McCain/Palin to Campaign in Colorado Springs Saturday

The Rocky Mountain News reports Sen. John McCain and Gov. Sarah Palin will campaign together at the Colorado Jet Center in Colorado Springs, CO Saturday.

Colorado Springs, home to evangelical America. James Dobson and Focus on the Family and the New Life Church are located there.

When George W. Bush was inaugurated in 2005, they made their intention to have a greater effect in politics well known.

Evangelical leaders promise that in coming years they'll be even more active in politics. And Colorado Springs will continue to be a base from which the evangelical movement launches initiatives that affect civic life across the nation.

John McCain, Panderer-in-Chief.

< Tuesday Night Republican Convention Thread | Palin on the Issues >
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    You can't criticize McCain (5.00 / 1) (#1)
    by elonepb on Tue Sep 02, 2008 at 08:35:31 PM EST
    He was a P.O.W.

    He couldn't pander for 5.5 years.

    How is it pandering (5.00 / 3) (#2)
    by americanincanada on Tue Sep 02, 2008 at 08:36:29 PM EST
    to play to your base and your running mate's strengths?

    Because he doesn't share their values (none / 0) (#3)
    by Jeralyn on Tue Sep 02, 2008 at 08:40:21 PM EST
    They opposed him and wouldn't support him, financially or otherwise, unless he put one of their own on the ticket. Now they are gleeful.

    They are a faction of the Republican base. He could have chosen a Moderate Republican as his running mate.


    He could have chosen a moderate, but didn't (5.00 / 3) (#6)
    by americanincanada on Tue Sep 02, 2008 at 08:45:07 PM EST
    Our nominee could have chosen differently, but he didn't. I fail to see why so much vitriol is required because a republican chose a republican to shore up a part of his base that he did not have.

    Obama chose Biden to shore up his ticket. What is the big deal?


    Listen, you just have to accept. . . (5.00 / 2) (#11)
    by LarryInNYC on Tue Sep 02, 2008 at 08:50:50 PM EST
    that there are some Clinton supporters here, myself and Jeralyn included, who actually believe in the issues Clinton ran on.

    People like us (colloquially known as Democrats or liberals) therefore do not like people like Palin whose views are diametrically opposed to those positions jointly espoused by ourselves and Hillary Clinton.

    We do not consider Sarah Palin, a whack-job conservative, to be in any way equivalent to Joe Biden, who is right (from our liberal, Democratic viewpoint) on almost all issues.  And therefore, Palin and her quest for the Presidency (because, let's face it, that's where she's planning to end up) are simply not going to get treated in the same way as Obama's or Biden's.

    Why do some people have such a hard time understanding that Clinton supports actually support Clinton policies?


    Hang on a second; I think most of us (5.00 / 1) (#23)
    by Anne on Tue Sep 02, 2008 at 09:11:28 PM EST
    are quite familar with the whole "us v. them" concept that is the Dems v. the GOP, and I don't think anyone expected McCain to choose a VP who would be acceptable to Democrats by being Biden's ideological equal.  


    We've been kind of expecting the GOP to put together a ticket that covers parts of the base that McCain doesn't - more or less the way Obama picked someone who filled in his blanks.

    I'm not altogether sure why there is so much anger that the GOP is doing what they were expected to do: be on the opposite side from where Democrats are on the issues.  Would you be less angry if it were Huckabee, or Romney or Pawlenty?

    Honestly, by the time we get to the end of the week, there will have been so many anti-Palin posts that people might be asking, "Barack Who?" and those new to the place might have to look twice to be sure the name of the blog isn't TalkPalin.

    We get it: she's evil, he's old and ready to kick the bucket, and they both pander.

    As BTD would say: they're pols, doing what pols do.

    But at some point, posting about what we are for might be a refreshing change of pace.


    I'm not angry at all. (5.00 / 1) (#25)
    by LarryInNYC on Tue Sep 02, 2008 at 09:23:43 PM EST
    I'm delighted.  I think Palin was a transparently cynical pick that perfectly exemplifies McCain's willingness to repeat Bush's hiring mistakes.  The only way he could have beaten it would have been to choose Michael Brown.

    What confuses me is why so many people seem to expect us Democrats to say "Hey, Palin, great pick -- anti-Choice, anti-Science, no experience, history of abuse of power, wow, I'll really have to reconsider McCain now!"  I mean, really.  McCain screwed up, why shouldn't Democrats take advantage of that?


    I haven't seen anyone saying that here. (5.00 / 1) (#28)
    by oculus on Tue Sep 02, 2008 at 09:29:59 PM EST
    I am (attempting to) employ hyperbole. (none / 0) (#29)
    by LarryInNYC on Tue Sep 02, 2008 at 09:33:12 PM EST
    Anne's position was that, as a partisan Democratic site, we should not be criticizing Palin.  Why not?  She's awful, and she represents much of what's awful about the loony-dominated wing of the Republican party and their ideology-over-everything approach to governance.

    There's criticism, and there's (5.00 / 2) (#32)
    by oculus on Tue Sep 02, 2008 at 09:37:33 PM EST
    obsession.  Time to move on, I think.  Also, Obama's reaching out to the religious of the US of A makes his positions on some issues rather hard to discern:  women's right to choose, same sex marriage, respect for gay and lesbians, to name a few.  I think he's trying to blur lines, which makes criticising Palin's positions on his behalf seem false to me.

    Why would any democrat say those things? (5.00 / 3) (#34)
    by SueBonnetSue on Tue Sep 02, 2008 at 09:41:20 PM EST
    I'm not understanding this argument.  Why would McCain expect democrats to be happy about his choice?  I'd have to say that if democrats liked his choice, he would be doomed.  It would mean no support from his party, no GOTV, and no money coming into the campaign.  

    Most republicans I know were indifferent to Biden and THRILLED with Palin.  Makes sense to me.  


    because thet are insisting (5.00 / 2) (#39)
    by TimNCGuy on Tue Sep 02, 2008 at 10:06:13 PM EST
    that Palin was put on the ticket to appeal to "issue-oeriented" Clinton supporters. And, she wasn't.

    I wonder at all of the vitriol (2.00 / 1) (#40)
    by hairspray on Wed Sep 03, 2008 at 12:40:08 AM EST
    and a lot of calculated misinformation on the woman. To me she poses no threat. But to many Democrats she apparently does. I think it may be fear.  Perhaps these are the younger mostly men who see a very pretty articulate woman who physically may be their equal and appears to be an outdoorsman (girl) who is rough and tumble and they are scared?

    I'm watching a panel discussion on (5.00 / 1) (#42)
    by oculus on Wed Sep 03, 2008 at 12:42:57 AM EST
    C-Span on the subject of "Women & The Republican Party."  One of the panelists sd., expectations of Palin are low.  She will only exceed those expectations.  

    that's fine (none / 0) (#18)
    by TimNCGuy on Tue Sep 02, 2008 at 09:01:39 PM EST
    then talk about her policies. But, to continue to argue that she was an invalid pick because she is a social conservative is kind of silly. It would be like Republicans arguing that Obama should have picked Zell Miller just to make them happier. McCain did NON pick Palin to try to get your vote. He did it to solidify his base. To appeal to indy voters who are social conservatives. And to appeal to the part of Clinton's base that was made up of conservative dems and the small part of her base who voted for Clinton only because she was a woman.

    I have talked to every (none / 0) (#21)
    by Jjc2008 on Tue Sep 02, 2008 at 09:07:15 PM EST
    friend, relative and colleague who supported Clinton. Overwhelmingly, all of them are angry as h*ll at two things.....
    one..the DNC, Dean and the old dems who shut out Hillary and her supporters.....and we plan to do something about that AFTER November,
    two..EVEN ANGRIER than people they think that "any woman" would do.  

    The fact that Hillary is female is/was a BONUS for those of us who believe in what Hillary believes.  For the right wing or anyone else to treat voters as if ANY woman would do is an insult.  It's as sexist as MSNBC.


    No, No, No, not any woman would do (5.00 / 1) (#33)
    by SueBonnetSue on Tue Sep 02, 2008 at 09:38:05 PM EST
    It had to be a woman like Palin who is a true conservative.  Without that, much of the republican base wouldn't have turned out to help elect McCain.  He did what he had to do politically.  Isn't that what all nominees do?  Isn't that why Obama chose Bíden?  To reassure part of his base that they know about foreign policy issues?  

    McCain chose Palin because he knew his party would love her.  He was right, $12 million in 72 hours, and thousands of volunteers have signed on.  

    McCain wasn't out to please us, he was out to please his republican supporters.  It's hard to argue that he didn't do that.


    are you unwilling (none / 0) (#24)
    by TimNCGuy on Tue Sep 02, 2008 at 09:16:19 PM EST
    to admit that some of Clintons 18 mil voters from places like WV, KY, OH, PA are conservative on social issues and might find Palin appealing? And, there are some former Clinton supporters who are hoping that the DNC etc get a lesson taught to them on Nov 4th. Trying to accomplish anything after November, if they are rewarded for their behavior on election day, seems like wishful thinking.

    No, I am not unwilling to admit (5.00 / 1) (#26)
    by Jjc2008 on Tue Sep 02, 2008 at 09:26:10 PM EST

    Actually I went to Denver last Tuesday.  Rode up there with a somewhat a-political Hillary supporter; a conservative republican Hillary supporter who will vote McCain; and I met some real live Pumas who won't vote dem because of the primary.

    But from my observations in Denver where the overwhelming majority of the 18 million voices who marched were going to do as Hillary asked, (while the PUMA group I met was small)....because like her they believe in what she believes.
    And I already pointed out the people in my life....also passionate Hillary supporters...who felt McCain made it easier to vote OBAMA because they saw the Palin pick as either insulting, or scary or both.

    All I can do is extrapolate from what I know. I understand in some parts of the country there will be conservatives who only supported Hillary.....and are not dems. I also know that some women will not vote the top of the ticket.
    I am simply relating my experience and contacts.


    yeah, I'm not understanding t his either (none / 0) (#12)
    by TimNCGuy on Tue Sep 02, 2008 at 08:51:15 PM EST
    did some dems expect McCain to pick a liberal? And really, spending the last 4 days trying to convince voters that the dem Pres candidate is more qualified than the repug VP candidate doesn't seem like a real good use of campaign time to me. Wake up. If McCain dies in office, Palin gets to have a VP to shore up her credentials just like Obama has Biden. Big deal.

    Apparently... (none / 0) (#43)
    by Ardeth on Wed Sep 03, 2008 at 02:55:26 AM EST
    ....it's pandering when they do it, but not when we do it.

    Didn't Obama put Biden (5.00 / 2) (#7)
    by TimNCGuy on Tue Sep 02, 2008 at 08:47:22 PM EST
    on the ticket to "pander" to the portion of the dem base that wasn't supporting him? Joe Biden, nice "older", "Catholic", from blue collar working class bitter small town Scranton, Pa?

    No, if Obama wanted to pander. . . (5.00 / 1) (#15)
    by LarryInNYC on Tue Sep 02, 2008 at 08:53:44 PM EST
    he would obviously have selected Clinton.

    Biden is a good addition to the ticket for a variety of reasons, but he commanded very little support in the primaries and he doesn't represent any particular wing of the party.  It's pretty clear Obama chose him because he likes him and thinks he'll be a valuable Vice President.

    On the issue of VP selection, Obama wins.


    when Biden was picked (none / 0) (#20)
    by TimNCGuy on Tue Sep 02, 2008 at 09:06:07 PM EST
    every pundit out there continually pointed out that he was Catholic and from a working class blue collar small town Pa background who was older and had foreign policy experience and that this package would appeal to Clinton's base. She won Catholics, working class and small town voters by wide margins.

    Pundits are bloviators. (none / 0) (#22)
    by LarryInNYC on Tue Sep 02, 2008 at 09:11:09 PM EST
    While much of what they said is true, it's also true that Biden is heavily associated with the credit card industry and it's anti-worker, anti-poor agenda.

    Pundits are paid to spout post facto explanations (generally explaining why their pre facto predictions were wrong)every time there is a political event.  I wouldn't pay them a lot of mind.

    Biden brings some nice balance to the ticket, but he doesn't _represent something in the same way Palin does.


    It was a smart choice but (none / 0) (#41)
    by hairspray on Wed Sep 03, 2008 at 12:42:49 AM EST
    whether it was the wisest we will know soon.

    Pretty sure it was a foreign relations pander (none / 0) (#10)
    by elonepb on Tue Sep 02, 2008 at 08:50:23 PM EST
    Although I'm not sure what constituency is a "foreign relations" value-voter.

    i tnink he was picked (none / 0) (#13)
    by TimNCGuy on Tue Sep 02, 2008 at 08:52:04 PM EST
    because he was suppsoed to be able to pander to both of those

    i mean how many more times (none / 0) (#14)
    by TimNCGuy on Tue Sep 02, 2008 at 08:53:03 PM EST
    could they mention that he is originally from Scranton, Pa?

    Appalachia, I heard a least 100 times that Biden (5.00 / 1) (#35)
    by SueBonnetSue on Tue Sep 02, 2008 at 09:44:03 PM EST
    Is a lunch-box democrat from Appalachia.  But no pandering there.  

    I think Scranton is too far east (none / 0) (#37)
    by TimNCGuy on Tue Sep 02, 2008 at 10:04:04 PM EST
    to be considered in Appalachia too.

    I live in Colorado Springs (5.00 / 1) (#17)
    by Jjc2008 on Tue Sep 02, 2008 at 08:59:16 PM EST
    It will be interesting.
    I worked for someone who ran for Congress on the democratic ticket in 2006.  We did not win but raised more money than any democratic candidate for Congress ever.  In the 30 years since they drew the lines here, this district (CD-5) has only had republicans.  The republican that beat my candidate was one of the worst of the worst.  We had one dem....so uncontested primary.  But there were five republicans running.  So before the primary we would have these "forums" for ALL the candidates so I got to hear them all alot.  One of the forums was at Focus on the Family headquarters.  It was like being on the other side of the looking glass.  
    Every time one of the "evangelical" favorites answered a question, the audience would say "Amen"  and hallelujah.  
    Some of the mainstream republicans here were so disgusted we managed to form a "republicans for...
    the dem candidate."  They even did a fund raiser for us.

    We did not win and while we had hoped to we always knew it was an uphill battle.  We scared them enough that they sent Dick Cheyney here the day before the election.

    What surprised me is that the one that one was the absolute worst debater I have ever seen (an 8th grader could beat him); the most extreme on the issues; the most BUSH rubber staff.  BUT he had the full support of the Christain Coalition, Focus on the Family and the Club for Growth. I believe he takes orders directly from Dobson on how to vote on everything.

    People here were literally afraid to put signs on their lawns for a democratic candidate.  BUT Obama did have a good team on the ground her for the dem primary. I will be curious to see if they can impact this district.  I suspect McCain is here to do some kissing up to the man behind the curtain at Focus.

    Jeralyn (5.00 / 1) (#31)
    by Ga6thDem on Tue Sep 02, 2008 at 09:35:16 PM EST
    have you thought about doing a post on how this affects things in CO regarding the Presidential race? I would enjoy hearing what you think on the subject.

    Jeralyn, I'm thinking it might be (none / 0) (#19)
    by oculus on Tue Sep 02, 2008 at 09:02:43 PM EST
    cathartic for you to attend the Colorado Springs campaign event on Saturday.  Maybe that's because, after watching Biden and Palin at their announcement event in Dayton (via TV), I'm having a really hard time getting worked up about McCain's choice of Palin.  I do not support their ticket, but I do think McCain's choice got the public's attention and will bring in votes.  Obama has reached way, way out for the votes of those who are practicing Christians.  McCain is doing the same, although the practicing Christians he is trolling for are much, much more conservative in their Christian beliefs.  

    If that $10M (5.00 / 2) (#38)
    by JavaCityPal on Tue Sep 02, 2008 at 10:04:30 PM EST
    I do not support their ticket, but I do think McCain's choice got the public's attention and will bring in votes.

    Figure in contributions she he announced her as his running mate is accurate, I'd say she certainly will bring him votes. Don't know from what demographic, but she seems to have struck a chord with some.


    Why would you want to subject her (none / 0) (#27)
    by Redshoes on Tue Sep 02, 2008 at 09:28:11 PM EST
    to that.  Where's the 8th amendment when you need it?

    I'm just tired of reading Palin stuff (5.00 / 1) (#30)
    by oculus on Tue Sep 02, 2008 at 09:33:23 PM EST
    fulltime here.  (Of course, I could back away from the computer!)

    Yeah, it seems weird to me (5.00 / 1) (#36)
    by SueBonnetSue on Tue Sep 02, 2008 at 09:48:47 PM EST
    That the democrat blogs continue to talk constantly about McCain and Palin.  I'm sure that republicans are loving this, but why are we supporting it?  

    What happened to the MSM's love of Obama?  I have seen anything about him in days.  We know where McCain and Palin are, every second of the day and night.  Where are Obama and Biden?  Has the MSM stopped covering them?  
    Sheese, this is getting old, all McCain/Palin coverage 24/7.  They sucked the air right out of our coverage.


    That's (none / 0) (#44)
    by TomStewart on Wed Sep 03, 2008 at 03:56:16 AM EST
    Democratic blogs.

    Personally, I think the coverage is because it's fresh (the convention is going on now, after all) and Palin is the gift that just keeps on giving. Really, we've chewed over Obama and his experience, jumped up and down about Hilliary, and pointed out the nonsense that been coming out both campaigns for the past several months. Even dems are looking for something new.

    We could, of course, go back to the false media narratives of the split party and how half or us are just sitting around and waiting for McCain to call and ask us to the dance, or we could talk about the latest developments, whatever they may be.

    Even with the media obsessing over Palin/McCain, Obama is moving up in the polls. McCain may have sucked up the coverage, but he did it over Labor Day weekend when a lot of people aren't paying that much attention. We'll see how his numbers spike when he comes out of his convention...and after the media is finished with it's investigation of Palin.


    I'm talking to a media publication (none / 0) (#46)
    by Jeralyn on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 12:45:45 AM EST
    about covering it for them, but there are details to work out. I'll let you all know.

    I believe Mccains numbers will spike because (none / 0) (#45)
    by Indy2008 on Thu Sep 04, 2008 at 12:23:52 AM EST
    I think most of us Indies are so tired of the over populated left media digging crap that doesn't matter in politics. Trying to find anything to smear whether truthful or  B.S. blogs that make it to New York Times and some people believe anything the media tells them. That tells me you've got nothin left! My own belief might be the media really wants Obama so later they have bad news because bad news to them always makes more money!! I'm independant and my wife registered to vote this year and has no interest in politics, but she now has some interest because obama has opened her eye's about who she does NOT want for this country! Guess what Obomicans I think your in for a Disappointment come November!! Good luck and Prosper..