Valentine's Day Open Thread

From our heart to yours, Happy Valentine's Day.

If you have a romantic event planned, feel free to share. If not, this is an open thread, all topics welcome.

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    For my wife I wrote a "poem" (5.00 / 10) (#1)
    by Slado on Sat Feb 14, 2015 at 04:28:13 AM EST
    She has been a superstar these past few months all things considered so even though I'm not a poet I wrote her this to let her know how much she means to me...


    As I lay awake at night I reflect on my life past
    Of memories and happiness that I could always grasp
    The joy and love and peace I find are mine to hold and cherish
    And it was my wife who helped me catch this life that will not perish

    Hope you and your loved ones make the most of this day.   Our kids are in FL with the grandparents so I get her all to myself.  

    Flowers and together time will be enough to make this one a special day.

    I hope (5.00 / 2) (#2)
    by Ga6thDem on Sat Feb 14, 2015 at 08:37:18 AM EST
    you and your wife have a wonderful day!

    That is lovely, Slado. (5.00 / 1) (#4)
    by caseyOR on Sat Feb 14, 2015 at 12:39:18 PM EST
     I hope you and your wife have the sweetest weekend ever.

    How great is it that the kids are at the grandparents'?


    and, thank you (none / 0) (#6)
    by NYShooter on Sat Feb 14, 2015 at 02:07:22 PM EST
    for the reference to, "my wife," instead of the (yuch) "the spouse."

    Wife or Bride (5.00 / 1) (#7)
    by Slado on Sat Feb 14, 2015 at 02:21:04 PM EST
    those are my two descriptions for her.

    Spouse is way to plain.


    Thought I would share this article (5.00 / 3) (#19)
    by Anne on Sun Feb 15, 2015 at 05:39:21 PM EST
    from the Baltimore Sun's TV critic, who is weighing in on the Brian Williams debacle.  The "meat:"

    Some still disagree about Williams. Their narrative is that he was a fine journalist who blew all that up with his self-aggrandizing lies that came to light in recent days.

    But the fact is that, as managing editor of NBC News' flagship broadcast, Williams helped drive it into journalistic bankruptcy.

    Exhibit A: NBC gives Williams a prime-time newsmagazine, and he hires Chelsea Clinton as a special correspondent at $600,000 a year. And he showcases her sorry work.

    This sent a demoralizing message to the real journalists at NBC News, especially those in combat zones who were in real danger and getting paid far less than $600,000 a year. And this for someone without a bit of journalistic training or experience, who during her mother's 2008 presidential campaign refused to even talk to the media.

    But there are many other examples, the most recent being an incorrect report on the "NBC Nightly News with Brian Williams" that the gunmen responsible for murdering 12 people at the Paris offices of the satirical magazine Charlie Hebdo had been killed or were in custody when that was not yet the case.

    Even after the "exclusive" report by Pete Williams was exposed as false by law enforcement authorities and other publications, it remained on the "Nightly News" website for more than an hour after the broadcast.

    Brian Williams acknowledged the mistake on air Jan. 8 during the "NBC Nightly News," but if there was any blame suggested by his words, it was directed at the two anonymous "sources" Pete Williams based his report on -- not NBC's news operation for going with their words.

    But worse, "NBC Nightly News" made a similar mistake a year earlier with tweets about a mall shooting in Columbia and refused to even acknowledge it, despite my calling the network repeatedly in an effort to discuss it.

    If nothing else, maybe this is the point where the networks do more "journalism," and less entertainment - yeah, they'll be doing it because there's money in stealing viewers from NBC, but if it ends up with better reporting, so much the better.

    RIP Leslie Gore (5.00 / 1) (#31)
    by CaptHowdy on Mon Feb 16, 2015 at 07:08:50 PM EST
    Sorry LESLEY (none / 0) (#33)
    by CaptHowdy on Mon Feb 16, 2015 at 07:17:33 PM EST
    lol; It's your party (none / 0) (#35)
    by Mr Natural on Mon Feb 16, 2015 at 08:10:10 PM EST
    ... serving on the Oklahoma House Committee on Education, who voted today to prohibit Advanced Placement (AP) U.S. history courses in that state's public high schools.

    Readin', Writin', n Weldin's all the Book larnin' (none / 0) (#65)
    by Mr Natural on Wed Feb 18, 2015 at 01:02:48 AM EST
    any kid needs.

    Fisher said the Advanced Placement history class fails to teach "American exceptionalism."

    Whadda buncha moroons.


    I'll be getting snowed in (none / 0) (#3)
    by CST on Sat Feb 14, 2015 at 10:51:30 AM EST
    Again.  So no going out anywhere.  But at least this blizzard is hitting on a weekend when I'm visiting the fellow, so it will be a lot nicer being snowed in together.  And since he works on weekends, but will be getting off due to the snow, in a way the snow is a Valentine's gift.

    At this point the situation in the city is already so bad, I'm not really sure how another foot or two could make things much worse.

    Here in the SouthWest (none / 0) (#8)
    by desertswine on Sat Feb 14, 2015 at 02:50:38 PM EST
    we've been trending about 20degrees above normal for the last couple of weeks.  It's so mild it's scary.  Might go down to Bosque del Apache this weekend to see the cranes (if they're still even here).

    Finally expected to get some snow (none / 0) (#10)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Feb 14, 2015 at 04:24:37 PM EST
    sunday night into Monday.  

    Nothing romantic this Valentines Day for me (none / 0) (#5)
    by Zorba on Sat Feb 14, 2015 at 12:45:23 PM EST
    Mr. Zorba is traveling in Europe for his job, and won't be back until Sunday night.

    12 Monkeys (none / 0) (#9)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Feb 14, 2015 at 04:23:20 PM EST
    i have been recording this series on SyFy but just got around to it.  It's really pretty good.  There is a marathon of all the episodes so far this Monday afternoon.  If you are snowed in, we expect to be, might be a good way to spend some time.

    Don't expect the movie.  It's completely different.

    And if you're not snowed in, ... (none / 0) (#16)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Sun Feb 15, 2015 at 04:32:01 PM EST
    ... then please don't waste your time seeing "Kingsman: The Secret Service." Trust me, I've already done that for you. The preponderance of gratuitous violence and gore renders it the most visceral case of cinematic excess I've seen in a long, long time, and it's clearly an early frontrunner for worst movie of 2015.

    Boo. Hiss.


    Thanks for the heads up. (none / 0) (#17)
    by vml68 on Sun Feb 15, 2015 at 05:15:51 PM EST
    I "watched" (had to close my eyes for most of the film) 'The Equalizer' a few days ago. What a waste of my time. Talk about excessive violence!

    Hopefully, next time I will pay more attention to the story than the star cast before I rent a movie.


    "Kingman" is far worse. (none / 0) (#23)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Sun Feb 15, 2015 at 08:39:16 PM EST
    Several scenes were really stomach-churning. We were guilty of the same thing, picking a movie by its cast, having noted that it starred Colin Firth, Samuel L. Jackson and Michael Caine. What could possibly go wrong with these guys, right? Well, lots of things, as it turns out.

    Am hoping tonight's 40th anniversary (none / 0) (#18)
    by Anne on Sun Feb 15, 2015 at 05:31:52 PM EST
    of SNL will be good - am going to record it, since it starts at 7...

    I'd be a bad person to discuss SNL (5.00 / 2) (#30)
    by CoralGables on Mon Feb 16, 2015 at 01:39:34 PM EST
    as the last time I viewed it, Mr. Bill's dog jumped through a fiery hoop somewhere around 1978.

    I enjoyed it (none / 0) (#25)
    by McBain on Mon Feb 16, 2015 at 01:32:42 AM EST
    I skipped through about a third but it was better than most anniversary shows.  Did Eddie Murphy only do that one quick monologue bit? I was hoping he would do an actual sketch.

    My favorite cast/era was either the Martin Short/Christopher Guest days or the Phil Hartman/Dana Carvey days.  


    I could have done without the (none / 0) (#26)
    by Anne on Mon Feb 16, 2015 at 06:42:02 AM EST
    overly-long "Californians" sketch.  And I wasn't crazy about the music: neither Paul McCartney nor Paul Simon can sing live worth a damn anymore, and I hate seeing such formerly great talents showing the world how much they've lost.

    There were parts we really enjoyed, but for my money, there weren't enough of those.  


    Best topical line of the night ,,, (5.00 / 1) (#40)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Tue Feb 17, 2015 at 03:05:48 AM EST
    ... was delivered by Jane Curtin on "Weekend Update":

    "Times have changed since the first time I sat behind this desk. For example, 40 years ago I used to be the only pretty blonde woman reading the fake news. Now there's a whole network devoted to that."

    Jane Curtin's still got it (none / 0) (#44)
    by CST on Tue Feb 17, 2015 at 09:26:18 AM EST
    And that was the best line of the night.  Dana Carvey and Steve Martin too.  Everyone else on the other hand...

    People who do too many drugs don't age very well, and neither do their voices.  Especially the musicians.  Take note Miley - who I thought was by far the best singer on stage that night, although I missed about a third of the show including Fallon and Timberlake.

    Everyone seems to have hated the Californians, I actually kind of liked it, until Taylor Swift showed up and completely bombed that accent.  Her inclusion there just felt forced, she's not a comedian.


    I would have liked to have seen more (none / 0) (#52)
    by Anne on Tue Feb 17, 2015 at 10:11:58 AM EST
    of Fallon and Timberlake, as well as Andy Samberg - I think they are all very good.

    Loved Jane Curtin, and agree she had the best line of the night.

    "Wayne's World" was pretty good, too, I thought.

    It really says something about the show and the people behind it - Lorne Michaels and the writers - that it's still relevant 40 years after it started (though I do think it's had some not-so-good years).


    Emma Stone (none / 0) (#53)
    by jbindc on Tue Feb 17, 2015 at 10:18:37 AM EST
    Did a great impersonation of Roseanne Roseannadanna.  And Melissa McCarthy as Matt Foley was hilarious.  

    Surprised Fallon and Timberlake could sing "Dick in a Box" at the very beginning, which was the 8 o'clock hour.  

    Wished Eddie Murphy would have done something, and I wished they would have cut all the musical numbers, except maybe Miley Cyrus, who did an amazing job on "50 Ways to Leave Your Lover," which I imagine couldn't have been too easy with Paul Simon sitting 20 feet away!  (It makes me sad to watch Paul McCartney now as he just doesn't have the chops, and Kanye sucks and was down right creepy, not to mention the "Kanye tries to run up to the stage" bit wasn't funny after the 2nd and 3rd time).


    Miley Cyrus was good. (5.00 / 1) (#54)
    by caseyOR on Tue Feb 17, 2015 at 10:24:30 AM EST
    I am not a Miley fan. I am not her target demographic by a long shot. That said, I loved her rendition of 50 Ways to Leave Your Lover.

    I was pleasantly surprised by her performance. And it was the best musical performance of the night.

    And, yes, it was a little sad to watch Paul McCartney. He just cannot hit those notes anymore.


    I also really liked (none / 0) (#56)
    by CST on Tue Feb 17, 2015 at 10:35:00 AM EST
    Bill Murray's Jaws song.  I forgot about that but it was definitely one of the highlights.

    Timberlake is one of the few singers who is actually a natural comedian, a combo that works so well on SNL, so I'm sorry I missed that part.

    I agree with the Kanye criticism, he just wasn't good.  He got too crazy with the set and missed the vocals.  Realizing he's certainly not everyone's cup of tea - I actually am a big fan of Kanye's music, although he seems to be on an electronica kick that I can't fully get into.  I have seen him perform live in concert before, so I know he is very capable of being a great live performer, but that was just bad. Miley Cyrus crushed it though.  Which going back to the Katy Perry discussion from the Superbowl, just goes to show that some pop stars CAN sing.


    Miley does a very nice version (none / 0) (#59)
    by jondee on Tue Feb 17, 2015 at 01:37:51 PM EST
    of the Dylan sing You're Gonna Make Me Lonesome on the recent Dylan tribute CD..

    She has one of those voices that sounds more European, like she should be singing in French in a smoky café in Paris..


    I liked the Californians (none / 0) (#70)
    by Militarytracy on Thu Feb 19, 2015 at 07:54:30 AM EST
    My husband thought Miley had a great voice.  He did not know who she was at first, and he missed all controversies.

    Louis CK made a good point (none / 0) (#27)
    by McBain on Mon Feb 16, 2015 at 12:43:10 PM EST
    most of those SNL sketches are too long.

    I don't like the recurring sketches/characters.  If it's funny once, it's usually not as funny the second time.  However, you can't blame Lorne Michaels for using a formula that has worked for 40 years.  Those recurring characters lead to profitable movies.  


    The Jeopardy skit was hilarious... (none / 0) (#28)
    by Anne on Mon Feb 16, 2015 at 12:56:52 PM EST
    and that was a recurring bit for some years.

    I still chuckle thinking about the Sean Connery character asking for the category  "Le T!ts Now" instead of "Let it Snow," and "Whore Ads" instead of "Who Reads."

    And Jim Carrey's Jeopardy appearance as Matthew McConaughey was spot-on.


    I don't like the skits that (none / 0) (#29)
    by nycstray on Mon Feb 16, 2015 at 01:09:46 PM EST
    don't really wrap up. Noticed that again last night. It's like the skit is moving along and then just sorta hangs before breaking up and off to commercial or something else.

    I keep trying (none / 0) (#42)
    by jbindc on Tue Feb 17, 2015 at 07:29:54 AM EST
    To find some of the "top" the women of SNL funny, bit it isn't working.  I WANT to like them.  Kristen Whig is supposed to be a genius, but every skit she's in - not funny and the gag goes on too long.  The Californians?  Stupid.  The songwriters sketch with Fred Armisen - lame.  Even when they showed "the classics" like the Target Lady, they were dumb, dumb, dumb Not sure why her characters always have to act like they are drunk or have neurological tics.

    Still don't get Tina Fey and Amy Poehler as more than slightly amusing.  Poehler seems to be shouting half the time and Fey's jokes are obvious before she gets to the punchline.

    Now, Maya Rudolph was funny (although the Beyonce skit with Martin Short went on to long). And of course, other alums like Molly Shannon, Ana Gasteyer, Rachel Dratch, etc.  were still funny.  


    I Am With You... (none / 0) (#45)
    by ScottW714 on Tue Feb 17, 2015 at 09:35:59 AM EST
    ...on Fey & Poehler.  And I will never get Kristin Wig, even the movies she is in, she is always the weak link.  And on SNL it seems like half her 'funny' characters were in some way physically/mentally handicapped and that to me is fruit hanging so low, it's rotten.  Fey & Poehler are much better in movies IMO.

    I am avid SNL viewer and I think the current cast of women is the strongest they have had in some time.  Cecily Strong, Nasim Pedra, and Vanessa Bayer are so funny.  But no one can mess will Bill Hader, I hate that he left.  

    My favorite bits are Kim K & Kayne, and Miley Cyrus.

    I think Taran Killam is going to be good and Kenan Thompson is such a good all purpose guy that he seems likely to make it post-SNL.

    I have not watched the anniversary show yet.


    Kenan Thompson (none / 0) (#47)
    by CST on Tue Feb 17, 2015 at 09:46:01 AM EST
    is a tough one - because he was doing sketch comedy for years on TV long before he was on SNL, and he's amazing at it, but it's also the only thing I can really picture him doing.

    Tina Fey only ever did weekend update and Sarah Palin - which was long after she'd left the show and she only did it because public opinion demanded she do it.  She was a writer though, she never did sketches.  Her first real "acting" gig was the one she gave herself on 30 rock.  That being said, I do like Poehler and Wig, although I agree that Maya Rudolph's Beyonce killed them all.

    I haven't watched enough of the new ones yet to have a solid opinion.


    Nobody beats Gilda Radner (none / 0) (#50)
    by caseyOR on Tue Feb 17, 2015 at 10:05:53 AM EST
    when it comes to being funny. She was a genius. I can only imagine where her career would have taken her and what laughs she would have given us, had she not been struck down by ovarian cancer at 42.

    And Jane Curtin was no slouch. Her post-SNL TV career has been stellar. Nobody does dead-pan like Jane.


    Where was Cheri Oteri? Would have (none / 0) (#57)
    by Anne on Tue Feb 17, 2015 at 10:39:02 AM EST
    loved to have seen a reprise of the cheerleaders with Will Ferrell.

    And as an aside, what a good sport Jon Lovitz was for being "memorialized," twice.

    I sort of felt like they took too much time stroking the egos of the former hosts, and killed too much time with some terrible musical performances (except for Miley, who at least can sing), when they could have devoted chunks of time to each decade.

    And the "red carpet" was also time that could have been spent better, but I guess NBC needed to toot its horn a bit in the wake of the Brian Williams fiasco (although one of the most awkward moments was Jim Carrey on the red carpet asking Matt Lauer and Savannah Guthrie, "so, where's Brian Williams?"  I thought Tina Fey looked like she wanted to be somewhere else RIGHT NOW).


    Looks like snowed in is a sure bet (none / 0) (#22)
    by CaptHowdy on Sun Feb 15, 2015 at 08:31:53 PM EST
    its just starting now supposed to go right through tomorrow afternoon.  As much as a foot.  I don't expect much sympathy from those in the north east.  In fact when it's done with us it's supposed to head north east.

    I'm all stocked and sitting by the fire and my nephew made it to the pot dealer.  Let it snow.


    I Have 12 Monkeys on the DVR (none / 0) (#46)
    by ScottW714 on Tue Feb 17, 2015 at 09:38:01 AM EST
    I loved the movie, so I was hoping for something close.  I record so few shows that I completely forgot about it, maybe tonight I will give it a go.

    Tortured romance at the Metropolitan (none / 0) (#11)
    by oculus on Sat Feb 14, 2015 at 04:40:56 PM EST
    Opera HD broadcast today:  Iolanta (father isolates his blind daughter; threatens to kill anyone who disobeys his order noone shall tell her she is blind; happy ending) and Bluebeard's Castle.

    Grey Gardens (none / 0) (#12)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Feb 14, 2015 at 06:10:32 PM EST
    Before I stumbled upon that film on TCM, (none / 0) (#37)
    by Mr Natural on Mon Feb 16, 2015 at 08:28:07 PM EST
    I'd read about the Jackie O. relative who'd gone cat lady, but I'd pictured the Cat Lady living in a Newport mansion, the eighty plus cats whizzing on marble staircases and rosewood inlays.  I was surprised, and also perversely delighted, by the depth of their descent into squalor, both real and psychic.

    For Valentine's Day (none / 0) (#13)
    by Zorba on Sat Feb 14, 2015 at 06:29:54 PM EST
    Same song... (none / 0) (#14)
    by desertswine on Sat Feb 14, 2015 at 08:06:31 PM EST
    The classic Miles Davis.

    It is a sad, yet eye-opening day here in Portland (none / 0) (#15)
    by ZtoA on Sat Feb 14, 2015 at 10:44:28 PM EST
    Kitzhaber has resigned and is now under federal investigation.

    Blueoregon.com has not been covering this until just two days ago (!!). I have not read The Oregonian for years and years, since they tried to take me out (career-wise) and the son of a friend of mine (he was sent to jail) just to name two instances but there were many more. Both very unfairly and rather unethically. So I jumped to the conclusion that the O was just being its usual conservative nasty selves.

    Turns out I might have had a more open mind. Apparently democratic staff and insiders have been jumping ship for several years now. Rather quietly - at least to non insiders.

    From my current understanding (and that is evolving) is that Kitzhaber had two major problems, Cover Oregon (Oregon's ACA implementation) and Cylvia Hayes. I did not follow the ins and outs of the state's working relationship with Oracle - was overwhelmed with other stuff - but my gossip lines regarding Oracle people, tell me that much of the problem was with the state's communication with Oracle. Do I trust my gossip lines (people who know Oracle but who are not being quoted in the media) or the media (who have their own agendas)?  Frankly, I don't know who or what to trust these days.

    In any case Cover Oregon was/is a disaster.

    Cylvia Hayes has gone from (at least in my pov) an attractive, smart, well intentioned progressive force to a less than honest, power hungry, rather paranoid force. Whether it was she or Kitz himself (I've read both) ordered emails destroyed, that was the move that broke many straw's backs.

    Remember (Slado) that the real forces for Kitzhaber's resignation were his fellow democrats in Oregon. Looks like the Oregonian and the WW started to attack Hayes when it looked like the horrid evangelical super-religious republican candidate could not win even with the money he could raise -- even against a governor who had screwed up very badly on Cover Oregon.  Any democrat would have been better than him for the majority of the people in this state.

    Remember Oregon has a large agriculture industry, and natural resources industries, and a strong rural presence, but it is the urban areas that have the populations.... and Intel, and Nike, Mentor Graphics, Adidas, etc. Green start ups - and actually many R&D and start ups are happening here. Remember, Slado, this kind of entrepreneurship is the heart of the 'american spirit' - so, yes, there are false starts, but over all, it is the life force of growth.

    I do think that our new governor, as of next Wednesday, Kate Brown, will be a formidable leader.

    Good post (none / 0) (#66)
    by Slado on Wed Feb 18, 2015 at 08:27:58 AM EST
    Thanks for the info.   Hard to get a feel for what's really going on when you don't live somewhere and it's as complicated as this story is.   Always easier just to accept the storyline that emerges in the media.    

    And then there is 'the media' (none / 0) (#71)
    by ZtoA on Thu Feb 19, 2015 at 11:09:46 PM EST
    and 'the media'. In Oregon there was a very distinct difference between actual reporting of facts and the editorial board of The Oregonian (Portland) - 6 conservative people. The editorial pages of The Oregonian targeted this democratic gov and really worked to take him out with many very specious statements. The Salem (the capitol) newspaper seriously outed some of The O's editorial 'facts'. The reporter's facts are not in question and that is the main reason Kitz resigned.

    Subtext is big energy interests vs new renewable energy and environmental interests - and all the $$$ that goes with those interests. Most in OR are wanting some balances. Extremes are being opposed by other extremes. Most here want both big and new energy.


    Today is the 25th anniversary (none / 0) (#20)
    by desertswine on Sun Feb 15, 2015 at 08:08:47 PM EST
    of the iconic photograph taken of the earth by Voyager I at over 6 billion kilometers away that inspired Carl Sagan's "Pale Blue Dot."

    My favorite blue dot pic (none / 0) (#21)
    by CaptHowdy on Sun Feb 15, 2015 at 08:26:33 PM EST
    That Used to be My Desktop Background (5.00 / 1) (#48)
    by ScottW714 on Tue Feb 17, 2015 at 09:46:48 AM EST
    While I was in Yellowstone last year, my brother had brought his spotting scope for wildlife.  We were using it to look at stars one night and this lady cam up with the phone app, Google something or another.  It maps the stars and planets.

    Anyways, we got honed in on Saturn.  OMFG, to see Saturn and its rings so clearly was a highlight for me last year.  I love space and have seen all kinds of images, but to see it, and then to have to move the scope because it was essentially setting was remarkable.


    That's a fabulous image. (none / 0) (#24)
    by desertswine on Sun Feb 15, 2015 at 11:54:42 PM EST
    OSCAR predictions a week out? (none / 0) (#32)
    by CaptHowdy on Mon Feb 16, 2015 at 07:14:02 PM EST
    i like that Birdman has the buzz but I really hope The Imitation Game gets some love.
    It looks like most people agree that Dawn of the Planet of the Apes should get the EFX award.

    I haven't seen it. (none / 0) (#36)
    by Mr Natural on Mon Feb 16, 2015 at 08:12:00 PM EST
    Hard to forget the original Planet of the Apes and the Ape's completely immobile lips.

    The apes are (none / 0) (#38)
    by CaptHowdy on Mon Feb 16, 2015 at 09:18:26 PM EST
    amazing.  Not just believably real but unique enough that you never confuse two of them without the help of costumes to distinguish one from another.  It really is an impressive achievement.  
    Also a very good film.

    I Rented it This Weekend... (none / 0) (#49)
    by ScottW714 on Tue Feb 17, 2015 at 09:49:11 AM EST
    ...it was insane, not only did they get the movements right, they emotion they were able to convey was almost better than human.

    Story (5.00 / 1) (#62)
    by CaptHowdy on Tue Feb 17, 2015 at 05:58:53 PM EST
    I recently got it from Netflix.  I viewed and returned it.   Then I found the DVD.  Which raises the very interesting question, what, exactly, did I return to Netflix.
    Honestly the mind boggles at the possibilities.  Still trying to decide how to handle it.  

    I was thinking about the bit (none / 0) (#63)
    by CaptHowdy on Tue Feb 17, 2015 at 08:52:22 PM EST
    where scar face plays the goofy chimp for the guards.  When he walks away toward the camera his expression changes as subtly as any actor.  Because it was.   I assume that was Andy Serkis.  He is the facial performance capture go to guy.  
    That's the scene I would show at the oscars.

    Awsum (none / 0) (#34)
    by CaptHowdy on Mon Feb 16, 2015 at 07:21:12 PM EST
    The NBC News-Marist (Iowa) poll released Sunday found Huckabee with 17 percent support among those surveyed followed by former Florida Gov. Jeb Bush with 16 percent support and Wisconsin Gov. Scott Walker with 15 percent support. Another 14 percent said they were undecided and the remaining eight names the poll listed each failed to get double digit support. New Jersey Gov. Chris Christie got 9 percent support while Sen. Rand Paul (R-KY) got 7 percent and Sen. Marco Rubio (R-FL) got 6 percent, tied with Dr. Ben Carson.

    Now THAT is how you do a clown car. (5.00 / 1) (#39)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Tue Feb 17, 2015 at 02:30:34 AM EST
    Lybia (none / 0) (#41)
    by Slado on Tue Feb 17, 2015 at 06:44:57 AM EST
    Not only did our use of "smart" air power leave a country in shambles now ISIS is moving in.


    Let that be a lesson to both sides of the ISIS debate.  It's not how you start, it's how you finish and once again when we go in with our military we destroy the society we found at the start then we leave and create a power vacuum where only bad things seem to happen.  In the case of Iraq and now Lybia we get more ISIS.

    ... was provided by the Europeans, particularly the French and Italians, and not by the United States. It was the French air force which caught Moammar Khadafy's column out in the open as he attempted to flee the city of Sirte, which led to his capture and killing by rebel forces. American participation was mostly the provision of logistical support, with the exception of our initial air strikes as part of the effort to curb Khadafy's impending assault on Benghazi.

    Historically, the aftermaths of revolutions have generally tended to be chaotic and messy, and it's not at all uncommon for civil wars to break out in the wake of a governing establishment's downfall. (See Ireland, 1919-22).

    You might consider that our own American Revolution was no exception. An estimated one-third of the population had openly supported the British Crown during the war for independence, and were subjected to vicious reprisals by the eventual winners. The bad blood became such that many of these "Tories" subsequently emigrated / fled to Canada in the wake of the 1783 Treaty of Paris which formally ended the war and established U.S. independence from Britain, rather than remain as part of the new nation.

    In many respects, the American Revolution was also characterized by civil war, as much as by hostilities with British and Hessian forces. From Gen. Washington's decisive victory over Lord Cornwallis's army at Yorktown in 1781, to the ratification of the Constitution in 1789, which formally established our present form of government, it actually took our country about eight years to finally get its act together. Those eight years were marked by very serious internal strife, and the domestic discord was never really fully settled until the U.S. Civil War seventy-five years later. Even then ...



    I Disagree... (none / 0) (#60)
    by ScottW714 on Tue Feb 17, 2015 at 02:06:47 PM EST
    ...with this, strongly:
    It's not how you start, it's how you finish and once again when we go in with our military we destroy the society we found at the start then we leave and create a power vacuum where only bad things seem to happen.

    It is all about how you start, and more importantly if you start, that formulates and paves the outcome.  Libya is not a good example in that we hardly did anything and have done little since.  There was no real commitment beyond providing air cover for the rebels.

    Iraq is a good example, where there was no clear directive/plan for anything beyond ousting Saddam.  It's still not finished, we left, but the war never really ended.  And now it's a complete mess.

    Whereas when Bush I went in, with a clear directive, and a good plan, we were done in 6 months, and out in a year.  The start is when all the variables and coalitions are worked through to ensure your have an expected ending.  

    Everything Bush II planned for failed, it was a child's view of war and being 'greeted as liberators' and 'ending in 5 months tops' or 'that the war would finance itself', and the other child like views that admin had of Iraq, including that they were behind 9/11, ensured the ending would not be a good one.  I doubt many understood, or even heard of kurds, sunnis, or shiites.

    Their 'start' ensured we would never 'win', which was also not defined in any reasonable way.  What was the goal, to this day I don't know beyond getting ride of Saddam, who at this point would be a welcome sight in the region, which is pretty damn sad.

    So the start matters in that it, more or less, lays the groundwork for the finish.


    I f*cking love how so many (5.00 / 2) (#61)
    by jondee on Tue Feb 17, 2015 at 02:23:05 PM EST
    monday morning armchair generals on the Right and Center-Right (Democrats) seem to be so certain exactly which "rebels" the U.S and it's allies should've supported, "rather than being waffling and indecisive" yadda yadda..

    It was precisely the problem at the time that in the legendary Fog of War NO ONE seemed to know with any degree of certainty whether the cure might be worse than the disease in Syria and Libya -- but only a seeming few were honest enough to admit it.  


    Agreed (none / 0) (#67)
    by Slado on Wed Feb 18, 2015 at 08:42:22 AM EST
    so Libya just sort of happened and we had nothing to do with it?

    I am on record as stating that our handling of Iraq and Afganistan were terrible mistakes and are a direct cause of the mess we see today in the Middle East.

    Lybia one could argue was doubling down on stupid and with zero plan to win the peace has descended into chaos.

    If Donald wants to hand out percentage of blame and Scott wants to refer back to Iraq I fail to see how any of that erases the reality that this administration pushed to overthrow a government and then later...

    Took credit for it

    ...before it all went south.  

    Why did it go south?  Because just like in Iraq when you create a power vacuum good guys aren't usually the ones who take over.

    I use Lybia as another example of the reality that no matter what choice we make in confronting ISIS e better plan ahead of time what happens next.


    Unlike Iraq, we didn't ... (none / 0) (#68)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Wed Feb 18, 2015 at 11:03:46 AM EST
    ... "create" anything in Libya. NATO responded in support of an ongoing rebellion against the Khadafy regime, and made a collective decision to intervene at Benghazi to prevent a likely massacre by government forces of the local population in that rebel-held city.

    I mentioned the Europeans' predominance in the assault on Libya and overthrow of Moammar Khadafy because you made it sound as though this was somehow a unilateral decision on the part of the United States and the Obama administration, with our allies acting more as our puppets than as independent partners, when it was really anything but that.

    For its part, France has a very active history of military intervention on the African continent -- including against Khadafy's Libya, defending Chad against his aggression back in the 1980s and '90s -- which long predates our own involvement in the region. Most recently, the French intervened in Mali to prevent a takeover of that country by Muslim extremists. Their national interests do not necessarily mirror our own.

    If President Obama has done anything positive in world affairs, it's been the walk-back of the silly and unsustainable right-wing notion of a predominate American exceptionalism in world affairs, which was very much the hallmark of his immediate predecessor, who did a lot of damage to our country's standing across the globe with his grievously misguided foreign policy.



    My Iraq I Reference... (none / 0) (#69)
    by ScottW714 on Wed Feb 18, 2015 at 12:55:46 PM EST
    ...was used as an example of a well planned and executed 'war', did you want me to go back to WWII, because there isn't too many to choose from.

    Not sure why you keep insisting that we did more than ensure rebels, who would have taken the country at some point, were not massacred.  We didn't start it, if you are looking for someone to blame, find a Libyan Rebel blog.

    One wonders if you even read the links you post:

    During that speech, Mr. Obama said that America had the responsibility to stop what he characterized as a looming genocide in the Libyan city of Benghazi (Principle 1). But at the same time, he said, when the safety of Americans is not directly threatened but where action can be justified -- in the case of genocide, say -- the United States will act only on the condition that it is not acting alone (Principle 2).

    And so, with Libya, the United States used its might -- providing crucial cruise missiles, aircraft, bombs, intelligence and even military personnel -- but it did so as part of the larger NATO coalition, led by the French and the British and including Arab nations.

    Good gravy, you post a link that in no way backs your argument or most of your 'facts'.  You are clearly pushing an agenda that you can't even back.  Libya would have fallen at some point either with us or without us.  We may have sped up the process and saved lives, but who knows, what is known is that many nations were not going to let Gaddafi's Air Force annihilate the rebels.  And w/o air support, Gaddafi did not have a chance.


    New Presidential election polling in New Jersey (none / 0) (#43)
    by CoralGables on Tue Feb 17, 2015 at 08:34:31 AM EST
    from Rutgers-Eagleton. Chris Christie fares best against Clinton when compared to Jeb Bush or Scott Walker.

    Christie currently loses 58% to 35%. The other two do somewhat worse.

    A federal judge in Texas (none / 0) (#51)
    by jbindc on Tue Feb 17, 2015 at 10:08:41 AM EST
    temporarily blocks Obama's immigration orders.

    A federal judge in Texas last night temporarily blocked the Obama administration's executive actions on immigration. The judge, responding to a suit filed by 26 Republican-run states, did not rule on the legality of immigration orders but said there was sufficient merit to the challenge to warrant a suspension while the case goes forward.

    No law gave the administration the power "to give 4.3 million removable aliens what the Department of Homeland Security itself labels as `legal presence,'" the judge said in a memorandum opinion. "In fact the law mandates that these illegally-present individuals be removed." The Department of Homeland Security "has adopted a new rule that substantially changes both the status and employability of millions."

    The Obama orders would offer a legal reprieve to the undocumented parents of U.S. citizens and permanent residents who have resided in the country for at least five years. This would remove the constant threat of deportation. Many could also receive work permits.

    They would also expand the 2012 Deferred Action for Childhood Arrivals (DACA) program that allows certain young people who arrived in the United States illegally as children to apply for two-year work permits and exemptions from deportation.

    Some 4 million to 5 million undocumented immigrants were said to be potentially eligible to benefit from the executive actions.

    Guess the Hispanic... (none / 0) (#55)
    by ScottW714 on Tue Feb 17, 2015 at 10:33:15 AM EST
    ...vote is not needed in 26 states.

    I thought we were past this, it sure would be nice if the republicans running Congress could actually do something beyond trying to ban ACA for the 56th time.

    It is unfair to say Republicans have achieved nothing in their dozens of attempts since 2010 to repeal Obamacare.

    In Tuesday's repeal effort by House Republicans -- their first of this Congress and their 56th overall -- it became clear that they had succeeded at one thing: They had bored even themselves into a slumber.

    For much of the debate Tuesday afternoon, no more than a dozen seats were occupied on the pro-repeal side of the House. More than once, the GOP had nobody available to speak.