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Saturday Morning Open Thread

By Big Tent Democrat, Section Blog Related
Posted on Sat Sep 06, 2008 at 08:04:02 AM EST
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It's a relatively quiet schedule in college football today. The game that will get the most attention is the renewal of the haphazardly played Florida- Miami matchup. Miami has won the last 6 times the game was played, but that has been over the course of 25 years. Today the Gators are 3 touchdown favorites in in The Swamp. Last week the Gators beat Hawaii 56-10. Miami beat Charleston Southern 52-7.

Go Gators!

This is an Open Thread.

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    Saturday Morning Open Thread | 93 comments (93 topical)

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    I'm not into football (5.00 / 2) (#2)
    by JAB on Sat Sep 06, 2008 at 08:21:21 AM EST
    so I can't participate in this thread in that way, and I know it's early, but why is Obama trying to go down the race path again?

    Yesterday in PA, Obama brought out the "funny name" and "maybe he's got Muslim connections" theme again. (You know, "Barack Obama" is no "funnier" than many immigrants names - heck, my great-grandfather's first name was "Fiorentino" and another grandfather's last name was "Zelazny").

    Link

    Does he not realize that people aren't buying this anymore? H needs to give it a rest - it turns people off.

    In PA? (5.00 / 2) (#5)
    by Fabian on Sat Sep 06, 2008 at 08:40:54 AM EST
    I think I can rattle off about five ethnic groups in PA that would have "funny names".  We grew up just west of PA and we were full of hard-to-pronounce, authentically spelled names from Russia, Slovenia, Poland, Germany and other Eastern European countries.  Plus cracks about "Polish noses" because we didn't have "Roman noses" in our town.  In our town, WASPs weren't local nobility, they were the elitists from the East.  

    Gotta know your audience.

    Parent

    I was thinking the same thing (none / 0) (#39)
    by BarnBabe on Sat Sep 06, 2008 at 10:03:56 AM EST
    At least with Barrack you can make a good guess with it when you see it. With the last names around here in Pennsylvania, you take a bad stab at them and can really mangle a persons name. I guess he thinks this works.

    Parent
    It doesn't work with YOU (none / 0) (#40)
    by CaptainAmerica08 on Sat Sep 06, 2008 at 10:13:33 AM EST
    because YOU aren't an sheltered, xenophobic, half invested voter. A lot of Americans are. How do you think Bush got this country to support the Iraq war? A big piece of it was fear peddling. Fear of the "other". You have to understand that every comment a candidate says isn't, can't and shouldn't be directed at every person that hears it.

    Parent
    Our point is the INTENDED audience (5.00 / 1) (#47)
    by Fabian on Sat Sep 06, 2008 at 10:37:07 AM EST
    It's not a "funny sounding" name, the locals have plenty of those. Obama's name says "You aren't from around here, are you?" to hill folks.  So his first job is to say
    "Hey, I'm not from around here.  My folks aren't from around here.  Watch me prove that I understand you and that I understand your problems.".

    Obama needs to stop thinking that he needs to sell voters on Obama.  He needs to sell voters on a vision.  He needs to sell voters on a plan.  All he needs to convince voters of is that his visions and plans are sincere, will help them and that he will fight for them.  (Both the voters and his vision.)

    The product is NOT Obama.  The product is "What will Obama do for me?".  Obama is just the delivery vehicle.

    Parent

    I don't know but (none / 0) (#6)
    by hookfan on Sat Sep 06, 2008 at 08:45:10 AM EST
    do you have any clue what he is referring to when he states that over the last 20 years he's been giving health care to kids who need it?

    Parent
    According to his own website (5.00 / 1) (#7)
    by JAB on Sat Sep 06, 2008 at 08:54:59 AM EST
    He "sponsored and helped pass legislation that expanded Illinois KidCare program" in 2003 that expanded the range of family income that would be eligible for the program. (would that be the same year Emil Jones fed him legislation?)

    Parent
    Thank you but that doesn't at all cover 20 years (5.00 / 1) (#9)
    by hookfan on Sat Sep 06, 2008 at 09:02:08 AM EST
    he's talking previous history to his involvement the Illinois legislature. Is he referring to playing pick-up basketball as a community organizer and pawning it off as health care?

    Parent
    I've googled it but found nothing (none / 0) (#8)
    by hookfan on Sat Sep 06, 2008 at 08:58:21 AM EST
    Please tell me he's not just making stuff up to cover his weak resume-- especially after the O'reilly blunder.

    Parent
    No, I found it (5.00 / 1) (#10)
    by JAB on Sat Sep 06, 2008 at 09:04:31 AM EST
    Link

    But again - I think this might be one of those bills  given to him by Emil Jones, but I don't know - the timing fits,

    Parent

    Football, sports, and funny names! (none / 0) (#38)
    by EL seattle on Sat Sep 06, 2008 at 09:57:55 AM EST
    Personally, Obama's "he has a funny name" riff never had much meaning to me because of all the "funny names" I grew up reading on the back of NFL football jerseys and watching all kinds of sports as a kid.  The multi-syllable Eastern European names were always fun when I was 6 years old and learning to read.  But that didn't stop me or anyone else from being a big, say, Carl Yastrzemski fan.

    Ultimately, does Barak Obama sound any funnier than Lew Alcindor?  Should  ol' Lew have changed his name to something more 'Merican sounding to have a more sucessful carreer?

    If Obama ever decides to change his name, I'm sure that NASCAR driver Dick Trickle would be willing to give hime a ride to the Department of Records (or whererever you go to do those things).

    Parent

    So this is the race card? (none / 0) (#80)
    by obiden08 on Sat Sep 06, 2008 at 03:22:41 PM EST
    You know, I've often wondered what folks meant when they said Obama played the race card so I really appreciate this post.  It would have never occurred to me that his "funny name" comments were considered playing the race card because I never thought of them that way.  I always thought he was trying to pushback against the "he's a Muslim terroist" comments and the insinuations that he's related to Saddam Hussein and Osama bin Laden.  

    Maybe he needs to just address the terrorist smears head-on instead of playing light with them, as I thought he was doing with the "funny name' comments.  I wonder if he knows some folks consider this "playing the race card."  The folks around him should be aware if he isn't.  

    Then again, I'm a bit worried that he's been campaigning 18 months and not everyone is clear on what a community organizer does.  This should have been clear a LONG time ago.  The campaign may be assuming understandings that the public just does not have.  Not good.

    Very interesting post and very enlightening.

    Parent

    Reminds Me Of A Story (5.00 / 1) (#4)
    by WakeLtd on Sat Sep 06, 2008 at 08:37:13 AM EST
    Years ago, I was involved, as a supervisor, in explaining to an employee that we were firing him for poor performance. My job was to go over all  the documentation of his performance  evalauations, his previous counselings, the metrics we used,  etc. When I was done he asked, "Do you think it is because I have a beard? Lots of people don't like beards. Should I shave it off?"

    No matter what Barack hears about why some won't vote for him,  he keeps coming back with, "It's my name right? Sounds too Muslim?"

    Rasmussen says Obama up by 3 (5.00 / 2) (#11)
    by MKS on Sat Sep 06, 2008 at 09:10:16 AM EST
    Here is this morning's Rasmussen poll, showing a one point gain by Obama since yesterday.

    Here is Poblano's analysis and estimate of Rasmussen's daily results.

    Poblano had the nightlies as follows:

    Weds:     Obama +6 (reaction to Thompson and Lieberman)

    Thurs:  Obama +2 (reaction to Palin)

    Friday:  To get to a three day average of +3, Friday had to be Obama +1.

    That means Obama outpolled McCain during the GOP convention.

    Depending on today's polling, the three day average reported on Sunday could show a lower Obama lead as Wednesday drops off.

    Rasmussen is overall not all that favorable to Obama....If McCain can't win the night he gives his acceptance speech according to Rasmussen, he is in trouble....

    Obama outpolled McCain (5.00 / 1) (#16)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Sat Sep 06, 2008 at 09:14:14 AM EST
    And that surprises you?

    My gawd, I hope he is outpolling McCain.

    Parent

    You have always been more optimistic (none / 0) (#20)
    by MKS on Sat Sep 06, 2008 at 09:20:46 AM EST
    than me....

    After Palimania and McCain's POW retrospective, I assumed McCain would have at least taken the night....He did not.

    Obama is today (at 49) only two points off his all-time high (51) on Rasmussen.  Obama consolidated the Democratic base with his convention....and McCain's convention stunts have not changed that...

    But if you have been more accurate than me, I'll take it....


    Parent

    The day McCain leads in the polls (none / 0) (#28)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Sat Sep 06, 2008 at 09:38:54 AM EST
    is the day I worry.

    Parent
    I think we'll see that by Tuesday ... (none / 0) (#55)
    by Robot Porter on Sat Sep 06, 2008 at 11:30:02 AM EST
    next week.

    Parent
    I think you should already worry (none / 0) (#69)
    by BernieO on Sat Sep 06, 2008 at 12:22:29 PM EST
    when you think that Kerry had a much bigger lead at this stage of the game. And the public wasn't nearly as fed up with Bush and the Republicans as they are now. Obama should be up by double digits, 20+ points given all that. It is not good since the Republicans have undoubtedly been waiting until after the conventions to use their best ammunition against him.

    Parent
    MKS- are you joking? (5.00 / 1) (#41)
    by kenosharick on Sat Sep 06, 2008 at 10:16:15 AM EST
    you think this is good news for Obama? They had expected to be leading by 10+ points right now. Instead you cite one poll (others show a tie-including CBS) that is within the MOE and seem to think this proves that mccain is in trouble. The Obama campaign should be worried just as much- this is going to be very close once again.

    Parent
    Who expected a 10 point lead (5.00 / 1) (#46)
    by andgarden on Sat Sep 06, 2008 at 10:33:30 AM EST
    right after the Republican convention?

    Not me.

    Parent

    That's because (none / 0) (#71)
    by BernieO on Sat Sep 06, 2008 at 12:23:42 PM EST
    you are aware that the race is neck and neck, but going by past campaigns that should not be the case given the circumstances.

    Parent
    the polls I was responding to were (none / 0) (#93)
    by kenosharick on Sat Sep 06, 2008 at 09:38:40 PM EST
    post Dem convention, not repub convention. And yes, the Obama campaign was expecting a pretty good bounce from their convention- regardless of what the media said, I do not consider 3-4 pts a bounce. BTW- ten points for the Dem after their own convention is a decent bounce, many have gotton more.

    Parent
    Up by 10 after both conventions (none / 0) (#92)
    by MKS on Sat Sep 06, 2008 at 08:05:54 PM EST
    in September?   You are talking LBJ type territory.`

    Any lead by a Democrat in September is good.  Democrats who lose die in August.  

    Parent

    So +6 to +2 to +1 (none / 0) (#34)
    by hookfan on Sat Sep 06, 2008 at 09:46:34 AM EST
    He's declining, but the averaging masks somewhat the decline. Does this mean they are in a dead heat?

    Parent
    The way I look at it (5.00 / 1) (#36)
    by MKS on Sat Sep 06, 2008 at 09:53:27 AM EST
    Obama just took McCain's best shot and still won the exchange....

    This should be McCain's high water mark--his bounce....

    Early next week's polling will be the key....and the trend could go in McCain's favor, and I think Gallup will show a decrease later today when they publish their three day average (again, going by Poblano's estimate of the acutal nightlies)....

    But 6.1% unemployment and no economic plan by the Republicans can cover a lot of Democratic weakness.  

    Parent

    I'm a Nervous Nellie, and I basically agree (none / 0) (#42)
    by andgarden on Sat Sep 06, 2008 at 10:16:19 AM EST
    But let's see if McCain gets a delayed bounce.

    Parent
    Now the 527s may start, so (none / 0) (#56)
    by Cream City on Sat Sep 06, 2008 at 11:30:25 AM EST
    we may yet have to see McCain's best shot.  

    The polls have to be put in the context of a McCain campaign that had to wait until now to be sure that Clinton was not the VP (or even cause for a coup)at the Dem convention and then get past his own convention.

    So now we will see what they've got -- and what they've had for months but have had to hold back.  What have Obama's 527s got on McCain?  Only Palin?

    Parent

    What Have Obama's 527a got On McCain (none / 0) (#65)
    by glanton on Sat Sep 06, 2008 at 11:58:04 AM EST
    Well, like Palin, McCain is a diehard enemy of women's rights, so one would think that 527s interested in women's rights would be invested in exposing him on that front.

    McCain's jokes about killing Iranians, his Beach Boys version of Bomb Iran, his cavalier attitude towards the carnage of warfare in general (did you know he was a POW) might be something that 527s invested in our children's future could look at.

    McCain's belief that the economy is okay could, you know, spark an Independent Ad or two.

    His stated intentions to do NOTHING about Health Care could, you know, possibly be of interest to those who recognize there is a crisis.

    That McCain and his running mate want to BAN embryonic stem cell research (not just federal funding for it) might could be a thing to expose and go after.

    I don't know.  What have they got on McCain except just about everything.  

    Too bad when people think 527s, theyt think Swifties.  527 Ads don't need to be defacto lies.  With John mcCain the truth is damning.

    BTW: Did you know he was a POW?

    Parent

    Oh Yeah (none / 0) (#66)
    by glanton on Sat Sep 06, 2008 at 11:59:33 AM EST
    And then all of the above shows that he is indeed seeking to bring about Bush III.  Some might not like that, either.

    Parent
    That's encouraging... (none / 0) (#51)
    by Exeter on Sat Sep 06, 2008 at 11:05:33 AM EST
    But I'm still concerned about McCain's increasing support among women: specifically older women, blue collar women, and "security moms."

    Parent
    Just Goes to Show (none / 0) (#67)
    by glanton on Sat Sep 06, 2008 at 12:01:34 PM EST
    That the Earth is Round, Water is Wet, and Stoopidity is Cross-Gender.

    Parent
    Thanks for reminding me. (5.00 / 1) (#14)
    by Fabian on Sat Sep 06, 2008 at 09:13:44 AM EST
    Another home game.  Another Saturday to check the schedule so I can plan my travels around the mobs of fans.  It's like having a cattle drive, predictable and messy.  Oh, and it brings money into town.  That's the one advantage of college ball - no fighting over who pays for the stadium or the parking lots.  And no greedy owners moving the teams either.  

    I just don't do anything on a whim on football Saturday.  Go out to eat?  Better check when the game ends - restaurants will be slammed then.  Going shopping?  Better not drive within a three mile radius during the beginning or end.  I remember taking a ten mile detour once just to get home.  I couldn't just drive five miles home because it would have meant driving INTO campus.  What NOLA uses for hurricane evacuations, Columbus uses for football Saturdays.  They shift traffic to move vehicles OUT of campus and onto the highways as efficiently as possible.  Trying to get home INTO campus?  Sorry.  No can do.

    To be honest, I am glad.  A bunch of out of towners blundering the wrong way on one way, one lane streets is a recipe for disaster.  They finally installed an exit ramp specifically for OSU Hospitals.  Before, the main access to the hospital(1/2 mile from the stadium) was also the primary access to the stadium.  Brilliant.  They have to park cruisers on the hospital ramp during game days to keep clueless civilians from attempting a shortcut.

    I'd like sports so much more if I never had to deal with tens of thousands of fans at once.  

    Try living right across the street from (5.00 / 1) (#74)
    by shoephone on Sat Sep 06, 2008 at 12:47:30 PM EST
    an astro-turf, 9:00 am - 10:00 pm, 365 day a year playfield. We are invaded by local junior football the entire day for the rest of the Saturdays during football season. And we had to take them to court just to get them to follow the city rules after they changed the field from being natural grass and half the hours of activity to what it is now. The all-day traffic on this tiny street is enough to make a person want to commit hari-kari.

    But I underdstand what you are going through too. I used to live near Husky Stadium. Had to escape the neighborhood every Saturday by 10 a.m.

    I guess I'm a hypocrite. I like watching football on TV. I just don't want it ruining my life from across the street.

    Parent

    Wow. Who makes money (none / 0) (#76)
    by Fabian on Sat Sep 06, 2008 at 01:20:14 PM EST
    on that enterprise?

    The one thing football traffic taught me is that you really NEED to herd people like cattle.  Also, if you go to a game please plan on getting there waaaaay early.  The farther you travel, the earlier you need to be and scout out parking ahead of time.

    The real problem is that people get impatient, don't want to wait and think they can find a way around the problem.  They immediately become a problem in themselves and a hazard to everyone else.  

    Max capacity at the Horseshoe is 102,000!

    That's just a logistical nightmare.  There's a difference between a stadium built on the outskirts of town and one built smack in the middle of the most densely populated neighborhoods in Columbus.  Most residential parking is on street permit parking.  One lane, one way streets.  One lane, two way streets!  If you live there, you always keep a sharp eye out when you drive.  If you don't live there, please don't wander around unless you are on foot.

    Parent

    Small streets, big traffic (none / 0) (#79)
    by shoephone on Sat Sep 06, 2008 at 02:05:09 PM EST
    It really makes no sense, does it? We don't have permitted parking in this neighborhood -- yet, the city is talking about it -- but when I lived near Husky Stadium my street was all permitted parking and, honestly, it didn't mean much. The footballers would park there anyway. Only one of the apartment buildings had off-steet parking for tenants. What a nightmare!

    As to your question of who makes money on the local junior football: the football organization itself makes money through big fundraising and, of course, the city makes money hand over fist charging them for the rental of the field. There is soccer and baseball there as well. The fake grass fields make a lot more money by the hour than the natural grass fields do, which is part of the reason they put it in (much to the chagrin of the neighbors). But that's not stopping the city from asking the taxpayers for another multi-million dollar levy for parks this year.

    Don't know if it matters to you, Fabian, but I will be pulling for OSU to win today!

    Parent

    The three busiest professionals (none / 0) (#84)
    by Fabian on Sat Sep 06, 2008 at 04:03:24 PM EST
    on game day

    Cops/traffic control
    Tower truck operators
    Beer vendors

    On campus, prompt or near instantaneous towing is a specialty.  

    Parent

    Go Gators!!! (5.00 / 1) (#63)
    by TheRizzo on Sat Sep 06, 2008 at 11:51:22 AM EST
    Wish I was at the Swamp tonight.

    Sports Illustrated cover this (none / 0) (#1)
    by CaptainAmerica08 on Sat Sep 06, 2008 at 08:20:36 AM EST
    week features the return of Alabama as a national force. They do look good.

    They looked good (5.00 / 2) (#17)
    by Slado on Sat Sep 06, 2008 at 09:14:50 AM EST
    versus a poorly coached and outclassed Clemson team.

    We'll see how they do vs. Auburn, LSU, UT and the other teams on their SEC schedule.

    However there is little doubt that in 1 to 2 more seasons Alabama will be a consistent top 10 team.

    Parent

    I have a fantasy football team.... (none / 0) (#3)
    by Maria Garcia on Sat Sep 06, 2008 at 08:35:52 AM EST
    ...my first time ever. My husband and son are in about 50 leagues each so this year I decided to join a league a friend of mine started on yahoo. There aren't too many people in it so the draft was pretty  lucrative and everyone got a great quarterback and a pretty good backup. I picked second and even though normally root against the Patriots my son advised me to pick Tom Brady. I somehow also got him AND Randy Moss so now I am all in for the Patriots. GO PATS! (Except when they play the Ravens.)

    Wow--great picks (none / 0) (#15)
    by MKS on Sat Sep 06, 2008 at 09:14:04 AM EST
    Brady was injured when he played in the Super Bowl.  Olbermann showed tape where he was not following through on his throws because of a bad ankle.  He was very good in the Super Bowl, unlike his usual god-like perfection.

    Brady is the best....

    I like Romo more, however.....

    Parent

    I drafted that combo last year (none / 0) (#21)
    by nycstray on Sat Sep 06, 2008 at 09:22:37 AM EST
    and won my league  ;) And yes, I ended up rooting for the Pats except when they played the Jets {grin}


    Parent
    I'm sorry, Favre looks weird (none / 0) (#29)
    by MKS on Sat Sep 06, 2008 at 09:40:09 AM EST
    in a Jets uniform....Much worse than Montana as a Chief.

    Parent
    as a long time 9er fan (5.00 / 0) (#31)
    by nycstray on Sat Sep 06, 2008 at 09:43:04 AM EST
    I'll take Favre as a Jet over Montana s a Chief!  :)

    Parent
    "How 'bout them Cowboys!" (none / 0) (#35)
    by MKS on Sat Sep 06, 2008 at 09:47:11 AM EST
    Remember that?  

    Parent
    1980? (none / 0) (#37)
    by nycstray on Sat Sep 06, 2008 at 09:57:15 AM EST
    When I first moved to NYC, the only time I cheered for the Giants was when they played the Cowboys.

    Parent
    Jimmy Johnson in the locker room after the Cowboys (none / 0) (#90)
    by MKS on Sat Sep 06, 2008 at 07:57:35 PM EST
    beat the Niners in San Francisco....early 90s.

    Cowboys went on to beat Buffalo for the first of three Super Bowl wins in the 90s.

    Parent

    "God's Team" (none / 0) (#44)
    by santarita on Sat Sep 06, 2008 at 10:27:28 AM EST
    God didn't help the 'Boys so much when Dwight Clark made "The Catch".

    I was a Giants fan before I was a '9'ers fan and never liked the Cowboys.  Especially after they knocked Frank Gifford out.  And through the years they have done nothing to redeem themselves in my opinion.  Nothing.  No how, no way.

    And Joe Montana in any uniform is fine with me.  The Best Ever.

    Parent

    Dwight Clark and Bart Starr (none / 0) (#91)
    by MKS on Sat Sep 06, 2008 at 07:58:11 PM EST
    ...I remember them well.

    Parent
    But he looks (none / 0) (#32)
    by rooge04 on Sat Sep 06, 2008 at 09:44:10 AM EST
    so cute now that he's aged into his looks. ;)

    Parent
    Is it really pronounced "faver"? (none / 0) (#54)
    by oculus on Sat Sep 06, 2008 at 11:28:11 AM EST
    I heard that on a baseball broadcast and was shocked, shocked, I tell you.

    Parent
    It's pronounced differently (5.00 / 1) (#58)
    by Cream City on Sat Sep 06, 2008 at 11:33:20 AM EST
    </