Sunday Afternoon Open Thread

Yesterday it was 84 degrees in Denver. Today, it's snowing.

I-70 is closed in both directions at the tunnel.

I-70 CLOSED in both directions from Silverthorne to Idaho Springs (MM 205-241) and from Vail Pass to Copper Mounain (MM 180-195) due to adverse conditions and multiple accidents. No estimated time for reopen. Reported Time: April 3rd, 2011 at 1:14 PM

This is an open thread, all topics welcome.

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    interesting (5.00 / 1) (#14)
    by Ga6thDem on Sun Apr 03, 2011 at 07:28:33 PM EST
    article on Obama's approval rating:

    He still has a huge problem with women voters garnering only 44% on both approve and disapprove.

    A more telling poll would be one (5.00 / 1) (#18)
    by shoephone on Sun Apr 03, 2011 at 09:22:24 PM EST
    that shows the percentage of women-registered-as-Democrats-and-most-likely-to-vote.

    Too early (none / 0) (#27)
    by Ga6thDem on Mon Apr 04, 2011 at 05:33:48 AM EST
    for that. Maybe next year as the election gets closer, the pollsters will start with that information.

    This is also telling: (none / 0) (#20)
    by Robot Porter on Sun Apr 03, 2011 at 09:44:11 PM EST
    According to the poll, 47 percent of Americans are opposed to the U.S. government's involvement in military actions in Libya; 41 percent of Americans support those actions. Depending on how things play out in that country, Obama could see his approval ratings plummet even further.

    I wish the opposition number was larger.  But it's nice to see a huge percentage of the American public wasn't buffaloed by the Libyan war propaganda.


    If it would make you feel better...... (none / 0) (#24)
    by NYShooter on Sun Apr 03, 2011 at 11:48:58 PM EST
    I heard on the radio tonight that a new poll came out stating that a majority of Americans think Nancy Pelosi is still Speaker of the House.

    In a corollary,  they said that the Republicans are doing nothing to dissuade that belief as the upcoming, potential Government shutdown would be blamed on the democrats, and that evil, Nancy Pelosi.

    So much for taking too seriously what the American Public "thinks."


    Snow in April (none / 0) (#1)
    by scribe on Sun Apr 03, 2011 at 02:47:57 PM EST
    departs quickly.

    One of my great-grandfathers grew up a tenant farmer on some count's land in central Europe.  He was barely literate - enough to write his name and maybe read a little in church - but he was nonetheless quite intelligent.  He had a couple sayings (passed down to me by my dad) among which was that "the most useless tool made was a snow shovel.  Come June, the snow will be gone all by itself."

    Boy do we need it! (none / 0) (#2)
    by MileHi Hawkeye on Sun Apr 03, 2011 at 03:31:42 PM EST
    The grocery store was packed--I guess everyone is a little freaked out.  

    Now for something completely different...

    Eagle babies!

    Two have hatched and the third one will be busting out any time now.  They're like little fuzzy weebles--only they do fall down.  

    Fun facts:  the nest is 8 stories up, weighs 1.5 tons and is 5-6 feet wide and about the same in depth.  

    Bonus points if you can find the mouse and the rabbit in the nest.

    Feeding them right now (none / 0) (#3)
    by CoralGables on Sun Apr 03, 2011 at 04:57:12 PM EST
    it's addictive watching

    Feeding time is the best! (none / 0) (#8)
    by MileHi Hawkeye on Sun Apr 03, 2011 at 06:15:25 PM EST
    And it looks like Dad just brought back another rabbit and a bird of some sort (crow?).  

    Mom and Dad are both in the nest right now.  Still hard to tell which is which...


    It must be buffet hour (none / 0) (#7)
    by CoralGables on Sun Apr 03, 2011 at 06:14:02 PM EST
    as I believe you can now add a fish and a bird to the menu of mouse and rabbit

    Missed the fish... (none / 0) (#12)
    by MileHi Hawkeye on Sun Apr 03, 2011 at 06:35:49 PM EST
    ...but I can see it now.  Quite the smorgasbord they got laid out--clearly an homage to Decorah's large Norwegian population.

    Needs a covered dish though, don't you know.


    Seen the rabbit and the mouse, (none / 0) (#9)
    by MO Blue on Sun Apr 03, 2011 at 06:23:38 PM EST
    a small bit of the remaining egg but so far no baby eagles. Now the mother eagle is covering everything.

    Evidently bad timing on my part. Will have to look again later.  


    you walked away (none / 0) (#10)
    by CoralGables on Sun Apr 03, 2011 at 06:25:41 PM EST
    2 minutes too soon

    Spoke too soon (none / 0) (#11)
    by MO Blue on Sun Apr 03, 2011 at 06:27:10 PM EST
    Just as I was about the click off, the mother flew away and I can see two of the babies. They are being fed now. How cute is that.

    Thanks for the link.


    Baby eagles were the top internet (none / 0) (#15)
    by MO Blue on Sun Apr 03, 2011 at 08:03:50 PM EST
    news story until a few minutes ago. The site briefly crashed due to the volume of viewers.

    A live video feed from northeast Iowa with a bird's eye view of eagle eggs hatching has attracted more than 100,000 followers -- so many that the site crashed briefly Saturday after the first eaglet emerged. link

    It even comes... (none / 0) (#16)
    by MileHi Hawkeye on Sun Apr 03, 2011 at 08:38:36 PM EST
    ...with a blooper reel.  First born latches on to Dad and gets thrown out of the nest...

    Worried about the second born--it is still too weak to keep its head up to feed.  


    Hope the second born is O.K. (none / 0) (#17)
    by MO Blue on Sun Apr 03, 2011 at 09:07:35 PM EST
    When I saw them earlier this evening it did look like the second born did manage to eat something.

    The AP article said the third would hatch in about 3 days. That seems like a long time between births. But I guess they know what they are talking about.  


    looked like the baby got a couple bites in (none / 0) (#19)
    by nycstray on Sun Apr 03, 2011 at 09:40:03 PM EST
    when I watched earlier today, after that, it seemed to run out of energy to hold its head up. The parent that was feeding it was pretty intent on trying though, so fingers crossed.

    Anyone seen the eaglets this Mon morn? (none / 0) (#29)
    by MO Blue on Mon Apr 04, 2011 at 10:42:28 AM EST
    Been watching this a.m. to see if the second born has gotten stronger but so far all I've seen is a parent sitting on the nest. Peeps seem to be louder and stronger than yesterday but no way for me to know if coming from one eaglet or two.

    They (none / 0) (#30)
    by CoralGables on Mon Apr 04, 2011 at 11:13:15 AM EST
    must be listening to you. You ask, and she gets up so we can see.

    Only briefly though (none / 0) (#31)
    by CoralGables on Mon Apr 04, 2011 at 11:15:24 AM EST
    they both look good today. It sounds as if the winds are much stronger today. Mommy protection mode?

    Still seriously worried about the (none / 0) (#32)
    by MO Blue on Mon Apr 04, 2011 at 11:37:10 AM EST
    second born. Momma eagle got up to feed the eaglets just a little while ago. The first born was attacking the weaker eaglet, knocking it over and preventing it from getting fed. Couldn't tell if it got anything to eat. The second born was very slow to get back up on more than one occasion.

    On a happier note, seen some movement in the third egg. It might be ready to hatch soon.  


    Can you tell (none / 0) (#33)
    by CoralGables on Mon Apr 04, 2011 at 12:15:03 PM EST
    what the new item is on the a la carte menu today? I can't make it out. They sure are stocking up on food for when these little guys are ravenous.

    Couldn't tell (none / 0) (#34)
    by MO Blue on Mon Apr 04, 2011 at 12:27:35 PM EST
    Not a rabbit IMO but looks like some type of rodent.

    Been trying to determine which eagle is (none / 0) (#35)
    by MO Blue on Mon Apr 04, 2011 at 12:31:56 PM EST
    male and which is female. Think maybe the male is on the nest now but I'm not sure. Wish they would do a close up on the face. The notes below the video state that the eyes are different but the current view is to far away for me to even try to determine if I can see the difference.

    Interesting, (none / 0) (#4)
    by lentinel on Sun Apr 03, 2011 at 05:18:39 PM EST
    isn't it?

    Libya, Libya and Libya.

    Then, it is off the front pages.

    Nuclear disaster in Japan.

    The war in Afghanistan made a rare cameo appearance thanks to a nut in Florida.

    Iraq? Pffft.

    Today it's the Ivory Coast.

    And while we were looking in the opposite direction, BP is getting ready to start drilling again.

    Except (none / 0) (#5)
    by CoralGables on Sun Apr 03, 2011 at 06:06:09 PM EST
    I pulled up the NY Times to check and 4 of the 5 you list are on the front page

    Just to be sure (none / 0) (#6)
    by CoralGables on Sun Apr 03, 2011 at 06:12:02 PM EST
    I checked the Washington Post... all five are mentioned on the front page today.

    You're (5.00 / 3) (#13)
    by lentinel on Sun Apr 03, 2011 at 07:03:34 PM EST

    It's the fever that I'm talking about.

    Each story is initially presented to us as a crisis. It dominates.
    Then, the stories move down the page - and often off the page.

    This is just my impression of things - but I think the fact about 7 tons an hour of radioactive water is escaping from one of the destroyed reactors in Japan into the Pacific - well - I think it is a major story. You have to dig to find that one.

    But, I will admit that I believe that certain events are raised to a level of a crisis by the government and the media just to keep our eyes off the ball; That ball being the wars and the corporate domination of the legislative, executive and judicial branches of government for example.

    Then they move on to something else to which they ascribe the feverish intensity. Julian Assange. Gates and Crowley...


    My front page headline this am? (none / 0) (#21)
    by ruffian on Sun Apr 03, 2011 at 09:47:19 PM EST
    Some restaurants serve some substitute fish instead of white tuna!

    And this is what, 80 miles from the Koran burning nutter? I give up.


    BP is getting ready to drill again (none / 0) (#23)
    by Militarytracy on Sun Apr 03, 2011 at 11:06:55 PM EST
    and blowout preventers don't work in deep sea drilling.  Nobody cares though, so what if they don't work?

    "Come for the dead baby dolphins, (5.00 / 1) (#25)
    by Joan in VA on Sun Apr 03, 2011 at 11:57:22 PM EST
    stay and get sick" is the Gulf Tourism Bureau's new slogan.

    BP is still using that worthless 2009 photocopied Spill Response Plan so it's all good. Apparently, no one in our government gives a fig if the Gulf is destroyed drill-site by drill-site. And if a few rig workers are blown-up? A sacrifice they're willing to make to the meme of "energy independence".


    That just hurts me (5.00 / 1) (#26)
    by nycstray on Mon Apr 04, 2011 at 12:04:45 AM EST
    in the deepest part of my gut.

    but hey! it's alright, we're getting ready to hear how safe "new" nuke plants will be . . . .


    We went to 'Sucker Punch' tonight (none / 0) (#22)
    by Militarytracy on Sun Apr 03, 2011 at 11:05:20 PM EST
    The guys liked it, but it really creeped me out.  I think with the current fairly successful war on women taking place, my issues around the treatment of women were too triggered.  I really tried to grasp what others have found intriguing about the movie, but no matter what I did I couldn't and for the most part felt sort of haunted and depressed and glad when it was finally over.  My husband liked it though and labeled it a guy flick, not in a bad way....just more of a guy flick.

    This article (none / 0) (#28)
    by lilburro on Mon Apr 04, 2011 at 10:04:15 AM EST
    explains more or less why I liked Sucker Punch, because I think they achieved what they set out to do:  www.io9.com.

    To me it was a commentary on action movies in general and on movies like Tomb Raider.  She does cool things, and oh it's just a coincidence that she dresses in this kind of campy, provocative way.  As a woman, the Tomb Raider movies were not particularly empowering to me.  

    This movie takes place in an asylum, which if you know anything about asylums, is a place where a girl is likely to be assaulted and abused.  It isn't that different from a brothel.  Take a movie like the Magdalene Sisters, for example.

    Women internalize a lot of damaging expectations about themselves, and they have to learn to take on those expectations.  To me the movie was a dramatization of that experience.  I thought it worked.  


    I'm a rape survivor (none / 0) (#36)
    by Militarytracy on Mon Apr 04, 2011 at 12:44:10 PM EST
    So I don't really appreciate someone talking down to me about internalizing damaging expectations about myself.  It wasn't internal expectations that were damaging, it was physical damage that was damaging and tons of social problems that go along with trying to get the courage to report the rape and survive the social scrutiny in a small town.

    I did finally report what happened to me seven years later, but that was only because I found out he was date raping....which is even harder for women to report.  When he did what he did to me I only knew him from high school and I needed a ride home after a friend ditched me at a party.

    To make things even more wonderful, when I reported it I reported it unknowingly to his cousin who was a deputy sherriff.  At least when I was done the guy explained to me that he was the guy's cousin, he also told me that he thought I had the wrong guy.  He asked me what I wanted to do with this report and I said I wanted it to go on file and that if he raped anyone else who came did come in when there was physical evidence that I would testify for them as to what happened to me.  I didn't kid myself, there would be no justice for me.

    His cousin probably told him to stay away from me after that, but when someone has been overall long term successful at raping young women they may not take that lying down.  He didn't.  Then he began stalking me and threatening me, not fun either and until he actually hurt me there wasn't much law enforcement could really do for me.  So please, don't talk down to me about my fake negative expectations that I have surrounding my womanhood and society.


    I'm sorry (none / 0) (#37)
    by lilburro on Mon Apr 04, 2011 at 01:06:06 PM EST
    It wasn't my intention to talk down to you.  I was telling you my opinion of the movie - I think it's about (in part) internalized expectations because it takes places in multiple fantasy worlds.  I was speaking generally.  What happened to you was horrible and I am sorry.

    I did try (none / 0) (#39)
    by Militarytracy on Mon Apr 04, 2011 at 01:41:25 PM EST
    to clarify that others (who are very bright wonderful people) with me liked the movie, and I was not able to judge it as a movie because I have "issues".  And really, since reading your response I want you to know that I'm not horribly upset or anything. My reactions about the abuse of women are varied probably mostly because I did this program years ago of a kind of reenactment therapy, a really deep thing.  But I didn't want the rape to affect my sexuality, and often it does for most women.  So I committed to what turned out to be a very difficult therapy situation, that is very controlled with lots of very professional couselor there...and they reenact trauma and help people to overcome.  It's horrible!  It's great!

     And often now I have the ability to stand back and assess, but sometimes I still don't.  Sometimes things trigger me and instead of assessing I'm an unwilling sucked in participant.

    When the movie started though, I got to the first scene where the lobotomization seems to be taking place and I said outloud, "I hate this movie".  I was triggered somehow.  But my husband and son were both concerned (WHAT GREAT MEN!!!) and asked me if I wanted to stay or not.  That made all the difference.  I told myself if I wanted to leave and go shopping for an hour and a half I could, I was not expected to stay and that helped a lot.  I tried, I did my best, but all the great stuff the movie has to offer has alluded me.  But both of my men are big gamers, and they loved the flick and it has some social justice gamer meaning that they pick up on.  For me, I must accept that there are some things out there I'm not capable of "getting", but in a different life I very likely could.


    Yeah (none / 0) (#40)
    by lilburro on Mon Apr 04, 2011 at 02:11:16 PM EST
    I didn't realize when you said triggered you meant it like that.  I just didn't pick that up.  Again, I'm really sorry.  Thanks for your comment.  Your husband and son do sound awesome.    

    and also I apologize (none / 0) (#38)
    by lilburro on Mon Apr 04, 2011 at 01:38:37 PM EST
    because I didn't know that story before I made that comment and had I known I would've responded totally differently to your original review.  I'm sorry and completely respect that you found it triggering.  Again...sorry.

    It's okay (none / 0) (#41)
    by Militarytracy on Mon Apr 04, 2011 at 02:31:33 PM EST
    Lots of good things happened because of it.  Real life rape trauma was discussed, social problems that can come at you, it was even brought up that reenactment therapy can do some pretty amazing things.  I did not know anything about that, and I had to dig for that information and it was a tough tough dig.  But by reading this, if anyone else is hurting out there they have perhaps some new information that can really help them to become a lot more whole again.  The guy that came after me, he was slick and when a few of us that he came after got to know who else he had come for...it seems that he was attracted to more outspoken self possessed women.  And surprisingly we are often just as vulnerable as all the other women.

    One of those that I got to know, her dad had nothing to do with the local Sherriffs department.  But shockingly...her dad was the police chief.  How do you tell your dad this happened to you?  I didn't tell mine until I was almost 30 and had come out on the other side.  A father usually feels deeply that he IS the protection that his daughter has where aggressive males are concerned.  She was a date rape, and she could not tell her father what had happened to her.  She had two older brothers though and she did tell them.  They told her to set up another date with him, and she did.  The guy headed out into the boonies again with her but he didn't know that her brothers were following behind.  When he found a secluded place and pulled over they beat him to a pulp.  He told all of his friends that a gang of Mexicans jumped him.  And then his "friends" spent several weekends hunting for this mysterious gang of Mexicans and sadly I remembered when this happened...about a year after my "episode".  And remembered thinking that in this small town in Wyoming...we didn't have a gang of Mexicans, but it never occurred to me that this was only about another victim.  They beat him very badly.  He was housebound for days, but if he stopped for a little while after that he did not quit for good.


    So (if you don't mind me asking) (none / 0) (#42)
    by lilburro on Mon Apr 04, 2011 at 02:53:03 PM EST
    was this guy eventually stopped and caught?  I admire your bravery in speaking up, especially in a small town.  Authorities are all too frequently incompetent when it comes to rape, it happens all the time.  Look at the Yale case in the news now for example.  My college had a number of unreported as well as uninvestigated rapes.

    I'm not sure (none / 0) (#43)
    by Militarytracy on Tue Apr 05, 2011 at 08:06:34 AM EST
    When I was going through what I did with him, others began to come forward and we met each other on that social level.  He then had a used car lot on the main street of this little town, he had always like restoring cars in high school.  Even though we didn't have any authority on a legal level there is a social level too that all function in, and he stopped showing up to open his car lot up.  Then it went up for sale.  I heard that he was going through a very severe depression.  He came from a family with a little money so he wasn't going to be in the gutter going through whatever he was going through.  After he became very depressed I didn't see him again and he did quit following me around and saying gross sexual things to me.  He was good though, it was surprising how well he could follow me and I wouldn't know it.  And then boom, he'd pop up seemingly out of nowhere as soon as I wasn't near anyone else who could actually witness what he was saying.  But so many of us meeting each other and talking to each other about what had happened did seem to really affect him in the end.

    Then my grandmother was diagnosed with cancer, and I moved back to Colorado to be near her and spend some time with her while we had that.  I heard later that his depression did seem to lift some after quite a long period of time, about ten years.  His family had a ranch outside of town and he wanted to start a subdivision there and one of my old friends told me about it.  I don't know if he was successful though or ever became very highly functioning in the community again.

    It's weird though in a way, I don't wish him ill.  A part of me is surprised by that part of me.  I don't want him to ever hurt anyone else like that ever again, that's the thing I really want most of all. And I don't forgive him for what happened to me, I don't ever wish to "know him" or share anything with him, but I don't wish him death or illness or suffering outside of what he did.  And I have a lot of empathy for people who are wrongfully accused of rape too, because the whole event is so horrible.  I know how I felt, and if someone is accusing you of that and it isn't true I imagine it feels just about as bad sans the physical damage.


    Thanks. (5.00 / 1) (#44)
    by lilburro on Tue Apr 05, 2011 at 09:20:58 AM EST
    I'm glad he's left you alone.  It does sound like you and the others attacked getting together made a difference.  Sometimes that's what it takes I guess.  I always expect the authorities in power to do more, and am shocked when they don't...but I'm slowly, hopefully, getting wiser on that score.

    There are other kinds of power (5.00 / 1) (#45)
    by Militarytracy on Tue Apr 05, 2011 at 02:03:40 PM EST
    And myself and some of the other women that he harmed seemed able to get some of that through knowing about each other.  We weren't alone anymore carrying his shame.  Can't really explain it.  And I could tell you that it was luck, but I don't think it was that either.  There were other people in the community too who helped us to connect.  One person would hear something, say something, and then someone who had been keeping the secret of another victim would tell that victim and little by little we got to know who some of us were.  We did have an attorney interested in representing us too.  I had gone to high school with him, and then he just happened to be present once and accidentally catch the guy stalking me.  He wanted to know if we wanted to pursue something along those lines, but I didn't want to.  This may seem really strange to say, but I found out things about myself and I found some strengths in me that I don't know I would have found without what happened.  It doesn't make it okay on any level, but we all deal with what we get dealt and some really horrible things are often a part of that.  And if through a civil suit he had to pay us anything, I didn't want to fight for money and if not money what else could be gained through that fight.  He sort of seemed to be self destructing before our eyes too under the weight of knowing that many people did understand some basic truths about some of his past actions.