, 2016 at 06:13:29 PM EST
    your presumption, from your misreading.

    Wasn't really presuming (none / 0) (#188)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Jan 23, 2016 at 06:24:42 PM EST
    But my bad anyway

    And the supporters of Ebonics (2.00 / 3) (#100)
    by jimakaPPJ on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 04:35:40 PM EST
    ....due to Jeb being able to construct complete sentences.

    Apparently, though, that is not the way to win with a lot of Republican voters.

    are Repubs??? Really??

    Sorry, the devil made me do it.


    Don't you believe in personal responsibility? (none / 0) (#123)
    by Molly Bloom on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 06:39:37 PM EST
    Yes, Trump (none / 0) (#85)
    by KeysDan on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 03:28:37 PM EST
    knows his audience.  He speaks in blocks, and uses simple words, pretty much at the third or fourth grade levels.  His all time favorites include great, terrific, very, bad, problem, beautiful,  dumb, and loser.   Unlike that smrt Bush brother, though, Trump is smart, in accord with all expectations for a successful demagogue.

    How's this for knowing his audience: (5.00 / 2) (#171)
    by shoephone on Sat Jan 23, 2016 at 04:38:56 PM EST
    "I could...shoot somebody and I wouldn't lose any voters. It's, like, incredible."

    And he's right. He probably wouldn't even be arrested. This is the America we live in now.


    Don't forget "low energy" (none / 0) (#97)
    by CoralGables on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 04:18:36 PM EST
    he nails the rest of the GOP field with that regularly on Twitter

    Seth Meyers (none / 0) (#64)
    by CST on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 01:46:32 PM EST
    Takes on his biggest role yet.

    "Ah you oh ah you nat a nack?" (none / 0) (#104)
    by sarcastic unnamed one on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 04:48:14 PM EST
    Today's google doodle ... (none / 0) (#89)
    by Mr Natural on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 03:56:29 PM EST
    honors Wilbur Scoville, inventor of the Scoville organoleptic test, better known as a way to quantify the heat of hot peppers.

    How can you find the doodle?  Search for it.

    How can you avoid (none / 0) (#93)
    by CaptHowdy on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 04:03:03 PM EST
    "The doodle"

    I liked it.


    Funny... (none / 0) (#102)
    by ScottW714 on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 04:41:43 PM EST
    ...check this out, Chuck From The Bronx and 1,041,427 SHU.    

    It was funny (5.00 / 1) (#191)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Jan 23, 2016 at 06:56:03 PM EST
    But, really?   I'm struggling with which is worse - that this moron would vidi himself chewing up a ghost pepper, drinking a gallon of milk, and then barfing the whole thing up in some Tupperware

    Of that I would watch him do it.  As a race, we are doomed.


    But then (none / 0) (#192)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Jan 23, 2016 at 07:04:57 PM EST
    I watched this guy snort wasabi powder 10 years ago

    So I probably should not come down all high and mighty


    Reading a bit about this Scoville thing (none / 0) (#193)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Jan 23, 2016 at 07:33:17 PM EST
    I learn that the Ghost pepper is not the hottest.  Not even close actually.  According to the chart the "Carolina Reaper" is nearly twice as high on the chart.

    here is TWO morons eating those


    London Spy- new show on BBC America (none / 0) (#124)
    by ruffian on Fri Jan 22, 2016 at 06:42:26 PM EST
    starring Ben Whishaw, who is one of my 'I'd watch him read the phone book' actors. I'm only about 10 minutes in but totally hooked.

    This looked interesting (none / 0) (#151)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Jan 23, 2016 at 08:55:05 AM EST
    I'm really likin COLONY on USA.   They are marketing it with MR ROBOT.  Very smart.   It might be as good.

    Its Carlton Cruz.  Of LOST.  
    On that subject I and waiting fir the first DVDs of the final season.  I think I see the ending that some had problems with coming.   I do not have a problem with it.  At all.

    In fact starting in Feb I will Dogital cable with streaming and I am seriously considering starting the whole thing again.  From the top.   It really is one of the 4 or 5 best things ever made for TV.


    London Spy will only be 5 or 6 (I forget) episodes (none / 0) (#159)
    by ruffian on Sat Jan 23, 2016 at 01:21:26 PM EST
    First one was great.  You knew something was coming but not sure what...can't wait to see what happens. Whishaw is amazing.

    BEST OF LUCK (none / 0) (#152)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Jan 23, 2016 at 09:05:00 AM EST
    To all our snowbound friends.

    It looks gruesome.  

    I had a Mini Cooper (5.00 / 1) (#163)
    by Chuck0 on Sat Jan 23, 2016 at 02:10:48 PM EST
    somewhere out back last night. Now just random piles of snow. Can't see out the front window anymore because the white mountain from accumulated shoveling has gotten so high. And you can't tell any shoveling was actually done today now. Think I'll make a pot of chili.

    That would be (none / 0) (#173)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Jan 23, 2016 at 04:48:23 PM EST
    My plan.

    Glad I am in (5.00 / 2) (#167)
    by ragebot on Sat Jan 23, 2016 at 02:39:34 PM EST
    Florida, but I did put on a pair of socks; a sure sign it is winter in Florida.

    Greetings from Snowpocalypse... (5.00 / 5) (#183)
    by Anne on Sat Jan 23, 2016 at 06:05:19 PM EST
    Came up to my daughter's on Friday, to help wrangle the 3 yr old and the baby while my son-in-law was out plowing snow; so far, about 2 ft of snow - though hard to tell as there has been a lot of drifting!  We still have power - as does my husband, who's holding down the fort at home. Big question is, when will I be able to get home?

    My grandson is just so cute: "Grammy, you're having a sleepover with me! "

    Really having a great time, snuggling with the grandkids, the snow is beautiful, fire going in the fireplace; made lasagne last night and a pot of chicken noodle soup this afternoon. Cookies tomorrow.

    Life is good!


    Daughter Zorba (5.00 / 1) (#194)
    by Zorba on Sat Jan 23, 2016 at 07:38:20 PM EST
    Is stuck in Hawaii (where she was on a business trip) until Monday, when it looks like she will be able to return to NYC.
    Oh, darn, what a horrible place to get stuck in for an extra day, Hawaii.  ;-)

    Aw (none / 0) (#186)
    by Ga6thDem on Sat Jan 23, 2016 at 06:21:26 PM EST
    glad to hear you're having a good time! But yes, I would say with that much snow there might be some concern as to when you are going to be able to get out!

    Aloha from Hilo! (none / 0) (#185)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Sat Jan 23, 2016 at 06:13:41 PM EST
    It's 82, and cloudy with a light rain. The weather on the continent must really be bad, because a flock of about a dozen Canada geese has somehow ended up out here, and they're hanging out at Waiakea Park. This is the first time I've ever seen them in the islands. I wonder if they'll blow off migrating back home and take up residence instead, now that they've gotten a taste of the good life.

    It's not bad everywhere (none / 0) (#187)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Jan 23, 2016 at 06:23:50 PM EST
    Pretty much the northeast.   Or under Johan.   This has so far been a very mild winter here.   We are having our first bout of daytime below freezing temps.  And we just had a bit of snow as that storm grazed us.   It's completely gone now and I'm keeping the dogs in until the mud dries.
    The news reports are a bit hysterical.  For example twice I've heard reports that made it sound like snow in Littke Rock is unusual.  It's not.

    Bloomberg for prez (none / 0) (#155)
    by ragebot on Sat Jan 23, 2016 at 10:58:05 AM EST
    I doubt I will support him but that does not seem to be stopping him for running.

    He's another egotistical one percenter snob (5.00 / 1) (#168)
    by shoephone on Sat Jan 23, 2016 at 02:57:50 PM EST
    Just what the country needs, cuz we don't have enough of those people already in power.

    Engineering an illegal third term as mayor should have gotten him the ax. He's actually a lot like Trump in the sense that he can't stand not having all the attention.

    If he wants a "centrist" candidate so much, why doesn't he throw his money and his campaigning prowess behind Clinton? See: previous paragraph.


    I think he will probably run (none / 0) (#172)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Jan 23, 2016 at 04:47:09 PM EST
    I've thought so for a while.  I have a feeling the BS about waiting to see how "weak" Clintin is just that.  
    I think if she wins both early primaries and puts the nomination away early he might not.  I suspect he is hoping that does not happen so he can feed the "weak" media narrative.

    Maybe we should pass a law saying you have to use your own money to run.  Make it so only billionaires can run,  with the growing income gap there is starting to be enough to have a nice selection.

    That was a joke.  Not a very funny one.


    Do we even need to pass that law? No joke! (5.00 / 1) (#176)
    by shoephone on Sat Jan 23, 2016 at 04:55:29 PM EST
    And if he does run, get ready for the media to cower even more, if that's possible. There will be no questions about the questionable legality of his third mayoral term, his support for "stop and frisk" policing, or his adamant opposition to the living wage law--of $10 an hour--for NYC workers.

    It's getting to the point where I may start seriously examining a move to just north of the Washington State border. This presidential election is making me sick.


    Of course (none / 0) (#180)
    by Ga6thDem on Sat Jan 23, 2016 at 05:23:56 PM EST
    but don't let the stinking media get you down.

    One thing that's been quite obvious for quite a while and that's the media could care less about us "peons" all across the country.


    But it does get me down (5.00 / 4) (#189)
    by shoephone on Sat Jan 23, 2016 at 06:40:42 PM EST
    Without real journalism, and real questioning of authority, everything gets shoveled under the carpet. It feels like oligarchic media voices are the only ones that are going to get heard. If you think the poor can't get any poorer, and that things can't get even worse for most of us, well, there's that bridge for sale...

    I live in an area that is touted as having flourished more than any other since the recession "ended". But pitiful wages are paid to the service workers feeding the economy for the rich tech a-holes who have bought up all the real estate and turned Seattle into a soulless playground for the one percent. Meanwhile, the non-rich are being told to go f*ck ourselves. City, county and state government are selling public park land to developers to build hotels on.

    There's really not a lot of reason to stay here anymore. Canada is close by. The Sunshine Coast of B.C. wouldn't be a bad place to settle.


    Portland, sadly, is not that far behind (5.00 / 1) (#196)
    by caseyOR on Sat Jan 23, 2016 at 07:53:53 PM EST
    Seattle. Although nobody is selling parkland to developers yet.

    Still, rents have skyrocketed the last couple of years. And those damn Californians who are selling out in the Bay Area are driving up real estate prices to the point that Portlanders cannot afford to buy.

    To add insult to injury, new buyers are tearing down beautiful old houses and building new homes that fill the entire lot. It is hideous.

    I never thought I would ever think of making my home someplace other than Oregon, but life as an expat is looking better every day.


    Yeah, I wouldn't want to move to Portland (none / 0) (#199)
    by shoephone on Sat Jan 23, 2016 at 10:11:09 PM EST
    but the rents there are still quite a bit less than here. That being said, the homeless situation in Portland is abominable, and the city is otherwise being gentrified to the point where pretty soon prices will be bad as here. One thing that has saved Portland so far is the zoning laws. They're not trying to build the tallest building west of the Mississippi like Seattle is. The 2001 earthquake took out half of Seattle's Pioneer Square. The next major earthquake is going to topple everything else.

    The statewide planning (none / 0) (#200)
    by caseyOR on Sat Jan 23, 2016 at 10:33:24 PM EST
    And zoning law that was enacted back in the 1970s has really saved Oregon from many of the worst horrors of rampant development. The state is still committed to preserving farm and forest land.

    Those same zoning laws have curtailed sprawl in the Portland metro area. Still, there is the problem that happens when there is an influx of people from somewhere else, in Oregon we like to blame this on Californians, who move someplace because it is different then try to make it just like where they came from.

    Portland has invested more than many cities in trying to deal with homelessness, but it is not enough by any measure. There is more talk than walk about low income and affordable housing in the city.


    Well (none / 0) (#197)
    by Ga6thDem on Sat Jan 23, 2016 at 08:16:33 PM EST
    a long time ago people were able to get things done without the media and today we have the internet. In some ways though I'm not sure how much that actually helps people who are poor because I'm not sure how much access they have.

    Well, here in GA we might not have all those problems but we have a lot of them. Stir fundamentalism into the toxic brew. You can find affordable housing but here's the rub. It's not near anything and you have a 60 to 90 minute commute one way to a job that pays somewhat decent.

    Out in the rural areas you can get really, really cheap housing but there are zero jobs.


    That's the problem right there (none / 0) (#198)
    by shoephone on Sat Jan 23, 2016 at 10:04:10 PM EST
    People can no longer afford to live near where they work. And--unlike Portland, which started putting in light rail two decades ago--it took Western Washington until four years ago to even build the first line, from downtown to the airport, and he didn't include an actual stop right at the airport.

    It took me 45 by car to get to work at either of my two jobs last year. No rail available, and, for this major metropolitan city with supposedly some of the smartest tech minds in the world, the bus system is still a joke. (It would have taken me three buses, two hours, and waking up at 5 am each morning--no thanks!)

    As for the internet being a check on the major media, well, I think that there too the loudest voices--usually vile right wingers, racists and misogynists--are the ones getting heard.


    That said (none / 0) (#174)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Jan 23, 2016 at 04:50:05 PM EST
    I think I actually like the idea of running against two billionaires.  IMO he would definitely take more republican than democratic votes.

    Let him run.


    Supposedly (none / 0) (#175)
    by Ga6thDem on Sat Jan 23, 2016 at 04:51:50 PM EST
    he's not going to "decide" until March. So after the SEC primary. I really think he's looking to see if Bernie is the nominee because he thinks in a Bernie Trump competition he can win. I don't think he would run in a contest where he'd just siphon votes from Trump and not win.

    He's been talking about it (none / 0) (#177)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Jan 23, 2016 at 05:12:04 PM EST
    Since way before Bernie was a factor

    Okay (none / 0) (#179)
    by Ga6thDem on Sat Jan 23, 2016 at 05:22:03 PM EST
    Well, it seems that it has just become "newsworthy" today for whatever reason.

    I do know he made noises back in 2008 about running too but I don't remember what he was saying back then.


    The reason (none / 0) (#181)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Jan 23, 2016 at 05:25:07 PM EST
    Is he told the NYTimes who he knows will write any story that implies Hillary is weak.

    Haberman (none / 0) (#182)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Jan 23, 2016 at 05:28:22 PM EST
    Nuf said

    OTOH (none / 0) (#178)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Jan 23, 2016 at 05:17:12 PM EST
    Maybe having more experience with Donald than most he agrees with me that taking him for granted is a big mistake and wants to make sure Hillary wins.

    He can afford it.


    Bernie wins nom (none / 0) (#158)
    by Kmkmiller on Sat Jan 23, 2016 at 01:07:17 PM EST
    Youll be looking at Trump and Bernie throwing red meat to respective bases and socially progressive fiscally regressive Bloomberg talking calmly to voters wondering what's going on with our democracy.

    He could win.

    Clinton wins nom and it's Clinton vs Trump no Bloomberg.


    NYT link (none / 0) (#160)
    by ragebot on Sat Jan 23, 2016 at 01:40:17 PM EST
    in my post made a point of Bloomberg's flacks saying Bloomberg was not happy with Clinton for several reasons and was considering running against her.

    Again I am no fan of Bloomberg but my take is there are lots of dems who are not happy with either Sanders or Clinton; similar to lots of repubs not happy with Trump or Cruz.


    But in terms of actually winning (none / 0) (#161)
    by Kmkmiller on Sat Jan 23, 2016 at 01:52:33 PM EST
    He can win if trump vs Bernie he can't win if trump vs Clinton ...

    That's the (none / 0) (#162)
    by Ga6thDem on Sat Jan 23, 2016 at 02:09:37 PM EST
    way the media is spinning it however his aides said that he would run if it was Sanders and Trump. Sanders and Trump both have 1/3 defections leaving an opening for Bloomberg. Hillary's defections are only 20% and besides Hillary is being supported by Bloomberg's organizations for President.

    Blurb from the link in (none / 0) (#166)
    by ragebot on Sat Jan 23, 2016 at 02:38:16 PM EST

    "Even a victory by Mrs. Clinton in the Democratic primaries might not preclude a bid by Mr. Bloomberg, his associates said, if he believed she had been gravely weakened by the contest."

    Article also says Bloomberg will wait till March and assess how Clinton has done, and  how much he views her as being weakened.

    While Clinton's supporters dismiss the e-mail investigation Bloomberg has concerns and feels there are also concerns about large number of folks who do not trust Clinton.


    NYT (none / 0) (#169)
    by Kmkmiller on Sat Jan 23, 2016 at 03:02:24 PM EST
    Hates Clinton sans Krugman of course.

    Team MoDo would like to keep repeating the word "weakened" in sentences with the name "Clinton" cause that's journalism.



    According (none / 0) (#170)
    by Ga6thDem on Sat Jan 23, 2016 at 03:44:37 PM EST
    to Time his aides said that he's less likely to run if Hillary is the nominee.

    Bloomberg's organizations have been supporting her. Of course the NYT is going to put the worst possible spin on it.

    C'mon. Yeah, the email thing is a biggie for people like you but there's an email also from the Intelligence Committee that Diane Feinstein has a copy of showing that they were going to gin up this nonsense.


    I have about 500 feet of (none / 0) (#157)
    by jimakaPPJ on Sat Jan 23, 2016 at 11:13:32 AM EST
    man made global warming to clear.

    Time to wake Grandson up and let him use all those Gold's gym induced muscles...

    Captain... (none / 0) (#201)
    by ScottW714 on Mon Jan 25, 2016 at 09:55:40 AM EST
    ...on the pepper video, I was asking myself, 'Why am I watching this ?', I came up because 'I know what is coming'.  I was thinking he might go to the hospital.

    Ghost peppers are the strongest you can legally buy in the US, but not even close to the hottest.  Not sure what Bear Spray uses, but it's rated at 3M SHU.  If a human gets sprayed with it they will have to go to the emergency room.

    I bought some for Yellowstone and because my GF doesn't trust herself with a gun, I gave her the bear spray for home defense.

    I don't think that's correct (none / 0) (#202)
    by CaptHowdy on Mon Jan 25, 2016 at 09:59:49 AM EST
    Carolina Reapers are way worse (check the wiki chart) and I saw websites selling them.

    Not (none / 0) (#204)
    by CaptHowdy on Mon Jan 25, 2016 at 10:42:59 AM EST
    Could Be... (none / 0) (#205)
    by ScottW714 on Mon Jan 25, 2016 at 11:34:01 AM EST
    ...but for a long time, people were touting Ghost Peppers as the hottest pepper you can legally buy.  I never validated the claims.

    I wonder if it's like cold, at some point it just doesn't matter, or like heat, the hotter they get the more you feel it.

    Fwiw (none / 0) (#206)
    by CaptHowdy on Mon Jan 25, 2016 at 11:38:58 AM EST

    The hottest chilli is Smokin Ed's 'Carolina Reaper', grown by The PuckerButt Pepper Company (USA), which rates at an average of 1,569,300 Scoville Heat Units (SHU), according to tests conducted by Winthrop University in South Carolina, USA, throughout 2012.

    The Scoville Unit (SHU) scale is a method of quantifying a substance's 'spiciness', through determining the concentration of the chemical compounds responsible for the sensation, which are named capsaicinoids.

    Full story: Smokin Ed's Carolina Reaper sets new record for hottest chilli

    We have American chemist Wilbur Scoville to thank for the scale that rates the chillies we chomp. In 1912, long before high-pressure liquid chromatography tests in labs, he relied on taste alone. A grain of chilli was dissolved in an alcoholic solution added to sweetened water until it could barely be noted by a panel of testers. The more dilution required, the higher the rating.

    Interestingly according to the chart. Linked to there is an even more dangerous one now.