Tuesday Morning Open Thread

It's another Champion's Leage Day, as the semifinals commence with the first leg of a Battle of the Titans: Barcelona vs. Bayern Munich.

The big question: Is Messi healthy? Without him. Barca has looked pedestrian. Bayern has looked tremendous all season (and the rich get richer as Bayern buys their German rival Dortmund's best player, Mario Goetze.)

I took Bayern to qualify (12 units at +140), but I fear Messi.

Tomorrow it's Dortmund vs. Real Madrid.

Open Thread.

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    It has started (5.00 / 4) (#1)
    by MO Blue on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 09:12:17 AM EST
    and not in a good way.

    Bloomberg Calls For Reinterpreting Constitution After Boston Bombing

    New York Mayor Michael Bloomberg has had enough of the Constitution, at least how everyone interprets it today. In response to the Boston Bombing, Mayor Bloomberg believes freedoms will have to be curtailed, to protect freedom.

    In the wake of the Boston Marathon bombings, Mayor Michael Bloomberg said Monday the country's interpretation of the Constitution will "have to change" to allow for greater security to stave off future attacks.

    "The people who are worried about privacy have a legitimate worry," Mr. Bloomberg said during a press conference in Midtown. "But we live in a complex word where you're going to have to have a level of security greater than you did back in the olden days, if you will. And our laws and our interpretation of the Constitution, I think, have to change."

    Too fast MO... (5.00 / 5) (#2)
    by kdog on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 09:20:14 AM EST
    I had the linked copied and ready to paste!

    Easy for Bloombucks to say, when the police state becomes too much to bear or martial law declared, he can jet off to Bermuda on his private plane without so much as a TSA agent removing his penny loafers or squeezing his inner thighs.

    Easy to call for sacrifice of essential liberty when you'll never be subject to a stop n frisk, a law enforcement home invasion, or spy cameras recording your picnic in a public park.  

    I say move to Bermuda full time you f8ckin' coward.


    I anticipated you would link to the Mayor's (none / 0) (#5)
    by oculus on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 09:43:16 AM EST
    latest proposal re cigs.

    Technically... (none / 0) (#10)
    by kdog on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 10:03:20 AM EST
    heir apparent Christine Quinn's proposal, but she is just Bloomy's puppet.

    I've long advocated for some uniformity...18 or 21, lets make up our f*ckin' minds when a person becomes a free adult.  I say 18 for voting, 18 for everything else like drinking and smoking.


    How about 25 for everything... (none / 0) (#34)
    by unitron on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 11:46:59 AM EST
    ...including marriage and joining (or being conscripted into) the military?

    25? (none / 0) (#46)
    by kdog on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 12:02:18 PM EST
    Don't you think we've extended adolescence enough unitron?

    So far, at least, I haven't read (5.00 / 1) (#74)
    by oculus on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 03:35:50 PM EST
    any comments here about the immature mind of the Boston bomber defendant.  Refreshing.

    oy (5.00 / 1) (#102)
    by sj on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 05:48:07 PM EST
    You might want to read the post by (none / 0) (#78)
    by Anne on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 03:45:31 PM EST
    Luke Dittrich that is posted over at Charlie Pierce's place - not because it shows Dzhokhar as "immature," but because it shows him as someone so normal and good that there is shock that he was or could be radicalized.

    I hope, for Dzhokhar's sake, that this isn't a case of him feeling he has to defend his brother by ascribing to himself motives and feelings and intentions he didn't have.

    We know he was there.  There is video of him with the backpack moments before it apparently exploded.  He was involved, but I think it's foolish to think we know more than we do.

    I just had a sick feeling after I read Luke's piece that won't go away.


    And the story (none / 0) (#82)
    by jbindc on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 03:56:39 PM EST
    May take a different turn.

    Who knows where else this story may lead or if any of it is connected?


    Benjamin Franklin (5.00 / 4) (#3)
    by Zorba on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 09:23:23 AM EST
    They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.

    Bloomberg needs to read Franklin, and Jefferson, and others of our Founding Fathers.  No doubt, they are rolling over in their graves.   :-(

    Bloomberg likes to change the rules midstream (5.00 / 4) (#6)
    by shoephone on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 09:54:20 AM EST
    After all, he corruptly muscled his way into a third mayoral term, even though the city's term limits law only allowed two terms...I guess when you're one of the richest men in America you have the right to decide what America means for everyone else? Mobsters come in all different shapes and sizes.

    Oh, absolutely. (none / 0) (#73)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 03:24:35 PM EST
    America has always been a country on the make, full of people who are in a perpetual search of the next big score. It's all a question of scale.

    If I have quizillions of bucks to burn, by all rights I should be able to buy you off and have my way. And if I'm unable to buy you off directly because you have principles to uphold -- well, then it's a good thing that most of your neighbors hold no such moral compulsions, because I'll buy them out and pay off the city council to change the zoning and compel you to bend to my will anyway. And by the way, resistance is futile so you're just making things hard on yourself.

    The difference between me the quizillionaire and your average godfather mobster is that I have bank presidents and high-end politicians stuffed in my back pocket whose sole purpose in life is to kiss my a$$ through the fabric, and I don't need to send guys named Noodles and Gianni Pirelli to go knocking on your door at 11:00 p.m. Those two clowns are trafficking in chump change -- knowhutahmean?

    I'm telling you, is this a great country, or what? Now, let's shut up and sing.


    To my mind, there's been a lot of (5.00 / 4) (#15)
    by Anne on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 10:25:03 AM EST
    "reinterpreting" of the Constitution going on, through back channels and executive orders and outright defiance ("whatever it is we're doing, you can't stop us, and we don't have to tell you about it") for some time now - all Bloomberg's doing is being open about it.  One might even say that he's kind of late to that bandwagon, really, when you think about what's been happening since at least the attacks on 9/11.

    It's easy enough for Bloomberg to say this, given that it's doubtful any "changes" would have the slightest impact on his life, or his way of life.  

    It's a shame, really; the man has made significant philanthropic contributions that have positively affected many, many lives, and given that he has the power to be a force for the kinds of changes that would strengthen our democratic foundation, it is beyond disappointing that he is out in public making statements like this.

    I wonder if expensive shoe leather tastes any better than pleather, because he's really put his foot in his mouth on this one.


    What a phucking moron (5.00 / 2) (#25)
    by Dadler on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 11:13:28 AM EST
    So have all this security you want, and a bomb will STILL go off if someone wants to carry out an attack...you know where it'll happen? Right there at the security checkpoint.

    And you know what being able to figure this out is called? Imagination.

    The absolute lack of it among the "powerful" is really something to behold. You have to have, literally, an inability to understand the obvious -- that humans will always be flesh and blood. Someone will always be able to walk up behind you and jam a knife into your spine if they want to, and lacking eyes in the back of your head...there is nothing you can do.

    Mortality is a bummer like that.

    Halfwits like Bloomberg do not have the brains to comprehend the limits of their own flesh, they are essentially trying to convince us they have the powers of immortality at their fingertips, and that we just have to let them use their powers -- and of course they will only use them for just purposes.

    Those who would sacrifice liberty for freedom deserve neither, one of the most famous quotes in our nation's history. Bloomberg should be made to write if over and over on the chalkboard.


    oop, mis-paraphrase of a lifetime (none / 0) (#88)
    by Dadler on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 04:45:16 PM EST
    How about something like Uncle Ben's real quote:

    Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.

    is this one of them Crump fantasies? (none / 0) (#124)
    by P3P3P3P3 on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 08:26:48 PM EST

    and escalating (5.00 / 2) (#56)
    by MO Blue on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 12:35:00 PM EST
    Former GOP Rep. Joe Walsh: We Need to Begin Profiling 'Young Muslim Men'

    Former Rep. Joe Walsh (R-IL) argued Monday for racial profiling of "young Muslim men" in the wake of the Boston Marathon bombings, including adding profiling to the United States' immigration process.

    "We're at war, and this country got a stark reminder last week again that we're at war," Walsh said to host Martin Bashir during an appearance on MSNBC. "And not only should we take a pause, Martin, when it comes to immigration, we need to begin profiling who our enemy is in this war: young muslim men,"

    "The fact is, Martin, neither you or I or Jonathan knows of the 11 million, and it's more than 11 million, how many are bad characters," Walsh continued, addressing Bashir and fellow guest, columnist Jonathan Alter. "And what we're going to do is replicate what we did in '86, provide amnesty to all of them, which in essence is providing legal status to a lot of bad characters. You know, Martin, there's also a piece of this legislation that bans our law enforcement officials of profiling. We need to profile even when it comes to our immigration policy."

    "These two guys weren't just losers. They were part of radical islam. They were radicalized," Walsh said of the alleged Boston Marathon bombers.

    Maybe we need to start profiling "losers" who refuse to pay child support for their children.


    How would one know if someone's Muslim? (5.00 / 1) (#59)
    by Anne on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 12:47:58 PM EST
    I mean, it's a religion, not an ethnicity or race.

    Maybe they could wear a crescent moon and star patch on their clothing...

    ...Golly, why does that sound strangely familiar?


    It sounds familiar IMO for the (5.00 / 6) (#60)
    by MO Blue on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 01:03:19 PM EST
    same reason the incessant use of "Homeland" sends chills down my spine.

    That's true. (none / 0) (#76)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 03:40:45 PM EST
    I would challenge clods like Joe Walsh to go to the Balkans in southeastern Europe, which has a very substantial Muslim population, and pick out by sight the people who practice Islam.

    You can't, really, especially in cosmopolitan places like Sarajevo and Istanbul. European Turkey, Albania and Kosovo are over 90% Muslim. 40% of Bosnians are Muslim, and upwards of 20% of Russians and Bulgarians are Muslim. They're also mostly all white.

    From my own experience in Europe, the only way I can tell is by introducing myself, because most Muslims -- but by no means all -- have adopted Islamic names. But by looks alone, it ain't gonna happen.


    well Donald I have been (none / 0) (#115)
    by fishcamp on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 07:36:35 PM EST
     all the places you mention and it is very easy to pick out the Muslims because almost all of them are that...especially by your statistics.  Europe is different than the countries you mention.  So I'm not sure what your point is.  :-)

    Okay, I lost you. Let me try again. (none / 0) (#132)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 10:00:38 PM EST
    fishcamp: "Europe is different than the countries you mention."

    Albania, Kosovo, Bosnia, Bulgaria and Turkey are all located in southeastern Europe. My point was that most Muslims in those countries have physical characteristics that are predominantly European -- i.e., white -- whereas there are a lot of people in this country like former Congressman Walsh, who are intentionally equating Islam with the swarthy and darkskinned peoples of southern Asia and Africa.

    I spent 10 days in Bosnia in 1997, accompanying my congressman as part of a visiting delegation in the immediate aftermath of the war there. Of most Muslims I met in that country, I had a hard time telling them apart at initial glance from the Serbs and Croats. That's actually what blew me away about the Bosnian War -- that the combatants were all remarkably similar to one another, save only for their respective religions.

    (I must admit that prior to my trip, I was fairly ignorant regarding the actual extent of Islam in the Balkans. That visit proved a real eye-opener for me.)

    In western European countries like Germany, the Netherlands and France, it's fairly easy to identify those people who aren't originally from there, because the indigenous populations are a lot more homogeneous. In France, the Muslim population is predominantly from Africa and the Middle East, whereas in the Netherlands, a lot of Muslims emigrated from Indonesia. In both those countries, that's a residual effect of their ties to their former colonial empires.

    But that's not the case in the Balkans, which became a battleground between East and West from the fall of Constantinople to the Ottoman Turks in 1453 until the end of the First World War in 1918. Substantial portions of the indigenous populations in southeastern Europe -- particularly in the swath of territory from Istanbul to Albania and Bosnia -- converted to Islam during the nearly 500 years of Ottoman rule.

    Sorry about the confusion. I hope that clarifies what I was trying to say.


    thank you Donald. (none / 0) (#150)
    by fishcamp on Wed Apr 24, 2013 at 11:29:44 AM EST
    France (5.00 / 2) (#62)
    by jbindc on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 01:22:47 PM EST
    Terrific (none / 0) (#68)
    by sj on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 02:56:29 PM EST
    I didn't even know it was on their radar.

    Me neither (5.00 / 1) (#72)
    by jbindc on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 03:14:42 PM EST
    And my guess is, it won't cause the demise of France either.

    Mon dieu! (none / 0) (#129)
    by Peter G on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 09:24:10 PM EST
    Gay marriage?!  What's next?  Could it be this?

    Wow. (none / 0) (#135)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 10:03:37 PM EST
    I didn't know that Ginger Rogers was gay.

    ATTENTION: Elvis has left the building. (5.00 / 1) (#120)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 07:54:49 PM EST
    Thank you. Thank you very much:

    Los Angeles Times | April 23, 2013
    Prosecutors drop charges against ricin suspect, filing confirms - "Officials have dropped charges against the Elvis impersonator accused of mailing ricin-laced letters to President Obama, a U.S. senator and a Mississippi judge, according to a court filing Tuesday. Poisoning suspect Paul Kevin Curtis of Corinth, Miss., was suddenly released on bond Tuesday in the middle of a series of preliminary evidentiary hearings that was put on hold. By afternoon, federal prosecutors had filed to drop the charges against him without prejudice. The filing stated 'the ongoing investigation has revealed new information.'"

    Mr. Curtis' subsequent press conference after his release has to be one of the more entertaining I've seen in a while. At least his brother found Moo Cow.

    Man, oh, man (5.00 / 3) (#138)
    by Peter G on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 10:29:21 PM EST
    If I'm ever falsely accused of trying to kill the President, and have my name plastered all over the national news with hardly a hint of doubt, I would only wish I could be that cool and funny when exonerated a few days later ... after sitting in jail.  Of course, he does go on about being worried about his dog for several minutes before mentioning any concern for his kids ....  I can also relate to being the defense lawyer, whom he offers to pay with a foot massage.

    who claims innocence:
    Numerous law enforcement officers went to Tupelo, Miss., the home of J. Everett Dutschke, 41. Dutschke adamantly claims that he has nothing to do with the letters attributed to Curtis.

    In a phone interview, Dustchke said he feels targeted by Curtis' defense, and that he didn't know why his name was brought into it.

    "I guess Kevin got desperate. I feel like he's getting away with the perfect crime," he said.

    He said he feels like his implication is a defense trick to establish reasonable doubt.

    "I don't know anything about this. Where are the allegations coming from? Who made the allegations? The defense attorney for the accused," he said.

    He said defense attorney Christi McCoy's bringing his name into the case has caused his family a lot of problems.

    "It has made my family incredibly unsafe. It has put a target on us, and it was reckless and irresponsible," he said. "The phone has been ringing off the hook, with calls and hang-ups and all sorts of horrible things."

    Max Baucus is retiring (none / 0) (#4)
    by jbindc on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 09:41:53 AM EST

    Another potential Republican pickup?

    I am sure that he will have a lucrative (none / 0) (#7)
    by MO Blue on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 09:57:42 AM EST
    post Senate career. His constituents will take real good care of him after he helped the them aka as the insurance industry write the Health Insurance Protection and Profit act. Of course he is bailing before the potential "train wreck" he created occurs.

    BTW, this news also kinda squashes the meme that he voted against background checks for gun purchases to protect his Senate seat.


    Baucus may have (5.00 / 1) (#11)
    by KeysDan on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 10:05:07 AM EST
    voted against background checks just to protect his seat.

    Are you guessing that he thought (none / 0) (#52)
    by MO Blue on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 12:15:01 PM EST
    he would run on the 17th. and only decided to retire after the vote on the background check occurred?

    Not sure of his electoral motivation, (none / 0) (#63)
    by KeysDan on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 01:48:11 PM EST
    but more confident of his innate desire to protect that anatomical part that rests on his seat.   Especially, as he moves to his real retirement as a former senator and present lobbyist.

    Unfortunately, there is still time (none / 0) (#67)
    by MO Blue on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 02:35:35 PM EST
    for him to do more damage.

    he's privately negotiating tax reform legislation with his House GOP counterpart, without regard to his party's commitment to increase federal revenue.

    Will Max Baucus Sell Out Dems On Taxes?


    That's a question that falls into (none / 0) (#71)
    by Anne on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 03:09:09 PM EST
    the same category as, "is the Pope Catholic?" and "does a wild bear sh!t in the woods?"

    I think the only real question is, how badly will he sell out?  

    I note that the TPM article claims the WH wants to nip this in the bud, but I don't know that I buy that; it wouldn't surprise me in the least if some of what Baucus is up to is as Obama's (stealth) surrogate.  He did it on health insurance, so why not taxes?

    These people make my head hurt.


    shallow categories Anne... (none / 0) (#118)
    by fishcamp on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 07:42:42 PM EST
    Do you have a point? n/t (none / 0) (#130)
    by Anne on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 09:24:44 PM EST
    Yes I do Anne (none / 0) (#151)
    by fishcamp on Wed Apr 24, 2013 at 11:39:53 AM EST
    but first let me apologize for my hasty and poor choice of words.  The Pope and bear analogies have always seemed over used and childish to me.  I say this because as a child my father overheard me and a couple of friends laughing hilariously about those very two cliches.  He reprimanded me and I guess it stuck with me.  Never would I want you to be mad at me, so once again I'm sorry.

    No apology necessary - I just wasn't (none / 0) (#152)
    by Anne on Wed Apr 24, 2013 at 12:17:58 PM EST
    sure what I was supposed to get out of your comment.

    I agree they are over-used - probably because for most everyone, they are the first ones that come to mind.

    Maybe we need to come up with some replacements that are fresher and more relevant; I'm open to suggestions!


    Who knows? (none / 0) (#9)
    by Ga6thDem on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 10:03:06 AM EST
    If the Tea Party is strong there, they could vote in a whacko to run for the Senate and the seat could stay D. Who would have through that McCaskill would still have her senate seat a year ago?

    Dems probably (none / 0) (#22)
    by Slado on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 11:02:26 AM EST
    have a better chance of keeping this seat now.

    Baucus is the father of Obamacare and that would have been hung around his neck like a boat anchor.

    Now a new candidate can run partially if not against Obamacare and keep the seat blue.


    The truth (5.00 / 2) (#31)
    by Ga6thDem on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 11:37:09 AM EST
    is the lobbyists where the parents of Obamacare. Baucus just was more or less a conduit.

    Fair enough but he (none / 0) (#33)
    by Slado on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 11:43:46 AM EST
    put his name on it and is smartly heading off into the sunset.

    If by sunset you mean a cushy job with a lobbyist.  

    Kind of ironic isn't it.  You write a terribly complicated bill and then you make millions lobbying to change it.

    Only in Washington.


    This is (5.00 / 1) (#51)
    by Ga6thDem on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 12:11:51 PM EST
    an honest question and I have asked many of my conservative friends and when I ask it they either avoid the question or spout some misinformation but why do conservatives not like this bill? I mean it came from a conservative think tank back in the 90's. They all were for all this kind of stuff until Obama was for it and now they're all against it. The only real reason I can come up with is that it's because Obama proposed it and it's just some knee jerk reaction.

    For eons I have heard conservatives whine and whine about how all these people have big screen TVs but don't have insurance. Well, now they are going to have to have insurance or pay a tax. BTW the big screen TV thing really comes out of ignorance of not knowing anything about insurance.  This is the kind of Big Daddy thing conservatives usually love.


    I reject your comparison (none / 0) (#91)
    by Slado on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 05:04:08 PM EST
    I don't buy the line that Obamacare is really a conservative bill.  It's not.  

    The main difference is while conservatives favored exchanges they did not favor all the restrictions and requirements.   But that's another debate.  Simply put, I don't' accept your basic premise.

    Now even if I did allow your point so what?   The idea was an idea floated around in conservative think tanks.   It was never rammed through congress on a partisan vote.

    Democrats did that.   Not a single republican voted for it.    

    Obamacare is owned fully by democrats.   I don't remember all the grumbling at the time.  I don't recall a majority of democrats claiming it was a conservative bill based on conservative ideas.   I didn't see these conservative in the Rose Garden when Obama signed it.

    Having buyers remorse now and trying to claim it's bad because its too conservative is frankly a cop out.

    Own the epic failure.  Admit that Obama screwed up.

    I had to do it for Bush and it's why I'm a libertarian now.


    There was significant grumbling at the time (5.00 / 1) (#98)
    by MO Blue on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 05:20:44 PM EST
    most of which was not reported. People who advocated for good quality health care repeatedly pointed out that this was a 1990s plan created by the Heritage Foundation. Even Obama and Pelosi mentioned that much of the legislation was based on a previous Republican plan.  

    This is not new information nor is it something that people here on this site have just come up with due to buyer's remorse. Many of us didn't buy into the plan at the time due to the fact that it was then and is now a conservative plan.


    Here are some detailed comparisons (5.00 / 1) (#104)
    by MO Blue on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 06:05:42 PM EST
    Obama's plan closely mirrors three proposals that have attracted the support of Republicans who reside within their party's mainstream:

    The first is the 1993 Senate Republican health plan, which is compared with Obama's plan here, with the similarity endorsed by former Republican Senator Dave Durenberger here.

    The second is the Bipartisan Policy Center plan, endorsed by Bob Dole, Howard baker, George Mitchell and Tom Daschle, which is compared to Obama's plan here.

    And the third, of course, is Mitt Romney's Massachusetts plan, which was crafted by the same economist who helped create Obama's plan, and which is rhetorically indistinguishable from Obama's. (The main difference are that Obama's plan cuts Medicare and imposes numerous other cost-saving measures -- which is to say, attempting to craft a national version of Romney's plan would result in something substantially more liberal than Obama's proposal.)


    I have inserted lines to separate the 3 proposals to make it easier to access the information. The original text of the article remains the same as do the referenced links.  


    You do know that the Heritage (5.00 / 2) (#114)
    by MO Blue on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 07:30:24 PM EST
    Foundation was a big supporter of MA Health Plan. From the Heritage Foundation on MA Health Plan:

    In reality, the legislation is designed to restructure and (partially) deregulate Massachusetts's small-group and non-group health insurance markets and to convert subsidies now paid to hospitals for treating the uninsured into subsidies for the low-income uninsured to buy health insurance. The objectives are expanded coverage, greater consumer choice and satisfaction, value-focused competition among insurers and providers, and ultimately a reduced burden on the state's taxpayers. The key to the Massachusetts plan is a new way of organizing the marketplace to enable consumers to compare and purchase health insurance plans.

    Wow replacing subsidies to hospitals with subsidies for low income people to buy insurance. Funny how Obamacare reduces DHS (subsidies to hospitals) with subsidies for low income people to buy insurance.

    Personal Responsibility

    Finally, the element of the Massachusetts bill that has attracted the most attention and dispute is the "personal responsibility" provision, also known as the "individual mandate."

    Romney also pointed out that to allow people to go without health insurance when they can expect someone else to pay the tab for their treatment is a de facto mandate on providers and taxpayers. Romney's plan was to take that option off the table, leaving only two choices: either buy insurance or pay for your own care. He proposed that those who want to go without coverage could place $10,000 in an interest-bearing escrow account, which providers could claim against if the individual did not pay medical bills

    Unfortunately, the state legislature changed that idea into a mandate: either buy coverage or pay a fine. This provision is more onerous and philosophically objectionable, but it is unlikely to prove onerous in practice. That is because the legislation includes three avenues through which Massachusetts residents can meet the individual coverage requirement by purchasing an inexpensive health plan. First, the bill allows more carriers to offer HSA products with high-deductibles. Second, it also circumvents Massachusetts' overly regulated non-group market by allowing any resident to buy coverage as an individual through the Connector, where a wide choice of plans and premiums will be available. And third, it allows insurers to offer inexpensive "mandate-light" policies to young adults between the ages of 19 and 26, those most likely to go without coverage.
    But that should not overshadow the significance of Massachusetts' achievement in enacting a bipartisan health care reform bill that fundamentally shifts the state's health care system in the direction of greater patient and consumer empowerment and control. The Governor and legislature have provided their citizens with the tools to achieve what the public really wants: a health system with all the familiar comforts of existing employer group coverage but with the added benefits of portability, choice, and control.

    Other governors and legislators would be well advised to consider this basic model as a framework for health care reform in their own states.


    BTW, Romneycare is more liberal than Obamacare and neither is the best we could do by a long shot.


    I am not (none / 0) (#111)
    by Ga6thDem on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 06:50:39 PM EST
    saying that it's not Obama's baby. I'm just saying that this is the kind of thing conservatives usually like.

    If Obama proposed the exact same things Ronald Reagan did the GOP would not vote for it. I don't think they voted against it because they didn't like it but because Obama was going to sign it. And the GOP worries a lot more about being primaried than anything else and that is why they have become very far right.

    I don't like the bill but the GOP refused to even work with him on it. They had a chance to contribute to the bill but chose not to. That's not being "rammed" that being obstinate.


    I don't (none / 0) (#112)
    by Ga6thDem on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 06:52:21 PM EST
    think you have read many of my posts. I am not a fan of Obama nor have I ever been much of one. So I don't know where you're going on that one.

    Thanks for the info (none / 0) (#143)
    by Slado on Wed Apr 24, 2013 at 08:27:53 AM EST
    I'm not a fan of Obama or GW.

    In fact he's the main reason I became a libertarian.  I've had it with both parties.

    If your point is even conservatives will embrace big government if they think it will result in some sort of common good then you are correct and it's the reason I no longer call myself a conservative.

    Prescription Drugs, military spending, No Child Left Behind, the Patriot Act, the War on Terror all the brain child of "conservatives" and resulted in more government.

    I've come to understand that while "conservative" Republicans in Washington will talk a good game the only difference between the two parties when you get down to brass tax is what they plan to spend our money on.  


    You really (none / 0) (#146)
    by Ga6thDem on Wed Apr 24, 2013 at 10:44:46 AM EST
    probably would be more effective as describing yourself as a libertarian than a conservative and it truly sounds that libetarianism is more in line with your political beliefs anyway.

    But if you go to political compass, there only are two basic ideologies libertarian and authoritarian.


    Kinda like (5.00 / 2) (#57)
    by jbindc on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 12:38:51 PM EST
    You write a terribly complicated bill and then you make millions lobbying to change it.

    You run a company into the ground, screwing over the economy, employees, customers, and yes, even sometimes shareholders, and you get a nice severance package on the way out and a bigger, better job somewhere else.

    Only in (corporate) America....


    Ok (none / 0) (#92)
    by Slado on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 05:06:33 PM EST
    So does that mean one is ok since we don't like the other?

    Washington bailed out Wall Street you know.   Which came first?   The chicken or the egg?


    Not necessarily. (none / 0) (#81)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 03:55:02 PM EST
    I would classify Montana as a "purple" state, because while it's definitely conservative-leaning when it comes to presidential politics, Montanans have also demonstrated a strong and stubborn independent streak at the state level, where Democrats have enjoyed considerable success of late. As of right now, they control the congressional delegation, the governor's office and both houses of the state legislature.

    Baucus may be retiring because recent polls last month showed him trailing former Gov. Brian Schweitzer by upwards of 20 points amongst Montana Democrats in a prospective primary matchup next year. I'd say that Schweitzer, a pretty popular two-term governor who was termed out last year, is probably a prohibitive favorite to retain the seat for the Democrats -- that is, if he even decides to run.


    I agree (none / 0) (#125)
    by P3P3P3P3 on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 08:39:00 PM EST
    it will stay Bacchus

    Soccer is hilarious (none / 0) (#8)
    by Dadler on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 10:01:00 AM EST
    Every ten minutes there's a new cup or championship being played, and every five minutes there's a new story about how utterly corrupt the sport is. And on a silly personal note, I hate the offsides rule in soccer. It literally serves no essential point except to almost exclusively punish athleticism, and about 50 percent of the time it's the wrong call, since the refs are never in the right position to make it, and can NEVER be, because, obviously, you cannot be watching three different things at the same time (i.e. the pass and where two or more people are in relation to it). GOOOOOOOAAAALLLLLLL!!!

    Beg to differ.... (5.00 / 1) (#12)
    by kdog on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 10:08:17 AM EST
    need an offsides rule, or else you'd always see a hanger sitting in front of the goal.

    I know you hate the hanger in a full court b-ball game...everybody hates the lazy hanger! I, for one, refuse to pass the ball to a hanger, you wanna play O hustle back and play some D! ;)


    Rule can be tweaked though (none / 0) (#13)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 10:17:45 AM EST
    Make the rule be no more than 2 yards past the last defender.

    No, not two yards (5.00 / 3) (#42)
    by Peter G on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 11:55:25 AM EST
    Two meters.

    My husband just came home for lunch (none / 0) (#50)
    by Militarytracy on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 12:10:08 PM EST
    He says that the ref line of sight using a body makes it difficult enough making offsides calls.  Now let's make the point of reference imaginary :)

    He says the game will be spiced up though, with fights on the field :)

    He accuses Armando of only seeking ways for strikers to cherry pick.  He says he doesn't care if they have the offsides rule but either we get rid of it or it stays as is and stop whining :)


    My husband plays defender (none / 0) (#14)
    by Militarytracy on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 10:20:27 AM EST
    New rules are for cowards :)

    You wouldn't say that ... (none / 0) (#84)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 03:58:45 PM EST
    ... if the new rules allowed players to carry clubs and blackjacks -- to be used only for defensive purposes, of course.

    We have a photo of my husband (none / 0) (#107)
    by Militarytracy on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 06:36:45 PM EST
    Playing defender in high school, they put it in the year book.  He is several feet off the ground swiping his foot through the air puffed up like a puffer fish possibly screaming while glaring by the looks of it.  The caption reads a defender intimidating :)

    There is no part (5.00 / 1) (#133)
    by DebFrmHell on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 10:00:52 PM EST
    of me that isn't screaming "I WANNA SEE THAT PIC!"



    Ha! And when you can't do that (none / 0) (#109)
    by Militarytracy on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 06:42:15 PM EST
    Well enough to get paid.  Well maybe you can find a different profession that will pay you for taking that stance and looking that way :)

    Just think how much more intimidating ... (none / 0) (#116)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 07:36:39 PM EST
    ... he'd have looked in that photo if he had also been swinging a blackjack down upon some poor forward's face.

    I think Calvinball should also be a recognized school sport.


    Interesting idea... (none / 0) (#16)
    by kdog on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 10:26:50 AM EST
    that would get rid of the borderline offsides call nobody wants to see.

    Or maybe add an equivalent to the hockey blue line, instead of using midfield as the line for offsides.


    How does that get rid (none / 0) (#17)
    by Militarytracy on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 10:36:46 AM EST
    Of borderline calls?  Won't

    The refs miss so many offsides calls as it is, it will never be an exact science.


    I guess... (5.00 / 1) (#18)
    by kdog on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 10:43:11 AM EST
    it would create new borderline calls, 2 yard buffer is tough to judge on the fly, but it would prevent the most egregious offsides calls where the striker is even with the defender or a toe past them.  

    There will always be bad calls, but even when technically correct nobody wants to see those.  


    You guys just want soccer (5.00 / 1) (#27)
    by Militarytracy on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 11:16:44 AM EST
    to be more like boxing and less like tennis :)

    In an effort to detour any plans our tiny grandson might have about Southern American Football, we are going full soccer at the YMCA here. I met one of the beautiful people who run it at the veterinarian's office.  She is going to be very short on coaches next season so I gave her the whole family's phone numbers.  She told me that I didn't want to do that, but I do.  Let's just commit now!

    Zoey and Naomi will start this fall, Podgie plans on coaching.  We may have hit a setback with his going to Korea until Nov.  Still waiting to see.  If he stays home for a few more months he will be their coach two days a week, and we are dragging dad into it.  Dad works very hard, he forgets to stop working sometimes so two days a week he will be assistant coach until he is full on coach until Podge gets back.  By the time the grandson gets interested we should be drenched in soccer.

    Spouses neice is a senior this year, her soccer team in Vermont did very well too.


    Speaking of youth coaches... (none / 0) (#37)
    by kdog on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 11:52:13 AM EST
    my niece's soccer coach is driving me crazy! She's on a travel team with tough, well coached opposition, and this guy is getting the pants coached off of him twice a week.

    I know he's a volunteer devoting a lot of time, and a nice enough guy so I'd never say anything, but he's playing kick and chase while other teams are already playing the beautiful game.  They got smoked 7-0 on Saturday and not because of a lack of talent.  And he subs way too much, the girls never get to develop any continuity.  

    End rant;)


    Just let me know if you need (none / 0) (#41)
    by Militarytracy on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 11:54:41 AM EST
    My husband's cell phone number.  I mean, we could get you up and running.  You guys could dissect video over skype.

    Come on Kdog (none / 0) (#44)
    by Slado on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 11:59:48 AM EST
    Give the coach a break.

    If you're such an expert offer to be the assistant, prove that you know more, and take over the team.

    That's what I did for my 7 year old.  

    If you sit in the stands, SHUT UP!!!!

    That was said with love by the way :)


    I thought I was... (5.00 / 1) (#49)
    by kdog on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 12:09:52 PM EST
    giving the coach a break...

    I know he's a volunteer devoting a lot of time, and a nice enough guy so I'd never say anything

    I'd never be that parent, I'm not even a parent!  Just griping here out of earshot;)


    Well, (5.00 / 1) (#70)
    by bocajeff on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 03:02:49 PM EST
    I manage 2 little league teams and always keep volunteer forms on me for parents who are criticizing. When they do (and they always do) I learned to politely hand them the form and tell them that I would love to have them come out on the field to assist. Shuts them up 100% of the time. Literally, 100% of the time.

    I prefer an email or phone call from a parent when it comes to oversights such as playing time, positions, etc...


    BTW... (5.00 / 2) (#19)
    by kdog on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 10:45:57 AM EST
    how was Disney with our pal ruffian? Did you guys get together as planned?  

    Enquiring minds wanna know! ;)


    It was great (5.00 / 1) (#24)
    by Militarytracy on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 11:07:58 AM EST
    I guess it was a test on how controlled my asthma is.  Passed with flying colors, four days of backpack and stroller pushing because we took Josh and we took our grandchildren along with his sister and our son-in-law.  Not one wheeze!!!!

    Ruffian is as another person describes her, a salt of the earth person.  We needed more time with her but she is busy with work.  Such an impressive person.  Mind like a steel trap :)  She says we are overwhelming.  Imagine that :)

    We got to watch the closing of Epcot with her, the world theme.  I did get to see it last year with just Josh and spouse but I was weepy getting to see it again with my whole family and Ruffian.

    If they could but that little show in a vitamin, all that ails the world would be cured.

    I had to meet with my asthma/allergy doctor today.  Now he suggests Sea World :)


    Salt of the Earth... (5.00 / 1) (#29)
    by kdog on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 11:27:30 AM EST
    no bout a doubt it...and she even treats asthma/allergies apparently, just by being in her presence.  What can't ruffian do? ;)

    Glad you guys had a good time, albeit always too short!


    Doesn't look like they'll be (none / 0) (#77)
    by oculus on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 03:45:04 PM EST
    posting photos here.

    (I have a keeper from B. B. King.)


    One thing my allergy/asthma doctor did say (none / 0) (#28)
    by Militarytracy on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 11:27:28 AM EST
    that was depressing, we were talking about how successful my treatment has been.  Is it the allergy shots he wants to know?  No way to know for certain, I think it is.  I wish I would have found this doctor when we first moved here.

    I thanked him, told him that he probably prevented us from HAVING to move.  He accepted my gratitude but then said that moving may not be an option for allergy sufferers before long because pollen counts are projected to increase 2000% globally in the next decade.  Will the desert be safe?


    Interesting, if not actually ironic... (5.00 / 2) (#39)
    by unitron on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 11:53:42 AM EST
    ...all those people who moved to places like Arizona for their sinuses years and years ago.

    Seems they brought in plants to decorate their yards.

    Which means increased pollen levels.

    If beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy, sinuses are proof that He was only kidding about the beer part.


    My asthma starts in my sinuses too (none / 0) (#54)
    by Militarytracy on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 12:31:53 PM EST
    New research indicates that for some of us, when our sinuses become inflamed it sends a signal to the whole airway.

    I was on many different steroid inhalers with a strange kind of mixed bag success.  Made my asthma look really erratic.  Once I began to get allergy shots though and I also wash my sinuses per this doctor (GROSS), and I use Panatase and Veramyst...no inhalers have been needed for about a year now.  I don't even use my rescue inhaler anymore before exercise.  Strange, but happens sometimes I guess.  Now he wants me to stop using daily Zyrtec, only the day of a shot.  Makes me nervous.


    Allergy shots... (5.00 / 2) (#47)
    by kdog on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 12:06:33 PM EST
    cured me of my allergies to pollen and dust fully.  When I was a kid my eyes would swell shut and hay fever like crazy whenever pollen was in the air.

    Started to get the shots, one in each arm every two weeks if I remember right...damned if I know what was in those shots but my allergies left and never came back...now I can roll around in the fresh cut grass no worries.

    I don't know, if not the shots maybe it's the cigarettes? ;)


    He said that you and I are the lucky 50% (none / 0) (#53)
    by Militarytracy on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 12:20:27 PM EST
    I am uber grateful to be in that 50%

    kdog...it must be the grass... (none / 0) (#119)
    by fishcamp on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 07:52:29 PM EST
    I found these photos of the meetup and (none / 0) (#20)
    by Mr Natural on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 10:51:02 AM EST
    shootout between the Tsarnaev brothers in two vehicles with the Police manhunt.  The photos were taken by a local resident from a third floor window.  He didn't notice the fresh bullet hole in his wall calender until later.

    No gore.

    Thanks for sharing. Did you read any of the (5.00 / 2) (#21)
    by Angel on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 11:01:11 AM EST
    comments?  There are a lot of crazies out there who think our government is behind this.  Is it just me, or is half our country comprised of ignorant fools?

    I did like the one comment... (5.00 / 1) (#48)
    by unitron on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 12:07:32 PM EST
    ...where someone noted the correlation between apparent low level of education as evidenced by poor facility with spelling and grammar, and the tendency to believe this is the latest episode of "The Black Helicopters Are Coming For Us".

    lol; I also noticed my misspelling of calendar. (5.00 / 1) (#69)
    by Mr Natural on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 02:56:30 PM EST
    What I see in these pictures (5.00 / 1) (#61)
    by Peter G on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 01:21:33 PM EST
    is that Tamerlan, the older brother, intentionally sacrificed his own life -- running down the street toward the police, shooting -- to give his younger brother a chance to escape by crashing the stolen SUV through the police barricade.

    Or else... (none / 0) (#66)
    by unitron on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 02:26:04 PM EST
    ...he was just seeking martyrdom for himself and leaving baby brother to fend for himself.

    I'm not sure either of these guys were thinking all that straight.


    Those pictures have been taken down. (none / 0) (#89)
    by caseyOR on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 04:51:37 PM EST
    They are no longer available for viewing according to a note on the website.

    No, Jake; it's the Internet... (none / 0) (#113)
    by Mr Natural on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 07:22:23 PM EST
    Here they are.

    Google is our friend.


    an interesting read (angle) (none / 0) (#128)
    by P3P3P3P3 on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 09:07:32 PM EST
    by a "Bostonian"

    "Now my advice for those who die... (none / 0) (#23)
    by kdog on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 11:05:42 AM EST
    Declare the pennies on your eyes."

    Cuz he's the Taxman, yeah the cyber-Taxman!

    Now I can see how it can be considered "unfair" to brick & mortar stores...but lets not pretend fairness is any concern of the state taxman.  Internet sellers in say CA don't use infrastructure in say NY, garbage collection in NY, etc. etc, etc.  Why should they have to collect state sales taxes for NY?  

    An article (none / 0) (#26)
    by jbindc on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 11:16:34 AM EST
    in support of collecting internet taxes.

    Really, the key here is that if you don't pay taxes to say, Amazon, you are supposed to pay it directly on your end-of-year income taxes (there's even a special line on the form for it).


    NYS Tax Form... (none / 0) (#32)
    by kdog on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 11:43:43 AM EST
    has that line, with a warning "do not leave blank!"  But maybe I should keep that down, NYS might be paying somebody 70 grand a year to read blogs;)

    I'm unconvinced by the arguments for the tax collection...the pro side makes no mention of the advantages brick & mortar retailers will always have over internet sellers.  I don't shop much at all online because of those advantages...ease of return or warranty issues being resolved, the ability to browse and touch, supporting local mom and pops.  

    For me, the key is out of state sellers are not using in state resources like police, fire, sanitation, all that stuff.  The buyer is, and any tax responsibility is the buyers.  Bottom line, state taxes are not the responsibility of a business not located in that state.  The Supreme Court had it right in 1992.


    All those Amazon real books seem to (5.00 / 1) (#79)
    by oculus on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 03:47:51 PM EST
    arrive at my doorstep via local roads.

    I can live with that (none / 0) (#103)
    by sj on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 05:50:52 PM EST
    But Kindle books don't use them. Just saying.

    Hence, the word "real." (5.00 / 1) (#105)
    by oculus on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 06:24:49 PM EST
    Like "Cleo"!

    please explain (none / 0) (#141)
    by DFLer on Wed Apr 24, 2013 at 08:11:43 AM EST
    your reference to "Cleo"  

    (don't get it)


    Stacy Schiff's "Cleopatra," which (5.00 / 1) (#149)
    by oculus on Wed Apr 24, 2013 at 11:13:49 AM EST
    I mailed to sj.  

    Isn't that what... (none / 0) (#140)
    by kdog on Wed Apr 24, 2013 at 06:17:13 AM EST
    the gasoline tax is for?  Whoever buys the gas to move the book is paying that, unless they're a better man than me and found tax free gas;)

    Which is why (none / 0) (#36)
    by jbindc on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 11:51:26 AM EST
    The buyer is, and any tax responsibility is the buyers.

    There is that little line on the tax form that everyone ignores!  :)


    Boo F*ckin' Hoo... (none / 0) (#40)
    by kdog on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 11:53:50 AM EST
    for the state/county/town taxman...can't win 'em all! ;)

    Just another excuse (none / 0) (#38)
    by Slado on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 11:53:29 AM EST
    for government to get bigger.

    There is no logical argument for this tax.

    Only the inevitable inertia of an ever expanding, and broke, government.

    States are broke because they overspent during the housing boom.  Now they have debts to pay and the soon to come health care cost explosion under Obamacare.

    They have their hands out.  

    Big Box retailers are predictably for this because it helps their bottom line.   But that is to be expected.   Business will always act selfishly and use the government to fix their problems.

    It's our politicians that should know better.   But they can't help themselves.

    So government just keeps getting bigger.


    Exactly... (none / 0) (#43)
    by kdog on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 11:59:25 AM EST
    lets not pretend this about leveling the playing field for brick & mortar retailers...it's a money grab, plain and simple, the states don't give two sh*ts about Mom & Pops Books competing with Amazon.

    My favorite tax quote ever (none / 0) (#45)
    by Slado on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 12:00:34 PM EST
    There are only three ways to acquire wealth in a free society. The inheritance model occurs when someone gives you wealth. The economic model occurs when you trade a skill, a talent, an asset, knowledge, sweat, energy or creativity to a willing buyer. And the mafia model occurs when a guy with a gun says: "Give me your money or else."

    Which model does the government use? Why do we put up with this?


    Why we put up with it... (5.00 / 1) (#58)
    by kdog on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 12:39:18 PM EST
    well for starters they have these things called prisons...;)

    So I can't take the Wesley Snipes route? (none / 0) (#95)
    by Slado on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 05:13:12 PM EST
    Darn it.

    You wanted to spend three years (5.00 / 1) (#99)
    by Peter G on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 05:26:11 PM EST
    in a federal prison, as Wesley Snipes just finished doing?

    Snipes dug himself a pretty deep hole... (none / 0) (#121)
    by Mr Natural on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 07:57:36 PM EST
    Wiki has some details; it seems less a conspiracy than a confederacy - of dunces.  How and why Snipes got sucked in would be a great story.

    Snipes was acquitted on the conspiracy charge (none / 0) (#139)
    by Peter G on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 11:48:04 PM EST
    and on the only other felony count as well, plus not guilty on three of six misdemeanor counts of failure to file returns.  Nevertheless, the judge imposed 3 consecutive maximum terms of one-year each on the misdemeanor convictions, which is rare and harsh.  I agree it is a very interesting story.  This interview is more insightful and informative than most.

    Thanks, very informative indeed. (none / 0) (#148)
    by vicndabx on Wed Apr 24, 2013 at 11:12:43 AM EST
    This falls under (none / 0) (#30)
    by Slayersrezo on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 11:35:25 AM EST
    Don't the cops have better things to do?


    Ridiculous... (none / 0) (#55)
    by kdog on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 12:34:45 PM EST
    so ridiculous...I may abhor the shirt's image and message but I will forever defend the boy's right to wear it.  

    The anti-gun nut authoritarians scare me more than the gun nuts.  This much closer to getting arrested for breathing.


    The school would probably (none / 0) (#153)
    by jondee on Wed Apr 24, 2013 at 01:41:37 PM EST
    make a stink if someone came to school wearing a tee shirt with the authoritarian words "well regulated" hi-lighted..

    This particular incident probably has as more to do with a policy concerning clothing displays with overt political messages, than with some nefarious governmental attempt to disarm the Wolverine squadron..

    A lot of schools have had so many problems and complaints from students and parents centering around confrontational, in-your-face, issue-mongering by students at school that they've taken preemptive steps to avoid a recurrence of those kind of probelms in the future.

    Because there are only so many hours in the day, and you can't please every student and every parent.



    "It's the first step toward.." (none / 0) (#154)
    by jondee on Wed Apr 24, 2013 at 02:21:25 PM EST
    "a dangerous, slippery slope"..that the Founding Fathers and Thomas Paine warned us against..

    Enough with the None Dare Call It Conspiracy, Alex Jones they're-coming-to-get-us, delusionary paranoia, already!

    DWI laws and banning assault weapons isn't "the first step toward" rounding up self reliant, patriotic Americans and leading them off to Maoist reeducation camps. Maybe if it were all your lives would be more melodramatic and exciting, but that isn't whats going on. Sorry.

    You folks really need to get a frickin' grip.  


    No (none / 0) (#65)
    by sj on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 02:25:56 PM EST
    this falls under "does the teacher know either rights or protocols"?

    I read the story (5.00 / 1) (#75)
    by Towanda on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 03:38:35 PM EST
    and want the police chief and others to provide more information on the student's other behaviors that, according to the police chief, were the cause of the arrest.  (Not the t-shirt.)

    If there was a disturbance in the school that was a "near-riot," then no, police don't have better things to do; schools call them in to take action.

    But, giving the story a careful reading:  More information could clarify whether others  also ought to have been arrested for creating the disruption.  


    Agreed (5.00 / 1) (#100)
    by sj on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 05:38:30 PM EST
    Also, I don't know about the kid's behavior or that of the other students.  They all tend to be rather snotty nosed at that point.  But based on the story it appears to be the teacher that was sort of the initial instigator.  Much as I agree with the sentiments of the teacher, people say all sorts of things I don't like.  And while the t-shirt was offensive, it doesn't appear to be against the school dress code.

    Solution: arm the teachers. (none / 0) (#80)
    by oculus on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 03:50:02 PM EST
    Agreed. (none / 0) (#85)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 04:07:31 PM EST
    Two words: Samurai sword.

    Donald (none / 0) (#94)
    by Slayersrezo on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 05:12:47 PM EST
    I'm sick of your irresponsible advocacy of weapons of mass destruction.
    Dozens of people are killed by samurai swords every year!
    THINK OF THE CHILDREN before you put out such stupid ideas or maybe you really don't care about all the little five year olds killed or maimed or missing their dear old pops.
    And we know the Ninja's in the inner cities can't be trusted with such powerful weapons.
    Bet you don't care about their lives either. People dressed in Color are always last in your estimation, you raycest.

    Instead of recommending that MORE people (including untrained Sensei that teach our innocent children ) be armed to stroke your paranoid fantasies of these weapons saving lives by deterring poor dresser everywhere, we should instead focus on REGULATING  the Katana that currently exist in our violence-prone society.

    A. For one, no one needs such powerful long swords. They certainly aren't needed for hunting.
    Wakizashi's could satisfy the need for hunters and those few ronin who need to protect themselves. With a permit of course. And locked up when taken out of the house unless displayed openly.
    B. The amount of swords purchased should be severely limited. Who needs more than one or two swords?
    C. The Sword Smith Loophole needs to be closed.
    D. Even though freaks like you have an ego problem or maybe feel some sort of sexual inadequacy, no one NEEDS a tachi style sword. That's just used for killing police and murderous rampages!

    In short, I wish you would shut up and just die die die because all your arguments are stupid and childish and you hate small children and want to cut up unicorns.

    The previous was satire, but kinda matches how some people argue at this site about guns.


    "Kinda matches" (none / 0) (#108)
    by Yman on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 06:41:37 PM EST

    @ Zero: (none / 0) (#117)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 07:37:23 PM EST
    Grow up.

    ohhhhhhhhhh another (none / 0) (#126)
    by Slayersrezo on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 08:46:04 PM EST
    Personal attack by the "adult".
    Don't you ever get tired of your act?

    One minute tongue in cheek or sarcastic the next minute pretending all such humor is beneath you. And doing so whenever it suits you.

    In fact my post is precisely like some here have acted in regards to me and others who - to put it bluntly - aren't supportive of their various cures for their purported 'problems'. And you've been one of the worst offenders.

    Physician, Heal Thyself.


    well done (none / 0) (#131)
    by P3P3P3P3 on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 09:35:44 PM EST
    caused Vapors

    kinda Mikado-esque



    What if the polices presence was (none / 0) (#90)
    by Slayersrezo on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 04:51:54 PM EST
    what precipitated the 'near riot'?

    From the initial reading it doesn't seem like this kid should have been hassled in the first place, and if that's the case then using the police to 'enforce' the stupidity just compounded things.

    Here's a thought: police (and the laws they enforce) don't just exist to maintain order, or any old law would do. And laws /policies have to reflect community values. Given the limited information we have at this time I'm willing to think that a policy at that school was either abused or was not a 'community norm' so to speak.


    Exactly. Based on the limited information (5.00 / 2) (#97)
    by Towanda on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 05:17:29 PM EST
    it seemed rash to castigate the cops on this one.

    Internet Tax (none / 0) (#35)
    by Slado on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 11:48:11 AM EST
    This is what truly scares us libertarians.

    Every once and a while both parties figure out that it's in their interest to screw us.

    This is a perfect example of why government never shrinks.


    This has nothing to do with government (5.00 / 1) (#64)
    by sj on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 02:24:53 PM EST
    shrinking or expanding.  It has to do with privately funded campaigns and the corruption that breeds.

    Frankly, while I understand that local and state governments are in dire straits, it just frosts me that, once again, they're looking to collect from the lower/working/middle classes.


    You just contradicted yoruself (none / 0) (#93)
    by Slado on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 05:11:46 PM EST
    The problem with wanting government to do everything is eventually someone has to pay for it.

    When they run out of rich people's money they come after the rest of us.

    Remember the Income Tax was promised to never exceed 3% and never be paid by anyone but the super rich.

    We saw how that turned out.


    Don't be ridiculous (5.00 / 3) (#101)
    by sj on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 05:46:47 PM EST
    I in no way contradicted myself.  Sales tax has been a fact of life for many, many years.  It isn't an expansion of "government."  An expansion of the tax code, yeah.  

    State and local governments are hurting and I happen to like the things they provide, like roads and schools and libraries and bridges and parks, and parks with fountains, and lots of other stuff that keep this from being a post-apocalyptic world.  I'll contribute to that kitty, gladly.  Although I'm not too happy about contributing to Homeland Security and DOD.

    But don't you fret about rich people's money. It'll be fine. The rich people are making sure they keep their money and get yours, too.


    You know what scares me about libertarians? (5.00 / 2) (#127)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 08:58:21 PM EST
    That you guys might actually believe your own bull$H!+.

    "Taxation is the price which civilized communities pay for the opportunity of remaining civilized."
    - Albert Bushnell Hart (1854-1943), historian and philosopher

    Personally, I don't want to live in a society in which it's every man for himself, and "Caveat Emptor" is the prevailing rule rather than the occasional exception.

    "Wealth is the slave of a wise man, and the master of a fool."
    - Lucius Annaeus Seneca (4 B.C. - 65 A.D.), philosopher and humorist

    Why don't you want to live that (none / 0) (#137)
    by Slayersrezo on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 10:26:08 PM EST
    way Donald?
    We all know that politics is the art of successfully building friendships (often at the expense of ethics or ones purported political philosophy) and determining who you can get away with stabbing in the back and who you can't.

    You'd probably be quite good at living in an anarchy (which is what you consider a 'libertarian utopia' to be). Since you do love your family, I suppose you would worry about THEM however.


    Is Armando still doing DK radio? (none / 0) (#83)
    by oculus on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 03:57:29 PM EST
    Or just soccer bets?

    Oh snap! (none / 0) (#142)
    by DFLer on Wed Apr 24, 2013 at 08:14:22 AM EST
    PoemsForKay, vol. 575 (none / 0) (#86)
    by Dadler on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 04:29:38 PM EST
    (I burp these out too fast sometimes, it's a daily sort of exercise, so forgive any lack of "evolved" greatness in it. Or any normal average-ness, for that matter. Have a great day, my friends. Peace.)

    PoemsForKay (pfk), vol. 575

    "Sunny Warm Days in San Francisco are Few & Dreamy"

    She had sapphire blue nails, so blue,
    That was the first thing I noticed about her
    The man at the bench told this to the police officer
    She'd been sitting on the bench with him
    At the other end, her eyes closed to the sun
    Warming herself like a lizard on a rock
    But she had a grin on her face like a cat
    They sun themselves too, don't they?
    The officer scratched his head, I dunno
    And he kept looking up into the sky
    Directly above the bench and the man
    Maybe thirty or forty feet up, the sun was bright and hot
    He had to squint, even with cop sunglasses on
    But he could see her hovering, four stories above,
    And it just made no sense at all to him, how could it?
    She just sort of floated up there, the man said
    They were talking at first, how she moved here a year ago
    And how this is only the second sunny day she remembers
    I told her she looked like she loved the sun, the man said
    Like a mother loves her only child and poof
    She just sort of slowly lifted off the bench and ascended
    But is there a rope around her? asked the officer
    Is this some kind of prank or stunt?
    Alotta jokers and artist types do dumb shit like this
    His fingers made "quote marks" when he said artist types
    A woman can't just lay there floating in the sky, he asserted
    Suddenly the woman spoke up, or down really
    Oh yes I can float, she said, don't you see me up here?
    And she gently spun around in the air to show him
    You can see there aren't any ropes either
    Come down, ma'am, before you hurt yourself
    But I can't come down, she replied
    The sun did this to me, the sun has to undo it
    Ma'am, don't make me call a ladder truck
    The woman paid no attention to his warning
    She talked about how warm it was, how wonderful
    I must come from one of those Sun God Tribes, she mused
    This is the ONLY thing I miss about southern California
    Ma'am, I'm calling a fire truck right now
    And you WILL have to pay the costs
    Money, thought the officer, convinces every sane person
    I don't think she cares, the man on the bench said
    Do you want to join me? the woman asked the man
    The man smiled up to her and said yes
    With a look of wonder he began to slowly ascend to her
    The officer was on his radio when the man started to float
    His jaw hung open and creaked at the sight
    The officer then dropped the radio when he, too, began to float
    At first he resisted, but then he surrendered
    The perfect metaphor for his profession
    The three of them remained in the sky for the rest of the day
    Basking in the rare sun and texting answers to media questions
    While they refused help, they did accept free drinks
    Served to them by an old hippy juggler on skyscraper stilts
    Who works Union Square and goes by the name Sir Real...

    thats alright (5.00 / 1) (#136)
    by P3P3P3P3 on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 10:09:04 PM EST
    light and fun

    I'd Venture the maidens name is Mary Jane


    Alligator lizards in the air (none / 0) (#155)
    by Dadler on Wed Apr 24, 2013 at 04:06:24 PM EST
    Damn I forgot how, um, induced those American lyrics were. The phucking Muskrat Love guys, come on.

    it can be a challenge (5.00 / 1) (#156)
    by P3P3P3P3 on Wed Apr 24, 2013 at 08:31:15 PM EST
    to match up items to connect, glad you listened and got it, California HWY too, I actually like Muskrat Love, but by the Captain and Tennille, there was some cute duo's bad in the day, the Carpenters, Sonny and Cher,  and Ashford and Simpson

    Do you remember the movie "Marathon Man"?, it came to mind on this cartoon


    Associated Press twitter account hacked. (none / 0) (#87)
    by caseyOR on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 04:30:13 PM EST
    A group calling itself the Syrian Electronic Army hacked in to the AP twitter feed today and posted a tweet claiming there had been explosions at the White House and Obama was injured.

    It took a few minutes for Twitter to suspend the account. In that time the Dow Jones dropped 150 points as traders read the false tweet. Once it was announced that the tweet was bogus and Obama was okay the Dow Jones regained those lost points.

    Who is the Syrian Electronic Army? As of this afternoon, that twitter account was still active.

    Twitter accounts seem to be very easy to hack. And that seems like   a potential recipe for chaos. Perhaps certain "essential" organizations should not have twitter accounts given the apparent ease with which they are hacked and the trouble those false tweets could cause.

    Tell Anthony Weiner. He just (none / 0) (#96)
    by oculus on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 05:16:49 PM EST
    re-opened his Twitter account.

    And not one of these comments (none / 0) (#106)
    by sj on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 06:34:15 PM EST
    ever showed as [new].

    I thought it was just me! (none / 0) (#134)
    by DebFrmHell on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 10:02:29 PM EST
    I even checked to see if I was logged in.

    What the Sanford? (none / 0) (#110)
    by Militarytracy on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 06:47:50 PM EST
    How?  How do you so shamelessly be that deadbeat?  Just throwing it away, Go Republicans....beat the Democrats (snicker)

    You know what's really funny? (none / 0) (#122)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 08:03:18 PM EST
    Mark Sanford held elective high office in South Carolina for over a decade, and yet it's only been over the last couple of years that people -- myself included -- are discovering what a complete and unmitigated frosted flake he actually is.

    Maybe it was the midlife crisis (5.00 / 1) (#123)
    by CoralGables on Tue Apr 23, 2013 at 08:11:36 PM EST
    that turned him into a frosted flake. Or maybe Jenny Sanford was always the brains behind the man.

    Obviously (none / 0) (#144)
    by Militarytracy on Wed Apr 24, 2013 at 08:36:33 AM EST
    I think when he was home on the weekends she had him in a pinch collar.  What a bad dog!!!!  Someone call Cesar Millan.  What do we do with this Dawwwg Cesar?

    Well, he was... (none / 0) (#147)
    by unitron on Wed Apr 24, 2013 at 11:06:39 AM EST
    ...hiding in plain sight among all of those other SC Republicans, which means you have to really get your crazy on to stand out.