Brian Williams Demoted, Will Return to MSNBC

Brian Williams is returning to NBC -- but not as the anchor of the evening news. Instead, he will anchor breaking news and special reports on MSNBC. He appeared as a guest on the Today Show this morning with Matt Lauer. He said he's grateful for the second chance and he knows and expects he will be held to a higher standard.

Other changes are coming for MSNBC, as the network, whose ratings have been poor, starts to focus more on breaking news and less on punditry and talk shows.

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    How much breaking news is there, (5.00 / 1) (#1)
    by Anne on Fri Jun 19, 2015 at 12:42:31 PM EST
    that it can be the focus of a 24/7 "news" channel?

    Why can't these news channels do actual reporting that involves more than just putting information on a loop that repeats throughout the cycle?

    At the risk of opening a can of worms, let me give you an example of what I mean.  On our regular local news, one of the stories being "reported" has to do with the significant rise in crime in the wake of Freddie Gray's death and the charges brought against the 6 members of the BPD who were involved.

    The other day, the mayor said that if police expect to collect a paycheck, they are expected to actually do their jobs.  Well, the FOP took offense to that and issued a statement saying that there was no work slowdown and police were on the job.

    Not one single station did any more than report those two things.  No one - at least on the station I watched - made any attempt to question how the FOP's statement jibed with the 90% drop in arrests and the eye-popping number of homicides in the month of May.  It was a version of he-said-she-said with no effort to go any deeper.

    Is that news?  Is MSNBC just going to be a TV news feed now?  Heck, I get that on my Facebook page.  

    What there seems to be a real dearth of is any interest in digging below the surface of something's-happening-and-some-people-are-involved-somewhere.  

    I would just note that after Dan Rather's debacle over the GWB National Guard records, I don't think anyone ever took him seriously again; I don't know if the same will be true for Brian Williams, but it's nice that the network is making it possible for him to remain among the 1% so he can keep living well.

    "Breaking News" is fertile ground... (none / 0) (#3)
    by Mr Natural on Fri Jun 19, 2015 at 12:51:36 PM EST
    ... for speculation.

    By definition, little is known.  

    NBC has cast Williams in the perfect role for his talents.


    His greatest (5.00 / 1) (#32)
    by lentinel on Sat Jun 20, 2015 at 08:25:18 AM EST
    talent would be in modeling suits.

    MSNBC (5.00 / 2) (#17)
    by Repack Rider on Fri Jun 19, 2015 at 03:26:27 PM EST
    ...infests my cable with three hours daily of Morning Joe, who is officially So Stupid It Hurts To Look.  Chris Matthews, who now claims liberal status, lost me forever when he got a tingle in his leg looking at GW Bush's package.  The network gives a platform to these insults to the intelligence.  How much dumber will they be by adding BW?

    I love me some Rachel, I like Chris Hayes and Lawrence.    I can only handle MSNBC in the evening after Chris Matthews is done for the night.

    I may be (none / 0) (#27)
    by lentinel on Sat Jun 20, 2015 at 07:27:28 AM EST
    wrong, but I think the tingle you mentioned was his peculiar reaction to Mr. Obama.

    Matthews lost me forever when he became a passive apologist for the war in Iraq.

    Someone, occasionally, like Scott Ritter, would come on his show and present evidence that there were no WMDs, yellow cake, or whatever, and Matthews would go, "uh huh", look blank, and that was that.


    Everything makes Chris orgasmic (none / 0) (#33)
    by Repack Rider on Sat Jun 20, 2015 at 09:26:19 AM EST
    Here he is after the "Mission Accomplished" speech on the aircraft carrier, responding to a publicity stunt.

    MATTHEWS: We're proud of our president. Americans love having a guy as president, a guy who has a little swagger, who's physical, who's not a complicated guy like [former President Bill] Clinton or even like [former Democratic presidential candidates Michael] Dukakis or [Walter] Mondale, all those guys, [George] McGovern. They want a guy who's president. Women like a guy who's president. Check it out. The women like this war. I think we like having a hero as our president. It's simple. We're not like the Brits. We don't want an indoor prime minister type, or the Danes or the Dutch or the Italians, or a [Russian Federation President Vladimir] Putin. Can you imagine Putin getting elected here? We want a guy as president.

    "I think we like having a hero as (none / 0) (#34)
    by oculus on Sat Jun 20, 2015 at 09:43:53 AM EST
    our president."

    George W. Bush?


    You didn't know? (5.00 / 2) (#38)
    by NYShooter on Sat Jun 20, 2015 at 10:16:15 AM EST
    Why, of course. I don't recall the exact time & place when the ceremony took place, but, I'm quite certain Chris Matthews, by a Congressional vote, was appointed America's Vicar of tasteless symbolism and putrid protocol.

    Who else, but C. Matthews noticed that the toilet paper roll inserted in "W's" crotch was at a perfect 30 degree angle, giving him the optimum  bulge that only a Man's Man like Matthews could fully appreciate?


    Chris gives it all away... (none / 0) (#36)
    by lentinel on Sat Jun 20, 2015 at 10:09:48 AM EST
    "We want a guy as president."

    A guy.
    Not just any guy, though.
    His requirements:
    A swagger.
    Physical. (?)
    Uncomplicated. (Stupid)

    Not to mention a war that "women like".

    Matthews: The "liberal" answer to Fox.

    Digitalis please.


    First (none / 0) (#41)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Jun 20, 2015 at 06:10:26 PM EST
    no.  He is a very big Hillary supporter.  Second only someone completely unfamiliar with the MSNBC lineup would say Matthews is the liberal answer to anything.  Especially FOX.

    I can't stand the guy but you appear to be talking about things about which you do not know.


    Actually (none / 0) (#44)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Jun 20, 2015 at 06:28:21 PM EST
    Matthews and Scarborough are the networks answer to rest of their liberal lineup.   They are an effort to lure some FOX viewers.

    You can go back to Mathews (none / 0) (#37)
    by jimakaPPJ on Sat Jun 20, 2015 at 10:10:19 AM EST
    He said it about Obama.

    During his 19-year tenure as host of the Hardball cable TV political talk show, Chris Matthews has made several mistakes, but the one he will probably be remembered for most was his 2008 off-the-cuff remark that "I felt this thrill going up my leg" while listening to a speech given by then-presidential candidate Barack Obama.



    As I pointed out (5.00 / 1) (#39)
    by Repack Rider on Sat Jun 20, 2015 at 11:04:56 AM EST
    He LOVES whoever has the juice at the moment.

    A full service panderer, not worth listening to.


    Rider if Joe is stupid, (none / 0) (#40)
    by fishcamp on Sat Jun 20, 2015 at 11:09:07 AM EST
    What does that make Mika?

    What does that make Mika? (5.00 / 2) (#47)
    by Mr Natural on Sat Jun 20, 2015 at 09:06:02 PM EST
    Stuck on Stupid.

    Mika's dad calls out Boring Joe (5.00 / 1) (#49)
    by Mordiggian 88 on Mon Jun 22, 2015 at 06:24:40 AM EST
    from a few years ago on his superficial views of the Mideast:

    Scarborough: "You cannot blame what's going on in Israel on the Bush administration."

    Brzezinski: "You know, you have such a stunningly superficial knowledge of what went on that it's almost embarrassing to listen to you."

    Wouldn't it be great if that were normal? (none / 0) (#50)
    by Mr Natural on Mon Jun 22, 2015 at 12:50:10 PM EST
    I woke up early today (none / 0) (#51)
    by CaptHowdy on Mon Jun 22, 2015 at 04:48:02 PM EST
    and like an idiot tuned in.  Immediately there was a segment on Terri Schaivo (sp?) that made me want to go back to sleep.

    Clueless Joe was condescending to Howard Dean about how he was an idiot to think it would be an issue in any possible election where Jeb was a candidate.  About how he did the right thing.  About how it was a decade ago and nobody cares but hysterical liberals.   Howard basically returned the favor and I changed the channel.


    Stupids sidekick (none / 0) (#42)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Jun 20, 2015 at 06:13:49 PM EST
    Stewart described them as two people who would normally only meet when her Lexis broke down and he picked her up in the tow truck.

    I actually used to see that show pretty regularly.  In the last year or two, or perhaps it's just me, it's gotten way more rightward leaning.

    I can't stand it any more.  I only tune in when I want the dependable right wing response to something.


    Also (none / 0) (#43)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Jun 20, 2015 at 06:25:55 PM EST
    i coukd have to do with the fact that I'm not working.   As stupid as they are they are IMO still way ahead of any other morning TV.  If you want to catch up on the news while getting out the door to work........

    Which is why I always saw it.


    Employed (none / 0) (#46)
    by unitron on Sat Jun 20, 2015 at 07:07:41 PM EST

    I can't say that I've missed his smirk. (5.00 / 2) (#26)
    by desertswine on Fri Jun 19, 2015 at 09:23:57 PM EST

    I Saw the Interview... (none / 0) (#2)
    by ScottW714 on Fri Jun 19, 2015 at 12:44:23 PM EST
    ...and as much as I like Williams, it rubbed me the wrong way how he avoided saying he lied.  He had a lapse of reason, his brain, his ego...  blah, blah, blah. He apologized, but as much as Lauer tried, he would not admit to lying.

    I like Lester Holt, but the Nightly News is not the same without Williams.

    Interesting that (5.00 / 1) (#30)
    by lentinel on Sat Jun 20, 2015 at 08:20:48 AM EST
    the Nightly News is not the same without Williams"...

    since the "news" is exactly the same no matter who reads the copy on the teleprompter.

    The difference is in the projected personality of the frontman, who is there to sell us on the authenticity of the mostly swill with which we are being presented.

    The Nightly News has become, and has been for quite awhile in my opinion, about 10 minutes of "news" - filtered through corporate/political slant du jour - and then the rest is a presentation of features. (also similarly chosen and filtered).

    Just my opinion...


    To a liar, the only sin is admitting it. (none / 0) (#4)
    by Mr Natural on Fri Jun 19, 2015 at 01:00:31 PM EST
    As Ken Kesey's famous patriarch said, "Never give an inch."

    What's unbelievable is that NBC allowed this crap artist back in the building.  He's their house Dubya.  And it speaks volumes about the depth of their concern for accurate and unspun reporting.

    Do yourself a favor.  Turn off your television.


    Better Idea... (none / 0) (#5)
    by ScottW714 on Fri Jun 19, 2015 at 01:25:40 PM EST
    ...stop reading your non-sense.

    I doubt there is a human being on the planet that hasn't embellished a past event, his problem was the event was related to the military.  Had he said he ran a 4:40 in college no one would have cared enough to even check.

    But more importantly, he wasn't doing it while reporting the news, it was on his own time.


    It wasn't just once, Scott; Williams (5.00 / 1) (#6)
    by Anne on Fri Jun 19, 2015 at 01:49:57 PM EST
    on numerous occasions "embellished" his stories, either to elevate his own role, or to jazz up the story.

    If someone is willing to do that, what else are they willing to take liberties with to make a better story?  Geez, it's bad enough that we can hardly trust the news, and always have to go in search of what they're not telling us, but I don't want it further tainted by some "reporter" making it all about him.

    He seems like a pleasant enough fellow, but there probably isn't a word that falls from his mouth now that I'd not question.  When that's how people feel about you, you don't have much of a future in the news business.


    He Lied on His Own Time... (none / 0) (#9)
    by ScottW714 on Fri Jun 19, 2015 at 02:00:47 PM EST
    ...to jump to 'taking liberties with the news' has not been proven and I am sure it's been thoroughly investigated.

    News business ?  Two posts up you basically call them stenographers.  It might be suspect, but for me, if they can't find one example in all of his air time, then I am OK with it.

    Yeah, and I embellish, you embellish, past stories, so what is the point, that doesn't in any way mean I embellish financials at work.

    I think that is a huge leap, you do not, so if I could watch him tonight I would, you would not.


    No, Scott - this wasn't just about (5.00 / 2) (#12)
    by Anne on Fri Jun 19, 2015 at 02:39:47 PM EST
    Williams lying on his own time.

    Here are three:


    During the January 30, 2015, NBC Nightly News broadcast, Brian Williams referred to "a terrible moment a dozen years back during the invasion of Iraq when the helicopter we were traveling in was forced down after being hit by an RPG." Williams later said he was not in the the helicopter that was hit by an RPG, but in a helicopter direclty behind it. The pilots of Williams' helicopter say their chopper was not directly behind the hit Chinook, but in a different company altogether.

    SEAL Team 6

    During the May 3, 2011, NBC Nightly News broadcast, Williams said that he had "the great honor of flying into Baghdad with [SEAL Team 6] at the start of the war." A Special Operations Command spokesman has told Huffington Post: "We do not embed journalists with this or any other unit that conducts counter-terrorism missions." Said another SEAL officer to CNN: "That early in the conflict, there were only missions taking place, not bouncing between outstations."

    The Berlin Wall

    At a 2008 forum at the Ronald Reagan Presidential Library, Williams said that he "was at the Brandenburg Gate the night the [Berlin] wall came down." As CNN reports, "'the night the wall came down' is widely recognized as November 9, 1989. ... An NBC News source in a position to know confirmed to CNNMoney that "Brian arrived the day after the wall came down.


    This does not include his reporting during Katrina, which is widely believed to have been "embellished," vis-a-vis dead bodies floating in the water.

    From what i've read, he did tend to be more careful when sitting at the anchor desk - likely because he had other people to answer to, but when he was sitting next to David Letterman, or Ellen DeGeneres, or doing appearances with Jimmy Fallon or on SNL or giving speeches and commencement addresses, he was doing so as the face of NBC News, not as Brian Williams, regular Joe.

    It's like saying that while George Bush was a horrible president, he was fun on his own time, so let's give him a break.


    I Thought... (none / 0) (#20)
    by ScottW714 on Fri Jun 19, 2015 at 04:00:37 PM EST
    ...these comments were made on a Late Night Show.

    This is the first time I am reading that he did it at the desk.  That definitely changes things and I feel like an idiot.

    Funny, I just read he is getting $10M, demoted down from $15M/yr.  The horror.


    but he lied (none / 0) (#10)
    by Reconstructionist on Fri Jun 19, 2015 at 02:03:26 PM EST
     about an event that occurred (or rather didn't) while he was working.

    i woulda checked. (5.00 / 1) (#8)
    by sarcastic unnamed one on Fri Jun 19, 2015 at 01:54:55 PM EST
    No way he was faster than me.

    Yeah 4:40 Would Probably Been Investigated... (none / 0) (#11)
    by ScottW714 on Fri Jun 19, 2015 at 02:32:50 PM EST
    ...even more, how about 5:20 ?  Better yes, how about 2/10ths slower than you ?

    He's like Steven Wright.  "The other day I ... no wait, that wasn't me."

    Hell, 4:40 isn't that great (none / 0) (#14)
    by Reconstructionist on Fri Jun 19, 2015 at 02:49:40 PM EST
      The national  HS record is 3:53 (and that's only in HS competition, I think there are faster times by HS kids in open meets). There are middle school boys and   HS girls who can do 4:40.

     I could consistently break 5:00 and it wasn't even one of my events. I wouldn't have batted an eye if he said her could do that (of course he'd likely have said 4:01 so his absence from a list of sub-4 runners would go unremarked).



    Ya, 4:40 is definitely not great. (none / 0) (#15)
    by sarcastic unnamed one on Fri Jun 19, 2015 at 02:54:05 PM EST
    I still woulda checked.

    Well, I would now (none / 0) (#16)
    by Reconstructionist on Fri Jun 19, 2015 at 03:01:57 PM EST
     as to Williams, although he looks like he could have been a good middle distance runner.

    As long as we're on the subject of ... (none / 0) (#18)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Fri Jun 19, 2015 at 03:41:17 PM EST
    ... hypothetical road races and one's embellishment of personal accomplishments, why should a newsreader like Brian Williams be held to a far stricter standard -- even in such a hypothetical -- than, say, a vice presidential candidate from a major political party who's also chairman of the House Committee on Appropriations?

    Now, I've never much cared for Williams and hardly ever watched NBC Nightly News while he was anchor. But I care even less for the obvious double standards on permanent public display in our society with regard to an individual's "truthiness."

    I would think that the tendency of Williams and / or Bill O'Reilly to dissemble and embellish isn't necessarily going to have a substantive impact on my life one way or the other. On the other hand, the similar tendency of a ranking public official like Congressman Paul Ryan to do the same has real potential to create some very serious problems for everyone. Yet of those three men, only one has paid a consequential price for his sins.

    Brian Williams has served his penance. I'm perfectly content to let him be.

    Happy racing.


    The difference (none / 0) (#19)
    by Reconstructionist on Fri Jun 19, 2015 at 03:55:00 PM EST
     is that with a politician individual voters each get to exercise their choice as they see fit. With a newsreader there is the simple expedient of his boss makes a call. The call the boss makes is suggestive of the values of the corporation.

     Of course, the collective choices of voters are also suggestive of values but it's sort of important to a free society that voters still be allowed to vote even if we don't agree with their values and think they exercise their franchise unwisely.

       And, let's try to retain focus. Williams wasn't disciplined for lying about his speed. He publicly misrepresented events that occurred in the course of his reporting.  


    I realize that. (none / 0) (#24)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Fri Jun 19, 2015 at 08:34:31 PM EST
    Reconstructionist: "And, let's try to retain focus. Williams wasn't disciplined for lying about his speed. He publicly misrepresented events that occurred in the course of his reporting."

    If you re-read what I wrote above, you'll note that I was simply playing off someone else's hypothetical, and clearly said so.

    But my point was and is this: Brian Williams is a newsreader. He's not empowered to make decisions that potentially impact the lives of others in this country, whereas Paul Ryan is a ranking member of Congress who was not only the 2012 GOP candidate for vice president, but is the chairman of a very powerful and important House Committee that develops the federal budget.

    And Congressman Ryan clearly fibbed about having run in multiple marathons, and further claimed that his best time was "2:50-something." The truth was that at the time he made his claim, he had run exactly one marathon in his life, and his time in that race was 4:03.

    Personally, I think that completing even one marathon is an accomplishment in and of itself. But the fact that Ryan so casually misled his interviewer about something otherwise fairly banal is much more telling about him, than anything Williams is alleged to have said on his own behalf.

    It's therefore probably not that much of a stretch for Ryan to then dissemble at length about the federal budget, and tell the general public that he's not cutting Social Security when an examination of his work product would clearly tell us otherwise. And that's the difference here between the two.

    Look, I'm not defending what Brian Williams either did or is alleged to have done in his now-former capacity as the anchor of NBC Nightly News. That was never my intent at all.

    Honestly, that guy has always epitomized to me the very definition of celebrity journalists, the sort who have a penchant for inserting themselves into their own storylines, more than likely as a means of elevating their own personal professional profile rather that serving the greater cause of journalism. (See "Cooper, Anderson.")

    With these types of journalists, there's always an element of risk that at some point, they'll inadvertently become the story themselves, often at the expense of the bigger picture. And that's what seems to have happened with Williams, at least as far as I can tell.

    So, while it's fine to "retain focus," let's also try to maintain some real sense of perspective here. There've been any number of people commenting about this particular story -- and about Bill O'Reilly's own dubious claims to have been a war correspondent, for that matter -- in the media and elsewhere, whose personal outrage meters are often in smoking ruins by the time they're done fulminating.

    But when it comes to some public officials of influence offering similar personal embellishments or fibs, like Paul Ryan, Hillary Clinton and yes, even the late Ronald Reagan -- who, lest we forget, once told Israeli Prime Minister Yitzak Shamir in November 1983 that as an officer in the U.S. Army Signal Corps during the Second World War, he had personally witnessed the horrors of Nazi death camps in Europe, when in fact he had never even left his assigned post in Culver City, CA -- many of these very same pundits and critics have often just shrugged their shoulders and said, "Meh!"

    It's that very sort of situational ethics which tends to bother me. As Scott noted earlier in this thread, people will embellish stories all the time for a variety of reasons -- some of them benign, some duplicitous and others apparently malevolent.

    Sometimes, our own clarity of mind fades with the passage of time, and we'll recall a certain event in our lives that actually didn't quite happen the way we now seem to believe it did. Other times, people embellish for dramatic effect to impress an audience or listener, which seems to be the case with both Williams and O'Reilly. And there are those whose prevarications are offered for less than altruistic purposes, like Dick Cheney.

    And what I'm noticing with increasing frequency is that critics are not really examining that person's possible reason or motive before rendering judgment, but are instead targeting the offending individual in their crosshairs on the basis of other criteria, such as personal politics.

    And in William's case, his critics -- particularly those on the right -- obviously weren't seeking to enlighten the public and correct the record. Rather, they were simply looking to take the guy's scalp and have his job, in order to send some sort of message to the left or something.

    Then critics on the left, looking to retaliate, proceeded to take to task Bill O'Reilly -- who tends to offer himself as a tempting target in any event -- over his claims about being in the Falkland Islands during the 1982 war between Britain and Argentina. And before we knew it, everyone's talking about the two of them like columnists in a gossip magazine, rather than perhaps reconsidering the actual stories they were covering at the time of their respective faux pas.

    As I said earlier, I hardly ever watched NBC Nightly News while Brian Williams was anchor, so I'm not at all vested in his professional fate, although I certainly don't wish the man any ill will. I simply feel that since he's now served his penance as ordained by his bosses at NBC for whatever it was that he did, if the network brass are fine with him returning to work in another capacity, then so am I. Anyway, it's their money, not mine.

    I can't speak for others here, but for me anyway, I think there are far more important things for me to be concerned about than the prospect of Williams anchoring "Breaking News" at MSNBC. I can only hope that in his case, he's since learned his lesson, and will henceforth resist any further personal urges to jack his own ego at the expense of the news itself.



    What Brian Really Learned: (none / 0) (#25)
    by Mr Natural on Fri Jun 19, 2015 at 09:02:11 PM EST
    There are three kinds of lies:  Lies, Damned Lies, and Television Journalism.

    For someone who doesn't like Williams (none / 0) (#35)
    by jimakaPPJ on Sat Jun 20, 2015 at 10:04:29 AM EST
    and who hardly ever watched NBC......

    You sure are trying to fog the issue.



    Yes, thanks for bringing up politicians' (none / 0) (#21)
    by sarcastic unnamed one on Fri Jun 19, 2015 at 04:03:59 PM EST
    "truthiness" and the double standards of their acolytes.

    How many of our candidates for POTUS, for example, have falsely claimed to have been shot at during the Bosnia War?

    And then when presented with video proving that the story was, well, "embellished," they quickly claimed to have "misspoke."


    Ouch! (none / 0) (#22)
    by Reconstructionist on Fri Jun 19, 2015 at 04:14:19 PM EST
      I'm willing to bet that any press attention to the fabulism of that candidate will not be met with wide approval here and will be dismissed with claims it is evidence of unfair bias.

    Should we start with Reagan (none / 0) (#23)
    by MKS on Fri Jun 19, 2015 at 05:58:42 PM EST
    and his fables...

    And Cheney and his death inducing ones?


    Reagan? (none / 0) (#31)
    by lentinel on Sat Jun 20, 2015 at 08:22:48 AM EST
    Who mean the guy who liberated the camps in WW2?
    That Reagan?

    I had not heard that one.... (none / 0) (#45)
    by MKS on Sat Jun 20, 2015 at 06:55:49 PM EST
    Well... (none / 0) (#48)
    by lentinel on Sat Jun 20, 2015 at 10:46:49 PM EST
    During Israeli Prime Minister Yitzhak Shamir's November 1983 visit to the U.S., Reagan told Shamir that during his service in the U.S. Army film corps, he and fellow members of his unit personally shot footage of the Nazis' concentration camps as they were liberated. Reagan would tell this story again to others, including Holocaust survivor Simon Wiesenthal. But Reagan was never present at the camps' liberation. Instead, he spent the war in Culver City, California, where he processed footage from the liberation of the camps.

    From http://www.salon.com/2015/02/07/ronald_reagans_wartime_lies_the_president_had_quite_a_brian_williams _problem/.


    It was also (none / 0) (#7)
    by Reconstructionist on Fri Jun 19, 2015 at 01:52:08 PM EST
     rather directly related TO HIS JOB.

    He couldn't say (none / 0) (#28)
    by lentinel on Sat Jun 20, 2015 at 07:35:01 AM EST
    that he lied.

    But he said he had said "untruths".

    What a tight-arsted bs artist.

    He's a politician.
    Not a journalist.


    A new one: (none / 0) (#29)
    by lentinel on Sat Jun 20, 2015 at 07:38:02 AM EST
    "The ego made me do it!".

    Possession by an Ego.

    Is there an ego-exorcism?

    I absolute love (none / 0) (#52)
    by CaptHowdy on Mon Jun 22, 2015 at 04:50:14 PM EST
    the right wing freakout over the president using the N word to make a point in an interview.

    Irony abounds.

    Oops (none / 0) (#53)
    by CaptHowdy on Mon Jun 22, 2015 at 04:50:50 PM EST
    wrong thread