"Resurgence" : Al Qaeda's New English Magazine

Seven months in the making, al-Qaeda’s as-Sahab Media Foundation has released the premiere edition of its new English magazine, "Resurgence." It has 117 pages and is filled with glossy graphics and articles about jihad and the war against America, all in understandable English. The content is global, but focuses a lot on the newest branch of al Qaeda in Pakistan, India, and Bangladesh.

The magazine visually resembles AQAP's Inspire. Content wise, it's different, in that there are no instructions for bomb making or lone wolf attacks. And unlike ISIS publications, there are very few Arabic words and it's not heavy on religious dogma. The magazine is available for download here, but it takes a really long time. For those who don't have the time or patience, I'll summarize what I think are the most interesting parts. [More...]

In one article, it sums up why al Qaeda targets America in 5 bullet points (adapted from Osama bin Laden's "methodology"):

  • America considers Islam to be its primary enemy and a threat to the very foundations of its existence. It has waged an incessant war against Islam and Muslims that has become increasingly overt over the last two decades. America considers it to be its foremost duty to crush every Islamic movement struggling for the ascendancy of Islam.
  • America is the patron-in-chief of Israel and the real cause of the existence of this oppressive and corrupt Zionist entity. America is equally responsible for every single act of oppression carried out against our brethren in Gaza and the rest of Palestine.
  • America is responsible for the shedding of Muslim blood in Syria, Iraq, Yemen, Mali, Burma, Bangladesh, Afghanistan, Pakistan, India, and the rest of the Islamic world.
  • America also bears responsibility for the tyranny, oppression and poverty from which the Muslim masses of the region are suffering. In this age of neo-colonialism, America has established colonies in the Muslim world through proxy rulers and apostate armies. Using these puppet rulers, America plunders the wealth and resources of the Muslim Ummah; while the vast majority of Muslims live in abject poverty.
  • In an attempt to subvert the religion of the Muslim masses, America defends and supports individuals, movements, and organizations which spread secularism and apostasy in the Islamic world.

There's a message for America and its allies from Taliban leader Mullah Omar (Mullah Muhammad Umar Mujahid of the Islamic Emirates):

We would like to convey this message to America and the European countries that have forces deployed in Afghanistan or want to establish permanent military bases so as to safeguard their political clout in this country that you should leave the Afghans alone so that they may form a free and independent Islamic government in accordance with their religious and national aspirations. The fact that you seek to deprive them of this right is an act of injustice and a violation of the values of humanity.

Rest assured that the result of this crime will be no different from what you have experienced at our hands during the last thirteen years of your occupation. Perhaps you would have realized by now that the Afghan nation has a rich history of Jihad and heroism in defense of its religion and freedom. This nation does not accept humiliation or the imposition of puppet governments.

We believe that the war in Afghanistan will not end until all occupation forces have departed from the country and a purely free Islamic government is established in Afghanistan. The presence of even a limited number of occupation forces, whatever the pretext may be, will necessitate the continuation of the war. Any attempt to prolong the occupation is something that will not be tolerated under any circumstances.

In a section on unifying jihad's various "ranks," the author writes:

The establishment of this organization comes in the wake of the American defeat and withdrawal from Afghanistan. America had invaded Afghanistan on the pretext of eliminating Al Qa’eda, but the enemies of Allah should know that Al Qa’eda is as much a message as it is an organization, and today its message has spread much farther than they could have ever imagined. This Jihad will not end with the American withdrawal from Afghanistan; America’s defeat is only the prelude. What lies in wait for her despicable ‘allies’ (read toadies) in this region is yet to unfold.

Shorter version: You can't defeat an idea, especially one that continues to spread around the globe.

This group still thinks Osama bin Laden is the greatest. There are several articles about him, including one that portrays him as a devoted father to his sons.

Anyone who had the chance to sit with him could not fail to appreciate his noble manners, graceful demeanour and high character.

At least the writer agrees that it was Khalid bin Laden, not Hamza bin Laden who died with Osama. Hamza, who was reportedly being groomed to be Osama's successor, wasn't at the raid, but in Pakistan. Osama was hoping he would get to Qatar or Saudi Arabia. Here's the letter Osama wrote a month before the raid about Hamza. Where is Hamza now? It doesn't say.

The magazine also lays out the group's objectives:

  • Engaging in Jihad against America and the system of disbelief that has been established under its aegis.
  • Striving for the implementation of the Shariah in Muslim lands and a complete revival of the Islamic way of life.
  • Striving for the freedom of all occupied Muslim lands and liberating the oppressed Muslims of the Subcontinent from Kashmir to Arakan.
  • Performing Jihad for the establishment of the Caliphate according to the Prophetic methodology.
  • Defending the Islamic Emirate of Afghanistan: a harbinger of the Caliphate and a stepping stone towards its revival in the Ummah.
  • Forming a just Islamic society in which there
    is no oppression against anyone, including the disbelievers.

It does not say that al Baghdadi is the Caliph it is waiting for.

The cover article is written by Adam Yahiye Gadahn, who is often referred to as al Qaeda's American spokesman, and is mostly an attack on capitalism.

It is time for us to fight fire with fire, and impose our own blockade and embargo on the Jews and Crusaders, by hitting them where it hurts and striking the heart and lifeblood of their economy, represented by international trade and finance.

The group plans to attack the U.S. Navy and ships in the Pakistan region. It devotes five pages to how the U.S. military is structured in the Middle East, listing all the command posts, and explains where it is weak and susceptible to attack. (Pages 99 to 103.)

There's an interesting article about crime and police by a tribal leader in Pakistan, with what I take as a jab at ISIS strategy. ISIS, as we know, insists on creating armed police forces who roam the streets looking for violators of Shariah law and criminals. He writes:

I can most emphatically claim that the tribal areas in general and Waziristan in particular have the lowest crime rates in Pakistan. Why? Because you don’t have the Punjab Police here. There is no crime because there is no police station in the tribal belt. You bring in a police station in a peaceful place, and you’ll soon see crime institutionalized. The police thrives where crime thrives....

...Another reason why you don’t have crime here is that it’s an armed society. In fact, before it is armed, it is a “society”. It is a world apart from our cities where all social ties have been bisected by the false gods of money and materialism. Our cities are places occupied by zombies who construct their own artificial reality around them to protect themselves from the real world. It’s an artificial world where you can’t tell a man from a walking ATM.

And to make matters worse, arms are the monopoly of two types of criminals: one in uniform that goes around in those Blue Civics (if he is a bigger criminal, then an olive green Hilux) and the other your petty thieves and robbers, who most of the time don’t even have bullets in their magazines and will load their guns twice, if not thrice, to scare their innocent (read ignorant) victims!

He says the tribes in Pakistan support jihad.

Everywhere it is the tribes and tribal society that have defended Islam against a global onslaught and have sheltered the Mujahideen.

(Of course, a few days ago, some tribal leaders and Taliban in Pakistan threw their support to ISIS. But there are also some denials as to which groups have pledged allegiance here. )

Another interesting article is a reprint of one written by a military commander for al Qaida, Abu Obaida al Maqdisi who it says was killed last summer. He warns against "overstretching" guerrilla warfare. Perhaps I'm reading into it, but I think he takes a few stabs at ISIS.

New jihadi groups that strive to gain empowerment on earth and establish the rule of Allah in the land, instead of merely inflicting losses on the enemy at the tactical level, should avoid beginning special operations against the enemy until they have guaranteed the basic conditions of their own survival.

Carrying out special operations is tantamount to entering into an all out war with the enemy in which the weaker side (usually the Mujahideen) tends to be unprepared for the reaction of the enemy. The enemy will escalate the conflict in reaction to these operations. A sudden escalation of the conflict may, in the end, result in the encirclement of the guerilla force, tightening the noose on it, and turning away supporters who are as important for the guerillas as water is for fish. Just as fish cannot survive outside water, guerilla fighters cannot survive if they are cut off from their supporters.

Thus the Mujahideen should avoid taking this step until they possess the ability to carry on the work even after they have carried out such operations...

...A guerilla force may possess the capacity of inflicting huge blows on the enemy, but it may be better for it to restrain from doing so in situations when the reaction of the enemy may be overwhelming. The environment for conducting spectacular special operations is never conducive until the guerilla force has attained sufficient strength and has become invulnerable to the power of the enemy. It is only after reaching this level of strength that it is possible to direct decisive blows against the enemy.

The basic principle, therefore, is to take into account the reaction of the enemy before every step in the escalation of the conflict so that decisions appropriate only for the final stages of the war may not be made prematurely.

He makes an exception for attacks on Saudi Arabia:

It is necessary for the Mujahideen to target this state so that it remains entangled in its own security problems and is unable to interfere in other fronts such as Afghanistan, Yemen, Iraq, (and now Syria) for the Mujahideen have never faced a calamity except that the Saudi royal family had a hand in it.

He also cautions against "media overstretch."

The media is like a windpipe through which the guerilla fighters breathe, and the same is true for their enemy. Guerilla war in its essence is based on gaining legitimacy for the struggle and winning people’s hearts and minds.

...Hence, it is important that the guerilla forces and their leadership address the people according to their level of understanding. They must step up the ante in their media statements in a very gradual manner, considering what is suitable in the situation at hand and taking into account the mental level of the ordinary people. They must reassure the people that their lives and livelihood will be protected. They should avoid meddling in the worldly concerns of ordinary people. The guerilla forces must use assuring words to win the heart of the people, especially the leaders, elders, and decision makers within them. They must address the people in a calculated manner, balancing potential benefit against potential harm.

In what I assume is yet another stab at ISIS, he continues:

Adopting a menacing tone in the media is an example of futile expansion in media activities, especially when the guerilla fighters are still at an early stage in their war. This is even more so the case when they lack the ability to fulfill their promises or follow up their threats with action. As a result, people lose confidence in the guerilla fighters, and thus we fail to neutralize in our war those who could be neutralized, even if temporarily.

It is foolish to challenge everyone to fight the Mujahideen. The life of the Prophet (peace be upon him) teaches us how to neutralize the enemy without necessarily engaging in a fight with him. Threatening words that are not followed by threatening action are damaging because they expose the weakness of the guerillas and their lack of ability to act on their promises. This further bolsters the opponent and creates new enemies for the guerilla fighter which he did not need in the first place.

The tone in the media must be in sync with and proportionate to the actual abilities of the organization, especially when it comes to issuing menacing threats and promising special operations. The guerilla must be like the calm that precedes a storm; his footprints seen, but only at an appropriate time and place, and according to an appropriate plan. Arrogance and false hopes have no place in the heart of someone who wishes to give victory to this religion.

He next warns of overstretching organizational capacity, and over-recruiting:

Among the examples of overstretch that is fatal in guerilla war is overexpansion of organizational activities. This occurs when organizational activities are expanded in disregard of the real capacity of the organization to absorb the effects of an expansion. This includes accepting new recruits into the organizations, and the difficulties in administration, training, capacity building, and provision of arms and security that follow.

The danger in this is that it may lead the organization in a downwards spiral:

This in turn creates hurdles in the movement’s progress. The organization begins a backward slide, differences surface, and fissures appear in the group due to a lack of uniformity within its members and an inability to respond to their needs. This makes the members of the group a burden on it. If this process is accompanied by dwindling or even static financial resources, and lack of an administrative cadre capable of imparting training, the crisis deepens. The situation becomes even more acute when there is a communication gap between the leadership and the cadre.

His conclusion:

The leadership of the Jihad must not be deceived by its capabilities or the number of supporters and allies. This factor, in guerilla wars, is often impermanent. People tend to follow the strong and experience is the best guide. People may become believers during the day and disbelievers and sinners at night. This is more so the case in these turbulent times in which the Jihadi movement is surrounded by conspiracies and intrigues. We ask Allah to ruin the plots of the enemy, make them fall in the traps of their own making, and turn the tide of events against them, for verily He is capable of this.

Finally, the magazine is also a recruitment effort, and calls on Muslims to volunteer.

So don’t delay, and play your part in the Jihad today, whether your part be military, financial, economic, educational, motivational or otherwise. Be patient and resolute, and instill patience and resolve in your brothers, because this war is still in its infancy.

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  • Display: Sort:
    Wow! Really? (5.00 / 2) (#1)
    by NYShooter on Sun Oct 19, 2014 at 04:39:33 PM EST
    *Forming a just Islamic society in which there
     is no oppression against anyone, including the disbelievers

    "Anyone," including women, gays?

    Pretty impressive.

    Haven't they heard? (5.00 / 1) (#2)
    by CaptHowdy on Sun Oct 19, 2014 at 04:41:23 PM EST
    print is dead.

    Depends entirely on how (5.00 / 2) (#8)
    by Peter G on Sun Oct 19, 2014 at 07:19:46 PM EST
    you define "oppression."

    everyone will have an equal chance (none / 0) (#15)
    by jondee on Mon Oct 20, 2014 at 06:11:02 PM EST
    regardless of their station in life, to convert or die.

    There are no gay people in the Middle East (none / 0) (#16)
    by Jack203 on Mon Oct 20, 2014 at 06:46:35 PM EST
    If you think otherwise, someone told you lies.

    That's snark, (none / 0) (#17)
    by CaptHowdy on Mon Oct 20, 2014 at 06:58:41 PM EST

    of course it's snark (none / 0) (#33)
    by Jack203 on Tue Oct 21, 2014 at 08:52:48 PM EST
    play on Ahmadinejad's own words.

    Only in the Middle East....


    On the off chance it is not snark (none / 0) (#18)
    by CaptHowdy on Mon Oct 20, 2014 at 07:08:22 PM EST
    i linking to an ARTICLE

    and a VIDEO

    That recently popped up on my FBook newsfeed-

    Activists and health providers from Lebanon will launch a new network for the Middle East and North African region at the International AIDS Conference in Melbourne, Australia. For more information go to unaids.org.

    Just join up, and step back into the 9th century.. (5.00 / 1) (#5)
    by fishcamp on Sun Oct 19, 2014 at 05:30:49 PM EST

    It's (3.50 / 2) (#9)
    by lentinel on Mon Oct 20, 2014 at 06:08:56 AM EST
    too easy to dismiss all of this.

    Consider the history of the region.

    In recent history, they experienced the installation of brutal dictators by the United States. They experienced the invasion of their countries by the United States. They experienced being killed by other countries who were armed by the United States. And ongoing is the unrelenting bombing and droning campaign by the United States.

    Think how we would feel if the reverse were true.


    They might know how make slick media but ... (5.00 / 1) (#12)
    by RickyJim on Mon Oct 20, 2014 at 12:06:30 PM EST
    they don't have much support in the Muslim world.  Look at this map.

    Interesting (none / 0) (#3)
    by CaptHowdy on Sun Oct 19, 2014 at 04:52:31 PM EST
    i would think this would generate more news.  This search-

    resurgence jihad 10/19/14

    Produced exactly one related hit.  This site.
    Seems odd.

    This is one of the (5.00 / 1) (#10)
    by lentinel on Mon Oct 20, 2014 at 06:11:01 AM EST
    reasons that this site is so important and unique: Jeralyn's incredible investigative journalism - of which we are the beneficiaries.

    That was really my point (5.00 / 1) (#11)
    by CaptHowdy on Mon Oct 20, 2014 at 08:38:16 AM EST
    which I probably did not make as well as I could have.   Which often happens.

    Ok (none / 0) (#4)
    by CaptHowdy on Sun Oct 19, 2014 at 04:59:15 PM EST
    searching with the title to this post produced a selection of links.  But only three from today.  

    Googling this stuff up (none / 0) (#6)
    by Militarytracy on Sun Oct 19, 2014 at 06:00:53 PM EST
    Will place you on a watch list a whole lot faster than searching for sniper suits on Amazon will Captain.

    I was at a meeting with (5.00 / 1) (#23)
    by Jeralyn on Mon Oct 20, 2014 at 09:02:30 PM EST
    a prosecutor and some HSI agents  a few weeks ago and told them I am on ISIS sites for hours a day, so if my IP address comes up on their screens, they should know I'm just blogging about them. I also told them I save almost every ISIS video and photo I come across, so if they need any, to feel free to call. They weren't particularly interested.

    I've been more concerned about clicking on a link and getting a virus in my computer than getting tagged by Homeland Security. So far though, the official ISIS sites are remarkably virus free.


    I find nothing reassuring in that Jeralyn (none / 0) (#25)
    by Militarytracy on Mon Oct 20, 2014 at 09:47:27 PM EST
    They can watch if they want (none / 0) (#7)
    by CaptHowdy on Sun Oct 19, 2014 at 06:05:11 PM EST
    honestly the only possible thing more boring than my life would be watching my life.  

    Why is the US responsible (none / 0) (#13)
    by oculus on Mon Oct 20, 2014 at 03:35:22 PM EST
    for the "shedding of Muslim blood" in Burma, Bangaladesh, and India?

    Good question! (5.00 / 1) (#21)
    by Politalkix on Mon Oct 20, 2014 at 07:57:42 PM EST
    Is lentinel also going to blame Muslims for shedding the blood of Zorashtrians in Persia, Hindus and Buddhists in India and Bangladesh and Christians in Armenia and trying to wipe out entire civilizations from history in their quest to impose imperial Caliphates (that some want to revive by shedding more blood) in the same way he blames the United States and Britain for everything that is going wrong in the world?

    Why is he silent about Muslims killing Muslims for the last 1400 years (many times more than we or the British have done).

    Is it because
    (1)He has very low expectations from Muslims (which by itself is very racist)
    (2) He is a hypocrite
    (3) He is feeling woozy after inhaling noxious fumes that he emits whenever he speaks.

    Enquiring minds would like to know.

    The BHO administration did its best not to interfere in the internal affairs of countries with large Muslim populations like Egypt, Syria, etc. That did not stop Muslims slaughtering Muslims in those countries and creating an even bigger mess. You can blame America and Britain as much as you like and attempt all sorts of distractions and dishonest rationalizations but that is not going to hide some basic truths regarding why the ME is such a mess.


    Well, (none / 0) (#14)
    by lentinel on Mon Oct 20, 2014 at 05:59:58 PM EST
    how about Iraq, Pakistan, Afghanistan - and Iran - in that we armed Saddam Hussein when he was our boy before he wasn't...

    And then there are our wonderful coalition partners - the British.
    They did a lot for India...
    And the French - they had a nice turn in Algeria...

    And then, from the Muslim perspective, there is also Palestine ---

    I think that would be enough to get their dander up...


    We are not responsible for every evil (none / 0) (#19)
    by Jack203 on Mon Oct 20, 2014 at 07:08:35 PM EST
    Despite your negativity, if a Muslim kills another Muslim, it is not our fault.  Are Muslim's animals that can't be held accountable for what they do?

    If a Sunni Muslim detonates themselves in a crowded Shiite market and kills 50 people...it is NOT our fault.  This has literally happened every day for the last ten years.

    I understand Al Qaeda has a point of view, and I welcome any attempt by them that can be construed as even slightly "moderate" like the magazine.  I feel our objective in the Middle East should be to try to lessen our involvement in every way possible.  We have very little credibility in the region for good reason, and the worst possible way to promote Democracy is to bomb it into people.

    And that is what Obama was doing the last six years since his poor decision to give Afghanistan one more chance at the beginning of his Presidency.

    Since then, I have agreed with pretty much all of his decisions.   Do you think we should have let the Kurds be slaughtered by ISIS?  Perhaps we should have because the last thing any sane person should want is another Middle East war, but I also suspect we would have been even more hated and a laughing stock of the region if we had just left our only ally in the region be overrun.


    Not our fault? (none / 0) (#20)
    by lentinel on Mon Oct 20, 2014 at 07:36:05 PM EST
    It is one issue to talk about what one faction of Muslims may be doing to another faction, but the simple fact is that we have taken sides by arming one of the factions against the other.

    Are you aware that it is we who armed Saddam Hussein?
    Are you aware that he also used those weapons to kill Iranians?

    It is another issue to talk about the United States involvement in killing people - wholesale numbers - in that region. They have taken notice and are fed up. Wouldn't you be?

    Hundreds of thousands of Muslims have been killed by us.
    And we're still doing it. In Pakistan. In Afghanistan. In Iraq.

    "Not our fault"? Are you kidding?


    Are we aware? (5.00 / 2) (#26)
    by NYShooter on Tue Oct 21, 2014 at 12:57:30 AM EST
    how can we not be aware;

    You remind us every day



    Day in,

    and, day out

    over and over and over and over and over again

    If we only left, they could go back to being the godly conscientious objectors they were for all those centuries.


    Hey Shooter... (5.00 / 1) (#27)
    by lentinel on Tue Oct 21, 2014 at 06:21:30 AM EST
    Since this item - our war - and  their calls for retribution against us - calls for lone-wolf actions - have left the front pages in favor of ebola and midterm politics, I don't think it hurts to be reminded what I consider to be an more deadly reality.

    Jeralyn is very diligently providing us with startling information about what is going on - most if not all of it I have seen nowhere else. I cannot help but react to it.

    But - my advice to you is to ignore my posts.

    It is easier on the brain to think of the Muslims as brainless heathens who are against us for no reason whatever except some inborn inclination.

    Being open to recent history, and to be aware of their grievances, well, that complicates things.

    Please ignore my repetitive posts and have a nice day.


    What do you think we should do now? (none / 0) (#38)
    by Jack203 on Tue Oct 21, 2014 at 09:55:41 PM EST
    "It is easier on the brain to think of the Muslims as brainless heathens who are against us for no reason whatever except some inborn inclination."

    Just the opposite.  I think the American people, media and politicians are easily manipulated by the different factions in the Middle East to further their own objectives.  If we ARE trying to manipulate them over their...we're not doing a good job considering everything we've tried to do over there has been an abject failure.

    "Being open to recent history, and to be aware of their grievances, well, that complicates things."

    I understand their grievances, but am not as impressed by them as you.

    The easiest way for reconciliation in my opinion is to

    1. Immediately stop meddling in their internal affairs
    2. Treat them with respect
    3. Be a good faith trading partner

    It's worked with Japan, Germany, China, and Vietnam, and somewhat with Russia.

    I fear our next president will reverse Obama's attempts to lessen our footprint over there.  

    If you've noticed, I've one of the only ones that has openly called for the Sunni's to have their own country in their own lands.  Let them call it whatever they want and let them be ruled by whoever they want.  It shouldn't be any of our concern as long as they stop attacking their neighbors.

    What do you think we should do?


    While I would like to believe you Jack, (none / 0) (#44)
    by fishcamp on Wed Oct 22, 2014 at 11:00:29 AM EST
    the stated goal of the radical muslims is to wipe out everybody on earth who is not Muslim.  That's a difficult one with which to reconcile.

    We cannot undo the invasion of Iraq (none / 0) (#22)
    by Militarytracy on Mon Oct 20, 2014 at 08:49:38 PM EST
    If we could I think the whole country would choose to do so.

    That doesn't divorce Shia or Sunnis or Kurds or anyone in the region from bearing the responsibility and accountability of their choices today.


    Maybe (none / 0) (#28)
    by lentinel on Tue Oct 21, 2014 at 06:30:35 AM EST
    we cannot undo the invasion of Iraq - but we could try to make amends for it - rather than accepting the Bush rationales and diving into this mess yet again.

    I wish I could accept that most people would choose not to have invaded Iraq. But I still see felons (imo) like Cheney strutting around saying we did the right thing - with not much rebuke from the media types he is beguiling.

    Sure, Shia, Sunnis, Kurds and everyone else in the region (Saudi Arabia, Turkey included) are responsible for their actions... or inactions.

    But so are we.

    And we have not accepted an ounce of responsibility for the disaster we have inflicted upon the people who live there.

    As I have said, the only references to Bush by Mr. Obama have been on the order of thanking him for his service.


    Not permitting a genocide to unfold (5.00 / 1) (#30)
    by Militarytracy on Tue Oct 21, 2014 at 02:20:57 PM EST
    Is not accepting the Bush doctrine.  The Bush doctrine seemed to encourage genocides.

    Our existing President has admitted that we destabilized the region, so have many of our political leaders.  The only choices that remain for them are to do the next right thing, and that would be disabling genocide when they can.

    Obama has been very very conservative with his use of any force.  He has allowed ISIL to reach Baghdad.  He has not bailed anyone out.  He has enough in the region to stop a genocide, but has forced the Iraqi leadership and Turkey to have to be eye to eye with ISIL.  He and the coalition have single handedly saved nobody.

    Then the players have to actually deal with each other and reach resolutions.


    Resolutions. (none / 0) (#31)
    by lentinel on Tue Oct 21, 2014 at 03:36:29 PM EST
    Then the players have to actually deal with each other and reach resolutions.

    I think we would help that come to pass if we did not insist on being the major player among them.


    How are we the major player? (none / 0) (#32)
    by Militarytracy on Tue Oct 21, 2014 at 06:48:07 PM EST
    And you prefer genocides while you turn a blind eye?

    Do you (none / 0) (#34)
    by lentinel on Tue Oct 21, 2014 at 09:04:05 PM EST
    deny that we are the "leader" of the "coalition"?

    Turkey isn't.
    Saudi Arabia isn't.
    Neither is the UK, France, Denmark or any of the other "partners" in this undertaking.

    Who else is pouring billions into this?

    I will also say that I do not believe that we are in this because we care about genocide. Not for a moment.

    In my opinion, this is about power and money.

    But I respect your opinion.
    I wish I could agree with it.


    I am not ashamed that we (5.00 / 2) (#35)
    by Militarytracy on Tue Oct 21, 2014 at 09:07:59 PM EST
    Chose to encourage everyone to join the table.  What a ridiculous thing to attempt to spread shame about.  The greater shame would be to do nothing when we do possess the ability to start a dialogue with all regional players and seek resolution instead of more death.

    OK.. (none / 0) (#39)
    by lentinel on Wed Oct 22, 2014 at 07:05:11 AM EST
    If that is your perception of what is going on.

    Although I must say, I haven't seen much dialogue going on.


    At the bottom of (5.00 / 1) (#41)
    by lentinel on Wed Oct 22, 2014 at 07:25:00 AM EST
    what I see as our disagreement is the rationale for this military action on our part.

    You see it as a noble endeavor meant to prevent genocide.

    I see it as a power play by mostly European countries and ourselves to keep a foothold in the region. I also see it as a cave to republican pressure to act tough. I also see it as a boon to certain corporations like the renovated Blackwater.

    There is too little interest in this country in preventing gun violence, police singling out minority kids as target practice, racial profiling, trying to help people who are losing their homes and their jobs - for me to believe that it is engaged in a purely humanitarian exercise.


    And a great deal of the bill (none / 0) (#36)
    by Militarytracy on Tue Oct 21, 2014 at 09:22:51 PM EST
    Is being paid by the regional players too.

    Another failed state encouraging acts of terrorism as we experienced with Afghanistan is also a concern to every member of the coalition, that is why they are invested.


    Why do (none / 0) (#40)
    by lentinel on Wed Oct 22, 2014 at 07:10:29 AM EST
    you think that "regional players" Saudi Arabia and Turkey have shown such a relatively disinterested response?

    Publicly they work to seem disinterested (5.00 / 1) (#42)
    by Militarytracy on Wed Oct 22, 2014 at 08:17:09 AM EST
    Because they fear extremist attacks in their own countries.  It's not rocket science.  Turkey has the largest problem at this time, because their Kurds have threatened to revitalize their now standing down terrorist organization if their government doesn't assist the Kobane Kurds.  While simultaneously Turkish Islamic extremists have been joining ISIL in the fight.  The current existing situation threatens to set Turkey on fire.

    Why are (1.00 / 1) (#43)
    by lentinel on Wed Oct 22, 2014 at 10:49:19 AM EST
    they more frightened than we are?

    We have reason to fear "extremist attacks" in our own country also.
    Yet, we're ploying right ahead.

    If I may play a card that I feel intensely: when our government starts treating veterans and those returning with grave injuries with the same kind of compassion you seem to believe they are expressing toward the victims of extremism in Turkey, I may be open to your suggestion that this is a humanitarian enterprise.

    Until then, it just looks like BushObama business as usual to me.


    Are you serious? (5.00 / 2) (#45)
    by Militarytracy on Wed Oct 22, 2014 at 11:33:04 AM EST
    Of course. (none / 0) (#46)
    by lentinel on Wed Oct 22, 2014 at 04:05:55 PM EST
    Jack please don't call people (none / 0) (#24)
    by Jeralyn on Mon Oct 20, 2014 at 09:05:40 PM EST
    "animals" here. Name-calling isn't allowed. And they aren't the only group committing atrocities. In the middle east or elsewhere.

    I know (none / 0) (#37)
    by Jack203 on Tue Oct 21, 2014 at 09:37:44 PM EST
    My point was that of course they are not animals, and therefore can and should be held accountable.  I thought it was a rhetorical question.

    I recognize our meddling in the Middle East has had a terrible and negative impact.  But that doesn't absolve individuals committing heinous acts.


    Interesting comments on management (none / 0) (#29)
    by Mr Natural on Tue Oct 21, 2014 at 10:52:46 AM EST
    and the institutionalization of police states, although the latter phrase was not specifically used.  I'm wondering if those ideas were those of earlier writers on revolution.

    What's really disturbing is that they're not ranting like disorganized psychopaths.  Disorganization would imply that they would be easier to bring to ground - or justice.