Friday Line on the Veepstakes

Chris Cillizza at the WaPo's The Fix puts out his (and I stress the word "his") Friday afternoon line on whom Obama will pick for Veep.

He has Joe Biden in top place and Kathleen Sebelius in bottom place at #5. In between: Jack Reed, Tim Kaine and Evan Bayh. (Big Tent Democrat thinks Obama's smartest move would be to pick Biden. Biden is a dealbreaker for me.)

Gen. Wesley Clark, my favorite, doesn't even make Chris' list.

Who do you think he will pick? Any dealbreakers out there for those of you who are planning on voting for Obama? Anyone who would make you stay home?

I think he will pick Virginia Gov. Tim Kaine. Am I happy about it? No, but I can live with it. Same for Evan Bayh. Sebelius would be better than than either, but he's obviously not going to pick a woman other than Hillary.

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    I have been (5.00 / 1) (#3)
    by americanincanada on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 04:45:20 PM EST
    torn between staying home and voting for Obama ever since Hillary stepped out. I was hoping Obama could convince me that he has what it takes and could be trusted to fight for the things I believe in but he has not been able to do that.

    Either Biden or Kaine would be a deal breaker for me and I'm afraid it's going to be Kaine.

    Kaine (5.00 / 4) (#6)
    by cawaltz on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 04:47:03 PM EST
    might even tick me off enough to make me work against the ticket. I'm done with settling. Either Democrats do more than mouth lipservice at those of us concerned about the erosion of rights regarding women's issues that we've seen occur or they give us at least one person on the ticket with credentials and a history of fighting for women on these issues or I'm for dismantling and starting from scratch. I've spent my share of time under the bus.

    I want Hillary Clinton on the ticket. I'd probably have a better shot at winning the lottery. I keep hoping though.

    Ummm (5.00 / 1) (#7)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 04:47:04 PM EST
    I do not care for Biden at all.

    I wrote that Biden is a much better political play for Obama than Kaine.

    I think Biden is a dope.

    I do not want Biden.

    My poltiical judgment that Biden is superior to Kaine for POLITICAL PURPOSES does not mean I like Biden for VP.

    Heck, I think Hillary  should be Obama's choice.

    Dope (5.00 / 1) (#25)
    by bocajeff on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 05:19:50 PM EST
    Of course he's a dope. He's not wrong on issues, he's not wrong on his world view. He's simply a "dope".

    ok, I'll change it (none / 0) (#10)
    by Jeralyn on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 04:52:36 PM EST
    to make that clear.

    It is going to be someone completely (5.00 / 1) (#8)
    by PssttCmere08 on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 04:47:40 PM EST
    out of left field.  

    I like that idea (5.00 / 2) (#9)
    by cawaltz on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 04:49:23 PM EST
    better than the names I see floating around with very few exceptions.

    True (5.00 / 2) (#23)
    by nemo52 on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 05:18:12 PM EST
    I don't like ANYONE on this short list!

    To us, at least (5.00 / 0) (#14)
    by JavaCityPal on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 05:00:41 PM EST
    It'll be a logical choice for the Obama campaign, though. Obama pays his debts. Kerry, perhaps.

    Hillary is (5.00 / 1) (#15)
    by chel2551 on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 05:01:01 PM EST
    supposedly off the list.

    Left field?  Obama is center field. Where's the pitcher?


    probably center-right field (5.00 / 1) (#44)
    by clbrune on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 05:54:40 PM EST
    not left ;-))

    Barry Bonds? (none / 0) (#16)
    by tree on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 05:02:31 PM EST
    Hey... (5.00 / 1) (#12)
    by Addison on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 04:58:27 PM EST
    ...Jack Reed! Alright!

    Get it in writing... (5.00 / 1) (#17)
    by Addison on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 05:02:55 PM EST
    Jack Reed, The Governor of Rhode Island, and a GOP Defection.

    Disclaimer: this doesn't even rise to the level of speculation, really. It just points some things out and talks about the resume of Senator Reed.


    Jack who? (5.00 / 1) (#19)
    by chel2551 on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 05:06:04 PM EST
    How many electoral votes does RI have?

    Jack Reed is teh swell (none / 0) (#86)
    by zyx on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 07:42:43 PM EST
    and the only one on the list that I like. And I like him a LOT.

    No Deal Breakers (5.00 / 2) (#28)
    by CoralGables on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 05:22:09 PM EST
    There are no deal breakers for me. (Richardson might make me flinch). As is my standard, I will vote for the Democratic nominee. Not voting for the nominee helps the GOP keep the presidency. That's a helping hand I'll never give, and another four to eight years I can't fathom.

    Yeah, (5.00 / 0) (#42)
    by rjarnold on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 05:51:01 PM EST
    no matter how mediocre the VP will probably be, they'll still be better than McCain.

    And my problem with Richardson isn't really that he endorsed Obama, but I think he is just plain dumb.


    No dealer breakers for me, either. (none / 0) (#34)
    by Shainzona on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 05:34:13 PM EST
    I'm already not voting - for the first time in my (long) life.



    Out of curiosity . . . (none / 0) (#103)
    by MojaveWolf on Sat Aug 16, 2008 at 06:44:07 PM EST
    I completely understand not being able to pull the lever for either of the two major party candidates this cycle, but wouldn't a protest vote for McKinney (if you want to show the Dems they need to quit nominating the most conservative candidate possible)   be a better way to let the dems know you're unhappy with them?  (or even Barr if the media focus is on his anti-surveillance society stance and not on his not-at-all-libertarian social policy positions)

    He should have (5.00 / 2) (#32)
    by Bluesage on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 05:32:21 PM EST
    Picked Clinton within days of her leaving the race and we would have gotten behind that ticket even if we thought it was upside down.  The VP guessing game while he goes on vacation and drops in the polls is becoming tiresome and shows me that he really does not have what it takes to lead this country.  He is really looking like an empty suit with a nice smile and the first real discussion he will have with anyone in a while will be with Rick Warren at the Faith Forum on CNN.  I can't even think of anyone for VP that would get me behind him now, certainly no one who has been mentioned so far.  Biden is ok but never knows when to shut-up and is pretty much owned by the credit card industry.  Delaware? Really!

    Does it bother anyone else.... (5.00 / 2) (#59)
    by Shainzona on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 06:18:35 PM EST
    that POTUS candidates are appearing on something called a "faith forum"?  I mean we do not have a religious test of public office and this just smacks of one - I felt that same way when both BO and HRC appeared on the show.

    CNN is simply wrong to do this....IMHO.


    cnn? any group that thinks continuous (5.00 / 1) (#82)
    by hellothere on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 07:34:14 PM EST
    wolf blizter is a selling point needs to disband and start over brand new.

    Yes. (none / 0) (#104)
    by MojaveWolf on Sat Aug 16, 2008 at 06:45:07 PM EST
    This bothered me during the primaries, as well.

    OMG - a diary at another (pro-Obama)... (5.00 / 1) (#60)
    by Shainzona on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 06:21:40 PM EST
    site (that contains repetitive DDs) is lauding Obama's religious claims - associated with Matthew 25 - that fundy group BO and Friends has set up - they are going to run commercials with "pastors" in them.

    I'm sorry - but this is unbelievable.


    This is very (none / 0) (#76)
    by Ga6thDem on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 06:58:45 PM EST
    tiresome. The Dems don't have a clue. One of the main reasons that Bush's ratings are in the toilet is because of the evangelical pandering.

    I DON'T WANT A MINISTER IN THE OVAL OFFICE! Is it too much to ask that we get a President who can run the government efficiently? Apparently.


    the fundies aren't going to obama. (none / 0) (#83)
    by hellothere on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 07:35:03 PM EST
    they can pander all they like, but it won't change what is going to happen.

    Hmmm (5.00 / 3) (#37)
    by TN Dem on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 05:39:38 PM EST
    I can't really answer the question of who is a deal-breaker since I never could bring myself to accept Obama's deal.

    I guess I have to consider who would be a deal-maker for me.

    I like Wes Clark, and of course Hillary, but honestly, I can't think of anyone else that brings me to the point of being truly excited about our candidate. The ones on the short lists most consider do not motivate me in the least.

    Not giving up hope for actual change (5.00 / 1) (#39)
    by shmerritt on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 05:43:39 PM EST
    If Obama truly wants to win the presidency for the Democrats, he should pick Hillary Clinton for his vice presidential running mate.  Stop standing on ceremony and just do it.

    I mostly agree (none / 0) (#48)
    by clbrune on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 05:59:49 PM EST
    Paint Clinton with an "establishment" brush, if you want (not "you" you, but "them" you), but she was for health care when no one else was, and if her name were not "Clinton" I bet she would have taken even more liberal/progressive stands than she has.

    Nothing is a deal breaker for me (although Obama surely doesn't inspire me).

    If he were to pick Clinton, he'd earn considerable respect from me.


    "establishment brush" (none / 0) (#89)
    by christinep on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 09:31:33 PM EST
    Well...maybe lots of us have all seen that all those who talked anti-establishment, etc. were not necessarily so.  (Hillary really became the new way in many respects.) Ah, the irony of politics.

    What I wonder is what is the fricken (5.00 / 2) (#40)
    by masslib on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 05:50:02 PM EST
    hold up?  Just announce already.  i know it's a super-duper surprise, but unless he's running with Elvis, people are going to be let down with all the suspense.

    Maybe waiting for after Olympics (none / 0) (#54)
    by BarnBabe on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 06:07:47 PM EST
    It is reported that people are really watching this year over previous years. Maybe because they are good or maybe because there is nothing on anymore. Either way, people are watching and would not stop to suddenly watch Obama and his new running mate. In fact, many I talk with are burned out on this election already. It has been going on soooo long.

    That's a snark...right? (none / 0) (#66)
    by Shainzona on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 06:28:02 PM EST
    Who really prefers McCain + Unknown VP over (5.00 / 0) (#46)
    by robrecht on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 05:57:08 PM EST
    Obama + Biden???  Seriously???

    I don't. (none / 0) (#50)
    by hitchhiker on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 06:01:10 PM EST
    But that doesn't mean I think Biden would be a good choice.  

    Obama's good fortune is this political environment--and it's infuriating to think that when we could have had a stellar team, we're going to have to settle.


    Nobody likes to settle ... (5.00 / 0) (#55)
    by robrecht on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 06:11:42 PM EST
    ... but it's common in politics.  My question is directed toward anyone who seriously considers Biden a deal breaker as VP.  Would you really prefer President McCain?

    VP (5.00 / 0) (#64)
    by bob5540 on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 06:25:30 PM EST
    There is NO circumstance in which I would stay home or not vote for Obama. The nation (and planet) cannot survive another four years.

    That said, Wes Clark is my choice. Even if I wasn't already in his camp, he would have won me over when he stated the obvious truth: Having been a POW doesn't make a good president.

    Evan Bayh is bottom of the barrel, and Joe Biden ain't much better. I would be terribly disappointed.

    Bob- a little overboard perhaps? (none / 0) (#91)
    by kenosharick on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 10:04:22 PM EST
    the world will not survive 4 years of mccain? On the car radio today I heard hannity (or was it o'relly?-same dif) claim the world couldnot survive 4 years of Obama. I think the world will survive either way. BTW- I still think he picks Bayh, though Clark would also be my favorite.

    The nation (none / 0) (#93)
    by Nadai on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 10:22:08 PM EST
    survived the Civil War.  We could survive another 4 years of George Bush if we had to, though thank the gods we won't.  I don't like McCain, but we aren't all going to die if he's elected.

    This isn't the End Times.  Really.


    Good question... (5.00 / 1) (#79)
    by HonoraryClinton on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 07:17:02 PM EST
    I'd love to know the answer too. Admittedly Jeralyn's argument against Biden is rather compelling, yet knowing that the only other legit option is McCain...well I can't understand how that is preferable to any VP selection.

    The VP isn't the president and doesn't set the agenda so I am not sure why any pick would be a "deal breaker" and this concerns me. Does anyone here honestly believe that McCain is better suited to run the country and pick judges and justices than Obama and Biden (yes I know about Thomas but he didn't select him).

    Would McCain really represent our beliefs and objectives better than Obama/Biden? Can you really risk another 4 to 8 years just because the VP isn't as progressive as we'd like? What becomes of TalkLeft if Biden is the selection? Would TalkLeft really become part of the vast right wing conspiracy?

    I hate how fractured our party has become. I'm not placing blame, I just wish we could find something, anything to bring about unity, even if that means comprising. Even if the candidates won't or can't, there has to be something we can do. All I can say is that some is better than none.

    The dealbreaker for me (5.00 / 2) (#87)
    by indy in sc on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 07:52:08 PM EST
    is McCain.

    Each day that passes without the (5.00 / 0) (#98)
    by JavaCityPal on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 11:22:15 PM EST
    announcement makes my smile grow at those who trusted him enough to hand over their cell phone numbers.

    I believe political campaigns are exempt from the Do Not Call laws, too :)

    The constant stream of emails that go to my junk folder from the Obama campaign is bad enough.

    Enough of the games (4.00 / 1) (#35)
    by mmc9431 on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 05:36:05 PM EST
    The only one I would want other than Hilary would be Clark. Why pick a Kaine or Bayh in the hopes they can maybe deliver when you have two that you know can do it for the ticket?

    Also unless he's embarassed by his choice, Obama should announce it now. Enough of the coy games of pitting everyone against one another. We need a ticket now, so that we can try to put humpty back together again.

    Biden & dealbreakers (2.00 / 0) (#13)
    by MKS on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 05:00:39 PM EST
    Biden's comments about a draft and his crime bill (which apparently went nowhere) seem more like grandstanding stunts than real attempts to change policy.....The draft issue certainly was a stunt....

    Biden is full of blarney--and I take his showboating for what it is.....and with a large grain of salt.

    The VP pick does seem to be Kaine, although Biden has been very quiet lately.

    Biden has also been very good on judges....He chaired the judiciary committee when Suiter was up, conducted a good hearing, and made the right call on that Republican nominee.  I believe he voted against Thomas, Scalia, Roberts, Alito.

    Biden introduces those crime bills (5.00 / 1) (#18)
    by Jeralyn on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 05:04:29 PM EST
    every year and some got passed. Follow my link -- he's dangerous, not just full of blarney. And he keeps pushing federal crime legislation that belongs in state court.

    Then he'll be fairly (5.00 / 0) (#33)
    by TeresaInSnow2 on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 05:32:31 PM EST
    well kept from doing that if he's VP.

    Hey Jeralyn, this afternoon, (none / 0) (#73)
    by tlkextra on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 06:51:36 PM EST
    I found it curious, that when driving by the Colorado Democratic Party building, I noticed they had a "Joe Biden '08" placard in the window, next to the Obama and among the local candidates. So I thought maybe I had missed an announcement. I also questioned whether it was only up there because it had been autographed (which I still didn't think took away from it being inappropriate - unless they know something we don't). Frankly, I think it would be a mistake for Obama to pick any former 2008 Presidential Candidate. I believe, at some time or another, they all probably expressed their opinion of him as lacking experience, which will make great TV when played over and over. IMHO, I also feel that is precisely the hurdle that many voters can't easily jump in order to "get on board".

    He voted for Scalia, but pretty much everyone (5.00 / 0) (#20)
    by tigercourse on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 05:06:44 PM EST
    else did as well.  He could have done more to keep Thomas off the court.

    He gave us Thomas. (5.00 / 1) (#47)
    by hitchhiker on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 05:57:15 PM EST
    Biden chaired those hearings.  He put a strict time limit on them, which is what sealed the deal.  It was within his authority to get to the bottom of what Anita Hill was talking about, and he just flat failed to do it.

    Strange Justice lays it out, if anyone still cares.  As one reader put it:

    Opinion on the Judiciary committee appeared to follow political lines, with Chairman Biden shuttling between the two sides like an amiable ping-pong ball, ever conscious of the risks implicit in taking a stand.

    It's hard to forget the frustration of watching the amiable ping pong ball sweating his way through that long weekend.  This is our vice-president?  Gag me.


    Biden? Might as well be Giuliani. (none / 0) (#45)
    by 1980Ford on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 05:56:42 PM EST
    No kidding.

    Biden aided and abetted (none / 0) (#78)
    by caseyOR on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 07:15:15 PM EST
    the burning at the stake of Anita Hill. His role in the confirmation of Thomas was despicable.

    biden with all his faults has a brain and (none / 0) (#84)
    by hellothere on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 07:37:07 PM EST
    so far although i know physically kane has a brain in there, i just fail to see much evidence that it is in working order. he panders in ways that make me want to barf. if i feel that way, i sorta think others do also.

    Clark (1.00 / 1) (#30)
    by bocajeff on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 05:29:19 PM EST
    Is, in my opinion as well as Amnesty Intl's, a war criminal for some of the stuff he dd in the Balkans. While not nearly as bad as others, a war criminal is still a war criminal.

    Plenty of info (none / 0) (#43)
    by jen on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 05:53:03 PM EST
    to prove you are incorrect in calling General Clark a war criminal. But as always, you are free to believe whatever you like.

    Serbian authorities were informed about RTS bombing beforehand

    Belgrade, 16:11

    Recently deceased Serbian and Yugoslav President Slobodan Milosevic had deliberately sacrificed 16 journalists killed in the building of the National Broadcaster RTS during NATO bombing campaign against Yugoslavia. This is stated in the book "Aberdar's Silence" authored by Zoran Janic and issued by Belgrade-based publishing house "Dan Grafa". The book contains evidence accounts on the involvement of the, then, top Serbian officials, SCG Army and RTS executives in the bombing of the building, aimed at winning the propaganda war against the International Community. The book cites official records dating a few days prior to the attack, such is "the death toll would be acceptable with respect to the achieved propaganda effect." "The documents and confirmed witnesses' testimonies leave no doubt that the Commander of Allied Forces for Europe, General Wesley Clark had notified Milosevic in due time on NATO's intention tobomb the building of RTS", reads Janic's book. ...

    Hillary is the only choice but, (1.00 / 1) (#94)
    by chopper on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 10:25:36 PM EST
    His baby's mama told him don't you dare.

    Um (5.00 / 0) (#97)
    by lilburro on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 10:55:54 PM EST
    did we not go over how that term is disrespectful, coarse, and racist?

    Don't use it.


    I think it will be Kaine (none / 0) (#1)
    by txpolitico67 on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 04:40:57 PM EST
    Obama really wants Virginia and sees Kaine as a path to victory there.

    i've thought it would be kaine (none / 0) (#11)
    by sancho on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 04:56:41 PM EST
    all along, which is also why, given my ability to predict things, i cant believe it will actually be kaine. jeralyn has convinced me it is clark based on the night's announced theme. but i dont know why many others aren't repeating that logic (including, now, jeralyn!) i still have hillary as a dark horse, despite all the negative stories.

    I think it will be Kaine too (none / 0) (#2)
    by Jeralyn on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 04:42:41 PM EST
    I just decided. I'll put that in my post.

    Can anyone explain why Kaine will.... (5.00 / 1) (#69)
    by Shainzona on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 06:30:40 PM EST
    help BO in any way (except the oft repeated, he's from Virginia)?

    Are voters so simple-minded as to say "Wow, he's from my state, now I will vote for X candidate?"

    Otherwise Kaine hurts, not helps.


    Kaine (none / 0) (#90)
    by christinep on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 09:37:20 PM EST
    What is Kaine's position on stem cell research?

    He opposes (none / 0) (#95)
    by Nadai on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 10:31:54 PM EST
    public funding of embryonic stem cell research, claiming that adult stem cell research is all that's necessary.  Beyond that I don't know.

    Did you get my email (none / 0) (#4)
    by txpolitico67 on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 04:45:48 PM EST
    I just sent you about that school district here that is allowing teachers to have guns in the classroom?

    yes, but I have to get back to work now and won't (none / 0) (#5)
    by Jeralyn on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 04:46:28 PM EST
    be able to check it until tonight. Thanks.

    I agree with cawaltz (none / 0) (#21)
    by txpolitico67 on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 05:12:54 PM EST
    the Democrats are so busy moving right that they are losing sight of core Dem values.  Wesley Clark is a Dem-come-lately but with good credentials.  He also gives balance with military and some leadership experience.  I'm not sure where he stands on women's rights/guns/capital punishment/economics.

    Russ Feingold would actually make me consider the Obama ticket.  HE's the ONLY one though, considering his views on the Patriot Act.

    finegold is a good man. i am sorry he (none / 0) (#85)
    by hellothere on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 07:38:15 PM EST
    isn't the candidate.

    I'd seriously consider giving up chocolate (none / 0) (#22)
    by HonoraryClinton on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 05:16:45 PM EST
    if it would increase Brian Schweitzer's chances. I can't remember the last time I heard an elected official discuss solutions in such clear and concise terms. Honestly, I am not even sure we deserve someone this good. I would hate to see him get ripped up in a national Karl Rove-ing. He deserves better.

    If you aren't familiar with Montana's Governor check out his interview with Charlie Rose on YouTube.

    According to Obama, it has to be someone (none / 0) (#24)
    by JavaCityPal on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 05:19:26 PM EST
    who he respects enough to take direction from. This person has to be able to tell Obama when he is wrong, getting too full of himself, or needs to consider more elements before making statements and decisions. Can he figure out who that person is if he has never spent any time with them?

    Since Caroline is the head of the vetting committee, who would Ted Kennedy choose?

    There is only one person (5.00 / 3) (#38)
    by Bluesage on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 05:41:16 PM EST
    Who fits that criteria.  So I guess that's it - Michelle Obama will be both VP and First Lady.



    Heh, wouldn't be enough of a surprise (none / 0) (#51)
    by JavaCityPal on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 06:01:26 PM EST
    Sam Nunn?? (none / 0) (#29)
    by Andy08 on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 05:23:38 PM EST
    But it's not on this list it seems....

    Who's Jack Reed? (none / 0) (#27)
    by Andy08 on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 05:21:36 PM EST

    Wasn't he (5.00 / 1) (#49)
    by JavaCityPal on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 06:00:25 PM EST
    Sgt Joe Friday on Dragnet?

    Thats Jack Webb, (none / 0) (#57)
    by tree on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 06:16:48 PM EST
    not to be confused with Jim Webb. Jack Reed is the character Warren Beatty played in Reds. ;-)

    Bayh (none / 0) (#31)
    by cmugirl on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 05:30:20 PM EST

    Not on The Fix list (none / 0) (#36)
    by jen on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 05:37:39 PM EST
    but I'm going with Dodd. Course there is the recent problem with the "special" mortgage, but Corpress let Obama slide on his shady home purchase dealings, so maybe it's no big deal. Part of the perks of being a "public servant" perhaps? Ha.

    What about for Mccain (none / 0) (#41)
    by coigue on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 05:50:40 PM EST
    Do we think this Georgia sitch could be a setup for Ju=ohnny to choose Rice?

    Kaine--Obama's trying hard to win VA (none / 0) (#52)
    by kempis on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 06:04:58 PM EST
    I don't know that Kaine will do it, but I think he'll choose a white male and centrist governor of a Southern state.

    I look for McCain to pick Ridge and make a serious play for PA and Independents. The rightwingers will be out in force anyway because they're afraid of Obama--just like the left is going to support Obama no matter what because they fear McCain.

    The battle is for the center.


    Considering nowadays (none / 0) (#61)
    by cawaltz on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 06:22:19 PM EST
    there a whole lot more indys and alot of them are more to the left than the supposed Democratic base that is in the bag for Obama this should be interesting.

    I wish Donna's "new coalition" lotsa luck.


    the funny thing is (5.00 / 1) (#77)
    by ohmercy on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 07:11:44 PM EST
    that Hillary Clinton is more liberal than Obama. All the far left were so nasty, rotten and hateful and obviously did no research, just repeated neocon memes etc. I even saw people talking about Vionce Foster as an example that Hillary was evil etc.

    There are a lot of sites that are non partisan and that do analysis of the political leaders by votes, bill sponsorship etc.
    www.govtrack.us rates Hillary as far left and O as "rank and File"
    Dodd is also considered far left.
    Must be why I like them so much.

    Bayh is more moderate, moving toward center.
    Really don't like him at all.

    O's narrative gives him the appearance of being far left but he really isn't.

    I want O to pick someone more liberal than he is to keep him from drifting too far right.
    onthe issues.com is also a good site to see what they are all up too.


    Reed would fit the military theme (none / 0) (#53)
    by byteb on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 06:07:05 PM EST
    of the night. He's a West Point grad and was an Army  Ranger and paratrooper...and since he has little (if any) name recognition, he'd fit the fresh face criteria but I don't see how he'd benefit Obama at all.

    I still want Clark.

    I would never say (none / 0) (#56)
    by Bluesage on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 06:11:57 PM EST
    That I prefer McCain but considering what has happened to the Democratic Party of late it may just be four years of McCain that would give this party enough of a kick in the butt to rid ourselves of the Dean, Pelosi, Brazille wing and get back to our core values.  I've been a very loyal, very active Democrat for 40 years and I've been disgusted watching this disasterous and disgraceful campaign and still can't figure out who all these "new" Democrats are.  We need to work our tails off for huge gains in the Congress and let the chips fall where they do.  

    If Obama is too stupid or too arrogant because of his own ego or short comings to see that Hillary is a winner for him and the country then I cannot and will not vote for him.  I might reconsider that if he was smart enough to pick someone like Chris Dodd who has the gravitas, intelligence and experience but I highly doubt that is the case.

    Gov. Howard B. Dean III, M.D. (none / 0) (#58)
    by wurman on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 06:18:07 PM EST

    Old guys (none / 0) (#62)
    by chopper on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 06:23:49 PM EST
    Those are all old guys. Biden has hair plugs!

    That goes against his change theme.  Isn't that why he said he didn't want Hillary.

    If he's going with the establishment, he may as well go with the one with the experience, knowledge, record of accomplishments, and the winner of the People's Vote.

    Taking a chance on anyone else is stupid.

    More bad judgement on Obama's part.

    I still prefer Wes Clark (none / 0) (#65)
    by robrecht on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 06:27:02 PM EST
    I didn't know he know he was a war criminal.  Although the Obama camp distanced himself from Clark with his criticism of McCain that's exactly the kind of direct speech I appreciate from a smart guy like Clark.  

    The real problem is that Clark has been as honest about Obama:

    Former NATO commander Wesley Clark, a Clinton supporter, called the comments "disturbing," and he accused Obama of not being prepared enough to be commander in chief and properly oversee an end to the Iraq war.

    "That means knowing where you're headed before you start down the path," Clark said.

    Ooops (none / 0) (#68)
    by robrecht on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 06:28:36 PM EST
    Here's the link.

    Clark is no war criminal (none / 0) (#102)
    by hf Jai on Sat Aug 16, 2008 at 10:43:12 AM EST
    Amnesty International originally charged that the bombing of the RCC tower was a war crime, but the Hague specifically found that it was a legitimate target according to the law of land warfare.

    Some people are just ignorant of history and the law, and would prefer to assume that every military person is some sort of criminal.


    Biden? (none / 0) (#67)
    by Moishele on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 06:28:12 PM EST
    A few years ago I saw Biden on some talk show yammering about how Democrats "looked down on" and "were hostile to" people of faith, and how we could never win a national election until that changed. Biden, of course, saw himself as a person of faith, but he was the exception.

    I've watched Biden be on almost every side of every equation. When Bush was riding high Biden was almost a cheerleader. When Bush was low suddenly Joe was glad to be a Democrat, again.

    I wouldn't trust the man as far I could throw him. If Biden is the VP pick that would make two on the ticket for whom I had that sentiment.

    I would love to see Wes Clark get the VP spot, but I think he's to tied to Hillary for the Chicago crowd.

    I just don't get it. If Obama's biggest weakness (none / 0) (#71)
    by Teresa on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 06:46:19 PM EST
    for voters is inexperience, why would he chose Kaine, a two-year Governor? I know he was a Lt. Gov., etc. but who outside Virginia cares? He could lose the election if he picks someone with even less national experience than he has.

    I keep thinking (none / 0) (#72)
    by Lil on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 06:47:52 PM EST
    we are missing someone. With names we slapped around this week, I just can't believe this is what's left (except for Clinton/Clark.

    Well, as far fetched as it may seem, (none / 0) (#74)
    by zfran on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 06:55:36 PM EST
    I still linger with the name of Colin Powell. This would be one way for Powell to redeem himself from what happened with Iraq. One of the problems I see is that if Obama truly wants repub. votes, they may see this as a "turncoat" action against Powell. Someone suggested Gore, but why would he want to put himself into that fray again!

    Dealbreaker? (none / 0) (#75)
    by Exeter on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 06:57:21 PM EST
    As in if Obama picks Biden, you won't vote for Obama?!?  

    Line in the sand for me (none / 0) (#80)
    by wasabi on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 07:19:22 PM EST
    I could not vote for a ticket with a Republican that is a heart beat away from the Presidency.

    No.  Never.

    What if he would convert to (none / 0) (#81)
    by zfran on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 07:30:30 PM EST
    being a dem?

    Vice President? So what? (none / 0) (#88)
    by newbroom on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 08:36:33 PM EST
    Who cares that much about the veep candidate?....Do we face the specter of another JFK?
    I love the idea of Russ Feingold....and I wouldn't even blink if it were Dennis Kucinich or Cynthia McKinney! Until along came Cheney, the veep has been ornamental...if only a heartbeat away from the big chair...Barack is moving cautiously, and I'm sure he'll make a good decision....

    Gore wasn't ornamental (none / 0) (#96)
    by Nadai on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 10:42:21 PM EST
    Barack is moving cautiously, and I'm sure he'll make a good decision....

    Yeah, kind of like how he did with FISA.  I can hardly contain my enthusiasm.


    I heard today that Obama has something (none / 0) (#92)
    by Anne on Fri Aug 15, 2008 at 10:20:08 PM EST
    scheduled in Richmond, Virginia for Thursday, leading to some speculation about Kaine.

    I just don't see what he adds to the ticket, and it just seems to edge it closer to the right than I want the party to be.

    It's starting to feel like progressivism is on life support and Obama wants to pull the plug.

    Obama - Gore (none / 0) (#100)
    by Pyre on Sat Aug 16, 2008 at 05:18:39 AM EST
    Wouldn't that motivate the base, now?

    And address any concerns about experience in the team?

    If Gore wanted to be VP (none / 0) (#101)
    by zfran on Sat Aug 16, 2008 at 08:02:57 AM EST
    again, I think that would be a step backwards for him.

    Not so much deal breakers (none / 0) (#105)
    by MojaveWolf on Sat Aug 16, 2008 at 07:13:27 PM EST
    as making the deal worse, would be the issue to me.

    I'm not voting for Obama.  I haven't planned on it since he was presented as the nominee in a sort of fait accompli, but back then, it was at least theoretically possible for him to win me over; unlikely, but theoretically possible.

    Since then, he has done everything possible to alienate Hillary supporters except publicly call her names, and even more than Kerry did years ago to annoy any progressives (like me) who weren't already on board.  Now, it's too late.  McCain could run on the "Nuke the World" platform and all the third party candidates could drop out and a disembodied voice could speak out of a burning bush telling me "vote for Obama", and all it would do is convince me the fix was really in and turn me off more.

    But . . .  there's a difference from Obama's perspective (or there should be a difference) in voters like me almost certainly voting for McKinney, maybe voting for McCain, and actively working for McCain.  I started out at the "voting for McKinney" stage.  I've moved into the middle ground.  If Obama keeps working so hard to appeal to us, he could do a nice job of keeping the green party down and helping McCain in the process.

    Presumably the Obama campaign can do sufficient math to see the difference in, say, McKinney getting 6% of the vote and Mcain 43% and McKinney getting 1% of the vote and McCain 49%? (I'm pulling hypothetical #'s out of the air here, but I do think McCain would take this w/that % of the total vote)

    For all that McCain falls below my minimal standard for a candidate as far as policy positions, making really sure the Dems don't give us another candidate running as far to the right as this one is very close to trumping the "don't vote for any candidate w/too awful of a platform" principle.

    Obama and his team already made sure I don't have to make a difficult choice 'tween "make sure the much better Dem gets in ahead of the republican vs. don't vote for the guy who ran the vomit-worthy primary campaign", because I no longer believe he would be a much better candidate, or even necessarily a better candidate (hard to call, honestly, for me, even if it was jsut the two of them w/no Congress and we were stuck w/them for ten years--and given that I've hated McCain's general election campaign, that has taken some real work on Obama's part) than Mcain.