Monday Afternoon Open Thread

A personal aside, this is worthy of a a chuckle. I have good friends who run that place, including the author of the diary and the proprietor. But I have to laugh at the "civility" problems, cuz, you know, it was all my fault once upon a time. Maybe not so much anymore.

In non me-centric news, the Yanks tooks the 3 game series in Fenway and the Gators are preseason number 1 in the AP college football poll. (Ok, that is pretty me-centric news too.) I am not angry at all right now.

This is an Open Thread.

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    Fresh Air (5.00 / 1) (#5)
    by Slado on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 01:13:06 PM EST
    Great episode today on Health Care.

    Author discusses the (4) types of health systems world wide and how America is a mix of all of them.

    Interesting for both sides to hear.

    My humble opinion is we are much bigger and different then the countries he compares us too but his one key point is undeniable.  Our system is too complex and the role the US government should at least do is streamlining it to reduce administrative costs at all levels.    

    After that let the debate rage on as to what the best solution is.

    He is very candid about the faults and pluses of each system.

    Great episode.

    I find that post and the comments (5.00 / 4) (#6)
    by Maryb2004 on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 01:13:48 PM EST
    very funny.  I've always thought that a sociology grad student could use these so-called blogging communities as the bases for an interesting dissertation.

    Maryb, they're already doing so (5.00 / 5) (#23)
    by Cream City on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 01:51:53 PM EST
    and I've seen some of the presentations of research at conferences, read some of the papers in progress, etc.  (I am wed to a prof of media convergence, per last year's passe term.  Then he became a prof of digital storytelling.  Of late, he is a prof of social media.  We are staying alert to see the next term du jour, so that he can update his seven blogs -- and tweet it, too, natch.)

    Frankly, it's a step forward from the entire panels filled with papers about the deeper societal meanings of Buffy the Vampire Slayer and Beverly Hills 50210 and . . . you don't wanna know.


    My brother is a prof of 'new media' (5.00 / 1) (#33)
    by ruffian on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 02:20:50 PM EST
    He does a lot of that type of research too. Your husband is not at a conference in Belfast this week, by any chance?

    Sadly, no, or I'd be on the ould sod (5.00 / 2) (#43)
    by Cream City on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 02:47:51 PM EST
    with him, youbetcha.  We saw that one but had to forgo it after spouse already had been on four other continents in a matter of six months -- when he ought to be retired but instead is the hottest thing around.  Amazing how hot the rest of the world is to learn backpack journalism and digital storytelling and such stuff, huh?  

    But then, we have seen for years that not just colleges but even high schools and grade schools and their equivalents in other countries require that students take media studies, so as to grow some radar to b.s. and some resistance.  It's desperately needed here, natch.  But we won't see it required here, where media and the corporates behind them prefer that the public remain dupes.  


    That must be why (5.00 / 2) (#48)
    by ruffian on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 02:58:35 PM EST
    my brother travels a lot too. Foreign universities are more interested - he had to spend the first couple of years at his U.S. post justifying the existence of his program.

    Yep. Been there, done that (5.00 / 1) (#53)
    by Cream City on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 03:34:37 PM EST
    and got weary of being told by English department types who became deans that media studies was just "vocational education."  To which I replied that the difference appeared to be the mass commies :-) aka mass communication grads got jobs.  (At least in the good old days before this economy. . . .  But then, they're still getting jobs at a better rate than English grads, law school grads, etc., per recent data.)

    No matter to me, either way; I switched programs.  Now I just subvert deans from a field that they dare not dis, or it will be even more evident that they are petty emperors sans clothes.


    It is a hilarious thread (5.00 / 4) (#24)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 01:54:40 PM EST
    For the record, I have not posted at Daily Kos since March 2007, by mutual agreement.

    What (none / 0) (#28)
    by Ga6thDem on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 02:08:54 PM EST
    did you in? Was it the Summers thing?

    Looking back that was eerily predictive of some behavior that came later on.


    Naw (5.00 / 5) (#35)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 02:26:32 PM EST
    Dana Houle convinced Kos that I was ruining the site with my incivility and I said 'say what?' Dana Houle says that? You got to be kidding me.

    At the time, I had already resigned from the Front Page. It was a hilarious episode.

    In any event, I wrote a post saying I was leaving due to differences with management. Management came in and said, it was solely my decision.

    I asked them to be straight aout what happened. They weren't. I told the truth and then that was that.


    "the management" (5.00 / 2) (#39)
    by Fabian on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 02:35:42 PM EST
    I never did trust the management after the Great Pie Fight and the management never gave me a reason to, either.

    Pie fight :) (5.00 / 1) (#50)
    by Militarytracy on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 03:11:40 PM EST
    What a time :)

    Leave bonddad (5.00 / 1) (#45)
    by Warren Terrer on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 02:52:29 PM EST

    ROTFLMAO!! (5.00 / 1) (#47)
    by Ga6thDem on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 02:54:30 PM EST
    Incivility? At DK? Double LOL! Of course, now I understand why you thought MB's post was so funny.

    For some reason I dont remember you writing about leaving but I do remember a lot of your posts that you did over there.  


    Dana Houle not exactly a model (none / 0) (#81)
    by MO Blue on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 06:57:37 PM EST
    of civility. If Dkos was modeled on "Survivor,"  he would have been the first one I would have voted off the island.

    And the post that triggered all this? (5.00 / 1) (#32)
    by snstara on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 02:20:11 PM EST
    The GBCW of Bonddad, saying he'll return only when the place becomes more civil.  

    Since at least one of the self-appointed defenders of 'civility' blamed Meteor Blades, I gather that this is MB's response.


    The most interesting times (none / 0) (#55)
    by Fabian on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 03:44:57 PM EST
    were when users figured out exactly what buttons to push to get certain results in the community.  I saw at least a few successful hoax/scam diaries there.  Recced right up until some inquisitive skeptics exposed them.  I thought that constituted accurate analysis (and exploitation) of the community.

    "it was all my fault" (5.00 / 3) (#7)
    by Capt Howdy on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 01:16:08 PM EST
    I always thought the fault was Hillaries.  well, hers and her inbred, low brow, low income, white trash supporters.

    That was before it was (5.00 / 8) (#21)
    by cawaltz on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 01:40:34 PM EST
    all the rude and obnoxious Edwards suppoerters fault(I remember when a slew of them lost TU status while the equally provoking Obama supporters were not given the same measure of "punishment").

    For the record, I find it interesting that anyone would have considered you the problem BTD. Sure, you are passionate and agressive with your opinions but so was a good 75% of the site at one time.

    I left sometime shortly after the Hillary darkened photos and the tripe about how Clinton's wins where she celebrated with her supporters were to be taken lightly. It was more than apparent that objectivity had been thrown out the window. Furthermore, there didn't seem to be any effort to even contain the worst and most disgraceful smear campaigns that seemed to pop up on a regular basis. Someone would make random crap up, not substantiate and next thing you know you'd have a bunch of dittoheads claiming it as fact.

    I was kind of sad to let the site go. I still miss the gardening and food diaries as well as some of the camraderie that I felt with some of the diarists. One of the worst things for me was taking my blinders off and seeing that some of the people I thought I shared principles and values with toss those right out the window in order to get something in the win column.


    I could use some good news. (5.00 / 8) (#37)
    by Fabian on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 02:30:01 PM EST
    Been putting off a doctor's visit until school starts.  It's a ton easier to do without finding child care.  I expect a GP visit, then a specialist visit, then a round of radiology and possibly some more imaging studies.  

    Doing some research on the web before I go in.  I really am like that!  Some people say "Doc, what's wrong with me?".  I try to figure out what is wrong with me and what the treatment is likely to be before I go in.  I don't like surprises.   Been there, done that and it stunk every single time.  I'd  be sitting there with my jaw on my floor, dealing with the emotional blow while the nice person was trying to tell me important things.  I was doing my best to understand and absorb it while my brain was going "Oh sh!t!  What does this mean?  How much will this cost?  How disruptive will this be?".  

    The good news is that for a year or two more, I'll still have good insurance through my husband.  

    ((((Fabian))))) (5.00 / 2) (#38)
    by cawaltz on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 02:33:36 PM EST
    We'll keep fighting the good fight to get you coverage after that year or two is up one way or another.

    Good luck.


    I'm hoping for good news (5.00 / 4) (#40)
    by Fabian on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 02:41:30 PM EST
    That's major surgery and three months of recuperation.  (There go my plans to whip the garden into shape this fall.)

    I looked at the bad news.  Let's just say that I'm praying that it is good news.

    Thanks for the hugs!  Much appreciated.


    watch for incoming (5.00 / 4) (#44)
    by Capt Howdy on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 02:49:09 PM EST
    positive vibes

    Here's hoping your doctor's (5.00 / 5) (#51)
    by MO Blue on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 03:21:10 PM EST
    "good news" is better than you are expecting.

    Will keep good thoughts going your way.


    Many, many good wishes (5.00 / 2) (#75)
    by Radiowalla on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 05:25:12 PM EST
    come floating your way.

    XXXOOO to you, Fabian



    Ugh, sorry (5.00 / 4) (#52)
    by andgarden on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 03:25:50 PM EST
    Best wishes.

    Yeah. (5.00 / 4) (#54)
    by Fabian on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 03:38:40 PM EST
    It'll delay some other goals - becoming employed again, getting a dog.  I could look up online courses to take! :)

    Fabian, hope it's better (5.00 / 4) (#58)
    by caseyOR on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 03:51:06 PM EST
    than you think. I'll be thinking of you. Good luck.

    Keeping my fingers crossed for you. (none / 0) (#84)
    by vml68 on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 08:44:55 PM EST
    It'll delay some other goals - becoming employed again, getting a dog.

    First goal is your health, next goal finding the perfect little kuvasz pup...at which point employment would be good considering what it's going to cost you to feed the dog.


    Actually (none / 0) (#85)
    by Fabian on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 09:12:47 PM EST
    One of the surprising thing about livestock guardian dogs is how little they eat for their size!  LGDs tend to be very thrifty animals.  My dog certainly was.  I once got him a few lamb hearts as a treat.  He ate some and buried the rest.  The smell of rotting organ meat taught me  to not do that again.  

    It's the care and the exercise that is the real issue.  No way I can deal with ninety pounds of enthusiasm unless I am fully able.


    I did not know that. (5.00 / 1) (#94)
    by vml68 on Tue Aug 25, 2009 at 08:23:22 AM EST
    I assumed it was only the giant breeds that ate less compared to their size. I thought the LGD's being really active dogs burnt a lot of calories and therefore had bigger appetites.

    He ate some and buried the rest.  The smell of rotting organ meat taught me  to not do that again.

    Ugh! Thanks for the tip.... :-)

    LGDs watch. (none / 0) (#95)
    by Fabian on Wed Aug 26, 2009 at 01:55:38 PM EST
    Even when they are actively investigating something, they aren't a whirlwind of activity.  They tend to be very focused, very precise.  If something is near, you'll know exactly where it is or what direction to look in.  By the intensity of the alert, you'll know what the threat level is.  

    They do enjoy long walks and will play with you, but a lot of time they are just keeping an eye on everything.  


    Tape recorder (5.00 / 5) (#56)
    by gyrfalcon on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 03:44:57 PM EST
    Ask the doc if you can bring a tape recorder and tape your session.  Friend of mind took to doing that when she had some complicated medical issues, and it helped enormously because she could concentrate better on the conversation without worrying abut remembering all the details, then go home and review what was actually said.  She said it was disconcerting how often the tape recording showed the doc hadn't quite said what she had thought.

    Always a good idea. (5.00 / 1) (#57)
    by Fabian on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 03:48:24 PM EST
    Another good idea is to bring someone with you.  I have a friend I could ask.  He's dealt with all manner of medical issues.  

    You would be surprised at how often (5.00 / 4) (#62)
    by MO Blue on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 04:19:49 PM EST
    two people will hear completely different things. My daughter came with me. When there was a difference of opinion, sometimes she was right and sometimes I was right.

    Best to combine a tape recorder and another person. Also, a good idea to have a list of items you want to discuss and share the list with the person who is going with you. It is very easy to be sidetracked and get home only to realize that you did not get all the information you wanted.


    My friend that I mention below (5.00 / 3) (#65)
    by nycstray on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 04:28:12 PM EST
    had that happen in her family (why they go in pairs now). Turns out her brother always hears something much more drastic than reality. My sister is like that, which is why I'm the designated one. My mother does not want her to have control of "the plug" when the time comes  ;) {family joke that sister isn't in on!}

    But even on routine info, there can be a dif. so it's good to have a recording or something, even just bullet pointed notes to be able to call the Dr back for clarification.


    I was going to suggest a friend (5.00 / 2) (#63)
    by nycstray on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 04:22:18 PM EST
    who brings a note pad. My friend and her siblings go to the hospital in pairs with their dad so they are covered on info and questions, with one being the designated note taker. My niece fills that role currently with my mom on my dad's medical biggies. Niece has home health training and some schooling, so she's been extra handy with the medical talk and note taking. You may also need support for good news, especially if you've been looking at the bad news. You can kinda go blank when they tell you it isn't the worst case scenario.  ;)

    Best of luck!


    Just a crummy observation... (5.00 / 5) (#68)
    by desertswine on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 04:40:41 PM EST
    I had to go for a ct scan this am.  It's like going thru the Stargate portal except that when you come out you're still in the same sh!tty place.

    Funny! (none / 0) (#86)
    by Fabian on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 09:16:53 PM EST
    Brilliant things, aren't they?  I saw my mother's CT and the details were so clear!  

    Wow, please take good care (5.00 / 2) (#79)
    by Militarytracy on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 05:42:53 PM EST
    as much as you can.  One day at a time.  I had some challenges awhile ago.  For the most part behind me now, but who knows....things can regroup.  I wish you well and if it is any comfort my doctor visit today was splendid.  More than I thought I could expect.  I'm very allergic to alternaria and this is the time of year that it is everywhere in the air down here.  It is the cause of my asthma.  I'm so allergic to it that my doctor would have liked to try a round of allergy shots but my RAST score on it was so high they decided not to because I could go into anaphylactic shock.  Today though he said that they are now doing an under the tongue drop for people with an extreme allergy like mine.  If it takes, in two years I may not have this asthma issue at all.  I was sort of floored that such a possibility existed.  I take my first dose on Wednesday and attend some sort of class on how to mix it up, then I will do that and take them at home from then on.  My doctor didn't know how much my insurance would cover though.  They are asking for copays on it.  I told him I did not care.  It was worth almost anything to me if it worked.

    Thanks. (none / 0) (#83)
    by Fabian on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 08:25:42 PM EST
    I'm glad they have found something for you.  I can't imagine having real allergies.  I just have to pop some antihistamines when I rake the leaves.

    Here's a link for you talking about the best and worst in dog breeding WRT bad hips.  Painful and promising at the same time.


    Bernie Madoff has terminal cancer (none / 0) (#1)
    by Slado on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 01:04:28 PM EST
    Too bad he wasn't convicted in Scotland.

    He will die in custody because he was tried in the US.

    perhaps its the (none / 0) (#2)
    by Capt Howdy on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 01:06:25 PM EST
    hate and anger that fills utterly  me but I think thats exactly what he deserves.

    Me too (none / 0) (#3)
    by Slado on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 01:09:22 PM EST
    I also thought it's what a certain Libyan terrorist deserved but it is interesting to learn this right after that case was so publicly discussed.

    Karma (none / 0) (#20)
    by TeresaInSnow2 on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 01:38:43 PM EST
    is a beeotttch! as they say.

    however (none / 0) (#4)
    by Capt Howdy on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 01:11:58 PM EST
    I would release him 10 times before I would have released the Libyan.

    I guess I just (none / 0) (#8)
    by Slado on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 01:18:13 PM EST
    don't understand the logic.  

    If you agree that 20 or 40 years for a crime is acceptable why does it become irrelevant when we learn that someone only has a few months to live?

    It's ok to take 20 to 40 years of someones life from them but not OK to take the final moths of a criminals life?

    Compassion and mercy are commendable but practiced indiscriminately they don't seem to fill any purpose.


    It's a budget item.... (5.00 / 1) (#36)
    by oldpro on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 02:28:33 PM EST
    cost-cutting measures for states right now, for end-of-life care - in or out of prison - are the most expensive years.  Government can't afford it.

    beats me (none / 0) (#9)
    by Capt Howdy on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 01:19:41 PM EST
    I guess it feels good.

    Capt, what do you ... (none / 0) (#10)
    by Robot Porter on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 01:22:41 PM EST
    think of the Delgo v. Avatar kerfuffle?

    You worked on Delgo, didn't you?


    link please (none / 0) (#11)
    by Capt Howdy on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 01:23:45 PM EST
    totally unaware of this.  although I did notice several visual similarities.

    Here's the ... (none / 0) (#12)
    by Robot Porter on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 01:25:22 PM EST
    that is too damn funny (none / 0) (#14)
    by Capt Howdy on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 01:28:38 PM EST
    I spent the whole weekend unplugged.  

    holy crow (none / 0) (#13)
    by Capt Howdy on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 01:26:38 PM EST
    I just googled delgo vs avatar.

    782,000 hits.



    that should get the (none / 0) (#15)
    by Capt Howdy on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 01:29:04 PM EST
    DVD rentals up.

    btw and for the record (none / 0) (#17)
    by Capt Howdy on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 01:32:48 PM EST
    it is completely untrue that I Xeroxed the AVATAR script I read in 1995 and gave it to Marc Adler to base Delgo on.

    but please spread the rumor anyway.


    A better rumor denial ... (none / 0) (#25)
    by Robot Porter on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 01:58:21 PM EST
    would be claiming "that stolen Delgo preproduction artwork cannot be tied to anyone in the Avatar production team."



    Why did the pope... (none / 0) (#60)
    by Dadler on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 04:12:06 PM EST
    ...forgive and support the release of the man who shot and critically wounded him (btw, is that any less heinous than murder simply because the Pope had to fortune to survive?)?  John Paul II said, "What we talked about will have to remain a secret between him and me. I spoke to him as a brother whom I have pardoned and who has my complete trust.

    What about the Amish community in Nickel Mines, who, after the terrible massacre of children in their school, responded with a deep sense of forgiveness?


    the Pope?? (5.00 / 1) (#61)
    by Capt Howdy on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 04:19:28 PM EST
    the Amish?  Im sure I do not know or care.

    Well, the shooter of the Amish (5.00 / 1) (#67)
    by Cream City on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 04:35:10 PM EST
    was already dead.  They might as well forgive him, and you might as well find a more relevant parallel.

    Ditto re the Pope's pardon, that was a personal one, and many of the families of the Lockerbie mass murder have done the same.  Who knows, maybe even some of the 270 passengers and crew in Scotland or the dozen on the ground who had a plane land on them would have done the same, but none survived to get the chance.

    But you don't think that the pope's pardon let the guy off, do you?  You might as well find another more relevant parallel. . . .


    Just because (none / 0) (#69)
    by jbindc on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 04:46:18 PM EST
    A vicitm can find forgiveness in their heart for the perpetrator of a crime against them, does not mean that the perpetrator should not be punished.

    Forgiveness is actually about the person wronged being able to get on with their lives - it really has nothing to do with perpetrator.


    Never Heard al-Megrahi Was Forgiven (5.00 / 0) (#73)
    by daring grace on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 05:16:49 PM EST
    by Scotland.

    Simply released to return to die in his homeland with his family for humane reasons.


    And mercy/compassion... (5.00 / 0) (#76)
    by kdog on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 05:25:32 PM EST
    is all about the person/entity giving it, the receiver is irrelevant.

    Instant Karma gonna get ya.... (none / 0) (#18)
    by kdog on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 01:35:40 PM EST
    At this rate, we can shut down the criminal injustice system, karma is on a roll baby.

    Just go easy on me karma...I'm tryin', I swear I'm tryin'.


    Not true, according to bureau of prisons (none / 0) (#46)
    by ruffian on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 02:54:26 PM EST
    Bureaus of Prisons, Bernies new landlord, denies he has cancer or is terminally ill.

    Whew... (none / 0) (#88)
    by kdog on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 10:36:41 PM EST
    thats a relief, can't have anyone dying before they've been adequately punished.

    feeling a little to healthy (none / 0) (#16)
    by Capt Howdy on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 01:29:53 PM EST
    KFC introduces the double down

    MMMMM (none / 0) (#19)
    by TeresaInSnow2 on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 01:37:47 PM EST
    Does it come with a free coupon for a cardiologist?

    I'll have to say, it sure looks good ;-).


    Pitiful compared to the (none / 0) (#22)
    by oldpro on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 01:41:46 PM EST
    Heart Attack Cafe/Grill...Arizona's contribution to the 'why wait to make your end-of-life decisions' discussion.

    Their all-you-can-eat french fries are cooked in LARD!


    Mmmm....Lard (none / 0) (#30)
    by kdog on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 02:17:52 PM EST
    I bet them sh*ts are goooood:)

    If the government ever gets full control of processing the healthcare bills, you'll see lard treated the same way we treat crack now....its what makes me nervous, otherwise I wouldn't care who processes the healthcare bills, whatver works best...but only the government can criminalize/prohibit behavior, the insurance companies have no such power, unless you consider the government as an arm of the insurance company, which might not be too far off:)


    Piecrust. I remember when (5.00 / 4) (#34)
    by oldpro on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 02:25:53 PM EST
    I transitioned from lard to Crisco  Didn't take long before I was adding butter to the batch...a little more every time!

    Butter.  I will never give up the real thing...not even if there's a war (or two) on and it's rationed (again!)  Yes.  WWII, the big one.  I even remember red points...for meat rationing, ya know.

    Ah, the good old days...


    Can't relate my friend.... (none / 0) (#41)
    by kdog on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 02:44:01 PM EST
    I've never known rationing or sacrifice...when the country has been in trouble in my lifetime, the orders were "go shopping, consume more!".

    But I ignored them:)


    IS there anything beer can't do? (none / 0) (#26)
    by scribe on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 02:02:24 PM EST
    It's even a crime-fighter's tool!

    At this rate, one might reasonably expect Batman to start having a six of Bud on his utility belt before long.  ....  It would make a great product placement opportunity, no?

    To be fair... (5.00 / 1) (#27)
    by kdog on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 02:07:51 PM EST
    my bong can do just as much damage as a beer can if thrown at a would be robber...or you could break it like a beer bottle and you've got yourself a blade.

    Now lets see beer treat glaucoma!...:)


    Are you mad? (5.00 / 1) (#42)
    by coast on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 02:45:45 PM EST
    Don't throw the bong, for God sakes have you lost your mind?  Simply throw the bong water at him.  That will mark the poor robber for a good while (I know it was almost impossible to get the smell out of my carpet). Then let the dogs find him.  No need to ruin a perfectly good bong.

    Not a bad idea coast... (none / 0) (#49)
    by kdog on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 03:06:07 PM EST
    but I'm not trying to get the guy arrested by marking him with scent, just wanna stop a robbery without dropping a dime and bringing even more trouble:)

    And then Ashcroft would send you up (none / 0) (#29)
    by scribe on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 02:17:40 PM EST
    like he did Tommy Chong.

    I hope karma knows she ain't done yet... (none / 0) (#31)
    by kdog on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 02:19:05 PM EST
    I can't wait to see what fate awaits Ashcroft and his minions who did Tommy so dirty.

    damn (none / 0) (#59)
    by Capt Howdy on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 04:10:34 PM EST
    Latest in Stimulus: 'Cash for Refrigerators'
    Coming this fall, a clunkers-type program to boost sales of energy-efficient home appliances will authorize rebates of $50 to $200

    wouldnt you know.  I just got a new fridge.

    Need a new washer and dryer (none / 0) (#64)
    by MO Blue on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 04:23:11 PM EST
    Would like a clunker program for them.

    Home appliances (none / 0) (#72)
    by caseyOR on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 05:11:43 PM EST
    Washers and dryers are home appliance, MO Blue. Lots of energy efficient (Energy Star) models on the market. Check it out. Could be a score for you.

    I thought I saw that (none / 0) (#66)
    by nycstray on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 04:31:24 PM EST
    but only caught the tail end an wasn't sure . .

    All mine are newish and energy efficient. I wish there were rebates on just buying a new without turning in an old. I could use a small fridge for a root cellar {grin}


    Michael Jackson's (none / 0) (#70)
    by Capt Howdy on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 04:52:19 PM EST
    That was f*ckin' predictable... (none / 0) (#71)
    by kdog on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 05:08:26 PM EST
    this is what happens when a society becomes obsessed with doling out "punishment".

    Propofol (none / 0) (#74)
    by Fabian on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 05:19:04 PM EST
    is not self administered (unless you have a death wish) and if the cause of death was "a lethal level of propofol" then they aren't attributing it to any of the other drugs in his system.

    A lethal level of a single drug that someone else administered?  Especially someone who should have known better?  I have zero sympathy for the doctor if this is the story.  A big fat "Fail" on medical ethics and another "Fail" on misuse of a drug.


    Fair enough... (5.00 / 1) (#77)
    by kdog on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 05:31:47 PM EST
    I got no problem calling him a sh*tty doctor, in fact I've said he was a drug dealer who just happened to be a doctor.  He was working in a drug dealer capacity...and I see no reason why he would kill his best customer on purpose.  On accident, maybe.

    If we wanna take his license away thats fine, but thats as far as I'd go. Don't feel sorry for the doc, feel sorry for our "punishment" society gone wild.


    Don't you think it worthwhile (5.00 / 1) (#80)
    by Cream City on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 06:38:26 PM EST
    to stop such doctors from doing it again?  Don't you know that the medical society does not sufficiently police its own, so that the larger society has to do something to prevent more deaths?

    Do you really think this always, always is about punishment?  Your knee-jerk defenses often have their charm, but that's not where your brains are, kdog!


    C'mon CC... (none / 0) (#82)
    by kdog on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 08:11:10 PM EST
    do we really need the state to lock his arse up in a cage to keep him from hurting us?  I don't need that protection, honestly, do you?  They ruled it a homicide to make somebody pay and have someone to blame besides MJ...public safety got nothing to do with it.

    Have you seen the time line (5.00 / 1) (#89)
    by nycstray on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 10:52:16 PM EST
    and the drugs he gave him before the injection that killed him? Latest I heard was manslaughter, which to me sounds fair (based on what's on the news tonight).

    Public safety? Um, how about a Dr that will feed addicts, against their best interests? It becomes a public safety issue when the Dr will feed an addict, and also what that addict can do to others in public (driving and killing others, perhaps?)

    From what I heard tonight, he didn't give just the one drug. It was a series of injections over time (night into morning). MJ may have had the money, but the Doc should have had the knowledge and compassion to do the right thing (that's if he's guilty).


    You're right. (none / 0) (#87)
    by Fabian on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 09:21:22 PM EST
    I'd just strip him of every professional privilege he had and turn him out into the street.  With no way of practicing medicine, he's going to be knocked way down the economic ladder.  He won't hurt anyone if he can't write another prescription.

    That wouldn't stop him (none / 0) (#90)
    by nycstray on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 10:54:00 PM EST
    if he really wanted to practice. We have all kinds of "illegal" Drs here. The patient stories aren't pretty . . . .

    But Fabian, the problem again (none / 0) (#92)
    by Cream City on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 11:00:36 PM EST
    is that the medical profession does not do that; it does not sufficiently police its own -- or this doc would not have been practicing, from what I've read.  (And not just in this case but in so many; maybe I'm fortunate in having a local paper with a long record of good reporters on the medical beat, so we know how impotent are professional boards.)

    Sorry to say so to you at this point, when you have to put your trust in medical professionals.  I sure do, but once I've checked them out -- as I know you do, from what you wrote.  So I wish you all the best.


    How nice for you and me (none / 0) (#91)
    by Cream City on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 10:56:11 PM EST
    as the rule is that if we're okay, screw the rest?

    You really must not have had to spend much time in medical care, if you think that you can control which medical personnel treat you, and you really must not ever have been put under an anesthetic, and . . . forget it; you take your risks all you want.  But for me and mine, I want medical personnel who will live up to the oaths they took.


    I meant you, me, and everybody CC... (none / 0) (#93)
    by kdog on Tue Aug 25, 2009 at 06:23:12 AM EST
    I don't think anybody needs "protection" from this man, even MJ didn't, he needed protection from himself, and I don't believe it is societies place to provide protection from yourself, only others who wish to do harm.  This quack isn't sneaking into peoples hospital rooms or bedrooms and sticking them with needles...he only comes when called, and gives people what they ask for..the classic Dr. Feelgood.  I don't see a crime.

    I think it is fair to say he won't harm anybody who doesn't want to be harmed...thats where I differ with you and stray.  I believe in the right to harm yourself if that is how you wanna live.  And I think this is how MJ wanted to live, and it killed him. Tragic, yes.  Sad, yes...addiction is sad and tragic.  I see no reason to add more tragedy via our cages.  


    Glad you're here, BTD. (none / 0) (#78)
    by jen on Mon Aug 24, 2009 at 05:42:35 PM EST
    Been reading you since the Clark days, and you were a lion in defending him. We were all so proud of you! During the 08 primaries, dk became noxiously toxic if one wasn't for Obama and a whole slew of us left. This blog, thanks to Jeralyn, has always been one of the most civil places on the left. It's a good place for you.