President Obama's Press Conference on CT Shootings

President Obama is speaking now.

It looks like he's reading from a statement but he's not reading all of it.

We're going to have come together and take meaningful action to prevent more tragedies like this regardless of the politics.
Short statement. He was emotional and seemed angry to me when he walked off. It seemed to me he didn't like some of his prepared remarks. He was perusing them but not saying anything for seconds at a time.

< Obama Addresses CO and WA Marijuana Laws | Conn. School Shooting: 27 Dead, Including 20 Children >
  • The Online Magazine with Liberal coverage of crime-related political and injustice news

  • Contribute To TalkLeft

  • Display: Sort:
    I have never seen Obama so emotional (5.00 / 2) (#1)
    by magster on Fri Dec 14, 2012 at 02:25:29 PM EST

    The President had perfect pitch. (5.00 / 5) (#2)
    by mogal on Fri Dec 14, 2012 at 02:28:11 PM EST
    Let us pray that this is the event that changes the course and discussion of the possession of guns.

    More despair than anger (5.00 / 1) (#3)
    by MKS on Fri Dec 14, 2012 at 02:35:48 PM EST
    CBS reporting that two bodies found in the home....

    CBS has a former FBI Deputy Director on air, and he is calm but apparently has very good sources and is very informative.

    From what I've read, Obama was expressing his (5.00 / 2) (#4)
    by MO Blue on Fri Dec 14, 2012 at 02:44:23 PM EST
    heartfelt grief over the situation.

    ....Obama said, noting the country has had "too many of these tragedies in the last few years.

    "Each time I learn the news I react not as a president, but as anyone else would -- as a parent. And that was especially true today," Obama said. "I know there's not a parent in America who doesn't feel the same overwhelming grief that I do."

    I believe that this was a very genuine response from the President.


    He did seem emotional and angry (5.00 / 2) (#6)
    by smott on Fri Dec 14, 2012 at 02:50:38 PM EST
    ...but I'm at the point where these words just seem so empty to me...unless there will be some meaningful action taken.

    And that would require real conviction and political cojones from Obama. So I am not expecting much, sadly.


    Obama might surprise you this time (5.00 / 2) (#19)
    by The Addams Family on Fri Dec 14, 2012 at 04:04:08 PM EST
    he talked about the need to "come together and take meaningful action to prevent more tragedies like this, regardless of the politics" (emphasis added)

    watch the video - the president sure looks & sounds as if he means what he said


    Hope you're right! (none / 0) (#20)
    by smott on Fri Dec 14, 2012 at 04:09:42 PM EST
    Last four years have gotten me to where I'll have to see to believe though...sigh.

    I have to agree with (5.00 / 2) (#25)
    by indy in sc on Fri Dec 14, 2012 at 04:44:06 PM EST
    Addams Family.  This statement felt different from the President.  Watching him, you really got the sense that this particular tragedy shook him to his core.  I also think this has hit/will hit the American people much differently than pass mass shootings given the number of very young children involved.  Once the names and pictures of the young children who were so brutally murdered start being released, I truly believe the people will demand sensible gun control.

    It shouldn't take a tragedy like this, but unfortunately, it was a little too easy to distance yourself from other mass shootings--this one, involving kindergartners and their teachers is hard to get past.


    Perhaps (1.50 / 2) (#35)
    by smott on Fri Dec 14, 2012 at 05:03:15 PM EST
    We have found something that Obama genuinely cares about, is emotional about, is truly motivated about.

    We've all talked the last 4 years re "What does Obama really care about - does he have any true convictions?" and so on....

    Well - maybe we've found an issue.

    Perhaps this is Obama's litmus test.

    If so, and he passes it, and we see meaningful change in gun laws, then Bravo.

    But as I said - I will have to see to believe, at this point.


    Kindergartners (none / 0) (#28)
    by MKS on Fri Dec 14, 2012 at 04:45:56 PM EST
    ....still hard to believe....

    Sensible gun control laws (none / 0) (#52)
    by TeresaInPa on Sat Dec 15, 2012 at 05:56:32 AM EST
    we have them.  Certainly CT does.  Seems to me what we don't have is sensible treatment of mental illness and a society with a place for everyone to "be" to work, to be part of a more cohesively woven fabric.

    This is horrid... (none / 0) (#69)
    by Cashmere on Sat Dec 15, 2012 at 12:15:34 PM EST
    I just have my doubts re: any changes, after all, I do not think anything changed after the Amish shootings at the school.  Granted, Obama was not the President then.

    The video was harder to find than I expected (5.00 / 5) (#30)
    by sj on Fri Dec 14, 2012 at 04:47:24 PM EST
    but it confirms this.  I was deeply moved by the remarks and by O's own emotion.

    Right now I have such a thin skin.  Babies.  They were babies.  I don't have a place to hold my response to that.


    They were babies. That is what keeps running (5.00 / 7) (#32)
    by caseyOR on Fri Dec 14, 2012 at 04:51:36 PM EST
    through my head.

    Babies. They were babies. I don't know what to do with this. My heart hurts.


    Rare front-page opinion piece in K.C. Star (5.00 / 5) (#68)
    by MO Blue on Sat Dec 15, 2012 at 12:00:25 PM EST
    The nation has a duty to protect its tiniest, most vulnerable citizens. Our children.

    America is failing at this task, and the proof is lying in Connecticut morgues.

    Don't dare forget the children of Sandy Hook Elementary School.

    Every last one of the 20 precious souls who died Friday deserves a more pertinent and lasting memorial than the shock of a nation reeling.

    They deserve deep, contemplative thought and action. They deserve changes in how we manage the right to own weaponry in America.

    If the slaughter of a classroom of children isn't enough to press for reasonable gun control, then nothing will help America. We might as well hand out NRA memberships with birth certificates. link

    video totally confirms this (none / 0) (#17)
    by The Addams Family on Fri Dec 14, 2012 at 03:59:19 PM EST
    I had a totally different impression (5.00 / 5) (#7)
    by fuzzyone on Fri Dec 14, 2012 at 02:53:50 PM EST
    I though he was overcome by emotion and just having trouble reading the statement. I was really moved by the emotion he showed.

    I can't even post about this one (5.00 / 2) (#9)
    by CST on Fri Dec 14, 2012 at 03:16:11 PM EST
    nevermind read a televised speech about it - but then again I'm not the president.

    I guess he had to say something.  Not really anything I can say at this point.  Of course he's emotional and angry.  I can't think of another possible response to this.

    Thanks to Kos diarist., what we're up against... (5.00 / 1) (#21)
    by magster on Fri Dec 14, 2012 at 04:09:48 PM EST
    Some commenters at FreeRepublic have posted the following:

    "He is coming after your guns. This is it that will get him cover."

    "It's folks like him who are responsible for many of these mass shootings..."

    "The left will find a way to make political hay off this murder"

    "Alternative title; 0bama Demagogues Gun Control With the Blood of Children"

     ""0bama Demagogues Gun Control With the Blood of Children"
    That's old news. Obama should have been impeached long ago for intentionally creating gun violence against innocent children in order to advance what he's about to advance in the weeks ahead. Elections have consequences. "

    "I have no reason not to believe this pResident was not somehow directly or indirectly behind the mass murders that occurred today or all the others that have happened under his pResidency."

    "Here's a novel idea. ALL teachers and school staff are required to take a firearms safety and proficiency course taught by law enforcement. Then they are issued a standard pistol and ammo or they can get their own side arm and approved ammo. Now ever six months all teachers and staff are required to go to the range for proficiency training. Here's the good part, all teachers and stall are required to OPEN carry while in a paid status at the school."

    "I have told my wife that since the left has thrown God out of the public arena (USA has turned its back on God), and killed the God-given institution of Marriage between a man and a woman, the country has gone to hell ever since."

    "You're absolutely right. Muslims set up their bases right in the schools."

    "Prayers for the families of those lost, but liberalism and gun control have to take some responsibility for making these kids and their teachers totally helpless along with the savage murderer. "

    "Obama has the massacre he's been waiting for."

    "... not much of a life Barry, paying for your callous spending spree. The children are with God and free from tyranny and debt"

    I have nothing to say to that (5.00 / 1) (#23)
    by sj on Fri Dec 14, 2012 at 04:37:46 PM EST
    except that I wish I could say that was unbelievable.  But FreeRepublic has always been like that.

    Separation of church and state not (5.00 / 5) (#31)
    by MO Blue on Fri Dec 14, 2012 at 04:50:46 PM EST
    guns responsible for the massacre.

    Former Arkansas governor Mike Huckabee attributed the mass shooting at Sandy Hook Elementary School in part to restrictions on school prayer and religious materials in the classroom.

    "We ask why there is violence in our schools, but we have systematically removed God from our schools," Huckabee said on Fox News, discussing the murder spree that took the lives of 20 children and 6 adults in Newtown, CT that morning. "Should we be so surprised that schools would become a place of carnage?" link

    I'm old enough to remember a time when neither God nor guns were in our public schools.


    Bryan Fischer of the AFA ... (5.00 / 1) (#42)
    by Yman on Fri Dec 14, 2012 at 06:52:59 PM EST
    ... made the same argument.

    'God didn't stop the shooting because he is a "gentleman" who "doesn't go where he's not wanted".'

    Not any G0d I'd ever have anything to do with ...


    Taking (5.00 / 3) (#54)
    by lentinel on Sat Dec 15, 2012 at 06:31:44 AM EST
    into account the number of Churches, Synagogues, Temples and Mosques where there have been shootings and bombings, the God these guys envision must be rather paranoid.

    The ambulatory morons (5.00 / 2) (#70)
    by jondee on Sat Dec 15, 2012 at 12:36:16 PM EST
    who've said, or implied, that Hitler was doing God's work..

    As Dylan said, it's a wonder that they still know how to breathe.


    Comments (5.00 / 2) (#51)
    by lentinel on Sat Dec 15, 2012 at 03:45:54 AM EST
    by people, even nutty people, is not "what we"re up against".

    It"s all too easy access to weapons.
    And the complete lack of will to do anything about it.

    That's what we're up against.


    Richard Hofstadter (none / 0) (#26)
    by The Addams Family on Fri Dec 14, 2012 at 04:44:51 PM EST
    How many people out there (none / 0) (#29)
    by MKS on Fri Dec 14, 2012 at 04:47:09 PM EST
    are really like that.....Could it be a majority of Republicans?

    Absolutely. No question. Believe it. (5.00 / 1) (#36)
    by sarcastic unnamed one on Fri Dec 14, 2012 at 05:03:36 PM EST
    OK, my comment was snark, (none / 0) (#44)
    by sarcastic unnamed one on Fri Dec 14, 2012 at 07:55:42 PM EST
    in case it was not completely obvious. Puhleeze.

    Not a majority.. (5.00 / 2) (#71)
    by jondee on Sat Dec 15, 2012 at 12:38:09 PM EST
    but in some states, they couldn't elect a dog catcher without them.

    a significant minority (5.00 / 1) (#41)
    by The Addams Family on Fri Dec 14, 2012 at 06:17:36 PM EST
    still sincerely convinced that communism is lurking right behind all the creeping socialism, and that the fate of the nation rests on restoring life as it was before the New Deal

    I find fascinating how many media (5.00 / 1) (#40)
    by Towanda on Fri Dec 14, 2012 at 06:05:22 PM EST
    are paraphrasing Obama's examples of the movie theater and the shopping mall -- but not including that he spoke, in the same sentence, of the mass murder in the temple.  

    Of course, those victims were not nice white Protestant people in an upscale burb.

    Here we (5.00 / 1) (#53)
    by lentinel on Sat Dec 15, 2012 at 06:20:08 AM EST
    go again.

    Obama says that we need, "meaningful action".
    He flies the flag at half-mast.
    He reads from the Bible.

    I understand the skepticism, ... (5.00 / 1) (#55)
    by Yman on Sat Dec 15, 2012 at 07:49:03 AM EST
    ... and while I usually don't read much into a pol's response/appearance, his response appeared to be very genuine.

    We'll have to see.


    Yes, we will have to see (5.00 / 1) (#58)
    by MO Blue on Sat Dec 15, 2012 at 08:43:03 AM EST
    I agree that his response appeared to be very genuine. I believe he was speaking from the heart when he said this:

    "Each time I learn the news I react not as a president, but as anyone else would -- as a parent.

    Yet as in all things, there can be more than one truth.

    While Obama's comments are his most forceful yet on the issue, his record on the subject of gun control is anything but reassuring to lawmakers and groups hoping to tighten the country's regulations.

    People rushed to buy guns in the run-up to Obama's inauguration in 2009, fearing he would make it more difficult to obtain firearms. But Obama's main actions in the White House during his first time have been to loosen gun laws by allowing people to carry firearms on Amtrak trains and in national parks. link

    Yes, we will have to see.


    Appearance (5.00 / 1) (#59)
    by lentinel on Sat Dec 15, 2012 at 09:04:08 AM EST
    is one thing.

    I don't really care how genuine he appeared to be.
    Sometimes, he identifies as a parent.
    Sometimes, notably relating to events in other countries in which we have a presence, not so much.

    Regardless, since the Bible has been brought into this yet again, let me quote Matthew 7:16: "By his works ye shall know him."

    To quote the more contemporary aphorism, actions speak louder than words, and as MO Blue points out below, "...Obama's main actions in the White House during his first time have been to loosen gun laws by allowing people to carry firearms on Amtrak trains and in national parks."

    And - about pols:

    Many of them have mastered the art of appearing genuine.
    A good example is Clinton's famous "that woman" speech. Even when you know he is out and out lying, he "appears genuine".

    So, I no longer judge by the appearance of genuine emotion. It's too easy to fake.


    The instant he said... (none / 0) (#73)
    by unitron on Sat Dec 15, 2012 at 08:04:29 PM EST
    ..."that woman", in that contempuous tone which he quickly tried to cover up by using her name, I knew as sure as I ever knew anything that he was lying right to our faces.

    He could have said "I have absolutely no intention whatsoever of discussing this young lady's private life" and ignored any follow-up questions involving her.

    But instead he lied to us.

    He should have resigned in shame (for the lie, not the sex, or the location of the sex) the day he had exhausted enough of his second term that Al could still run for re-election in both 2000 and 2004.


    Perspective (5.00 / 4) (#56)
    by Reconstructionist on Sat Dec 15, 2012 at 08:29:22 AM EST
     To me, at least, it is perfectly understandable that rampages such as this provoke discussion of the problems guns in our society create (and I'm using "create" intentionally). I'd be concerned if they didn't cause people to bring up the subject.

      That so many of the dscussions follow in the immediate aftermath of a mass killing though can distort perspective and lead to the rather inane retort that guns are not necessary to kill, which is true but rather beside the point.

      The point is that easy access to guns does mean more people die-- and not just more people at one time in incidents such as this. When an angry husband lashes out as his  wife or a couple of drunks get in a fight someone is FAR more likely to die if a gun is present. The disingenous nonsense about well bombs can kill too doesn't come into play in these and all the more common gun killing scenarios. People die because someone has a highly effective and efficient killing machine that takes no forethought to use. Less people would die if these violent incidents involved no weapons or weapons less deadly than a gun. that is inarguable fact.

      Positing that a  person could assemble the materials to build a bomb and take the bomb somewhere where many people are present and detonate it in no way whatsoever supports the proposition that just as many people would die even  if there were fewer guns in fewer hands.

      I have said I do believ Heller was correctly decided and that the 2nd Amendment does confer an individual right to bear arms. That's because I'm a lawyer with a history degree who tries as best I can not to let my personal biases infect my analysis. It's not because I think it is good policy to make it so easy to obatain and keep firearms in our present day society. I don't favor banning private gun ownership because I don't think it is either  justified or practically possible. I do firmly believe we need to take strong steps to restrict certain types of firearms and to increase the numbers of people who are not allowed to possess firearms, and we need to enforce such laws vigilantly.

      Obviously, that will not stop all gun killings let alone all killings. It should not bear repeating but sometimes it it seems necessary to remind that less of a bad thing is better than more of a bad thing. That an  action will only reduce not eliminate a bad thing is only a good argument against taking the action when the negative consequences of the action outweigh the reduction of bad.

      I've heard all the arguments against gun control (and even agree with some of them) but I defy anyone to give me a sound argument that the negative consequences of reasonable restrictions outweigh larger numbers of dead people lack of such restrictions cause.

    indeed (none / 0) (#63)
    by smott on Sat Dec 15, 2012 at 10:11:28 AM EST
    An angry man without a gun is just an angry man.

    Jeralyn (5.00 / 3) (#57)
    by CoralGables on Sat Dec 15, 2012 at 08:29:48 AM EST
    Just curious as I do my best to abide by the site rules. You stated that this was the thread to discuss any debate on gun control control laws since Obama did mention the need for "meaningful action".

    Yet you deleted the link to the White House petition that was asking for meaningful action. Could you tell me why posting that link went against what you said this thread was for?

    Almost 75,000 have signed the petition (5.00 / 4) (#60)
    by Towanda on Sat Dec 15, 2012 at 09:23:07 AM EST
    to the White House, within only the first hours since it went up, and I'm glad that I got word of it on another blog, anyway.  I was coming here to post the link, but if it means another comment of mine will be disappeared, I won't bother.  I will tell others to go to whitehouse.gov and look up the link to petitions and. . . .

    The signatures this morning (5.00 / 1) (#67)
    by CoralGables on Sat Dec 15, 2012 at 11:03:24 AM EST
    are coming in at a little over 3000 per hour. At that pace it should become the #1 signed White House petition by midnight on the east coast.

    Looked it up (none / 0) (#64)
    by Yman on Sat Dec 15, 2012 at 10:23:33 AM EST
    Apparently, someone has also posted a counter-petition to arm teachers and principals, seeking a "gun in ever classroom".

    Didn't realize anyone could post a petition on the Whitehouse site.


    Oh, yeah... (none / 0) (#74)
    by unitron on Sat Dec 15, 2012 at 08:08:00 PM EST
    ...as soon as he got re-elected, it flooded with petitions for secession for every state.

    And I think someone started up one asking him to force Texas out of the union as well. : - )


    Those going on the Whitehouse site (5.00 / 2) (#65)
    by MO Blue on Sat Dec 15, 2012 at 10:28:09 AM EST
    to petition for meaningful action on guns might also want to sign the petition to Make Mental Health a National Emergency

    It is my belief that we must have a two prone approach to this problem.


    Allow me to suggest... (none / 0) (#75)
    by unitron on Sat Dec 15, 2012 at 08:10:21 PM EST
    ...a two pronged approach instead, we've been prone on both issues quite long enough.

    However, solving the mental health problem would make huge inroads in the gun problem all by itself.


    Yes, I saw my spelling error (none / 0) (#76)
    by MO Blue on Sat Dec 15, 2012 at 09:09:25 PM EST
    almost immediately after I hit post. I use to correct my spelling, grammar and proof reading errors in another attached comment but it became tedious since I do it so often.



    Susie Madrak poses a good question (5.00 / 2) (#61)
    by MO Blue on Sat Dec 15, 2012 at 09:37:09 AM EST
    regarding the logic legislatures in Michigan are using to justify their new law to allow carrying concealed weapons into schools, churches and stadiums as well as doing away with county boards currently overseeing concealed pistol licensing.

    And you know what? If they really believe their insane rationale, how come you're not allowed to carry a gun in Michigan's state capitol, or when you visit a legislator's office? Maybe some brave reporter (yeah, right) should ask them: link

    Going with the logic of "If you have pistol free zones they are actually mass murderer empowerment zones," why do they want to make the state capitol and their offices a "murderer empowerment zone."

    Stricter gun laws will not make people (5.00 / 1) (#66)
    by Politalkix on Sat Dec 15, 2012 at 10:56:46 AM EST
    kill with bombs or other weapons as is being spuriously argued by some. Please read this article about Japan.

    I think this shooting and killing of so many (5.00 / 1) (#72)
    by Angel on Sat Dec 15, 2012 at 03:04:05 PM EST
    innocent babies is the tipping point for gun control legislation.  I do believe we will see something from President Obama.

    From MSNBC (none / 0) (#5)
    by ScottW714 on Fri Dec 14, 2012 at 02:49:56 PM EST
    A teacher's son clad in black and carrying two guns rampaged through a Connecticut elementary school Friday, killing 18 small children and seven adults, including his mother, in the nation's second-worst school shooting, law enforcement officials said.

    The gunman, identified as Ryan Lanza, 24, of Hoboken, N.J., was also found dead at Sandy Hook Elementary School in Newtown, a federal law enforcement official said.

    Lanza's mother is a kindergarten teacher at the hilltop school, and it's inside her classroom where most of the casualties were found, according to NBCNewYork.com.


    Correction: Adam Lanza (none / 0) (#8)
    by Towanda on Fri Dec 14, 2012 at 03:00:04 PM EST
    according to some updates.  Brother of Ryan.  The latter may be the brother who was reported as also killed, but I have not seen word as to whether there were more than two brothers in the family.

    The surviving brother (5.00 / 3) (#11)
    by MKS on Fri Dec 14, 2012 at 03:29:27 PM EST
    must be going through pure hell right now....All his family killed, being questioned by the authorities, having been mis-identified as the shooter.

    Reports that (none / 0) (#10)
    by smott on Fri Dec 14, 2012 at 03:29:23 PM EST
    He killed his father at home and his mother at the school...



    Fox says the father (none / 0) (#15)
    by Jeralyn on Fri Dec 14, 2012 at 03:53:00 PM EST
    is alive.

    A law enforcement official in Washington said the attacker, who was killed at the scene, was a 20-year-old man named Adam Lanza, whose mother was a teacher at the school and was one of the adults killed. His brother Ryan Lanza, 24, is a suspect and is being questioned by New Jersey police. Lanza's father is alive but Adam's girlfriend is missing, according to authorities.

    Authorities are looking investigating Lanza's Hoboken, N.J., home.

    According to WFSB-TV, Adam was carrying ... (none / 0) (#12)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Fri Dec 14, 2012 at 03:36:35 PM EST
    ... his brother's ID on him at the time of the shootings, and that accounted for his body's initial misidentification by authorities.

    Here's a link to ... (none / 0) (#13)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Fri Dec 14, 2012 at 03:43:45 PM EST
    ... WFSB-TV's live feed. That's the local station for the Newtown / Rocky Hill region of eastern Connecticut.

    I hope he was angry (none / 0) (#14)
    by Yman on Fri Dec 14, 2012 at 03:49:52 PM EST
    We should all be angry.

    domestic terrorism? (none / 0) (#16)
    by ricardo on Fri Dec 14, 2012 at 03:57:53 PM EST
    I'm thinking that the revulsion against the growing number of mass shootings (culminating in today's horrific incident) may be such that a consensus will emerge for them to be labeled - rightly or wrongly - simply as domestic terrorism.

    With that label affixed, the whole apparatus of our security state - mass wiretapping, computer surveillance - might be directed towards the apprehension of individuals suspected as would-be shooters.

    The civil liberty implications are real and perhaps disturbing, but Americans on the whole seem much more comfortable having their rights of privacy and unreasonable seizure abridged than enduring a challenge to their right to bear arms.

    What rights of privacy and unreasonable seizure (5.00 / 2) (#18)
    by vicndabx on Fri Dec 14, 2012 at 04:03:03 PM EST
    need be abrigded?  When was the last time you obtained a driver's license?

    Timeline of mass shootings in last 30 years... (none / 0) (#24)
    by magster on Fri Dec 14, 2012 at 04:38:08 PM EST
    ... that involved at least 4 deaths.

    Think Progress also has a timeline of mass (5.00 / 1) (#47)
    by MO Blue on Fri Dec 14, 2012 at 09:43:26 PM EST
    shootings in the US since the Columbine High massacre.

    On Friday morning, 27 people were reportedly shot and killed at Sandy Hook elementary school in Newtown, CT. According to sources, 18 of these casualties were children. This is the second mass shooting in the US this week, after a gunman opened fire in an Oregon shopping mall on Tuesday, killing 2. ABC News reports that there have been 31 school shootings in the US since Columbine in 1999, when 13 people were killed.

    The rate of people killed by guns in the US is 19.5 times higher than similar high-income countries in the world. In the last 30 years since 1982, America has mourned at least 61 mass murders. Think Progress

    "politicizing" the tragedy (5.00 / 9) (#48)
    by MO Blue on Fri Dec 14, 2012 at 11:38:49 PM EST
    When we first collected much of this data, it was after the Aurora, Colo. shootings, and the air was thick with calls to avoid "politicizing" the tragedy. That is code, essentially, for "don't talk about reforming our gun control laws."

    Let's be clear: That is a form of politicization. When political actors construct a political argument that threatens political consequences if other political actors pursue a certain political outcome, that is, almost by definition, a politicization of the issue. It's just a form of politicization favoring those who prefer the status quo to stricter gun control laws.
    If roads were collapsing all across the United States, killing dozens of drivers, we would surely see that as a moment to talk about what we could do to keep roads from collapsing. If terrorists were detonating bombs in port after port, you can be sure Congress would be working to upgrade the nation's security measures. If a plague was ripping through communities, public-health officials would be working feverishly to contain it.

    Only with gun violence do we respond to repeated tragedies by saying that mourning is acceptable but discussing how to prevent more tragedies is not. "Too soon," howl supporters of loose gun laws. But as others have observed, talking about how to stop mass shootings in the aftermath of a string of mass shootings isn't "too soon." It's much too late.

    Source: Twelve facts about guns and mass shootings in the United States

    Amen (5.00 / 2) (#49)
    by Lena on Sat Dec 15, 2012 at 12:18:17 AM EST
    I guess the problem with discussing gun laws after gun violence is that any closer look at them might highlight how nonsensical and gap-filled our laws are. Better for the furor to die down after a mass shooting so that people don't use their grief and anger to mobilize and demand tougher gun laws.

    Today I feel like I did on 9/11. I can't even comprehend that an act like this is possible.


    Not discussing how to prevent more tragedies (5.00 / 2) (#50)
    by MO Blue on Sat Dec 15, 2012 at 01:21:45 AM EST
    such as this IMO allows us as a country to avoid many issues that need to be addressed. The lack of common sense gun controls, adequate mental health programs and research into identifying and treating at risk individuals just to mention a few of these issues.  

    Australian studies have found that most (more than 75%) of people with a serious mental illness had their first episode before the age of 25, with the highest prevalence found among those in the 18-24 age group. This statistics highlights the importance of mental heath awareness in young adults, so that emerging schizophrenia and other serious mental health disorders can be quickly identified and treated.

    Jared Loughner was definitely schizophrenic. Here is what a psychiatrist and one of the foremost experts on paranoid schizophrenics said at the time:

    During media coverage of stories like this, we often hear that we should take mental health seriously in this country. What would that mean, exactly?

    It would mean you would actually have the resources to do something we haven't done yet, which is get people treatment. We have been very good at emptying the hospitals. What we haven't done is to offer treatment once people are out of the hospitals. In Arizona, for instance, they closed down most of the hospital beds. They are next to last in the United States in the availability of hospital beds for the population, and they have closed down some of the outpatient clinics. If you want to get serious about mental illness, then you need to provide the resources so people can be treated.

    And then the tricky question is: Where do those resources come from?

    This has been, for 200 years, the state's responsibility. That's why state hospitals were built. This has not been, primarily, a federal responsibility. Ultimately the states are responsible, therefore the governor's responsible, the legislature is responsible. And the Department of Mental Health should be held responsible. This is not rocket science. We know what the good programs are. Everyone has decided: It's better to save money, and we'll close down hospital beds; people who want to get help, we'll try to get them help, but we won't do much more than that. If you keep doing that, you will continue having these kinds of disasters. This is not new. If enough people become sufficiently angry, they will demand that their state government do what they should have been doing all along. Until a sufficient number of people become angry enough, it's not going to happen.  

    More on no real effort to stop these massacres (5.00 / 3) (#62)
    by MO Blue on Sat Dec 15, 2012 at 09:52:43 AM EST
    It's Easier For Americans To Access Guns Than Mental Health Services

    Most murders committed in the United States involve a firearm -- particularly handguns. A quick search shows that a typical handgun can be purchased for anywhere between $250 and $500. A .223-caliber semi-automatic rifle -- which some reports indicate was the type of firearm used in today's attack -- costs between $700 and $2000. And contrary to the gun lobby's most ardent hysteria about Barack Obama, gun ownership has actually been rising over the past four years, as has the use of guns in violent crimes.

    By comparison, access to mental health services remains spotty, its funding and beneficiary requirements subject to the whims of governments attempting to balance their bloated budgets. People often do not know when they are entitled to preventative care services for mental health, and the people who do often forgo care due to the stigma associated with receiving such care.

    And then there's the cost of more extensive care. According to the National Survey on Drug Use and Health (NSDUH), a mere 7.1 percent of all American adults receive mental health services. Most of these Americans' care is covered by private insurance, with children, poorer, and more elderly Americans being covered through public insurance programs such as Medicare and Medicaid. An additional ten percent are uninsured. But out-of-pocket costs for both inpatient and outpatient mental health services remain staggeringly high:

    The July 1, 1993 shooting (none / 0) (#37)
    by MKS on Fri Dec 14, 2012 at 05:04:49 PM EST
    on California Street was at my old law firm....One of the victims was a young lawyer who told others how to get an outside line as he lay dying.

    I  had taken a deposition in the the glass-walled conference room that was shot up just a couple months prior to the incident....Chuck Ehrlich, the head of litigation became an advocate of gun control.  The firm imploded, which was not direclty caused by this event, but was more of the crowning blow that sent it under.


    Guess They Don't Have... (none / 0) (#27)
    by ScottW714 on Fri Dec 14, 2012 at 04:45:11 PM EST
    ...Craigs List in Italy.

    that comment was deleted (none / 0) (#39)
    by Jeralyn on Fri Dec 14, 2012 at 06:00:09 PM EST
    please don't post garbage you read elsewhere here.

    Ryan Lanza has told authorities (none / 0) (#38)
    by sarcastic unnamed one on Fri Dec 14, 2012 at 05:18:40 PM EST
    Ryan Lanza has told authorities that his younger brother is autistic, or has Asperger syndrome and a "personality disorder." Neighbors described the younger man to ABC as "odd" and displaying characteristics associated with obsessive-compulsive disorder.