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Chinese Organ Harvesting From Live Prisoners

Anderson Cooper 360 featured a long segment on how the Chinese are taking and selling organs from prisoners condemned to death. Doctors have testified at hearings that sometimes the prisoners are still alive. Americans and other foreigners who can't get an organ in time from being on a donor list are flying to China to receive the organs, justifying their decision by saying they aren't told anything about the organ donor, so they don't know their new liver, kidney or eyes, whatever the case may be, came from a person who was killed in order that the organ be harvested and sold.

CNN referred to the "death vans" I wrote about here, which are used both to execute the prisoner by lethal injection and then, within 15 minutes, take their organs.

In an editorial Wednesday, a Chinese newspaper defends its death penalty and organ harvesting program.

Of the 12 death-row inmates executed between 2003 and the present, seven donated their organs of their own free will. None of their organ donations ran against medical ethics principles, the official stressed.

....Another argument against the use of capital punishment is that innocent people may be executed by mistake. The fact is that, in Taiwan, the death penalty is ordered by the court only when there is clear evidence showing the suspect is guilty. The chances of imposing a death sentence by mistake are almost nil.

Is it just death row prisoners who are being killed for their organs? Or are Falun Gong practitioners in forced labor camps like Sujiatun facing the same fate?

Related: Who executes the most prisoners? Amnesty International reports:

In 2005, 94 per cent of all known executions took place in China, Iran, Saudi Arabia and the USA.

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    Re: Chinese Organ Harvesting From Live Prisoners (none / 0) (#2)
    by jondee on Thu Jun 15, 2006 at 10:17:35 PM EST
    Lucky for them they dont have any leaders named Saddam, otherwise Fox, Rush, Ann, FrontPage and Powerline would be all over this.

    Re: Chinese Organ Harvesting From Live Prisoners (none / 0) (#3)
    by squeaky on Thu Jun 15, 2006 at 10:46:30 PM EST
    Our guys torture and kill political prisoners and then throw out all the good parts. That makes ours, as far as brutal sadism is concerned, kind of a purer position. I mean if the Chinese cut out someone's liver let's say, while they were alive, and then started sliding around the room on it like it was a surfboard or something, without giving any thought to its commercial or medical value, that would be pure. As it stands now the inhumanity of the Chinese is quite compromised. Quite compromised compared to our inhumantiy, that is.

    Re: Chinese Organ Harvesting From Live Prisoners (none / 0) (#4)
    by Al on Thu Jun 15, 2006 at 11:05:16 PM EST
    Dear Chinese people, Thank you for your letter requesting urgent help against the ruthless tyrants that govern your country with an iron fist. In order to qualify for full occupation service, including statue toppling, free flags for children to wave, and installation of puppet government, a country must satisfy the following requirements: 1) It must be really, really far away from the United States. 2) It must have oil. 3) Its army must be a pushover. In addition, since March 2003 the following additional requirement applies: 4) Its population must be totally unable to fight a guerrilla war. We have reviewed your application for occupation, and regret to have to inform you that your country only seems to satisfy requirement 1, and therefore is ineligible at the present time. Yours sincerely, George W. Bush For Kellogg, Brown, and Root

    Re: Chinese Organ Harvesting From Live Prisoners (none / 0) (#5)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Fri Jun 16, 2006 at 12:02:41 AM EST
    The chances of imposing a death sentence by mistake are almost nil.
    Seems like I've seen this argument before. I guess it all depends on what one means by "by mistake", doesn't it? Surely, when a court imposes a death sentence, the chances are exceeding good that it meant to impose a death sentence.

    Re: Chinese Organ Harvesting From Live Prisoners (none / 0) (#6)
    by JK on Fri Jun 16, 2006 at 12:04:26 AM EST
    Squeaky, You're right! We should stop throwing out the good parts.

    Re: Chinese Organ Harvesting From Live Prisoners (none / 0) (#7)
    by cpinva on Fri Jun 16, 2006 at 03:25:59 AM EST
    best to get those parts fresh. the only concern i can see is with the method of execution. isn't it possible those drugs might just taint the organs, rendering them unusable for transplant? *snark warning!

    Re: Chinese Organ Harvesting From Live Prisoners (none / 0) (#8)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Fri Jun 16, 2006 at 03:52:43 AM EST
    Al: KBR is good people. I have had my aircraft serviced by KBR members in Djbouti (no oil), Bosnia, (no oil), and Kosovo (no oil). All have been very firendly and seem to like their job. No doubt down deep they are very evil.

    Re: Chinese Organ Harvesting From Live Prisoners (none / 0) (#9)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Fri Jun 16, 2006 at 05:30:29 AM EST
    家家都有本难念的经!AL同学太激进了。Every house has a skeleton.Student AL is too radical.

    In fact, we should use the dead row inmates here in the US to save lives. I wonder what happen if this is put to a vote and see if the general public will support using organs from child killers to save lives.
    Your ignorance of the US Justice System is incredible, or should I say typical. Your post, once again, provides additional evidence that you are nothing more than a simple sadist.

    What does it say about the motives of some of the people here when a case of governmental murder for organ harvesting is viewed as just another opportunity to bash Bush? I used to think we were entering a phase analagous to the time of Tiberius in the Roman Empire, but if this is what passes for intelligent commentary among the self-professed "progressives", we're well past the Caligula stage.

    Re: Chinese Organ Harvesting From Live Prisoners (none / 0) (#13)
    by Che's Lounge on Fri Jun 16, 2006 at 07:44:01 AM EST
    This is old news. And we are in no position to judge them. Not that it's not a savage act by supposed CIVILians. Al, They hold our debt. No war for now.

    Re: Chinese Organ Harvesting From Live Prisoners (none / 0) (#14)
    by kdog on Fri Jun 16, 2006 at 07:46:51 AM EST
    It's a sick world we live in. We should try not to buy Chinese goods...as hard as it is these days. Just say no to tyranny with our wallets.

    Re: Chinese Organ Harvesting From Live Prisoners (none / 0) (#16)
    by nolo on Fri Jun 16, 2006 at 08:08:02 AM EST
    Al, that was brilliant.

    TL, did you realize the link to the editorial leads to your post on death vans, like the other link?

    Re: Chinese Organ Harvesting From Live Prisoners (none / 0) (#18)
    by Che's Lounge on Fri Jun 16, 2006 at 08:25:30 AM EST
    TL, Can you open a thread on the senate/house debates on the War? Byron Dorgan is kicking Halli's ass.

    Re: Chinese Organ Harvesting From Live Prisoners (none / 0) (#19)
    by Patrick on Fri Jun 16, 2006 at 08:51:34 AM EST
    Che, here's a link to the results of the vote. I don't think it was the a$$ kicking you thought it was....

    Re: Chinese Organ Harvesting From Live Prisoners (none / 0) (#20)
    by Che's Lounge on Fri Jun 16, 2006 at 09:29:16 AM EST
    Oh well you are so right I'll shut the f**k up anytime I hear a politician actually speaking his mind. Feel better now? Quit being part of the problem.

    Re: Chinese Organ Harvesting From Live Prisoners (none / 0) (#21)
    by desertswine on Fri Jun 16, 2006 at 10:16:03 AM EST
    Doctors have testified at hearings that sometimes the prisoners are still alive.
    C'mon, this is nightmare city.

    Re: Chinese Organ Harvesting From Live Prisoners (none / 0) (#22)
    by kdog on Fri Jun 16, 2006 at 10:16:27 AM EST
    Narius...we couldn't boycott Chinese goods if we wanted to. They make everything for us these days...we make next to nothing. Glad to hear you are ok with organ harvesting...as long as it's a "criminal". We both know innocent people never ever in a million years could get convicted. Propose it in your home state.

    Re: Chinese Organ Harvesting From Live Prisoners (none / 0) (#23)
    by Dadler on Fri Jun 16, 2006 at 10:21:00 AM EST
    So nice to think the American Right wants to constitutionally outlaw flag-burning, just like they do in...CHINA.

    Re: Chinese Organ Harvesting From Live Prisoners (none / 0) (#24)
    by jondee on Fri Jun 16, 2006 at 10:41:03 AM EST
    jeepster - What does it say about your "motives" and intelligence when you interpret the pointing out of the administrations glaring hypocrisy in turning a blind eye to China's human rights nightmare as "Bush bashing"?

    Re: Chinese Organ Harvesting From Live Prisoners (none / 0) (#25)
    by jondee on Fri Jun 16, 2006 at 11:08:26 AM EST
    narius - Do you have that much faith in the morality and decency of the Chinese govt with its horrendous track record of repression of the Chinese people, that you honestly believe everyone they declare a "criminal" is truely a criminal? Or are you just testing to see how much of an idiotic troll you can get away with being?

    Re: Chinese Organ Harvesting From Live Prisoners (none / 0) (#26)
    by roy on Fri Jun 16, 2006 at 11:15:41 AM EST
    Maybe we can compromise and ban burning US flags made in China.

    Re: Chinese Organ Harvesting From Live Prisoners (none / 0) (#27)
    by Patrick on Fri Jun 16, 2006 at 11:36:34 AM EST
    Oh well you are so right I'll shut the f**k up
    That would be nice, but it's too much to hope for. Besides if the arument was that persuasive, perhaps the vote would have been closer.

    Just like If you build it, they will come, and if you split the atom they will bomb, if you heal people with replacement organs the demand for those organs will exceed the ethical supply. We better hope they hurry up and learn how to grow new organs from stem cells, or it's going to become a LOT scarier to be poor soon.

    Re: Chinese Organ Harvesting From Live Prisoners (none / 0) (#29)
    by squeaky on Fri Jun 16, 2006 at 12:57:08 PM EST
    Agent99-
    We better hope they hurry up and learn how to grow new organs from stem cells, or it's going to become a LOT scarier to be poor soon.
    Ever see "Dirty Pretty Things" Good movie.

    Re: Chinese Organ Harvesting From Live Prisoners (none / 0) (#30)
    by kdog on Fri Jun 16, 2006 at 12:59:13 PM EST
    I hear that Agent. It could be like the old slave auctions...where the sick yet rich bid for the poor yet healthy's organs. "Look at this fine specimen down on his luck. Do I hear $5000 for his kidney?"

    Squeaky: Never saw it, but I'm guessing dirty pretty things may be clones?

    Re: Chinese Organ Harvesting From Live Prisoners (none / 0) (#33)
    by squeaky on Fri Jun 16, 2006 at 04:53:11 PM EST
    Agent99-No clones but poor people selling their organs. a synopsis from the link above:
    Okwe, a kind-hearted Nigerian doctor, and Senay, a Turkish chambermaid, work at the same West London hotel. The hotel is run by Senor Sneaky and is the sort of place where dirty business like drug dealing and prostitution takes place. However, when Okwe finds a human heart in one of the toilets, he uncovers something far more sinister than just a common crime.
    worth renting.

    Aw, yipes! I'm senile way too early. I did see that. Yes, very good movie. Sheesh. Sometimes I do little film festivals on my iMac, play ten, fifteen, twenty movies in a row to shake out the political angst and I guess they're not imprinting so well. I'm not old enough for this! Can I sue the monarchofascists for this? Agh.

    Re: Chinese Organ Harvesting From Live Prisoners (none / 0) (#35)
    by squeaky on Fri Jun 16, 2006 at 06:12:41 PM EST
    I have been there many times myself. Hard to keep it all straight. I love the idea of a movie marathon purge. Sounds like dreaming while awake.

    alright, i just came home with the mu shui pork (try it spicy!) and read about the "Death Vans"...and now i cannot eat a bite as my mind began writing a chapter in the new chinese horror genre "happy excellent state organ method". the hero, a convicted father of 4 girls, survives a liver heist while out on parole. he runs into his old boss, Nike-tsu, when the two of them come to the aid of a woman who has just outrun a black clad "Organ Unit". the trio form a crack band of vigilantes whose exploits become the stuff of legend at the dialysis clinic. they roam the city streets at night targeting the occupants of the Death Vans in bloody "Robin Hood meets Frankenstein"-style transactions-clandestine boxes of dry ice and vital organs materialize unannounced on hospital doorsteps- that have the people wondering whether they were better off under the paternal care of the state butchers. directed by David Cronenberg.

    Re: Chinese Organ Harvesting From Live Prisoners (none / 0) (#37)
    by jondee on Fri Jun 16, 2006 at 07:50:40 PM EST
    narius - So, how's that serial murderer transplant worked out for you so far?

    Re: Chinese Organ Harvesting From Live Prisoners (none / 0) (#38)
    by squeaky on Fri Jun 16, 2006 at 08:34:36 PM EST
    Jondee- Yes, a bit like the 1935 remake of Orlacs Hände (1924) calledMad Love. Except instead of the hand transplant it was the spine.
    : An insane surgeon's lPeter Lorre] obsession with an actress [Frances Drake] leads him to replace her wounded pianist's hands with the hands of a knife murderer which still have the urge to throw knives. (more)
    One thing is true is he could never be off topic on this particular thread. I see him more as Lorre than Drake though. Although you never know.

    Re: Chinese Organ Harvesting From Live Prisoners (none / 0) (#39)
    by kdog on Sat Jun 17, 2006 at 06:07:58 AM EST
    Technology can lead to terrible things sometimes. I guess it was inevitable that the ability to transplant organs would lead to some of us itching to get our hands on the organs of others against their will. Another sad display of humanity.

    Re: Chinese Organ Harvesting From Live Prisoners (none / 0) (#40)
    by Andreas on Sat Jun 17, 2006 at 10:05:56 AM EST
    Some background information and analysis on China: WSWS International Editorial Board meeting The implications of China for world socialism By John Chan, March 2006 Part One, Part Two, Part Three

    Re: Chinese Organ Harvesting From Live Prisoners (none / 0) (#42)
    by kdog on Sat Jun 17, 2006 at 03:11:38 PM EST
    We do things against criminals will all the time
    We don't take their organs. The fact that you, as an American, aren't bothered in the least by it is so disheartening.