home

President Obama HCR Speech Live Blog

I will be live blogging the speech of the President of the United States before a joint session of Congress. The speech is scheduled to begin at 8 pm EST.

Pre-Speech Sports Update: Melanie Oudin trails 0-3 to Wozniacki in the first in the US Open Womens Quarters. Serena and Clijsters are through to the semis, where they will meet. USA national soccer team locked in 0-0 draw in a World Cup qualifier at Trinidad late in the first half.

Madame Speaker, the President of the United States!! [Live blog on the flip . . .]

Clap Clap!

30 seconds in, no mention of the public option . . .

The only thing we have to fear . . . they have the economic stimulus speech in the teleprompter . . Complete fake out . . .

Pivot from crisis to future - the issue of health care. You can now read the script on Jeralyn's post below.

[Fancy quotemark]I am not the first President to take up this cause, but I am determined to be the last. It has now been nearly a century since Theodore Roosevelt first called for health care reform. And ever since, nearly every President and Congress, whether Democrat or Republican, has attempted to meet this challenge in some way. A bill for comprehensive health reform was first introduced by John Dingell Sr. in 1943. Sixty-five years later, his son continues to introduce that same bill at the beginning of each session. Our collective failure to meet this challenge Ė year after year, decade after decade Ė has led us to a breaking point. Everyone understands the extraordinary hardships that are placed on the uninsured, who live every day just one accident or illness away from bankruptcy. These are not primarily people on welfare. These are middle-class Americans. Some canít get insurance on the job. Others are self-employed, and canít afford it, since buying insurance on your own costs you three times as much as the coverage you get from your employer. Many other Americans who are willing and able to pay are still denied insurance due to previous illnesses or conditions that insurance companies decide are too risky or expensive to cover.[Fancy quotemark]

The personal stories, Reaganesque. A staple now.

Defining the problem. He gives good speech. But some of us are waiting for two words and the words that follow - "public option . . ."

Interesting, defines single payer as the Left. This will piss off the single payer advocates but allows him to pivot to the public option as the Center.

Back to the text. Still no mention of the public option.

Mid-speech Sports update - Still 0-0 in Trinidad, 60 minutes in. Oudin lost the first set 6-2.

Hmm, how about the um, "public option?" We're waiting . . .

Mandates get a plug . . .

So this is the end of the Obama plan . . part 2 is the good stuff you do not get to have.

This obvious division of the speech really stinks. I am down down on this speech right now.

"Publicly sponsored insurance option just like Medicare." Choice and competition. Hopefully more than this . . .

Let me be clear, only an option for those who do not have insurance, less than 5% of Americans will sign up . . ." This is the robust defense??

Basically he is pleading that it really will have little effect.

This simply stinks. I have no wrods for how bad the public option section of the speech is. I SHOULD pretend that he is strongly defending it. He is not. He is letting you know he could not give a sh*t about it.

It is all on the Progressive Block now.

My live blog of the speech is over. This is a fail.

Post speech live blog sports update - USA 1, Trinidad 0. Oudin down a set , 2-2 in the second.

Here was the most pathetic and sorry excuse of advocacy for the public option you could have possibly fashioned:

Now, I have no interest in putting insurance companies out of business. They provide a legitimate service, and employ a lot of our friends and neighbors. I just want to hold them accountable. The insurance reforms that Iíve already mentioned would do just that. But an additional step we can take to keep insurance companies honest is by making a not-for-profit public option available in the insurance exchange. Let me be clear Ė it would only be an option for those who donít have insurance. No one would be forced to choose it, and it would not impact those of you who already have insurance. In fact, based on Congressional Budget Office estimates, we believe that less than 5% of Americans would sign up.

Despite all this, the insurance companies and their allies donít like this idea. They argue that these private companies canít fairly compete with the government. And theyíd be right if taxpayers were subsidizing this public insurance option. But they wonít be. I have insisted that like any private insurance company, the public insurance option would have to be self-sufficient and rely on the premiums it collects. But by avoiding some of the overhead that gets eaten up at private companies by profits, excessive administrative costs and executive salaries, it could provide a good deal for consumers. It would also keep pressure on private insurers to keep their policies affordable and treat their customers better, the same way public colleges and universities provide additional choice and competition to students without in any way inhibiting a vibrant system of private colleges and universities.

Itís worth noting that a strong majority of Americans still favor a public insurance option of the sort Iíve proposed tonight. But its impact shouldnít be exaggerated Ė by the left, the right, or the media. It is only one part of my plan, and should not be used as a handy excuse for the usual Washington ideological battles. To my progressive friends, I would remind you that for decades, the driving idea behind reform has been to end insurance company abuses and make coverage affordable for those without it. The public option is only a means to that end Ė and we should remain open to other ideas that accomplish our ultimate goal. And to my Republican friends, I say that rather than making wild claims about a government takeover of health care, we should work together to address any legitimate concerns you may have.

An F for this speech.

Final sports update - US picks up 3 points in Trinidad, winning 1-0. looking good for qualifying for South Africa 2010. Oudin looks finished, trailing 5-2 in the 2nd, after losing the first 6-2.

Speaking for me only

< Excerpts From Obama's Speech Tonight | Post-Health Care Speech Thread >
  • The Online Magazine with Liberal coverage of crime-related political and injustice news

  • Contribute To TalkLeft


  • Display: Sort:
    Republicans incapable of telling the truth. (5.00 / 1) (#1)
    by kevsters on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 06:43:33 PM EST
    Why do Republicans insist on lying about every aspect of health care reform? It seems like they are incapable of telling the truth. Here is Senator Barrasso, a medical doctor, blatantly lying about health care premiums.

    progressno­tcongress.­org?/P=283­9

    Corporations vs. the People (5.00 / 1) (#3)
    by NealB on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 06:58:06 PM EST
    Watching MSNBC. Olberman frames the speech bluntly: health care reform is a battle between the profits of corporations and the needs of Americans. Obama needs to say he will veto a bill that doesn't have a robust public option.

    I'll be logging (5.00 / 1) (#5)
    by The Addams Family on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:00:10 PM EST
    contact between the seat of Nancy Pelosi's pants and the seat of Nancy Pelosi's chair.

    I got to sit in that chair (none / 0) (#12)
    by shoephone on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:09:36 PM EST
    the day after the 2007 SOTU. Very exciting.

    At least she gets to sit next to Biden instead of Cheney. Those two seats are on top of each other. Knees touching, and all.

    Parent

    Michelle Obama looks really pretty n/t (5.00 / 2) (#6)
    by Jeralyn on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:03:15 PM EST


    Hillary looks really happy (5.00 / 2) (#7)
    by Jeralyn on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:03:51 PM EST
    and pretty as well.

    Collins was sure trying to button-hole her (none / 0) (#14)
    by shoephone on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:10:49 PM EST
    And Hillary was doing her best to get out of Collins' grip. Diplomatically, of course.

    Parent
    Her interaction with Obama was interesting (none / 0) (#18)
    by nycstray on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:18:55 PM EST
    considering the topic on board. Very relaxed and friendly/intimate.

    She does look great. I want her secrets!

    Parent

    Pantsuits (5.00 / 1) (#21)
    by Cream City on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:23:44 PM EST
    so no need for pantyhose.  Life with pantyhose is h*ll. :-)

    Oh, and jalapeno peppers.  Did you know that she has said her secret is jalapenos daily?  Yikes.

    Parent

    hillary (5.00 / 1) (#8)
    by kmblue on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:03:55 PM EST
    looks great

    Rachel Maddow Just Said (5.00 / 1) (#13)
    by daring grace on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:10:47 PM EST
    (paraphrasing) the Dem party (or the people? sorry was only half listening) has to decide whether the people have an ally against corporate interests in the Dem party or not.

    Unfortunately, I thought we had that answer already.

    NPR says special interests stayed out of it (5.00 / 2) (#20)
    by BluestBlue on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:20:35 PM EST
    What the heck do the call $1.4 MILLION A DAY in spending by Health Insurance Lobby Against Health Care Reform??

    If that is staying out, god help us if they got involved.

    Keep in mind that NPR (none / 0) (#23)
    by shoephone on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:25:20 PM EST
    considers Newt Gingrich an expert on health care. They interviewed him this morning.

    Parent
    Thank god I missed that "treat" (none / 0) (#37)
    by BluestBlue on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:30:23 PM EST
    Newtie is an expert on Hospitals only when it comes to dumping the current wife wife while she is in the hospital for chemotherapy so he can marry the new model.

    Parent
    "Only wealthy nation... (5.00 / 1) (#22)
    by shoephone on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:23:49 PM EST
    that allows such hardship for its citizens."

    Yes, Mr. President. Because we are the only wealthy democracy that refuses to adopt a true national health care plan for its citizens.

    Oh oh, he hits on Medicare costs (5.00 / 2) (#24)
    by Cream City on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:26:00 PM EST
    right away.  Social Security will take a hit, too, perhaps?  And I just turned 60 -- so have been paying into one or both for 45 years. . . .  Sigh.

    'Whoos" (5.00 / 1) (#25)
    by lilburro on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:26:12 PM EST
    and "Yeahs!" from the single payer crowd.  I love it.

    Oh god (5.00 / 2) (#26)
    by The Addams Family on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:26:29 PM EST
    False "bipartisan" equivalence . . . but loved the outburst of applause at the mention of single payer.

    "RADICAL SHIFT" baaad (5.00 / 2) (#27)
    by shoephone on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:26:53 PM EST
    We can't be too radical, people. The insurance companies demand obedience.

    Wow (5.00 / 2) (#28)
    by Dadler on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:27:29 PM EST
    He actually just said there's a good argument for making healthcare anarchy (everyone just buy your own).  Unbelievable.  And he just repeated that we can't have too much change.  Somehow other nations did it, but we are just America, we can't do big things.

    O joy (5.00 / 1) (#29)
    by The Addams Family on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:27:37 PM EST
    "reform" that drug companies can support . . .

    or reform they WRITE (5.00 / 1) (#31)
    by Dadler on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:28:13 PM EST
    "that has never happened before" (5.00 / 3) (#30)
    by Jeralyn on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:28:10 PM EST
    what about the Patriot Act? How long did Congress review that? Act in haste, repent at leisure.

    Time for bickering is over (5.00 / 2) (#32)
    by The Addams Family on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:28:31 PM EST
    Leftists, sit down and STFU

    Insurance is not healthcare (5.00 / 2) (#38)
    by Dadler on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:30:42 PM EST
    Against the law to deny you coverage becaue of pre-existing condition, and, of course, they can still charge you impossibly high rates to NOT deny you.

    LOL.

    and (5.00 / 4) (#51)
    by TeresaInSnow2 on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:35:17 PM EST
    if you can't afford those high rates, the government will tax you as a penalty for not carrying insurance.

    And on top of that, since you don't have insurance, you'll have to pay the exhorbitant non-negotiated cost for physician and hospital that the uninsured people typically have to pay....

    Oh, tis so much better than nothing ;-).

    Parent

    Glad he added "or in a lifetime" (5.00 / 1) (#40)
    by The Addams Family on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:31:14 PM EST


    Do people "catch" breast cancer? (5.00 / 1) (#43)
    by shoephone on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:32:06 PM EST
    Sheesh.

    That was an unfortunate (none / 0) (#46)
    by The Addams Family on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:33:29 PM EST
    choice of verb. He meant "diagnose."

    Parent
    WORM (none / 0) (#179)
    by Spamlet on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 08:24:26 PM EST
    Insurance Exchange? WTF? (5.00 / 2) (#47)
    by BluestBlue on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:34:07 PM EST
    We knew he'd never back a robust public option.

    I hope the Dems that pledged to stand tough against any bill w/out a public option stay true.

    Um.. did he just say I'm going to have the same (5.00 / 1) (#49)
    by shoephone on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:35:00 PM EST
    insurance as those in Congress?

    Oh, here we go. Tax credits will save us. Sounds exactly like George Bush. And he thinks John McCain deserves credit for him bringing it up now! Woo hoo! Go GOP!

    Remember when (5.00 / 2) (#59)
    by TeresaInSnow2 on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:39:02 PM EST
    gas prices soared and Bush said it was okay because our tax cut would pay for it...

    also, just came to me, I don't know if you followed University of Washington's tuition increase?  Emmert's justification for the 28% increase (over 2 years) was that federal financial aid had been increased just enough to pay for it....

    If a public institution can eat up funding subsidies without a conscience, insurance companies will have no problem with doing the same.

    Parent

    Emmert's $900 million salary (none / 0) (#68)
    by shoephone on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:42:29 PM EST
    should be cut in half. He's the highest paid public university president in America.

    Now, back to our regularly scheduled programming...

    Parent

    Tax credits, malpractice reform, (none / 0) (#160)
    by MO Blue on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 08:12:22 PM EST
    federal conscious laws remain in place. Although he mentioned public option he left the door wide open for triggers or co-ops.

    The only thing I liked was that he said that if you had a pre-existing condition the government would help you get coverage before the bill goes into effect. Would like to have someone from the administration or Congress provide some details on the exact date, how it would be done, the amount of coverage and costs.

    Parent

    Insurance companies will love it... (5.00 / 1) (#54)
    by NealB on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:36:49 PM EST
    ... because they'll get millions of new customers.

    New customers who will be forced, against their will, to pay for it out of their own pockets.

    It's a good idea because John McCain proposed it!!!

    Yob ho. I'm all on board now.

    he's never been good at ironing or details (5.00 / 1) (#55)
    by BluestBlue on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:36:58 PM EST


    I wish this surprised me (none / 0) (#132)
    by denise k on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 08:00:25 PM EST
    You could see his weasel-words coming from a mile away if you could get past the hero worship.  I never saw it myself and find none of his wishy-washy weasel words surprising at all.  I say this sadly.

    Parent
    Likening health insurance to (5.00 / 2) (#56)
    by shoephone on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:37:04 PM EST
    auto insurance. Because we have a choice about whether to drive and whether to get cancer and die.

    Ha! They're laughing about the non-existent details. He's not saying what the penalty will be for not complying.

    What big circle jerk (5.00 / 3) (#57)
    by Dadler on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:37:06 PM EST
    There you have it, against the law not to have junk coverage.

    Mandate without a public option for all means we are going to sink further into the abyss.

    He has to know this.  If he doesn't, well, I refuse to believe he doesn't.  He knows this is a sellout disaster.

    What a relief (5.00 / 2) (#60)
    by The Addams Family on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:39:22 PM EST
    No health care for undocumented residents. Good thing they never get TB.

    He can't do this (5.00 / 1) (#62)
    by NealB on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:39:44 PM EST
    He's a robot.

    Oh, wait, here come the "key controversies."


    And an attack on abortion access (5.00 / 2) (#69)
    by Cream City on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:42:46 PM EST
    as a fundamental right just was done by a former law prof.  Well, I guess that's because it's just a Supreme Court precedent, not in the Constitution yet.  So it's our bad.

    Jeesh again.

    Public option (5.00 / 1) (#70)
    by Dadler on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:43:05 PM EST
    here we go, now start backtracking.

    and backtrack he does.  it's not available to all of the public.

    so it's really a private public option, saved for those poor folks who we'd rather stay in private places and not bother us with their pesky illnesses.

    And can someone please tell me (5.00 / 1) (#72)
    by BluestBlue on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:43:41 PM EST
    Where does he get that southern accent? Is it the south side of Oahu or the south side of Chicago?

    It's the preacher voice (4.25 / 4) (#88)
    by Cream City on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:47:24 PM EST
    that came out in the campaign sometimes, too.  It's what he does when he's trying to sell something.

    It's different from his faux Southern accent, which came out in the campaign when he was in front of AA audiences.

    Parent

    "Please people, stop exaggerating" (5.00 / 1) (#77)
    by shoephone on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:44:57 PM EST
    "Public option only a means to an end."

    Shorter Obama: Go screw yourselves.

    What was that ugly noise coming (5.00 / 1) (#78)
    by sallywally on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:45:06 PM EST
    from the Repubs  ....very ugly and threatening sounding .... when he was listing the "misinformation" and lies - didn't he call the death panels lies?

    And what sign does that one Repub have in his lap???

    Scary.

    One of the GOPers called him a liar (none / 0) (#138)
    by shoephone on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 08:02:10 PM EST
    on not covering illegal immigrants.

    Parent
    Yes. There were several other voicews (none / 0) (#197)
    by sallywally on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 09:26:06 PM EST
    going on there at the same time. Just a general semi-loud talkback.

    Parent
    No, sir, your "progressive friends" (5.00 / 3) (#79)
    by Cream City on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:45:47 PM EST
    have not been talking for decades about better health insurance coverage.  We've been talking about better access to health CARE.

    Obama is a smart man.  So if he really doesn't get the difference, he doesn't want to do so.

    Since when are we concerned about being fair (5.00 / 1) (#80)
    by DWCG on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:45:53 PM EST
    To private insurance companies that provide a fraudulent product, get in the way of a doctor-patient and spend 10 times as much on overhead as Medicare.

    "We will provide you with a choice" (5.00 / 2) (#81)
    by The Addams Family on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:45:56 PM EST
    Eat sh!t or die.

    Maybe he can do this. (5.00 / 2) (#83)
    by NealB on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:46:03 PM EST
    "A strong majority of Americans still favor a public option."

    I'm glad he said this. n/t. (5.00 / 1) (#117)
    by sallywally on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:56:02 PM EST
    BHO using right-wing talking points (5.00 / 2) (#85)
    by DWCG on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:46:49 PM EST
    "government bureaucrat getting between the care you need" - when has Medicare done that?

    According to Mom tonight . . . (5.00 / 1) (#101)
    by nycstray on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:50:49 PM EST
    never.

    Oh, and she is to the Right of me.

    Parent

    Jeez (5.00 / 2) (#87)
    by lilburro on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:47:23 PM EST
    sorry, Bill Clinton could've pulled off a public option defense much better.  And for like 25 minutes.  ARRRRRGH

    And I would have believed (5.00 / 2) (#94)
    by Cream City on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:48:21 PM EST
    that he felt my pain.

    Parent
    Yeah (none / 0) (#102)
    by lilburro on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:51:18 PM EST
    if even Ezra Klein doesn't like this speech, you KNOW it is a disaster.

    Parent
    Ah, (none / 0) (#171)
    by lilburro on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 08:15:49 PM EST
    I was wrong!

    Thought this was Obama's most effective policy speech by far. This is not a format he's done very well at in the past.


    Parent
    more spending cuts... (5.00 / 1) (#89)
    by Dadler on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:47:33 PM EST
    ...if the savings don't materialize.

    guess who's gonna get cut?  those who can least afford it.  

    and round and round we go.

    he's a fool to me right now.

    If you want cost savings (5.00 / 1) (#90)
    by BluestBlue on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:47:45 PM EST
    Then why did you take Single payer off the table? 30% savings off the top.

    And unlike the lies you mouth, you don't have to start from scratch, you can do Medicare for all. That shouldn't be too changey for Mr Hopey.


    "I will not back down... (5.00 / 1) (#92)
    by NealB on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:48:02 PM EST
    ...if you can't find an affordable option, we will provide you with a choice."

    Medicare reassurance for seniors (5.00 / 1) (#93)
    by andgarden on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:48:15 PM EST
    Good.

    He's backtracking on that (5.00 / 2) (#97)
    by Cream City on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:49:41 PM EST
    assurance, if you ask me.  Hundreds of billions of dollars of waste and fraud?  Never saw evidence of that much.  So the rest would have to come from cuts to Medicare services.

    Parent
    They're not going to catch as much fraud (none / 0) (#100)
    by andgarden on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:50:48 PM EST
    as they claim. This is going on the credit card, and nobody's Medicare benefits will cut.

    Parent
    SO he can clain to have not increased (none / 0) (#107)
    by shoephone on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:52:42 PM EST
    the deficit, just the national debt.

    Parent
    pretty much (none / 0) (#109)
    by andgarden on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:53:10 PM EST
    I am sure there is (none / 0) (#180)
    by robert72 on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 08:26:09 PM EST
    a teeny bit of fraud in Medicare - in the Canadian system I am sure there is a bit, but not enough to ever make the news.... I did hear of one doctor who made the patients come back if they had a second concern - one concern per doctor visit... That was weird, but I am sure it is rare.

    Parent
    The Intermountain healthcare in Utah (none / 0) (#104)
    by shoephone on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:51:37 PM EST
    should be our national model. Let's cut Medicare and Medicaid to get a system like the one in Utah!

    Parent
    I believe (none / 0) (#185)
    by standingup on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 08:33:38 PM EST
    a good portion of that might come from changing Medicare Advantage. The private insurers are receiving billions in government subsidies but spending less on health care and pocketing more in profits. It is also less efficient, costing the government around 13% more for care for participants than they would pay for the same under traditional medicare.

    Parent
    Watch out for IMAC (5.00 / 1) (#141)
    by lambert on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 08:04:23 PM EST
    The composition of that advisory board is key.

    Parent
    Talking about Medicare Advantage (none / 0) (#112)
    by sallywally on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:53:53 PM EST
    as a huge expense in subsidies to the Medicare program, which it is, straight out of our pockets. I support this (and I'm going on Med. Adv. when I turn 65 on Jan. 1).....:)

    Parent
    And now he's going all Bill Bradley (5.00 / 1) (#106)
    by andgarden on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:52:30 PM EST
    F*¢k him.

    Wow the cent sign works really well (none / 0) (#200)
    by Militarytracy on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 09:47:20 PM EST
    for that word.  I hadn't figured that out yet.

    Parent
    Never has a president... (5.00 / 3) (#108)
    by Dadler on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:52:54 PM EST
    ...in either party, spent so much time and effort ignoring his base (the American people) while pandering to the disloyal opposition.

    Never.

    Tort Reform. (5.00 / 1) (#111)
    by shoephone on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:53:52 PM EST
    Blah blah balh.

    Goodbye Obama. Primary challenge in 2012.

    Never gonna happen (5.00 / 1) (#186)
    by Spamlet on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 08:36:58 PM EST
    even if it should.

    Parent
    He sold out to Big Pharma and Big Insurance (5.00 / 1) (#113)
    by BluestBlue on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:55:03 PM EST
    Long ago. THis was a done deal before it started.

    We'll give you mandated purchases, you give us a little bandaid that looks like we'll get savings... and if we talk about the total POSSIBLe amount of savings no one will notice how little it is compared to the total spending on drugs and insurance... and there is no requirement that you actually provide the savings... just tell us you'll try! They'll believe you

    "My door is always open" (5.00 / 1) (#114)
    by shoephone on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:55:24 PM EST
    But don't you dare try to kill this sh*tty f*cking plan of mine.

    It is??!??! (5.00 / 3) (#142)
    by lambert on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 08:05:08 PM EST
    So he'll be inviting single payer advocates to sit down at the table when, exactly? Tomorrow?

    Parent
    "Just for this minute!" n/t (none / 0) (#152)
    by lilburro on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 08:09:07 PM EST
    What was that slamming noise? (none / 0) (#158)
    by lambert on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 08:11:09 PM EST
    I think I can guess....

    Parent
    The insurance cos were getting cold. n/t (none / 0) (#162)
    by lilburro on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 08:12:41 PM EST
    I'm liking the speech. (5.00 / 4) (#115)
    by indy in sc on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:55:27 PM EST
    I may be in the minority here, but I'd give it a B+ so far.  I like the specific items on overall insurance reform, the defense of a public option (though I grant you that he made it clear he would sign something with a wimpy public option such as co-op or other non-profit).

    I liked that he mentioned that we should not lose sight of the goal based on our own preferred means of getting there.  I'm still skeptical that the goal can be met without a true public option, but I'm open to hearing how it can be done.

    I think illegal aliens should be covered, so big boo to his saying that they won't be.  That will represent a loophole of uncontrolled costs because of course they get sick too.

    It SOUNDS good (5.00 / 2) (#122)
    by andgarden on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:57:11 PM EST
    I think it will lift his numbers, but I don't know what it will do for policy advancement.

    Parent
    Yea, let's allow illegals to contract (none / 0) (#168)
    by BackFromOhio on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 08:15:00 PM EST
    and spread communicable diseases so they can spread like wildfire to those of us who pay for medical care & insurance.

    Parent
    My door is always open to good ideas?? (5.00 / 1) (#118)
    by BluestBlue on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:56:31 PM EST
    Like saving 30% with single payer???? Yeah right.

    He won't accept status quo, but he won't accept a workable solution that saves money and covers everyone.


    $900 billion (5.00 / 1) (#120)
    by NealB on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:57:05 PM EST
    Baucus' amount. That confirms it for me. Obama's been the one delaying the Finance committee.

    Really exploiting T Kennedy. (5.00 / 1) (#127)
    by shoephone on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:58:03 PM EST
    Boo.

    I opened a 2003 Merlot (5.00 / 1) (#134)
    by Militarytracy on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 08:00:48 PM EST
    Don't have any Champagne. It's sooooo worth it watching those effing wingers take this public a$$beating while being told that if they have a real plan Obama will listen.  What a bunch of psycho whackjobs.  Whew, and all this McCain buttering.  He's gunning for useable McCain support.  It's hard to watch but I did once have some respect for McCain....pre BushCo.

    Obama's a$$kissing of GOPers is revolting (none / 0) (#153)
    by shoephone on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 08:09:19 PM EST
    McCain is totally irrelevant.

    Parent
    I would be focusing on the only one for public stroking who displayed moments of documented clarity at some points while sitting in the Senate.  I swear to God I thought for a minute McCain seemed to remember something from long ago.

    Parent
    Does he feel our pain? (5.00 / 1) (#143)
    by nycstray on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 08:05:55 PM EST
    I think not, no matter what the talking heads start rambling.

    PPUS lives on.

    Yeah, on a policy level this was cr@p (5.00 / 1) (#145)
    by andgarden on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 08:06:33 PM EST
    I think it's time to kill the process formally known as "health care reform" and go for incremental steps. But we have to recognize that the President killed it.

    D.O.A. (5.00 / 2) (#194)
    by mmc9431 on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 09:05:49 PM EST
    Listening to Obama's speech and watching his inept handling of the entire issue has convinced me that HCR was never alive in his or the Democratic leadership's mind. So you can't kill something that was never alive in the first place! (snark)

    This whole dance has been as phoney as the war funding and FISA battles.

    Parent

    Sure! (none / 0) (#155)
    by lambert on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 08:09:34 PM EST
    Deep six the mandates, deep six the health exchanges.

    Parent
    Uh, the exchanges are fine no matter what (none / 0) (#159)
    by andgarden on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 08:11:22 PM EST
    but that's not health care reform.

    Parent
    Deep six all the complex machinery... (none / 0) (#165)
    by lambert on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 08:14:01 PM EST
    .... is what I meant.

    Go with some small, and  -- dare I say it -- imcremental steps.

    Parent

    What the hell is this crap about (5.00 / 2) (#163)
    by Chuck0 on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 08:12:48 PM EST
    government takeover of healthcare. English must not be this guy's first language. I didn't hear anything about government run  healthcare. Why do the scumbags on the right just keep making stuff up. (Wow, I must be channeling the boob in Alaska.)

    Mr. Obama is Max Baucus (5.00 / 2) (#164)
    by KeysDan on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 08:13:56 PM EST
    he is using the $900,000 billion amount over 10 years, and his revenue source is the Baucus plan of taxing the insurance, medical devices and other health care sources.  No longer apparently, the tax on the $500,000 per year families.  The rest is from those magical savings from Medicare.

    Well, that's an hour I (5.00 / 1) (#166)
    by scribe on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 08:14:33 PM EST
    won't get back.

    Thin soup.

    Recognize Obama killed it before it even started (5.00 / 3) (#173)
    by BluestBlue on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 08:16:31 PM EST
    This was a foregone conclusion.

    How could ANYONE realistically expect to get health care reform done when you started with almost 80% public support, Democratic majority in the House, 60 Seats in the Senate and a "Democratic" president with overwhelming popular support. Good lord , what a sell out. Bought and paid for. They got their money's worth.

    I was okay with it (5.00 / 2) (#181)
    by Militarytracy on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 08:26:43 PM EST
    I was okay with him giving lip service to tort reform studies.  He promised affordable healthcare. He hasn't dumped a public option.  He's concerned about the economic affects the drastic would do....I figured that.  He made the Republicans look like the insane jerks that they are.  He addressed a lot of the horrible lies that Repubs have used to terrify people.  I'm okay. I don't know how this rates an F, but I'll probably come to understand what a sucker I am.

    I don't think it was an "F" (5.00 / 1) (#184)
    by shoephone on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 08:30:47 PM EST
    but not good either, IMO. It's probably because, regardless of the lip service he pays throughout the speech, I just don't believe he really means half of what he says. Except for all that nonsense about bipartisanship. I think he really believes in that.

    Parent
    How can he really? (5.00 / 2) (#188)
    by Militarytracy on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 08:39:29 PM EST
    Come on man....the whole crowd of Republicans showed him their a$$ more times in that speech than I can count.  They yelled at him, called him a liar.

    Parent
    heheh (5.00 / 2) (#190)
    by lilburro on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 08:42:34 PM EST
    "showed him their a$$"...one of my favorite Southern expressions :P

    Parent
    I thought everybody said that. (5.00 / 3) (#192)
    by jeffinalabama on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 08:47:33 PM EST
    Guess I'm a moran.

    Parent
    Yeah but we still don't get health care (5.00 / 1) (#191)
    by BluestBlue on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 08:46:52 PM EST
    so it isn't worth much. Plus he waited till now to call them on their lies. He should have been out in front of it, showing his support. The republicans have been insane jerks for years. Nothing has changed

    With Democratic Majorities in the House and Senate (60 F'ing seats!) and a President with a D next to his name on the ballot we should be able to get Health care through. Especially with almost 80% support from the public.

    Sadly no.

    Bush had no majority a divided country and lied through his teeth but got what he wanted. There is only one reason Obama can't seem to get Health Care Reform done. He doesn't want it and neither do the people who paid for his Kool-aid.

    It reminds me of Bush and his tax cuts. When he came into office, everyone was sold on responsible government, they bought into paying down the debt. People weren't calling for tax cuts. Bush just kept banging away with that hammer to get what he wanted for himself and his wealthy patrons. You know, his base, "the haves and the have mores!"

    We just got a different flavor of the same kool-aid.

    Parent

    Me too.. (5.00 / 2) (#199)
    by sallywally on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 09:43:20 PM EST
    He talked about cutting Medicare Advantage, which is a form of privatized Medicare that gets huge taxpayer subsidies to maintain their obscene profits. I think this is a form of waste - abuse - and fraud. I will be glad to see it go.

    I loved hearing him call out the Repubs, although their loud, surly shoutbacks (and the one "You lie!) were a bit scary to me. But he didn't let it stop him. And later he called them out again, about continuing to tell lies, and about not listening to them if their ideas were just efforts to prevent reform. I thought that was great.

    I didn't feel bad about his defense of the public option. I thought it was ok. And he noted that a majority of Americans want the public option. That was an important statement. And even though he said only 5% would buy into it, I think that if people have the choice it will be much higher, but I think it was a good idea not to say that.

    And he conveyed determination, and I liked that.

    Just hope he follows through, and the Dems pull together and discipline the Blue Dogs. And I hope the Blue Dogs were called out when he said he wouldn't accept ideas that were "just the status quo."

    Maybe I'm a sucker, but I liked it.

    Parent

    We'll be suckers together for awhile :) (5.00 / 1) (#201)
    by Militarytracy on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 09:52:32 PM EST
    You would think that my broken crystal ball could be right twice a year or something.  A magic eightball has to have a better average of being correct than my MT cosmos linked crystal ball does.

    Parent
    Will there be PONIES????????? (4.50 / 6) (#157)
    by lambert on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 08:10:22 PM EST
    Judging by most of the reactions on this thread, I'm guessing no.

    But, but, but . . . (none / 0) (#175)
    by nycstray on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 08:16:51 PM EST
    I really, really want a spotted one!!!

    {The Dot has taken over my computer!!}

    Parent

    You mean I can still have a pony? (none / 0) (#187)
    by BluestBlue on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 08:39:02 PM EST
    Even if I don't get health care, I can still have a pony?

    Well that makes everything ok then.  I thought there were no ponies!

    Parent

    I'm gonna name my pony "tort reform"!!!! (5.00 / 2) (#198)
    by lambert on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 09:35:47 PM EST
    I would have named it Trigger, but Trigger's dead LOL!!!!!!

    Parent
    Now he's passionate... (4.00 / 1) (#34)
    by Dadler on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:28:43 PM EST
    ...about how now is the time.  Now!!!

    Sorry, sir, yesterday was.

    Now is the time because the midterms... (5.00 / 1) (#161)
    by lambert on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 08:12:23 PM EST
    ... are coming up.

    For us, however, the time is 2013. That's because Obama doesn't want to run on any of this. And for good reason.

    Parent

    Come on dude (5.00 / 1) (#174)
    by Militarytracy on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 08:16:49 PM EST
    I will not shoot myself in the face....sorry.  I will B*tch when it needs to happen and I will open good Merlot when it needs to happen.  I didn't open the 1999.  I'll do that when he signs these promises.

    Parent
    We're still on daylight time :) nt (none / 0) (#2)
    by inclusiveheart on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 06:55:44 PM EST


    I'll be chiming in here in comments (none / 0) (#4)
    by Jeralyn on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 06:59:21 PM EST
    if I have any thoughts. Thanks, BTD!

    the only thing (none / 0) (#9)
    by kmblue on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:06:37 PM EST
    I like about Sebelius is her hair.  There's Rahm--boo hiss.

    nooooo (none / 0) (#10)
    by kmblue on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:08:06 PM EST
    stephanopolos sez obama will "reach out" to Republicans....why oh why?

    With a Taser, I hope n/t (5.00 / 1) (#11)
    by The Addams Family on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:08:58 PM EST
    let them work for his election next time out (none / 0) (#121)
    by denise k on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:57:08 PM EST
    Like in 2008? (none / 0) (#183)
    by Spamlet on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 08:30:06 PM EST
    by the way (none / 0) (#15)
    by kmblue on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:10:51 PM EST
    co-ops and triggers suck

    Mitch McConnell and Harry Reid (none / 0) (#16)
    by shoephone on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:12:45 PM EST
    Sigh. What we must deal with in this life.

    Was Biden chewing gum just now? (none / 0) (#17)
    by The Addams Family on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:12:51 PM EST


    Yikes! (none / 0) (#19)
    by The Addams Family on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:20:23 PM EST
    "Democrat" (adj.) instead of "Democratic"?

    Partisanship bad. (none / 0) (#33)
    by shoephone on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:28:35 PM EST
    Olympia Snowe, good.

    "The time for games has passed." Jeez. Talk about projecting.

    Single Payer vs. Ending Employer based (none / 0) (#35)
    by NealB on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:28:54 PM EST
    Fair and balanced.

    Heh (none / 0) (#36)
    by lilburro on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:30:18 PM EST
    having been so absorbed in this debate, I do find this intentionally humorous.  Is it possible this irrelevant man is getting so excited for a trigger option?  I hope not, but if we are getting this speech for a trigger option, you really just have to throw up your hands.

    Or just throw up. Period. (none / 0) (#41)
    by shoephone on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:31:32 PM EST
    The leftist option. n/t (5.00 / 1) (#44)
    by lilburro on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:32:35 PM EST
    Let me repeat this: (none / 0) (#39)
    by shoephone on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:30:46 PM EST
    The insurance companies will still rule the waves!

    Oh yeah, and no cutting you off for pre-existing conditions.

    Three points (none / 0) (#42)
    by NealB on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:32:02 PM EST
    1. keep what you've got if you've got it
    2. force you to buy something if you don't
    3. cut costs

    Ok. How?

    It's the marketplace, stupid! (none / 0) (#45)
    by shoephone on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:32:58 PM EST


    IOW, catastrophic coverage (none / 0) (#48)
    by The Addams Family on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:34:35 PM EST
    not full coverage if you don't have insurance now?

    Could he suck up (none / 0) (#50)
    by BluestBlue on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:35:04 PM EST
    to the republican minority any more?

    He lays out rationale for mandates (none / 0) (#52)
    by The Addams Family on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:35:33 PM EST
    and explains it well, imo.

    "Nothing requires you to change (none / 0) (#53)
    by nycstray on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:35:51 PM EST
    what you have"

    But will it change what's offered in what they currently have? Mom was just talking about Medicare and the freedom to go to Drs with me tonight. It came up when discussing Dr referrals. She generally gets one because she asks what Dr they recommend, but she has never felt, for her or my Dad, they were restricted in ability to go where they need to.  

    Health insurance is like auto insurance (none / 0) (#58)
    by NealB on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:38:38 PM EST
    .

    Both Dems and Repubs cheering about (none / 0) (#61)
    by shoephone on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:39:40 PM EST
    phoniness of death panels talk. But there's someone who yelled "LIE!" about no coverage for illegal immigrants.

    Who was it?

    That will be the story in all the papers tomorrow.

    Just checking in at the 40 minute mark (none / 0) (#63)
    by andgarden on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:41:08 PM EST
    Nothing unexpected, I take it?

    Just in time for the public option applause line (none / 0) (#67)
    by andgarden on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:42:15 PM EST
    "it would only be an option for those who don't have insurance." Good politics, bad policy.

    Parent
    Bad Policy Is Bad Politics (none / 0) (#116)
    by BDB on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:55:32 PM EST
    Ask the Republicans.

    There's nothing in this plan that Romney wouldn't agree to or rather nothing that Romney didn't agree to as Governor.  Explain to me again why I voted Democratic if I'm getting Mitt Romney's healthcare reform?

    Between this, the bailout, and the no withdrawal plan for either war, the Dems really do not deserve to govern.  At least the Dem leadership doesn't.

    I don't care who they run against him in 2012, if Obama doesn't improve on the big issues, I'm not voting for him.  I'm not voting Republican either, but they'll have to win without me.

    Parent

    so I can have it if I drop out of COBRA? (none / 0) (#129)
    by denise k on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:58:21 PM EST
    Dropping out now...

    Parent
    Only if you can wait for another 4 or 5 (none / 0) (#177)
    by MO Blue on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 08:21:13 PM EST
    years. The roll out starts in 2013 - full implementation 2019.

    Parent
    Minor little detail I forgot (none / 0) (#195)
    by denise k on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 09:08:04 PM EST
    I imagine my COBRA will have run out by then -- or maybe I will have a new job!

    Parent
    Here is hoping you have a new job (none / 0) (#196)
    by MO Blue on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 09:09:54 PM EST
    with insurance and all kinds of goodies.

    Parent
    So tell what I get (none / 0) (#65)
    by BluestBlue on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:41:42 PM EST
    For my democratic votes and donations that brought us a democratic house, 60 democratic senate seats, and a president with a "D" by his name?

    They said I had no choice if I wanted Democratic values. Clearly I have no choice.

    I'll be taking a hard look at the Greens next time. I hope they put forward strong candidates and not nut jobs.

    I think Obama just said it. Consumers do better when there is choice and competition.

    Our problem is we're controlled by one company, the democrats, that treat their customers badly, by giving away the store and sacrificing Democratic and Liberal values before the negotiations even start.  

    I just want ot hold THEM and HIM accountable!

    Nancy's up! (none / 0) (#66)
    by The Addams Family on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:41:54 PM EST


    Plan B contraceptive... (none / 0) (#71)
    by shoephone on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:43:33 PM EST


    "It's impact shouldn't be exaggerated" (none / 0) (#73)
    by andgarden on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:43:47 PM EST
    BOOOOOO.

    Hillary in the front row, in a red suit (none / 0) (#74)
    by andgarden on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:44:15 PM EST
    Just like Pelosi.

    To my progressive friends (none / 0) (#75)
    by Dadler on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:44:34 PM EST
    Not my FELLOW progressives.  We should be open to other ideas, especially ones that don't work.  The ones that do, STFU, they're too changey.

    Props, the Republicans have props! (none / 0) (#76)
    by andgarden on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:44:48 PM EST


    If you can't find affordable coverage (none / 0) (#82)
    by Dadler on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:45:56 PM EST
    No definition of what affordable is.  How about this, Mr. Prez -- if you simply want to be out of the for-profit health insurance nonsense, then we will give you that choice?

    Oh, wait, too changey, can't do it.

    Susan Collins (none / 0) (#84)
    by andgarden on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:46:31 PM EST
    loves the "no deficits" line

    Too Bad She Doesn't Love It (5.00 / 3) (#125)
    by BDB on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:57:42 PM EST
    when it comes to tax cuts and war supplementals.

    Parent
    What is (none / 0) (#86)
    by dk on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:46:59 PM EST
    President Snowe wearing?

    A Cheshire grin. (5.00 / 5) (#95)
    by shoephone on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:48:57 PM EST
    Not one dime added to our deficits (none / 0) (#91)
    by shoephone on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:47:56 PM EST
    either now or in the future.

    Because we already gave away all the taxpayer funds to the banks. And I made a promise to Big Insurance and Big Pharma. So let's raid Medicare. It's full of waste and abuse!

    Don't you trust me on this?

    A toothed Med Pac (none / 0) (#96)
    by andgarden on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:49:03 PM EST


    I'm sorry, but this speech is a mess (none / 0) (#98)
    by Dadler on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:49:49 PM EST
    It is all over the place, unfocused, try-to-be-all-things-to-all-people...ugh...

    He hasn't learned a thing.

    I can't understand how people stomach (none / 0) (#103)
    by BluestBlue on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:51:29 PM EST
    Their comments that a country that can figure out how to send a man to the moon and back safely can't figure out how to have an excellent, cost-effective, and robust public health care system.

    Obama keeps worshiping at the feet of Reagan and the scariest words are "I'm from the government and I'm here to help you"

    Design and administer an effective system. Democrats are supposed to GOVERN  effectively.

    "That will not happen on my watch." (none / 0) (#105)
    by DWCG on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:52:07 PM EST
    Calling them out.  Too bad the plan he's proposing sucks.

    This is some serious smack talking.  Never seen a president do this before.

    But who is he calling out? (5.00 / 2) (#128)
    by Cream City on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:58:09 PM EST
    Could be the Palinesque death-panel conservatives.

    Or it could be the progressives.  Either term filled the blank that I heard him leave wide open.  

    We will see.

    Parent

    At least he said (none / 0) (#126)
    by The Addams Family on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:57:47 PM EST
    "on my watch," not "under my watch" like GWB. That's something, I guess.

    Parent
    That was funny. ;-) (none / 0) (#176)
    by shoephone on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 08:18:20 PM EST
    Hahahahahhahahahahaha (none / 0) (#110)
    by lilburro on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:53:41 PM EST
    TORT REFORM.  OHHH MY GODDDDDDDDD

    is this section going to be as long as the public option?  Just about!

    He's coming to his sentimental close (none / 0) (#119)
    by shoephone on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:56:53 PM EST
    Oh cr*p, here comes the Ted Kennedy b.s. He's going to call for a bill to be named after him.

    That's disgusting (3.00 / 2) (#149)
    by lambert on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 08:08:13 PM EST
    Grave robbing's not illegal in Chicago?

    Parent
    Yankees (none / 0) (#123)
    by TeresaInSnow2 on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:57:16 PM EST
    are getting zipped by Tampa Bay Rays.

    I didn't need to watch the speech.  Who didn't know what Obama was going to say?

    Beatles anthology (5.00 / 1) (#133)
    by Cream City on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 08:00:33 PM EST
    is coming on, with the new old cuts released today.

    That beats the Yankees and Obama's old new talk, youbetcha.

    Parent

    I'm skeptical (none / 0) (#150)
    by TeresaInSnow2 on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 08:08:30 PM EST
    that the remasters will be all that good, since they are severely limited by the old audio technology used to originally record them.

    Oh, did you know that the British pronounce "glaciers" as "glassiers?" Just saw that when I turned the channel. I laugh, but they do speak the proper Queen's English, don't they?

    Parent

    No (none / 0) (#167)
    by The Addams Family on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 08:14:43 PM EST
    They just speak their own dialect(s).

    Somebody has pointed out that the difference between British and American pronunciation can be summed up in two contrasting pronunciations: "aqAtic plahnts" (UK) versus "aquAHtic plAnts" (US).

    Parent

    Beatles Rock Band released too (none / 0) (#156)
    by Militarytracy on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 08:10:18 PM EST
    co-ops aren't wimpy (none / 0) (#124)
    by BluestBlue on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:57:36 PM EST
    They don't work. It's been proven. They've been tried and they don't work.

    I wouldn't care what they called it (none / 0) (#130)
    by BluestBlue on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:59:03 PM EST
    IF it was actually Health CARE and not another handout to the Health insurance and Drug industries

    Jesus effing C (none / 0) (#131)
    by The Addams Family on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 07:59:11 PM EST
    Self-reliance!

    like all our imported oil (5.00 / 1) (#135)
    by Dadler on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 08:00:59 PM EST
    and cheap trinkets from third world sweatshops.  and corporate food.  

    holy sheet.  

    Parent

    What are the papers (none / 0) (#136)
    by Chuck0 on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 08:01:03 PM EST
    that the scumbags on the right are waving?

    Looks like the Ways and Means HCR bill (5.00 / 2) (#137)
    by andgarden on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 08:01:48 PM EST
    You can "act" all you want (none / 0) (#139)
    by BluestBlue on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 08:04:11 PM EST
    but you actually have to do some work before anything actually gets done.

    "Some measure of security (none / 0) (#140)
    by The Addams Family on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 08:04:22 PM EST
    and fair play." And insurance companies will decide exactly what that measure will be.

    Eff u, Obama.

    Obama doesn't want to kick the can (none / 0) (#144)
    by The Addams Family on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 08:06:28 PM EST
    He just wants to tell insurance lobbies and the GOP, "Kick me again." Why did Obama want to be president?

    Platitudes about the Republic (none / 0) (#146)
    by NealB on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 08:06:53 PM EST
    This is a very wierd speech. He's speaking to the snakes in the pit as if they're people. He should be killing them.

    What a steaming pile of excrement (none / 0) (#147)
    by BluestBlue on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 08:07:00 PM EST
    I'm

    Stephanopolous says it was (none / 0) (#148)
    by shoephone on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 08:07:20 PM EST
    "a really remarkable speech!"

    Cripes.  

    Here comes the GOP response. Tort reform, tort reform, tort reform. And mandates.

    A scrapping speech (none / 0) (#151)
    by Militarytracy on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 08:08:54 PM EST
    CNN says that whoever the Republicans are that yelled out to Obama that he lies will be named as soon as they get confirmation enough that they feel safe naming names.  Here comes Boustany, my daughter hopes he's better than Jindal....the addiction is wearing off on her :)  Or maybe single parenthood with two children to support.

    Oh look, an instant replay (none / 0) (#154)
    by BluestBlue on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 08:09:31 PM EST
    Seem like they both have the same sponsor paying for their time.

    They both want bipartisanship and they don't want anything too scary and changey, because we just aren't capable of doing anything right. We're all incompetent!

    Can someone please explain to me (none / 0) (#170)
    by shoephone on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 08:15:34 PM EST
    How his $900 billion "plan" won't add one dime to the deficit, but HR 3200's $1 trillion pricetag will bust our budgets?

    BTD, I remember your first reaction to Obama's (none / 0) (#172)
    by steviez314 on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 08:16:18 PM EST
    health care press conference was it was FDR-like.

    I suspect your "F" grade will be equally correct.

    Well, I missed it (none / 0) (#178)
    by ruffian on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 08:22:41 PM EST
    Judging from the comments I didn't really miss much.

    Over to the conference committee to make salvage good out of this mess.

    You watch it (5.00 / 1) (#182)
    by Militarytracy on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 08:28:25 PM EST
    Come back and report.  I don't come away with a "he sucked" judgement.

    Parent
    My thoughts... he sounded good. (none / 0) (#189)
    by jeffinalabama on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 08:42:10 PM EST
    Speechifying is his strong point, not the content of the speeches.

    As to content? I'm reminded of Jackie Mason's comments on Nixon."Phlebitis? NO. He has syphillis. You can't screw 300 million people and not get syphillis."


    catching breast cancer (none / 0) (#193)
    by gish720 on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 08:52:17 PM EST
    I thought that business about catching breast cancer was a little odd too, but when I thought about it....what he said was, we need to catch breast cancer before it spreads...he was talking about early preventative care.

    I thought Obama's speech was a rousing success (none / 0) (#202)
    by Swiggs on Wed Sep 09, 2009 at 11:54:28 PM EST
    Just checking in from the West Coast, and I guess I'm in the minority because I was hugely relieved and pleased with the President's speech.  I thought he hit it out of the ballpark!  It's what I've been waiting for for weeks.  Not sure what "defense" of the Public Option people were expecting - but I though what he said was great.  Because he basically said, come up with something better or it's in.  And what can the Repubicans say to that?  They have nothing better.  So, de facto it's in.  So what's the problem?  Expecting Obama to go farther than he did seems silly, and needless risky.  Why poke a stick in the eye of someone you've already cornered?