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Coptic Christian Family Not Killed by Muslims

By Jeralyn, Section Crime in the News
Posted on Sat Mar 05, 2005 at 10:39:38 AM EST
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In January, we wrote about the murders of a New Jersey Coptic Christian family and how conservatives went on a rampage, blaming Muslims, coming up with slogans like "Jihad in New Jersey."

Arrests have now been made in the case. Two tenants of the family, men who lived upstairs, have been charged. Robbery was the motive, according to police, not religious hatred.

Many in New Jersey's Coptic Christian community had speculated that Hossam Armanious angered Muslims with opinions he posted in Internet chat rooms under the user name "I Love Jesus."

"I'd like to make one thing perfectly clear: The motive for these murders was robbery. This was a crime based on greed, the desperate need of money," Hudson County Prosecutor Edward DeFazio said.

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    Coptic Christian Family Not Killed by Muslims | 12 comments (12 topical)
    Re: Coptic Christian Family Not Killed by Muslims (none / 0) (#1)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Mar 05, 2005 at 11:05:08 AM EST
    But how do you know that for a fact? did the guy have any real property of the murdered people? If I was a cop working this case I would love it to be Robbery and not Religious hated. But lets see what comes of this and not just hang the guy right now. its sounds like an easy mark to me.

    Re: Coptic Christian Family Not Killed by Muslims (none / 0) (#2)
    by jondee on Sat Mar 05, 2005 at 11:43:56 AM EST
    Way to call em trolls. Of course you'll see it when you believe it.

    Re: Coptic Christian Family Not Killed by Muslims (none / 0) (#4)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Mar 05, 2005 at 11:52:01 AM EST
    "its sounds like an easy mark to me" Most violent criminals are dumb as rocks. Their crimes are often completely senseless, and frequently they can be solved fairly easily. Anybody who says, "It doesn't make sense to kill a whole family just to steal $3,000" or somesuch does not understand the violent criminal's mindset.

    Re: Coptic Christian Family Not Killed by Muslims (none / 0) (#5)
    by scarshapedstar on Sat Mar 05, 2005 at 12:18:20 PM EST
    And another "enemy within" gets swept under the rug, soon to be replaced like another bogeyman. It's almost like how the Swiftliars would make sh*t up and it would be disproven in the same news cycle, yet Instapundit and the gang never seemed to notice and would give their next lie the "HEH, INDEED, READ THE WHOLE THING" treatment.

    Re: Coptic Christian Family Not Killed by Muslims (none / 0) (#3)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Mar 05, 2005 at 12:30:44 PM EST
    The NY Times has a piece on this. The prosecutor gave a very detailed description of the crime, which implies they have a good idea what happened: link Of course, that's not stopping all the Muslim-haters at sites like LGF and Jihad Watch, who are now speculating that the suspects were converts to Islam. [Ed. urls must be in html format, we fixed this one, future ones will be deleted. They skew the site.] Despicable, absolutely despicable. It's true that we don't know for sure exactly what happened yet. But that's precisely why it was (and is) utterly irresponsible to speculate about Muslim involvement. Anybody who wants to invoke the burden-of-proof principle really ought to think about that.

    Re: Coptic Christian Family Not Killed by Muslims (none / 0) (#6)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Mar 05, 2005 at 12:44:32 PM EST
    TL, a defense attorney, believes everything prosecutors say? That's a bit odd, no? Here's the link to the latest Jihad Watch thread on this. The two currently in custody might be the perps and the only perps and there was no religious link at all. But, that remains to be seen, no? Consider also the following from the link above: I hope Edward DeFazio will be courteous enough to answer. But considering that he recently forbade a reporter even to ask him about possible religious motivation for the killings, I won't be holding my breath.

    Re: Coptic Christian Family Not Killed by Muslims (none / 0) (#8)
    by Kitt on Sat Mar 05, 2005 at 02:14:52 PM EST
    Mahan - Just above the space where you type your comment is the reference for putting a link in the HTML format....cut and paste if you have to get it correct. Mahan's link I've read some at Jihad Watch, listened to some stuff on PalTalk; LGF is too much for me. The murders were particularly brutal; however, I don't know how germaine the religious angle is and the role it played in the murders of this family. I think it's easy to scapegoat Islamists, Muslims. I'm pretty agreeable when it comes to someone's religion (until they begin evangelizing and forcing certain issues). I have mine; you have yours. Leave it at that. I have a hard time with Islam and have to really work at not succumbing to the bullsh*t so imagine how easy it is for those who don't try much or at all.

    Re: Coptic Christian Family Not Killed by Muslims (none / 0) (#9)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Mar 05, 2005 at 03:37:43 PM EST
    JH has, of course, their own agenda. But, unless we're going to equate "seeking the facts" with "hate", I have trouble seeing the hate.

    Re: Coptic Christian Family Not Killed by Muslims (none / 0) (#10)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Mar 05, 2005 at 04:43:12 PM EST
    These people could care less about "seeking the facts". What they want is to ignore the facts that don't support their theory, or else pretend it's all some conspiracy to protect Muslims. This guys quote pretty much sums it up: "I will always believe that Muslims did this, no matter how much the media and the police attempt to put a towel over this pile of dump." Is that what you call "seeking the facts"? And honestly, who on God's green earth could possibly believe that a whole group of New Jersey prosecutors and detectives are actively engaged in a coverup to protect Muslim murderers??? These people sound like they're living on another planet... We should be so lucky,

    Re: Coptic Christian Family Not Killed by Muslims (none / 0) (#7)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sat Mar 05, 2005 at 09:56:36 PM EST
    I encourage every decent person to go look at that Jihad Watch link in the above comment. Also, read the comments on LGF: [link deleted, not in html format] This is pure, unadulterated hate-mongering, and it desperately needs to be more widely exposed. Anybody with a conscience in this country needs to be aware that this is going on, and what a serious danger it represents. These people literally want to eliminate Islam and Muslims. It is the equivalent of the nascent hatred of Jews in pre-WWII Germany that gave rise to the Nazis and the Holocaust. Why in the world is the media ignoring this threat?

    Re: Coptic Christian Family Not Killed by Muslims (none / 0) (#11)
    by Dadler on Sun Mar 06, 2005 at 11:19:39 AM EST
    Amen Mahan. Nice post. Peace.

    Re: Coptic Christian Family Not Killed by Muslims (none / 0) (#12)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Mon Mar 07, 2005 at 06:52:23 AM EST
    Mahan, if you saw the original thread for this story you wouldn't be so surprised (though no less outraged, I'm sure) to see that a small number of commenters do hate Muslims and believe they all are Jihadists and should be "wiped out". Like a good hunting dog, you give them a sniff and say "go boy!" and they'll dehumanize any target you give them. How quaintly reminiscent of our tribal past, where we only defended our own genetic progeny. If it makes you feel any better, it was the Jews, the Japs, the Irish, the Gooks... depending on who pulls the string on these fools. What enrages me is that I lost a family member on 9/11 flight 175 - and these folks have hijacked HIS memory for their bloodlust.

    Coptic Christian Family Not Killed by Muslims | 12 comments (12 topical)