Friday Morning Open Thread

Too busy, no blogging.

Open Thread.

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    Omar Khayham: (5.00 / 3) (#1)
    by oculus on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 12:09:09 PM EST
    The elite and lofty crowd who
    hold exalted office
    are disgusted at the life of
    grief and bother that they suffer.
    But when they consider the ones who,
    unlike them, are not the
    prisoners of high ambition-
    the amazing thing is that they do not
    even reckon them as human.

    Translated by Juan Cole
    from Omar Khayyam's Rubaiyat

    Near the end of OK (5.00 / 2) (#49)
    by ZtoA on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 01:52:25 PM EST
    An Love! If you and I
    with fate could conspire
    to grasp this sorry scheme of things entire,
    would we not smash it to bits
    ad re-mold it closer to our hearts' desire!

    From one of the translations:)  the one I happen to remember


    Nice lead-in, because ... (5.00 / 1) (#63)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 02:39:51 PM EST
    ... speaking of the elite and lofty crowd who hold exalted office, we visited the Great Mausoleum of Ho Chi Minh the other day -- and all I can say is that I was impressed with the reverence in which people still hold him, 44 years after his death. If only people would build me something like that when I pass on to the great beyond.

    The Red River delta region is very pretty, and so is Hanoi, in its own way. Like old Saigon, however, there are older parts of Hanoi could clearly benefit from underground wiring. Honestly, I've never seen such a mishmash of overhead power lines as I've seen in the central core of Vietnamese cities. In certain places, it's really hard to take a clear photo because of all the wires and wiring bundles, strung up and down the street and between buildings, etc. No use for urban building codes in these areas, apparently.

    And I will also note that for the capital of a socialist country that ostensibly embraces atheism, the people of Hanoi sure do like their Buddhist and Confucian temples, which I have to admit surprised me somewhat. They have some beautiful architecture and landscaping, We went to the Temple of Literature yesterday, which is a Confucian facility, and walked through its beautiful gardens.

    Haven't seen a large Roman Catholic presence up here, though, at least not to the extent that I saw down in Ho Chi Minh City. there was one fairly large church just off the main highway heading south from Noi Bai International Airport, which looks to still be in the same musty-looking, dilapitated state that it was in when the French abandoned the country in 1954.

    We're traveling down to Haiphong later this morning (it's 2:10 a.m. Saturday morning right now), and then we're leaving tomorrow afternoon to fly back to Japan, where we'll spend three days in Tokyo before returning home. Noi Bai International Airport, which serves the Hanoi region, looks to be a fairly new facility, and it's situated well to the north of the city proper, amid all the myriad acrage of the unbiquitous rice paddies throughout the Red River delta. But just like so many of our cities in the U.S., the area is seeing some significant urban sprawl, which is clearly creeping northward from the capital and displacing agriculture as it grows.

    It's been a wonderful trip, and I'm really glad that I came. I'd heartily recommend Vietnam to anyone looking for an overseas adventure to someplace different. Despite our rocky history over here, the Vietnamese are beautiful people, and their ready embrace of the growing American presence in their country is rather striking.



    Did you go to Halong Bay? (none / 0) (#72)
    by oculus on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 03:16:05 PM EST
    Yes, we did. (5.00 / 1) (#81)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 03:52:08 PM EST
    It was beautiful, even in the intermittent rain. My wife and I walked completely around the lake at what passes for dusk in the tropics. (It's like Honolulu -- very short period of transition between day and night.) I love how the Turtle Temple in the middle of the lake gets all lit up as the sun goes down, and then the neon glow comes out in some of the surounding buildings.

    Amazing (none / 0) (#83)
    by Militarytracy on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 04:10:31 PM EST
    Krugman takes on (5.00 / 1) (#4)
    by CST on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 12:26:42 PM EST
    One of Jeralyn's big topics.  The privatization of prisons.

    "if you think about it even for a minute, you realize that the one thing the companies that make up the prison-industrial complex -- companies like Community Education or the private-prison giant Corrections Corporation of America -- are definitely not doing is competing in a free market. They are, instead, living off government contracts. There isn't any market here, and there is, therefore, no reason to expect any magical gains in efficiency."

    "Privatized prisons save money by employing fewer guards and other workers, and by paying them badly. And then we get horror stories about how these prisons are run. What a surprise!"

    in Fed and state-run prisons?

    Also, from a quick google:

    Employer Types

        The type of employer running the correctional facility can have an effect on the wages paid to prison guards, according to PayScale. Guards working for private, for-profit corporations and those working in facilities operated by the federal government tend to earn similar wages, ranging from approximately $27,000 to $46,000. Prison guards who work for state and local agencies fared a little better, averaging between $28,000 and $49,000 as of October 2010.

    Hawaii has long had ... (none / 0) (#82)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 04:07:06 PM EST
    ... a rather notorious reputation when it comes to prisons, both civilian and military. After all, it was only after he experienced doing hard time out here at the infamous Schofield Stockade that John Dillinger supposedly declared that no prison would ever be able to hold him again. As I've said in other thread, you do NOT ever want to be sentenced to prison in the islands. Paradise, it ain't.

    But even our omst most hardened corrections officials were taken aback by what's been happening at CCA-run facilities in Arizona, where we had been outsourcing prisoners after our last bruising run-in with the federal judiciary (and the usual consent decree) regarding overcrowding and general conditions in island prisons. After the last incident in which two of our prisoners were killed due to inadequate staffing, we're looking to keep our felons home now.


    Speaking of Sports... (5.00 / 1) (#15)
    by indy in sc on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 12:51:23 PM EST
    Let's hear it for the Miami Heat!!!!  SI has an excellent write-up that gives a little more insight into the LeBron/D Wade relationship.

    Heat hear this..... (none / 0) (#16)
    by kdog on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 12:54:21 PM EST

    ^^^This. (none / 0) (#20)
    by MileHi Hawkeye on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 01:02:43 PM EST
    Even though I can't like the Thunder because they are ill gotten gains from the Emerald City, I hate them slightly less than the Heat.

    I hear ya... (5.00 / 1) (#46)
    by kdog on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 01:45:39 PM EST
    the squad formerly known as the Supersonics are a likeable bunch...the owner otoh is a no good thief in the night.

    But ya gotta give it up to the OKC fans...a spirited bunch who make an excellent 6th man.  They just wanted a team, it's not their fault they got a stolen one.


    The Seattle sonics fans (none / 0) (#55)
    by brodie on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 02:14:19 PM EST
    were even more supportive and boisterous if memory serves, even during off years.  All the more reason to denounce these OKC owners along with the League authorities who allowed the move.  

    That's why this west coaster who normally roots for the western conference rep wasn't at all upset by the Miami victory.

    And I think I was rooting for LeBron Jim in a backlash way to get back at the childish Cleveland fans who wouldn't allow him the freedom to choose teams.  Plus I'm still intrigued by those controversial LeBron-James Naismith reincarnation rumors.  I tend to believe them in fact.


    I think people (none / 0) (#57)
    by jbindc on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 02:17:32 PM EST
    (me included) were disgusted, not that LeBron didn't have the right to go where he wanted to play, but the whole ESPN half-hour show dedicated to "Where will he go?"

    He's very good, but no one is good enough to warrant a whole show dedicated to "Where will I make even more obscene amounts of money??"


    Agree on the show (none / 0) (#65)
    by brodie on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 02:47:19 PM EST
    And I think LeB is aware now of what a pr mistake it was.

    Of course espn has no qualms about producing such empty and exploitative programming.  They are just a Corp entity out to enhance ratings and find new ways to make a buck by associating themselves with and overhyping the latest young sports superstar.

    They used to be known as the (Michael) Jordan Network twenty years ago. Then they went overboard worshipfully covering Tiger Woods.  And after his fall, LeBron was there to step into the sports media void.

    Naive but probably decent guy from all appearances and I'm sorta glad he got that championship ring.


    Did you see the documentary ... (none / 0) (#64)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 02:46:13 PM EST
    ... about what happened to the SuperSonics, "Sonicsgate: Requiem for a Team"? Apparently, CNBC decided to run it concurrently to the NBA Finals. I had seen it earlier, and really is a compelling film. It's enough to make you swear off the NBA.

    Haven't seen it -- (none / 0) (#90)
    by brodie on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 04:31:06 PM EST
    we saw a bit of the final game then, oddly for me, went for some rare Reality TV programming on Lifetime (Wife Swap -- very amusing lite family fare) once it was clear the Heat had the game won.

    Will look for the doc on YT.


    Ha! (none / 0) (#48)
    by indy in sc on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 01:50:45 PM EST
    I hear ya.  I know you (and 85% of the U.S.) hate them.  I can't say that if I were anywhere outside of Miami, I wouldn't look at them as the "evil empire" the way I do the Yankees or Real Madrid.

    However, they didn't start the "getting a Big 3 through free agency" thing, and they won't be the last team to do it.  

    I also can't help but be happy for LBJ.  He really seems to be a good guy and does a lot in the Akron and Miami communities.  The worst thing you can say about him is he made a bone-headed decision regarding how to announce what he was going to do with his free agency.  He didn't even beg to be traded like some of the other "stars" out there.

    I'm also very happy for Battier, Mike Miller and Juwan Howard--each with 10+ years in the league and finally getting that ring!  Particularly Miller and Battier, who were both big contributors to the victory.


    Don't mind me... (none / 0) (#52)
    by kdog on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 02:05:05 PM EST
    Really I'm just a bitter Knicks fan who wishes Lebron took his talents to the world's most famous arena.

    Congrats indysc and Miami...but make no mistake, you're just as much as an evil empire now as the hated Yankees.



    The pressure to win one (none / 0) (#73)
    by indy in sc on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 03:18:54 PM EST
    heads right up I-95 to Melo now! ;)

    Hope to see more of Linsanity!


    I'm holding out hope... (5.00 / 1) (#76)
    by kdog on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 03:24:54 PM EST
    we score Steve Nash for the sunset of his stupendous career, with some Linsanity off the bench.  If anybody can fit these square pegs in round holes and make it work, its Stevie Nash.

    This just in, the NBPA won the case regarding Bird rights for waived players, meaning the Knicks can exceed the cap to try and resign Lindipitous and Novakaine.  A surprise ruling, the experts predicted a loss for the players union.


    I might have sympathy for you, ... (none / 0) (#124)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 06:34:20 PM EST
    ... if you guys in New York didn't already have the football Giants and the Yankees, and if the Knicks-Rockets Game 6 in the 1995 NBA Finals didn't get pre-empted midgame so we could all watch OJ's slow-motion getaway attempt along L.A. freeways. So, the verdict is in, kdog -- nobody outside the greater N.Y metro area cares.

    Anyway, I've given up on the NBA. If I were home, I'd be watching the College World Series. Any time you get to see a scrappy, under-the-radar team like the Kent State Golden Flashes eliminate the perennially overrated and overblown (and No. 1-seeded) Florida Gators -- regardless of the sport -- is a good time, in my opinion.


    Last shout out to any NYC area TLers (5.00 / 1) (#28)
    by Dadler on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 01:14:41 PM EST
    Last week for some intimate theatre by a couple of my old university peeps.

    First, north of the city a few hours, my old prof and chum Carey (son of Sir Rex) Harrison is staging his yearly play up in Woodstock, literally in the woods at the Byrdcliffe Theatre, a converted Barn in said forest, which is part of the century-plus old Byrdcliffe Artists Colony.  The play is HEDGEROW SPECIMEN (link), a great piece of stagecraft of the minimalist sort.  See it if you can, they'd love to have you there.

    Meanwhile, down in the east Village, at the Acting Company's tiny 4th Street Theatre, my fellow UCSD Theatre Department alumnus Andrew Weems, a fantastic writer/performer, is ending his NY run of his one-man show, DAMASCUS (link).  It's a dark and brooding and hilarious and beautiful trip of a journey. Check it out if you are in the city, it's more than worth it. This is small theatre, microscopic, but better in so many respects.  And up close and personal kind of thing. When you can hear the actors actually breathing. Crickets in the woods.  Sirens on the street.  Good stuff, great really.  Get some, if you possibly can.  Peace.  

    da Raiders (none / 0) (#2)
    by ScottW714 on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 12:20:29 PM EST
    Could be going back to Los Angeles or Santa Clara to share the 49ers stadium if they don't get a new one.

    The Oakland A's and the Golden State Warriors could leave as well.


    Good luck getting ... (none / 0) (#69)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 03:11:06 PM EST
    ... San Francisco voters to approve a new public bond issue to build a new waterfront arena complex for the Warriors down on Piers 30-32. San Francisco has long enjoyed a notorious reputation as a very liberal city, but when it actually comes to city finances, its residents are actually very pragmatic to the point of conservative. They refused to underwrite the building of a new stadium for the 49ers, which is why the team is moving south to Santa Clara.

    Sure, the Warriors said they'd privately finance the arena itself, but what about the cost of repairing those piers alone, in a manner that would support the weight of the proposed arena? That's been estimated in the nine-figure range, all by itself.

    As for the Raiders' threat to move back to Los Angeles, you'd think Mark Davis would have learned something from his late father Al Davis, who for all his faults and foibles, never willingly doubled down on stupid. The proposed bond issue for "Farmers Stadium," which was to be the new football complex near Staples Center in downtown L.A., is already in the weeds.

    Further, the residents of greater L.A. have already proved that they're perfectly content without an NFL presence there, since most of the games are broadcast on TV anyway, and getting their approval for a billionaire's subsidy is also problematic.


    BCS changes. Why no (none / 0) (#3)
    by oculus on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 12:24:07 PM EST
    discussion here?  

    Pete Hamel

    Thank goodness (5.00 / 2) (#5)
    by jbindc on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 12:30:25 PM EST
    Hopefully this will eliminate things like teams playing for the national championship who can't even win their own conference.

    Ruffian almost, but not quite, agrees. (5.00 / 1) (#9)
    by oculus on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 12:37:20 PM EST
    4 out 5 (none / 0) (#11)
    by jbindc on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 12:40:30 PM EST
    ain't bad.  :)

    I usually assume a 4 (5.00 / 1) (#12)
    by CST on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 12:42:58 PM EST
    is just a slip of the finger.  And not the middle one!

    I think of it as (5.00 / 3) (#13)
    by jbindc on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 12:45:22 PM EST
    The same number of dentists who recommend Trident gum!

    ha! sorry about that. Can't even blame (5.00 / 2) (#40)
    by ruffian on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 01:31:17 PM EST
    autocorrect on that one.

    I owe you a 5!


    Me? College football? I have no real (none / 0) (#39)
    by ruffian on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 01:29:41 PM EST

    Did I rank someone's comment  accidentally? Sorry!


    "Win their own conference"? (none / 0) (#71)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 03:13:02 PM EST
    Hell, Alabama didn't even win its own division!

    Now now (none / 0) (#84)
    by jbindc on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 04:14:58 PM EST
    Why do you hate the (overhyped) SEC??

    Hmmm -- let's see, now. (none / 0) (#111)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 05:15:42 PM EST
    How about, just for starters, that several of the SEC's marquee teams, i.e., Georgia, Alabama and Florida, have proved themselves not at all willing to play a non-conference away game north of the Ohio and west of the Mississippi, and won't schedule home-and-home series against good mid-major programs like BYU and Boise State (and occasionally, Hawaii).

    It's a lot easier to win when you're always playing eight to nine games a season at home. That's why Boise State deserves a lot more credit for their accomplishments than Florida, because the Broncos are more than willing to play anyone at any time, anywhere -- as they did last year when they went to Georgia and beat up the Bulldogs. You can't say the same for the Gators, who'll whine if they have to go play Florida State a hundred miles up the road in Tallahassee.

    I guess it's because I live in a state that's home to the country's most geographically remote D-1 football program. We're acutely aware of road trips, since the average road game for the Warriors constitutes at least a 5,000 round-trip (if the game's in California), and usually more -- so it's really kinda hard to work up any sympathy for programs that won't even travel out of their own time zone.

    The year Hawaii went to the Sugar Bowl (2007), they played seven games on the road, which included two in Louisiana, as well as in Seattle, Reno, Logan (Utah) and Las Vegas. The team annually has to play five to six games in the season away from home, which given the distances involved is a minimum three-day trip for the (Road) Warriors. This year, they open the season against USC in Los Angeles.

    Contrast that with Georgia, which two years ago had to play a game against Arizona State in Tempe (which was the back end of a rare home-and-home, non-conference series). It marked the first time they'd played a regular season non-conference road game west of the Mississippi in over 40 years! Yet Georgia Head Coach Mark Richt and his staff griped so much to the national media about the terrible inconveniences and indignities they endured on the road, you'd have been forgiven for thinking that perhaps the Bulldogs had somehow booked the trip out west by covered wagon.


    Blah Blah Blah (none / 0) (#146)
    by CoralGables on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 11:30:49 PM EST
    your SEC hatred is unbecoming of a sports fan.

    SEC National Titles this year in Division 1:
    Men's Football (Alabama)
    Men's Basketball (Kentucky)
    Men's Outdoor Track (Florida)
    Men's Indoor Track (Florida)
    Women's Softball (Alabama)
    Women's Tennis (Florida)
    Women's Gymnastics (Florida)
    Women's Outdoor Track (LSU)

    Men's Baseball (South Carolina) plays for the National Title starting Sunday.

    As for the top Men's Division 1 Athletic Teams in the country in the Capital One Standings, The SEC is ranked 1 & 2 this year.


    More Naked Northern Aggression! (5.00 / 1) (#152)
    by Militarytracy on Sat Jun 23, 2012 at 08:59:32 AM EST
    Led by that fascist socialist African Barack Obama.  The Southeastern Conference must succeed!   They are running roughshod over our forefathers!

    Priceless. (5.00 / 1) (#153)
    by oculus on Sat Jun 23, 2012 at 09:29:59 AM EST
    Hilarious. (none / 0) (#160)
    by lilburro on Sat Jun 23, 2012 at 01:11:05 PM EST
    Because SportsLeft (none / 0) (#6)
    by MileHi Hawkeye on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 12:35:09 PM EST
    was left to wither and die on the vine due to lack of attention, nurturing, passion and love.

    Was that a question? Seems like (none / 0) (#8)
    by oculus on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 12:36:32 PM EST
    plenty of those qualities exhibited here in the past!

    Pretty sure (none / 0) (#10)
    by MileHi Hawkeye on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 12:39:29 PM EST
    that was a very declarative statement.  But yes, there has been a pattern of such behaviors being exhibited in the past.

    Glad to see remarks (5.00 / 1) (#53)
    by easilydistracted on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 02:07:43 PM EST
    from some old friends.

    Hows it, Easy D? (none / 0) (#88)
    by MileHi Hawkeye on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 04:19:35 PM EST
    Life is going OK for you, I hope!

    Going well, my Friend (none / 0) (#172)
    by easilydistracted on Sat Jun 30, 2012 at 12:16:00 PM EST
    Hope all is will with you. So many new members here its often difficult to run across some of the old friends. Especially when I don't get to visit the site as often because of my travel schedule. Everything well on your personal health front? I recall an issue or two some months back.

    Thx for the post (none / 0) (#51)
    by brodie on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 02:01:35 PM EST
    Actually it's by Pete Thamel.  Not sure the famous columnist Pete Hamill is still around.

    An improvement I'd say, provided they arrange to have two semi finalists from the same conference/state/region play each other before the championship game.  Call it the SEC Rule.

    I'm also fine with teams making the final four who didn't win their conference.  Call it the SEC Rule 2.0.

    They should also preclude more than two teams from the same conference making the playoffs.  SEC Rule 3.0.


    Politico suspends a reporter (none / 0) (#7)
    by oculus on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 12:35:29 PM EST
    re his tweets:  NYT

    I am pausing before I click the link (5.00 / 1) (#41)
    by ruffian on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 01:33:19 PM EST
    to predict what would possibly get someone suspended from Politico. Must be something edgy. Certainly all manner of inanity has been allowed there.

    ROFL (none / 0) (#43)
    by ruffian on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 01:35:45 PM EST
    I called it.

    But the funniest part is this description of Politico:

    the Web site devoted to covering all facets of the political news cycle

    My bold. Yes, they do report about the news cycle. and that is about it.


    New Hampshire governor (none / 0) (#14)
    by jbindc on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 12:48:34 PM EST
    John Lynch (D) vetoes bill passed by Republican legislature that would legalize medical marijuana.

    "I cannot support establishing a system for the use of medical marijuana that poses risks to the patient, lacks adequate oversight and funding, and risks the proliferation of a serious drug," Lynch said.

    An override is unlikely.

    "Risks to patients".... (5.00 / 1) (#17)
    by kdog on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 12:57:46 PM EST
    ya mean like the risk of arrest Lynch?

    Lacks adequate oversight?  Ya mean like the "no oversight" you have now?

    "Proliferation of a serious drug"?  I got news for ya, it's already highly proliferated.

    'Live Free or Die' my arse...


    Berkeley finances: (none / 0) (#19)
    by oculus on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 01:02:35 PM EST

    15 million dollars but not much profit.  


    Not surprising.... (none / 0) (#26)
    by kdog on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 01:09:18 PM EST
    its a medical mj dispensary, not Bain Capital.  

    Squeezing every penny of profit out of the business isn't the primary goal, making a living and serving your community...imagine that! ;)  


    But, like Bain, top mgt. is (none / 0) (#29)
    by oculus on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 01:16:06 PM EST
    well compensated.  

    Perfect example... (none / 0) (#34)
    by kdog on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 01:22:43 PM EST
    of earning a cool million a year honestly providing goods and services of value...we're not communists oculus;)

    Bain Dispensary Corp CEO woulda hammered the growers on the price, cut workers pay, laid off half the security guards, raised prices, took 5 million a year, borrowed every nickel possible against the business, declare bankruptcy and stiffed vendors, and ran off to the Caymans.


    And undoubtedly leaving the crop to rot (none / 0) (#54)
    by easilydistracted on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 02:10:24 PM EST
    in the fields

    And insider trade... (none / 0) (#61)
    by kdog on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 02:35:46 PM EST
    on marijuana futures based on the info! ;)

    I don't know how (none / 0) (#92)
    by jondee on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 04:34:24 PM EST
    "good for them" it would be, but I'm sure it would be better for my mental health if the frat boys down the street had a steady supply of heroin rather than Bud Lite. I wish someone would hook them up.

    Where do Americans get this idea that being hammered means you have a special license from god to be an azole?

    Somebody fill me in.


    I'm shocked that your local college-types (none / 0) (#147)
    by sarcastic unnamed one on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 11:41:48 PM EST
    are such azoles to someone as kind-hearted, understanding and diplomatic as you.



    I take it thats (none / 0) (#148)
    by jondee on Sat Jun 23, 2012 at 12:12:56 AM EST
    some of that famous "sarcasm" you've always threatened to unleash..

    Light an extra candle for Ron tonight, it'll make you feel better.


    Kdog, I think this is a nonprofit (none / 0) (#123)
    by SuzieTampa on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 06:23:33 PM EST
    In the article, the execs compare themselves to "other medical nonprofits." If it's a nonprofit, I'm disgusted. They don't need to be giving themselves 50 percent raises or spending $39,916 on "decorations and ambiance." Do they really need to spend that much on advertising? Jesus H ... F... Christ, this is pot.

    They are selling pot at the "market rate," i.e., what it's sold for illegally. The article says: "medical marijuana costs as much as $60 for an eighth of an ounce in California." Instead of finding ways to use their "profit" to benefit top employees, they could use it to lower prices. It looks like their pot prices are higher than the costs for generic anti-anxiety, anti-nausea and anti-emetic drugs.

    People who need medication for anxiety, nausea and vomiting need to understand that the different drugs, pot included, work better for some people than others.

    If the pot dispensaries are for-profit companies, than I feel about them the way I do about all drug companies.

    Also, by the way, legal pot appears to be much more expensive than legal generic opiates. I don't like pot, but I thank Jesus H ... F ... Christ for morphine.

    Btw, when legally dispensed, I think all of the opiates are cheaper than pot, too.


    I checked.... (none / 0) (#168)
    by kdog on Mon Jun 25, 2012 at 09:37:46 AM EST
    the article and their website, I don't think they're a non-profit, found no mention of that Suzie.

    I see your point...most any profitable business could charge their customers less and make a little less, especially when health is at stake, but thats just not how we roll. What the market will bear, for good or ill.

    And its not like they're making 475 to 1 over their workers like some big corporations, only 3 times more or so.  If every industry rolled like that I think we'd all be better off.


    I'm an idiot... (none / 0) (#169)
    by kdog on Mon Jun 25, 2012 at 09:39:12 AM EST
    not 3 times, 33 times a 30k a year worker or so.  But still better than 475 times;)

    I wonder if a nonprofit could dispense (none / 0) (#170)
    by SuzieTampa on Mon Jun 25, 2012 at 11:42:31 PM EST
    medical marijuana and undercut them. That would be sweet. I went through their very long first page of reviews on Yelp, and they sounded like restaurant reviews. Only two people commented on medical issues, one briefly, and the other explained how it helped his chronic pain.

    I don't care if pot is legalized, but I wish people wouldn't make the medicinal uses one of the strongest arguments. Kdog, I'm not accusing you of this, but sometimes it feel like people are using my misfortune to push their own agenda.


    I, for one... (none / 0) (#171)
    by kdog on Tue Jun 26, 2012 at 08:18:04 AM EST
    was never big on the medical marijuana movement, didn't think it was the way to right this wrong.  Just legalize it already, and the sick could sort themselves out right along with the recreational user.

    A medical use only system is ripe for gaming, just like our stupid permission slip system for legal prescription drugs.  Either you have the right to put what you want in your body or you don't, what difference does it make if it's medicinal or recreational...I mean the healthy are entitled to same rights as the sick, are they not?

    That being said I support the medicinal use movement, to get the state's boot off the neck of the sick at least, if not us all.


    Hey kdog (none / 0) (#104)
    by sj on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 04:53:04 PM EST
    I naturally thought of you when I read this via the always wonderful Avedon Carol.

    I always though it ironic (none / 0) (#21)
    by CST on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 01:02:47 PM EST
    that the "live free or die" state had the strictest pot laws/culture in New England.

    They are cool with guns, fireworks, driving with no seatbelt (for a while at least) and booze on sundays long before MA.  But pot?  Dangerous!!!

    And I like John Lynch, but this is just silly:

    "risks the proliferation of a serious drug"

    Heroin is a serious drug.


    sorry (none / 0) (#22)
    by CST on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 01:04:42 PM EST
    they are apparently still cool with driving without a seatbelt.  I thought they changed that but apparently not.

    Does Lynch know? (none / 0) (#30)
    by kdog on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 01:16:21 PM EST
    Danger! Danger! Proliferation of Danger!

    Please don't (none / 0) (#23)
    by jbindc on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 01:04:59 PM EST
    take us down the road of "heroin is dangerous" again.  :)

    Ohhhhh.... Jesus F Christ (3.50 / 2) (#32)
    by ScottW714 on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 01:22:20 PM EST
    Please don't, my head will explode if I have read how deluded I am with boogieman propaganda, one more time.  

    I concede, it's so benign they should fortify cereal with it.  Vitamin H.


    I'm sorry, but I believe Jesus' middle initial (5.00 / 3) (#38)
    by Anne on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 01:29:24 PM EST
    is "H," not "F," at least according to my dad, who said it so frequently I figured he had to know what he was talking about...

    Not the Way I Say it (5.00 / 1) (#66)
    by ScottW714 on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 03:05:45 PM EST
    Jesus Hucking Christ just doesn't cut it.

    (Gasp!) (5.00 / 1) (#75)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 03:22:28 PM EST
    "God'll get you for that, Walter Findlay."
    -- Maude Findlay (Bea Arthur), Maude (CBS, 1972-78)



    SuzieTampa (none / 0) (#129)
    by lentinel on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 08:18:00 PM EST
    above covers all the bases with

    Jesus H ... F ... Christ

    Sh*t... (none / 0) (#35)
    by kdog on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 01:23:54 PM EST
    might work as a treatment for ADHD, calm the little buggers down so they are easier to indoctrinate;)

    Can't Be Any Worse than Meth... (none / 0) (#68)
    by ScottW714 on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 03:07:22 PM EST
    ...aka as Ritalin.

    I despise (none / 0) (#87)
    by sj on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 04:18:43 PM EST
    being misrepresented.

    Taking back the downrating (none / 0) (#106)
    by sj on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 04:55:36 PM EST
    I finally had a chance to eat lunch and I am much less cranky.  Have a good weekend.

    sj (5.00 / 1) (#162)
    by ScottW714 on Sat Jun 23, 2012 at 04:52:33 PM EST
    That was joke, not meant to represent.
    Sorry, sing it ridiculously high tone...

    for once (none / 0) (#25)
    by CST on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 01:08:08 PM EST
    I think I am on your side with that.

    I've lost too many to that path.  And the only one that has come back was in a casket.  So no, you won't ever see me write anything positive about heroin.  I just don't think our current legal situation is helping the problem.


    Who knew... (none / 0) (#18)
    by kdog on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 12:59:17 PM EST
    flipping Ray-gun the bird was controversial?  

    American as standing for the national anthem in my house;)

    Would your moms approve of this (none / 0) (#24)
    by oculus on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 01:05:20 PM EST
    behavior by guests at the WH?  

    Not guests.... (none / 0) (#27)
    by kdog on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 01:14:41 PM EST
    part owners...they're Americans and its our house, presidents only reside on a 4 year lease with an owners option to extend to 8.

    But to answer your question moms would probably frown upon it, and suggest saving the sh*tting on Reagan for the ride home., where she would be happy to chime in too;)


    Huh? (none / 0) (#93)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 04:38:03 PM EST
    I'm sorry, but if you look at the vast majority of lease agreements and applicable landlord-tenant statory codes, owners / landlords most definitely do NOT enjoy the right to come in and out and / or do as they please, once the lease is in effect and the tenant takes control of the property.

    When I first moved to Honolulu, I rented a small 1-BR cottage in the Kapahulu area just outside Waikiki, whose owners were a couple from Georgia. One late afternoon after work, I got out of the shower and walked into the hallway completely naked, only to find my landlady's husband standing there inside. I yelled at him to get out, and he left without saying anything. A short time later I received a call from her, and she proceeded to chew me out, saying that it was her property and they had the right to do as they wished.

    Whereupon I called HPD. An officer took me over to their place, and then informed her in no uncertain terms in my presence that actually, she and her husband were the ones who were in violation of the law, because they were required by Hawaii statute to give me no less than 48 hours' notice if either of them wanted to come onto the property for any reason sans my invitation -- and further, were I to file a complaint right then and there, he would be obliged to arrest her husband for unlawful entry and trespassing.

    Needless to say, they shut up and said no more about it, and I moved out two months later by mutual agreement.

    I'm no fan of Ronald Reagan or either of the Bushes, but if you can't respect the men, than at least respect the office of the presidency, of which the White House is part. So, I agree with oculus.


    What does (none / 0) (#130)
    by lentinel on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 08:23:03 PM EST
    that even mean - respecting the "office of the presidency",

    If the people who hold that office have no respect for it, how can we?


    Bro... (none / 0) (#78)
    by ScottW714 on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 03:31:40 PM EST
    ...if some secret scrolls ever revealed jesus to be gay, the right would replace his make believe portraits with Ronny's.  Flipping off Jesus Redux is a huge no/no.

    To hear some talk, you swear the guy walked on water.  But I remember a fumbling idiot who like to talk about aliens too much and took way too much credit over the USSR collapsing.

    And to oculus I would say if you don't want people disrespecting your likeness, don't disrespect them in legislation.  One is harmless, the other has real world consequences beyond ruffling morality feathers.

    And my moms still thinks Ronny was the bestest eva, so she wouldn't like it.


    Yeah... (5.00 / 1) (#80)
    by kdog on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 03:49:38 PM EST
    I don't get the idol worship there at all.

    Err, I do get it...he kicked hippies in the teeth as governor, and kicked unions and homosexuals in the teeth as president.  Of course he is idolized, makes perfect sense;)


    Reagan told the 1% (none / 0) (#97)
    by jondee on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 04:45:57 PM EST
    that they benefit us all simply by EXISTING; which was, and still is, a huge psychological/spiritual weight off for them and all the other mammon-worshipping wannabees..

    What with that whole camel-through-the-eye-of-a-needle thing hanging over their heads for so long..


    Well, Reagan did set us (none / 0) (#98)
    by KeysDan on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 04:48:05 PM EST
    on a "new trajectory" and gave us a peep show of things to come for the country early in his administration with a $1 billion cut in the FY 1982 budget for school lunch programs, resulting in the proposal to re-classify ketchup from condiment to vegetable.  The hot lunch program could then save money on the little backs of school children by eliminating a serving of cooked or fresh vegetables. Ketchup   was to count as meeting nutrition requirements.  The hot lunch program offered in many instances the only good meal of the day for poor children.  

    On the same day the USDA announced the cost cutting proposal for children's lunches, the White House, it was learned, purchased over $200,000 of new china with the presidential seal embossed in gold.


    well, of course (none / 0) (#105)
    by jondee on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 04:55:24 PM EST
    poor children needed to be rebuked for their parents sinful ways..

    As Falwell (may Blue Bottle Flys copulate in his nostrils) probably would have said, those unfortunates are the seeds that landed on barren rock..


    btw, sorry for not respecting (none / 0) (#110)
    by jondee on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 05:07:00 PM EST
    the office of the founder of Liberty U and the Moral Majority..

    Something just came over me..


    "(may Blue Bottle Flys ..." (none / 0) (#134)
    by unitron on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 09:02:34 PM EST
    "As Falwell (may Blue Bottle Flys copulate in his nostrils)..."

    I'm pretty sure they have more self-respect than that.

    Are they still using Jerry's picture in the dictionary next to the entry for "smug"?


    Like a corrupt jerk water (none / 0) (#138)
    by jondee on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 09:46:24 PM EST
    town politician with all the redneck cops in his back pocket..

    Ole Jerry..


    Obamarama (5.00 / 1) (#131)
    by lentinel on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 08:30:25 PM EST
    thinks that Reagan was "transformational".

    I know that Reagan transformed Union shops into non-Union shops.

    But I don't think that's what Obama meant.

    I don't really know what he meant.

    But harkening back to this salesman as if he were something to be emulated makes me queasy.


    I didn't mind the alien (none / 0) (#86)
    by brodie on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 04:18:32 PM EST
    talk so much as he used it as a pretext to build his Star Wars missile defense system.

    And it's my understanding -- from an alleged and rather interesting contactee -- that our alien friends themselves had little good to say about Ronnie.  They apparently regarded him as a reckless warmonger until a modicum of sanity emerged in the second term, mostly thanks to Gorbachev.

    Hey, I just report 'em.

    But it's a subject that has interested me since childhood.  Apparently Jimmy Carter and Bill Clinton also had this same interest.


    Hey Brodie (none / 0) (#118)
    by jondee on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 05:45:01 PM EST
    Any thoughts on that book that came out by the LA Times reporter about a year ago, in which the author claims that people with very high security clearances told her that the whole Area 51 thing was part of a Soviet scheme to cause a panic in the U.S, by crashing an "alien spacecraft", piloted by adolescents who were gentically engineered (so to speak) to look like beings from another world, on U.S soil?

    As you say, I just report 'em..


    Even more absurdly and (none / 0) (#139)
    by brodie on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 09:52:39 PM EST
    ridiculously, the author contends -- based on one unnamed source -- that the bodies found at Roswell were actually human children from the Josef Mengele experiments put there in a scheme involving Stalin whose purpose was to cause panic among the American people like the 1938 War of the Worlds radio program.

    Uh, riiiight.

    And this author -- peddling her laughable theories -- was treated very gently in the media interviews I saw.  A reminder I suppose that expressing an anti UFO position in US media gets you a friendly reception and plenty of airtime in primetime while serious authors showing solid evidence in favor of alien visitation are relegated to late night and Internet radio shows only.  Raises obvious Qs of who controls the media ultimately as well as media groupthink attitudes.

    My opinion:  Roswell was as initially reported by local military authorities -- a crashed alien disk.  Most likely, as I understand, the occupants were only biological androids and not their creators.  Probably multiple crashes/shootdowns in that area and other parts of the world in that time period.  And the physical evidence recovered by authorities is unlikely to be disclosed to the public for a very long time yet so dont expect official disclosure in your lifetime.

    We just aren't ready to receive it on a societal basis.  Certain large sectors of the public wouldn't take it well.


    The Terri Gross interview (5.00 / 1) (#142)
    by jondee on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 10:22:08 PM EST
    was the most unintentionally hilarious one I've ever heard her do..

    You could almost hear her thinking "WTF?!" over the radio..


    Haaa (none / 0) (#140)
    by BTAL on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 10:09:46 PM EST
    And some here use the "crazy" term liberally regarding conservatives.

    Now, its clear where to pigeon hole jondee.


    I didn't say I believed (none / 0) (#141)
    by jondee on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 10:19:47 PM EST
    that farrago of nonsense. I just gave a thumbnail sketch of the LA Times reporter's book..

    This isn't like you and that ludicrous Book of Revelations of yours..


    But you did believe in (none / 0) (#143)
    by BTAL on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 10:33:36 PM EST
    "Hope and Change"



    not even that.. (5.00 / 1) (#144)
    by jondee on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 10:36:09 PM EST
    I just believed it more than Milton Friedman, the neocons and the Left Behind series..

    Which is to say, hardly at all..


    Obama: The Less Dangerous Huckster (none / 0) (#145)
    by jondee on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 10:46:54 PM EST
    that should be his tagline.

    Except (none / 0) (#163)
    by ScottW714 on Sat Jun 23, 2012 at 05:03:37 PM EST
    Us fools that believed in Hope and Change walked away with some egg on our face.  While literally millions have died for your beliefs.

    Not really the same now is it.


    Don't forget the drones! (none / 0) (#165)
    by jbindc on Sun Jun 24, 2012 at 07:19:25 AM EST
    How are (none / 0) (#31)
    by jbindc on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 01:20:14 PM EST
    comments still being added to the latest Zimmerman thread?  They're at 234 (or 239) now...

    Excellent. Keep it going--there!!!! (5.00 / 4) (#33)
    by oculus on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 01:22:42 PM EST
    LOL... (5.00 / 2) (#37)
    by kdog on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 01:27:31 PM EST
    Not to bring it here but I'm starting to see so much reasonable doubt that I think Zimmerman should be acquited of any charges on grounds of self-defense.  As it should be when there is reasonable doubt, regardless of how it all really went down that fateful night.  Err on the side of freedom, always.

    But I maintain my opinion that plenty of evidence exists to convict him of being an armed and dangerous arsehat in the 1st degree in the court of public opinion.  


    Zimmerman schmimmerman.. (5.00 / 2) (#99)
    by jondee on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 04:48:56 PM EST
    let me be just the first to say it..

    But, one man's meat is another man's poison (he added, in a fumbling attempt to be diplomatic..)


    Ditto. Just wait for (5.00 / 1) (#101)
    by oculus on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 04:52:34 PM EST
    the trial already.  

    me too kdog (none / 0) (#44)
    by ruffian on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 01:37:40 PM EST
    I still think we could use an (5.00 / 2) (#42)
    by Anne on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 01:34:17 PM EST
    Open-To-Anything-But-Zimmerman Open Thread.  Not that people who don't understand "200-comment limit" would pay any attention to that designation...

    I'm convinced that these are the same people who think having 57 items in the 10-items-or-less express lane is not a problem.


    Excellent idea. (5.00 / 3) (#60)
    by brodie on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 02:30:21 PM EST
    I overdosed on the Z case weeks ago just dipping into one thread filled with unhelpful, speculative comments and seeing too many trollish posts from suspect newcomers.

    I think discussion of it tends to take up too much bandwidth in too many threads here already.  My two cents.


    I second that emotion. (5.00 / 2) (#77)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 03:29:21 PM EST
    I'm all for an open thread, or two or three, to be declared a "Zimmerman-Free Zone."

    I swear, the subject of George Zimmerman has managed to bring out the absolute worst in a lot of people, both here and elsewhere. It's like they think it's totally cool to be openly racist again.


    My desire for a Z-FZ is two-fold: (5.00 / 3) (#100)
    by Anne on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 04:51:49 PM EST
    (1) it keeps the open threads free for other discussions and,

    (2) it reduces the number of factually deficient, Fox News-style comments in the political threads.

    There honestly have been days when I haven't recognized the blog and had to check to make sure I hadn't landed on Red State by mistake.


    Agreed. There's been ... (5.00 / 1) (#116)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 05:34:08 PM EST
    ... a lot of really trashy Fox News addicts who've obviously come here from elsewhere, attracted to Jeralyn's extensive Z-Man coverage like a moth to a bug-light.

    I wonder if J realizes that her pro-defense counsel position with regards to Z-Man has led a lot of these migratory white-wingnuts to somehow think that she's one of them. I mean, WE get where she's coming from. They clearly don't.


    I don't know that she thinks they think she's (5.00 / 2) (#127)
    by Anne on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 06:52:43 PM EST
    one of them; she's having to do more clean up in non-Z threads, and has said that she knows they bring a conservative point of view to the blog, but figures they won't stick around once Zimmerman ends.

    The disheartening part of that is that I think Zimmerman's going to be around for a good long while.

    As I may have said in some other comment, at least it gives the more liberal-minded commenters the opportunity to hone their arguments; I do think many of these new commenters are not used to the high standards here for supporting one's opinions, and have been rhetorically called on the carpet for thinking we'd just let the Fox News/sound bit comments stand - I think you may have contributed to that effort!

    I have to say that I have found myself directing my "are you f'ing kidding me?" mutterings more at these clowns than at Obama - so maybe they serve a function after all.  ;-p


    You can still add a comment, you just can't (5.00 / 2) (#36)
    by Anne on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 01:27:12 PM EST
    "Reply" to any one comment in particular.

    I tried telling them about the 200-comment limit that Jeralyn observes, suggesting to them that they take the discussion to what was then the only other open thread, because with so many comments over 200, it was possible the overage would end up being deleted.

    But I see they're still posting along...seems kind of like staying at a party after the host has gone to bed, but apparently, the Zimmerman thing renders people incapable of caring about anything else - including their hostess' rules.


    They're of the "me me me" generation. (none / 0) (#47)
    by Angel on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 01:50:05 PM EST
    So, they were born after 50,000 BCE? (5.00 / 1) (#50)
    by Farmboy on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 01:58:50 PM EST
    Color me surprised.

    I'd like a word with you, sir... (5.00 / 1) (#135)
    by unitron on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 09:11:56 PM EST
    ...about compensation for keyboard damage.

    "including their hostess' rules" (none / 0) (#161)
    by Rojas on Sat Jun 23, 2012 at 01:51:02 PM EST
    Seems just a short time ago someone was all in a huff and bidding goodbye after being deleted for constantly violating the hostess' rules...

    Our mission is to intelligently and thoroughly examine issues, candidates and legislative initiatives as they pertain to constitutional rights, particularly those of persons accused of crime.

    Just curious - are you this bitter in the rest (5.00 / 4) (#164)
    by Anne on Sat Jun 23, 2012 at 06:45:56 PM EST
    of your life?  I actually find myself feeling sorry for you sometimes, that you feel the need to be so vindictive - selectively so - while at the same time, adding so little to the discussion.

    And, "constantly?"  I don't think so.

    [rolls eyes]


    OMG (5.00 / 3) (#79)
    by ScottW714 on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 03:36:35 PM EST
    I am so GZ burned out, yet when it's the only thread going, I can't stop myself.

    And Anne, for the love of god, don't point them to an open thread.


    Funny or desperate? (none / 0) (#56)
    by BTAL on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 02:14:48 PM EST
    Well at least it is unique.  

    Obama campaign launches events registry

    President Obama is launching an events registry that will allow a birthday boy or a bride-to-be to encourage their friends to give to the campaign -- instead of a gift.

    "Got a birthday, anniversary, or wedding coming up?" the campaign wrote in a blog post. "Let your friends know how important this election is to you--register with Obama 2012, and ask for a donation in lieu of a gift."

    "It's a great way to support the President on your big day. Plus, it's a gift that we can all appreciate--and goes a lot further than a gravy bowl," the campaign wrote.


    My goodness he's the President ! (5.00 / 1) (#58)
    by samsguy18 on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 02:25:30 PM EST
    This event registry is Crass....what is going on with his campaign...they have lost touch  with the real world

    I think it's tacky too (5.00 / 3) (#59)
    by jbindc on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 02:28:05 PM EST
    First of all, if you have a wedding or christening or whatever and you invite guests, there actually might be people who do not share your political inclinations, and to ask them to contribute to the Obama re-election campaign is...tacky.

    Yes, it is (5.00 / 1) (#62)
    by Zorba on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 02:38:44 PM EST

    Don't know your age, but this may fall in the (5.00 / 1) (#67)
    by Farmboy on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 03:07:18 PM EST
    "get off my lawn" category for you:

    With the average ages of brides and grooms today at 27 and 29 respectively, many have all the dishes and bedding they need. So instead of asking for china and crystal, The Early Show contributor Laurie Hibberd reports, they're asking their guests to donate to charity.


    Bethany Robertson is the executive director of the I Do Foundation, a non-profit organization that helps couples incorporate charity into their big day.

    Roberts says, "We have seen a phenomenal increase in the number of couples who are participating. In 2004, we had about 20,000 couples in the program. And this year, we're on track to have over 200,000 couples choose a charity through either the I Do Foundation or one of our partners. This is money that did not currently or before exists in the charitable pipeline. This is money that was being spent on cake toppers and garter belts. Now, it's being used for children's health or for community development, things like that. I kind of think of it as icing on the cake, really."


    Granted, you may not be of the opinion that donating to a political campaign is equivalent to donating to a cause. Somebody in Obama's campaign staff must think that they are.


    People still give... (5.00 / 1) (#70)
    by kdog on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 03:11:16 PM EST
    actual gifts at weddings, like china and bedding?  I thought that was what a bridal shower was for (girls stuff;), and at the wedding you give 'em an envelope to offset the cost of the wedding, or at least pay for your plate.

    Maybe the wealthy roll differently, but in my circles ya gotta give the newlyweds an envelope so they don't start out too far in the hole;)  


    For the weddings I've been to in the last ten (none / 0) (#95)
    by Farmboy on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 04:41:46 PM EST
    years or so, the couples have migrated from long gift registry lists full of items to shorter lists with gift cards for that store.

    Of course, as you get older you find yourself invited to more second marriages than firsts, but the same principle holds. The couple doesn't need the basics, but why not put something a little nicer on the registry - in my circles "a little nicer" means shopping at BB&B instead of Target - with the wink to gift cards if the guest doesn't want to spring for "something nice."

    As to donating to the Obama campaign in the couples' name, if the couple put it on the registry as a suggestion who are the guests to judge? If a guest doesn't want to make the donation nobody is forcing them to, and if it makes them think less of the couple for being Democrats, perhaps they should just send a nice card and stay home.


    I'm for cash, (none / 0) (#96)
    by Zorba on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 04:45:19 PM EST
    Myself.    Everyone could use some extra dollars, and the newlyweds don't have to worry about returning something that is a duplicate.  Unless  I know the couple really, really well, and find something (not on the registry) that  is unique and that I absolutely know that they would treasure.  Some people consider cash to be crass and that it doesn't take any thought to give.  But how much thought does it take to  go to their online registry and order something that hasn't been bought yet?  Give 'em cash,  I say.  If you know where they like to shop, a gift card is also good.         ;-)

    And call me old-fashioned, but I think (none / 0) (#108)
    by Anne on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 05:01:35 PM EST
    wedding gifts for second marriages are tacky, too.

    My problem with cash gifts is that it makes me feel like I am paying for my seat at the reception and/or that I didn't care enough to think too hard about a gift.  I've actually heard of brides taking the position that if they are putting out $X per head at the reception, the least guests can do is give a gift of equal or greater value.  Ugh.


    Yes, I think that (5.00 / 1) (#112)
    by Zorba on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 05:17:18 PM EST
    wedding gifts for second marriages are tacky.  Most particularly if you have given a gift to either the bride's or groom's first wedding.  We spent a lot of money (as did the Zorba kids) on the gift for the wedding of the child of a very old friend, and their spouse split something like two weeks after the wedding.  And no wedding gifts were returned.  Nor were thank-you notes sent.  Now that's tacky.
    As the Zorba kids said at the time "Well, if X ever gets remarried,  all they're going to get is a congratulatory card and a hearty handshake."
    I don't think of cash gifts as paying for my meal at the reception.  If we're close enough to the couple to receive an invitation and attend a wedding, they get a whole he!! of a lot more cash from us than they spent on the meals for us.  If they're not that close, they get a card, and at the most, a modest gift card.  And, as I said, if we know them very, very well, they will get something picked out especially for them.  Some really exquisite pottery or artwork, for instance.  But only, as I said, if we know them really well.  And so far, upon those occasions when we've done this, the couple were extremely touched and pleased.  Either that, or they're great actors.   ;-)

    I had a cousin (5.00 / 1) (#150)
    by jbindc on Sat Jun 23, 2012 at 05:42:41 AM EST
    Who registered for (and got, I believe) a back hair trimmer for men.  When I harassed him about it, and told him we all now know more about him than we should, he just laughed.

    I love that (none / 0) (#133)
    by sj on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 08:49:15 PM EST
    And, as I said, if we know them very, very well, they will get something picked out especially for them.  Some really exquisite pottery or artwork, for instance.
    I may have mentioned that I went to my cousin's wedding in Poland several years back and by far most of the gifts were beautiful things even when functional, like quilts.  Lots of art of all types.  

    We didn't even have a registry for our wedding! (5.00 / 2) (#151)
    by Angel on Sat Jun 23, 2012 at 07:13:47 AM EST
    Going on 35 years now and we did it without china and silver pattern selections! LOL

    When I got married at 29 or 30 (5.00 / 1) (#154)
    by SuzieTampa on Sat Jun 23, 2012 at 10:10:41 AM EST
    my husband and I already had more than enough for one household. For our engagement shower, we registered at a nursery with native FL plants so that we could xeriscape our yard. For the wedding, we each designated favorite charities. But many people gave us more traditional gifts instead.

    We actually didn't ask for anything, but we did (5.00 / 1) (#156)
    by Angel on Sat Jun 23, 2012 at 10:22:50 AM EST
    receive gifts, the best of which came from my sister and late brother-in-law.  They provided the musical entertainment for the wedding - he was a musician and put together a string quartet for both the procession and reception.  He was killed in an auto accident in 1986, so when I think of him I always remember that oh-so-special wedding gift.

    Wonderful. Did you get a recording? (none / 0) (#166)
    by oculus on Mon Jun 25, 2012 at 01:27:27 AM EST
    I'm sorry to say that we didn't, and I'm sad for (none / 0) (#167)
    by Angel on Mon Jun 25, 2012 at 07:25:27 AM EST
    not having done so.  

    My brother (5.00 / 1) (#155)
    by Ga6thDem on Sat Jun 23, 2012 at 10:21:46 AM EST
    did that too but the reason he didn't register was because they really needed money and kind of wanted a way to get people to give money instead of gifts and they figured not registering would do it. I guess it worked some but they still got gifts.

    I registered china and all that but at the time I was thinking why am I doing this? I know it's tradition to do it so I just did it not thinking much about it. About three or four years later it dawned on me why you do it. You do it because you probably would not have any china for years and years unless you got it for a wedding present.


    We waited 17 years, took a trip to Europe and (5.00 / 2) (#159)
    by Angel on Sat Jun 23, 2012 at 12:29:55 PM EST
    purchased china there, had it shipped home.  Worth the wait because we got something we think is spectacular and use it all the time.  We never would have selected anything remotely like it had we done it at marriage.  

    It feels so 2008 (none / 0) (#91)
    by nycstray on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 04:34:10 PM EST
    Not sure it's such a good idea 4yrs down the road . . .

    My or anyone else's age (none / 0) (#94)
    by BTAL on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 04:40:35 PM EST
    has nothing to do with the subject, but a A for deflection effort.

    Next up will be red kettles and bells outside Wal-Mart for campaign volunteers to man.


    Just thought maybe your reaction (none / 0) (#102)
    by Farmboy on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 04:52:48 PM EST
    to the idea of gift donations was because it had been a while since you needed to peruse a wedding gift suggestion list. That's why I provided a link to help out. Based on your response, however, your reaction stems from some other cause.

    Sorry if I offended by wondering about your age but at least in my experience as you get older you attend fewer weddings - and christenings and bar mitzvahs, etc. - and more retirement parties and funerals.


    Its the RW talking point of the day (none / 0) (#107)
    by MileHi Hawkeye on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 04:57:30 PM EST
    faithfully recreated at the other blogs I read right on cue.  

    Is it? I thought they were still on about how (none / 0) (#113)
    by Farmboy on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 05:29:23 PM EST
    Obama personally gave his step-grandfather's handguns to Mexican drug dealers so he could then use executive privilege to take our 2nd amendment rights away.

    Or was about how Obama said just a few months ago that he couldn't enact the DREAM act without congress, and then he rolled up the constitution in a giant Marley and shared it with 800,000 illegal aliens?

    Something like that, at any rate. It's hard to keep the swamp gas bubbles straight as they burble up from the muck.


    No offense taken regarding (none / 0) (#126)
    by BTAL on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 06:38:25 PM EST
    age.  And I understand your point regarding weddings, etc.

    The point being (as mentioned by others) is that for the POTUS to ask people to give his campaign money instead of a birthday, wedding, etc. gift is tacky at best.  Hence, the repeated reference to red kettle begging outside Wal-Mart.


    I thought you guys (none / 0) (#114)
    by jondee on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 05:29:42 PM EST
    were all down with higher-office-seeking being a money raising contest..

    I'm just wodering if there's some conservative article of faith that dictates that they all have to vote for Obama if he winds up with more money than Romney..


    Nope (none / 0) (#125)
    by BTAL on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 06:35:08 PM EST
    But there is a red kettle and bell waiting for you at the local campaign office.

    In which case you'd be talking (none / 0) (#128)
    by jondee on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 08:14:59 PM EST
    about how Democrats are making a mockery of a Christian holiday cherished by millions of (legitimate) American citizens -- and about how Obama doesn't mind doing it because his religious affiliation is still an open question..

    Or some such warmed-over Fox, talk radio swill..


    Swing and a miss (none / 0) (#137)
    by BTAL on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 09:35:53 PM EST
    Try again.

    Even by your standards, that was completely lame.


    A DK diarist named Armando (none / 0) (#74)
    by oculus on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 03:20:08 PM EST
    has an excellent post up at DK entitled:  President Obama addresses National Association of Latino Elected Officials.

    So its really... (5.00 / 1) (#85)
    by MileHi Hawkeye on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 04:18:12 PM EST
    "Too busy. No blogging for you."

    Too busy to blog about (5.00 / 2) (#89)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 04:30:17 PM EST

    We could use you (5.00 / 3) (#103)
    by Zorba on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 04:52:58 PM EST
    Back here posting, BTD.  I'm beginning to think that this site should be renamed "Talk Zimmerman.".

    I am not opposed to groveling for (5.00 / 3) (#109)
    by Anne on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 05:06:52 PM EST
    something to discuss that doesn't start with "G" and end with "Zimmerman," so keep that in mind; we might even be able to get a group-grovel going...  

    Even if all you did was cross-post your DK writings, I can assure you that many of us would be eternally grateful.


    Ah, the irony (none / 0) (#115)
    by SuzieTampa on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 05:31:45 PM EST
    of commenting on a subject that you wish fewer people would comment on. :)

    Ain't it the truth? (none / 0) (#122)
    by Zorba on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 06:00:36 PM EST
    But it's either b!tch here on an open thread, or inundate Jeralyn with our complaining emails.   ;-)

    I feel like a dufus, (none / 0) (#117)
    by DizzyMissL on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 05:35:17 PM EST
    but can someone explain how the rating system works?  What does the Rate All button do?

    You can rate (none / 0) (#119)
    by Zorba on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 05:48:56 PM EST
    a comment anywhere from "5" (if you strongly agree with it) to "1" (if you strongly disagree), and anywhere in between.  In order to have your rating show up, then you click on "Rate All."  If you have rated more than one comment in a thread, this will also post your scores on all the comments you have rated in that thread.

    "1" is lousy and "5" (none / 0) (#120)
    by oculus on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 05:51:18 PM EST
     os great.  But then, for some reason unknown to me, you must push "rate all" for your rating to be submitted.  

    It took me a while to (none / 0) (#132)
    by sj on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 08:47:21 PM EST
    figure out that "rate all" notation.  I take it to mean rate all that I have marked.  I go through the thread and assign ratings and once I've read all the new comments I click "rate all" to submit all the ratings I've assigned in one swell foop.  

    I like that ratings aren't automatically submitted as they are on some sites.  There would be a whole lot more 1's from me and I don't need to be passing those out willy-nilly like that.


    Please consider reading (none / 0) (#121)
    by oculus on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 05:56:21 PM EST
    Anthony Shadid's non-fiction "House of Stone."  An interesting, touching account of his renovating the abandoned home of his great-great grandparents in Southern Lebanon.  Lots of history of the region, religious tolerance/intolerance, working with the local tradesmen re restoring the house, and his reflections on the ME in general.  Sadly, he died in Syria after finishing the book.  He was the Beirut bureau chief for NYT.  

    BREAKING: The jury's in on Jerry Sandusky. (none / 0) (#136)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Fri Jun 22, 2012 at 09:21:58 PM EST
    He's found guilty on 45 of the 48 counts against him.

    O'Mara finally comes out with it (none / 0) (#149)
    by Redbrow on Sat Jun 23, 2012 at 12:34:09 AM EST
    Motion to dismiss on 6/29?

    After his client was charged in April, O'Mara said in a press conference that he doesn't think Zimmerman can get a fair trial, but hoped that the judge might throw out the case before that point.


    O'Mara (none / 0) (#157)
    by CoralGables on Sat Jun 23, 2012 at 10:29:01 AM EST
    would probably have a better chance of cashing a bet on the Cubs winning the World Series this year than he would getting the charges dismissed in this case.

    Hey hey hey....low blow (none / 0) (#158)
    by ruffian on Sat Jun 23, 2012 at 11:40:28 AM EST