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DNC Thursday: Obama's Big Night

The text of Obama's speech is here.

It's a Wrap: Obama gave a great speech -- he was inspiring, authentic, inclusive, humble, passionate and most of all, Presidential. His supporters love him. They will work extra hard in November. There's too much at stake.

8:55 pm: Obama's hit his mark. Most moving line so far: "Welcome Home."

Youíre the reason a young immigrant who grew up here and went to school here and pledged allegiance to our flag will no longer be deported from the only country sheís ever called home ó why selfless soldiers wonít be kicked out of the military because of who they are or who they love, why thousands of families have finally been able to say to the loved ones who served us so bravely, welcome home. Welcome home. You did that. You did that. You did that.

[More...]

The truest line:

Times have changed and so have I. I'm no longer just a candidate, I'm the President.

Good dig at Romney for his Olympics gaffe and comments about Russia.

You might not be ready for diplomacy with Beijing if you canít visit the Olympics without insulting our closest ally.

His closing lines:

We donít turn back. We leave no one behind. We pull each other up. We draw strength from our victories. And we learn from our mistakes. But we keep our eyes fixed on that distant horizon knowing that providence is with us and that we are surely blessed to be citizens of the greatest nation on earth.

8:25 pm: Obama takes the stage. His daughters are so grown up, it's great to see them live!

8:09 pm: I can't pretend to like Biden, and his speech was too long, but I'm sure some people thought he was inspiring. Here's Dick Durbin, to introduce Barack Obama.

6:55 pm: John Kerry is very good tonight. He also looks better now than he did in 2008.

6:17 pm: Jennifer Granholm is on fire -- she's terrific but she seems about to have a stroke. Is she an actress? Poor Eva Longoria, having to follow that. Never mind, I shouldn't have worried. Eva's a great speaker as well as being outrageously beautiful. No desperate housewife tonight."The Eva Longoria who worked at Wendy's needs a tax break, but the Eva Longoria who worked on Desperate Housewives does not." Almost a standing ovation.

Granholm, like Clinton last night with his stopped clock is right twice a day comment, seems to be channeling defense lawyers. Her elevator ride and shaft comment is a used in defense closing arguments: "My client went for a ride on the elevator of justice but all he got was the shaft."

The energy is very high tonight in the audience. Gabby Giffords really roused them.

The schedule starting at 8pm ET:

  • Caroline Kennedy, author and attorney
  • Rep. Xavier Becerra of California
  • Jennifer Granholm, former governor of Michigan
  • Actress Eva Longoria
  • Gov. Brian Schweitzer of Montana
  • Charlie Crist, Jr., former governor of Florida
  • Sen. John Kerry of Massachusetts

9 - 10 p.m.

  • Video: Veterans
  • Retired Adm. John B. Nathman, United States Navy
  • Introductory Remarks: Angie Flores
  • Dr. Jill Biden, wife of the vice president
  • Vice President Joe Biden Video
  • Vice President Joe Biden

10 - 11 p.m.

  • Video and remarks: Sen. Dick Durbin of Illinois
  • President Barack Obama Video
  • President Barack Obama

There's also a performance by the Foo Fighters and Marc Anthony will sing the national anthem. Scarlett Johansson and Natalie Portman will also speak.

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  • Display: Sort:
    Go Gabby (5.00 / 2) (#1)
    by CoralGables on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 06:59:05 PM EST


    Tears were rolling (5.00 / 4) (#107)
    by MileHi Hawkeye on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 08:05:39 AM EST
    down my cheeks watching that.  You can tell that she is a fighter and has the attitude you need to come back from something as horrific as she's been through.  That smile says it all!  

    Parent
    Eva Longoria! (5.00 / 3) (#4)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 07:25:14 PM EST
    Without a doubt, she'll do The Spouse's hometown of Corpus Christi, TX proud tonight -- well, the nonwhite portion of it, anyway.

    While most people know her from Desperate Housewives and as tabloid fodder, Ms. Longoria is actually an unsung but staunch advocate on behalf of the nearly 500,000 migrant child farm laborers in this country.

    Ummmm (none / 0) (#126)
    by ScottW714 on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 11:05:48 AM EST
    They haven't been together for a couple years and Tony Parker is French.  And I think he still plays for the French team he partly owns, I doubt he calls anywhere in the US home.

    Parent
    Both of you are correct. (5.00 / 1) (#141)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 01:22:47 PM EST
    My wife hails from Corpus Christi, and she and her nine siblings were raised by parents who until 1986-87 were undocumented immigrants.

    Her two eldest siblings came over the Rio Grande with their parents as very young children (under 5), and were thus also undocumented until 1987. And she and five of her siblings also served in the U.S. military.

    Everyone who was born in Mexico has since been able to obtain U.S. citizenship, thanks to the last round of comprehensive immigration reform in 1986. They have all more than proven themselves to be loyal Americans, and thus the Dream Act really hits home with us.

    Parent

    I think Donald may have been referring (none / 0) (#129)
    by Anne on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 11:12:17 AM EST
    to his own spouse, not Longoria's.

    Parent
    I could be wrong (none / 0) (#130)
    by CoralGables on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 11:14:05 AM EST
    but with the capitalization of "The Spouse" Donald was being much closer to home.

    Parent
    You haven't seen Granholm before? (5.00 / 1) (#8)
    by Towanda on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 07:30:11 PM EST
    You bet she's an actor.  That's what pure Midwestern firebrand stump speaking is -- acting -- and she had to learn to act it, since she's a Canadian-cum-Californian-cum-Michigander.

    But she sure can talk some Detroit, dere:  Ya know what I'm sayin'?  

    Granholm reminds me of the stump speeches (5.00 / 1) (#31)
    by caseyOR on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 08:17:27 PM EST
    my parents took me to when I was a wee lass back in central Illinois, lo these many years age.

    She gave a barnburner of a speech. And Towanda is right. That's how it is done in the midwest. Shades of Robert LaFollette.

    Parent

    Granholm was marvelous. (5.00 / 4) (#36)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 08:27:37 PM EST
    The Dems have opened up a can of Whoopass on the GOP this convention.

    Parent
    Ahhh . . . did get to see Dirksen in Illinois? (none / 0) (#43)
    by Towanda on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 08:40:55 PM EST
    He was a fun one.

    And, yes, Fighting Bob was part of the barnburner tradition -- as was Fighting Belle, who actuallly wrote his speeches as well as her own, and I have great photos of both in action, often speaking from wagons in front of, yes, barns.

    But even more, I think of the tradition going back to the likes of William Jennings Bryan, especially the "Cross of Gold" speech.  It's still good reading, but descriptions of his delivery make me yearn for a time machine to see him in action.

    Parent

    I did see Dirksen. His hometown, Pekin, IL, (5.00 / 2) (#54)
    by caseyOR on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 09:17:25 PM EST
    is only about 15 miles from my hometown. We saw quite a bit of old Ev.

    Dirksen died when I was a high school senior. I attended his burial in Pekin as a member of the press, serving as the pool reporter for all the high schools in our conference. I had real, official press credentials and a seat on the press bus.

     I chatted with reporters from the NY Times and WaPo and the Trib. I saw Teddy Kennedy and Spiro Agnew and Chuck Percy and Jerry Ford and many other politicos. It was the most amazing experience of my life at that point in time.

    And I agree about the "Cross of Gold" speech. It set the standard for barnburning speechifying. I'd love to have seen Bryan in action.

    Parent

    I got to see the Senate (none / 0) (#87)
    by oculus on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 01:28:15 AM EST
    debate between Dirksen and Pastore as to location of the Fermilab.  Illinois got it, probably in exchange for Dirksen's agreement to support the Civil Rights Act.    

    Parent
    What is your hometown? (none / 0) (#92)
    by Wile ECoyote on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 05:34:39 AM EST
    My wife is from Tremont.

    Parent
    Dang (5.00 / 2) (#86)
    by lilburro on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 12:07:02 AM EST
    if that's what Midwestern politics has to offer, I've been missing out.  It may not have as broad of an appeal as BC's speech last night but it was as exciting, in under 10 minutes.  Regional differences aside, I hereby nominate her for the Julia Sugarbaker Award for Fearless Liberal Tell-Offs ;) I was waiting for her to tell me that That Was The Night The Lights Went Out... but of course, they didn't.  

    Parent
    I haven't seen her before (none / 0) (#12)
    by Jeralyn on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 07:41:38 PM EST
    she reminded me of a child actress all grown up. Kind of Shirly Temple-ish. Her face is still like a little girls. I can only imagine her at an aerobics class. But again, she was really good.

    Parent
    She is also a very smart commenter on Current (5.00 / 1) (#15)
    by ruffian on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 07:51:12 PM EST
    Razor sharp, but with the fun personality. I enjoy her show,

    I had never seen her give a speech like that before. Enjoyed that too.

    Parent

    Didn't catch the silly little girl angle (5.00 / 2) (#105)
    by brodie on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 07:43:51 AM EST
    I've long thought she could be the daughter of the fine actor Robert Vaughn (The Man from UNCLE), especially in the mouth nose area.  And like Vaughn she's very smart about politics, a person of real substance who can communicate very effectively.

    Darn shame the Con is so hard to amend, as she would be my first choice for prez in 2016 if Hillary doesn't run.  As we know it would get changed quickly if Arnold had only not screwed up as gov and had not poked the housekeeper.

    So instead I've got Granholm down for the next CA senate seat opening, preferably DiFi's seat.

    Parent

    Charlie Crist is nailing it (5.00 / 5) (#11)
    by ruffian on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 07:40:29 PM EST
    Very impressive.

    I really wanted to hear what this one (none / 0) (#13)
    by Militarytracy on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 07:41:58 PM EST
    had to say.

    Parent
    He talked about Obama making (5.00 / 5) (#14)
    by ruffian on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 07:48:54 PM EST
    sure FL got money for firefighters and teachers, etc, and how Crist got in trouble wi the GOP for embracing him . Also about how Reagan woould be too centrist for the GOP. Much along that line. About how he saw a leader in Obama during the BP spill,

    I liked it because it was very matter of fact and plain spoken. The GOP lost a good one there.

    Parent

    When he stood up to the GOP (5.00 / 2) (#16)
    by Militarytracy on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 07:51:48 PM EST
    over women's rights, he has essentially won my attention forever.

    Parent
    I truly miss him (5.00 / 1) (#88)
    by Amiss on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 01:35:19 AM EST
    Going from him to Rick Scott is like being shell shocked I think you would feel. When I left Fla briefly Graham was Governor. Came back I think for a year of Crist although I just lived outside Jax city limits we were at Kings Bay and now recently back in Fla. I feel like Alice. Everything is backwards from the way it used to be.

    Parent
    I moved here when he was in office (none / 0) (#94)
    by ruffian on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 05:54:13 AM EST
    and it seemed like a fairly sane place for a while...then came The Hug that shook the world.  Soooo ridiculous. Now the inmates are running the asylum.

    What I can't figure out is how Rick Scott plans to take credit for creating any jobs without sharing the credit with Obama. Oh, I am sure he will try.

    Parent

    I moved here when he was in office (none / 0) (#95)
    by ruffian on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 05:54:13 AM EST
    and it seemed like a fairly sane place for a while...then came The Hug that shook the world.  Soooo ridiculous. Now the inmates are running the asylum.

    What I can't figure out is how Rick Scott plans to take credit for creating any jobs without sharing the credit with Obama. Oh, I am sure he will try.

    Parent

    And he got off the great line (5.00 / 3) (#18)
    by Towanda on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 07:52:54 PM EST
    to ask Bin Laden if he's better off than he was four years ago.

    Parent
    Kerry is funny. Really! (5.00 / 3) (#17)
    by ruffian on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 07:52:04 PM EST


    This is a side of Kerry (5.00 / 3) (#20)
    by CoralGables on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 07:54:43 PM EST
    we never saw before

    Parent
    I recall him as very funny (5.00 / 1) (#28)
    by Towanda on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 08:07:11 PM EST
    on the stump in that campaign, coping with hecklers.  He also was very impassioned, very good.

    Apparently that side of him was not seen elsewhere?  Or only when cameras weren't watching?

    Parent

    I (5.00 / 1) (#104)
    by lentinel on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 07:37:22 AM EST
    watched him.

    During the debate with Bush, I thought Kerry was pathetic.

    Bush lied us into a war, everybody knew it, and Kerry just couldn't bring himself to say it loudly and clearly to his face.

    I have thought often that all he would have had to have done mention Bush's little antic at the dinner for the media where he did his schtick about "where are the WMDs?" This - while thousands of people were being killed for nothing thanks to him and his bunch of thugs.

    I am very angry at Obama and Holder for letting those b@stards off the hook.

    We need Democrats with guts.
    Kerry showed me nothing in 2004.
    And I don't even think he would have gotten the nomination without "borrowing" a few million from Ms. Heinz for his campaign at a time when Howard Dean was ahead in the primaries.

    Parent

    Where (5.00 / 1) (#102)
    by lentinel on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 07:26:36 AM EST
    was he in 2004 when we needed him?

    Parent
    Too bad we didn't! (none / 0) (#21)
    by ruffian on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 07:56:25 PM EST
    That was a heck of a speech.

    Parent
    I saw him on C-Span3 laaaaaaate (none / 0) (#45)
    by nycstray on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 08:48:16 PM EST
    one night (re-runs) giving the smack down in a hearing over BPA and was like "Where the F!CK was this guy?!" (in regards to 04). He was good. Real good.

    Parent
    Surprising (none / 0) (#19)
    by Democratic Cat on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 07:54:16 PM EST
    A really excellent speech.

    Parent
    I loved the line ... (5.00 / 2) (#39)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 08:30:25 PM EST
    ... in which Kerry said that Mittens "talks like he's only seen Russia by watching Rocky IV."

    Parent
    Give him 4 more so he can take care (5.00 / 4) (#27)
    by Militarytracy on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 08:04:50 PM EST
    of the vets as he brings most of them home.  We need him.  The Republicans did not mention vets.  They don't like pacts either.

    The stark contrast between the ... (5.00 / 7) (#29)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 08:10:51 PM EST
    ... two political conventions has been totally amazing. I'm not just talking about the obvious differences between the two parties in terms of racial and ethnic diversity, although Jeralyn's recent description of the GOP gathering as a "sea of mayonnaise" comes immediately to mind.

    The Democrats have been remarkably upbeat and unabashedly pro-Barack Obama in their demeanor, even as they get in their requisite partisan digs at Mitt Romney, while last week's Republican conclave was relentlessly downcast, meanspirited and negative in its general tone, and far less pro-Romney than it was simply anti-Obama.

    PBS has really booted it as far as I am concerned (5.00 / 1) (#32)
    by womanwarrior on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 08:19:28 PM EST
    I am so disappointed with the meaningless babble and idiot commentators and pundits instead of the speakers.  Where did they go wrong?

    As soon as I saw David Brooks, it was (5.00 / 3) (#37)
    by Anne on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 08:28:05 PM EST
    off to CSPAN I went - and I never looked back; look up "twit" in the dictionary, and there's his picture - he's the third from the left in the back row (yeah, it's a group shot).

    Parent
    Welcome (5.00 / 1) (#41)
    by CoralGables on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 08:36:41 PM EST
    another punditless CSPAN convert :)

    Parent
    I came close to tackling my husband for (5.00 / 1) (#42)
    by Anne on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 08:39:31 PM EST
    the remote last night so I could change the channel; he's pretty used to those kinds of reactions from me, so we both had a pretty good laugh about it.

    Parent
    I solved that problem at my house (5.00 / 2) (#89)
    by Amiss on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 01:59:06 AM EST
    We now have two remotes.. Someone gave me one of those over the arm organizers and my remotes never get lost his do however
     LOL

    Parent
    I know (5.00 / 1) (#101)
    by lentinel on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 07:23:14 AM EST
    that this is mean of me to say, but I always think to myself that David Brooks is one of those individuals about whom it can honestly be said that he is as dumb as he looks.

    Parent
    "Group shot" (none / 0) (#44)
    by lilburro on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 08:41:41 PM EST
    may have to steal that one!  Hilarious (and true...).

    Parent
    Brooks actually had (none / 0) (#103)
    by BackFromOhio on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 07:28:18 AM EST
    a lot of nice things to say about Clinton's speech Wed. night and some comparisons I think between Dem & Repub conventions that were not flattering to the latter.  

    Parent
    For me, (5.00 / 2) (#100)
    by lentinel on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 07:21:49 AM EST
    they went wrong a long time ago.

    They went in for big money.
    Corporate grants.
    Government subsidies.

    And when they became cheerleaders for the war in Iraq, I said, "no mas".

    Parent

    C-Span is the way to go if ... (5.00 / 1) (#108)
    by Robot Porter on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 08:31:14 AM EST
    you want to avoid the idiot commentators.  Gavel to gavel.  No babble.

    In fact, I think C-Span is the best way to gain a handle on the race.  I learn much more watching unedited campaign events than from the babbling morons on cable news.

    And when C-Span does have babbling morons they are featured in longer appearances, also unedited, which are generally more academic in nature.

    Plus, it's just a better use of your time. Because there's probably more campaign pertinent information in 1 hour of C-Span, than in 18 hours of cable news.

    Parent

    I went with Cspan tonight (4.50 / 2) (#33)
    by Militarytracy on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 08:21:55 PM EST
    Just not in the mood for the professional commenting.

    Parent
    And what's wrong ... (none / 0) (#34)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 08:24:28 PM EST
    ... with David Brooks? ;-D

    Parent
    Poor David Brooks is afflicted with a (5.00 / 1) (#38)
    by caseyOR on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 08:29:20 PM EST
    chronic and apparently incurable case of twittism.

    It is so sad. Even though he has great health insurance through his employer, it doesn't appear that his doctor has told him about possible treatments, or else David rejected treatment.

    This, my friends, is what happens when a good education goes bad.

    Parent

    Michelle during Biden's speech (5.00 / 5) (#40)
    by lilburro on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 08:35:06 PM EST
    seems very emotional and genuine.  These two families seem to get along really well.

    The other Michelle sounds genuine, too. (5.00 / 1) (#47)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 09:06:09 PM EST
    "Biden just mentioned 'prosperity.' Meantime, White House trashes and bullies Americans for Prosperity."
    - Michelle Malkin via Twitter

    Genuinely deranged, that is.

    Parent

    lol! that she is. (5.00 / 1) (#50)
    by lilburro on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 09:09:41 PM EST
    It's that mandatory... (5.00 / 2) (#62)
    by unitron on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 09:49:26 PM EST
    ...Republican willing suspension of sanity they all indulge in these days.

    Parent
    Every time the camera is on her (5.00 / 1) (#51)
    by Towanda on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 09:09:46 PM EST
    (on MSNBC, anyway), M. Obama looks like she's crying -- even when Biden says somethig that has others cheering -- and like it's the same shot, over and over, and she hasn't moved a whit.  

    Weird.  

    Parent

    I'm glad she looks cheerier now! (none / 0) (#53)
    by lilburro on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 09:12:13 PM EST
    I chalked it up to Biden's personal tone and what seems to be a real connection between the two families.

    Parent
    joe biden (5.00 / 2) (#46)
    by CST on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 08:56:12 PM EST
    Osama Bin Laden is dead and General Motors is alive.  Bam!  Also sticking it to the GOP.  

    You could hear a pin drop right now. (none / 0) (#48)
    by nycstray on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 09:07:30 PM EST
    I mean that in a very good way! n/t (none / 0) (#49)
    by nycstray on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 09:08:34 PM EST
    gosh that speech was so sweet. (none / 0) (#52)
    by lilburro on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 09:11:00 PM EST
    Of course he used that line (none / 0) (#142)
    by jbindc on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 01:23:34 PM EST
    He's been using it for weeks now.

    It definitely plays well.

    Parent

    A good line is usually worth (5.00 / 2) (#148)
    by brodie on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 02:06:30 PM EST
    repeating especially in an election campaign.  I hope they keep repeating it over the next 8 weeks.

    Plus it's accurate and it stings.

    Parent

    ive been relatively politics free (5.00 / 1) (#149)
    by CST on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 02:09:44 PM EST
    For weeks now.  I imagine a lot of people are like that till the conventions.  Of course it plays well.  It's also true.

    Parent
    Sure (none / 0) (#154)
    by jbindc on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 02:52:40 PM EST
    By letting them go bankrupt - a managed bankruptcy.

    Trust me, I'm as pleased as punch, but we won't really know the effects for 10 or 15 years, according to most experts.  But for now, some of the bloodletting has stopped.

    Parent

    Obama's speech strikes me as (5.00 / 2) (#60)
    by shoephone on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 09:45:11 PM EST
    a State of the Union speech. Nothing new in it either. Yeah, I'm in the minority. Flame away. I'm so disloyal!

    I agree with you (5.00 / 6) (#63)
    by lilburro on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 09:50:48 PM EST
    but I think that is the point - to outline the plan in a way the GOP did not.  It isn't soaring (yet, anyway) but I think not everyone is as familiar with the platform as TLers are.  This is him doing the I'm the Responsible Incumbent thing.  imo anyway.

    Parent
    Oh, I'm sure it will get the votes (5.00 / 1) (#64)
    by shoephone on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 09:52:51 PM EST
    It's a wonderful, soaring speech. It's just that I remember his past speeches, and past promises. I'm very, very jaded.

    Parent
    I'm not do sure it will get the votes.... (5.00 / 2) (#66)
    by samsguy18 on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 09:59:40 PM EST
    I heard this all before......Actually I am getting very annoyed....we need more plans less soaring rhetoric

    Parent
    It's a much stronger speech (5.00 / 1) (#68)
    by shoephone on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 10:03:52 PM EST
    than Romney's (which was vacuous garbage). But lilburro's right about something: we're more informed than the usual voters. This speech is for the low-info couch potato crowd. It will get him votes.

    I just can't stand the warmed-over lines we've heard again and again. In the end, it's all pablum for the masses.

    Parent

    What evaluation would you assign (5.00 / 1) (#122)
    by christinep on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 10:35:05 AM EST
    Romney's speech, then, samsguy 18?  For comparison purposes?

    Parent
    I don't think you are disloyal (5.00 / 1) (#96)
    by Militarytracy on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 05:57:29 AM EST
    And I don't think you are jaded in an irrational way.  You have many rational reasons to be jaded right now.

    I'm fully onboard because of the Republican war on women.  I can't control my visceral gut response to that, and I'm not sure I want to.  It's about survival and my daughter and granddaughters.  Also, I want Afghanistan wound up in 2014.  He is making all those military moves, you can see them, and he doubled down and promised tonight. That just affects my life too directly for me to not get excited about that.

    I do not discount your right or even reasons to be experiencing an enthusiasm gap right now, and you may go joylessly to the voting booth.  I just want you to go.

    Parent

    It was not a soaring speech (5.00 / 2) (#77)
    by Politalkix on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 10:13:49 PM EST
    it was a very resolute speech.

    Parent
    I liked his emphasis on the concept of citizenship (5.00 / 5) (#81)
    by DFLer on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 10:36:54 PM EST
    I am so sick of people talking about government as other. We ARE the government.

    Parent
    Yes. Amen. (5.00 / 2) (#85)
    by lilburro on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 10:46:27 PM EST
    And my favorite line - "Yes, our path is harder - but it leads to a better place."

    Parent
    Ha! It got there. (none / 0) (#70)
    by lilburro on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 10:06:13 PM EST
    And a hell of a song to go out on.

    Parent
    My TV's sound sux (none / 0) (#72)
    by shoephone on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 10:07:52 PM EST
    What's the song? Kinda sounds like the Boss.

    Parent
    Springsteen (none / 0) (#74)
    by lilburro on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 10:09:29 PM EST
    "We Take Care of Our Own" a new song I think.

    Parent
    Thx. I thought it was him. (none / 0) (#75)
    by shoephone on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 10:11:48 PM EST
    It's the opening track to ... (none / 0) (#79)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 10:33:43 PM EST
    ... his latest albu-- uh, excuse me, I mean, "CD" -- "Wrecking Ball." The Boss seems to be listening to a lot of Woody Guthrie and Pete Seeger of late.

    Parent
    Donald, don't you mean MP3?? (none / 0) (#83)
    by shoephone on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 10:44:17 PM EST
    Kidding. We're gettin' old.

    Actually, Springsteen's been linstening to Woody a long time... he's on the 1988 Folkways tribute to Woody and Leadbelly, singing, "I Ain't Got No Home." It's always been my favorite song on that rec...I mean CD.

    Parent

    hey..kids these days are into vinyl (5.00 / 1) (#84)
    by DFLer on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 10:45:50 PM EST
    He did an album of Seeger covers (none / 0) (#93)
    by ruffian on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 05:46:25 AM EST
    a few years back - 'We Shall Overcome - The Seeger Sessions'.  His voice and style on acoustic guitar are so perfect for those songs, I think he would have had to record them even if he didn't like them! But he obviously has an affinity for that music.

    Here is Erie Canal live in Belfast, one of my favorite tunes.

    Parent

    The (5.00 / 1) (#98)
    by lentinel on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 07:13:51 AM EST
    French edition of the Huffington Post summed it up well, I thought.

    Obama n'a rien dit mais il l'a bien dit.

    Translation; Obama didn't say anything, but he said it very well.

    Parent

    Couldn't find anyone saying (5.00 / 2) (#110)
    by brodie on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 08:35:20 AM EST
    precisely those words at the article linked at HPFr, and it looks like a headline writer's synthesis of this quote, a tweet

    Certes, le Président n'a rien dit dans son discours ce soir, mais il l'a fait bien mieux que Romney à Tampa."

    from one Joe Scarborough.

    Parent

    I think you can hear (5.00 / 2) (#61)
    by lilburro on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 09:47:34 PM EST
    a lot of thus far repressed anger at the GOP coming out in these speeches.  I like it.

    I have to say, I love his use of the feminine (5.00 / 4) (#65)
    by caseyOR on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 09:55:33 PM EST
    pronouns throughout this speech.  Sure, it may well be cynical politics at work. It may be a ploy to get women on board. I don't care. Talking about what the future for women and girls could and should be in this country can never be a bad thing IMO.

    A professor of mine (none / 0) (#73)
    by lilburro on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 10:08:41 PM EST
    in school used to use the feminine pronoun in otherwise gender neutral situations.  I like it when people do that, too.  It subtly underlines how often male dominated our discourse tends to be.

    Parent
    It may be cynical politics at work, (none / 0) (#78)
    by nycstray on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 10:20:40 PM EST
    but d@mn if my ears don't perk up at the mention.

    And quite frankly, if I were an indy, I might just pay attention to that, knowing me :)

    Parent

    He did what he needed to do (5.00 / 6) (#67)
    by Jeralyn on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 10:03:34 PM EST
    it was a really good speech -- and very moving.

    agreed re did what he had to (none / 0) (#69)
    by DFLer on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 10:05:22 PM EST
    and moving o me in the sense that he came off as genuine in his emotions, passions etc

    Parent
    now we got Springsteen (5.00 / 1) (#71)
    by womanwarrior on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 10:07:44 PM EST
    Well, good ending.  We don't leave anyone behind.  Those of us who are somewhat disillusioned still have to go with the positive, and not with the screw you people.  

    buzz kill Cardinal Dolan ends with a blessing (5.00 / 1) (#76)
    by DFLer on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 10:12:38 PM EST


    Now, now! (none / 0) (#82)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 10:40:17 PM EST
    It's a face-safing gesture for the gold-robed man in the ruby slippers, after all the serious criticism he took from Catholics like me -- and lots of others, as well -- for giving the benediction at the GOP convention last week. It wasn't exactly the type of benediction I wanted to hear either, but I can live with it.

    Parent
    My two favorite parts tonight (5.00 / 1) (#80)
    by CoralGables on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 10:35:13 PM EST
    obviously Biden and Obama had some great moments but I'm going to grab from earlier in the night.

    Gabby Giffords

    Jennifer Granholm

    Someone needs to explain to me how (5.00 / 4) (#97)
    by Anne on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 06:52:28 AM EST
    we are going to cut $4 trillion from the deficit and not end up with cuts to the safety net.  How is that level of cutting going to enable us to have any meaningful public investment?  And when the government is forced to stop spending, how is that not going to further hamstring the economy? It isn't spending that is holding the economy back, or keeping unemployment high - by all accounts it's what's keeping the economy's head above water, so why would we want to take a $4 trillion life preserver away from it now?

    Austerity does not work, so why is Obama so determined to go there?


    Dunno (5.00 / 4) (#99)
    by lentinel on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 07:19:48 AM EST
    Austerity does not work, so why is Obama so determined to go there?

    I think he's really stuck in the republican way of doing things.

    Clinton got the deficit under control by raising taxes - some of them retroactively as I recall.

    Who's going to say that in public?

    Parent

    We aren't going to (none / 0) (#140)
    by jbindc on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 01:17:59 PM EST
    It's all smoke and mirrors:

    President Obama repeated a claim made by former President Bill Clinton the night before, but even less accurately. Clinton referred to a "plan of $4 trillion in debt reduction over a decade." Obama leaves off the time line, and makes it sound like the current $1 trillion deficit would be eliminated, resulting in a surplus.

    But, while the numbers seem large, the results are unimpressive. At the end of the 10-year budget window, Obama would have the national debt at a 76.5 percent of gross domestic product. That actually would be an increase over the 74.2 percent of GDP in this year. In contrast, the debt reduction plan envisioned by the Simpson-Bowles commission -- cited by the president -- would reduce the debt-to-GDP ratio close to 60 percent.

    Moreover, independent analysts have criticized the administration for claiming some $800 billion in phantom savings from winding down the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan, even though the administration had long made clear those wars would end. (The Bush administration had started the wars on borrowed funds.) Then, the president proposes to spend a good chunk of the nonexistent money on other spending -- as he put it in his speech, "rebuilding roads and bridges; schools and runways."

    The $1 trillion in savings negotiated with Republicans, mentioned by the president, actually accounts for the bulk of his proposed reduction in spending. Indeed, much of the president's debt reduction would come from tax increases on the wealthy, not spending cuts.

    They put it better when Bill Clinton said it:

    The repeated claim that Obama's budget reduces the deficit by $4 trillion is simply not accurate.

    By the administration's math, you have nearly $3.8 trillion in spending cuts, compared to $1.5 trillion in tax increases (letting the Bush tax cuts expire for high-income Americans). Presto, $1 of tax increases for every $2.50 of spending cuts.

    But virtually no serious budget analyst agreed with this accounting. The $4 trillion figure, for instance, includes counting some $1 trillion in cuts reached a year ago in budget negotiations with Congress. So no matter who is the president, the savings are already in the bank.

    Moreover, the administration is also counting $848 billion in phantom savings from winding down the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan, even though the administration had long made clear those wars would end.

    In other words, by projecting war spending far in the future, the administration is able to claim credit for saving money it never intended to spend. (Imagine taking credit for saving money on buying a new car every year, even though you intended to keep your car for 10 years.)

    Rather than good arithmetic, independent budget analysts called the maneuver "a major budget gimmick."

    The administration also counts $800 billion in savings in debt payments (from lower deficits) as a "spending cut," which is a dubious claim. We didn't realize that debt payments were now considered a government program.

    There are a number of other games being played, so fake money is being used to pay for real spending projects. In effect, most of Obama's claimed deficit reduction comes from his proposed tax increases.



    Parent
    Once again, you're missing the point. (4.00 / 4) (#144)
    by Anne on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 01:40:58 PM EST
    It isn't about checking the president's math, it's about him having a raging, dogged case of deficit fever, and what happens when already-in-the-pipeline trigger cuts go into effect and additional spending cuts are made on top of that.

    With absolutely no guarantee that the proposed lapse of Bush tax rates for the +250K crowd will ever come to pass, which will immediately lock the cross-hairs onto the safety net programs.

    Ending or reducing the deficit is NOT a magic prescription for a better, growing economy; budget surpluses mean that the government is spending less than it is taking in, but it doesn't mean that the things it used to spend money on don't still need help or that they aren't issues anymore.  Will a budget surplus mean that we will have full employment?  No.  Will it mean that no one will need Medicaid or WIC?  No.  Will it mean that our infrastructure has been modernized?  No.

    You just really aren't getting it.

    Parent

    Despite (5.00 / 1) (#163)
    by jbindc on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 03:31:44 PM EST
    Your smart a$$ answer - you still are wrong.

    It's EXACTLY the point.

    He's spewing forth bold faced lies about "cutting the deficit" and in doing so, he's getting smart people, like many here, to actually defend this crap (or sputter things like "But..but...the other guys is worse!") and actually think he has a workable plan.  It isn't about whether it will work or not - this was all about getting re-elected.  It has nothing to do with actual policy, because the only policies that will get enacted in either a second Obama term or a first Romney term are ones that are going to benefit the incumbents and their friends.  It isn't about you or me or us, and why you keep thinking it is charming, but naive.

    Swooning Democrats falling all over themselves for campaign lies is sad.

    YOU aren't getting it.

    Parent

    He may be using fuzzy math, but he most (5.00 / 3) (#169)
    by Anne on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 03:53:53 PM EST
    certainly is not blowing smoke about cutting the deficit; I can't believe that with all the research you do you've missed what people within the administration are saying is on Obama's agenda for a second term.

    Cutting the deficit is not a campaign slogan for the president who put Alan Simpson and Erskine Bowles on a special commission that made recommendations he is committed to implementing - people who are paying attention get that, but you must be so busy playing tit-for-tat that you missed it.

    I'm well aware that those who benefit from the president's fiscal and economic policy will not be the average person, or the below-average person; the economy in general is not going to benefit from it - which is the point.  Austerity doesn't work under these conditions.

    Parent

    Not for nothing (none / 0) (#166)
    by vicndabx on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 03:42:25 PM EST
    but I found the mild irony of you dissing folks saying

    he's getting smart people.....{to} sputter things like "But..but...the other guys is worse!"

    kinda funny.

    I know it's a typo, but it's a funny typo

    Parent

    jbindc's "missing the point"? (3.67 / 3) (#155)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 02:53:10 PM EST
    Wow. Imagine that.

    But I bet Sister Andrea Mitchell over at Our Lady of False Equivalency would heartily approve this deficit riff, as would undoubtedly all the Very Serious Persons who reside inside the Beltway.

    And it's not only the social safety net that's imperiled by such austerity measures. We're losing lots of teachers and public safety employees as a result of all this hyperventilating kabuki over the deficit, which is really hurting municipal governments.

    Parent

    Obama said the country could cut oil imports in (5.00 / 1) (#117)
    by ding7777 on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 09:44:41 AM EST
    in half by 2020.  Why?

    U.S. Was Net Oil-Product Exporter for First Time Since 1949

    Shipments abroad of petroleum products exceeded imports by 439,000 barrels a day, the department said today in the Petroleum Supply Monthly report


    I don't know about anyone else, but (5.00 / 1) (#127)
    by Anne on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 11:07:51 AM EST
    I've been wondering if we need to put out an APB on BTD; haven't seen hide nor hair of him in days...had been looking forward to some posting from Charlotte.

    Maybe I can bring him out of hiding with this, from naked capitalism:
    We're Not Broke and the Clinton Surpluses Destroyed the US Economy

    Two of our nation's most influential progressive journalists -- Slate's Matt Yglesias and Business Insider's Joe Weisenthal --  just took on two powerful economic myths.

    1. The Myth that The US Government is Out of Money

    2. The Myth that A Government Surplus is  a Sign of Fiscal Responsibility

    It's hard to imagine a more empowering message.  As word spreads, elected officials in both parties will lose their primary excuse for inaction on on a whole range of neglected and underfunded programs.  "I'd love to help, but I'm all tapped out," simply won't sell.

    Nor will the desperate calls for "shared sacrifice" and "entitlement reform" in the name of fiscal responsibility.

    A very big thank you to these men, who will undoubtedly suffer the slings and arrows of many of their progressive followers, who have long considered the Clinton surpluses the crowning achievement of modern Democratic governance.

    or this, from Matt Stoller, posting at naked capitalism:

    DNC Convention Slogan: "Give Me More Time"

    The Democratic National Convention's message was simple: "Give Me More Time". Every great speech, or bad speech for that matter, had at its core the argument that George W. Bush wrecked the economy, and slowly but surely, Barack Obama is repairing it. You might not feel it, but as Democratic partisan Paul Krugman notes, "there's a pretty good case that the stage has been set for a much stronger recovery over the next few years."

    What is striking about the two conventions, and the commentary around it, is there is very little discussion of what Obama's policies have actually been. Obama, through various programs centering on the Wall Street bailout, basically reinflated financial assets owned by the wealthy while foreclosing on everyone else. The data shows the result - inequality has gotten worse, faster, under Obama, than it did under Bush. There are new jobs, but they are sparse, and low-paying. Corporations are beginning to recognize that the end of the middle class is a permanent condition, and shifting their marketing to a "barbell" model, selling products to the high and low end. And today, while people are focusing on a poor jobs report, negotiations for the large and secretive Trans-Pacific Partnership, the so-called NAFTA on steroids, are going on in Virginia.

    The reason there has been no discussion of this real agenda is because Romney agrees with it, as does most of the elite political class. The new shape of the American experiment is taking place.

    [Come out, come out, wherever you are...]

    I think we're more likely to hear his take (5.00 / 1) (#134)
    by CoralGables on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 11:59:04 AM EST
    on The Florida State-Savannah State game tomorrow. It's a point spread that I'm sure is having him studying all day.

    Parent
    How about he discusses...? (none / 0) (#143)
    by jbindc on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 01:27:47 PM EST
    US only added 96,000 jobs in August.  Unemployment drops slightly to 8.1%.

    U.S. job creation grew at a distressingly slow pace in August, as employers added just 96,000 positions and more discouraged people stopped looking for work, the Labor Department reported Friday.

    Despite the weak growth, the unemployment rate dipped from 8.3 to 8.1 percent. But even that was bad news. The jobless rate shrank only because more than 300,000 workers dropped out of the labor force in August, following a trend that has accelerated with the nation's economic problems. The Labor Department counts only those who are actively seeking a job as unemployed.

    The report also said that 41,000 fewer jobs were created in July and June than first estimated. The revisions mean that employers have added just 139,000 jobs a month since the beginning of the year, below last year's average of 153,000.



    Parent
    Posts that are always anti-Obama ... (none / 0) (#171)
    by magster on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 03:56:08 PM EST
    .. no matter how compelling whatever defense of Obama or critique of Romney BTD makes, probably explain BTDs absence.

    Parent
    He's been on the radio in Charlotte n/t (none / 0) (#172)
    by lilburro on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 04:03:30 PM EST
    A more balanced (none / 0) (#170)
    by vicndabx on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 03:55:58 PM EST
    view on Modern Monetary Theory via Jared Bernstein

    And while Modern Monetary Theory's proponents take Keynes as their starting point and advocate aggressive deficit spending during recessions, they're not that type of Keynesians. Even mainstream economists who argue for more deficit spending are reluctant to accept the central tenets of Modern Monetary Theory. Take Krugman, who regularly engages economists across the spectrum in spirited debate. He has argued that pursuing large budget deficits during boom times can lead to hyperinflation. Mankiw concedes the theory's point that the government can never run out of money but doesn't think this means what its proponents think it does.

    Technically it's true, he says, that the government could print streams of money and never default. The risk is that it could trigger a very high rate of inflation. This would "bankrupt much of the banking system," he says. "Default, painful as it would be, might be a better option."



    Parent
    You can (none / 0) (#2)
    by Ga6thDem on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 07:05:36 PM EST
    also watch on DNC streaming which is what I did last night. It was nice to not have any pundits talking.

    Why is Eva Longoria speaking? (none / 0) (#3)
    by shoephone on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 07:16:21 PM EST
    The conventions are so silly.

    Because (5.00 / 4) (#5)
    by Zorba on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 07:25:16 PM EST
    Um, because she's cuter than Clint Eastwood, and a Democrat?  And not senile?   ;-)
    Yes, conventions are silly.  They're theater, meant to energize the base.

    Parent
    She's also (5.00 / 3) (#9)
    by CoralGables on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 07:35:04 PM EST
    one of the co-chairs of the Obama re-election campaign.

    Parent
    She's still cuter (5.00 / 2) (#35)
    by Zorba on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 08:25:54 PM EST
    than Grandpa Eastwood.   ;-)

    Parent
    See my comment #4. (5.00 / 2) (#6)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 07:28:12 PM EST
    Eva Longoria is an active advocate for the Hispanic American community.

    Parent
    OK, that makes sense. (none / 0) (#24)
    by shoephone on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 07:59:59 PM EST
    because she has worked hard enough for (5.00 / 3) (#10)
    by Jeralyn on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 07:39:25 PM EST
    Democrats and Obama to earn her slot. And she's smart and a terrific speaker.

    Parent
    I know..... (none / 0) (#136)
    by coigue on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 12:10:34 PM EST
    but she actually made some good points and emphasized her own rags to riches story

    Parent
    The Foo Fighters (none / 0) (#7)
    by Militarytracy on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 07:29:27 PM EST
    Fighting all the Foo out there for Obama, but Rage Against the Machine stopped answering their phone for awhile.

    John Kerry looks ... different (none / 0) (#22)
    by brodie on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 07:57:01 PM EST
    Maybe just some age kicking in.

    But he still has that hard to shake resemblance to the guy on the $20 bill.

    Jennifer Granholm -- what a feisty speech by a still very attractive woman.  Married however...

    he looks better now (none / 0) (#23)
    by Jeralyn on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 07:58:37 PM EST
    than he did in 2008. Here's a closeup I took of him at the 2008 convention.

    Parent
    Actually I like that picture better than how he (none / 0) (#26)
    by ruffian on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 08:03:29 PM EST
    Looks now!

    Parent
    Not sure if either (5.00 / 1) (#30)
    by brodie on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 08:12:38 PM EST
    look is that flattering, then or now.

    Except for the hair -- still a full head of it withworld class styling.  And how does he manage to get dark hair below with a dusting of gray on top?  

    Parent

    Yeah, less craggy (none / 0) (#25)
    by ruffian on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 08:02:45 PM EST
    It was a little distracting to me.

    Parent
    What is the name of the song that was playing (none / 0) (#55)
    by caseyOR on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 09:25:21 PM EST
    when Obama walked onto the stage?

    U2 (none / 0) (#56)
    by Democratic Cat on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 09:28:00 PM EST
    City of Blinding Lights.

    Parent
    music (5.00 / 1) (#90)
    by Amiss on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 02:12:50 AM EST
    Never noticedd much before but it appears that maany more lyrics are available for use by Democrats than Republicans. Was it last week that Dee Snyder stopped Paul Ryan from using his song. And Dee really is good about letting most people use them,

    Parent
    Have I ever (5.00 / 1) (#91)
    by Amiss on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 02:20:38 AM EST
    Menttioned that I hate auto correct?

    Parent
    Thanks. n/t (none / 0) (#57)
    by caseyOR on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 09:33:30 PM EST
    Aha. Foreigners' music, huh? (none / 0) (#58)
    by Towanda on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 09:35:48 PM EST
    What's wrong with American musicians?  Well, other than those with lyrics like "99 Problems and the You-Know-What Ain't One."

    Parent
    Hey! U2 is Irish, not foreign ;0) (5.00 / 1) (#59)
    by DFLer on Thu Sep 06, 2012 at 09:40:39 PM EST
    99 Problems... (none / 0) (#113)
    by kdog on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 09:02:56 AM EST
    has some poignant politically conscious lyrics....

    The year is ninety-four, in my trunk is raw

    In my rear view mirror is the motherf*ckin' law

    Got two choices y'all, pull over the car or

    Bounce on the Devil, put the pedal to the floor

    And I ain't tryin' to see no highway chase with Jake

    Plus I got a few dollars, I can fight the case

    So I pull over to the side of the road

    "Son do you know why I'm stoppin' you for?"

    'Cause I'm young and I'm black and my hat's real low

    Do I look like a mind reader sir? I don't know

    Am I under arrest or should I guess some mo'?

    "Well you was doin fifty-five in the fifty-four

    License and registration and step out of the car

    Are you carryin' a weapon on you? I know a lot of you are"

    I ain't steppin' out of sh*t, all my papers legit

    "Well do you mind if I look around the car a little bit?"

    Well my glove compartment is locked, so is the trunk in the back

    And I know my rights, so you gon' need a warrant for that

    "Aren't you sharp as a tack, what are you a
    lawyer or somethin', somebody important or somethin'"

    Child I ain't passed the bar, but I know a little bit

    Enough that you won't illegally search my sh*t

    "Well we'll see how smart you are when the canine comes"

    I got 99 problems, but a b*tch ain't one, hit me

    This country got 99 problems, but a lack of great artists ain't one...hit me!

    Parent

    "What are we cheering for? " (none / 0) (#106)
    by Mr Natural on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 08:01:54 AM EST
    Inequality increases faster during recessions (5.00 / 1) (#114)
    by jtaylorr on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 09:07:48 AM EST
    When did George Bush ever talk about inequality? He was blessed with a strong economy given to him by Clinton which kept that middle class quiet until it all went to carp in 08.
    Obama on the other hand, has made it the centerpiece of his campaign. Whether or not he's serious about tackling the systemic problems (and looking at the past four years, it's doubtful), at least he's out there talking about it.

    Parent
    Cheering for the... (none / 0) (#109)
    by kdog on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 08:33:12 AM EST
    political demise of Willard, a few extra scraps, and th-th-th-that's all folks!

    Parent
    The GOP probably told more ... (none / 0) (#111)
    by Robot Porter on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 08:41:25 AM EST
    "lies" at their convention.  But I found the Dems to be more disingenuous.

    The GOP supported a lot of their claims with evidence that was problematic to incorrect.

    The Dems did some of that too.

    But the more damaging thing they did was claiming to support things that they just haven't been supporting.

    Which is worse? Six to one and pick 'em.

    Parent

    If I wasn't so aware of this (5.00 / 4) (#121)
    by sj on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 10:30:58 AM EST
    ...claiming to support things that they just haven't been supporting.
    I'd be all fired up.  I'm so, so tired of being sad.

    Parent
    Joe Scarborough on the Two Conventions (none / 0) (#112)
    by ScottW714 on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 09:00:46 AM EST
    Oh good lord, if we are going pound for pound round for round, this wasn't Ali verses Frazier, this was Mohammad Ali verses Chuck Wepner.

    ...where you had a republican convention that was trying to figure out how to love Mitt Romney.  It really was problematic for the convention that just wasn't excited about their nominee.  You felt that in Tampa and here in Charlotte you certainly felt the love for their nominee.


    This was his Tweet (5.00 / 2) (#115)
    by CoralGables on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 09:10:45 AM EST
    immediately after the Obama speech last night:

    Joe Scarborough @JoeNBC
    Game. Set. Match. Democrats crush Republicans in convention wars.

    Parent

    No question.... (5.00 / 1) (#116)
    by kdog on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 09:20:03 AM EST
    if not for the god/Jerusalem horrorshow, it would have been a flawless Brand D "Ron Popeil". Made Brand R's  "Ron Popeil" look like amatuer hour.

    Parent
    The Haircut Helmet ? (none / 0) (#119)
    by ScottW714 on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 10:29:44 AM EST
    The godfather... (none / 0) (#125)
    by kdog on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 11:02:32 AM EST
    of the infomercial..."But wait, there's more!"

    Ya think you're buying the greatest thing since sliced bread, than ya get a plastic chinese p.o.s. and ya got rheemed on the shipping and handling;)

    Parent

    That What I Gewtting At (none / 0) (#128)
    by ScottW714 on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 11:08:51 AM EST
    ...an amateur RP would be hocking the haircut helmet at 2am, while the real deal is selling the thing that slices, dices, and cooks it for you...

    Parent
    Hmm, bad analogy (none / 0) (#118)
    by brodie on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 09:49:41 AM EST
    Wepner -- allegedly the inspiration for "Rocky" -- was liked by many in the crowd, being the Everyguy and heavy underdog, and through about nine rounds he seemed to be doing well before Ali woke up and finally dispatched him.

    But in the conventions battle, this was clear advantage Dems from the opening day and each day thereafter.

    More like Ali vs Floyd Patterson -- as I recall it -- a no doubt about it thumping, round after round, of a recent well respected former champion.

    Parent

    Inspiration, Get a Life (none / 0) (#123)
    by ScottW714 on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 10:50:19 AM EST
    The only person who thought Chuck Wepner was the inspiration for Rocky Balboa was.... drum roll... Chuck Wepner.  And apparently Brodie.

    I thought the analogy was spot on; beyond getting his A handed to him by Ail, he was convicted of forgery, namely Ali's autograph like 10,000 times.  And I am pretty sure even Scarborough is a little deeper than Wepner's fantasy of inspiring anything.

    Google Thomas Rocco Barbella, a more likely candidate.

    Parent

    Maybe the only person (none / 0) (#131)
    by brodie on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 11:18:31 AM EST
    who could read my post and conclude I was a firm believer in the Wepner-Rocky link is one ScottW714.  Did you miss my using the word "allegedly"?  I didn't think I needed to spell it out further since it was a side issue descriptive for those here not familiar with his name, a controversy anyone could easily read about at wiki if they wanted more info.

    And you're well into other irrelevant aspects of CW's life with the forgery stuff.  Clearly Joe Sca was talking activity in the ring, where as I said, which you avoid disputing with your tangent, the Chuckster wad actually holding his own with Ali well into the fight.  Such was not the case in the convention battle, the point of my post.  Poor analogy by the Scarman.

    Parent

    You Wote It Because You Don't Believe It... (none / 0) (#133)
    by ScottW714 on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 11:54:59 AM EST
    ....I see

    Parent
    Again (sigh) it was only used (none / 0) (#137)
    by brodie on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 12:32:33 PM EST
    as a brief descriptive or identifier for those not familiar with the name.  Little did I know I would get a trollish response about it from someone determined to score points on the most irrelevant side issues.

    Parent
    How Many Points Did I Score ? (none / 0) (#151)
    by ScottW714 on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 02:29:08 PM EST
    Yeah, the the lunatic in the park is 'allegedly' the King of the Park because he said he was.

    Man, you should working politics for the media, they like printing stuff people say that is wildly untrue too, allegedly.

    Parent

    But Wepner did somehow manage to ... (none / 0) (#145)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 01:41:00 PM EST
    ... score a surprising knockdown of Ali in the 9th round -- I believe he only the second fighter to accomplish that feat at that point in The Greatest's career -- and then withstood a pretty vicious pummeling until 20 seconds to go in the 15th round, when he was finally knocked out.

    That's a helluva thing to be the highlight of your life, though -- taking a brutal beating like that, and still nearly going the distance with the champ. And as you noted, it was all downhill for Wepner from there.

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    Well going from memory only (none / 0) (#150)
    by brodie on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 02:20:27 PM EST
    Ali was knocked down at least once in the period bef he first became champion, once by Frazier in their first fight and -- guessing here -- might have been knocked down once during the many fights he had from 1964-7 as champ, but I couldn't tell you by whom.  

    And in the Wepner fight Ali later claimed it wasn't an actual knockdown but instead that the Chuckster stepped on his foot.  That's how I saw it too.

    So maybe three legit knockdowns pre Wepner.

    Not a knockdown if memory serves, but in one of their three brutal fights, Ken Norton broke Ali's jaw.

    Parent

    Wepner hit Ali with a body blow. (none / 0) (#159)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 03:18:35 PM EST
    He ducked a punch and then hit Ali square in the ribs with his right, and Ali flinched and fell completely backwards, feet up in the air. Further, it's pretty clear from the video of the ninth round that Ali had been rocked by that blow and was hurt. At least in my own opinion, there's no question that the "Bayonne Bleeder" knocked Ali down, fair and square.

    Anyway, watch the video and see for yourself.

    A then-unknown Ken Norton broke Ali's jaw in the first round of their first of their three fights, a 12-rounder, which Norton won by decision. Ali was never knocked down, and it's testament to his endurance in the ring that he even finished the fight still standing.

    I used to be a big fan of boxing back when I was a teenager, but not so any more. In fact, knowing what we know now about the brutality of the sport and the long-term damage it can cause its participants (one look at a modern-day, Parkinson's-riddled Muhammad Ali would more than suffice), it would not surprise me if sometime in the future it was eventually banned.

    Parent

    as a non-partisan (none / 0) (#162)
    by CoralGables on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 03:28:55 PM EST
    in this discussion, I would say this video proves nothing one way or the other.

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    Look at the way Ali fell. (none / 0) (#174)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 04:11:55 PM EST
    Ali enjoyed a well-earned and justified reputation as both a prizefighter and self-promoter. He was never the type of guy to willingly admit in public that his opponent had hurt him during a fight.

    So while it doesn't surprise me that he'd have claimed afterward that the primary reason he fell was that Chuck Wepner stepped on his toe, the evidence doesn't support that contention. He wasn't tripped. He fell because he had been rocked -- hard.

    There's one photo of Wepner advancing on Ali in the 9th round after the punch, which shows him with his left foot on top of Ali's right foot -- but as you can see, that photo was clearly snapped after that punch from Wepner had been thrown, and Ali is already reeling backwards from the blow.

    Parent

    Last para we agree on (none / 0) (#176)
    by brodie on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 05:40:49 PM EST
    Having woken up to the sport's cruel brutality, after having watched it during Ali's reign, I am no longer interested and wouldn't mind if it's banned -- so count me with you and Howard Cosell.

    Nikola Tesla, one of my heroes, had a weak spot for the sport.  But then besides being a genius, he was an odd duck, and considered people to be no more than "meat machines.". Wouldn't even shake hands with them.

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    I have to admit I fell asleep near the end (none / 0) (#120)
    by ruffian on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 10:30:12 AM EST
    of Biden's speech...only woke up for Obama because my sister bu**-dialed me on her cell phone...

    I did like most of Biden's speech, though it went on about 10 minutes too long according to my biological clock. I hate the word 'authentic', but he is it. I don't necessarily want him to be president, but he is a lot more than just a gaffe machine. Charlie Pierce says it best as usual.

    Whenever I see him deliver (5.00 / 1) (#132)
    by brodie on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 11:35:41 AM EST
    a stemwinder, I think of what a great, and probably successful, nominee he could have been in 1988, but for that stumble lifting others' speech material.  

    No Q he would have been our best candidate and, unlike MikeyD, wouldn't have stood passively as Poppy-Atwater kicked him in the shins:  they would have gotten a knockdown blow to the jaw in return.

    But I think his time has about passed.  If Hillary wants it, Joe won't be able to stop her.

    Parent

    ... but I have to admit that he's been a good vice president -- and Heaven forbid, were anything to ever happen to President Obama, I think we'd probably wind up being greatful that he was the guy who stepped into the breach. He strikes me as the type of person who would keep his cool while those around were losing theirs.

    Parent
    Well it's not too farfetched to envision (none / 0) (#153)
    by brodie on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 02:35:32 PM EST
    a blue collar Irish Catholic Joe losing his cool.  But I'd imagine he'd have a level-headed Dr Jill around to remind him to calm down and take a deep breath.

    What I'd like about a Pres Joe, in the event, is that he's already well steeped in the issues and has significant FP experience.  So going into a crisis he'd already be well ahead of the curve compared to most presidents in that position and wouldnt need last minute tutoring on what and what not to do.

    Parent

    Yup. Make no mistake - (5.00 / 1) (#177)
    by ruffian on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 05:45:23 PM EST
    I'd rather have Joe than anyone I saw in Tampa!

    Parent
    Curious Romney approach (none / 0) (#124)
    by CoralGables on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 10:55:48 AM EST
    It's only the start of September and the Romney campaign has pulled its advertising dollars out of Pennsylvania, Wisconsin, and Michigan.

    Even with a huge money advantage Romney has settled on an 8 state strategy for September. If you live in one of these 8, your state is about to get a lot of ad money and also more Romney than you ever wanted. It's going to be an 8 state carpet bomb attack.

    Colorado (9)
    Florida (29)
    Iowa (6)
    Nevada (6)
    New Hampshire (4)
    North Carolina (15)
    Ohio (18)
    Virginia (13)

    100 total electoral votes. Romney needs at least 79 of those to come out ahead with this strategy.

    happy to hear that they're pulling ad dollars (none / 0) (#138)
    by DFLer on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 12:47:38 PM EST
    out of Wisconsin. Living on the border, we get inundated here.

    However, will the superpac ads pull from here? Now that I think of it, that's what I've seen, mostly. perhaps that expenditures allows the official campaign to cut down.


    Parent

    Kos just posted that he's dialed down OH too (none / 0) (#168)
    by magster on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 03:52:16 PM EST
    Which makes no sense at all. But he did. So WTH?

    Parent
    Are the big donors backing off already? (5.00 / 1) (#173)
    by Towanda on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 04:11:11 PM EST
    After that dud of a convention, with not much post-convention bounce, plus are they seeing some polls coming re the Dems' post-convention bounce?

    Or are some of the big donors actually now seeing that Romney's pick for VP ought to scare the bejeesus out of them and get them out?

    Nah . . . the big money is in it for the win.  This must be the result of hiring some new strategist, perhaps one who is factoring in the variable without precedent (so the polls matter not):  the states with new voter-suppression laws that have been upheld or have not yet been overturned?  I keep saying that is going to be a complicating factor, confounding the polls, as I can see in my state.

    Parent

    I am not a Biden fan either. (none / 0) (#135)
    by coigue on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 12:09:20 PM EST
    Does he really call his PhD wife 'kiddo'?

    I actually thought (5.00 / 5) (#139)
    by indy in sc on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 01:15:23 PM EST
    that was very endearing.

    Parent
    It makes me cringe. (none / 0) (#152)
    by coigue on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 02:31:57 PM EST
    It seems very patronizing to me.

    Parent
    I can see why you might feel that way (5.00 / 2) (#156)
    by sj on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 02:54:34 PM EST
    but I fall into the "endearing" camp.  There are all sorts of personal endearments.

    Parent
    I agree (5.00 / 2) (#158)
    by jbindc on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 02:56:21 PM EST
    Joe Biden calling his wife that is endearing.

    If he called Michelle Obama or any other man's wife that name, it might be a bit weird or awkward.

    Parent

    That is definitely a midwestern (5.00 / 1) (#178)
    by ruffian on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 05:47:58 PM EST
    term of endearment. My whole family uses it. Nothing cringe worthy if you are used to it - more likely to create warm feelings - you know he is being truly personal.

    Parent
    Never heard it when (none / 0) (#181)
    by coigue on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 06:25:15 PM EST
    I loved in Ohio, but that was only for 8 years in Columbus. Just personal taste.

    Honey, baby, sweetie....all seem better than kiddo. That's more for someone younger that you are mentoring, teaching, or raising.

    Again, just a personal preference.

    Parent

    Rather, when I lived in Ohio (none / 0) (#182)
    by coigue on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 06:26:06 PM EST
    How 'bout when you (none / 0) (#184)
    by brodie on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 06:33:07 PM EST
    "loked" in Ohio?  ;)

    Parent
    Loking is the practice of (none / 0) (#197)
    by coigue on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 08:29:14 PM EST
    turning over parked cars in the OSU hood when the Buckeyes lose....or win.

    I thought everyone knew that.

    Uber-Loking is when you set those cars on fire while eating buffalo wings.

    Parent

    I use "kiddo" all the time. ruffian's (none / 0) (#185)
    by caseyOR on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 06:43:09 PM EST
    right. It is a very midwestern term of endearment. My aunts used to call my cousins and my sibs and me "kiddo" all the time.

    Parent
    That's your aunt. (none / 0) (#186)
    by coigue on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 07:36:51 PM EST
    The older generation speaking to the younger. See the difference?


    Parent
    It seems more brother/sister than (5.00 / 1) (#187)
    by Anne on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 07:49:39 PM EST
    husband/wife, but that's just me.

    Parent
    All of us siblings call each other kiddo (5.00 / 1) (#188)
    by ruffian on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 08:02:53 PM EST
    Also use it for the actual kids, the nieces and nephews. And I specifically know one brother calls his wife kiddo. Probably the others do too.

    It is kind of an alternative to 'honey' when that is too schmaltzy.

    Parent

    we used it all the time (none / 0) (#193)
    by fishcamp on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 08:18:24 PM EST
    as a child in Portland.

    Parent
    Well....if you took geography in Illinois in (none / 0) (#189)
    by ruffian on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 08:07:25 PM EST
    the 70s you would have learned that Ohio is not in the Midwest. :-)  It is in the Mideast. That probably went out of vogue when the Middle East became more prominent in the needs.

    Or maybe is is a specifically Chicago thing and Biden got it from the Obamas.

    Parent

    Ha. News, not needs. (5.00 / 1) (#190)
    by ruffian on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 08:09:11 PM EST
    Anyway kiddo, have a good night!

    Parent
    Ohio thinks it's in the midwest (5.00 / 1) (#195)
    by coigue on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 08:22:46 PM EST
    now. I never even learned of a mid-east in the USA. It went from New England to Midwest to Great Plains to Rockies, to West, then the South.

    Parent
    Goodnight Homer. (none / 0) (#196)
    by coigue on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 08:23:17 PM EST
    Would you rather that he called her ... (none / 0) (#160)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 03:21:29 PM EST
    ... his "wench"? ;-P

    Parent
    yep (none / 0) (#161)
    by coigue on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 03:25:22 PM EST
    Or the more common... (none / 0) (#164)
    by kdog on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 03:36:02 PM EST
    endearment, my old lady;)

    Adressing ones lover/life partner/best friend by official title would be Guinness Book of World Records weird.  Actually, I could see Mitt Romney doing something like that;)

    Parent

    "My old lady"? (none / 0) (#167)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 03:43:23 PM EST
    How Jimi Hendrix and Alice's Restaurant!

    Parent
    'Twas funny to be someone's "old lady" (5.00 / 3) (#175)
    by Towanda on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 04:12:58 PM EST
    in the '60s.

    Say it to me now and prepare for a smackdown.  After all, I've got a lot more weight to do a smack down now.  And a bookbag that weighs a ton, too.

    Parent

    honey or dear (none / 0) (#192)
    by coigue on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 08:16:18 PM EST
    doesn't imply a grownup/kid kind of relationship as much.

    I don't know why, it bugs me. In fact many of his mannerisms bug me.

    Parent

    His blindingly white teeth bother me... (5.00 / 1) (#198)
    by Anne on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 08:32:54 PM EST
    every time I see them, I think about the Friends episode where Ross whitened his teeth to the point where they glowed in the dark.

    That and the leather pants episode are in the top 5 of my favorite Friends episodes...

    Parent

    Yes. It's very distracting. (none / 0) (#199)
    by coigue on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 08:36:51 PM EST
    lol.

    Parent
    If you like, (none / 0) (#194)
    by coigue on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 08:18:55 PM EST
    I'll write up a Coigue-approved list of endearment terms for different social situations.

    Parent
    Now I kind of wish he had (none / 0) (#179)
    by ruffian on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 05:50:17 PM EST
    said 'Hey, baby'......I would have snorted my wine!

    Parent
    I loke that much better (none / 0) (#180)
    by coigue on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 06:23:19 PM EST
    "loke" -- I guess that's something (5.00 / 1) (#183)
    by brodie on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 06:31:38 PM EST
    stronger than like but not quite as strong as love?

    Parent
    exactly. (none / 0) (#191)
    by coigue on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 08:11:43 PM EST
    Initial poll numbers from Gallup ... (none / 0) (#147)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 01:52:24 PM EST
    ... may be the leading indicators of a pretty nice convention bounce Obama and the Democrats. We'll know a lot more in about a week.

    Probably the same (none / 0) (#157)
    by jbindc on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 02:55:24 PM EST
    point or two they lost ground on after the RNC last week.

    Of course, today's job numbers may put a damper on any bounce.  Even the campaign is downplaying any expectations of a measurable bounce.

    Parent

    Given that there's actually not ... (5.00 / 2) (#165)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 03:40:04 PM EST
    ... much that's in play in the electorate at this point, I certainly don't anticipate a large swing either. Most people have already made up their minds.

    But I think we'll still see something substantive in the way of movement at the margins toward the president, which will make it that much harder for Mitt Romney and Paul Ryan to overcome in the remaining two months.

    The Republican ticket really needed something positive to happen these last two weeks to beak the prevailing status quo. Not only did they not get it, their overall standing has probably been eroded by the juxtaposition of the two conventions.

    Ryan's dissembling during his acceptance speech quickly became a public issue, and Romney's own acceptance speech was further upstaged badly by his campaign's own clumsy stagecraft. The public takeaway that evening was Clint Eastwood berating an empty chair, which clearly backfired big-time, and not anything that Romney or anyone else (other than the unfortunate Ryan) said or did.

    Contrast the dour GOP convention in Tampa with the sheer exuberant performance by the Democrats in Charlotte, and I don't think there's any question whatsoever as to which side won that battle of public perception. And when you're the challenger, that's not a battle you can necessarily afford to lose only two months out.

    Aloha.

    Parent

    If I'm not mistaken, this Gallup (none / 0) (#200)
    by BackFromOhio on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 09:27:02 PM EST
    poll is based on RVs - registered voters.  Such polls are skewed 5% in favor of Dems.  

    Parent
    Yes and no (5.00 / 1) (#201)
    by CoralGables on Fri Sep 07, 2012 at 09:38:05 PM EST
    Yes in most cases but Nate has Gallup Tracking as skewed a point to the GOP if I remember correctly.

    Parent